Mfw humans think they can have true socialism/communism without a hive mind

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pathetic smh

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How exactly are the means of production not held in common in the federation? Even if you ignore their moneyless, propertyless society, they you can clearly see they all have equal access to the replicators on their ships.

Industrial replicators are not shared in Federation society. The Federation is a military(???) institution and so access to replicators can be denied. Normal citizens have limits on their rights to using the replicator, for example they cant print a federation uniform.

Who owns the star ships in the federation? Who owns the rights for the industrial replicators? Who decides what trade deals to make and how does that benefit the common prole?

Afaik there is no private property in Star Trek but there is personal property (Picard inherited a Chateau in France).

Apparently the moneyless part was a retcon since there were federation credits.
memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Federation_credit
I think the federation people on DS9 had some kind of currency they used for trade.

Pretty sure the Federation is a bog standard social democracy that is able to take advantage of cheap energy and replicators to bribe the populace into giving up their power to the political class who hold true power in that society.

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They only use currency for foreign trade.

And the point of communism isn't that literally everyone gets to do whatever they personally want with large-scale means of production, but that the means of production are socially controlled. Do you have any evidence that means of production, like industrial replicators, aren't socially controlled?

Greed is personal gain at the expense of others. It's hard to be greedy in a post-scarcity society.

I miss anarcho-transhumanist threads.

memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/United_Earth
Apparently there is still a President and a senate of the United States. memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/United_States_of_America

Couldn't even find anything about United Earth elections. memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Prime_Minister_of_United_Earth The head of the United Earth is elected from the parliament who I do not know if they are placed there from votes, per capita representation, or from the more local governments. memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/United_Earth_Parliament

This looks like normal a normal liberal democracy to me dude. I guess post-scarcity means communism to you tho lol

That wasn't my point at all.

ummmm do you actually care that much about a shitty tv show to lie about what happens in it so you can pretend they're actually communist when everything in it points to them not being that at all???

They were capitalist in TOS but communist in TNG

Credits were a way of rationing energy on starships no?

there's plenty that points to it being so

chateau picard belonged to his family and the sisko's had a restaurant. just because anyone can't just walk up to an industrial replicator and build a starship doesn't mean that they don't have control of the means of production, not the least of which considering that replicators aren't the only and sole productive mechanism existing at the various points in the star trek timeline.

This sort of highlights the problem of actually discussing any real political implications of Star Trek; the canon is a mess depending on who was writing on the time. Gene Roddenberry, though having some strains of utopianism in his science fiction, was by all other accounts unremarkable in his politics given the time (engrossed in what was effectively American Cold War era "centrism.") By the time TNG game around, Gene wasn't nearly as involved with the project, and as such the show went in a more coherent but ultimately different direction when expanding on the lore of that universe. The underlying politics and economics of the Federation and other galactic entities saw a lot of retcons. The implication largely in TNG is that money, class, and a sizable portion of the traditional state have either been abolished or have taken a drastically different shape, but those are by no means the case in TOR where the Federation was basically the "America IN SPACE". DS9 apparently also further deviated in its own direction lore-wise, but I never really kept up with that series.

I wonder whose behind this post.

Yeah, you can see a big shift in things like The Prime Directive, which goes from an iron clad non-interference law in TOS, such as the episode where the Enterprise gets embroiled in a simulated war, to a much more flexible principle in TNG, like the episode where Data responds to that little girl alien's distress signal. Or that Rome Planet episode in TOS where everyone is stoked that these space pagans are finding Jesus, to the TNG episode where Picard looks almost physically revolted at the idea of an atheist society reverting to religious superstition.

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