One Chinese Esperanto speaker described Esperanto as a linguistic handshake. When two people shake hands they both reach out halfway. When two people speak Esperanto they have both made the effort to learn a relatively easy, neutral language instead of one person making the huge effort to learn the other person’s difficult national language and the other person making no effort at all except to correct his/her interlocutor’s errors.
One Chinese Esperanto speaker described Esperanto as a linguistic handshake...
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But now you'll only handshake internet esperanto larpers
There's nothing wrong with Esperanto
There's nothing wrong with English
That simply isn't true
The only guys more obnoxious than esperantist, are the sanskrit faggots.
Practically, English is the universal language of the (near) future. But the history of English is incorporating new words and language features as it encounters other languages, and we should continue that tradition.
English is probably one of the shittiest languages. I'd take Russian or Spanish any day even if they are far more complex, but Esperanto is promising.
English is the most logical and scientific language ever developed.
If you can't learn English properly, you should shoot yourself.
How is it so shitty? It's quite expressive, has lots of useful features, a massive vocabulary, conjugation is relatively simple…
Esperanto has no use in the modern world. It's a relic of the 19th century. A utopian ideal created by overeducated Europeans.
fuck off esperantocucks. your "language" is trash and will never be accepted
Agreed. English serves as a good enough tool for international communication. Esperanto is a failed experiment. It has never worked in practice.
Sometimes I think English would be improved if we adopted phonetic spelling to help new English readers and writers, but keeping the spelling conventions of the language the word originates from gives clues to context and meaning, so I'm on the fence.
English works fine as it is. It has been successfully implemented worldwide. We don't need to make everything in the world artificial.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
English lacks some nice cases present in other languages, like dative for example. Pronunciation is horrible and completely arbitrary, and some words present in other languages are instead substituted by verbal combinations as happens with the verb make. I will learn Esperanto after I am advanced enough in Russianzbut from what I have practiced in Esperanto, it is extremely easy, far more than English.
No one really says why English is better, it will probably come to be spoken over the entire world, but in Communism it is probably that we would speak more universal tongues.
Unlikely. Stalin was right in removing Esperanto from Soviet society. We need to embrace a real natural language spoken by real humans. Be it, English, Russian, or Kurdish.
You're the same autist who shitposts in every Esperanto thread, right? It wouldn't surprise if you were samefagging here.
Well nitpicked, dumbass.
English is complete gibberish without a genitive case or fonetik speling!
But it is.
Esperanto is a fucking meme, there is no need to force an international language when global capitalism has already provided one: english. Selling the rope we hang them with.
Agred. From Portugal, to Russia, to India, Eurasia will transform into a communist society.
English's prominence kind of fucks with romanizations, one isn't exactly sure how an "oo" or an "ee" is supposed to be pronounced. But I don't think esperanto would be better.
Just learn it. All letters present in a sentence are pronounced and they have set pronunciations, as far as I remember.
Stop shilling for your made up zionist tongue.
Pretty much this, tbh. I hate sounding provincial as a burger, but language is a great unifier of the masses. Pushing Esperanto would just distance us from the rest of the world.
Instead, perhaps Spanish might suit us better? Latin America has a huge interest presence, and the language is pretty easy for the most part. Problem is, I don't know where to start…
>>>Holla Forums. Mortigi vin mem.
After capitalism I don't see why Esperanto couldn't be taught in schools as a easy communication tool.
Empieza con Memrise, Duolingo, y Lingvist. El español es un gran lenguage, a pesar de que es mucho mas complejo.
This conversation is deeply ironic because English is literally what is allowing all of us, many of whom are European and South/Central American, to communicate, I gather.
Exactly. Esperanto is the language of zionism, division, and laughable utopia. English is the language of unity, science, and scholarship. The language of revolution.
Pronunciation in English is shit.
I don't think that Spanish is easier either.
What do you mean by this? That the spelling isn't phonetic? Yes, it's not ideal…
Yes. There are no solid rules in English pronunciation.
Right, that's actually by design. English keeps the spelling conventions of the language of origin of the word. This gives the reader clues about the cultural context and history of the word.
And I find it dumb how there are so many people that say "English is easy to learn" when it's the only language that they know.
Bullshit, most people speak English as a second language. In fact, China has more speakers of English than the United States.
English is too ingrained, it will forever be the international language.
Word. Every second spent learning esperanto is a second that could have been spent learning about leftist theory and practice. We have to roll with what we got. English isn't perfect, and it's true that native speakers have an advantage in communication over non-native speakers, which is less than egalitarian, but trying to teach everyone a new language is a non-starter.
Also esperanto is hella Euro/West-centric. It's not like Esperanto is easy to learn for Asians.
I hope that you're trolling. That amount is only for "learners". China only had around 10 million English speakers in 2006.
You've seen those "explosive dog" engrish translations? That's what the average Chinese person can do with what they learned in school, using a dictionary as a crutch.
Out of curiosity I youtubed it, and Asians indeed sound retarded when they speak Esperanto.
Do you only have 1 hour of free time? Are you going to die in a few months or some shit?
Everyone should speak fluent slovenian in order to fully understand Zizek tbh.
yeah i don't know what you are talking about. he is perfectly intelligible and probably much more so than if he had been speaking english.
I have lots of hours I can use however I wish and there's no way in hell I'm going to spend any of them learning Esperanto. If I'm going to learn another language it's going to be a programming language TBH.
it's gibberish and he's mispronouncing every word. Esperanto is only for Europeans. We shouldn't force Esperanto, Christianity, the metric system, and other European cultural inventions on people who neither want it or need it.
Now hold the fuck up, everyone should use the metric system. It is nothing about the asian genes or culture that makes it easier to use something else.
Said the person who never left the USA in his life. If you'd choose randomly two so-called """English speakers""" from around the world, they probably wouldn't understand each other.
Wow what sort of mutant English are these people speaking then?
No he isn't. His speaking his readily understandable by any esperanto speaker.
Have you never heard a foreigner speak english or something?
It's being retarded a requirement for being a nazbol or is it just a coincidence that everyone they posts with the nazbol flag is fucking stupid?
His pronunciation is perfectly fine. You don't even know how it's supposed to sound why the fuck would you write something like this? Nazbols are truly the worst.
As a French/English speaker, I'd agree English is more simple, especially written.
Yes, in fact I was able to communicate with them just fine.
The thing about esperanto is that is liberal masturbation fantasy.
One of the most common myths is easy to learn by anyone, and still is fucking eurocentric as fuck.
And not even getting on the peace through language bullshit, it's really liberal thinking in there.
A universal language is a good idea, Esperanto is not it, and I just hope the Esperanto cultist realize.
yes, now take two of them with wildly different accents and grammar problems and they will not be able to speak effectively.
It might be Eurocentric, but it's still easy as fuck to learn for everyone.
That says more about French than English tbh
We already have English. Esperanto speakers are literely a cult. They learn a made up zionist language and refuse to suport something that actually works. American English is the universal language, and it's indeed a waste of time to learn it. Reading Marx, Lenin, or Stalin is more important than wasting time with a liberal edgy idea.
If anything we should codify a simplified and standardized version of English that is backwards-compatible with standard English. We could use phonetic spelling and adopt any useful features from other languages.
Wait so you're saying that they can communicate with native speakers but not with each other?
Ignore him. Esperanto speakers are cultists. They believe in a fantasy world where people will actually learn a made up European language.
That's called Globbish. Honestly, French is already wide-spoken around the world. It's the "universal language" in Europe and Africa at least.
Fucking LOL m8 it's definitely not easy for Asians or Middles Easterners.
Uh, yes its easier for a native speaker to understand someone with an accent and bad english than two separate foreigners trying to speak. How do you think a conversation in english between a native chinese speaker and a native haitan creole speaker would go?
Most of the people who are usually counted as English speakers barely speak the language and has accents that would make native speakers commit sudoku.
Not an argument. You are just buttmad that it is a constructed language, as if languages weren't constructed after all.
yeah it is actually.
It is though, ask any of them.
To be fair, most Asians and Arabs already speak a European language. Usually French, English, or Turkish.
Maybe 100 years ago. Today English is the defacto near-univseral language, especially among young people. The internet has cemented English's status as the language of the future.
This is what Esperantists actually believe.
Language is tied with power. As soon as Trump gets impeached and the American system completely collapses, the power will shift to Europe and China. It's only a matter of time.
Wow y'all need to check your muh privilege. Clearly the only universal language is body language.
So it's shit by design?
But people will still speak English. Have any of you spoken with European highschool or university students? Most of them speak very good English.
That's ableist, my friend is a ghost and has no body yet can talk.
This is completely retarded. Creating standard orthography and creating a European yiddish pidgin from scratch are two different things.
English, Italian, German, Chinese, and Arabic reflect the languages of real people for hundreds/thousands of years. Esperanto was made up by some Jew a hundred years ago. Not comparable.
Yeah then go back in time and start talking to your "ancestors" I'm sure they'll understand you with no problems
Actually it's super dank by design. English is like the "Best Of" album of languages. It's taken all the best bits of the world languages it encountered over the years and amalgamated them into a cohesive, highly effective whole. It's a joy to use and the legacy spelling is one of the best parts because the spelling hints at the etymology.
No, it's not. The reason it's "easy" is because they already know a western language as points out.
And if you can arguee that it's easy because of the current conditions, the same could be on english as it has become the de facto language.
And also to clarify, I don't think english is the best, I do believe like that once America loses the leverage it currently has, the use of english would reduce quickly.
Esperanto draws from various languages you absolute mongrel. Fucking pronouns are immediately identifiable to any European, be he Spanish, French, Italian, whatever. Verbs too, are immediately identifiable as well, and can be easily learned through association. You are cancer and have done nothing but shit up with the thread.
Except English is literally just Old English+French. Unless you think those are the best languages the world had to offer English hasn't really taken all the best bits of world languages.
Yes it is easy, there is testimony to that everywhere. the same cannot be said for english, the language has no logic, no formal rules and is not phonetic. English is much harder to learn than Esperanto for non-europeans.
No way, comrade. Young Europeans have learned English so that they can participate in the discussion on the internet and enjoy American/British media, especially music and movies.
English is certainly rapidly evolving right now but it's only going to become more dominate. Esperanto is NOT a practical alternative, and I just don't see everyone learning Chinese or Russian.
Not only that. Even if the European Union supported Esperanto post-Brexit, Esperanto would eventually be replaced by the next super power.
All Empires eventually crumble, along with their language. There is no logical reason to force Esperanto as the international language, since it's going to disappear one way or another.
That doesn't matter. English has much more resources, community, and prestige. Norwegian is possibly the easiest language in Europe, but no one outside "polyglot autists" learn it, since it really is useless. Esperanto is even more useless than Norwegian, no country has ever adopted it. It's a fucking meme, a joke.
Relax, cultist. Esperanto's baby grammar doesn't attract speakers and never will.
FALSE! There are all sorts of borrowed words from other languages. "Sofa" and "pajamas" are borrowed from Persian, for instance. English has borrowed the " 's " possessive form from German, and also its compound word construction, although English uses hyphens instead of just smushing the words together.
Eventually humanity will go extinct anyway, so what's the point of reproducing?
No traces of argumentium in the area, sir.
100 years ago no one saw English spreading either. No one thought that Russian would be one of the most important languages of the 20th century.
We cannot predict the future. But English is here to stay for a long time. The United States has the most weapons along with the biggest propaganda/cultural prestige.
Even in Europe, young men and women learn American English over Received Pronunciation. Even if they live a couple of hours away from Britain.
Yeah, there's a bunch of words borrowed from other languages. But I hope you understand that every language ever, except possibly languages spoken by uncontacted insular tribes, has done this. There is not a language on the planet that doesn't borrow words from other languages.
If you think foreign loanwords are unique to English you are a brainlet.
It didn't "borrow" it from German, English is a Germanic language and they both have common linguistic roots.
Teaching Esperanto will take too much resources when we can feed and clothe refugees instead. There is movement for Esperanto for below. No one sees a real reason to spread it. English, French, and even Mandarin are more likely to spread in the West than Esperanto.
True but English has probably done this more than any other modern language because of its maritime and general exploration tradition. It has had way more interactions with other languages.
Dawg, the timing of the internet and global culture during a period of American cultural and economic dominance has ensured that we'll all be speaking English soon.
English is such a linguistic clusterfuck, colored by centuries of England being conquered and reconquered by successive waves of inbred Germanics. With such a layering of the inherent Teutonic inferiority complex, it's no wonder the British went on to conquer a quarter of the planet.
This is assuming that global capitalism will be the dominant force in society indefinitely.
There can easily be an alternative future where different regions have walled off internet and internal media for their citizens to consume.
I can't see why Hollywood and the Libertarian Internet lasting forever.
Only 6% of English words come from languages that aren't Germanic, French, Latin or Greek. And every language in Europe is massively influenced by Latin and Greek. As I said, English isn't a remarkably Frankenstein-language, it's development isn't that abnormal compared to other European languages. Very little of English came from places that aren't it's immediate European neighbours.
I would hazard that the language to have done this the most is probably some literally who Indian language due to the sheer volume of languages in India and the constant uninterrupted exchange between them over literally thousands of years. As well as the amount of contact with cultures outside of India.
The Internet is going to make English the standardized language of the world the same way that the printing press standardized languages as we understand them today.
The printing press was used to print different dialects of German and French that later became subservient to the standard language. I imagine in Britain dialects were also printed regularly until London won.
Esperanto is easier for Mandarin speakers than Korean, Japanese or Thai. You have to be retarded to think that all languages in that continent are similar to each other.
Yes, and that only happens because of the leverage America has on the world. If that is lost, people will learn other languages so they can participate on the discussion and enjoy media of the next superpower. Other languages have been on english's place and they've been thrown out, you could argue that it was because the world was not as interconnected as now, but I believe the opposite would happend, the speed on how the new content would be generated will accelerate english demise.
Testimony from esperantist themselves, people who likely have been exposed to other languages and are likely into learning languages. A biased sample if I might say.
Besides, my point here is not Esperanto vs English, my point here is that Esperanto is not the universal language that Esperantists repeat.
The link I posted before has some critics to that notion.
And TBH, this thread exemplifies what I hate about esperanto, and why I compare it to liberal fantasy. Almost every other thread Holla Forums is aware material conditions are the reason why the world is like this, but it seems like esperantists prefer changing the superstructure.
It's not merely about grammar, culty.
Korean and Japanese are easier for a Chinese speaker for cultural reasons. Chinese people are more likely to consume East Asian media than Esperanto youtube videos.
Agreed. Esperantists refuse to deal with the realities on the ground. No one is interested in learning a utopian language. People want healthcare, good wages, and a pension. Esperanto learning is a waste of energy and resources in the left.
I have not seen any esperantints here do this. If anything, they learn it because it is more possible that it will be spoken once communism is achieved. That is, if we get there.
The Soviet Union opposed it because they realized that the goal of Esperantists is to spread Utopian Internationalism instead of a stable working class.
In Yugoslavia, Tito embraced Esperanto to piss off Stain. There was no inherent value in the language itself.
Stalin opposed it because he hated Jews. Before Stalin it was supported, after Stalin it was tolerated.
Stalin was not ant-Semitic. He killed Esperantists because they were mostly ideological enemies. Stalin was trying to build a socialist society within the borders of the Soviet Union. Esperantists wanted to force their Utopian view by risking the stability of the union.
Spreading communism to a nuclear armed Western hegemony was impossible. Socialism in one state was the best way to preserve the victories of the Bolshevik revolution.
(It's a nazbol, did you really expect his shit to be logical?)
And what came out of that? The Soviet Union went to shit.
How the fuck were they ideological enemies? Are you a complete retard?
Don't be a faggot. People can discuss culture aside from basic stuff, in fact I think is essential. But people should drop the magical thinking on pushing for a universal language before changing the competitive system that will push for de facto universal langages based on power dynamics.
I don't think that'll happen, and I certainly hope that if it does, it will be a different esperanto that addresses it's multiple failures. Still thanks for the comment, it made me realize i might be overreacting.
Still, I believe that during communism, a natural language will raise as an standard, and people will just learn languages outside of an academic setting just because it's fun.
The reason why that won't happen is the same reason why Esperanto doesn't have at least 20 million fluent speakers.
To the people that know Esperanto: Have you considered subtitling TV programs? There's a serious shortage of subtitles.
Why not have an easy language that is actually spoken by people, such as Spanish, be taught?
Learn Japanese instead.
* beautiful language
* grammar is more logical than English
* fun to learn
* lots of manga/anime/light novels and ancient texts available for study
* ability to de-spook Japanese classcucks
* have some understanding of logographic writing systems
* enjoy Japanese Marxist literature
* don't need anime subs any more
* ability to argue against nationalists on 2ch without being immediately dismissed as bakana gaijin
Except all the bullshit excepts, irregularity, non-phonetic spelling, etc.
People actually speak Esperanto.
Bueno, hablemos en español si quieres que te diga que el inglés es terrible :^)
It even has native speakers!
I highly doubt it.
That won't make it less true.
Language is a spook.
I only watch anime
…how can a constructed language have native speakers?
How can't it? A native speaker of x is someone who's first language is x. If your parents speak to you in x since you are born, then your first language is probably x.
Worst use of a leftist's time ever!
Who is speaking primarily Esperanto doe?
Autists. Real people speak real languages.
That is simply false.
Esperanto has a number of problems, chief among them being that due to it being constructed from European languages, it is only simple to learn for those whose mother tongue is a Germanic, Slavic or Romance language.
Due to this euro-centrism, it is not fit for purpose as an international auxiliary language.
The only constructed language fit for that purpose is the wonderful language of Lojban.
Couples who met through Esperanto.
It's simple to learn for everyone. Lojban is unsuitable for human use, it's made for computers.
This is now a thread about Esperanto.
Just because it is easier for Chinese to learn then English dose not change the fact that it is not an international language.
It is just as euro-centric as forcing English upon the world.
Lojban is not made just for computers to use.
It being easy for computers to parse is just a benefit of the language, not an aim.
Just because Lojban requires some degree of effort to learn does not make it 'unsuitable for human use', there are plenty of online communities of people that use it to communicate with each other.
non-phonetic, idoisyncratic spelling especially in Bong English (manouvre, faeces, etc.), written words that can be pronounced two different ways (the tear you cry when you find a tear in your favorite shirt), multiple meanings, funky parsing ("he brought Lincoln and Roosavelt the two strippers" can mean bringing strippers to those presidents or bringing those two presidentail presidential strippers to some other person, place or thing), orphaned idioms (how many people in the Anglosphere have literally beaten a dead horse in the last 50 years?), lower case "L"s look like upper-case "I"s in many fonts, "C" being either pronounced as either "s" or "k" and being fucking superfluous, the "U" after every "Q" defeating the purpose of having one letter for the "kw" sound, no letter for the two different sounds we use "th" to indicate, which also makes words like "meathook" one more idiosyncratic thing for people to learn, vowels as often as not not pronounced as spelt and there are not enough of them. Also I don't know if it's something that could be fixed by changing it, but it leaves kinda too much room for making murder sound respectable and so on.
Just so you know, im going to refer to meathook as me thook from now on.
How often do you talk about meat hooks?
You mean a meaþook?
If you're raised with 3 languages, all 3 will be your first languages. That's why the term "first language" sucks, use "native language" or "mother tongue" instead.
If you're raised with 3 languages, all three will be your native languages.
this makes you wonder if the perfidious albion intentionally made his language so ridiculously idiosyncratic and complex to basically keep out plebs and foreigners from higher echelons of society. At the same time however english is so pleasantly easy to use if you just disregard all that shit, maybe we should just develop a more coherent form of niglish and put all the spelling and grammar nazis up against the wall
i get what yall are saying about esperanto being unifying and all but my chauvinistic id still thinks its gay as fuck and you should just try to learn languages that will be important to your AO
also soros needs to be removed first he taints the esperanto name
Yeah, I'm saying that "first language" is a bad term because you can have more than one, and you don't see multiple "first" things often.
i don't think that he's recommending it for anything other than promoting esperanto.
if the only translation available for a well known japanese game was an esperanto translation, that could give esperanto some attention.
Now, I don't want to sound like tumblr, but you all really need to check your muh privilege, specifically anglophone muh privilege.
Also, it's really fucking delusional to think English will stick around after America is impotent.
It's delusional to think it's going to go away? What is going to replace it? Chinese? Please!
I picked up Spanish and then Russian. It's extremely easy. Very straightforward in almost all cases, no wacky declensions and the conjugation system doesn't require you to have pronouns like English and Russian at times. The only thing that I really miss is the double negative.
As for the rest of you, take a look into Lojban. A fully-developed language usable for day-to-day communication which also translates nicely into code could be very useful, much more so than Esperanto.
REMOVE GREEN FLAG remove green flag
you are worst esperantist. you are the esperantist idiot you are the esperantist smell. return to poland. to our poland cousins you may come our contry. you may live in the zoo….ahahahaha ,esperanto we will never forgeve you. socom rascal FUck but fuck asshole esperantist stink esperanto sqhipere shqipare..esperantist genocide best day of my life. take a bath of dead esperantist..ahahahahahESPERANTO WE WILL GET YOU!! do not forget ww2 .spanish we kill the king , spanish return to your precious mexico….hahahahaha idiot esperanto and esperantist smell so bad..wow i can smell it. REMOVE GREEN FLAG FROM THE PREMISES. you will get caught. russian+english+spanish+french=kill esperanto…you will ww2/ tupac alive in english, tupac making album of english . fast rap tupac english. we are rich and have gold now hahahaha ha because of tupac… you are ppoor stink esperantist… you live in a hovel hahahaha, you live in a yurt
tupac alive numbr one #1 in english ….fuck the esperanto ,..FUCKk ashol esperantists no good i spit in the mouth eye of ur flag and language. 2pac aliv and real strong wizard kill all the esperantist farm aminal with rap magic now we the english rule .ape of the zoo zamenhof fukc the great satan and lay egg this egg hatch and esperanto wa;s born. stupid baby form the eggn give bak our clay we will crush u lik a skull of pig. english greattst language
BORN TO DIE
WORLD IS A FUCK
Esperanto sounds like spcispeak to me.
Why not Interlingua?
Hell I haven't even learned the language and yet I can understand this article almost perfectly well, although tbh it is pretty euro-centric, so maybe it's not the best for worldwide use.
"Interlingua es un lingua auxiliar international naturalistic basate super le vocabulos commun al major linguas europee e super un grammatica anglo-romanic simple, initialmente publicate in 1951 per International Auxiliary Language Association (IALA).
Interlingua es le resultato del labores de 15 annos de un equipa international de linguistas.
Le labor pro crear Interlingua habeva le start in Europa, a Liverpool in 1936 e le fin a New York in 1951, le equipa de linguistas ha extrahite le vocabulario international del linguas europee.
In 1967, ISO (International Organization for Standardization), que normalisa le terminologia, ha votate in unanimitate pro adoptar Interlingua como le base pro ille dictionarios.
Interlingua (= "International Lingua") es intendite que illo debe devenir un lingua commun del mundo pro succeder in servir le humanitate, ma non un sol lingua commun.
Appellate a vices Interlingua de IALA pro distinguer lo del altere usos del parola, illo es le subjecto de iste articulo e le lingua de iste encyclopedia integre. Le linguistas, qui ha create Interlingua, ha laborate in le organisation IALA (International Auxiliary Language Association), que esseva establite in 1924).
Anque Latino sine Flexione de Giuseppe Peano esseva anteriormente appellate Interlingua, ma iste denomination cadeva in disuso post le publication de Interlingua (de IALA). Le nomine 'Interlingua' esseva usate con le permission del Academia de Interlingua, le academia del lingua auxiliar de Giuseppe Peano.
Interlingua pote in ultra esser un synonymo pro lingua auxiliar international. Vide etiam interlinguistica."
This is the first time you've seen this language and yet you still understand the gist of it, don't you?
FRANKENSTEIN GANGSTER COMPUTER GOD
Ugly language and hardly anyone uses it. You're more likely to find someone who speaks Klingon than Esperanto.
That is, strictly speaking, untrue.
English is fine.
Literally factually untrue.
It isn't, I learned it from music and video games.
If there's to be an universal language it will happen organically, perhaps a couple of centuries from now people globally will be talking some English based creole, there is really no point on arguing about it, if it is meant to happen it will happen, I only study conlangs because I'm such a huge nerd not because I see them as a prerequisite for muh revolution.
same tbh, Esperantacists are trapped in a catch-22 really, what's the point on learning it if there's no media made in it? And since so few speak it is not like there's any incentive to make more media on it…
Esperanto is a classic example of scientism. It rejects all of the natural, organic, human beauty of languages like English or Chinese and tries to replace it with a cold, uncultured, mechanistic simplicity. Can you name a single great work written in Esperanto? Does Esperanto reveal great insight into the true names of God? No. If the languages spoken by Shakespeare or Confucius are too hard for you, maybe you should just accept that you don't deserve to communicate with others.
Fukke offe. Sheakspar a revisonyste be, Chawser, forr alle aeternity.
Honestly, fuck off.
Besides, Lojban is the language with the Positivist seal of approval, not bloody esperanto.
You seem spooked, my friend.
Positivist scum are ultimately to blame for all attempts at creating artificial languages. It's pretty much the thing positivists are famous for.
There's like a million native speakers retard
Lojban has fucking weird semantics. It has no prepositions, IIRC. The sentence is extended by adding relevant extra information in places specified in advance along with verb definitions that you have to memorize. If you want to describe something about an action that is not specified along with the verb, it is not expressible in the language. It's basically newspeak.
Pretty much. Human ingenuity has created natural and beautiful ways of expressing though. Esperanto will never have a soul. No one has ever felt love, grief, or joy through Esperanto.
Isn't English pretty much unique in being nongendered outside pronouns?
That alone should give it +1 billion points unless you want to have autistic SJW "Latinx" arguments until the end of time.
It's not unique at all:
I'm suspicious of that list…
Have you even read the pages you linked?
You say that like it's a bad thing.
I'm assuming you didn't?
I did. They have no grammatical gender, just like the list claims. Esperanto has the same problems as English (gendered pronouns, some words being male by default, like postman in English), and the Japanese is about ways of speaking. Maybe you don't know what grammatical gender is?
Anyway this list might be better:
English is actually pretty shit compared to some other languages.
Finno-Ugric languages for example.
Sounds pretty gay.
Not only do you sound like an extremely spooked pseudo who just came from Holla Forums, you also completely miss the point of Esperanto. It's not supposed to replace your native language, but act as a way for you to easily and fairly communicate with everyone else with a different native language.
Languages are just ways to communicate. Words don't make you feel anything, it's the meaning behind them. I wouldn't give a fuck whether a qt I liked said "I love you" "te amo" or "mi amas vin" because it's not the words that have any significance, but the meaning and feeling behind them.
Not to sound like a fag but words in most languages carry slightly different meanings. Sure you can translate most of them to one another, but they also tend to have meanings that are not so easy to translate into one another. This happens to me with English and Spanish.
I realize that, I'm just making a point how when you're communicating, the words have very little relevance to whatever feeling someone might get from it. Obviously they matter in something highly based on aesthetics like poetry, singing, or literature, where the specific words with their specific sound and meaning are carefully chosen and it's not really possible to have a 1-1 translation, but that doesn't mean some languages don't have their own unique aesthetic qualities.
nope, you don't know what that means.
I don't know much about it, but wouldn't Lojban be shit for poetry? Wouldn't translations from any language to Lojban be a pain in the ass?
Aviation English is the language of god. I've been up there and checked.
You should have stayed up there
Would using words from Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Hindi and Malay make the language easier to understand for people from those countries?
Only marginally for learning the vocabulary, since they might have a 1/10 chance of coming upon a word they recognize. A lot of words in Esperanto are recognizable to Anglophones and Europeans in general because they usually have knowledge of other European languages or their language has a lot of borrowed words. But even still, Esperanto has a lot of Polish, Yiddish, and Russia words that most Europeans aren't going to recognize, and have to learn them by memory like any other language. While the grammar is very unique and foreign to almost everyone while being very logical and consistent.
Considering most of the world either speaks a European language and almost all of the rest has some knowledge of one, Esperanto doesn't really favor Europeans specifically. The only part of the world that has limited or zero knowledge of European languages is East Asia and the ME, but that doesn't seem to stop East Asians from learning Esperanto, while Middle-Easterners have more important things to worry about than learning a conlang, regardless of how many Arabic words it might have in its vocabulary.
Ïngliṡ djust nïdz e camprîhínsiv spèlïng rïfårm èend får evrïwen tû talerët ïtṡ‐eðerz daielèkt, þin þíngz wud bï perfikt :)
but we have no way of differentiating you (plural) vs you (singular)
Most languages do not have an inclusive/exclusive ‘we’ either
Esperanto is a horrid language. It has all of the problems of spanish and italian, with none of the benefits.
No, It's an amalgamation of shit it's come into contact with that it's speakers used (whether it was easier or just cause or any other reason), like literally every other language, I mean english is cool and all, but let's not kid ourselves here.
Also "Best of" albums suck.
Komunismo igos la Fina Venko.
No, It's an amalgamation of shit it's come into contact with that it's speakers used (whether it was easier or just cause or any other reason), like literally every other language, I mean english is cool and all, but let's not kid ourselves here.
Also "Best of" albums suck.
Komunismo igos la Finan Venkon.
For once you're not a faggot Howard.
I'd rather go with Lojban, due to it being designed as logical from the start. And you can always change/fork the vocabulary to make it easier to pronounce.
Esperanto might be mostly neutral, but at the end of the day it is still a distinctly indo-european language.
Comrades, we do not have time to be teaching everyone a new language almost no one will ever master.
English is the only pragmatic solution.
Lojban is a complete joke, it has only a dozen speakers and they often can't even understand each other. It's a complete failure.
Most ESL speakers never master the language…
People are voluntarily and naturally learning English, mostly through interactions on the internet.
This is never going to happen with Lojban or Esperanto.
The cat is out of the bag. English has all the momentum. Embrace it!
Yeah, because people learning English are totally being taught to use Y'all and it isn't just slang used exclusively in America
Fam, the guy making that quote is a chink. If it was that hard, he wouldn't say it.
Y'all is a very useful and relatively popular construction and I hope it becomes universally adopted soon.
Wikipedia claims there's about 500,000,000 native english speakers. I think it's safe to say 100,000,000 use "Y'all". Is that not "relatively popular"?
Also, even if it's not used by the other 400,000,000 they would have no problem understanding it.
What is taught is dead. In living English the plural you is y'all. Just like how the pronoun for a person of unknown gender is the formerly exclusively plural 'they.' Learn to deal with reality, Gramps.
That's a pretty big leap.
Yeah, except those 400,000,000 people have their own dialects, have their own opinions on what the language should look like, and whose literary standards (including those in the states) don't at all align with having y'all, a slang term and a compression, as being 'proper English'. You'd have an easier making them learn Esperanto than changing that.
Besides, this is ignoring all the non-native speakers, who aren't taught to use y'all.
Gee, I didn't know I was speaking a dead language right now, considering I was taught it.
You mean in American English, spoken by a certain group of Americans, who don't represent all of the English speakers.
C'est in French is proper.
I guess I shouldn't be surprised that a prescriptivist is this retarded.
Spanish is the best, next best is Russian.
All other languages gtfo.
English is unusable because of it's arbitrary pronunciation.
Spanish is extremely regular, there are very few exceptions to rules, same with pronunciation. Also it's one of the most widely spoken languages in the world. Also, it is easier to learn for most other native language speakers, except maybe ameritards. native asian language speakers have trouble with the 'r' sound, but that's really not a problem as it doesn't interfere with understanding. Indian languages have similar phonetics to spanish.
Really, you should be speaking spanish by now.
The french language is also made of compressions. It's a latin language. English is a germanic language, and compressions are pretty much forbidden in the written language.
At least according to how I was taught it.
We are talking about international languages. People who don't grow up speaking English have to be taught it. People are taught to learn standard English, they're not taught some dialect spoken by a certain subset of English speaking people, and neither are other English speakers who don't speak that dialect. The idea that y'all is a universally recognised evolution of the English language is fucking retarded, and just screams that you're an ignorant burger.
We aren't restricted by any of this! If English has some missing features or words they should just be added in! And if the non-phonetic spelling is a problem then we should just adopt phonetic spelling!
Unless there's some kind of perfect synthesis of American and British English, then yeah, they are
When you learn Japanese, you're taught the Tokyo dialect. Chinese too, you are taught the dominant, state approved dialect. When you are taught a language, you're just being taught the 'official' dialect. It's the same with English. You're literally taught a regional dialect spoken by a subset of people. That doesn't make it any more or less correct than any other dialect.
Yeah and workers are voluntarily selling their labour power to the bourgeoisie.
The cat is out of the bag. Capitalism has the momentum. Embrace it!
That's happening organically as there is more interactions between the two linguistic groups.
Native English speakers are fucking trash
Of course, and that's kinda the point. Y'all isn't in any state-approved dialect, and it certainly isn't gonna be a part of Oxford English, which is often what people learning English are taught. Instead they're gonna learn and use the 'you' (plural), which again goes back to the original point that the English language is fucking retarded, and the people who are gonna have to learn English in order to make it an international language are gonna struggle with the retarded grammar.
I live in a country where people are relatively good at English, and even then most people can barely speak it after years and years of being taught it (which is how most non-native speakers are gonna learn it). Meanwhile you can learn Esperanto in a few years, and it's easy to learn even for fucking Chinese people, who happen to be terrible English speakers despite a huge effort to teach them.
That article is condemning native English speakers for feeling free to use idioms, acronyms, and uncareful speech other native speakers would find completely unproblematic. This is equally true of any other language, you don’t see people saying Mandarin speakers can’t communicate because people who speak Mandarin as a second language don’t understand their idiosyncrasies.
As far as I know the only language quantitatively “known” to employ idioms more freely than “average” is Ubykh. Korean and Japanese are known to employ highly advanced honorific systems that are notoriously opaque for foreigners, nobody says “Japanese speakers can’t communicate”.
That's why we need Esperanto. No natives who think they are superior just because they were born in the right country.
Literally has nothing in common with Spanish or Italian except some words.
I'm certain only people who know practically nothing about it could seriously advocate for it being an IAL.
Unfortunately Esperanto has a retarded pronoun system also.
What's that? Explain please!
Never heard that term either, but it probably means something like this: When a speaker uses inclusive we, this includes the person the speaker talks to. E.g.
A: Where are you guys going?
B: We are going to the cinema.
In a language with the inclusive/exclusive distinction, there would be information in the sentence whether they intend to take person A with them or not. I don't speak any language that makes such a distinction, but I have thought before about how annoying that lack of distinction is, so that's just my guess.
You aren't all this retarded are you?
Why are all the detractors of Esperanto such absolute mongs?
pidgin always gonna be the best way to talk. something else always gonna be the best to read
Uphold Marxism-Leninism-Lojabanism against eurocentric Esperanto imperialism