Disability under socialism

I'm not sure anyone would want to copy the Indian model for the disabled.

You run into the same problem that every other socialist solution runs into. There is no way to truly evaluate what the individual is capable of. Without a proper incentive, people will make themselves out to be more disabled than they actually are, in order to qualify for the highest tier handout. "From each according to his abilities" socialism has never been able to accurately measure that.

It's the price calculation problem all over again. Doh!

Can't tell if serious or ironic, but nice quads

Uh… no?

...

Gotta love Poe's Law. And thanks.

Back to >>>Holla Forums dumbass.

what is it with leftists who unironically and sincerely go full binding and hoche when it comes to disabled people??

(accidental greentext)

Just because I got Hitler quads, doesn't mean I'm Holla Forums. Handouts from the government are certainly socialism, but socialism is more than just that. Please, user.

uhm that's literally nazi policy for the disabled (which they implemented, look up Aktion T4)???

Being braindead makes you unconcious and you have a machine hooked up to your breathing and to feed you because you can't even eat correctly, is this really the "life" you'd choose? If you don't even know you're alive then what does death make a difference?
nice faulty generalization, faggot.

Confirmed for liberal.

Association fallacy. And I said "if they're braindead", learn to read you dumb shit.

I was mostly talking about people who are impaired, but still mostly able to function, like the girl in OP.

Read again

paperweight

Educate me, marxbro. I'm a Basic Capitalist but I'm not an idiot. Try me.

See this flag next to my name (Anonymous)? I'm an anarchist, not a Marxist. What you're desrcigbing is keynesianism which is liberal, ergo rightwin and therefore capitalist. Socialism is the workers control of the means of production, not to be confused with communism (pics related)

Most certainly not, the size of welfare does not suddenly change the underlying foundations of the economic system.

peope not wanting to work on shitty capitalist jobs while being disabled is quite expected. Under socialism people woul need to work way less, and with a planed economy we can reserve jobs most suited for disabled people.

What you mean is: it is subjective. So what?

"To each according to his contribution"
And also the fact that working to better society is actually gratifying, but I don't expect you to understand that.

Then why don't literally everyone do that today?

It's fucking nothing then.

And you people call me a shitty psychiatrist

?

So handouts are keynesian, and I'm a liberal. Got it. Your second image, however, I take issue with because it assumes that workers are fungible units of labor. Rather. humans are incredibly stratified by ability, intelligence, and ethical integrity. And even those variables change depending on the context, motivation, etc.

The aim is that they could take care of themselves, organizing themselves, and validate their own needs just like any other group. IMO it is a rather shitty way to talk about them as if they were any more special than, say, a steel workers union: they can provide something to society and they need some things to be able to provide that. Currently it takes my government 5-10 years to make workplaces handicapped accessible. If it were up to the workers and not to capital management these needs could be prioritized and handled effectively.

Like everybody else. Again, nothing special about them. How do they differ from miners who need special medical attention because of their harsh work environment, or pregnant women, firefighters? Disabled people are just another group of workers with specific needs. What makes them special is that they are not a concentrated but a diffused set of workers (unlike the miners who work at a specific place) of society.

Disgusting. Unemployment is a pathology. Look at this dude and tell me that he can't be trusted with managing sites, documentation, ot whatever kind of work that doesn't require leaving the house: youtube.com/watch?v=qn70gPukdtY

FROM.
EACH.
ACCORDING.
TO.
HIS.
ABILITY.

who let Iain Duncan Smith on leftypol?

This is nothing but the Puritan work ethic cloaked in red flags. Communism seeks to abolish social classes, not to romanticise the dreadful proletarian condition as some sort of final, ideal New Man.

Even Huey Newton in the bloody 60s understood that the automation of the day was taking away jobs and that a basic income would be a necessary thing! Many such cases of leftists in 2017 not realising this! Very sad!

Imagine being in 2017 and still thinking "he who does not work, shall not eat" being in any way appropriate to the material conditions of the day.

Can't wait to see the people who see "He who does not work shall not eat" as a valid principle of socialism going forward when a slice of GPU silicon and some electronics takes their jobs :^)

Lots of Marxists have never been good with the NEET / lumpenproletariat issue but this is gonna get even more flagrant as time goes on.

You think stuff like self-driving vehicles isn't somehow going to create a shitton of permanently unemployed people????

fuck, what's coming next in terms of technology's ability to wholly replace humans is gonna make the social shit created by the Jacquard loom being a Thing look insignificant. it's up to leftists to be ready for this but instead they'd rather mock neets and autists.

I'm honestly scared by this weird, almost infantile, desire to avoid reckoning with the material conditions of work and automation today, much less those of a decade in the future.

This

There would be no "disabled" because there would be no need for such a distinction under communism. You produce what you produce, you need what you need.

Actually yes, see any welfare state.

Threads like this are just The Twenty Days of Turin according to characters of the plot.

You workerist proletariat have been dicking over disabled people (with Marx's "lumpenproletariat" schtick) so fucking long and we will be fucking laughing when you get automated out of a job by fucking GPU silicon and get subjected to the very same anti-lumpenprole nonsense you helped foster.

Bend that big ass over for the spanking, you classcucks. Huey P. Newton was RIGHT.

PS: there is deep corrosive irony in that it's gamer NEETs who helped fund GPU development – the same GPUs whose descendants are gonna operate the neural nets that are gonna automate you wagecucks out of work.

Automation is doing away with most work. As it stands most people won't be able to work even if they wanted to. It stands to reason only those who want to work should, and the disabled may do this. However, that doesn't mean they can't dedicate their lives to productive endeavors. You don't need to create value to live a full life.

yes, this.

also a lot of work for disabled people under capitalism (yes, even with "accomodations") is utterly menial feel-good nonsense (and yeah, most disabled people who are forced into that know full well that what they do is utterly useless and is just punishment) that would be better done by a goddamn robot.

Like for example there's "sheltered workshops" where disabled people "work" and do menial tasks like "count out ten items and put them in a box" all goddamn day long. Sometimes they can't even do it so they get "hand over hand coaching" where an "assistant" physically manipulates the disabled person's hands to accomplish the task, all fucking day long.

There's absolutely no dignity or honour in this sort of disgusting nonsense. Let disabled people have freedom from work.

This is what happens when you spend your days jacking off to manga instead of reading.

At the end of the day people don't even want to think what job they would give the disabled, despite most people being completely out of their minds bright are to some extent, disabled.

They are told to do the laundry, clean the shit, go be useful.

Despite in fact, being a savant, some some savant can easily fall down the cracks in society based entirely on their social well being. And I would like to say all of you have a grasp on the situation, but you don't, despite being so close to the truths of the matter, some of you are still far far away.

The lowliest of low will push for themselves to be isolated in Sanitarium with an internet connection, it seems.

I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a disastrous misspelling of "lumpen proletariat", dumbarse

nice

You seem to be suffering from the INSTANT COMMUNISM meme. There is undeniable a transitory period leading from capitalism to communism (usually called: socialism) that will require immense amount of work. No denying that this isn't the same forced schedule as under capital, but come on.

i think you misunderstood me – i'm saying that disabled people shouldn't have to do nonsense busywork (that could be done with a machine) for the sole purpose of punishing them via work (or as "therapy" for the supposed pathology of unemployment).

Nothing I said was a statement about the work and labour needed in the transition from hellish neoliberal capitalism to communism.

Furthermore, "It seems to us that there is only one answer to this question: We must recognize, and loudly proclaim, that every one, whatever his grade in the old society, whether strong or weak, capable or incapable, has, before everything, THE RIGHT TO LIVE, and that society is bound to share amongst all, without exception, the means of existence at its disposal. We must acknowledge this, and proclaim it aloud, and act up to it." ~ The bread book

Idk what the "bread book" is but I strongly concur with the quote you posted.

They'll be made allowed to work for less than minimum wage. You know, for dignity's sake.

...

The Conquest of Bread by Kropotkin.

You will be each allowed to work in a Sanitarium, there, you cannot write fiction, you cannot write anything false, but only the truth of how you feel, for the entirety of the public to read. This Sanitarium Library will be your duty from now on.

But why would anyone willingly submit to that?

lol damage control

You already do. That's the joke.

That Sanitarium is called the Internet.

Here

Mind blown

It's the plot to a novel from Italy from the 70's by someone who wasn't even aware of arpanet so it probably should be.

Huh

Giorgio De Maria

I want to fuck her.

...

You people are aware that "from each according to his ability to each according to his need" is a guideline rather than an actual societal model or economic recommendation, right?
Badmouse explains it pretty well.
youtube.com/watch?v=BNxSHcQqiMc

Remember, it's the movement that abolishes the present state of things, it needs to adapt to new problems as time goes on.

I need to replay it.

Maybe if you compare people on a one-to-one basis like a liberal pleb, that argument works, but this is the real world. What matters is the ability of the system to command and allocate the labor of multiple bodies. It doesn't matter if you are the most glorious, singular ubermensch of all time, the labor of 100 average men, embodied in the will of those who command them, is still going to outdo your own. Furthermore, capital exists, and capital is dead labor - what was created by labor in order to reduce the amount of time and effort it takes per worker to produce an amount of value. Someone was commanded by some guiding authority to create that foundry, that software, that McDonalds.

The goal of socialists is to create a society in which labor is put to effective use to create in the name of what people actually need (production for use instead of production for profit) and in which the guiding authority is the rational will of the people, embodied in their directly-democratic assemblies. That is, a stateless, classless society based upon the guiding principle of "from each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs".

My man, my man.

I work with profoundly disabled people for a living at a state run home. Ask me whatever you like and I'll answer come tomorrow and I'll post my general thoughts on this subject as well

Under socialism, I suppose they'd be kept alive by the welfare state, similar to current circumstances but more humane. Under communism, like everyone else, they would work to the best of their abilities, which obviously vary widely depending on their disabilities, and have their needs provided for. All euthanasia advocates here have very poor understandings of socialism, particularly the moral underpinnings of socialism.

Seeing as it's state run, are you concerned about funding being cut?

yes Right-Libertarians are just a return to Classical Liberalism, no need to take it as an insult though (still it's often used as an insult)

Absolutely. As is we're very underfunded because we only get money for the state and occasional donations plus fundraisers

Most of those who live her are wards of the state so we take care of them without any charge except to the state

I'm schizophrenic along with other shit. I'm basically kept some what sane because of government aid. I get enough aid to where I'm able to live a simple life without many "luxuries". Think of it as receiving UBI to cover the cost of food, shelter (live with roommates or parents that charge rent), medications and have a small cash allowance. The medications that I need to take pretty much physically hinders me. I've had jobs where I'd needed to be social and jobs where I needed to do manual labor. Peaking at $25/hr when I was in my early 20's. I can't do either of those anymore. I've been stuck as a shut-in NEET for the past decade and I'm losing my goddamn mind doing nothing and having no "life" mostly because I think the government will look for any reason to cut me off such as seeing me in public. I was thinking of seeing if I can get a job, anything, just to get out the house and maybe meet some people so I don't feel lonely but if I start working I start losing benefits (medical being the most important for subsidized medication). Maybe I could volunteer at an animal shelter or something, I don't know. I'm pretty much being paid to not kill myself at this point. Not sure how much longer I can take it. am burger

You can volunteer (and participate in other social events that you don't gain any monetary benefit from)

Unfortunately, the government will try to take your disability if you make too much money.

which novel?