How does one get roped into radfem idpol?

What is radfem about that image?

It smacks of "Slate-reading liberal" to me.

Why? Did you rape/abuse her?

radfem is even worse, it's taking the bullshit booj ideology and slapping a paper thin layer of 'revolutionary' thinking and a shitload of unironic, nazi-esque hatred of men while still demanding all the entitlements the white female luxury class sought in creating the women's movement.

There are two main ways of becoming a feminist, be a greedy little pearl-clutching cunt who wants to be protected from the realities of capitalism that men have to endure or 2. Be a white knight faggot like the loser i replied to that actually thinks of the female sex as inferior and needing protection.

The idea that the nazi-like qualities of radfem are 'funny' or 'ironic' is itself a manifestation of white knight sexism.

No I did that before the relationship..

Nah, I mean something bad did happen to her, but that was deep in the past.

She was a light fem when we first meant but she got further into it about half a year into the relationship.

first met*

Why did she go radfem?

lmao this is actually totally correct

She started to believe all men were a genuine threat, she would say I was the exception, but I didn't really trust her for other unrelated reasons/other problems with the relationship.

She also said she felt it was the more consistent philosophy to go full on in with extreme feminism. Which was strange because she always castigated me for being too extreme politically.

fuck you radfem is an extension of marxism as many women face relations of production in categories entirely confined to the domestic sphere (like fucking mothers)

Youre asking how does someone get radicalised which is a fairly complicated answer. Its subjective op, at the end of the day radfem isnt as big of an issue in the real world as it is online, and without radfem we wouldnt have had the second wave in the 60s. Idpol does have its merits-at times- and i think we get wrapped up in our very hardline class dogma alot, in majority of society dismissing feminism as part of the class struggle just wont fly. Sure, eliminating capitalism will fix the problems, but if we are gonna be practical, we should support feminism and some basic idpol beliefs.

omg, have i found a sensible human being?

uphold Marxist-Feminism

Radfemism and libfemism is trash & doesn't count as actual feminism.

This. Marxist-feminism is the only way forward.

Lip service might be necessary, but identity's extreme prevalence in neoliberal politics means that are a ridiculous number of people that are concerned with it exclusively, because they think identity politics are politics. They are quite literally unwilling or even incapable of a different perspective. This means that idpol is too volatile to handle without your entire organization getting slowly sucked into mainstream liberalism and its petty wedge issues. Virtually every Western leftist tendency loses its concern for class struggle over time, until its economic concerns are endorsement of welfare while every meeting and demonstration is about whatever identity is cool to feel bad for.

Even right wing politics fall into the same trap: the Ron Paul era of socially unbiased laissez-faire-worshiping libertarians didn't just die with the meme candidate as much as it was slowly taken over by the right-sympathetic political groups they tried to appeal to. Now most lolberts don't even care about economics beyond contrarian endorsement of capitalist theory to spite the "cucks" and unironically want dictators to segregate the population by race while killing anyone with different opinions, and in their minds, this is "liberty", just as liberals think their little welfare capitalist affirmative action reform is "socialism".

when i said "radfem" i meant marxist

if by paying lip service you mean saying "racism is bad" and "women are people" than yeah we can do that

Marxism and feminism are incompatible

Overall I think it would be better to simply explain why idpol is unnecessary and counterproductive. Liberal politics aren't even good at the equality narrative they claim to value.

I'm afraid you're asking too much.

I wanna fuck whatever gender that person is.

we all want to fuck Contrapoints :3

might just have

...

to an extent you are right, but its the politics of our era. im sure once its over things will be better for everyone, its hardly a bad ideology to be trapped too. The only way we can separate idpol from "economic politics" is by being examples, unfortunately. If you can go out there and give creedance to idpol issue whilst keeping the little separation between social and economic issues clear, then you have that balance.

the problem with idpol is that within liberalism, it is impossible to state any form of human life has value as all things are subordinated to the law of value

liberal feminists want to change the conditions of our existence without changing the underlying dynamics

its not just that though, if your willing to forget about "muh idpol" for a second, there are structural biases, and many issues regarding respect and dialects keep certain minority groups down in comparison to white people. With every extreme idpol issue put forth, there is a grain of truth to it.

the equality arguement is fairly misguided aswell, its equity and respect in society, with equality fo minority groups who do face the sharp end of policy

I agree with that. It's difficult to admit there's a kernel of truth to idpol on leftypol, and for good reason, as all "big lies" emerge from small truths. But we should be willing to accept the fact that trans people face discrimination AND they can get around it if they're rich. Both happen to be true.

The trans struggle is so unique though. Of course, access to finances can make the transition easier, its transcendent of class. Jenner still faces great opposition, it would be great if she came out in support f the bathroom issue, which hopefully gets sorted soon.

I disagree, it can be productive to try directly to get someone to see things from our perspective and let them come to our conclusions. The only problem is a general unwillingness to listen, because people don't like being told their entire belief system is wrong.

Language is not oppressive, postmodernist insanity has never solved a real world problem for anyone in the working class.
There isn't so much a grain of truth as much as people mistake this obscurantist horseshit for concern for the actual problems they face in their lives–all of which are inexorably linked to capitalism.

If you think Jenner isn't a complete porky asshole, this probably isn't the board for you.

All issues tied to idpol are a lot more complicated than the idpol narrative where you have one monolith subjugating another. It's more complicated than the intersectionality version of that too where each identity splits the population into shitloads of monoliths. Individual variation in personality or situation is more important anyway, and Caitlyn Jenner is a fuckwad.

huh, didnt know our conclusions were the right ones. Now obviously i do think were fairly okay on most things but im being condsiderate of the majority and of attitudes with time. Its always good if can adapt your ideology.

Your right, post-modernism hasnt solved anything yet. Language, in itself, isnt oppressive, but what you use it for can be. If you think language snt subjective to culture then i dont know what to tell ya.
your last point is flippant.

Just using her as an example for trans issues, not class issues, cus she is a complete porky asshole

Narratives are flawed in their binary nature, yeah, but then again whos gonna get behind a vague subjective issue. Trust me, when your in "sjw" and "idpol" circles, the infighting between the said subjectivity is suprising.

Precisely

Most ideologies aren't like neoliberalism, a self-declared post-ideological mess that already aims to prevent discussion or even contemplation of other ideas. At some point, you have to put your foot down.
Besides, even tankies are rarely racist, sexist, etc. It's not a practical issue. I imagine some liberals would be easily convinced by people they already know are well-meaning, but no one wants to be the political guy in the family, lel.
Base and superstructure. Capitalism is not just the source of financial woes, it is the fundamental basis of modern culture, for better or for worse.
Blaming language for societal oppression is beyond insane. Using politically correct terminology has only fostered animosity toward the "marginalized" groups that liberals care so much about.

She should be a prime example of how idpol seeks to replace class struggle.

Yeah fair point, i just adapt my views to who i speak too, its never any radical shifts, its just dependent and how soon i state "capiltalism is teh problem lel".

I am not blaming language for oppression, that is insane. Nor am i advocating for a pc culture (which, again, does have some merit too it) what im saying is that its time we analyse how we use language in relation to culture, race and gender, especially in existing power structures. i havent got the stats with me but i do know that "academic" english and "african-american english" often inhibit black applicants for teacher positions, applications and even school testing.

She isnt actively being used as a distraction from the class struggle, i dont think any idpol subject is, shes just the most famous trans person atm. Idpol aint bad, just misguided.

Trans are psychotic, read Lacan. Giving them easy access to drastic surgery is dumb.

I wouldn't call it creepy, but I would call it attacking low hanging fruit, picking on the potentially weak and petty. The Anitas of the world are one thing, but when a teen vlogs and two minutes of it contains a snippet of feminist navel gazing and then someone like sargon or bearing with a massive and known to be abusive audience is made aware of this fact they don't go and tell this youngin the error of their ways in a calm rational manner, twenty of them in a row will tell them they need to die or drink bleach immediately. It's made all the worse when they tell this to a young trans or a rape abuse victim. Which has happened multiple times.

You might be the toughest motherfucker ever and none of this would effect you, but it does effect some and not all of them were asking for it or knew that their is a massive community waiting to dissect in thunderfoot word by word anal retentive detail about an offhand comment they made about feminism.

Good
Can dweebs actually post arguments instead of saying "read x"

I only want HRT myself.

...

Oh, shut the fuck up. Common language is a practical necessity in occupational situations, especially something academic that focuses on tremendous amounts of specialized jargon. Moreso in English, now that it's replaced Latin as the lingua franca of intelligentsia.

I mean, is anybody bitching about the unfairness of yankees toward People of Southernness?

Disgusting tranny is disgusting. Ya'll niggas don't even know quality.

contrapoints isn't transgender, he is just a fabulous guy

Really? Damn, seems like a bro.

When it's all you're exposed to by liberal English teachers. You think I'm kidding? In my AP English Language class in high school, we had to read Malcolm X's autobiography. My AP Spanish Literature class (which I took to get extra credits to skip classes in college) was, for a good part of the second semester, a lot of talk about how men are responsible for oppressing women. My AP Gov teacher made a specific thing of mentioning how Congress is becoming less and less "old Christian white men".

When you're surrounded by liberal idpol loudspeakers like Buzzfeed and John Oliver and are then given extra bullshit in school with a veneer of respectability while the opposition is merely right-liberal idpol, stuff gets ingrained in your head.

That being said, that was in the Bay Area, which is pretty much the center of idpol (and unfortunately also any sort of job relating to computers and mathematics and engineering).

As someone who believes in the primacy of class warfare in one of the most classcucked societies possible, I felt like I was being gaslighted until I found this place. I always felt that something was deeply wrong with idpol and that states, corporations, and other material institutions of power were responsible for a lot of the misery in the world right now.

...

Which women aren't in capitalism, nor are men somewhere outside that sphere. That shit stopped being an issue nearly a hundred years ago.

grow up

Ah, the child's favorite insult.

I did acknowledge english as the common language, but you need to realise language changes with culture, no matter how common it is.

mabye, just cant be arsed with people who believe transgender is a mental illness. Go outside dude. It saddens me we share the left.

Don't give them ideas.

Part of being an adult is accepting that other people are able to make their own choices, even if you don't like them. It doesn't harm anyone or anything if a tranny gets a sex change. Why do you care so much? It's their decision to make, not yours.

Yes, grow up.

How is he wrong? How does gender displacement or whatever the fuck it's called is not fit the definition of a mental illness? If such a thing as "mental illness" exists fuck off psychoanylists, then imagining that you are something that you are not would seem to fit the definition.

Bullshit. That is an arbitrary quality applied to a biological reality. Being an adult is nothing more than being post-pubescent, regardless of how many spooks get associated with it by the people–usually children–who want to imagine it as an identity.

Its gender dysphoria, and it seems as if your denying the existence of mental illness. I mean, it fits your definition of what mental illness is, but it would because some people would be adverse to trans people. At the end of the day, its not your choice, and it shouldnt be anyone elses choice as to whether someone can or cant be trans. Its not gonna be the undoing of the moral fabric of society, or whatever shit some people say it is.

That's not the question, though, is it? The question is whether or not trannys are mentally ill. Some guy who feels the need to repeatedly bang his head against a wall is not hurting anyone else either, but that does not change the fact that he is insane.

Okay, imma appease your real outdated ideas, why does someone being transgender effect you PERSONALLY? why do you care?

Equating dysphoria with insanity is fucking madness.

That has nothing to do with the question.

That's it? Just argumentum ad hominem? That's the only reason anyone seems to want to give for why it isn't a mental illness despite it seeming to fall squarely into that category.

Being "are transgenders mentally ill"? if thats the question, the burden of proof lies on you. If you wanna talk seriously about dysphoria being a mental illness, imma need you to show me evidence. Credible, scientific evidence. Anything else will receive "citation needed".

you will never cuddle with contrapoints whilst playing skyrim

So youve come and argued trans people are mentally ill with no evidence at all. Fuck off.

It's a simple question of definitions. There is NAMI's defintion:

Here is the CDC's:

Here is the current DSM definition:

Gender dysphoria seems to fit pretty squarely into all of them.

No, definitions are scientific evidence. Try again.

nothing? no studies? no charts? not even an article? but i guess feels not reals strikes again huh

By reading marx and actually believing his views on culture, socialization and human behavior

wew and wew

Of course, idpol reinforces people's false consciousness while supporting the one-dimensionality of the system they live in. It makes people legitimately think they're challenging and changing the system by simply swapping out people of one race with another.

why do you ruin my dreams :'(

Depression is a mental illness dipshit. Having a mental illness doesn't mean you're "throw them in a straight jacket" crazy. It's just what said.

It does no one any favors by indulging the delusions of a person with a mental illness. We don't do it for schizophrenics,or people with Body Integrity Identity Disorder, why should we do it for people with GID?

Because muh group rights! [autistic screeching]

Malcom X was idpol, and thats wrong, but he did have some very revolutionary ideals

If there was ever actual proof of meme magic, that would be it. There is not one single drop of evidence to support that, it's just retards repeating other retards because feelz.

Citation needed. Show me a scientific study that say Gender Dysphoria is a mental illness. your feelings dont matter in this debate

you guys really dont like science do you. im still waiting for anyone to show me evidence of GID being a mental illness.

back to tumblr idpol snowflake

Your demands are very telling of your lack of education.

Mental illness is a broadly defined topic, thus you're not going to find a study "that says X is a mental illness" for ANYTHING because that is fucking unhelpful for medical and scientific professionals. WHAT WOULD YOU EVEN BE STUDYING? There's no "mental illness" section of the brain you buffoon.

That something "is a mental illness" tells you nothing about that specific condition, which is what matters. Instead, you'll find studies, studying the specific causes and effects of pathological conditions.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11605311

pb.rcpsych.org/content/32/8/316.3

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8992520

onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1046/j.1440-1614.2001.00859.x/full

scholar.google.com/scholar?q=gender identity disorder schizophrenia

There's plenty of associations of GID with schizophrenia (which you're also not going to find a "study showing it's a mental illness"). We don't understand how GID develops, we're trying to figure it out.

nice one dude

The should give Trump some hummus with that celery. Eating it raw like that tastes nasty.

Inb4 red flag faggots disappear from the thread only to appear again tomorrow making the same debunked argument.

Hey reddit, whatcha doin'?

Anyway fam, read Lacan. GID is a matter of psychosis. It's all in the Name-of-the-Father.

Called it.

Mental illness is a spook. I'm surprised being anti-capitalist isn't a mental illness yet

Not really. Apparently, it is not a fixed concept.

The extent of discussion was
We literally made charts with liberal "integrationists" on one side and not-liberal "nationalists" on the other side. They put Stokely Carmichael and Huey Newton on the nationalist side, didn't even mention Fred Hampton.
Just shoot me, these people suck.
They always downplayed the revolutionary side of him and emphasized the "fuck all white people, especially Jews" part. Someone even brought up Palestine once. What the hell is wrong with them? GAAAAH!

Ok, fine, we'll consider that gender dysphoria really is a mental illness (which I'm still unsure about). What about it? It's not harming anyone. If they want to get treated for it like how people with depression choose to, that's equally as valid as solving it by undergoing an operation.

The only winning move when it comes to identity politics is to make no move, to ignore them entirely or simply refute them if you see an opening.

Like what?

The point is that everyone working in the same field needs to conform precisely to identical language. Ethnic/regional/youth/subcultural/etc snowflake dialects are fine among laymen, but they must be cast aside when working as an expert. Linguistic descriptivism is an intellectually bankrupt concept

That's it.

Oh my god, why would you ask that? Nobody fucking wants to read any of that shit again.

Because I don't know what today's supposedly "real" feminists have problem with, it was never my concern. What is it then? Porn industry and advertisement?

#NoTrueFeminist