I'm starting to think that there are many people in the Right, particularly the radical Right...

I'm starting to think that there are many people in the Right, particularly the radical Right, who are egalitarians at heart who have simply found no proper outlet for it.

Think about it. Today's politics can be divided between those who are in favor of hierarchy (conservatives) those who focus on dismantling economic hierarchies (socialists), those who focus on dismantling identity hierarchies (libs) and those who want to dismantle inequalities of status, of social and cultural capital, of looks, of social skills, of sexuality etc, which is much of the radical right.They are often outcasts, particularly if they're young and male, and because there's no real language of left-leaning orientation to address those concerns, the outcome is that they cling harder and harder to identity and economic hierarchies, because the former gives them a sense of superiority to compensate for individual failures to fit in, and the latter gives them hope to ascend to a place beyond those concerns.

I think the social hierarchies the Left usually concerns itself with give them a sense of order and certainty that they're reluctant to let go of. Their Houellebecqian little minds start to wonder if undoing those formal hierarchies won't just bring more and more emphasis to the informal hierarchies based on certain traits and skills they don't possess.

IMO, we could save ourselves a lot of future headache if we start now addressing this problem, kicking those silly thoughts out of their head and making them realise they're proles before anything else.

That's wrong. Race is real. Non whites are incapable of civilization.

The first civilization was made by non-whites.

Really activates your almonds, doesn't it?

Is there no value to my argument bout you and most of your kind being just incel failsons who just want to believe things like that because it removes the pressure of being incel failsons?

This acts from the assumption that leftism is the natural state of man, and that when he is not leftist, it must be because of some malfunction.

I see no reason for this to be correct.

Same for radical islamists right? God you are f** delusional mate

Everyday we inch closer to whites no longer being the majorities in their own homelands and subject of black and brown imperialists. It is a disaster. The lower races will eat us alive.

it doesn't though

Literally humans vs orcs

Wait, what about the radical islamists?

It does, they're not leftists because they're failures, they're not leftists because things haven't been explained well enough to them, they're not leftists and they are supposed to be so, if only it wasn't for some malfunction.

Maybe you should take a class in intersectionality. Being a minority is atrocious. Especially when that the conquering peoples have been brainwashed from birth to blame all the ills of the world on European imperialism. I sincerely hope Europe pulls a Sampson option and nukes itself before it formally falls to muslim and African rule.

You've missed the fact that I'm addressing particularly people who, altogether, resent some type of social hierarchy and power system out there, and I'm just mentioning the fact that, of the three major types of inequality, those who attack two of them lean towards the Left and those who focus on one lean towards the radical Right, and I'm trying to identify the reasons for that.

People who don't bother with those hierarchies or consider them right/natural/fair I just vaguely labelled conservatives and set aside because they're not the point of the OP.

Really makes you think who the lower race really is don't it?

Close one mate, almost made the most basic observation about universal human ideas.

Vae Victus

That they too are just confused egalitarians

Because you're thinking according to a dichotomous political spectrum which is reflected in the abstract generalities of your criticism: failures / non failures, well enough / non-well enough, malfunctioning / proper.

He'll either teach you just how much better than niggers he is or invoke Atlanteans (assuming he's not Holla Forums falseflagging, which is something i've been noticing a lot), don't derail OP's good thread.

Leftism is the natural outcome of man.
Malfunction is Ideology.


Oppression naturally leads to resentment and revolt, that revolt can be directed to either emancipatory goals under leftist theory or reactionary ones through identitarian and fascist ideology. Antideutsche-bro explained it pretty well. It's a shame his thread was shitposted into the ground.

Culturekampf just needs to ease up on whites and give them their safe spaces along with everyone else. Leftist idealism needs to compromise with human nature and realize people like to be with people who look and think like them.
Rightist demagogues need to realize that radicalism always has a material cause and that well-fed, secure people become moderate, soft, and peace loving. If they took any time to research Islam, they'd see it's riddled with subversive moderating elements that would quickly water it down. The only things stopping them are the desperate material conditions of violence and poverty.

I don't totally disagree with you, to be honest.
What this should reveal to everyone is that whites and nonwhites alike have a shared vested interest in ending and then preventing imperialism, so no race can become the de facto subject of another. But the capitalists presiding over a system that invariably trends towards imperialism of one sort or another finagle it so that the short-term interests of members of one race separate from and then counter those of others. It's too bad that multiculturalism and globalism are so often aligned with precisely the sort of racial unity we need in order to to combat and overcome them.
Today's capitalists are predominately white and jewish, but capitalism is in no sense inherently white or jewish.


No, but it's certainly important to look seriously at how these puritan fundamentalists are able to push their fundamentalism so effectively under a banner of "anti-imperialism," namely against the secular pan-Arab nationalism of yesterday, whereby autocratic strongmen themselves came to power under a banner of "anti-imperialism."

kek. it's funny to counter troll Holla Forumsinsects will these type of infographics. shows them the absurdity of their notion that human beings aren't equal

My God man, thinking human beings are equal is pure ideology. It's retarded. We can all only run as fast as we can run, or get so far in mathematics without improving no matter the hours put in.

This shit is fucking retarded way to tackle the differences in global populations.

Huh. That's funny. Your entire ideology contradicts millennia of a deeply entrenched caste system and all of the sexual behavior that upheld it. Not only those your 19th century deny differences among groups but within as well.

This assumes that ideology stems from some sort of power matrix that is central in the SJW ideology, as if it's all strategy in a game theory setting. Because things don't work as they should do in such a setting, there must be subversive forces who manipulate this for their own gain, thereby affirming the consequent.

This is the central flaw in marxism and it's derivatives, it is always true, and when it's not, that means the enemy has the upper hand in the game.

I call this "zoo nationalism", a result of leftism so completely filling up the ideological horizon that even the far-right has to appeal to it. Hence the saying "we are the true multiculturalists, if we all mix diversity will be gone". Such a static world is impossible, much less desirable to any aware fascist, it would require a supreme command that continuously keeps everything in check, the zoo keepers so to say, which if it ever happened would mean exactly that a cabal rules the whole the world, which is exactly the globalism they oppose.

I don't, I'm pointing out how the OP presents it as such.

Minorities don't make it easy to defend them when they start rioting as proof they aren't destructive criminals. I've yet to see white rioters who aren't antifa or white guilt liberals tbh fam.

The mental gymnastics are real.

No die hard right winger is egalitarian. Outliers, moderates and people who were born into the belief system may have some egalitarian spirit but on the whole the far right is a product of autocratic, domination hierarchy thinking.

We know

pretty fucking genius indeed.

There is no enemy, there are competing historical forces(the proletariat and the bourgeoisie), both trying to perpetuate themselves.

They're egalitarians for whites with average to below-average intelligence and desperately wan to preserve their traditions and values. If you take HBD to its logical conclusion, the vast majority of whites are degenerates who are soon to become utterly useless to global capitalism, much like the minorities they despise.

The hilarious thing about this, especially among the more authoritarian capitalist types, is that if they tried to teach HBD/social Darwinism to the high-IQ Ivy League/MIT/Berkeley types that would actually be running the State, it would just confirm their priors about poor whites being stupid religious sexist degenerates, and said right-wingers would probably get social liberalism on steroids. Could you imagine a better way to get rid of democracy than to convince the neoliberal managerial class that it's the best way to protect gays, minorities, and women from persecution by white redneck degenerates? kek

It's funny because Hitler kinda started it.

Also fascism isn't far right.

Yes you do, your presentation is as much given to the idea of it as it is part of it

it's like.. ying and yang dude..


Nazism shared it's horizon with it's time and place, they were native to it.

Explain, or it must be the fact that I cannot point something out without mentioning it.

I agree

One thing that put me off the right is how elitist it is. I favoured a strong welfare state and zero immigration and I'm still somewhat sympathetic to that now. But the leaders of the alt-right are all rich kids. As a working class white guy I'm kind of between a rock and a hard place.

You are the perfect mirror for reality. Your ideas are brilliant flashes of light in a world of pitch ignorance.

I really don't think that's the case. Imperialism is a necessary result of the capitalist mode of production. The only way to ensure whites are never catching, rather than pitching, is to overturn the conditions that uniquely and assuredly cause imperialism.
Besides, I'm clearly appealing to rightism here

You got me. I now feel like a liberal lol.
Yeah but you claimed here that today's fascists and nationalists are bad or wrong for celebrating diversity meanwhile the original IRL fascists like Hitler and Tojo collaborated with foreign fascists and cultivated some deranged internationalism.

I don't know about specific fascist theorists but it always seemed to lean more towards preservation than supremacy, at least in rhetoric.

That's because you're replying to Holla Forums. He's saying that the idea of equality between nations is wrong and a product of Liberalism.

reply to

...

There is no imperialism as such, with that I mean is that it's one of those catch-all terms that is affirming the consequent when applied to that other catch-all term, capitalism. If this theory were correct, wars of conquest should have reached it's zenith by now, while in fact the opposite has occurred.

Communism is a nothingness and therefor the solution to everything, presenting all actuality as projection of holographic information, all history has hitherto been the history of class struggle, base vs superstructure, dialectics, commodification and so on…. The problem with this circular reasoning, confined in itself, and therefor only answering itself, is that it makes so much sense, there will always be an answer because question and answer are one and the same.


They didn't mean a word of it, they created ideological cargo cults that subscribed to the ideological horizon in a token manner, like the second cousin twice removed of a medieval king claiming the throne on the base of legitimacy.

Which no one in their right ming would support today and died right before we started existing. So much for human nature!

So it's unnecessary to appeal to right-wing concerns when you're not talking to people with whom it is necessary to appeal to right-wing concerns? Gee…

Liberalism is what leads to exploitative and codependent relationships between countries. Of course I wouldn't advocate for any sort of "enforced equality" between nations and I recognize that's self-defeating because it itself implies an exploitative relationship. Free association between nations, or communities, whatever, can not be achieved by prohibiting free association, but by removing the barriers to it erected by production relations.


How do you figure? Outright conquest is far less efficient and effective than the form imperialism takes today, and as such we shouldn't expect to see it predominate. Consider Kipling's The White Man's Burden. It's an openly racist critique of conquest and colonialism as outmoded, inefficient, and ultimately doomed to failure. You don't have to be a social liberal to see the contradictions in this sort of policy, and why the ruling class is pressured by pragmatic reality to adopt a more refined approach. On the contrary, liberals seem to cast decolonization as some sort of "awakening" of the ruling class as to the "moral wrongness" of its actions, which couldn't be further from the truth.
I think they have fairly clear, objective definitions. These aren't just post hoc terms thrown out to clumsily describe events.
You've used this phrase a couple times now, but I'm really not seeing any assumptions that (A->B)->(B->A) anywhere here or within Marxism

I don't follow. You seem to simultaneously claim that Marxism is unfalsifiable and that it has been falsified.

The radical right is getting bigger because the middle class is disappearing and all these frustrated people seek for an outlet to find who is responsible for their problems (unemployment, poverty etc)

So they end up blaming the immigrants, the various conspiracies, anyone but the ones that are actually responsible.

These people won't join the Left because the Left is being portrayed as a muslim-loving degenerate movement by their opponents. This is what we should fix

This is what I meant with the question and answer being the same, if the conclusion doesn't follow from the theory, it's only because it's even more sneaky and efficient. It's the same in every marxist derivative, the patriarchy/empire/capital is absolute, and if it isn't, it's because the apparent lack of it is an illusory feature. There is a man hiding in the room, if you can't find him, that proves how good he is at hiding himself.


It's not a matter of with how much ease it can described in dictionaries. .


It takes capitalism as a singular entity, an everything, a map that is mistaken for the territory, reasoning from this it is taken as holographic, the true form that expresses itself in the multitude. This postulates a mechanic of the workings of capitalism, by assuming it in it's premise, and then confirming it by it's own logic.

This is why marxist writers call anything and everything capitalist modes of domination, capitalism -by being capitalism- seeks to dominate everything, and therefor everything that can be related to it, from pop songs to architecture, is concluded to be tools of this domination.


It is unfalsifiable for those who believe in it, which is why it is so hard to discuss with marxists, they always drag you into their language game and demand you reason according to it's rules.

Imperialism isn't hidden. It's readily observable what is done, and who benefits. Capitalists don't really have a reason to be categorically sneaky. It's done through proxy war, installing governments sympathetic to international capital, destabilizing regions, and so on because those are strictly more advantageous and more profitable than outright conquest given current conditions. I'm surprised you would deny that point, look at the Bush boondoggles in Afghanistan and Iraq. The most advanced military in the world can't effectively occupy two countries against insurgent cavepeople with beat up rifles and improvised explosives. Look at the string of colonial wars in the British Empire, which in many ways relied on an arms disparity that no longer exists to be effective, and were nonetheless costly.
You really have to view it as an evolutionary process akin to natural selection or game theory. If it is more profitable under current objective conditions for party A, a state representing the interests of several capitalists, to take a certain action than its alternatives, it gets a competitive advantage or looses a disadvantage against party B and can then accumulate, or stop loosing, power. If party B (and others) does the same, the paradigm changes to that new action, and if they do not, they diminish in relative power and importance to where those agents who adhere to the new paradigm, and thus the paradigm itself, come to dominate. There's no mysticism here, it's a matter of rational economic self-interest. People don't even need to be cognizant of those interests for the process to function, again, as with natural selection.

Capitalism isn't an "absolute idea," it's an emergent property of the rational economic interests of those who demonstrably hold the means of production.
I don't see where this is done. If you mean that using historical/dialectical materialism to explain society is begging the question, literally every worldview asserts premises which then imply its conclusions (provided the logic is sound.) Hell, even in physical sciences you need to assume the universe exists, is observable, is governed by laws invariant over space and time, and which can be approximated by models with predictive capability. But chemistry is hardly a circular philosophy.
It's technically inappropriate from the standpoint of Marxist theory to anthropomorphize capitalism and ascribe it goals and a volition "of its own," since it's an emergent property of individual material interests structured in a specific way we can analyze, and not an autonomous entity, but we often do so informally when it's clearly a metaphor, and always with fundamental causes in mind. Tying it to its fundamental causes around things in the real world (say, MoP) is the "materialist" part of the theory, no less! Even in orthodox microeconomics we talk about how an equilibrium ''responds to pressure" as a demand curve "shifts," in chemistry we talk about where electrons "want to go."

Your critique here applies to everything and leaves nothing. It reduces to solipsism.

This, however, is a valid point, and I'm myself rather skeptical of the work of the Frankfurt School.

Popper's falsifiability criterion is flawed in a similar way. There's no formulation of the social sciences which can satisfy it.
It's important to point out here that SJWism is rather easy to critique "according to its own rules" and effortlessly contradicts itself, almost wherever you look, just as Marxism exclusively critiques capitalism within capitalism's own internal logic and rules. Dialectics, the analysis of something's internal contradictions, is really the tool we have to weigh up "meta-narratives" against one another. If you have another one, shoot, but otherwise your position defaults to either postmodernism or some other radical subjectivism.

Besides, something like
essentially brackets metaphysics

Just a couple of examples of how utterly retarded you are

Homosexuals and Jews. It is controlled opposition.

Why? Why do you need someone to lead you? Lead thy self.

ISHYGDDT

Kicking their brains of their heads has historically had better results.

The Celts were the people who discovered soap, and they had an advanced civilization including bathhouses and roads. This is just regurgitating 2000 year old Roman racism.

They need to take the class pill and start hating people who control the MoP.

We wuz warlords n sheeit
Romani ite domum

The Jewish banking elite.