New sectarian atmosphere

this

exterminate Stalinism and Maoism

It's an echo chamber, and that's precisely the way you can tell them apart from other communities.

Hey dude, you're cool. Hope your life goes well.

Anti-Stalinism is a code word for anti-Communist.

No one will force the market on you tho, under proper anarchism, socialists can decide to experiment with planned production as long as they dont become totalitarian nutjobs

It depends on how you behave. If you are a non-anarchist and don't act like a retard no one will call you a tankie.

...

That train of thought is retarded because many anarchists see "disagreeing with them" or "being a marxist" as acting like a retard, and then they call them tankies.

Lmao. Anarchist claims of Marxist dogma is only matched by their dogma against what they percieve as "tankie". Idealists and fools all.

Basicaly a tankie is any guy who defends Stalin as a nice guy, or the USSR as actual socialism.

This is basicaly synonymous with being retarded.

Too many times its been just a buzzword for what anarchists don't like.

stalin never died he just fled to the kurdish mountains and started loving the trees and shit

I suppose I can see it being used against people who say the bolsheviks were nice guys too.

This

It was a classless society, it was socialism. Fuck you.

no. ideology is a disease that needs to be destroyed in and of itself. the only way the left can unite is if we move beyond the left and ideology itself.

The fact that people like you exist is one of the things that is holding the left back. You are almost as bad as the idpols.

I wonder whos gonna /get/

For like the 2 seconds under Lenin's soviets I suppose it was.

STOP BEING SECTARIAN!

that is what I'm trying to suppress, but anarchists and leftcoms make it really hard for me

I'm really glad that we are miles apart
because I have a short temper and may cause some problems for myself and people around me

I've noticed a lot of hostility towards theory in the anti-Trump movement. Also a lot of hostility in divulging and simplifying theory by actual leftists.

sectarianism is practically the left's founding meme

praise comrade stalin

Stalin dindonuffin

We always talked shit to one another before, but there seem to be some new guys wearing anarchist flags who have recently gone on a crusade against all marxists whom they describe as "tankies." I don't know if they are just newfags or pigs trying to split us. Either way, they are not helping anything.

Ah yes, people who support the theory responsible for the most revolutions, which lasted longest, are the ones holding leftism back.

because those theories resulted in brutality that most people you're trying to convert don't feel comfortable with?

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There needs to be a minimum of ideological overlap, seems like you lack it.

That guy smells of bacon. Don't take his flag too seriously.

Tankie hate thread it is then.

Now this faggot you can take seriously. Nihilists are always like this.

Since when are these factors in anyway a sign of socialism? Based on that Primitivists should be the only ideology, their glorified society existed for millions of years.

This is like when the idpols call people who disagree with them racists and shit.

Tankies, everyone

AKA, they resulted in REVOLUTION. REVOLUTION IS BRUTAL. You are a fucking moron if you are against brutality and call yourself an anarchist, let alone an anarcho-nihilist.

They're not comfortable with brutality? They must be pretty fucking uncomfortable with the present state of affairs then. You'd think if they hated brutality so much, their number one goal would be a brutal revolution to put a stop to all the imperialist brutality that is killing millions. No, they're hypocrites on brutality. They'll come to honestly love it when automation decimates the job market and global warming ruins their crops and coastal communities. They will be calling for genocide. It's our job as leftists to make sure it's a porky genocide.

Name ONE (1) socialist state that meets your autistic standard.

funny, I was thinking the same thing.

This post is nonsensical.

...

Communism is classless and stateless. Socialism is just classless. Jesus christ, anarchists really don't have any theory.

It's cuz reddit tankmeisters found us
This board used to be almost completely left libertarian, ancom and syndie
Then reddit purged the ultras, and they came here, but they made good posts
Then reddit purged the weebs (ironically, the most reactionary group of online permavirgins there is), and they came here
Then we got raided for our Wolff thing, and more redditors settled here
Then Holla Forums got mad that our board got more popular than theirs, so they raided us and settled here
Then Holla Forumss confused rejects came here after being banned, and became nazbol and tankies as well

Once upon a time, these tards would show up and we would all laugh at them, and tell them to gb2/marx/

>>>/marx/

Quite ironic.

it shouldn't be against its own people after the revolution is fucking over. not to mention the concept of revolutions is inherently ideological and the individual is often lost in the ideology. this is especially easy when using a tool such as the state.

again, i meant brutality against the people by the state, not against the bourgeoisie

>>>/liberty/
it is where you belong stupid animal

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The state is the manifestation of the ruling class interest. In a "classless society," there is only one class, which in the case of the USSR was the proletariat. The USSR state was manifested to create and defend revolution from the bourgeois states, which was the interest of the proletariat. Communism can only become classless and stateless because it means the abolition of the proletariat class as well, through automation.

The bourgeois and traitors aren't the "own people" of a revolution. That's a nationalist spook.

The revolution never ended in the USSR because it was always under siege. The definition of socialism is the revolutionary stage between capitalism and communism.

This is incomprehensible nonsense.

Dude, just fucking purge me already. Reading your bullshit is making me lose brain cells at an amazing pace. You might as well kill me now than have me go through the torture of reading tankie "theory".

As you can see, marxist have proved themselves to be genocidal faggots yet again

They manage to be almost as dense as Holla Forumstards.

you know
I really hate you with passion right now

>>>/anarcho/

...

Its ok, The hate is mutual you bootlicker cuck

so we're just ignoring Stalin's psychotic tendencies towards political foes and the failure of Mao's cultural rev. and great leap forward. all of these are products of the state

still not an excuse for the abuse under the USSR

not really

You're the faggots going on about purging "tankies," yet when confronted with a simple fucking argument you throw up your hands and go woe is me. Anarchists, vanguard of the stupid.

Hello Trotriend, I'm sure you embraced this meme.

Ah yes, Stalin's purges are literally the only thing the USSR ever did.

Yeah, but the thing is your argument is wrong as fuck.

He also starved people, imposed a totalitarian regime on other countries and created a new form of aristrocracy

aka the new bourgeoisie. and look at what russia and china have descended into. the same capitalistic exploitation that the states aimed to end.

Dude, whether the USSR did good things is irrelevant to them being socialist or not.

I dare you to name just one

it's not
and it will never be
banner of revolution will be red with the blood of anarchists

Yet again marxists proving they are genocidal faggots

you asked for it

The Kronstadt guys.

Again the tankie reveals his counter-revolutionary tendencies for all to see! You guys are a literal parody of communism.

Utter slave morality

Many anarchists supported the Bolshevik revolution. Those who did not decided to blow shit up. Makhno did. The Konstadt rebellion did. It's fair to say that more anarchist attempts have been violently put down by bourgeois states more so rather than ML ones.

Individual leader's failiures are somehow representative of how useful of the state is as a tool of power? I think not.

Really now? What is the abuse you speak of? Political repression? Bound to happen. If you're pissed at the deaths of so many comrades who might have been innocent than I understand. It rubs me the wrong way as well, but for real I believe utilizing a state is the best path for us not to end up like the ever growing list of crushed socialist attempts.

It is like you never lurked in this board your entire life. The purges along with WW2 killed off many, many members of the Communist party. Leaving individuals who basically lacked the dedication and fervour of past members. I would say that they became petty-bourgs in terms of mentality and decided to give concessions to factory owners and revisionism.

Ideological traitors, you mean.

Doing a strike in favour of having a less repressive system is totally the same as blowing shit up.
Even if they did start blowing shit up, they would have been justified, seeing how the bolsheviks abolished the soviets and took power for themselves instead of giving it to the workers.

le "they did worse tho" meme

Not an argument.

muh bureaucracy = bourgeoisie

the revolution failed and it turned into a normal capitalist country

the revolution saw massive setbacks, and retreated to a state capitalist NEP which has created the world's biggest economy while raising hundreds of millions out of poverty with history's fastest, most dramatic industrialization.

So basically, if a communist revolution fails or sees setbacks due to capitalist hostility, everything that follows is the fault of the communist revolution. If we apply this logic to anarchism, anarchists are responsible for fascist Spain, socialist Ukraine, and (soon) re-integrated bourgeois Syria.

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Yeah. Which is why every counter-revolutionary movement from Whites and White Finland to France and England were hurrying to help them.

that sums it up, you are purely ideological. pure ideology if you will.

When did that happen?

yes because those leaders controlled the entire movement

then don't start a "revolution" that's easy to pinpoint and crush. terror cells formed by affinity groups are way harder to catch, especially if on a large scale. stay ungovernable.

(cont.)
I've said this before. Anarchism has always been crushed in their most ideologically pure state. No anarchist state has survived long enough to be subject to bourgeois ideology destroy it from within. It has pretty always been from bigger and larger bourgeois states which is probably why there are as many advocates for a state as is.

That came after the revolution due to the material conditions of Russia. Russia wasn't that industrialized and people were starving and pissed after a civil war and such. Lenin understood this and had the NEP to build up infrastructure. Even then you have to have a plan because simply "give it to workers" is not going to solve everything. The specific condition that USSR was in led to the necesity of the NEP and such. Other ML revolutions went much smoother although they all had the eventual problem of falling to revisionism, I believe that the left can learn from the mistakes of the past as whole to prevent such things from happening.

there was no theory behind them apart from reelection of soviets and removal of party influence from the army
their policies were no different from NEP

top kek, literally CIA. Terror cells can last forever while accomplishing fuckall. there is no successful movement in history based on isolated terror cells, and very few successful groups based on organized terrorism either.

As one of the few Communalist on this board,I'm starting to feel a lot more annoyed at anarkiddies than Marxists. Maybe this is what Bookchin tried to warn us about lifestylism? Tankies are id-polled on soviet symbolism. Leftcoms are fucking leftcoms. Trots are a humorless people.

I feel like Communalism has a lot more in common with traditonal marxism tbqh

tankies

This is kind of reasoning could easily be used to justify capitalism because any problem within the system is the problem of the individual, even if the said individual held a lot of power in the system.

Stupid arguments get stupid replies

"those leaders" had conflicting interests. Why is it that Deng was so removed from Maoist thought? Why did Khruschev decide to screw over Soviet planned economy? All of which are revisionist in their own right. There are conpeting factions within each party and it is clear that things are more complicated than simply using these men as attacking points.

Not the same thing though. The "state" can be used to enforce the rule of the bourgeoisie or the proletariat. It is a tool. Capitalism is the material reality that we are in as of now.

...

The only reason Communalism exists is because of how much Bookchin ended up hating anarkids by the end of his life, to the point where he felt that trying to "fix" the movement would be impossible.

That doesn't mean that China can't be criticized because it was all Mao's fault and in theory it should enforce the rule of the bourgeoisie.

Btw I don't get why would you need to enforce the rule of the proletariat on others. The proletariat is the majority ffs, that would mean maximalized democracy not a one-party state.

More importantly, there is no need for an NEP or anything like in industrialized countries. The early-twentieth century revolutions were jumping the gun on historical materialism.

This nigger gets it.

Because people are confused at what's going on in the world right now. Lots of different ideas, lots of disagreements.

Hungary

hungary revolt was rife with fascists.

idk why but "rife with fascists" reminded me of this

Daily reminder to everyone that the ban on factions was precisely the excuse that stalin used to purge the old bolsheviks who disagreed with him on anything

without 'sectarianism' we just have an echo chamber

Lenin almost immediately subordinated all independent soviets to the Sovnarkom and dissolved those which didn't return Bolshevik majorities. What happened when the non-Bolshevik ones resisted dissolution? Kronstadt.

Lenin was a proto-tankie, along with Trotsky. Stalin just took things to their logical conclusion.

Seriously? The dust of the event has long settled, and you're still accusing Nagy of "fascism"? What the fuck, man, what the fuck. Like arguing with a wall. What the fuck.

This is why people don't take the far left seriously: because it's actually rife with downright reality deniers spewing support for actual fascists like Kim Jong Un.

Every single "hi, I just came over from Holla Forums" thread, a tankie says "convert to ML immediately" and I always have to refute the same. fucking. arguments. We need a purge of tankie shitposting, now.

There is nothing wrong with the MLs making a case for their own ideology.

They can have their own threads for that. They hijack every thread that they can and don't shut up, even after you refute them. I'm telling you, parties and party-supporting ideologies spread themselves like cancer. It's as much a rule of them as it is that the first job of the bureaucracy is to protect the bureaucracy.

so your syndicates would be without bureaucracy?
what a fucking joke

also
you usually refute your own strawman
continue to fight your own shadow

I am not sure how many of them are serious and how many are taking a piss. There is no way of knowing. It is just like how I strongly suspect that the nihilist and the supposed ancom in this thread have less than honest intentions, but I have no way of knowing whether or not that is true.

...

Anarchists are COINTELPRO. If you don't just blindly hate everything done by 20th century aspiring socialist states, you deserve to be killed.

One is left to wonder what sort of force would do this killing. Maybe some sort of… state?

Triggered.

I disagree with your conclusion. Marxists, even the orthodox one, are of a much more dangerous nature than any Post-left lifestylist.

He's either a cop or a newfag to leftism. The nihilist is probably n1x without his trip.

Well yeah, because post-leftists are incapable of ever accomplishing anything.

This

In the sense that they have a track record of actually seizing power whilst narchos have a track record of dying? Sure.

I imagine this was what it was like when fascists killed the anarchists on 4chan.
Why does stupidity always kill freedom?

never underestimate what humans are willing to sacrifice for "muh dick/vagina" or "muh power"

Because freedom stupidly fails to have a coherent praxis.

you're just too dumb to get it

u wot m8

If something keeps happening over and over again, it's almost like there is some kind of condition underlying society that makes it so. Maybe a material condition? But fuck that, who needs theory?

Yeah, I never quite understood the whole fight-for-two-years-and-then-die strategy.

the praxist of freedom: i am going to ass fuck my girlfriend, take a microdose of acid, lift weights naked in my gigantic forested back yard, cut some wood, start a fire, shoot my dinner and then relax by the fire while i make art of statists having their heads chopped off using my own blood and pastels. fuck off

ironically I've never felt more welcome on Holla Forums

the reason this is happening is because the moderators have done nothing to stop the bunkerfag nazis like this guy from taking over

people are separated by attractiveness, killing prowess, intelligence and race. in every society in human history, the differences in ability between humans and sexes were codified into caste systems and social classes. Every single socialist society has failed to remedy this issue, with iran having more female reps than most socialist states and the nomenklatura being the de facto ruling caste in the USSR. Even among the leftist groups the men are almost always the leaders, the smartest and most attractive members being the leaders of the men. yet socialism completely ignores these common tendencies for social organization in its theories about property rights, racial and sexual equality along with the motivations people have for exploitation.

now you have two choices: retract your retarded "thus far x always happens so y is inevitable" argument or accept the conclusion of my counterargument that socialism fails to remove or account for innate qualitative differences in humans. Have fun with this one, you probably should think more clearly before you reject freedom

I'm just here to shitpost with my fellow 90s kids, friend. what is a bunkerfag?(USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)

are all the races equal, yes or no

are the sexes equal, yes or no

is class struggle the ultimate social problem, yes or no

do people deserve to be taken care of regardless of their output for society, yes or no

gulags are a necessity.

1 & 2) materially equal no. spiritually equal, debatable but I lean toward yes.

3) don't care about "class struggle" in the sense of big conglomeration of spooks leftists have built up around it, but I would like to kill bankers, mafia government fucks, etc.

4) those 2 things are orthogonal in my mind, which isn't the same as saying they don't deserve to be taken care of. ultimately its about who pays for what, I will take care of my parents in their old age for instance.

would you institute a racial caste system?

should women be kept out of politics, military and work place?

are you ok with for-profit usurous banking like what hitler tolerated during the build-up years? as long as its white bankers, investing in white owned industries? what about private property? is it acceptable to rent-seek or flip properties?

lastly, is physical strength and the will to take what you want a worthy justification for expaning one's territories and taking resources from others? how do you justify Hitler's attempts to conquer Europe?

No they certainly do, or at least did until their mods and a part of the user base banned everyone who didn't toe the party line

nice strawman you have there
mods are based for letting shit to sort itself out

sad!

yeah, riiiiiiiiiight…

????
wtf. I wasn't at all. Tankies are fascists, they have nothing to do with communism whatsoever.

then nobody has anything to do with communism whatsoever

...

great, not only you're an anarcho-syndicalist
you're also a relativist

congrats, you hit the rock bottom

really makes me think

does not compute

baited/10

Leninists are the original activists

like bunkerfag nazis?

bunkerfag nazi isnt an adhom attack, its a statement of what you are.

...

I love how anarkiddies think we aught to be afraid of them. You're all easily killable.

reminded me of this

You couldn't kill anything.

idk why this thread was bump locked, but it's allowed

why did you delete my post you fag

He said the uprising was filled with Fascists, which is factually correct.

Whether or not Nagy himself was Fascist - while not publicly espousing support, he did deliberately intervene to help Fascists murder Communists - is irrelevant.

...

You can kill only this board, with your shitposting.

...

...

Is this COINTELPRO?

It's always the anarchists that start it tho

I actually wasn't to alien to anarchist thought up until recently, but these repulsive asshole wearing the ancom and annihislist flags here makes it truly seem like it's living up to the idea of them just being angry teens.

Tankie was originally a term used to describe those who supported the invasions of Hungary and Czechoslovakia by the USSR. With time it has been expanded to anyone who uncritically supports dictators who operate in the name of communism. And according to these fuckwits everyone who thinks the USSR had any positive aspects or that a single word Lenin wrote is worth examining is a tankie as well. Marx and Engels were also tankies.

Anyone who writes >>>>/marx/ unironically on this fucking image board probably needs to GTFO to >>>>/anarcho/.

LMAO

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No its reality

I quite like the sectarian battles. When people use actual theory/history to argue their points of view, the conversations are often informative.
Anarchist v Tankie monkey-like shitflinging like in this thread is just embarrassing.

This.

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I was never an anarchist, but I can't deny looking at how anarchists behave has altered my view on anarchists. I honestly think I'm letting anarchists leave their best impression by basing my views on them by posters here rather than the idpol-infested fb anarchists.

You may say that taking anarchist behavior into consideration at all is FEELS>REELS, but honestly it does not matter how profound Kropotkin is, as long as anarchists continue to act as they do currently they won't ever be even a substantial minority.

Just base your views on actually organised syndicalists and platformists. They are the best.

Don't be too hasty. I suspect that the one supposed ancom is the same faggot that all the other ancoms were telling to drop his flag not long ago. The angry cat shows up to every discussion screaming about tankies before they even make themselves heard, which makes me suspect that he is either a cop or another kind of falseflagger. The nihilist is just like that. He is an anti-capitalists who wants to meme capitalism out of existence.

1. "Secterianism" doesn't apply when it's incompatible ideologies. Holla Forums has always been doomed to fail due to lack of ideological clearity.

2. Non MLs are basically american liberal teenagers

3. Those only got here because of youtube and reddit mentions as well as the disgusting socdem Sanders.

4. Their influx is fairly recent, so of course their cancerous newfaggotry leads to just what you were observing.

5. Connected with point 1 and the ideological clearity on Holla Forums, the only, lowest common denominator was "anti idpol" - and you can see the rise of newfaggotry by threads putting this into question and not understanding what identity politics actually is.
What used to be broad consensus has been subverted by a growing anarkiddy cancer brigade and there was nothing Holla Forums could've put up against that because there was no containing of the autism that is fringe socialist believes, such as anarchism and so on.

If you have any critisism of any of them you are more than welcome to post them.

Depends on what your fail condition is.
For ideological coherence, there is /marx/ and /anarcho/ for MLs and narchos respectively

0/10

Funny enough, Zizek promoted SYRIZA.
Now go, do something useful you're actually good at, like choking on dicks.

I never implied that you were unable to come up with some insult against them as well, nor that I supported them. You said only american liberals weren't ML's, and I listed some non ML leftists that doesn't fit that description (they are leftists wheter you like em or not). I also bet there is enough edgy american teens ready to suck stalins dick at a minutes notice without having read anything by him or even marx. That being said I have fairly close family who are ML's that I have way more respect of than the average anarkiddie.

Just stop typing, get back to sucking.

Not an argument.

thank god

Yeah, if we ever united you might have to get off your ass and actually do something.

I fucking hate anarchists. Don't think I've ever seen one make a post worth reading.

Go be Holla Forums somewhere else.

Pretty sure it's the anarchofaggots with the most right ring autists in their school of thought, reddit.

No. But you more than your genetic lineage of phenotype.

No. But we don't need to be for us to treat each other decently.

No. It's actually ecology. But it's so intertwined with the class system it can be considered part of it.

No. It's an illusion and makes people complacent. Be wary, be prepared. Always.

And this helps us… how?

If you want to stop someone from crushing your head with their boot, make sure you're better armed.
It's the only safeguard against tyranny.

You okay tankie?

I don't like Sanders and I've not heard leftypol mentioned in any youtube videos.

If you want to stop the anarkiddie flood, shitpost harder. I've not seen a good ML thread in weeks. Make one.

there are genotype differences between the races, Blacks are legitimately more likely to have powerful fast twitch muscle fibers in their legs and abs than we are. Asians are better at rote memorization than whites. Jews are verbally more dextrous than Whites. Whites are better inventors and artists than the other races. Whites have bigger bicep inserts, are on average taller and are probably the most efficient and deadly killers on Earth.
I have no problem with treating women with decency. They are worthy of decency, a degree of respect and of course the right to live and flourish. But, they're not the equals of men in terms of intellect, genius or physicality. They are great performers, beautiful, inspirational, often deft artisans. That doesn't constitute equality though. We are lacking by comparison in grace and sensitivity to raw emotion compared to women, thus we are unequal to them in that respect. We also can't bear children, but we do not have to deal with menstruation which are both unequal power relationships. So my real question is, do you understand that women will never fill the role of men as long as they could still be called women?
Its ecology AND ideology, they are both the poles of human existence and the only things that matter. Class struggle is an idea, its not the raw dynamic of idea itself which is more important to the fate of our species than economics ever will be. I agree about ecology's general primacy though I don't think you can be a leftist and still talk about the ecological implications of class and race and sex.
Would you accept the gradual (peaceful) reduction of the population down to ~1 billion healthy, mentally well, competent individuals?

I recognize the overall difference of geographically distinct populations. But I don't obsess over it and recognize that outliers exist. Implying Jews are one race also doesn't make a lot of sense. There are black jews, middle eastern, indian ones, even east-asian. Most of them might share a lineage, but clearly different.

Definitely. It would be better for everyone, and beats extinguishing civilization because we turned Earth into a toxic wasteland.
It's also something that could be achieved within this century.

I believe it's in humanity's best interests to make sure the next generation is as close to flawless as possible. Freed from the burden of genetic illness, and conforming to our ideals of intellect, beauty, athletic ability. All while being as representative as possible of our phenotype diversity.