Who are you rooting for in the French elections?

glorious insurrection

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Tiqqun

Nice accelerationism.

Nope, pragmatic realism

Also, far-right containment

Shit vote then

Has the word lost all meaning on this board?

It's like you love to be fooled.

Shit vote is anything that is not social-liberal

In the absence of genuine socialist faction, the wise choice is not to vote for a social-democrat. Social-democracy is not closest to socialism than libertarianism, it's just an other variation of capitalism, and not the best one to push a socialist agenda

Why ?

Voting Mélenchon or the "antiliberal left" actually is to be fooled

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Macron is the only candidate who literally promise nothing and will change nothing.
its amazing !.

Sure my vote will counts for little, but it only takes 5 minutes for me to do it so why shouldn't I go to vote

tbh accelerationism would be voting for LePen

It's like you don't want to bring production back to France and let the increased cost of wages force capitalists to automate and replace workers.

fuck off Holla Forums

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How is she going to do this exactly?

Your vote won't count for little: it will count for nothing. And there is literally an infinity of useless things that take less than 5 minutes; why pick up vote – and even plan it?

Obama

The meme that Fascism and other far-right governments in the 21st century somehow constitutes acceleration is fucking retarded. Acceleration is done by enacting more neoliberal policies, more imperialism, more everything that makes Porky porkier.
The more austerity, the more growth, the more wars in foreign land, the more "degeneracy", the more we're accelerating and the closer we are to the end.

The self-negating movement of the proletariat

The true centrist candidate in its purest form

Pure unadulterated accelerationism will continue to deindustrialize the west, leaving no industry to take over. Her economic """patriotism""" will impose taxes on companies hiring foreign nationals. They won't hire french workers because they're too expensive so they'll need to automate production.

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Macron and other Hillary-style neolibs are what created the far right. The modern far right only exists in opposition to them. They can't fight against the program of a committed socialist like Melenchon.

Le Pen

dude LePen would crash the Euro the moment the news of her election comes out.

Lepen

No. I can't believe even leftypol thinks this

Are you joking ?

Contemporary far-right existed long before neolibs. They just get out the closet with the internet

Not this piece of shit I hope.

I'm french and really I would prefer anyone over Macron

Même Lepen ?

Au moins l'élection de LePen causerait des manifs, et j'espère des radicalisation. En plus ça serait intéressant par rapport à l'UE

Si Macron est élu ça serait une victoire de la fausse politique et des propos vides

Benoît Hamon or Philippe Poutou

Nathalie Arthaud, Oscar Temaru

Sert à rien. Les forces de l'ordre (gendarmerie, armée, police,…) sont largement réacs et ne se retourneront pas. Au mieux on aurait l'équivalent des féministes américaines qui se mettent des bonnets en forme de chatte sur la tête pour protester contre Trump et des braquages des banlieusards en masse assortis de "nik la France ! On rentre au bled avec le cash !". Sans compter qu'avec Trump et Poutine, le contexte international est très favorable à un évolution autoritaire de la république. Au lieu de pouvoir faire monter la conscience politique des gens, on passerait notre temps à essayer de recouvrer un état démocratique et les débats publics seraient encore plus pollué par les foutaises sur l'Islam, la laicité, la délinquance, le terrorisme, ….

En quoi ? C'est pas l'UE le problème, c'est la propriété privée

Si il arrive à réduire un peu le chômage ça mettrait un coup aux discours antilibéraux et ça forcera les gens à approfondir leur critique.

On peste contre l'UE, la mondialisation, le "néolibéralisme", les écarts de richesses, ect mais jamais jamais jamais on ne remet en cause la propriété dans ce pays
Le principal obstacle à l'émergence d'un mouvement révolutionnaire socialiste en France, c'est que le sentiment anticapitaliste est totalement parasité par l'antilibéralisme.
Le meilleur moyen de défaire l'antilibéralisme, c'est de mettre un libéral modéré et "intelligent" comme Macron.

That's what most of the workers want at this point. They want nothing to do with the Euro or this continued EU madness. The poster you responded to is right, more liberalism will lead to more anger and resentment. That's the only accelerationist choice.

The refugees

So now worker movment is all about restoring old currencies and leaving an international organization ?

Wow. Socialism is really dead nowadays, there is only reactionnaries

I don't think it is positive if this discontentment is directed toward some liberal institutions and not property itself.

i have FR citizenship but live abroad but forgot to register in time for the election but if i had done so i would have voted for Mélenchon.

this, da refugees need 2 be perzdent

A complete collapse of the bourgeoisie. I'm dreaming high, I know.

This meme needs to fucking die already.

Exact same situation here. Well, I """"forgot"""". I wanted to just vote par procuration so that my parents could just vote for the Chon while I enjoyed not bothering about the politics of this shit country, but I couldn't bother to go to classcuckyourself.gouv.fr so I won't be voting.

Le Pen.
The prospect of triggering the collapse of the EU and yet another satisfying blow to the Neoliberal hegemony is far to good to resist.
I would be actively campaigning for her if I were a frog.

they all suck

And then have a fascist hegemony ? What the fuck is this logic ?

Not that guy, but proper fascism doesn't have anywhere near the material conditions to take root in one of the central countries, let alone become hegemonic.

You are beyond deluded if you think Le Pen is a fascist.
Action Française is the only notable French fascist party, and they are still a political irrelevance.

kys plz, you have to be a gullible idiot to vote for this bankster marketed technocrat
also wtf are u doin on a board called leftypol u fucking liberal faggot
Melenchon is the only one who offer progress in the right direction instead of worsening this shit. Also lol if you think fn won't win if we get another 5 years of austerity pro finances economics you retard

your political analysis is fucking retarded

you're fucking retarded if you think EU is salvagable

mods, can you set up a way to censure all Emmanuel Macron pictures ? It triggers me.

Actually no, the Action Française are ultra-reactionary (monarchists) but not fascists. The GUD and Bloc Identitaire are very close to fascism, and intellectually, the GRECE and Alain de Benoist and his followers are too. All of these are quite influent, more so than the Action Française. Fascism is far from dead in France.
But I agree with you, Le Pen has nothing of a fascist party.

He's fucking right, are you kidding ?

Ignorant burgerlander here. If the open borders crowd survives the election unscathed, what will the next few years of frog politics be like?

11/10 bait, triggered, made me rage. You even stuck in the line about left-idpols so it wouldn't quite look like copypasta from outside Holla Forums.

The thought of self-styled socialists, somewhere out there, who actually believe the establishment's laissez-faire antipopulist line, is terrifying.

Des manifs en défense du parlementarisme bourgeois. C'est tout le contraire d'une « radicalisation »… communiste ! On l'a bien vu dans l'entre-deux-guerres.

literally kil yourself fam

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Hamon because the Universal Basic Income is the next major social advancement.

En même temps, pendant l'entre-deux guerres, le PCF (et donc la quasi-totalité de la gauche Française) était sous commandement soviétique.

Et donc ?

Donc la situation est fort peu comparable.

I don't give a fuck about the EU. I just try to point out that anti-Eu is an inherently reactionnary stance

developp please

The sole fact of calling politicians and capitalists by those terms make you closest to the far-right

Nope.I'm a genuine socialist. I want a massive collectivization and reorganization of the whole world economy on a new basis

Melenchon only offers more regulation, more tax and more state intervention, which is inhernetly ruinous in the framework of a capitalist economy. Also he contributes to maintain the false idea that socialism=more state.

And his populistic rhetorics are a direct and shameless imitation of Lepen's ones; by doing so, he commits two crimes :
1) he allows the bourgeois intellectuals to popularize the bullshit about "horsehoe theory" arguing that the "far-left" and the "far-right" are the same thing
2) he accustoms people on the left to typical Holla Forums conspiracist analysis and worldview about a little international elite controlling everything and dictating to governments their policies, therefore inflating the ranks of the next far-right generation : how will evolve all his current electors when the debates will shift on something else than globalization or austerity ? A large amount of them already partly agree with reactionnaries on those issues, why could they not rally together in a close future on automatization or environnmental crisis?

Sorry for eventual bad english

The Chaos Candidate

1)
2)

Le Pen, only sane candidate

myself

This is fucking cancer.

He's the Trudeau of France.

I was hanging out with some yuppie "start-up" types a couple weeks ago. This one guy was going on about how he loves Trudeau, Merkel, and Macron because they are all "principled centrists."

proletarian internationalism

And Melechon is the Sanders of France, in worse actually. You would have not liked that Sanders became the democrat candidate and won the elections, no more nor less than Trump but for some other reasons. The economic failure he would have caused or the renounciation to most of his promises would have discredited to RadLeft in very prejudicious way

Idiot, that was not my point. I told more people were going to believe their lies (such as "leftists and fascists are the same", "if you have a problem with capitalist irrationalities, it makes you a totalitarian", …) after having taken a look on Melenchon, since he deliberately borrows his style from Lepen's populism

If you do believe that the capitalist world is not directed by the impersonnal logic of capital accumulation but by a little rich elite, then your worldview is not scientific and materialist, but idealistic and conspiracist. Be warn, it makes you closer to Holla Forums crap than proper socialist views, and therefore it is not surprising you do not considers Melenchon as an enemy

Burger here, comparing a theoretical president Sanders to politicians in other countries is somewhat misleading, since even if he was the worst of Syriza, Podemos, and Lib-Dems rolled in one (which I doubt, but even so), he'd still have been something the USA hasn't had since FDR over 70 years ago: A social democrat, Keynesian, and protectionist.

That might not sound like much to Europeans, but it would be a tremendous breath of fresh air for us, and the harbinger of better things to come.

I suspect France, like most European countries, has somewhat different needs than us. Specifically, people on the left willing to admit that the EU has been horribly-most likely unsalvageably-perverted from a union of equals to a laissez-faire mechanism for exploitation through arbitrage.

What ?

Those policies are disastrous, not socialist at all, and shouldn't be labelled as "socialist" by the large public. We need collectivization to build a completely different economic system, not more state intervention in the current one, which will only led to an even more inefficient capitalism and an increase of the unemployment rate. The banner of the revolution must not be tainted by the ineluctable failure of some stupid socdem policies and so, we souldn't support Melenchon, Sanders, Podemos, Syriza, …

Also Social-democracy and keynesianism are the cancer of the revolutionnary Left
While protectionnism and yelling about the EU are structurally reactionnary stances

Protectionism represents the force of law being brought to bear by representatives of labor against the voracious appetites of untrammeled capital. Consumer protections, workplace regulations, industrial regulations, financial regulations, (relatively) corrution-free bureaucracies to enforce law in a consistant and rigorous fashion… All of these are hallmarks of the modern era, won at dear cost by the past struggles of labor, maintained and advanced by our struggles today.

But these things only exist where such laws and norms can be enforced, inside the protective borders of the republican polities that cried, sweated, and bled to carve them from the grasp of tyrants throughout history.

Unlike true socialist globalism, which seeks to achieve harmony and the dissolution of borders by raising standards worldwide, neoliberal transnationalism strengthens capital by weakening the legal strictures that bind it, marching the helpless peoples of weak and corrupt governments against labor's global strongholds.

It is a reaction by the ancient arbitrary domination of abject dictators against the liberating force of fair and equal law.

The only theoretically justifiable argument for neoliberalism under the current capitalist system, is the dangerous path of accelerationism.

le pen winning would cause the most butthurt, but the french political system seems more fucked than americas. If she does win, then we truly are at a turning point.

Do you aknowledge that protectionism is always harmful to the working class ?
Once should not concludes that because something strenghtens big capital, it has to be counterred in the interest of the proletariat

Compared to a theoretical status in which laws, enforcement, and economic conditions are approximately similar worldwide? Sure, it's harmful. But in the current quo of developed and undeveloped world? It's a necessary measure.

Furthermore, intelligently designed protectionism phases itself out out as different nations come closer to harmony, shrinking the arbitrage between them that incentivizes abusive interactions. FairTrade, countervailing duties, foreign aid, developmental subsidies, that sort of thing.