The freer the market, the freer the people

Freedom is a concept defined by society, not by individual ideologues and their conceptions of absolutist property rights. Individualism is a lofty idea but not practical in the extreme. It also should be countered by the needs of the community not held up as a concept above all others without any thought to the negative consequences that would produce. ( Like it fucking is today in western culture.)

Markets are a side effect of military actions and forced intrusions into new areas of the globe. They don't freely arise of their own accord, local communities often trade in favors and credibility, before they're forced to use literal money and credit. Transactions are often anything but "voluntary" and people who think they ere often completely ignore circumstance or the availability of other options.(Lack thereof.)

Put this all these facts together and you don't get the lolbert dream.

the market is not totally free

The very concept of a 'free market' is flawed, since there will always be some outside influence on any system that uses money. The idea of a 'free market' is like saying 'free prison', it is inherently self contradictory.

See I know big words

redpill me on french liberalism

It was a 100% reactionary and lead to giving the rich power in the long term scenario. In a way, you can blame this whole mess on french liberalism due to how it easily influences the masses without regard to the message itself.

'no'

Yes! :^D

Not all markets are capitalist.

Markets freed from the state and capitalism would be pretty chill.

It is a bit reactionary in the romanticist sense, but it's a far better philosophical definition of freedom than lockean or neolockean "freedom."

The free market doesn't exist. Monopolies are a natural tendency of capitalism.

But I'm arguing that unchecked freedom leads to massive corruption. You can't have total freedom without it leading down to this exact scenario. Thinking that total freedom means you are truly free is the real romantic notion.

Easy.

Prove me wrong.

Just put on the tankie flag friend. No one was arguing for that.

Do you understand what capitalism is?

When you respond directly to people, it should be a response to their statements. I mean this isn't a hard and fast rule, but what is in life?

Implications tend to cover where direct statements don't or aren't seen to be needed. I felt my critique was sufficient to bypass those problems.

no but i hate it

The freest countries in the world are regulated as fuck western economies, with their Rule of Law bullshit everywhere, which is just pure fascism from non-western perspective. Like, you can't grow food on your property in the US, and this is actually enforced, wtf is this?

Chattel and other forms of slavery are the natural progression of the free market.

/thread

It was freer that the Weimar socdem clusterfuck.

Cant, the logical conclusion of free markets is total anarchy

If there is a natural supply of land, since we see it exist as a material reality and a natural demand for it, since humans naturally evolved with agriculture, there is no reason why the government should protect arbitrary property rights

Fug had my shitpost flag

markets are a spook

You still do, famrade! :^)

lol good thread

Freer markets are better than mercantilism and corporatism, I don't think anyone will deny that.
Doesn't mean markets are the best way to organize production.
You can whore yourself all you want in the market, just don't thread on the natural resources and human knowledge that belong to society at large.

tread*

No they aren't they are just a vehicle for the people to trade goods.

What exactly do you mean by a "free" market

define free market

Somalia.

Bam.

imma remember that one lmao

socialism is the logical conclusion of enlightenment thinking

adam smith and rousseau were basically proto-socialists

and 'classical liberals' are a meme, we are the true heirs of the french liberals

I knew i will need this pic

A system cannot be considered free if it systematically destroys options for survival.

If people were given a choice between 'keep working your own land/workshop and having very little besides food' and 'work for Porky'. That would have been free, but instead capitalism took the land and market shares people survived with. The choice now, for most people, is 'work for Porky or starve'.

An aside, some histories of early American capitalism where land was plentiful and free(ly stolen) credit the Homestead act with the reason why early American capitalism shared more with the workers and didn't result in the drop in real wages that early capitalism caused everywhere else. People did, at that time, have a choice between working for porky and working their own land.

The ideal Market (ie. what Ancaps and american libertarians talk about) requires Ideal people, totally rational, knowing all developments and purchasing without biases and at all times ready to risk all they have to start a business in case the market doesn't offer a good enough product.

Disturbance to this process, and that doesn't just mean Government intervention, but no processes outside of the market, nor any natural developments - basically the real world - will harm it.

Furthermore, once you're on the top of the market, you'll want to do all you can to destroy the path that lead you there, making consumers irrational, creating more demand, etc.. The consumer on the other hand ultimately doesn't care how he gets his food, shelter and other needs or wishes. therefore he doesn't care about the market either, if it can't please him. In fact, the only people who would care about it would be small businesses, aspiring to grow larger. But if nobody except them (keeping in mind that fhey aren't the most influential people in society) is interested it keeping "pure" or free markets, they will deteriorate by themselves.

Also this: (markets and planning are a false dichotomy, soms marxposter gave a good explanation a while back)

Bump

Skull has become more dense than neutron star.
The fabric of space is not only torn, but put into a pendulum of existence & non-existence, sending ripples throughout the universe, shattering reality as we know it.

1) pinochet
2) any banana republic latin american shithole circa mid 20th century
3) china circa now

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will you post it when you kys?

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marxists are utterly retarded aren't they?

what is tragedy of the commons

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Correct, but socialist markets are freer than capitalist markets.

This

BASED