We really need to organize and push

We really need to organize and push.

I know that sounds obvious as fuck and sounds like "Hurr durr revolution, muh left unity" LARPing, but I am serious. Sure, recently we have had a few small victories, such as Milo getting axed, Spencer taking a fist to the face etc. but have we had any real victories?

No, we haven't.

As much as I hate to say it, we need to somewhat learn from the "Alt-Right" movement and what they are doing. When Alt-Right faggots show up somewhere, normalfags see fun, memes, cute cartoon frog pins and snazzy suits and haircuts. When Lefties (The few real Lefties there are) show up somewhere, normalfags see crazies in black hoodies burning things holding a flag of a nation that killed 70quatrillion Kulaks.

That needs to change if we are going to make any progress. We need to look fun and inviting and viable, and consciously distance ourselves from nations/movements with "Bad rep" among normal people. There is a reason Alt-Righters (usually) don't prance around with swastika armbands. First off, we need to ditch symbols like the Hammer & Sickle, and come up with something more "acceptable" for people to associate with us. Maybe something historical many don't know like the C.N.T bandannas or something. I don't know, that's for you guys to figure out. Next, we need a Pepe. We need something that can be associated with our message, something that is easy to slap onto images, nice looking and unique. I personally think Alunya and related characters would be perfect for this job. A cute catgirl that is pretty easy to draw could be great for propaganda. And something Alunya has over Pepe and related characters, is that she is cute and could help swaying younger people leftward a ton.

Regardless, you get the idea. We need to expand, find a public footing and outpropaganda the right-wingers.

Discuss.

Other urls found in this thread:

cnn.com/2014/02/25/us/hate-groups-decline/index.html
aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2017/02/americans-joining-socialist-groups-trump-170205083615002.html
reddit.com/r/TheOldLeft/
archive.li/v412o
twitter.com/NSFWRedditVideo

You materialist cucks will never understand aesthetics or esoterica, do not even try. Also socialism is as boring as you can get.

Don't worry bae we'll come up with more stuff for you to rip off soon.

I am all for using qt catgril for propaganda for the working class

You really should stop looking to the Alt-right. They've had their month in the spotlight, and they've already discredited themselves in the sphere of public opinion and are busy eating themselves. Republicans may have used them to bring "fun" and some LARPers along with their campaign, but by now, most don't want anything to do with them. Most of their tactics are copypasted from the SJWs, so you won't learn from there. If you want to appeal to a wide swath of people, you need to care about their problems, point out the contradictions in capital and appear to be looking for solutions. And of course it helps to know your theory inside out so that you're always trying to maintain the quality of discussion and not stoop to your opponent's level when they try to lower it. Don't take this to mean no fun allowed, just that it is always secondary and not the primary goal or basis around which you organize

Not really, no

When the "Alt-Right" shows up people see autism and maladjusted dipshits that masturbate to anime and worship a frog.

The Alt Right is a meme that's only significant because it was born on the internet. If weren't for the fact that social media is a giant, drama addicted echo chamber they'd be completely irrelevant.

Membership in "far right" groups is tanking: cnn.com/2014/02/25/us/hate-groups-decline/index.html

While membership in "socialist" groups is rising: aljazeera.com/indepth/features/2017/02/americans-joining-socialist-groups-trump-170205083615002.html

Leftism and socialism is what's growing. It might be shocking to Holla Forumscucks, but most people aren't driven by irrational hate for people not like themselves. They work with Mexicans and live next to Arabs and stand beside Whites as they wait to be checked out by Indian clerks before going out to eat Somalian food which is also probably made by Mexicans and they're fine with it. The racist bubble they've encapsulated themselves in exists only online and in their minds.

If you want to make stupid memes to appeal to stupid teenagers then fine, be my guest, but Holla Forums's numbers have tripled since this time last year while Holla Forums does nothing but bleed users.

Sage for shit analysis in a crap thread full of bad ideas. OP is a faggot and not my comrade.

Op is a fag, but, we should appeal to stupid teenagers and try to make them go left.

In 10 years they will make great cannon fodder.

A 'normalfag' doesn't know what a Kulak was.

What they see is the flag of a state that massacred millions of its own citizens.

The problem is that the collapse of the Soviet Union was a catastrophic blow to the Left from which it has yet to recover. The Marxist-Leninist model, flawed though it was, at least provided a reliable point of reference backed up by real power. Now that it has conclusively failed, we are left in a situation where the left lacks any sort of concrete monetary or political support and no longer has an obvious sort of framework to revolve around. It has also widely discredited the ideals of the radical left in the eyes of the population. So we now live in a time when the far left is a truly fringe movement which is splintered between dozens of tendencies which all lack any sort of real political clout.

But this isn't the case. Why deny the actual existence of changing technology?

If we look at Lenin's "Where to Begin?" every evidence in favor of forming a newspaper could very easily be applied to the internet. Why not take advantage of every echo chamber available and make the drama addicts dependent on our drama?

The alt-right isn't worthy at looking towards for how to grow, but more that they have likely had an influence over culture, at least online (the sole source of news for many people across the globe, which will only become larger as time goes on).

Of course, advocating for an increased online presence does not mean abandoning IRL activism, nor does it mean we should expect any tangible change after spamming communist Pepes on Twitter. Rather, its a statement that we should take full advantage of every possibility of cultural manipulation.

My 2 cents: As an ex- Holla Forumsback, I have to say that personally the 2 reasons why I joined Holla Forums to begin with was because their ideas were censored at the time and I was curious, and because it the maymays and infographics were fun and easy to digest and spread. Hope that helps somehow

I'm not really smart and its been a while since I read leftists books, that's why I think right wing bullshit being so simple to understand is their biggest asset.

If anything we should look at the commie manifesto for guidance and in context. That was easy to understand and made it clear in a few pages what was the objectives of the communists and the reasons shit was fucked up during Marx's time.

we have to kill the myth of "socialism is when the government does stuff". Idk how tho, flyers? posters? memes? i think most people like the idea of democratic control of the workplace but they just don't know that thats the core of socialism. also: people are just scared off by the marxist and old communist vocabulary and symbols, so dont go around putting the hammer and sickle symbol everywhere

Why dont just uhh, create more democratic workplaces

Come join the action front discord. We are organising.

Also


Fuck it's like Christmas and birthday combined in here

Just because they are ideologically retarder does not mean their marketing wasn't tip top

source?

link?

My take on this entire issue is that political movements are as organized as their activities.

You can't reason with people into accepting discipline and organization. it must either be imposed, which we can't do, or grow organically once a group recognizes the necessity of it.

The alt-Right is usually more organized than the socialist Left because they make raids, they doxx people, they harass, they like to debate and come up with arguments, they love exposing the "irrationality" of the other side, etc. All dumb activities, yes, but they all make them realise the necessity of some order and of a group that can keep this order.

When you learn to attack the other side online through these 5-hour alt-Right youtube clips, you go to a protest, you debate those protesters, film it, make it available online, get together to meme and harass the person debated and so on, you're organically creating some type of network where the roles and goals are implicit. There's even something of an economy to it: the youtubers wouldn't waste his time making videos if there were no people interested in using that knowledge elsewhere.

The socialists, on the other hand, usually do everything to make their engagements as brief and passive as possible: occupations, protests, walk-outs, etc. The most "symbolic" and focused on "raising awareness" (e.g. fucking useless) the better. Anyone who partaked in those know that these can be done without any discipline, by isolated groups. In fact, the freedom from discipline is usually seen as a positive thing for some of those leftists. It requires no knowledge and no organization.

What we need is to change our daily tasks and actions. Focus on things that will make the necessity of education and organization evident.

[email protected]/* */ email that and I will send you an invite to our screening channel first we need to go over some stuff before you come in proper

Agreed. We are in dire need of better praxis.

I believe you could join also, we've been talking about a lot of this stuff


You too

Dude, I'm a europoor. Is it supposed to be an international thing?

What does the screening consist of? I don't want to be a paranoid loony but it's hard not to be nowadays.

Yes it is supposed I be international, I am a bong. We have an Aussie and bunch of yanks. Having people everywhere is a key goal.

The screening is us finding out you aren't a polack fuck by having a chat

I might shoot you guys a message as well, if you are alright with that. I am 100% okay with a little screening too, we gotta be safe.

I'm tired of inaction, I want something done.

What sort of activity do you have in mind?

This is what I was trying to say in another thread. We need to organize and make movements that the general political-apathetic people can understand. Do anything. There are 3 types of activism you can do that I would recommend.
Wheither it's a fucking facebook group or some type of organization you have at a college. Just try to make your movement positive + active
Make flyers, posters, youtube videos, anything. Make sure you give easy to understand concepts, use diagrams and statistics. Spread them, but don't be annoying about it. Public image is very important.
This is the most important, but there's a barrier depending how apathetic you are, many can't cross it. Help with casual causes like Food Not Bombs, make an event out of cleaning a neighborhood/park/beach.

God speed user. I hope we can really push these ideas, I'm going to try my hardest.

He literally gave two. If you're asking for sources on the growth of leftypol you can literally see them any time.

Jesus christ, screening and stuff to join a discord?

Are we trying to butcher our movement? It should be public. I wish our leftypol server was larger and we focused more on serious discussion like this.

Anyone have another serious activism discord that I don't have to be fucking vetted for?

hi fellow leftist

only on leftypol would a guy asking for a source be interpreted as asking for the source of data instead of the hot seminude chick

As an artist, is there anything I can do to help? I know its not much, But I'm semi decent and was thinking about making a leftist webcomic or something. I did some "volunteering" in the inner city with other artists last summer but it was filled with hipsters who wanted to do stuff like buying parking lot space and moving couches,chairs,lamps,tables,ect, so they could act as "talking spaces" and other wacky bs; instead of building community gardens or something actually useful.

Is that Proudhon on the right?

All anons in this thread asking for me, I'm sorry I have been dealing with diabolical internet for the last couple days and these posts didn't show up on my phone. Please check your email/if it was a burner please make another and send me another message in back in the land of interweb and I can answer you swiftly

wish I was in America to help you Comrade :^

user from the thread joined the action front. I am British. We are international. Get in here

We've started an anti-idpol sub with a modteam controlled by leftypol users. Come help it expand.

reddit.com/r/TheOldLeft/

You're right.

We must explain to normies that it is correct to kill kulaks

ree fuck off

...

What's keeping the Holla Forums server from having serious discussion? Nothing. Lead the way, captain.

I've tried getting a channel dedicated for serious discussion, any form of serious discussion gets washed away in general with shitty responses and memes.

Would anyone be interested in joining a discord for making leftist content and trying to get the ball rolling? We can make inforgraphics and flyers, maybe fund content creators. Anyone interested?

More Leftist memes, and anything that BTFO's the "Communism doesn't work" memes.

I just did this, and guess what

IT DIDN'T SOLVE ANYTHING

start a coop, a reading club, a dining room for the poor which is entirely self reliant and so on

yes

More Leftist Anime Memes!

People are already so sick of the culture war. You guys are just getting revved up to fight yesterday's battles, and the zeitgeist will have already passed you by.

I realize you'll probably think I'm giving you poisoned advice, its actually funny how much genuinely good advice I see given from nazi flags on this forum. I know I won't be able to persuade you but I'll say it anyway: the most important thing going forward will be to cultivate your own character.

...

Memes are useless ideological mastrubatory content. The memes didn't bring people to the alt right, they merely reafirmed existant biases on predisposed indignated individuals. This does not work for the left because people don't share the same hatred we do for the current system.

I wanna actually do something but I'm in QLD and don't know what the fuck I can even do. Anyone else here Australian? Do i really have to scrape up the funds to go to another happening country to do anything worthwhile?

fucking this
we need more people to create info-graphics and help others understand what the fuck leftism actually is. We need a modern day manifesto that can relate to the people of today with more accessible language and references to more recent phenomenons.

such as?

I agree with this but if for any reason people can't do these things memes are at least SOMETHING.

Make good looking memes

Nothing will happen here unless it happens in the US first, and then 10-15 years down the line.

It's frustrating but also kinda comfy that nothing we do in this country matters at all to anyone else and barely even to ourselves.

You could also go graffiti Pauline Hansons house or something

there's a One Nation poster on my way home from work, gonna go one night and turn it into a Boner Nation poster. someone on it is going to receive a Hitler moustache too.

Good points. I'm inspired.

That's because the Right is socially apt and morally conservative, so they appear clean cut and kinda funny, while the Left is socially liberal and morally nihilistic which manifests in unfunny and obnoxious ways.

it'll look forced since Holla Forums did it first


again the alt-right was branded by some liberal as "hentai masturbators" and cute anime girls are already co-opted by nazis.

Try to think up something original, copying the Right will just look like youre forcing it and desperate.

POLAND STRONK

You do know that he only gained more power right?

One of the greatest points Rafiq ever made.

Im not an Ozzy but you should still form groups and exercise the power that comes with communal autonomy for when the time comes.

This is dumb. Just because your shitty, unorganized maymays and internet activity didn't do anything, doesn't mean all internet activity is doomed to failure.

I don't understand the argument against "internet activism". Trust in the media is at record lows, and more and more people are getting their news entirely through internet sources. This provides an avenue for independent sources (ie us) to change the information people take in, thus changing their decisions (as opinions are largely a product of what information you had to base them off of).

How did Lenin start building his party, was it through co-ops, reading clubs, and other lifestylist shit? No, it was a fucking newspaper, because creating a newspaper forced people together, it forced them to discuss ideas and come up with a platform, and it gave them a propaganda platform. Nowadays, newspapers are a fucking dumb waste of paper that nobody reads, so it follows we should instead build a platform online.


The culture war is eternal and will continue to exist so long as the systems of cultural hegemony and manufacturing consent are in turmoil. Because the internet allows the masses a chance to undermine the cultural authority of the long-reigning media, there will be a "culture war."

Yo are you the person who just joined the discord? On the off chance you're not there are two QLD people including myself in the action front group. [email protected]/* */ If you have already joined disregard this.

was going to seriously reply but then I reached the
part, lenin is utterly irrelevant today

also

kys

Jesus fuck, anarkiddies are retarded. It doesn't matter if you disagree with Lenin's praxis, his descriptions of the evolution of Imperialism, on how to build a centralized propaganda platform, and on applying Marx to your own time are still relevant.

Yes, it's obvious you haven't read Lenin.

The problem is that people are told that this is leftism, that liberalism is what all leftists want and that since we live in a liberal society we have to do the opposite. Edgey teens want to be contrarian to their parents they see how many leftist movements have failed (from hippies, punks etc) and they don't want the same old thing. The only way to combat this is mass information spreading, showing the flaws in idpol and neoliberal capitalism and then showing how these can be fixed with socialism. When it comes down to it far right ideas are mostly very easy to disprove or argue against, they're just better at recruitment.

archive.li/v412o

Its over comrades

Do I have to remind you how much the USSR during both Lenin and Stalin traded with other nations or what?

1) stop fucking LARPing you nerds. That means no USSR memorabilia around your house and no portraits of "the greats" during marches - it makes you look like a fucking cult.
2) Use accessible language, stop saying bourgeoisie and proletariat outside of academic contexts, those phrases are dead and meaningless to the working class and just make you look out of touch
3) When you mean class, say class. If you keep saying to Liberals that identity politics is shit, explain to them why class politics is more important. The ""Left"" these days, as I'm sure you'll all agree, seems too focused on pandering to gay Saharan transgendered people and not enough time on shit that is universally important: working hours, wages, housing, and other economic factors.
4) it would be great if, instead of saying where your ideas come from, you first explained what the fuck they are. When I first got into communism I didn't care less who said what, so long as what they said appealed to me. After they're already a communist or socialist is the time when you start telling them who said what because before that nobody could give two shits whether it was Marx, Lenin or Mao who said "the working class shouldn't starve, it's not good for their health. they should also maybe get a nice place to live and work, with some good ol' socialism to go along with it so they don't work 8 hours a day and so they don't get alienated to shit"
5) To add on to 4: don't fucking tell people you're a Marxist, Anarchist, LeftCom, Maoist, or whatever before you've convinced them. People will reject your ideas solely on the label associated with them. This is mostly from personal experience, but just an example: I've known people to reject Marx's theory of alienation just because they knew that it was Marx who said it.

sorry this list is pretty shit, but I'm slightly drunk and think this is better than nowt

sorry but are you american?

I'm fully N O R T H INGERLAND m80

...

well, the american people have been taught that the class system consists of the rich class and the middle class, and the middle class are just temporarely not poor

this has to stop

fite me cunt
people understand employer and employee, and even if it's wrong, I'd rather use slightly wrong language and get my point across than be not understood at all and just look like a right twat

Honestly, this is pretty sound advice. Definitely the case in america


Just because you're a fucking NEET who has never interacted with the public, doesn't mean they are like us, the posters on leftypol. The average american has no clue what the fuck that means.


You're not wrong, user.

Even though Brits are classcucked to fuck for the most part, we do have the best alternative lexicon. Shame faggots in the establishment have tricked the spastics into letting them co-opt in. Britain is pretty fucking pleb tier for letting 2008 recession anger be rewritten into the fault of Labour, the unemployed, immigrants and the disabled.

Reminder Leninhat posters are the long haired guys at the pub peddling revolution and talking like academia after two shandies.

kek, "guis, lets use misinformative language because our opponents are too fucking dumb to understand two words :DD."

This is why no one will ever take Holla Forums seriously.

Reminder that Holla Forums is filled with socially inept spergs that are incapable of explaining the definition of two words.

pls excuse lelninist they are retarded

Well from my personal experience, The memes really do sway teenagers and get them interested in marxism

reminder that you're a retard if you think you need to use new words that need explaining when you can always not look weird and get your message across easier by using words that everyone already fucking knows.

Reminder that you're a retard if you think using the dumbed-down version of a word is going to change the mind of a liberal or anticom.

Woah, they traded??? I thought they magically achieved full communism because of all of their bountiful goods and resources! Are you saying that the forces of imperialism and global capitalism didn't instantly vanish after a revolution? Amazing!

Literally just read "Imperialism," by Lenin. It is a theoretical framework, it has nothing to do with Lenin's belief on compromise or a vanguard party or anything like that.

Also - reminder that you're a retard if you think "proletariat" or "bourgeois" are new words.

You are like a little baby, watch this
The establishment elites from Oxbridge and Eton have stripped the manufacturing industry from this country purely for the purpose of an ideological war against average working people. The financial sector of London runs the rest of the country like its own personal fiefdom, bribing the working class into apathy using substandard benefits while they asset strip everything here and pillage the rest of the planet. The only solution to the greed that festers in the capital is the total demolition of the current system and the entrenched establishment that thrives from it.

To hundreds of people they are new words. Not everyone goes to university. Not everyone has spoken to a Marxist before. Not everyone did sociology A level.
This isn't the 19th century, language goes in and out of fashion and I'm sorry but proletariat and bourgeoisie aren't used outside of socialist or academic circles.

Because Lenin totally thought about class as just "proletariat" and "bourgeois".

Deal with it, those terms are terribly out-of-date and a drastic simplification of the current economic situations.

My point is, people are more likely to take you seriously or believe you if you use 'academia' language when discussing politics or economics. When people talk about serious subjects using dumbed-down or more casual language, it makes othertake them less seriously.

People are physiologically conditioned to equate higher language with intelligence.

I mean, in casual conversation or on chans, sure say it however you like, as long as it's still true to the definition. But the general public are more likely to take you seriously if you use a more extended vocabulary.

You're an idiot. If people see you throwing around terminology from the industrial revolution, they are going to think you're a pretentious twat. There's a reason Occupy Wall St, Bernie Sanders and other such opportunists use the terms "1%" and "99%" – they're easier to digest for the average person.

Your idea is retarded. The workers don't want to be talk to as if they're stupid children. Treating them like it will just push them away.

In my experience they've just gone: "…what? What the fuck are you on about?"
They're more likely to be convinced by Theresa May and her bullshit about a "shared and fairer country" than the inevitable collapse of capitalism due to the contradiction between labour and capital. Why? Because it's simple. Because it doesn't need and explaining and can be grasped in a sentence. And more importantly, it's a load of shite, but it still appeals to their emotions which a lot of leftists ignore for some reason. If your entire rhetoric is "holy shit everything's so bad you poor proletarian you must want to kill yourself" and other negative shite, people aren't going to feel emotionally comfortable with you and your ideas (I'm not saying that people can't look past that, but if all your ideas make me feel like shit I'd rather reject them than give them a second thought).
If all people perceive about you and your ideology is that you're a bunch of negative cunts who want something different, but they can't understand what because every time you try to say something you sound like a drunk wizard, then they won't want to be around you or your weird, outlandish ideas, however logical they sound to you.
This isn't just about using different, more understandable words and phrases, but also about rhetoric in general. Positivity is important. Don't moan unless you have an alternative. Don't just point out that capitalism is shit, point out why socialism is great. Don't say why alienation's shit, point out how we can get rid of it. Don't moan about electoral politics being a bourgeois farce, explain how more effective political action exists outside it that can be used to improve their every day life, e.g. joining a union, going on strike, having a march.

This guy is not British. Going off what he said I want to punt at American.

Yes, and having to explain words which effectively act as stand ins for other words which will become apparent when you have to explain them won't make people think you are talking down to them. People love people that go out of their way to teach them new words.

Nobody's saying we should treat them like children, just that we should try to convey our ideas in the way that's easiest to understand.

What? Why is "proletariat" and "bourgeoisie" cool adult words, but "99%" an "1%" are childrens shit? If anything, the numbers are a more accurate representation of current class structure, as the gigantic growth of the managerial class is countered by them being subservient to global finance capital.

[armchairs screaming in the distance]

Fair point.

top wew lad.

Why else do you think Clinton blew up Honduras? If he'd succeeded, everyone would've realised someone like Boynie could've won.
The cheap shoes are just a bonus.


minor surfing hint: always try to change a dumblr link to _500 (usually gif) or _1280, thx!
bonus content: On pinterest change image links that say /236x/ or /564x/ or /736x/ to "/originals/"
remember only YOU can prevent the spread of ANTinfestation!
Let's make image sharing great again!
(faecesbook is utterly bizarre and sometimes it has a larger size available and sometimes it don't. Shares this weirdness with Instagram and Flickr. Changing it to _b or _o or _l usually gets a bigger one but not always. Fecking stupid. They cause me a lot of false positive grief.


you're thinking of it wrong, it's more like advertising, it's making people remember that you're there and drawing in new viewers/buyers is just a bonus. Especially if said person has gone a long time without seeing it and then it reminds them there are similar groups out there. (alternatively, they can also be used offensively like the whole "weaponised gif posting" against Butthurt Eichenbald, which I guess a rl equiv would be how the IRA's last major public pushes are all really big and flashy attacks followed by a few months of inactivity, then without warning they strike again)


there's more than one kind of anime, just putting it out there. I mean there's already a token vegan on the cast of Totally Spies and the french connection would imply Robespierrian hijinks. Just an idea.
or you can somehow abduct Kim Jong Un's furry show and troll practically everyone at once. I don't have any good ideas there as they already make the American wolves look cooler than everyone else

reported for being a sperg

OP is retarded

fucking LARPer
(no offense to cool larpers)

I also need to add on: criticism is important, but just as important are the solutions you come up with. Nobody wants to hear how their life is so bad when you're not saying how much their life could be better, and how to achieve this better life. Give them hope, and maybe they'll start agreeing with you. Just, in general, "You earn $8/hour right now? Join our [socialist group/union] and maybe you'll be earning $10/hour".
I must also stress that short-victories are just as important as long-term ones. If you keep focusing on some long, far away "revolution" you'll lose support very quickly. People want something now, not in 10, 20, 30 years. Unless you can create socialist drones who will spend their lives dedicated to the prospect of revolution, then you have to stress small things like raising wages, building housing, lowering tuition fees, etc. because otherwise people will just get demoralised and weary if they perceive themselves to be making little or no progress.

What about a revamped Bunkermag? It would be a most revolutionary newspaper. An all-internet newspaper.

real lefties find Milo funny, you bourgeois feminist.

When mainstream conservatives rebuking a gay who offends their fragile christian sensibilities is a victory for "us", I question who the "we" are supposed to be.