Inconsistency in tierlists between pokemon gens

Question

Inconsistency in tierlists between pokemon gens

Isaiah Johnson

With every new pokemon gen that comes out, they introduce more and more new pokemon, new moves, new abilities, new held items, and new forms to deal with in competitive battles. Drastically changing the preexisting tierlists a lot in the process with each new Pokemon game.

Despite being just an "OU banlist", the Uber tier has proven to be the most consistent tier out of all of them. You can see this with how little the Smogon Uber tierlists have changed over the past seven gens. Retaining most of the usual mainstays from the previous gen's Uber tierlist with each new, passing generation.

smogon.com/dex/rb/formats/uber/
First gen; no returning ubers, because there is no previous gen.

smogon.com/dex/gs/formats/uber/
Returning pokemon from gen 1: Mew, Mewtwo

smogon.com/dex/rs/formats/uber/
Returning from gen 2: Ho-Oh, Lugia, Mew, Mewtwo

smogon.com/dex/dp/formats/uber/
Returning from gen 3: Deoxys (all 4 forms), Groudon, Ho-Oh, Kyogre, Latias, Latios, Lugia, Mew, Mewtwo, Rayquaza, Wobbuffet, Wynaut

smogon.com/dex/bw/formats/uber/
Returning from gen 4: Arceus (all types), Darkrai, Deoxys (all 4 forms), Dialga, Giratina (both forms), Groudon, Ho-Oh, Kyogre, Lugia, Manaphy, Mewtwo, Palkia, Rayquaza, Shaymin-Sky

smogon.com/dex/xy/formats/uber/
Returning from gen 5: Arceus (all types), Blaziken, Darkrai, Deoxys (all 4 forms), Dialga, Genesect, Giratina (both forms), Groudon, Ho-Oh, Kyogre, Kyurem-White, Landorus, Lugia, Mewtwo, Palkia, Rayquaza, Reshiram, Shaymin-Sky, Zekrom

smogon.com/dex/sm/formats/uber/
Returning from gen 6: Aegislash (both forms), Arceus (all types), Blaziken (both forms), Darkrai, Deoxys (all 4 forms), Dialga, Genesect, Gengar-Mega, Giratina (both forms), Groudon (both forms), Ho-Oh, Kangaskhan-Mega, Kyogre (both forms), Kyurem-White, Landorus, Lucario-Mega, Lugia, Mewtwo (all 3 forms), Palkia, Rayquaza, Reshiram, Salamence-Mega, Shaymin-Sky, Xerneas, Yveltal, Zekrom

As you can see, whenever newer uber pokemon are added with every revision to the latest Uber tierlist, the new pokemon feel more like Additions rather than Replacements. This is largely because uber-class Pokemon are so powerful, it's generally hard for the uber mainstays like Arceus to "fall down a tier". Making the Uber tierlists the relatively Most consistent between the different generations. Especially when you compare it to lower tiers like OU, where the tierlists can rapidly change because new threats can Replace the old ones. Or even knock them down a tier, if old pokes are made unviable in the latest OU metagame.

December 17, 2017 - 16:54

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Ayden Anderson

For example. Take a look and compare the different Smogon OU tierlists over the past seven generations. Aside from a few mainstays like Gengar or Tyranitar, newly released pokemon games can drastically change the newest OU tierlist up from the previous one.

smogon.com/dex/rb/formats/ou/
First gen; no returning ou pokemon, because there is no previous gen.

smogon.com/dex/gs/formats/ou/
Returning pokemon from gen 1: Cloyster, Exeggutor, Gengar, Jolteon, Rhydon, Snorlax, Starmie, Zapdos

smogon.com/dex/rs/formats/ou/
Returning from gen 2: Blissey, Cloyster, Gengar, Heracross, Jolteon, Porygon2, Raikou, Skarmory, Snorlax, Starmie, Suicune, Tyranitar, Zapdos

smogon.com/dex/dp/formats/ou/
Returning from gen 3: Aerodactyl, Blissey, Celebi, Flygon, Forretress, Gengar, Gyarados, Jirachi, Jolteon, Metagross, Skarmory, Snorlax, Starmie, Suicune, Swampert, Tyranitar, Zapdos

smogon.com/dex/bw/formats/ou/
Returning from gen 4: Blissey, Breloom, Celebi, Dragonite, Forretress, Gengar, Gliscor, Gyarados, Heatran, Hippowdon, Infernape, Jirachi, Jolteon, Lucario, Magnezone, Mamoswine, Metagross, Rotom-Wash, Scizor, Skarmory, Starmie, Tentacruel, Tyranitar, Vaporeon

smogon.com/dex/xy/formats/ou/
Returning from gen 5: Breloom, Dragonite, Dugtrio, Excadrill, Ferrothorn, Garchomp, Gengar, Gliscor, Heatran, Hippowdon, Jirachi, Keldeo, Kyurem-Black, Landorus-Therian, Latias, Latios, Magnezone, Rotom-Wash, Scizor, Skarmory, Starmie, Tyranitar

smogon.com/dex/sm/formats/ou/
Returning from gen 6: Bisharp, Chansey, Charizard (both megas), Clefable, Diancie-Mega, Dragonite, Excadrill, Ferrothorn, Garchomp (both forms), Gengar, Heatran, Keldeo, Kyurem-Black, Landorus-Therian, Latios (both forms), Lopunny-Mega, Magnezone, Manaphy, Medicham-Mega, Mew, Pinsir-Mega, Scizor-Mega, Skarmory, Tangrowth, Tyranitar (both forms), Venusaur-Mega, Zapdos

December 17, 2017 - 16:54

Brody White

^ Is everything I wrote just pure 100% Pokemon autism? Meh, probably. But the bottom line is this. Even if you heavily disagree with the pokemon that Smogon chooses for their tierlists, a pattern Does emerge: That the Uber tierlists stay relatively consistent with its mainstays, whereas lower tiers aren't quite as consistent between the different generations.

I had a roommate that use to spend a lot of his time breeding competitive pokemon for OU battles in pervious gens. With so much time and effort he spent in getting great IVs, it's a shame that a good chunk of those old pokemon are just not as viable in the current OU metagame as they use to be. Replaced by better Pokemon species that can get the job done and actually win battles.

So it got me thinking: If I were to build a competitive pokemon team, I might as well make it an Uber team. As I proven above, it's undoubtedly the most consistent and future-proof out of all the tiers. Whatever new powerful threats the upcoming 8th Pokemon generation might bring, I highly doubt they'll ever knock down old ubers like Arceus "down a tier".

December 17, 2017 - 16:55

Angel Myers

I understand everything you just said, but what's the point, exactly?

December 17, 2017 - 17:00

Anthony Watson

Well, at least you're somewhat self-aware

December 17, 2017 - 17:00

Leo Williams

If you're to waste your time breeding a pokemon team that is comp viable, I would agree that an uber team would last you the longest

WHY you wanna breed this shit instead of using a simulator is beyond me though

December 17, 2017 - 17:06

Ian Moore

I just don't wanna waste my time like my roommate did. It just seems like a lot of effort wasted for nothing whenever new gen comes along and makes old OU mainstays obsolete or fall down a tier. The tier that's least affected by this is the Uber tier, which has stayed relatively consistent throughout these past seven gens.

Which explains why I mostly just play Ubers now. When the 8th gen comes, I doubt that Uber mainstays like Arceus will ever get knocked down a tier.

December 17, 2017 - 17:07

Oliver Kelly

7 GENS

December 17, 2017 - 17:07

Evan Sanders

You compiled a lot of good data, user, but the issue (at least what I think you're getting at) is that some people want to use the obviously overpowered pokemon - i.e. the Ubers or OU - to play, but there are some devoted players, much like the type you see in the Fullderp threads, who just care about having fun.
Speaking for myself, I usually built my comp teams entirely of UU since they are usually gimmicky but fun pokemon.

December 17, 2017 - 17:08

Brandon Ross

There is irony when they deliberately design over-powered Pokemon it's more balanced than the metagame where the "balanced" Pokemon result in the same teams over and over (A.K.A. Chalk)
VGC2017's limitations were actually pretty fun. You had more variety certainly.
Now the VGC2018 teams look like 2016- but with the additions of Tapus, and Mega Charizard Y being really popular despite Rock Slide from Landorus being common.
Another interesting point is almost any other mechanic is dead. Sure you have terrains, Trick Room, Weather (mainly MZardY's drought), and mind games of when a Z-Move will come out (even if whose can do it is more obvious). Buffs, Stalls, even Entry Hazards are fucking dead.
The ocean got wider, but it got shallow-er again.
Nerf Landorus T

December 17, 2017 - 17:13

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