Left 4 Dead

James Walker
James Walker

Both games are on sale atm, if I want to play MP which one should I buy?

Cooper Diaz
Cooper Diaz

2

Andrew Martinez
Andrew Martinez

2 has come to include 1's levels so there really isn't any reason to go with 1 nowadays.

Thomas Martinez
Thomas Martinez

There is very little reason to buy the first game.
The second game includes all weapons, characters and campaigns from the first one.

Angel Watson
Angel Watson

Nigga they gave L4D2 for free last year, that`s what you get for not coming here enough

Justin Gutierrez
Justin Gutierrez

Where was it? Maybe I can still find some keys

Eli Anderson
Eli Anderson

Know that both are pretty dead as far as multiplayer goes… No pun intended

John Jackson
John Jackson

2, especially since you can play the co-op campaign with more than 4 players.

Nicholas Scott
Nicholas Scott

(checked)

Theres still a lot of people playing custom versus servers on l4d2.

Jacob Jenkins
Jacob Jenkins

Is this true? If so, can you recommend me an alive co-op FPS?

Landon Howard
Landon Howard

Killing Floor?

Henry Walker
Henry Walker

You can see your feet in the first one. If memory serves me correctly most of the animations in L4D2 are downgrades; But 2 has a higher player count, better mod support, and more vanilla content.
That's incorrect, user.

Jason Murphy
Jason Murphy

he doesn't know about the server browser

Blake Miller
Blake Miller

actually purchasing l4d2
in 2017
zero hours
Enjoy getting vote kicked, faggot.

Isaac Lee
Isaac Lee

Neither. The community is utter garbage now and you'll never have fun playing with randoms.
Else 2.

Jacob Cooper
Jacob Cooper

being so new to gaming you have to even ask this question

Josiah Peterson
Josiah Peterson

All the servers that are still active are shit, modded to the point where the vanilla game no longer remains and are filled with degenerate furries. It's dead, user. No amount of "b-but muh dedicated servers!" can save it at this point.

Jonathan Roberts
Jonathan Roberts

The first game feels like a computer FPS, the second feels like it was consolized.
If you haven't played either before, play 1 first.

Gabriel Diaz
Gabriel Diaz

The first game feels like a computer FPS, the second feels like it was consolized
No it doesn't dipshit, you're pulling random shit that means nothing out of your ass. They are identical aside from more weapons and more special infectd.

Gavin Taylor
Gavin Taylor

It only feels that way because the second game's levels are less vertical so you're mostly shifting your aim from left to right(this is done to accommodate the new special infected). More horizontally designed levels is commonly associated with console FPS games(Where aiming up or down is usually avoided in the design). Also, in the first game you didn't have Spitters or Chargers so you were really relying on the people playing Hunter to try and land those 25-point pounces, hence the extra verticality. But in the sequel it's more about synergizing the special infected into coordinated attacks.

Noah White
Noah White

All the servers that are still active are shit, modded to the point where the vanilla game no longer remains and are filled with degenerate furries.
There are plenty vanilla servers still up. Server browser -> custom -> Valve Official. Enjoy playing on custom match making servers even ones set to friends only and private.
It's dead, user. No amount of "b-but muh dedicated servers!" can save it at this point.
It's actually pretty active and you don't have to play with furries. Makes me question what servers you have in your subscription list. Please don't tell me you are one of the faggots that added Hentai Rape servers and now complain because you get thrown into one by pressing quick match.

Also, in the first game you didn't have Spitters or Chargers so you were really relying on the people playing Hunter to try and land those 25-point pounces, hence the extra verticality. But in the sequel it's more about synergizing the special infected into coordinated attacks.
What, the first game is the only one that gives you reliable four-cap spawns. If anything the first game requires even more team work than the first one. 25-point pounces don't mean anything when you only get 2-3 attacks in per map. They just eat the pills and keep running.

OP if you want to play co-op you'll find plenty of players still in vanilla. If you want to play versus play on vanilla servers until you learn the basics then get on the Hot Mess servers if you want to see what high level play is like. The first game still have a lot of players as well and I prefer it to the 2nd but if you just want to play co-op you'll probably enjoy the second one more.

Juan Cruz
Juan Cruz

If anything the first game requires even more team work than the first one
*even more teamwork that the second one.
I'm not going to continue my autism but both of you obviously didn't put much time into either game.

Jonathan Wilson
Jonathan Wilson

Weird, I played online about a year ago and used the server browser and there were only 6 games going with no more than 10 people in each.

Easton Taylor
Easton Taylor

Not really, I played yesterday and it immediately found me a server with 3 players on it

Asher Sullivan
Asher Sullivan

I don't have a subscription list. I just know that every time I've gone into the server browser I had a hard time finding servers playing the vanilla game and weren't dominated by try-hard esports faggots who think that you're playing the game wrong if you don't know all the speedrun strats and if you use tier-2 weapons
That's where you're wrong, kiddo

Easton Long
Easton Long

1 and 2 play and act differently. 2 is a similar game that tacked on a bunch of unnecessary shit like melee weapons(which would make sense for the setting, but not for gameplay), sidegrade weapons that are just filler like the suppressed SMG, two sets of shotguns that perform exactly the same as their counterparts, the AK, SCAR, and the military sniper.
2 isn't consolized
Levels are no longer at night(the closest it comes is the second half of Hard Rain or the sewer in The Parish), melee weapons were introduced to reduce the punishment for bad aim and/or coordination, and adrenaline was added to negate the slow walk speed of low-health survivors and allow full-health survivors to negate high-drag terrain or outpace most threats.

Juan Cox
Juan Cox

And my time for the first game(I actually have what is well over 300 hours in the first game but I couldn't afford a nice PC at the time of release so I played it religiously on the Xbox 360 version for a lot of it)

Liam Cook
Liam Cook

Do you have any specific examples of the decreased verticality between the games? The first finale in L4D2 is more vertically oriented than anything present the first game.

Thomas Jones
Thomas Jones

The offer ends in about 1 hour so I have to be quick. I'll probably buy L4D2, but just noticed buying both L4Ds cost only 1$ more to me. Is there any reason to get the first game?

Carter Green
Carter Green

Dead Air levels 2 and 3, No Mercy Levels 1, 3 and 4, Death Toll levels 1, 2 and 4. I'm drawing a blank on Blood Harvest for some reason.
In L4D2 I can only think of the alarm segment in Dead Center, Dead Center's finale, Dark Carnival levels 1, 3, 4 and 5, Swamp Fever level 5, Hard Rain levels 2, 3, 4 and 5, two spots in the Parish and that's it.

Noah Kelly
Noah Kelly

No, but it has a good atmosphere and is more immersive than the second. Get it for GMod content or something.

Chase Jackson
Chase Jackson

The first level of most campaigns in L4D2 is mostly flat. Meanwhile the first game has every first level present the special infected with opportunities to attack from above, pull you down or even potentially push you into hanging from somewhere(Blood Harvest is underrated)
Dead Center: The flatest map in Left4Dead ever. Hallways with only one spot in the whole level where Hunters can get high damage pounces(and it's at the very end so if you miss you just wasted your only chance)
Dark Carnival: A little bit more verticality from the overpass, 2 billboards and motel roof. But that's only about 1/4th of the map.
Swamp Fever: First level has almost nothing going on for it in terms of verticality. The rooftops of the buildings at the start of the level will be hard pressed to give Hunters anything bigger than 10 point pounces in the best case scenario.
Hard Rain: First level has most of the same problems as Swamp fever, except with a few more two story buildings. You'll still be hard pressed for good opportunities to get good pounces in. But 20 point pounces are possible. Top I ever got on this level was 21, I don't know if the full 25 is possible
The Parish: Probably the best first level in the vanilla game's campaigns for vertical space. Lots of high rooftops where Smokers, Hunters and Spitters can hide. With lots of spaces that funnel survivors into choke points where you can land a 25 point pounce and have it followed up by a charge or spitter slime. You can really tell why they decided to use The Parish for the majority of their press events.
Then the DLC campaigns for some reason are real good about vertical space, they seemed to have learned their lesson later on.
I've run out of good Zoey porn, the rest of the porn online is DA trash drawn by 12 year-olds
No. But I must say I prefer the music of the first game. The menu theme and victory theme I prefer to the second game's immensely.

Elijah Sanchez
Elijah Sanchez

Not only can you get all L4D1 sounds in L4D2 via mods, but people also ported over the weapon animations which I think are better. Look on Steam Workshop and you can find those pretty easily.

Isaac Foster
Isaac Foster

L4D1 did have superior weapon animations yes. This is a big difference in the design of the two games that you can actually confirm in the developer commentary. In the first game they made it so your visibility with weapons was only impaired when reloading. The weapon would fill more of your screen when reloading, this was done to decrease situational awareness and ramp up anxiety in survivor players.
In L4D2 they decided that the weapon should just take up 1/4th of your screen at all times and barely move from it's place. What a stupid fucking decision that was. Look at these screenshots. The pistol in L4D2 takes up as much screen space as the first game's Uzi. Who the fuck thought this was a good idea?

Henry Martin
Henry Martin

modded to the point where the vanilla game no longer remains

These are the best ones.

Bear in mind some people have been playing L4D2 since it came out. They arent going to be satisfied with the base game forerver. They want to improve it.

But the custom servers that have their own playstyles and communities are much better.

The biggest flaw in the vanilla game is thatyou could end up stuck on a team with retards.
Most custom servers allow 10 per side so the chances of you having at least one or two non retards are much higher.

furries

They all play TF2 from what I can tell.

Charles Cox
Charles Cox

The majority of modded servers are fucking trash though. With shit like perk systems, point systems that let you buy weapons and items at any point in the match, and fuck that 10+ players per team system. What makes Left4Dead fun is the small team formula. Making Left4Dead 10v10 kills the fun of the game, it's like making Rainbow Six: Siege 10v10. It's a bad idea and should never even be considered.
The problem with modded servers in this game is that they don't improve the game, they just fuck it over. It's like playing a Rainbow version of Street Fighter, fun but is the same game in name only.

Oliver Flores
Oliver Flores

I remember one of the L4D games had a phenomenal set of Crash Bandicoot levels. Utterly nonsense, but it was actually very well done and kind of difficult, at least for just two people.
I also remember someone recreating the first Silent Hill, which is surreal to experience in first person when a horde of zombies can come running out of the fog at any second.

Julian Russell
Julian Russell

and fuck that 10+ players per team system

They are the best ones.

What makes Left4Dead fun is the small team formula

On the survivors side that is true. But all the tards die pretty quick and you are left with a handful of very good survivors facing a team of 10 infected.
Think of it like L4D meets Charles Darwin.

Thomas Reed
Thomas Reed

There aren't any lewd mods, are there?

Blake Johnson
Blake Johnson

They exist.

Jeremiah James
Jeremiah James

Yes there are, many in fact. Some even with jiggle physics.

Colton Evans
Colton Evans

Just the nude Zoey skin.

Xavier Smith
Xavier Smith

2 has both inside so

Xavier Ortiz
Xavier Ortiz

2 no question.

Josiah Cruz
Josiah Cruz

It was worth it in my experience, one of the first online games I really got into.

However nowadays there are better games to play in my opinion

Levi Fisher
Levi Fisher

1 had better maps, characters, and was more difficult.

Melee, and the lack of having a 2 hunter 1 smoker 1 boomer setup is what killed the online play.

Also shit maps

L4D 1 could have been a competitive game if Valve wanted. That shit was amazing

Thomas Torres
Thomas Torres

Think about this, in the first game every weapon came with a flashlight attachment, in the second game a flashlight magically appears from your chest when carrying a melee weapon.

Caleb Gonzalez
Caleb Gonzalez

Also your teammates flashlights dont actually light up the room.

Ethan Williams
Ethan Williams

I know why the weapon models are closer to the player's face, to hide the incomplete under cooked animations, just raise the FOV and see for yourself

Kayden Powell
Kayden Powell

Left 4 Dead 2 is a crap shoot in terms of quality compared to the much tighter made Left 4 Dead 1, they couldn't even correctly port the Left 4 Dead 1 survivors into the second game correctly. They have yet to fix them.

Owen Wood
Owen Wood

You can adjust these from the default.
I read it was something to do with console players expecting a larger gun model.

Im sure you are right but graphics and polish arent everything. If they were EA would be able to make good games.

Nicholas Butler
Nicholas Butler

got it
playing
it's some uber fast shit with runner zombies
music blasting in your ears
and effects everywhere
As a guy who comes from no more room in hell a lot of things seem meaningless here.
ammo is pretty close to a non-issue
consumables are pretty limited
special guns have no ammo issues
you can never barricade yourself anywhere
zombie numbers are a not a problem
It feels really low on the survival element compared to no more room in hell.
It's just run and gun.

Samuel Reed
Samuel Reed

Thats because its literally a race. Its called "left 4 dead" as in "if you dont keep up you are left for dead".

Do people actually think its a survival game? at best its a very chaotic first person schmup.

Caleb Cruz
Caleb Cruz

L4D is not a survival shooter, it's just a shooter. Running out of ammo does happen, but it's not that common if you're not retarded. If you find it easy, you might want to increase difficulty, although it doesn't really become more fun by playing on Expert in my opinion. Alternatively you can try playing with pubbies on any difficulty above Easy, that is guaranteed to make it way more difficult.

Hunter Flores
Hunter Flores

special guns have no ammo issues

Huh?? Both special guns (greande launcher and 50 cal) have severely limited amunition.

Thats a bit part of the mechanic of using them because there are no ammo pickups. If you throw your AK to get the 50 cal you may end up with only a melee weapon or a pistol once the ammo runs out.

Jose Jenkins
Jose Jenkins

Those are the special of the special.
In no more room in hell you find a pistol with 7 bullets total and you need to find specific ammo.
In no more room in hell you find 80-600 bullets along with your gun.

Ian Gray
Ian Gray

I just wanted something more on the zombie survival side of things where conserving ammo is a bit more meaningful.
The mere act of barricading a door feels great for these sort of games.

Correction:
In no more room in hell you find a pistol with 7 bullets total and you need to find specific ammo.
In left 4 dead you find 80-600 bullets along with your gun.

Hunter Murphy
Hunter Murphy

left 4 dead 2? what is that a text message from 2004?

Robert Martin
Robert Martin

In left 4 dead you find 80-600 bullets along with your gun.

That's what Left 4 Dead is all about, big guns, big zombie hordes.

Lucas Reed
Lucas Reed

Fuck off, the game is actually unique compared to every other generic zombie shooter on the planet. Stop trying to think of it as some shitty survival horror game and start thinking of it at a chaotic zombie shooter and you will have fun.

Kevin Campbell
Kevin Campbell

big women, big fun.

Logan Moore
Logan Moore

Women

Jacob Roberts
Jacob Roberts

no theres plenty of people playing it. and dont fall for the killing floor meme, its boring as hell.

Carson Russell
Carson Russell

I am having some fun but it feels like the fun will run out extremely fast.
It might have been unique a bunch of years back, but right now it's nothing special.

At least headshots could have been a bit more meaningful.

Connor Phillips
Connor Phillips

Headshots are very meaningful when fighting special infected, the game is surprisingly deep and the fun secretly lies in versus.

Levi Wilson
Levi Wilson

Headshots instakill most things including specials, bodyshots don't, depending on the gun. On higher difficulties, bodyshots do even less damage. L4D is very much designed to be played in coop too, so you will not get that much out of it playing alone. I have 110 hours on both 1 and 2, having gotten them way back around when they released. Out of that almost 0 was in SP and maybe around 5-10 hours in public lobbies.

Alexander Cox
Alexander Cox

This, I'd suggest getting at least one friend for this game, finding non-retards in public lobbies is difficult.

James Collins
James Collins

In no more room in hell you find a pistol with 7 bullets total and you need to find specific ammo.
In left 4 dead you find 80-600 bullets along with your gun.

I dont think you pointed out that pistol ammo is unlimited in L4D which is a bit unrealistic.

MFW I was the one who was arguing with you but Im helping you make your point.

Isaiah Morales
Isaiah Morales

At least headshots could have been a bit more meaningful.

You can probably mod in the doom voice that says HEAD SHOT!
Would be pretty fun against hundreds of zombies.

Juan Young
Juan Young

The most fun part of l4d was playing versus with and against competent people, I couldn't ever find a decent group of randoms in l4d2.
Being so kick happy probably made things worse, since that stops the noobs learning from someone better than themselves.

Cameron Lopez
Cameron Lopez

Ammo is pretty close to a non-issue
The reason why ammo is limited at all is to keep players from just spraying the whole time.
Consumables are pretty limited
As they should be. The whole side element of strategy in the game is when you should use your limited consumables. You're saying it like it's an oversight and not strictly intentional
Special guns have no ammo issues
Are you referring to weapons like the grenade launcher and M60? Because while the GL can last a long time if you place shots correctly and have a good secondary weapon, it also has the problem of being able to fuck you over easily. Fire your shot at a tank and now he's smacked you? The reload animation is so long that he'll hit you again before it's over and repeat this until you're downed. That's the drawback of the grenade launcher, it leaves you open if you don't play it smart. Also, the ammo on the M60 is a fucking joke and no one bothers picking it up ever. I also never seem to even find one when I play anymore, wonder if Valve secretly removed it from the spawns.
You can never barricade yourself anywhere
Because the game is about going from point A to point B as quickly and safely as possible. It's not about locking yourself in a room, assessing your supplies and then picking off zombies through a window until there's a big enough gap in the crowd to get moving. No More Room in Hell already does that, why do you want L4D to just be NMRH 2?
Zombie runners are not a problem
They're not supposed to be. They're supposed to be a distraction for the special infected to get you. Without the generic mob zombies you'd just snipe every special infected before they could get close.
None of it is meaningless. You're just projecting your own biases onto the game and acting as if they're flaws in the game design.

David Campbell
David Campbell

zombie numbers are not a problem
Play on advanced/expert then come back and say that

Jack Peterson
Jack Peterson

All of this.

Sebastian Allen
Sebastian Allen

NMRiH 2
Game is currently in Development by the way. Will cost money unlike the first.

Cameron Taylor
Cameron Taylor

While most of that is true I thought there would be decent mods that change the standard gameplay.
With the expectations I had I see left 4 dead as really simple action game. that doesn't really do anything all that well. Exactly like vermintide.

Dylan Jackson
Dylan Jackson

nowadays there are better games to play
mind to name a few?

Jace Reed
Jace Reed

payday 2 and warframe

Samuel Ortiz
Samuel Ortiz

Why didn't you get both games when Valve was handing them out for free?

Julian Gonzalez
Julian Gonzalez

he was too young to use steam last year

Grayson Jenkins
Grayson Jenkins

Payday 2
aka game bloated with feature creep and microtransaction CS:GO skins
wew

Luis Brooks
Luis Brooks

Payday 2
Battlefield 3 wannabe with microtransactions and DLC out the ass with memes and stornk independent womyn of color
Warframe
The Iron Man of Grindathons and no helicoptering
No thanks.

Dominic Collins
Dominic Collins

You can play mutations that basically do that, but they generally keep in line with the normal gameplay, they're things like "all specials are hunters", "katanas only", "pipe bombs only", et cetera.
doesn't really do anything all that well
No, in its class it's the best. Your expectations were completely off. Payday 2 is a good example of how the same horde-wave-shooter can be done much more badly.

Cooper Lopez
Cooper Lopez

Sounds like they sucked you in with all the leveling up and grinding for weapons.

Jason Hill
Jason Hill

battlefield 3 wannabe
???
stornk independent womyn of color
Oh, okay, you've never played the game before.

Zachary Edwards
Zachary Edwards

Remember that time L4D2 was supposed to have random dynamic weather as well as random day and night cycles alongside part of the maps being randomly closed and blocked, opening new routes and making levels feel new and fresh every time you played?
I do.

Grayson Lewis
Grayson Lewis

There are no women of color in the game, there's only one black guy if that matters.

You seriously have no idea what you're talking about…

Asher Murphy
Asher Murphy

Not to mention the black guy is just dumb muscle and nothing more.

Zachary Brooks
Zachary Brooks

He's a pretty memeable character and everyone knows that, people have fun with good ol' chains.

Christopher Hernandez
Christopher Hernandez

I do remember the 1 year development, that surely had something to do with the game coming half cooked.

Nicholas Walker
Nicholas Walker

this
I unknowingly bought both 1 and 2 at one point.

Liam Thompson
Liam Thompson

part of the maps being randomly closed and blocked, opening new routes and making levels feel new and fresh every time you played?

That feature was implemented in both L4D1 and 2.

There are no women of color in the game, there's only one black guy if that matters.

How do you know he didnt identify as a woman you transphobe!

Lucas Torres
Lucas Torres

That feature was implemented in both L4D1 and 2
Show us, valve dick sucker.

Lincoln Barnes
Lincoln Barnes

I would have to handhold you through the game and point them out to you.
Which sounds like a lot of effort with absolutely nothing in it for me.

Jaxon Wright
Jaxon Wright

i can prove you wrong but i wont, xd
And the bitch runs away with a tail between it's legs…

Robert Phillips
Robert Phillips

So, you have nothing and are a bullshitting liar. Good to know.

Nathaniel Hernandez
Nathaniel Hernandez

OK you peer pressured me in to doing a google search for you. You lazy cunt.

Happy now?

I dont know why you think this is such a great feature anyway.

Kayden Jenkins
Kayden Jenkins

Things like that are kinda rare and when they do happen they're minimal at best, so now in this case, instead of going through the little tunnel, you just go walk a few steps ahead and take the stairs… not really of note if you ask me.

Xavier Clark
Xavier Clark

They promised actual new areas to go trough because the default road got closed, not walk two feet around the corner to the right alongside weather being random on ALL maps, ranging from bright daylight to fog, to thunder storms at night.

Jason Ross
Jason Ross

samefag
not only is that not the first game but that's one minor sequence, i don't even know of any others and i have at least 500 hours on l4d2

Camden Garcia
Camden Garcia

I was just responding to what the person posted in this thread.
part of the maps being randomly closed and blocked, opening new routes

Theres one on no mercy. The round the back way to the exit on the first level chganes.
Although now Im saying it that might just be the l4d2 version of the map.

Still I think you imagined this to be something it was not.

Carson Perry
Carson Perry

I heard Vermintide is basically Warhammer: L4D. I vaguely remember threads about it, but how was the game?

Aiden Foster
Aiden Foster

how was the game?

Its basically Warhammer: L4D.

Logan Young
Logan Young

Holy ctrl+c & ctrl+v batman! That's fucking stealing the L4D UI holy shit.

Colton White
Colton White

Hey, if it works, right?

Brayden Turner
Brayden Turner

I really wanted to like it but its kinda impossible, I've put a fraction of the time I put into l4d1/2 into vermintide and I'm allready quite bored of grinding the maps.
Now the second one they're making looks like a dlc / what the first one should have been and I'm really dissapointed in it.

Jordan Anderson
Jordan Anderson

Now the second one they're making looks like a dlc / what the first one should have been and I'm really dissapointed in it.
You mean like L4D2?

Carter Gray
Carter Gray

Differences between Vermintide and L4D:

The emphasis is more on melee than shooting.
RPG elements such as classes, leveling up your weapon and your character
Quests given each day but just becomes pointless once you have the gear you need
You dont slow down when you are low on health. This is the main difference.
All the enemies are now rats.

Carson Sullivan
Carson Sullivan

So then… it's worse?

Hunter Morgan
Hunter Morgan

Some maps do indeed feature obstructions that can appear or be missing, mainly coming to mind the start at in the 3rd map of Carnival you can either walk straight to the bumper cars or have to walk around.
The only map that I can remember of the top of my head to actually feature different weather is the first map of the passing where you can storms.
All in all I think that it was planned and the technical groundwork is there but got axed due to the rushed development.

Sebastian Walker
Sebastian Walker

Rats sound boring as fuck.

Wyatt Price
Wyatt Price

But zombies don't ?

Jason Long
Jason Long

Less boring than that, zombies actually have variety in L4D2 and mods can easily replace them with headcrabs/teletubbies/stormtroopers/whatever.

Charles Hughes
Charles Hughes

You could say that.

Id say its wirdly similar in a lazy way. Like they werent bold enough to try out any new ideas besides adding generic RPG elements and modern grinding mechanics.
Even the special rats are just slightly modified from the L4d ones.

William Adams
William Adams

zombies actually have variety in L4D2
Aren't there more rat varieties in vermintide compared to l4d2 zombies?
If not then vermintide, that doesn't even have proper modding suck dicks.

Nathaniel Ramirez
Nathaniel Ramirez

No, l4d2 really has nothing special to offer compared to the first one, its just new maps basicly.

Owen Murphy
Owen Murphy

In Vermintide you have your Trashrats (Skavenslaves that are practically naked and Clanrats that have some leather or armor and are bigger). Then you have the Specials, Stormvermin are Man-sized, heavily armored rats with halberds that hit hard but are slow, they can show up alone or in Patrols of half a dozen or up to 2 dozen depending on difficulty.
Then you have Specials with abilities, the Gas Rat who throws poison globes at you often killing the skavenslaves around you, then the Gutterrunner who is basically the Hunter, the Packmaster who grabs you with his pole and drags you aways from your team-mates, the Ratling Gunner who will shoot warp infused bullets at you by the hundreds and finally the Rat Ogre who is basically the Tank although he has more moves and jumps around instead of throwing heat-seeking rocks at you.
From what I see that is a lot more variety than L4D especially since things like a Stormvermin Patrol can kill the whole Team as easily as a Tank/Ratogre can.

Chase Bennett
Chase Bennett

you can never barricade yourself anywhere
Doors in L4D2 can take a certain amount of damage before they open in the middle; after they break a little you can shoot through them but any stray bullets will splinter the door further. Opening a door into a zombie cluster will stagger them, which enables you to play peekaboo if you know your back is clear and a smoker won't grab you with the door open.

There are layers to the door mechanics which make them interesting depending on what the situation is and the status of your teammates. You sound fucking retarded because I noticed this the first time I played the game and it's much more engaging than >muh barricades

If you haven't played with other players, or as the infected, then you also don't understand the concept of spawn blocking and why it rewards map knowledge and mental reads. It's impossible to run Left 4 Dead 2 perfectly unless one team is ass or godlike, so you must be able to adapt to different circumstances while moving as quickly as possible. Barricading is boring as shit in any game.

Liam Wright
Liam Wright

Peekaboo with doors is meh and can be done in many games.
Nothing special or very tactical about it.

Ayden Ward
Ayden Ward

Played the free weekend of Vermintide, was very boring solo. maybe their 2nd game with Chaos can make it more exciting, but I doubt it. very shallow game if you play alone.

Ryder White
Ryder White

1 is better
2 has much shittier hit detection

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