Dragon ball z games general

Again, I didn't make that pic.

Here have a real memer

I ranked these by enjoyment but now I realize it would be funnier if DBZ MUGEN 2011 was the punchline. Oh well.

Man, UB22 is probably the worst of the 2D DBZ fighters. Final Bout is also pretty bad.

Super Butouden 2 was fucking great just for the story mode alone.

Also what was up with Butouden 3? It's such a barebones sequel.

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For a fighting game, the story mode really is great. I still keep finding new stuff.
I love how the true final boss if you play with Gohan is Goku himself.
But the game mechanics are also tons of fun. A lot of people get put off by the slow speed, but there's an easy way to enable the turbo mode, which is how the game should be played.

What in the fuck.

This is the best DBZ video game.

Yeah I'd place Hyper Dimension slightly under Butoden 2. I can even understand how some people might prefer it to Butoden 2, it might be the best DBZ fighting game ever made.

That's one of the worst, but that intro is 10/10.
I remember putting the disc on my ps just to watch it over and over.

Good intro =/= good game

Suck my dick plebs

Also what do you think about Legends for the Saturn?

Even if it is, it's not exactly a high bar to clear.

I had the PS version, which is virtually the same game.
It's the best or most enjoyable out of the PS trilogy for me, but mainly due to presentation and the unique concept. Being able to have real-time fighting action while switching between characters on the fly is pretty damn cool, and you feel like you're playing an actual DBZ fight. But in the end the game is really simple because it all comes down to mashing buttons and pressing up.
The only stage I remember ever actually losing (and I think only once), was the androids stage. I think it was the only one where you had to fight against 3 powerful enemies instead of 3 vs 1 or 3 vs 2, so it was an even 3 v 3 match.
Regardless, as a kid I enjoyed going through all the DBZ story while mashing buttons and seeing shit fly through the air, but nowadays I only listen to the soundtrack.

I'm not sure if you realized it but my list was intentionally filled with the worst DBZ games I could remember.

I did, I was just agreeing and sort of realizing how true that is.

Alright, some times people take those brain charts seriously so I gotta make sure.

Been playing XV2 for the first time for a bit, and I feel like I'm missing something with the combat. It was a breeze up until I got to the story mission where you fight both Frieza and Cooler at the same time. It feels like, once they power up, they're just able to hit me before my attacks land, and that they're able to hit me with a follow up when I dodge an attack. I don't know how I'm supposed to approach them without getting hit and caught in a long combo.

Budokai 3 didn't have the "WE WUZ HARDCORE AND SHIT FORCED TO PLAY SHIT DBZ GAMES UNTIL NOW" fuck-faggotry attached to it like DBF:Z does. As such, it cannot be the greatest DBZ game.

If Advanced Adventure was a DBZ game, it'd be the best, but it's only a Dragonball game.

I'd disagree.
Tenkaichi 3 had a great chunk of characters and therefore a fuckload of content and possibly the BEST loading screens,making a tournament with a shitton of friends and picking random characters was the shit back in the day.
2 had some quirks like the original stories that were a nice twist.

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Best game coming through.

I used to play the shit out of this game online on ZSNES. It's hard to find matches these days.

This cover makes me wonder which DB characters would play vidya and what would they like. I mean, present Trunks is a no-brainer, but I feel Chichi wouldn't get any games for Goten, and Gohan definitely didn't play them as a kid. I could see him maybe getting into them as an adult. Roshi's not only a bro who would play them, he's probably got a bunch of old PC-98 games to ogle over on occasion.

Mr. Satan and Buu probably play vidya all the time.

Will Budokai 3 ever hit Playstation store so I can play it on my ps3/4?

It's already on PS3. They swapped out the music with shit from Ultimate Tenkaichi and censored a bunch of stuff, but it's there.

Probably, to be honest.

Get better

I know this is bait, but Final Bout is borderline unplayable and has like, 6 or 7 playable versions of Goku. It's a shame such a cool intro is stuck in that piece of shit of all games.

Was it really called dragon ball z for Kinect?

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GT is a mixed bag.

If you actually watched it you can tell whoever was in charge of it was at least an actual fan of the Dragon Ball and wanted to bring back that adventure element that was really missing since Z got into it's groove. Art quality was generally well done, and was a nice break from the constant action that was Z… but ultimately starts to feel like it's dragging it's feet with the marriage episode and those guys that dance. I think the worst part of the first half through was those robot guys that could fuse into one big toy.

Finishing that by transitioning back into the Z style after baby come into the picture was also good choice. And the show should have ended with him being defeated. (And I honestly think that was the original intention.) Cause almost everything after that felt like it was rushed and the quality drops horrifically. The very last episode where it time skips is the exception. Super 17 and especially evil dragons in concept seem like a good ideas. One brings back an otherwise unused character and the other actually brings consequences to just wishing everyone back over and over… But they missed the mark really badly with both. To be honest at that point it was starting to suffer from some similar things that Super just has throughout.

Ultimately though GT isn't this horrific mess that people want to claim it is. It's got a really fucking bad dub with bad music, which makes even watching the good half nearly impossible. So if you've only seen that version. You should try it subbed.

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Super has been kind of shit all the way through though. It might be hard to explain, but everything either feels very artificial or that there is no real stakes to anything that's happening. I'm going to ignore the retelling of the movies. Take the first tournament that Beerus and Chompa have for example… You really don't feel any tension about anything because there is no real consequence for any of the main characters. They're essentially just working under beerus in a safe environment fighting over bigger dragon balls… which at this point I have yet to really see why these are "better" than Earth's… outside of maybe not being able undue a wish from the Super Dragon balls. Despite what the show will try to make you feel, with it's dramatic music and everyone looking worried… a lack of anything to really care over makes it all feel empty. Fights were kind of boring and ultimately it's only plot relevance was to serve as a minor push for Zamasu to continue with his edgy rampage.

Speaking of that, while they at least fixed that "no stakes" problem… as that arc starts to unfold we begin to start noticing how certain characters are being treated weirdly in terms of writing. And when the whole power-scaling thing gets even more fucked up than it was, especially way later when they go back and fight him the second or third time. I would go into the tournament arc but holy fuck I don't feel like thinking about that at all after writing all this. I'll just say that the Manga is much better as said. But still kind of suffers from some of the same fundamental issues.

TLDR GT is better than Super and whats canon ultimately doesn't matter. Getting good writers is.

I haven't watch GT but I suspect that Super isn't treated with the same disdain as GT because of when it was released.

Every idea to fix DBS involves Goku and Vegeta never using SSJG or SSJB ever again.

That's what I'm trying to do, but I'm not going to get better just pounding my head against the mission over and over again. I need to find out what I'm doing wrong so I stop doing it.

I agree that Super has some major issues, but there's a lot of little things that I think it gets right, mostly in terms of character relationships. Vegeta and Bulma actually feel like a couple, for instance. There's a lot of fun little moments, like Piccolo finding out how Goku and Vegeta could stand being married to their chosen wives.

Yeah, GT came when DB was still at the height of its popularity. Super came after a long period of nothing but two movies and a special (two specials if you count the retarded Bardock one).

The thing is, after the space adventure part, it feels like DBZ filler.
Super introduced way more interesting characters and settings than GT ever did.
They are already fixing the animation in Super by the way, latin america is already airing Super and they're getting the fixed animation, which I guess will be on japanese blu rays.

Still, it's obvious Super is a way to cash in the franchise and Toriyama is just sitting back there "supervising" Toei and Toyotaro.
But yeah I enjoyed Super more than GT, at least I'm still watching Super, I dropped GT around super 17.
The Zamasu arc was good by the way.

No, it wasn't. It had some good moments and the memes that came out of it were fantastic, but the arc as a whole was a clusterfuck of bad ideas and ass-pullery with an unsatisfying ending as the cherry on top. Not to mention there was only like two good fights in the whole thing. I'm sure the manga was better than the anime, but the anime version came first, and it sucked.

I loved it, wish it was longer.

What I hated about the Zamasu arc was how it seemed to be spinning its wheels with no significant progress being made until the very end. Everyone goes to the future, gets beaten up, goes back to the past, goes to the future, gets beaten up, goes to the past, goes to the future, gets beaten up, wins by an asspull, doesn't actually win at all, everything is made all better because Whis can do just about anything. Not to mention the retarded retcon of Potara fusion lasting only an hour for mortals (which then lasts all of 5 minutes because lol SSJB used it up) just to they kept bringing things just to have them as fan pandering, but then shoving them out the door so that nothing actually happens with them. They bring back the Mafuba, only for it to not work because Goku is suddenly a forgetful idiot. They bring back Vegetto, only to retcon it so that Potara fusion only lasts an hour for mortals (but it only lasts all of 5 minutes because lol SSJB used it all up). Zamasu was a great villain, but he was the only good thing about it.

Wow, I fucked up one of those sentences badly. This is why you proofread.

Is it weird that I wanted to play an MMO after watching that whole thing?

Nah it had a lot of great moments that weren't fighting-related.

Interesting vid on DBZ.
The guy goes further than "Power levels go too far".

Game looks hype though.

Those things could very easily have happened with a different plot, though. They could have used any excuse to have Trunks come back and see everyone. Meanwhile, Zamasu gives us Goku being a bigger retard than usual, a very poor understanding of time travel, asspulls galore, really bad pacing, Trunks and Mai romance while weirdly ignoring the fact that Mai is old enough to be Trunks' grandma, and enormous missed opportunities.

They didn't do enough with Future Trunks in the past. I expected more with him and little Trunks hanging out like brothers, but most of that was pushed aside for a ridiculous love triangle with Mai.

Super's fun to watch, and frankly it's the exact same mindless garbage as DBZ. You're just in denial about liking trash while gazing lovingly at DBZ through three layers of nostalgia shielding.
It's okay to have a guilty pleasure, user, and DBZ is the Chad of anime.

I'll show you real

I disagree on the nostalgia bit. DBZ had its low points but honestly Super feels like one big Garlic Jr. Saga in terms of quality.

I bet you think the animation quality went up because of a total 5 minutes of it being not shit to.
Zamasu is literally Sensui if instead of watching chapter black he got upset because a some kid did a thing he didn't want them to do without telling the kid not to do it.

Zamasu was great because he was a hypocritical egomaniac with a complete god complex. He had an entertaining personality coupled with a penchant for theatrics. He could have had a stereo blaring classical music whenever he fought and it would have been completely in-character for him. The dude literally gave himself a halo. His motivation was idiotic, but that was part of the charm of the character. He just could not comprehend why mortals were allowed to exist when gods already did.

GREAT PINK SCYTHE TEARING REALITY APART

The original was funnier.

The fighting in Super is its weakest trait, but DBZ's always shined the most in its filler to begin with. In the fights it's always just yelling and punches and things exploding, but the character episodes are actually fun.
The best episode of DBZ by far is the one where Goku and Piccolo go to driving school, and the Buu saga is packed with great silly episodes between all of the humdrum fighting.

tits or gtfo

You know what? I'll say it:
The driving school meme has gone too far. Yes it was silly, yes it was fun, no it wasn't the best episode what the fuck is wrong with you?
Were you sick the day Goku went Super Saiyan? When Vegeta pulled out the Final Flash? When Goku landed on Namek and cleaned the Ginyu Force's collective Clocks? When Vegeta tried to destroy the entire Earth after getting buttblasted by the Kaioken?
The show has some really humorous moments but to say that getting a driver's license was the crowning achievement of the whole series tells me you just like parroting what others are saying and never, ever cared about DBZ.

The Buu saga was also full of absolutely ridiculous ass pulls and completely irrelevant slice of life garbage that they dropped without doing anything with. If you thought that was great, I can understand why you would like Super but I must ask, why not just read Dr. Slump or Neko Majin Z if you just want silly fluff with no action?
I'll admit, I loved the Great Saiyaman but that shit will always pale in comparison to Super Buu wiping out all of humanity with one attack.
I'm done sperging about DBZ today.

TL;DR DBZ's best stuff has always been the action, it only makes sense that people would dislike Super since it gets the most important part wrong.

I love the early DBZ filler. The Gohan episodes were very comfy, and at times tearjerking.

You are the biggest goddamn pleb. DBZ absolutely pales in comparison to DB because of worse action, less humor, and power level stupidity. DB is at its best when it isn't buff dudes screaming about how much higher their number is and shooting out beam attack #1273. Action is far from the most important part of the franchise.

Cell Saga filler + the search for the dragon balls was good to if I recall correctly,I always thought as a kid that Ten Shin Han got strong enough to pull out the Neo Ki Ko Ho because of the tournament.
ALSO MOTHERFUCKING TAO APPEARS AGAIN,TWICE.

Zamus always felt like parody of Edgy OCs. Super as a whole feels, for better or worse, like somewhat of a mix of Z and OG.

It was the best arc in DBS but it was still extremely shit.

ftfy

Budokai is clunky as fuck and only goes up to the Cell saga. Good story mode though.

Budokai 3 has great gameplay and a great roster. The free roaming story mode was also neat. The only flaws were missing a couple minor characters that were in the previous games (Dodoria, Zarbon, and #19) and biggest of all: Dragon Rush. The completely luck-based QTE is bullshit. Other than that, Budokai 3 is perfect.

The handhelds had some great games as well:

And the upcoming fighter game DBFighterZ looks good as well. Finally something Budokai fans have been wanting for all these years, instead of another generic 3D Tenkaichi casual button masher.

Nope, Tenkaichi 3 will remain the best DBZ game for a long time.

Its odd how badly they fucked up using Tenkaichi 3's combat system in Xenoverse and just made it significantly worse in every aspect.

Everyone I know dickrode Budokai 3 hardcore, but I fucking loved Tenkaichi 3. It captured the high speed, flight heavy combat fucking beautifully.

In what ways was it "clunky"?

Have you played it?

I got the Budokai HD Collection on Xbox 360. I easily notice the stark difference.

3 is smooth, more control of your character, fluid movements, it just feels right.

1 feels like you're controlling a robot, the gameplay is barebones, powering up looks retarded and transformations are on a short timer. There's also no way to escape from a combo unlike in Budokai 3 where you can teleport or dodge.

That shit's a dime a dozen, what makes it done well is how the character comes to get to this outlook, even Bleach managed to do it better with Aizen simply since birth been smarter and stronger then everyone so wants to evolve everything to his level at the expense of everything before.
What personality, muh ningen, the only shread of personality the dude had was at once point he cries because he's told he's a mortal now too, everything else is him going "muh high ground anakin" "This is your fault"
Him and about 5000 shit villains off of the production line.
So this is the mindset it takes to enjoy super?
No he was pissed why they aren't punished for breaking rules of the gods when they were never even told the rules of the gods.

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Zamasu was fun. I swear it was just a huge joke.

Scrub detected
It also never felt that stiff to me, and I've played the HD collections (which is fucking garbage; its better to just emulate the gamecube/ps2 version)
and I've played Budokai 3 as well; I didn't notice any particularly large jump in smoothness or fluidity of combat; they just added more follow-up options and dumbed down the special move mechanics

Mai a cute!!!

Y'know, the Budokai series really drives me insane. Even though the series kept getting better with each entry, they somehow managed to balance out all the positive changes with a bunch of boneheaded decisions that totally held each game back. Like for fuck's sake, after Budokai 3 all they really had to do to be perfect was make Super moves not be awful to pull off, but three games later well five, but I'm not counting Another Road and the Evolution game they still couldn't make the definitive Budokai game.

Where Super saiyan 4?

I brought up DB because your entire reasoning for Z being better than Super (which I agree with) was absolutely retarded. The entire Dragon Ball franchise is at its best when its about the characters, not the fights. This is why episodes like the driving lessons are so good. Your insistence that the action was the most important part, especially with Z, made you sound like one of those idiots who watched DBZ on Toonami as a preteen and believed that's how everything Dragon Ball should be. I brought up DB because ''that's" what the franchise should strive to be.

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This is why Infinite world is best, you should never be using supers outside of an ensured win because they have 500hp and stun since Ki is meant to be used for all defensive tools.
All the gimmicks are gone except supers having the QTE and who cares about story mode shit you unlock everything right away for the sake of actually playing the game.

Shit taste detected
Go jack off to your overrated AI slut
Tay for life

The entire idea behind super moves is that they exist as a way for players getting their asses beat to turn the tides. They're high risk enough as is, slapping a QTE on top of it is fucking bullshit.
Well considering you actually need to play through the story mode to unlock everything, I'd say a lot of people care.

DBZ is boring and overrated as fuck. GT is everything wrong with Z cranked up to 11, and DBS is trying and failing hard to do anything actually interesting with the setting and characters and is slowly falling back into the Z way of doing things making it all so fucking boring. The series was at its fucking peak when Goku beat his arch-rival, won the tournament, declined the offer to becoe god of Earth and rode off into the sunset with his fiance on his flying cloud. To say Z is better than anything is laughable.

God that GBA game was ass.>>13504761

Tay would call you a nigger for taste that shit.

No it's a win more or finisher in almost any game since SF2, most games only give you enough meter or much more meter towards supers for being the aggressor while the one who's ass is beat will never receive enough meter from damage to pull it off if any. IDK where you pulled that come back part out of unless you only play tekken 7 because since SF 2 they've only been earn able via actually being the one attacking.

Fuck off

That orphans episode was fucking terrible. I still kind of pissed that the robot episode was passed over in favor that one when Ocean was originally dubbing the series.

It was considering it was cancelled within a year.

It's literally just having the low quality 3D models doing small talk before fights. Want to see a good recreational anime story mode that's also fun and works with the gameplay? See Berserk for PS2.
Implying Budokai 1 is sound.
an infinite in Budokai 1 which is almost universal across the cast is KKKKG or 6PKKG, they didn't even try to fix that shit till 3 where they simply allowed you to teleport out of combos.

Yeah, and fighting games just involve pressing buttons in sequence faster and in proper order than your opponents
Please, kill yourself.
Show me an example of those combo being "universal" and I'll believe you; I'm having trouble believing that they even are a thing
I've almost never seen those combos, the combos I usually see would be something like KKKKG->sidestep->P->PKG->KKK->G

No kill yourself.
Most regular sized characters in the game have KKKKG or PKKG cancel. Video related explains how to do it around 10 minutes in. only almost universal since smaller dudes don't have the same go to strings.
everything that worked in 3 combo wise works in 1 excluding special related stuff like Goku can't Dragon Fist loop in 1 or 2 due to no actual dragon fist or Goku's ki ball launch extender from IF due to him not having the moves to do it yet.
Only in 3 and IF on you're not just doing infinite since with the introduction of vanish attacks you now have to maximize your damage before their Ki recovered.
Nothing stops you from just doing an infinite that stalls the timer to win besides turning it off before hand.
youtube.com/watch?v=0GqLojky5Js here's another video showing characters just doing it with the base KKKKG loop with multiple characters to show it off more. You can do it faster then the character can drop to recover.

Nigger I never said it was "dynamic", where is this arbitrary adjective coming from?
It can be great without having to be "dynamic", that has nothing to do with anything
You kill yourself.

That aside, you provided proof about the infinites. I'll concede that point. You were right about that being a legitimate problem with the game (at least in the HD collections; I'd have to see if it was the same in the original, but it very likely is)

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At least DBZ was consistent with the power levels. DBS is all over the place. Hell, even Master Roshi was able to beat 3 of the universe strongest warriors.

It's still kinda nice they're giving old characters some relevance again like Togashi did for Yu Yu Hakusho (power levels became bullshit after Frieza anyways). I just wish Piccolo was as strong as Goku and Vegeta as he was during the Cell Saga, and Tien was given more love.

I fucking hate tournament arcs. The last one wasn't good and that was their one freebie. If they wanted to pretend that the non-Saiyans were not worthless, they could have used the hyperbolic time chamber and Elder Supreme Kai's potential unlock. The manga is way better but still kinda shit.

Fuck the Tournament of Power.
Fuck DBS.
Fuck Toei.

I dunno about you fags but I'm hyped for using Tien and Yamcha. All of the shitters are going to be using Goku and Vegeta and that leaves the non-saiyans and non-villains as grey area territory where all the focus is off of them. Then things will get even more exciting once the tier-list fags rank them low and that means every time you use the bottom tier guys, you cause an immediate upset. What makes Fighter Z the most interesting when it comes to the inevitable tier-list faggotry is that the characters are shipping with pre-determined stats.

From left to right: power, speed, technique, reach, energy
Then the last one below: Ease of use

All of the plebs will gravitate towards the characters with the most S ranks. This leaves the non-plebs with an advantage over the non-S rank characters. To give you an idea; yamcha has the most B rank stats, his only S rank is in speed. Meanwhile Tien has the most A ranks while every other character (except 18) has at least one S. I'm anticipating the greatest clusterfuck to ever grace fighting games as tier-list fags will clash with power level nerds and neither of them will be valid.

Daily reminder that Super is canon, vastly superior to GT, and is making Toei so much money that it'll be continuing for a good long while.

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What's the best build to cheese my way through Xenoverse 1 quickly so I can play Xenoverse 2?

Honestly, just play Xenoverse 2.

Muh autism tho

DBFZ will be too dumbed down to be as good as SDBZ. probably still good tho

on the topic of SDBZ–good channel. updates regularly.

It's 2 episodes tonite baby

You can start watching dragon ball again. The filler ended.

Feels like it, this is the first arc where I feel like there's actually a story with impact going that could branch off to that 700 episode series Toriyama wants. Also, the new form is pretty sick.

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Has there been any word yet if modders are finding a way around the anti-cheat shit?

You're wrong by default and have shit taste.

Holla Forums's retard problem is worse than I thought.

Did they rebalance SSGSS Vegeto in Xeno2? He's only got four bars of Ki and needs five to use the Final Kamehameha.

You were 115 replies too late fag

Are you fucking shitting me? It was total dogshit.
"He ate the spirit bomb it works because no one can explain it"

I never said the games were shit. In fact, they're the only good thing aside from some characters, some concepts and some porn.

Dragon Ball was absolutely shit on once the initial thrill of Goku and Piccolo forced to team up to fight a new enemy who turned out to be his brother that even ended with him fucking dying and having to be wished back at the beginning of the story wore off.

Sounds to me you don't know how to enjoy things. Stop taking the show so serious and maybe you'll start to enjoy it.
Or perhaps you don't want to enjoy it and you just enjoy being angry at it for not being something it isn't.
Except they did. You can say "I didn't like the explanation", but that's your own problem.

What was the explanation?

Ah yes, how to forget the genius of the episodes of the false Namek saga, or the Oh look it's Garlic Jr. again saga, or the tail end filler episodes after Buu was killed
This meme needs to end

dude don't forget the episodes where ginyu and bulma switch bodies, those episodes are the highlight of the series

Watch the episode. Whis explains it.

Whis explains the power he obtains, not the method he obtains it with.

As a matter of fact, Krillin says "That doesn't make sense", to which Whis responds, "Exactly."

Are you fucking shitting me? It was total dogshit.
"He drank water it works because no one can explain it"

Are you fucking shitting me? It was total dogshit.
"He got pissed off it works because no one can explain it"

Are you fucking shitting me? It was total dogshit.
"He got possessed but not really it works because no one can explain it"

Okay but all those things were previously explained within the lore.
This new form was out of nowhere because he faceplanted a ki attack that shouldn't even have hurt him in the first place.

The super saiyan form would actually render him able to be damaged by the spirit bomb due to how the form taints the heart and soul, this is why he cannot use the spirit bomb outside of base form but can power up when needing to push it back at someone.

So was this, just because you can't remember anything from before 5 episodes ago doesn't mean they didn't happen.

that's true but the guy who uses it should still know better

I'm pretty sure you have memory problems now. Go have that checked. It was Tien that said that and Whis does the opposite, he explains how he obtained it, not how it works or what it is specifically (In this episode anyway, see ).

Whis then goes on to say
"However the main point is something else"
"…the raging power of the spirit bomb that entered Goku and his power to resist it"
"beyond that clash of power Goku broke through the shell to the deeper potential within himself"

I wonder where you'll move the goalpost next.

That was anime movie canon only.

That's a fucking word salad. Those words literally don't mean anything together. So this entire time all Goku needed to do was let a Spirit Bomb hit him while he was Super Saiyan or higher, and he could've bodied every villain so far. Cool, good writing.

Also, how is that moving the goalpost? He knows how the Spirit Bomb works, that's why he threw it at Gohan during the Vegeta fight. Why not just power down before impact so it doesn't hurt? Or get out of the way? Or anything except eating an attack you KNOW will kill you?

krillin mentions this in the episode that you clearly didnt watch

Not him, but

That explains why he got hurt by the Spirit Bomb. It doesn't explain why it allows him to become fucking stronger than a god.
If it was a zenkai, it'd be permanent. But it isn't that. So it's a baseless powerup.

At least those were better than the other Bulma doing some pointless shit episodes

Nothing stopping people from making ultra instinct versions of goku and staying on older version of the game just like skyrim players do it with their shitty special edition updates that break skse.

Again, I said you can just say "hurr I don't like it" but that's your problem.
Then he wouldn't be able to fall into it and get this new goody he can now use. I told you to stop taking the damn show so serious but people like you just won't listen.
Want an explanation? The fight was intense enough that Goku wouldn't want to just fuck off out of the way of it like some kind of pussy and have the fight end there. Would you just let go in a tug of war when you're losing?

Read that "word salad" again and try to understand it this time. It's not that hard.
At this point I'm starting to think you're being obtuse on purpose. You can't be this autistic to not understand how this works.

IF IT WAS A ZENKAI, IT WOULD BE A PERMANENT POWERUP, BUT IT WASN'T THAT.

Yup, you're retarded. No one is talking about zenkai you dumb nigger. You think somehow zenkai is the only thing that lets saiyans grow stronger? Well, here you go.

so you're abandoning your argument that it makes sense until they explain it away with bullshit later, which was my point in the first place

What, you watch fucking Dragon Ball for the deep story? Give me a break.
And no, I'm not. You're just incapable of remembering shit. You say bullshit, but it's really just "I don't like how they explained this".
I'm going to stop here because there's nothing beyond this point except variations of "no u".

Stay mad at your Alzheimer's, I'd be upset too.

If the issue being argued about is that the explanation for the new form is bullshit that doesn't fit with the series, then using a fact from the explanation itself, that previously only existed in movie-only material, doesn't really nullify that argument. Plus, the idea that SSJ "taints" the heart directly contradicts Super itself, as everyone went SSJ to help Goku attain SSJG, which requires five "pure-hearted" Saiyans to do. If SSJ makes them not pure-hearted, they shouldn't have been able to power up Goku while in the form.

Meant to add that it's the same kind of bullshit retcon as potara fusion lasting only an hour. It was only done so that they could make something cool happen without having to put any effort into writing anything.

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Are there any Dragonball games that have come out recently that aren't fighting games?

Dragon Ball Fusions. ATB RPG with an interesting positioning mechanic. And you can fuse your OC with any character you want to make your fanfiction boner explode.

Dragon Ball lore vs Kingdom Hearts lore, who would win?