Nipponese Learning Thread: バカンティハンター Edition

Could you also say something like, "居間は壊すになった"?
Sounds like an interesting game, do you think it could be played on an emulator?

nah 壊す is more like something broken like an object (car, tv, console, phone, computer, etc.). also the grammar there is wrong the verb 壊す doesn't take になる

but yeah man the easiest way to play it is on psx since the saturn version doesnt work well on the emulators that are out there.

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I don't know why Custom Robo isn't scratching my itch. I love tiny customizable robots. I beat the first N64 game and the DS game and found both enjoyable, but couldn't get into the rest of the games.

I don't even care about the customization or the battling, I just like the dialog so far. And Marcia is pretty cute, too bad there's no good art of her.

I have a hiragana test tomorrow. Wish me luck. I think I have it down for the most part. Just have to remember long consonant/ vowel rules.

Hiragana is easy, you should be able to pass, provided that you actually studied. You did study, right, user?

Yes, over a long period of time actually. I just haven't practiced the small hiragana and long consonant/vowels a whole lot. Probably should practice tin tins as well, but those are pretty easy.

My google IME suddenly stopped working and no amount of reinstalling, restarting or fiddling can get it to work again. Anyone else had this issue?

We're probably all making progress without realizing it that's how my students are with English

You even make progress while you're sleeping.

Use Jack Halpern's SKIP technique. Google it.

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I wouldn't call people that come to an eikaiwai students. More like dupes.

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Generally, yeah, but there's quite a few who actually do real work learning on their own and just come to have real native speakers to practice against/ask questions to, and regardless, I try my best to help anyone who actually is trying to learn then there's also the guy who basically comes to talk Super Robots and the like with me, which is the fucking best.

Do you only speak English there?

From the thumbnail, I thought the first word was sex.

Sex has a long consonant in there: セックス

Mostly, but I use a fair bit of Japanese to explain things quicker or more clearly or simply to make them loosen up and laugh every so often

You could say 居間は壊された, but what you had there is completely ungrammatical.

Ah I was just being flippant, I worked at one my first year in Japan and switched jobs as soon as possible since it's the easiest way to get a visa. You're right there are all kinds of students: kids that are forced to be there, teenagers that just came from school->sports->juku and then to me, bored and overworked salarymen who get a stipend to learn english for a promotion, senile old people that need a hobby that gets them out, lonely and bored housewives with lots of money, returnees, and the serious students who actually want to learn - then you get the oddball. I had a 30 year office lady that only talked about Resident Evil, a 90 year old man that told me about his town being firebomed in world war ii, another guy who talked about financial news, a ex-salesman that got demoted to translations and hated his job he used to make fun of his boss and talk about drinking all weekend, and even a young girl that lived in the same town that I went to college in; it's really crazy the kinds of people you meet and what you can learn from them it's really the only thing that I miss about the job.

I used to get in trouble at that job for using Japanese, meanwhile my students loved it, especially after I quit and did my own private lessons, especially for early / intermediate students who had trouble understanding the meaning.

Nah you wouldn't because the living room is a space not an object.

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I think you're mistaken about that. Native speakers don't seem to make any such distinction. Take this quote about the gas chambers in Munich, for example.
Or this quote about an office being wrecked.
Hell, you can even 壊す abstract concepts. Try joogling "概念を壊す".

(Checked)
Look up Hymmnos. You should learn that next. The fuck is a /LDeNt/LØ/LLΘN?

Yeah but in the context of the picture you wouldn't use it.

That would be 身分証明書. The sentence structure goes something like ください　見せる　に　わたし　あなたの 身分証明書（を）. The pronunciation in kana for the the full sentence is in the file name but there's some slight variation I can't type out. The language is based off of Esperanto I guess but I don't know how much so.

Oh, I was wondering how that was done in the original language. That group of NPCs was one of the best gags in the game.

I've been trying to find some mangos in nip for the sake of practice, but have had little luck so far – only one site that had a mediocre collection.
Does anyone know a good place?
Or would I have to use my shekels to buy the real thing?

Thanks for the reminder, user.

Why not try Microsoft IME instead?

Have you checked the cornucopia or nyaa?

You could try for untranslated doujin manga on the panda. Madokami has raws as well but I suspect that's the "mediocre collection" you were referring to.

Which is fair, I fully understand the sentiment after working for NOVA for two years. Similar experiences myself, for that matter. We're technically not supposed to use Japanese, but like you said, the students love it, it makes them feel safer asking questions and even making conversation or jokes because they feel more safe that you'll "get it." Even for higher level students, it helps them really "get it" too - I was just doing a lesson on "It's for a " and while they understand it enough to use it when explained in English, I then say "＿＿にしては＿＿" and you can almost hear the light bulb go off in their heads. It's really amazing how much of a difference there is between understanding it and really getting it.

やってやるぜ！！

Panda doujins can get a bit repetitive after a while, which is why I was looking for something new.
I honestly didn't know about Madokami, so I'll check it out now.
Thanks.

I can't even find this one.

YOU CAN'T LEARN PROPER JAPANESE WITHOUT SPENDING AT LEAST HALF A DECADE OF HARD STUDYING YOU DUMB FUCKS

smart people learn faster you dumb fug

Yay for mark up messing up my attempt to create blanks.

All the more reason to get started now!

I don't mean porn. Look for non-H fanworks of a series you enjoy. Apparently Voile is still around if you're into Touhou as well, check around for other communities like that.

There is no royal road to any worthwhile language. But you won't get anywhere if you don't start.

Or if you do.

No shit. That's why everybody is here studying, you fucking idiot.

Oh yes, that's right, they have non-H doujins on panda as well.
I completely forgot about that.

I'm guessing they rewrote that dialog instead of trying to translate it.

Anything in particular you are looking for? I can check the private torrent sites.

How do you use 「どうしん」? Genki says that it means "why" but doesn't say how to use it and no other source says the same.

Fate/kaleid liner Prisma Illya
It has 3 series and I cannot find them anywhere for the life of me.
If you could find these somewhere, I would be really grateful.

HAHAH I worked for NOVA too man that shit fucking sucked, but at least they helped me get everything set up as far as the basics.
Maybe your not understanding. It's not wreck like completely destroyed, it's like when you were a kid and your mom came into your room and said "This room is a wreck" as in it's messy, not literally destroyed so NO you wouldn't use kowasu

All the research I've seen says that "immersion" limited to an hour or so a day in the classroom is the worst way to learn a language, specifically for beginners who aren't very young children. There is a lot more success starting with all instruction being in the naive language and slowly transitioning of several years into MOSTLY target language in the classroom.
The Japanese philosophy of complete immersion seems to me to be motivated by some kind of cultural idea about difficulty or purity rather than any evidence that it works better.

Understandably. I should probably look for another job, but my commute most days is a five minute walk, and I live right next to a major train station, a supermarket, and a 100 yen shop, and that alone makes up for a lot of other shit.

Also consider that eikaiwa are business before school, and take the same approach as MMORPGs do - by tricking people into thinking they're making progress and in the case of MMOs, having fun while doing everything to make sure they aren't so they have to keep buying into the system, they maximize the profit from each person.

Only found the raws of the first two. The third is still ongoing apparently.

Makes sense but it is my understanding that the same thing happens in Japanese highschools, no?

If you could give me a magnet link, that would be great.
Thanks for looking this up.

Torrent link won't work since you need to be a member to download, so I'm uploading to Mega.

part 1:
mega.nz/#!axxxzbgA!ILr0diRCNmz7i5ck7THxT6VefIuf-hMdeQejZ3uFd60

part 2:
mega.nz/#!64o3wKRS!VY4xmozB-c9X1mmFVhQfkENjRuU7l_1lsBlE3UWEQsg

yeah i lived in chiba city right next to the red light district so i had access to tokyo and there was plenty of shit to do in tokyo. there are a couple of better companies there if you want to take the time to look for them, even better is if you have a tesol or celta cert you can apply for private schools, they usually pay better and you have normal hours. I had a few friends that did they said it was a cake walk and you didn't have to be a soulless salesman.

What you mentioned below is something that I hated because there were plenty of students that I could help more in a different environment and then you're forced to sell the class or book that the manager decides is best regardless of your evaluation. So the student winds up wasting money and time on shit they don't need and won't help them. That's why that school that we both worked at did the thing with the new books being 50 lessons each so the student has the illusion that they are making progress because it's just a box to check off, wether they understood the point or not which the lessons are fucking garbage they throw in everything - listening, dialogue, conversation, and grammar into one lesson so that everyone feels like the accomplished something instead of having a full lesson focus on one thing.

You are too nice.
Thanks a lot.

np

Anyone else using Slime Forest?
I don't know if its that good or not but it makes the grind of recognizing kanji easier.

The cornucopia is in the guide in the op. Searching the Japanese title for a manga + "raw" will usually turn up a ddl website if scans are widely available online.

Poor Harry. ;_;

Haven't been in one so don't know for sure. My impression is that they don't have enough native speakers for full immersion though, and enough of them know the Japanese terms for English grammar words but not the English (i.e. 進行形 but not "progressive") that while it could just be it being harder to remember the foreign version, it could also be that they just learn it in Japanese.

Ah, in Nara myself, I would hate being near Tokyo just for the prices. Would be nice to have access to TGS I guess, but considering how god awful this year's is looking, I'm not really missing much I guess.

And yeah, the 50 lesson books are crap, they're just a bunch of nothing crap that we're supposed to "extend" which is bullshit because they want us to keep it uniform while at the same time make us come up with our own material for it. I end up finishing it in half the time and trying to get them to free talk or ask any random questions they might have, which is more useful both practically and if they want to do the stupid leveling up test, which the lessons don't prepare them for at all, especially now that because the white people higher up in the organization are all British, they're pushing that new British scoring system thing that makes no sense.

Does something bad happen if you force Mira to take your watch?

Yeah, I wasn't considering the context, but only the semantics of whether the word 壊す can be used with only objects or not. It can be used with anything, you can even 壊すthe universe itself.

Also, here's an example of 壊す being used in a figurative exaggerated manner with the sense of "messing up" rather total obliteration.

syo-ken.jp/publics/index/89/:

バンプ～

今は日本語を習っている
メアリーさんは中出しが好きですか?

もちろん。彼女はヤリマンだから。

ヤメロォォ
メアリーさんは純潔な女だぁぁぁ

現実を見ろよ。メアリーめは人間の風上にも置けない淫売なのだ。

You have to backtrack a long way to get it latter. Funny but not really worth it.

これはすぎる難しい。無理だよ！

すぎる goes after the i-adj (and replaces the い): 難しすぎる

成程そうですね

いや、メアリーは淫乱な肉便器。

Audience don't seem to find it as funny as I do.

何で男色なお前はそんなに気にしてるのか？

If the problem is 湯のみ, that's "yunomi," a teacup.

damn youre lucky. if you haven't been to yoshino during hanami season get your ass over there next year its the most beautiful thing i have ever seen in my life. actually i like that area better id rather be closer to osaka i didnt really like tokyo compared to osaka which is much more raw, laid back and crazy and the people are much cooler. anyway man i used to do the same shit and it seems like it has changed the brits are at the top so they push for all british stuff when they dont realize that it fucks students over as most of them are learning american english in school and clubs so when they come to class and the american teacher who has to teach british english tells them something completely different it really screws the student up so much that theyd probably quit. they need to make it clearer what exactly they are teaching, for example even though i have heard a lot of shit about shane english at least they are explicitly upfront about teaching the queens english - when you have native speakers from all background teaching a variety of english styles it gets confusing especially when you get up to the idomatic level - or even worse pronunciation.

i dont know how good your jp is but maybe youd enjoy this and maybe someone else might be. i love these guys got to see them while i was still in japan. i love konto but these guys are the one of the best.

Examples?

バンプ～

I wait for the day when one of you fags come down from the mountain top after extensively studying Japanese for years and tell us
YOU CAN LEARN JAPANESE

We've already been saying that. What do you think these threads are?

Ended up acing my hiragana test.

Anybody have any tips for remember vocabulary? I have some physical flash cards but having trouble remembering some of the stuff.

Download or make an Anki deck.

Will do. Will be more helpful because I have the app on my phone as well.

I threw away romanji now I am going to move up to katakana. Wish me luck lads.

Don't worry, eventually you will be glad to be rid of romaji. It just makes things more confusing.

Use mnemonics.

You know what the funny thing is? The hardest part for me isn't the Kanji, I'm actually fine with it. The hardest part for me is the grammar/word order. It's hard to learn when Japanese is all Yoda speak.

That's normal until you start reading.

How do you guys handle leeches? I have a separate deck I transfer leeches to with the Leech Dialog addon, eventually transferring them back when (if) they mature.

I just set them to tag only and treat them as any other card.

Don't you eventually get swarmed with them? All my never-leeched cards (about 1500) have 43 hours of study total while my (300-ish) leeched cards have 37.

I don't even know how to check that info. I learn them eventually though.

The way I did it is by creating another deck and moving all cards tagged with "Leech" to it, then comparing the stats. Just remember to check the "All Time" option.

I also set to tag only, but have never had any problems with only 25 leeches. Could be that I just never set my new card count high enough to where it was too difficult for me to take it all in. Also a good amount of my cards are self-made so I have an initial encounter with those words prior to Anki which may benefit memory.

I know. But the fucking word order, it gets confusing.

The word order doesn't even matter that much. Just remember that verbs go last and that particles attach to the end of the word they apply to.

I hope someone weighs in on this, because this looks good for me

I tried it, but didn't really like it. It seemed to be slower than just grinding them on Anki. If you have a lot of free time and just want a way to make the study more engaging it might work. I can't really say if it's good or not because I didn't play it for very long.

CAN'T

Hell yeah, two years straight.

Not fucking bad, user. What kind of ability do you have at this point?

Enough to easily play games, but probably not enough to translate or take N1 yet. Maybe next year.

heh

And now an example of how not to learn using Anki…

Maybe if you are autistic.

It actually is important for using kanji dictionaries, since they sort by stroke order.

Use Halpern's SKIP system, it's much easier to find kanji that way. But learn stroke order anyway, it's very useful for deciphering written kanji.

Here's an idea for the filthy gook: how about using the Latin alphabet? It's a perfect system that anyone can understand.

A through Z? It's pretty imprecise and a pain in the ass, to be honest, symbols don't tell you for sure how to pronounce them and certainly don't give you a clue as to what they mean. Even if it wasn't though, wouldn't change the fact that Japanese is a required skill for anyone who gives a shit about video games.

Each character has a corresponding unique numeric value, and they are ordered as such. Nothing imprecise about it.

Nor do the fucking moonrunes.

That's because they have to be recursively composed to have a mean. You have to work with a couple dozens of symbols, instead of 2000+. BNF grammar: letters form words, words form sentences, sentences form texts, all using recursion.

What, like A = 1, B = 2? You could do the same thing with the kana. Either way though, that's not what's being talked about at all.

They absolutely do. Once you know how to read a kana, you know how to pronounce it.

That's because Nipponese is easy as fuck to pronounce. And the same thing can be said about syllables using the Latin alphabet.

Nah, the writing system they have is fine.

hahaha the irony man

Using Latin characters to classify Kanji might be pretty inconvenient; there's only 26 letters to classify ~50.000 Kanji with. Classification by radicals is much easier since there are 214 of them and you can do it though a single lookup.

Syllables constructed with Latin alphabet aren't necessarily easy to pronounce, since some languages that use the alphabet aren't phonetic language, e.g. English, and some allow syllables to have ridiculous amount of consonants put into them, e.g. Czech (or any other Slavic language that I've forgotten).

You mean the arabic numerals. Latin alphabet was made by southern Europeans.

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You only just realized that?

I figured it, but this is only the second game I'm playing in japanese so it was kind of cool to see it

No I knew exactly was I meant. The Latin alphabet ultimately evolved from the ancient Greek alphabet used by the Etruscans, the ancient Greek alphabet was derived from the Phoenician alphabet which in turn was derived from Egyptian hieroglyphics.

What was the first?

Well kanji came from chinks, so if you're going to play that game then it isn't much better.

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What are you even talking about? I was just pointing out the irony of another anons post and then correcting a misunderstanding or ignorance of history on another anons part. I wasn't not saying what is good or bad, better or worse.

How are you guys gonna learn Japanese when your English reading comprehension is this poor?

The first one was Recettear, which in hindsight wasn't such a good choice, since it had very little casual conversation and a lot of retail-specific words.

I'm sure you're replying to this user.

What kind of games do you like and what is your JP level (beg, int, adv, etc), maybe I can make a recommendation

Not a bad choice though, since it was translated by goons so it's better to experience the original.

To be fair, there's no such thing as a good translation

I've become quite a bit more confident since then, I've got a pretty good grasp on my skill level and what I can play. Next I'm looking at blue reflection or atelier firis, but I'd say my level is nearing intermediate, just need to expand my vocabulary a bit more and get better at listening.

How do i build more vocab?
Phrase wise?
Like i can figure out kanji and shit but like, i have no idea what stuff means together

I find the easiest way to is to read/watch/play shit you want to, and just look shit up as you go. It'll be slow going at first as you look up pretty much every word, but it's effective since it'll be shit you care about and want to remember and will use multiple times.

THanks m8

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Even when you learn all of the core6k words, you will still run into a lot that aren't in there.

Languages have a lot of words, user.

What the fuck.

That´s almost nothing. Keep in mind, to be considered literate in any language you have to know at least 50.000 words. That´s why studying a language always takes years. You can read through a grammatic guide maybe in a week or so, but learning all the vocabulary is hard and long work.

Fucking WRRRRRY

why

I don't think I know that many even in my native language. Maybe I should just give up.

I'm rooting for you user

Don't forget that small shit like "in" and "of" count as words.

Hey guys. I have a japanese test coming up on thursday. Trying to study but memorizing vocab is a bitch. I also have trouble with where to place words, it's taking a lot of practice.

I was practicing learning kore, sore, and are.

for example if I want to say "whose bag is this?" I would say

これはだれのかばんですか

Taking a japanese class seems to accelerate learning somewhat but it's also a bitch.

I think simply 誰のかばんですか would suffice, but classes often want you to answer specifically how the teacher taught you to say something, and I don't know what the teacher taught in that regard.

we don't use kanji yet. Only hiragana. I think she just wants us to understand the distance thing. so if I'm talking to a friend and the bag was near him I would have to write

それはだれのかばんですか

and if the bag was far away from both of us it would be written

あれはだれのかばんですか

It kind of confused me at first because I was trying to write it with "kono, sono, ano" because I thought when we want to specify something we had to use those.

So i have anki set up so that on one side I have the hiragana of the word. Then I have to correctly answer which will then flip to side 2 of the card which has the english meaning.

Since I have to be able to not only memorize the vocabulary, but also write it in sentences, would it be beneficial to have it so that I have the english meaning of the word on side 1 and then I have to correctly recall how to say the word in japanese?

Hope that makes sense.

First, there are lots of the words that come in sets of こ そ ど (and some times あ). Learn as many as you can, and what they all mean, they're important and come up quite frequently.
Some of the most common are
これ
この
ここ
こんな
こんな風に(different than the above)
Second, it's important to remember (and you may already know this) that この vs その vs どの and so on doesn't just refer to physical space, it can be used for how closely you may be attached to something if you're not just talking about a tangible object.

You use この、その、あの、when the specified noun directly follows after. この is just an abbreviation of これの after all. Also it maybe helps you to think of これ as the english "this" and それ as "that" and あれ is probably aequivalent to "that over there", which already implies that the thing in question is far away from both of you.

Tfw I can realize when subtitles are outright wrong.

Definitely not. Remembering the definition of the kanji is what you should be training more for, because you'll hear or read in the pronunciation when reading something with Furinaya, or watching a show/cutscene with subtitles. Plus, Anki's definitions for a lot of words blow ass, and I wouldn't recommend getting those stuck in your head. For instance, 悪い can mean anywhere from, "Feeling not well (sick)," "being depressed," to "Being evil(ish)." A more effective way to translate many Japanese words is to identify a gut feeling with them rather than an English definition. This is REALLY apparent with the "words" like そう、ねえ、もう、or こう, all of which are very hard to "define" unless you use multiple sentences.

this 100x. Obviously you need a basic definition to know what kind of idea the word represents, but I spent far too long treating every time I saw もう as absolutely meaning "already", and same with most of the words that involve the kanji 生. A big part of getting good at reading is understanding context, and that can be hugely important for determining what a word means.

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Make sure you sleep, user.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_and_memory

This is false; the average native English speaker only knows about 20,000 to 45,000 words with the upper bound being well within the "well read" zone. If you look at non-native English speakers they only know 5,000 to 9,000 words. Being literate doesn't mean you can define every single word in a given language; it means you can read and write at or above the level that the majority of the literate people can.

バンプ～

Hey guys, so I have to take a picture of a friend to my japanese class tomorrow. I have to introduce them and describe them in japanese. So I would have to say their name, age, and occupation or major.

So how would I start it off?

Keep in mind I am only on lesson 2 of genki so it shouldn't be too complex.

I'd start it like
これは維子(example name)です
維子は俺の友達です
維子は23歳
and so on and so forth, but I don't know how your teacher wants you to structure your sentences, if they're supposed to be linked together or whatnot.

Get a friend

I'm not sure what the kanji is.

So I'm guessing it would go

to introduce him "kore wa logan-san desu."

To describe occupation as a college student "Logan-san wa daigaku no gakusee desu"

To describe his nationality "amerikajin desu"

To describe his year in college "ichinensee desu."

To describe his major "senkoo wa konpyuutah desu"

To describe his age 23 "nijuusansai desu"

Does that sound about right?

>これは私の友達, のお名前は

これはわたしのともだち、　ローガンさんです。
ローガンさんはだいがくせいです。
アメリカじんです。　だいがくいちねんせいです。
せんこうはコンピューターです。　にじゅうさんさいです。

I think that sounds right, and other than the name 維子, you should probably look all of those up because 俺, 友達, and 歳 are some of the most common words you'll see.
has it right about how you don't have to state the topic over and over again once it's been established, but your teacher may want you to do it anyway (same deal with this post about the kanji, get used to looking them up, because you're going to be doing a lot of that, but again this user uses only very common words)

This is a bit unrelated, but is the romaji provided with genki completely retarded and different from the accepted norm?

さすがはヤリマンだね

Yeah. It's also retarded that they use romaji at all in a textbook.

Yeah the romaji is pretty fucked. I know all the hiragana so I try to follow that. We haven't started on kanji and are just working on katakana for now.

It's hard to practice ahead of the cirriculum because studying takes up a lot of time, and we are only supposed to practice the lessons in the genki book. I suppose you could study ahead anyway, but the looming test makes it so that it is more beneficial to focus on the upcoming lesson test.

In other words, taking a japanese class sucks because you want to study ahead of the class but that might screw you over because of time constraints.

Ironically, I don't think a class is good for someone who actually wants to learn. You will just be dragged down by the lowest common denominator.

Yeah, sounds about right. Well at least it is good for getting me started, from here on I will just teach myself.

を marks the direct object; the subject of the verb, but you have no verb here nor is there an implied verb and it's marking the wrong word. The subject of the verb, "study" is 経済 so the を should follow that. The word choice itself for study would be better as 勉強する or 学ぶ. One last thing, the は after 大学 probably isn't really necessary unless you specifically want to stress 大学 as opposed to something else.
（彼女は）大学で経済を勉強しています

Oh.

I have a solution for that. I'm the lowest common denominator, so I have no problems with that!

I've started to attempt reading raw manga, I decided on スラムダンク. So far it has been painful, taking nearly an hour to comprehend two pages. I know it's going to be slow an painful, but what I'm wondering is if I'm going about it alright?

I basically read along, if something comes up I don't know I look it up, continue, repeat, until I reach the end of the sentence. Then I try to combine it all together to get a general idea (not 100% perfect) and continue.

Should I be spending even more time trying to get a perfect understanding, or continue as is, and as I keep going more and more will click?

I'd argue the opposite, that starting by yourself is easy, but as it gets more complicated a structured environment will help. But the important bit isn't how you start, as long as you DO start.

As long as you know the intent of the sentence you're good, because when translating Japanese that's all you can really get. Only the simplest sentences have a direction 1:1 translation. As you read and get more context you'll understand better what you read before.

Read the translated version too after to check if you were right. But remember that the translation can be wrong.

Understood ありがとうございます

Bump

Thanks for the correction.

Could someone please help me out? I want to know what the っと at the end of this sentence means:
ポケモンたくさん捕まえよーっと！
I tried looking it up, and I got people saying it means something was omitted. I'm not sure what that would be, though.

Hard to say without context. It's probably a quote, but with just that you can't tell if it's a quote of something said or thought.

Thanks, I guess it doesn't matter a whole lot if I understand what he's saying. I'm guessing he thought it, because it would be weird to tell someone you said it.

Stop scaring the beginners, user. You only need to know 10.000 words at maximum to pass JLPT N1, and by the time that happens, you'll be fluent enough to be indistinguishable from native speaker. You can even read most manga and watch anime with just N2-N3 competency, which require 4000-6000 words.

It could mean something like 'oomph', but I don't think there's anything meaningful behind it.

dictionary.goo.ne.jp/jn/137404/meaning/m0u/
Maybe it's short for the だっと onomatopoeia？

10k isn't a lot. JLPT isn't close to native and you're not going to learn only the exact words you need.

バンプ～

FUCK THIS LANGUAGE

I know this feel. I feel like a dumb ass if I can't completely understand a panel in some simple shit like NEW GAME. We're all experimenting here and that's what makes it fun.
I've recently made a habit of cropping almost every single panel as I read and retyping it all in kana for the filename since there's an anki add-on Media Import that sets the filename as the answer. Snipping tool makes this a breeze if your a windowsfag like me.

Latin based languages

Insectoid languages

Why do piss skins such so much at linguistics?

Simple patterns and grammar rules are you fucking retarded?

Japanese grammar is way more logical than English.

Just report and ignore Goons, don't feed them.

Even if this wasn't a fuck-up on their end, browbeating people into paying real money to "redeem" themselves because they feel bad about failing is kinda shitty. The numbers are meaningless. Either you improved yourself or you didn't.
They are seriously trying my patience. I've been using Duolingo for nearly two months now, and while I have learned words from it, I probably wouldn't say it's worth very much in the long run.

The learning structure is terrible. There's no learning phase, only quizzes. The questions in a quiz are randomized, so it will often give you written-answer questions about things you couldn't possibly know about yet, forcing you to fail them. There's no explanation whatsoever about grammar, and it expects you to intuit all grammar rules by the questions it gives you. Obviously, this only works part of the time, and is made doubly bad by the aforementioned question randomization.

If you don't understand what it is that they're trying to convey, or why you're getting a question wrong, you'll always wind up accidentally memorizing the correct order for that specific question before figuring out why it's correct, or what the grammar rule you're meant to understand is, making it a useless endeavor. I'm aware that there are comments on each question which often shed light on it, but the idea that one should have to "check the forums for the fix" for questions in a language learning app is ridiculous. Either it teaches you or it doesn't. Duolingo doesn't. You could say that this is how children learn language, and that's true to a degree, but adults are always there to correct children when they speak incorrectly. And aside from that, babies don't have jobs. They spend nearly all of their time trying to figure out how to interact with adults through sheer trial and error, which isn't something adults have the time to do.

It'd be incorrect to say that there's nothing of value here, but I think the time would be much better spent just reading Tae Kim and grinding vocab or something. At least then you know exactly why things are done the way that they are, and you're not wasting time on unanswerable questions. Also, there's a bug where if you rotate your phone on one of the questions where you're meant to select a set of tiles to create a sentence, it will automatically fill it with the correct sentence.

Not him, but I do really hate the grammar. I haven't practiced translating full sentences too much yet, but it feels like you have to sit there and memorize the words that were said, and nothing makes sense until that final verb gets dropped.

Just use Anki instead of an online app.

That's how it is for every language, of course when you're reading a full paragraph made of 8 sentences there will be context and you can make sense of things before that final verb, but the grammar is pretty simple once you get a decent amount of practice understanding it.

Already more flawed than Latin itself. After Rome and Greece, it was all downhill from there, culturally and linguistically. Then again, if it wasn't for the ancient world, I bet that we would be speaking barbarian baby speak right now. Or fucking hebrew, because the west has been basically Jewish since the fall of Rome.

Kanji is the only thing that really fucks Japanese up, though. The kana do make sense (and once again demonstrate that the Japanese are superior to the Chinese). Symbols that represent certain sounds. It's practical and easy to learn.

The kanji have absolutely nothing to do with sounds, though. They represent a concept, and can be pronounced in any way. It's insanely inefficient (takes until adulthood to learn, even after most kanji were entirely discarded from the language), though it does seem to speed up reading, for natives. You can't read shit just knowing kanji, and you can't read shit just knowing the words. In western languages, if you know the alphabet, you just have to learn the words, and it's easy to look them up because you can already write them.

Having no spaces is also nonsensical. Other than memorization, you can't really know where one word ends and the other one begins. It does save space, but everything looks cluttered.

Apparently, in the past, the Chinese invented printers way before the west had them, but couldn't use them because their language made the technology impossible to use.

Really, this system is mostly useful for isolationist purposes. It does protect them from cancerous foreign influences. Other than that, it really does make no sense. Well, other than kana and grammar. I think that does make sense.

That's what kanji is for.

It also makes it much easier to figure out the meaning of a word you've never seen. For example, the word for "esophagus" is 食道.

Kanji.

It's part of why I dread translation technologies actually taking off, to be honest.

That's almost 100% bullshit and will confuse people if you say it. It doesn't work very well because a fuckton of words are composed of both kanji and hiragana. Normally doesn't make any practical sense either, because it's just a ridiculously complex kanji replacing a simple hiragana, making things harder for no reason and not even making the word shorter or easier to write/identify.

A lot of the time it's too vague to make a difference. And a lot of combinations make absolutely no sense.

I am not fully convinced that this is even possible. Unless they create sentient AIs that can understand context.

Globalization is the biggest threat to Japan. Their government will completely screw them over for money (or the possibility of making more money if they adopt more Americanisms). In fact, the birth rate thing is just another scam. Japan is overpopulated (127 million people in a tiny country is more overpopulated even than Europe), but the government doesn't give a shit because more people=more money for them, or so they think. Their government will gladly go against nature and culture because of greed, just like all other governments, and Japanese people seem to currently be more complacent than ever, not that they have ever had many anti-establishment tendencies to begin with. It will probably lead to mass immigration if things don't change, and then Japan is fucked unless it solves everything with good old violence (and they are more likely to do so than the west, for sure, because Asians are not nearly as pussified as people think, since they don't feel guilty about crushing their enemies, like the Christianized faggots in the west).

So, Japan is already as screwed over a Europe (Except, they have yet to experience the degradation in life/culture/rights/etc).
>It will probably lead to mass immigration if things don't change, and then Japan is fucked unless it solves everything with good old violence (and they are more likely to do so than the west, for sure, because Asians are not nearly as pussified as people think, since they don't feel guilty about crushing their enemies, like the Christianized faggots in the west).

Most words only begin with kanji, and don't end with them, so it does help. And while there are kanji that replace single kana, there are also quite a few that replace 2-4 as well.

Granted, but it's still better than English most of the time in my experience.

I hope you're right.

This.

So fucking this. Abe and his cronies are so blatantly corrupt it's not even funny.

So fucking this. It's a scam to justify upping the retirement age and the consumption tax.

Sadly. Most of the ones who pay attention and give a shit as well are too old to really do much unfortunately, and everyone young is too busy trying to get through the day as is.

I have nightmares about this.

Not surprised in the least.

And look at where they are now. Practically Jewish. Might as well gas them as well, with their Argentinian communist pope. The crusades were a fantastic event. It's a shame that neither side disappeared. Both should have been driven each other to extinction. Islam and Cuckstianity. They are both just more extreme forms of Judaism.

I guess that's to be expected when you run Jewish software on white hardware for 1600 years. Worship the dead Jew and you will eventually become the Jew yourself. The dead Jew if I get my wish. Crucify them all for treason is what I say. I don't care how long ago it happened. If that doesn't happen, then they will convert to Islam and in 100 years will be talking about just how white Islam actually is, and how it invented civilization. Cucks never change.

Anyway, Japanese culture has been deteriorating. Not that quickly, but it is happening. They have also become more accepting of foreign bullshit, more likely to change their ways in order to please the globalists, and adopted cancerous American consumerism, as well as American economics (if you haven't studied economics, just look at their insane dept-to-GDP).

They need a reduction in population, increasing its quality, and more confidence and celebration of their own culture. Also, a return to Shinto. They have no idea how lucky they are for still having the traditional religion of their race completely intact, unlike the low IQ, uncultured white Jewish scum (that really deserves to be exterminated if you ask me, whether they are actually religious or not, for being loyal to ideas that came from people that consciously destroyed their heritage and forced their ancestors to adopt this filth).

They also need to cut ties with America entirely, and make a stronger military (for defensive purposes). The men should be encouraged to practice traditional Japanese martial arts, because that celebrates their culture and makes them stronger and fitter. Traditional art should also be encouraged. Of course, they also have to heal themselves from the (mostly mental) damage that WW2 caused (minor compared to fucking Germany, of course, which is basically already dead, because of its population of traitors, that also happen to be partially Russian in great numbers, because of the rapes). I guess redpilling them on Pearl Harbor could be useful. Not sure whether they know about it or not, but it's not even that far from mainstream. America provoked the attack in the first place (breaking all of their trade agreements only with the Axis, while still claiming to be neutral), and then allowed it to happen, minimizing the damage, but letting people die so that their retarded population would agree to go to war. Japan should hate America at least a little bit. Not obsess over it, because that's dumb and a sign of weakness, but they should still know who not to trust.

In essence, Japan is superior to the west, and has a lot more potential. They have an ancient culture that hasn't been corrupted for very long (unlike western culture, which has been destroyed by Constantine's lineage, and had all of its attempted renaissances ruined by the white kike masses, and also became worse and worse in modernity), racial purity and a cultural tendency towards isolationism and self-preservation. They are also resistant to guilt, as real whites were, unlike the modern white kikes and niggers.

English is nonsensical, but easy as shit to learn, so it doesn't matter. I never studied English in my life (other than using a dictionary and then translating things on AltaVista when that was a thing). It honestly takes more effort to not learn English than to actually learn it. Only retarded people have difficulty learning this language nowadays, especially considering that they should be exposed to it, since almost everything ever made is available and easily found in English.

At the same time, it could be entertaining, because I legitimately believe that the Japanese, when cornered, would be pretty damn willing to send the shitskins to the camps and turn all those Jewish fantasies into reality right then and there. Regardless, I want them to survive, because they are in many ways more similar to our ancient Greco-Roman roots than modern whites are, because they were a race of cultured warriors just a century or two ago.

They need a lower population, though. Everyone does. Modern life destroys the mind and the body, and overpopulation is one of the things that make this possible in the first place. In fact, the current population of Japan is around two thirds of the total population of the planet a few centuries BCE, and even back then philosophers were already talking about overpopulation being an issue (and it caused massive unemployment very frequently in history). The modern version is an issue of truly insane proportions. Hopefully it won't need to be solved by plagues or a solar storm (billions are guaranteed to die very quickly from that).

I wouldn't say kanji alone isn't quite enough to substitute for spacing, but together with knowledge of conjugation, particles and such it's simple even without it.

Anyone got any recommendations for stuff that's not in standard or kansai dialects?

I'm not sure if you're aware, but according to the Gook who occasionally blogposts in the GamerGate threads, Japan is as nationalistic as it ever was, in addition to retaining their superiority complex. He even states the only thing keeping Japan from going the Japanese equivalent if "Deus Vult" is politics involved, the presence of the U.S. military in the region, and the regulations preventing the country from having an army (Which Trump said they plan on lifting, hopefully, soon).

From what I've seen of Gookanon's posts about South Korea, being a puppet state for Japan would be a massive improvement to their current situation.

That country's morality and legal system is straight fucked.

HAH. I fucking wish.

There's nothing really for us to go to war against except the fat fuck with the nukes to the northwest and personally I'm hoping he bombs South Korea into the stone age and then gets counterraped by literally everyone else because no one in the region benefits from an actively destructive North Korea. That said, politics IS a big part, because Abe is a globalist cuck who desperately labored to get TPP passed.

Also the most westernized country in Asia. No wonder they turned into Asian Sweden (without the immigration).

He won't. His goal is unification. Worst Korea is probably the last place that he would nuke. He wants to conquer it, and I hope he does, because that would be funny.

Anyway, the world is so fucked up that no matter where he drops the nuke (except maybe Japan), it will make things better for everyone. Considering how competent the DPRK is, they might even end up accidentally nuking themselves. That would be fantastic. I just want whatever happens to be funny.

Maybe someone could convince them that America is somewhere else. Like Mexico or Canada, and get him to nuke a bunch of honorary niggers. Or maybe someone could inform him that America's real capital is actually Israel, and get him to nuke them. It wouldn't even be a lie, would it? Though America itself is still more Jewish than Israel will ever be, so maybe it wouldn't do much.

France would be nice, because fuck France. I want to see that white flag one last time, because it is, after all, the whitest thing in that country. Just get all the art out of there first. It shouldn't be there anyway. It should be in Europe instead.

Latin based languages are the worst. You have to learn 100 different forms for each verb, and there's a fuck ton of irregular verbs. It's a total nightmare. Also, Latin itself has a nasty declension system where you have to learn a billion different forms for every noun, and there are all kinds of irregular forms, and it can be hard to tell which declension a noun belongs to. They also made it even worse by mixing up Greek and Latin case ending in irregular ways for certain nouns.

In certain cases, there are even words that are made less clear by being written in kanji, as the written forms for several different words are identical when written in kanji, but different in kana.

最中　For example, this could represent either
さいちゅう　"in the middle of" or もなか "bean jam filled wafer cake".
上手 じょうず　= "skilled", 上手 = かみて = "upper part"
中間 = ちゅうかん "midway" ちゅうげん = "Samurai's attendant"
行方= ゆくえ "whereabouts" 行方= いきかた= "way of going"
目下= めした "subordinate" もっか　= "at the present / now"
人事 = じんじ "human resources" ひとごと = "someone else's problem"
生物 = せいぶつ "living thing" なまもの = "perishable"
お札 = おふだ "talisman" おさつ = "bill"
There's probably easily more than 100 words like these if you went through everything.

So you called the whole of Japan retarded, because Japanese notoriously suck at English.

On the other hand, the advantages of kanji are excellent when it is used in a non-retarded manner.
木化 = I was immediately able to understand what this Japanese word meant because I know kanji, but the English equivalent "lignification" meaning "conversion into wood" might as well have been fucking Greek to me. Advantage goes to kanji. Consider, that the more advanced the level of vocabulary becomes, the bigger the advantage of using kanji over a system like English grows.

Well, there exist two problems with nuking Isreal. First, that defeats the entire purpose of the country. For years prior to WWII, Pro-Zionist Jews were trying to find a way to make Anti-Zionists Jews want to go back to their "Holy Land" (More for philosophical reasons than the standard Jewery), but the Anti-Zionists had grown too accustomed to their "European life" and they didn't want to leave. So, when Hitler began his Anti-Semitic campaign, a number of Zionist Jews saw that as the perfect chance to change the minds of the rest of the Jewish population. They made a deal with the German government that the Jews would willfully leave the country for Palestine, and Hitler agreed to support the program because he saw it as a "containment" initiative, especially for the more troubling Jews. Naturally, the Anti-Zionists didn't want to leave, but when given the option of either sailing for Palestine or going to a camp, they mostly chose Palestine. And, the program was a huge success, so much so that the Middle Eastern leaders demanded that Hitler stop the deportation program. However, when he refused, they began slaughtering the Jews currently in the Middle East, which lead Hitler to rethink where to send the Jews next to contain them (Which was probably what they discussed during the "infamous" 1942 conference on the solution to the "Jewish problem", however, we may never know). After the war, and the Holohoax began being spread, (I don't how truthful this next part is because I got it from a pozzed source) the Pro-Zionists again pushed for the establishment of their own state, except demanding that the British government follow through on their decades-old "promise" of the Jews owning the territory that was Palestine (Because they apparently paid for the land in full a couple times). So, to get the first problem out of the way, the idea of having Isreal established is to serve as originally as a containment nation for Jewish people. Would you rather have most of the Jews contained and/tied tied to a single nation, or have them without a nation and just bumming around wherever they may go?

The second problem that exists is that, according to the Christian Bible, the apocalypse is suppose to be right around the corner when a world war centered around Isreal begins to take place (I'm fuzzy on the more exact details of it). For that matter, you're going to have the world's Christian population (30% of the world population) divided between shoving the end of the world "off for another day", or pushing for and encouraging a war so that they can reach paradise sooner. So, add religious outcry and division to the mix (As if that doesn't exist already).
Looks like we're having fun with politics.

I would say that what it comes down to is that by and large most Japanese don't actually need English once they get out of school. The ones who do, whether because they have to go abroad or because they're doctors and they want to keep up with the latest research and articles from the West, are generally pretty good, and just lack confidence which in turn affects their performance, especially considering how vastly different the languages are. The thing is, on average it's not great because most people really don't give a shit because English is by and large fucking worthless in everyday life beyond a few loanwords and some trendy shit.

I have wet dreams about this happening, and the explosion being so powerful it causes South Korea to sink into the ocean.

I'd say Saudi Arabia before Israel, but yeah, the Middle East basically controls America.

It's always these fucks, isn't it?

To be fair, Abrahamist texts are expressly written specifically to be as vague as possible for exploitation in whatever situation they're needed for.

Good luck knowing what the actual word is, though. Still wouldn't know what it means if you heard it instead, probably. You can still guess what words mean in western languages if they originate from other words, so that kind of thing is always there.

Kanji doesn't necessarily increase your vocabulary. That's the biggest issue. It would definitely function a lot better if each kanji only had one reading and it didn't ever change no matter what. Even then, except for the really simple kanji, they are just a pain in the ass to write compared to hiragana. Not even the Japanese can do it, so they just avoid it.

Western languages are easier to deal with. Just learn the alphabet (that everyone already knows, including the Japanese) and vocabulary and you can easily figure out the grammar just by reading. You do, however, have to worry more about pronunciation. Japanese is one of the easiest languages as far as that goes. English is terrible as far as that goes, even though it's a very easy language. Chinese is supposed to be one of the most difficult languages to pronounce, and they have all of the bullshit that the Japanese have and maybe more, so you can imagine just how bad that must be.

Western vocabulary is easier to learn and to use because you can read and write even words that you don't know. The alphabet just makes our languages easier to use overall. The Japanese don't use it for typing (and then convert to hiragana/kanji/katakana) for no reason. It's simply a more efficient system. Vocabulary doesn't come with unique symbol combinations to be memorized, so you can just read a word, find out what it means and never forget it. In Japanese, if you don't know the kanji, you can't read it.

Their language probably holds them back in one way or another, because it takes so much time and effort to learn. They could be focusing on other things instead. HOWEVER, I do think that their ridiculously complicated language enhances their average intelligence as well, so it doesn't hurt them.

Did he ever give up on the Madagascar Plan? I assume that he didn't, but wasting resources on that wasn't exactly viable until after the war.

I have one major problem with not nuking Israel, and that would be the lack of fun involved in the process of not getting a fat Korean man to blow them up. I know that America is the real Jewish Empire, and the successor or the USSR. Israel may end up disappearing just because of its demographics. Also, since American Jews don't seem like they are going back to Israel (and Americans aren't going to deport them), it would be nice to at least get rid of a good portion of the Jewish population. Of course, it would be nicer to put them all there and then get the fat communist to nuke them. I just really like the idea of watching a communist nuke all the Jews. Poetic justice at its finest.

I don't care about how Christians will respond. I think that they deserve to be destroyed as well, so they can do their thing and make everything even worse for themselves. Hell, they might even hurt their own religion, in that case, which is fine with me, and may also be entertaining. I dislike them even more than I dislike the Jews, by far, so it's fine. They are Jew enablers and have had a more direct and active role in destroying the west. The nukes are too good for them. Inventing Christianity is the worst thing that the Jews have ever done. It's more Jewish than Judaism. So Jewish that even most Jews thought that it was too much at the time. Of course, their religion was still all about making all the gods that stand for anything good their enemies while worshiping the most evil of all of them, and it created Christianity and Islam, so it shouldn't be allowed to exist, but at least it was ethnic and didn't convert people of other races, at least in its purest form, if evil can be pure.

Yes. Japan still has isolationist tendencies as far as their culture goes, so they might be the country that needs English the least on this entire planet. Good on them.

My reasoning for not nuking them would be that it wouldn't do much. There are too many sandniggers in too many countries. And then we would have to deal with "refugees" that aren't even from there, because western politicians (and most of the people) are all traitors that deserve to be hanged with their own intestines and then set on fire. Sandniggers occupy a really huge area, so they should be attacked mostly with conventional weaponry. I think using that many nukes in one go isn't a good idea.

Japan IS nationalistic, but in a weird way that's abnormal to Americans. Japanese don't talk about how Japanese are better, they intrinsically KNOW it. If you talk about how great your country is, they'll smile and say, "Well that's cool!" while thinking, "That doesn't make any god damn sense." So to say they're nationalistic is accurate, but it doesn't really tell the story.

He should have shipped them to Madagascar like they planned in the beginning.

I mean more that specifically the Saudi royalty is in tight with the American government, being "close personal friends" to the Bush family, and having very obvious money ties to the Clintons.

That's politicians in a nutshell really - look up shit on Abe or Masuzoe for instance.

what the fuck

As an English speaker and Japanese learner, I would never have guessed in a 1000 years what "lignification" meant, but the meaning of 木化 was immediately intuitive. There is literally no way of even guessing what "lignification" means unless you happen to already know Latin to be aware that "lignum" = wood and thus the word "lignify" means "to change into wood" similarly to the word "petrify" meaning to "change into stone". And none of the modern Latin languages even have a cognate with it, except for Italian, which has "legno" for "wood". Truly mastering the vocabulary of English practically requires knowing 2 other ancient dead languages, and then some. Mastering Japanese requires only the knowledge of roughly 2000 characters. It's clear which is the easier task.

Knowing kanji does immediately increase your intuitive grasp of even unknown Japanese vocabulary. It's like the equivalent of having a full education in classical Latin and Greek for understanding the roots of English words, in terms of the weighted boost it gives to one's understanding of vocabulary in Japanese. Learning 2000 kanji is nothing at all, when the total lexicon of the language has hundreds of thousands of words. If learning those 2000 characters helps you to intuitively grasp all those words, then the benefits clearly outweigh the drawbacks.

Not sure what you're getting at by bringing up Chinese. It has none of the bullshit that Japanese has. The only thing it has in common is being written with Chinese characters, but for the most part, mostly everything is read regularly with one reading per character instead of a dozen with a bunch of irregular readings like in Japanese, and the syntax is like an even more simplified version of English. "Wo ai ni" means "I love you"and translates word for word literally into the exact equivalent in English, while the Japanese equivalent is something like, 私は貴方の事を愛している, but often reduced to simply 愛してる.

I think I can live not knowing what lignification means, though. The concept can easily be expressed without the word anyway. Not worth memorizing 2000 kanji just so I can know what it means, not even knowing the reading. If it's really necessary, then I will learn it eventually. It will be in a book and then I will know it.

And about Chinese, I was specifically talking about the characters and the pronunciation. As far as I know, Chinese is really damn difficult to pronounce (unlike Japanese). If you screw up the tones even a little bit, you may end up saying something else entirely. Japanese doesn't have much of that. And they still have the characters, possibly more of them (not sure about how many they abandoned in modernity), which is bullshit. They also don't even have hiragana (which is more practical than kanji and arguably better than an alphabet). Chinese is definitely worse than Japanese.

Your posts just sound like you're making excuses to justifying not learning Japanese.

This video is like weirdly viral in Japan. I teach at elementary schools and almost all the kids know it. Like I swear I remember first seeing it before they were born.

Mostly just talking about how learning Japanese is fucking bullshit, and you can't do it. I still try. Just not very hard anymore, because it will take a decade for me to be able to read either way, and it's not like I don't have other things to learn.

either you're retarded enough to fall for the meme that it's exceedingly difficult to learn japanese or you're so retarded it will actually take you a decade to read anything

Git gud

Originally thought that it was difficult, then after a while I thought it wasn't so bad and it kinda makes sense, and then I realized that it is worse than I imagined. Their language is mostly nonsensical. The parts that make sense actually make more sense than western languages, but for the most part it's a huge mess.

I haven't studied shit in two weeks or maybe a little more, so it probably will take a decade. Not useful enough for me to try that hard, considering that it will be completely useless until it's mastered (which is annoying for a guy like me, that learns by doing). After a while, it just felt kinda dumb to spend all of my free time learning this language just so that I can play video games and read, when I could be actually playing video games and reading instead. I have been playing mostly arcade games with barely any text anyway.

Haven't been in the mood for this stuff. Working on electronics and exercising more than usual instead.

Fight me, nurd.

You only need like an hour a day at most.

Once you pass a certain point you learn by playing video games and reading.

The language isn't nonsensical at all, it's just so completely removed from English that it can be very hard to wrap your head around first. A big part of starting off learning is attitude, and it's clear that yours is shit

I studied 3 or 4 hours a day when I was still really into it. Then it went down to one hour, and then to zero (because I am not fully convinced that it's worth learning anymore). Reviewing things also takes longer and longer. I tend to remember most words permanently in an instant, but a third of them take a lot more effort. Kanji kinda killed my motivation, though, because the entirety of my vocabulary is completely useless without it. The more complicated ones take forever to write even once, I can barely read them on my screen even on lower resolutions, and changing the font even slightly is already enough for it to look like something else entirely.

This is not my first time learning another language. Japanese is more like trying to learn two or three languages at the same time, because the kanji are essentially disconnected from everything else in the language. The readings can be absolutely anything. I think that describes the issue.

The fact that looking them up is so inconvenient doesn't help either.

Well there's your problem. Anyone would burn out from studying that much.

I reccomend Tengugo Kana and Tengugo Kanji as well, you can get them on google play and the app store.
I managed to learn kana in a night from it.
They also have other apps for other languages.

No it won't. I'm nowhere near mastering it, and I fucking live in the goddamn country and do most everything in it.

I've been trying to conquer Core2k/6k twice within last 5 years and both times failed miserably when it came to two kanji words with no kana such as 制度 and 配達. They all look the same, there is no kana to give a hint and kanji don't necessary have the same meaning as the word. I stopped memorizing them and started cramming them instead, then forget them on next day, so the amount of words I have to memorize increased every day until it took 5 hours to finish reps and I gave up.
How do I break through this wall?

The words that actually give you trouble, write out on some notecards and stick them on your monitor. That's all I can think of.

That ain't gonna work. At some point I had like 500 "red" words.

It looks like you're trying to learn more than you can handle. Set new cards number to a lower value (it's in the deck options). Heck, even set it to zero until the number of relearns decrease to a manageable amount.

Yeah I've been doing this too. Setting new card to 0 then trying to memorize all the shit I already have. But they just won't stick into my head. Like at all. the weeks passed and amount of red cards didn't moved an inch because I didn't actually learn them but just cram and forget the next day.

Even now after not touching anki for a whole year I can remember early kanji and words with kana but those late kanjis I was forgetting within a hour after being done with reps.

You are doing too many per day. Don't do more than an hour of Anki a day. Restart the deck if you have to, and set the new cards much lower this time.

And this is not entirely true anyway.

I was just playing a game and came across the word 盗掘, which I am pretty sure I have never seen before, yet I knew the reading was とうくつ. It's because I've seen other words with those kanji in them, like 盗難 and 採掘.

But it could have been something else, couldn't it?

Only if it were a word that completely ignores the kanji readings, which there are few of in the language.

I have similar problems remembering some words. I'm pretty sure it's just because I haven't seen them in the native material I enjoy. Stuff I see even occasionally in music/reading or whatever sticks with me much better since I have some actual connection to those words. Shit that just pops up when studying but I don't actually see used is harder to remember. So maybe you shouldn't get so stuck on trying to remember shit from the deck, and just try to enjoy things outside of studying more. Anki isn't all there is to understanding the language after all.

You mean actual "study time", or time interacting with the language at all? Because only 1 hour a day is nothing.

I mean study time. Obviously when you start reading you're going to be spending more time than that.

Finished case 3 of Dai Gyakuten Saiban 2. It's pretty great so far, I highly recommend the series to any learners who want a good story and waifus to practice with.

Japanese has the same thing with tones, it's just there are only 2 tones, high and low, which is referred to as a pitch accent instead of tonal, but it's still basically the same system. Every syllable in Japanese has either a high or low tone, and the tonal pattern of the word is used to distinguish between homophones in the spoken language. Does はし mean 箸 chopsticks, 端 edge, or 橋 bridge? In the spoken language, the distinction is made strictly through tones.

Not only can you confuse the meaning of Japanese words by screwing up the tones, there's also the distinction between double consonants and long versus short vowels, that Chinese doesn't have, but Japanese does, so even though Chinese has 4 tones instead of 2, it's not necessarily any more complicated since Chinese doesn't have those features. Video related showing pitch accent "aka tonal system with 2 tones" in Japanese and it's use to distinguish homophones. Bottom line, the distinction between words that are seemingly homophones is crystal clear to the Japanese because of intonation, something that Westerners fail hardcore at picking up on (with the possible exception of the Swedish, who have a pitch accent language?).

But yes, Chinese actually uses more than twice as many characters as Japanese. Also, to be clear here, I'm talking about Mandarin. Cantonese and other Chinese languages have even more tones.

Can't say I've ever heard a difference. Context is enough of a clue anyway.

Basically, like how we have lead (The element) and lead (Past tense for the word lead) where both sound and are spelled the same, but it's the context the establishes it.

But how do I read stuff without knowing most of the kanji? When I learned English I did exactly this - just played vidya and tried to talk with people and even if I don't know the meaning of the word I can at least read it and guess the meaning from context. But it absolutely doesn't work with japanese because I can't read the word unless I know the kanji.

You could do the same thing in Japanese. Try to infer the meaning of a Kanji based on context and the knowledge you have. You won't be able to know the pronunciation this way, but that wouldn't be important at the time when you are reading it anyway, you can look that up later to not break the flow of your reading time. Finding some things at a lower reading level you can enjoy helps too.

Learn some kanji and vocab before you jump into reading.

And there we back to original problem

Start with Remembering the Kanji to help differentiate them.

This is not helpful at all.

the past tense of lead is led, but you have the right idea

Just to chime in a bit. In English, even if you do not know a word, at least it's clear where the word starts and ends, and you can read the word, and type it into a dictionary if you really can't figure out the meaning. Try to do this with an unknown kanji, especially if you happen to play a game made for some older console where the authors tried to squeeze that 20+ stroke kanji into a 5x5 pixel square. Not to talk about fun things, like is 入り口 one word or two? And 打ち合わせ、割り箸, and so on, sometimes they're pretty clear if you know the compounds, sometimes just random (why enter mouth is entrance? hit together -> meeting?). This is especially worse if the source material contains long kana soups for whatever reasons… TL;DR: if it's written in kanji you're fucked if you don't know 2000+ kanji, if not, you're fucked anyways.

I've never tried RTK, but adding a deck with just one kanji and associated meanings can help. At least if you see a word and recognize the kanji that makes up the word, it's probably easier to remember it.

compound words like those are often pretty consistent, and after you learn a few you get better at detecting them. They often follow patterns, there are many that start with 気に/を and many others that end with に合う. Even for the ones that don't follow a pattern, usually if you look up the 2 words as separate words, the sentence won't make any sense, so then you know to try it as a compound. You absolutely do not need to know 2000 kanji to read material written with kanji, I know about 400 + a bunch of words that are 2/3 kanji but I don't know the individual meanings and I get by just fine with a dictionary.

Oh, "Remеmbering the Kanji" is actually a title of the book. Sorry to previous user, I'll give it a go.
I also downloaded TenguGo Kanji. Looks interesting.

Thanks for advises, will see if I'll be able to progress further this time.

Oh, "Remеmbering the Kanji" is actually a title of the book. Sorry to previous user, I'll give it a go.
I also downloaded TenguGo Kanji. Looks interesting.

Thanks for advises, will see if I'll be able to progress further this time.

I heard Dai 1 was shit though?

Learning radicals and writing out words/characters as you review them are some things you can do to help you better differentiate between similar looking stuff. Pretty sure RTK teaches radicals as it goes along, but never used it so don't really know too much about it. Personally, I think that in general, learning kanji in tandem with vocabulary is better than focusing just on kanji prior to vocabulary, but whatever works. Reading is an opportunity to learn more kanji, it may not be smooth sailing when starting out, but the more you look up, the less you'll have to look up. As said you don't have to look up every single thing if it's too overwhelming, you can just go off context when possible or outright ignore difficult passages until you feel better equipped for them. As far as making it easier to look up words with unfamiliar characters, you could go with something which uses furigana. When you don't have furigana, you can look up unknown characters through radicals on jisho.org or by drawing them in Google Translate or IME pad or something.

No, the first one was great too.

I found a copy of 零：赤い蝶 for halloween. This is going to be the first time I've played a game in japanese, any tips?

Don't give up like me after 5 minutes.

If I remember right that has mostly voiced cutscenes right? I would recommend a game with text you can advance at your leisure instead.

seconded, when I played fire emblem the cutscenes scrolled automatically and I didn't understand some of them and had to watch the english versions online, now I'm playing atelier and while it's voiced all the text advances when you tell it to, which is a huge help.

Tone phonemes are not the same thing as a pitch accent at all and Japanese is literally less tonal than English, which is less tonal than Chinese.
For one, tone in Chinese is concerned with specific levels and contours that are district segments tied to a syllable. It diferentiates two syllables as much as a different vowel does.
Japanese pitch accent is different in that it is a suprasegmental feature, tied to entire phonological words, is only concerned with relative level of pitch (stressed mora is higher than following mora), and cannot distinguish two syllables, only two words.

Should I just find the translated versions of the cutscenes and compare them? I'm quite set on playing this

I mean, just try it an see if you can progress. I wouldn't rely on any translations.

English is not more tonal than Japanese. Tone is irrelevant to distinguishing English homophones, while tone is critical to distinguishing Japanese homophones, as I have already pointed out with a video demonstrating it by a native speaker.

A pitch accent language is still basically an impoverished tonal language. It can still be thought of as tonal even without contour tones. Also, it seems that the natural result of the simplification of a full tonal language is a pitch accent language. Just look at Shanghainese, a Chinese pitch accent language which presumably had a full tonal system earlier in its evolution.

wu-chinese.com/zanhei/faq.html
wu-chinese.com/zanhei/pitch.html

English and Japanese use stress to distinguish homphones in almost the exact same way, and english stress is pitch based; English also uses tone phonemes to distinguish a wide variety of grammatical and syntactic functions, which is something Japanese doesn't do.

The japanese system works like english's stress system, and neither of them are tone-phoneme systems in the way that chinese is.

バンプ、　日本語を好きになりましょ。

English doesn't though.

English places stress ona syllable in a word. The most important factor in perception of stress is the increase in pitch, which is usually accompanied by an increase in volume.

A CON-tract is a signed agreement
To con-TRACT is to get someone to agree to a job. The first syllable will be emphasized in nouns, the second in verbs.

I see.

It's important to note that this is inconsistent between accents, and not all homophones have a differentiation like that.

Stress in English is phonemic and must be memorized for each word (coincidentally, exactly like Japanese), but it is true that many noun/verb pairs share a similar pattern.

The system in Japanese and Shanghainese Chinese is a pitch accent (tonal system with 2 tones high and low ) and has nothing to do with stress at all. The only thing that matters is the relative distinction between high tones and low tones.

On the other hand, English stress accent has nothing to do with pitch. In fact, it almost always boils down to differences in the actual pronunciation of the vowels. Unstressed vowels in English are often changed to the "schwa" sound, "uh". "Con" in the verb "contract" sounds like the "cun" in "cunt", while "con" in the noun "contract" sounds like "con" in "concept". Tone never matters at all in English pronunciation unless you are talking about some obscure African pidgin English. You can say "contract a disease" all in a high pitch voice, or you can growl it in a low pitched voice. Same with "sign a contract". The distinction will still be crystal clear. Pitch is entirely irrelevant to understanding the difference between that minimal pair. The same is not true in Japanese. はしが HLL means "chopsticks", はしが LHL means "bridge", and はしが LHH　means "edge". It couldn't be further from the stress system in English. There's absolutely nothing in common.

The japanese industry will die out, or convert to sjw, before you can learn japanese.

The world will end before you get those ten bucks back.

Are those her 勝負パンツ? And why is there a wet spot in a weird place?

A pitch accent is just a kind of stress. And your assertion that English stress is entirely qualitative is just ignorant. In systems that construct vowel reduction as an aspect of stress, there is always invariably constructed multiple stress levels, because there are definitely, in all prestige dialects of English, words that can be unstressed without being reduced.
tbh you should learn English before you focus on Japanese.

…Japanese is tonal?

No but it has an accent system based on pitch, which behaves like English's (or really more like Spanish's) accent system, except without increases in loudness.

Ok, thank god. I thought I had fucked up real god damn bad for the past year.

Doesn't know the second hole you fuck is lower and closer to the anus

Can someone identify this kanji scribble? Google and Jisho are giving me nothing.

I'm pretty sure that would be だからお願い

its grinding my autism

だからお願いだ。

I'm pretty sure that's a musical note on the left and a heart on the right, not a だ

だ the article; that was a sentence not a correction.

If I just leave this here it's going to bother me, so I'm going to elaborate, mostly for my own sake and partially to help any onlookers.

The point about English is actually completely irrelevant to the thread, but let me expand on it anyway because it's an interest of mine.
English has a complex system of stress no matter which canonical construction of the system you subscribe to. All of these systems have one thing in common: at least two levels of stress that are differentiated by two things: Force (loudness) and Pitch (stressed syllables being louder than the surrounding syllables). Which of those two is more important for perception of stress is a matter of debate, but both of them are pretty important and an English speaker should generally be able to distinguish stress with only one of them (though it will sound strange and foreign). An example of a minimal pair showing this feature is increase (n.) /'ɪn.kriːs/ vs. increase (v.) /ɪn'kriːs/. These words have exactly the same values (they have no reduction), but are still distinguishable based on the placement of stress within the word.
Some systems construct a multi-level system of stress, where some syllables are very unstressed, or reduced, where many vowels become /ə/. While this is a valid system, it still has the above levels, in addition to this new one, and such systems will generally look something like this (in their most simplistic form): Syllables may be Stressed, unstressed (no reduction), or very unstressed (some degree of reduction).
However, many linguists subscribe to a different theory, where reduction is a separate phonological process that sometimes occurs within unstressed syllables. This system has the advantages that it puts English in line with it ancestor languages as having two levels of stress, and that reduction by and large seems to occur independent of what is stressed and unstressed.
Furthermore, in General American English, there is no auditory difference between /ʌ/ and /ə/ (they are both pronounced [ə] phonetically), and the difference in notation is only kept because of tradition (a recurring problem in English linguistics), so in this dialect, even in a vowel reduction system, words like Russia (traditionally /'rʌʃə/) are actually only distinguishable by accent (in modern GenAm it is really /'rəʃə/).

Onto the Japanese.
First of all, your description of pitch is a tool used in manuals designed to teach Japanese to English speakers to help them learn the accent. It is not an accurate representation of Japanese phonology or phonetics.
Phonetically speaking, Japanese pitch is usually rises steadily from low to middle to high in when there is more than one syllable between the first and stressed syllable. That is, there is a constant rise in pitch that at no point in the rise can be described as high or low. Generally, this rise reaches a maximum at the stressed syllable and then suddenly drops after the first mora of that syllable. So right away, the assertion all syllables can be described as low or high is wrong. Also, the "H" in heiban words (LHH) is not the same pitch in accented words (it is different from the H in LHL).
Phonemically speaking, teaching this model as a description of Japanese phonology (as opposed to a teaching tool for foreigners) has the following problems:

Furthermore, teaching people the pitch accent the way you are saying should be done is just really ineffective, and (in addition to being wrong) needlessly complicates an already complex language for the people trying to learn it. Talking about the tones of Japanese like that implies that the learner should memorize the specific tone of every mora to use the pitch accent properly, when in reality the specific tones are A) unimportant as above, and B) can be predicted using rules based on the pitch accent.
So while you could (and should) teach people to memorize just one extra part of a word (which syllable is accented), and maybe teach them phonetically what this means, which would make their learning faster and their understanding and use of Japanese more accurate and native-like, you instead want to use a system that will take a more difficult path to arrive at a similar but inferior position.

For anyone reading who wants to know what to study about the pitch accent, this is what you should actually do, depending on how much you care:

Unless you've actually studied linguistics, this is unreadable. There is far too much jargon and far too few simple examples for a typical reader. If your intent was only on elaborating for those with the education to comprehend this then fuck me, but if you actually want a typical user to be able to understand this then consider dumbing it down some more. I applaud you passion either way.

I summarized everything a layperson needs to know at the end.
And the person I was replying to was acting like they knew linguistics (which they obviously didn't) so if they don't know what is going on it's their own damn problem for running their mouth.

The way you're describing the rules almost seems like you're describing how to sing.

since pitch in speech and pitch in music are the same thing (fundamental frequency), it's similar, but for speech, what is 'high' and what is 'low' is defined by the speaker's comfortable range.

Your argumentation style is almost purely Jewish sophistry, and you spent most of the time in these posts strawmanning, but what you described in the end is absolutely nothing at all even remotely like the stress accent system in English, but nearly exactly the same as the pitch accent system in Shanghainese that I presented as evidence that a pitch accent system is just a subtype of tonal accent system earlier. Thanks for proving me right, Shlomo.

Bottom line, pitch ("Pitch" as in frequency, not amplitude, don't be Jewish and use the same term to mean different things in different contexts and then claim they are the same because you put the same label on them.) contrasts are not phonemic in English (i.e., you cannot distinguish minimal pairs in English through only the frequency of vowels), but they are in Japanese.

haskins.yale.edu/Reprints/HL0026.pdf

blackwellpublishing.com/content/BPL_Images/Content_store/Sample_chapter/0631234942\001.pdf

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2897724/

English is NOT more tonal than Japanese. Stop your bold-faced Jewish lies.

Using the wrong pitch for the word はしが HLL vs はしが LHL is perceived by native Japanese speakers as a similar kind of mistake as saying "lice" instead of "rice" in English.

Japanese is in fact a kind of tonal language, while English is not.

ドウブルを見ますよ！

My friend made ad-free Realkana-clone as a programming exercise vatsul.com/Kana/

Shanghainese is also pitch accented and not tonal.
Pitch contrast, as in f0, fundamental frequency contrast, is a major part of English stress perception, enough that an English speaker can distinguish stress from it without accompanying force contrasts. This is really basic stuff and if you don't know that you aren't educated enough to discuss the topic. I also already gave a minimal pair that can be distinguished by its pitch in my post.
The first paper you cited by Bolinger says
(I never said it did) but clearly you didn't actually read it because it goes on to talk about the ways that English pitch is phonemic, including it's interactions with stress. This kind of pitch is different from the pitch used in stress, but this article doesn't actually support your point at all. Way to cherrypick
The second source you cited says
melodies.
Which is true, there are tonal varieties of Japanese like Kyoto. But Tokyo dialect is the standard, and has only an accentual pattern. That paper then goes on to discuss the phonetic pitch pattern in terms of the placement of accent within a word.
It is true that don't people consider pitch accents a kind of tonality. I don't, because they behave more similarly to stress accents than tonal languages as laid out in my post.
You cherrypicked an example about two very specific and limited cases and presented them completely without context. That last paper is a study of cross-language examination of people from other languages listening to Mandarin, and that quote is talking about phonetic similarities between the languages that will effect it.

If you're so totally assblasted about me saying that English is more tonal than Japanese, English isn't more tonal lexically than Japanese, in fact it's probably a little less. What I meant was that English uses tone (partially) to distinguish lexically like Japanese, and also had a complex system of tone phonemes that give information about syntactic function (you cited a paper that says this, too)
You haven't addressed my points about why saying that Japanese is tonal "like Chinese" is both incorrect in terms of Japanese phonology and a terrible method of teaching that you should keep out of a thread about learning Japanese.

Hey guys, I need help with katakana. I think I have most of it down, but I need to practice. Is there a website for that?

My test is on thursday and I will have to translate Katakana into romanization. Then I will get romanized words and will have to translate into katakana.

realkana.com/

Or try maybe.

Oh, I've already practiced that. I need a website to practice actual katakana words.

Here's a list you can use
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_gairaigo_and_wasei-eigo_terms

thanks, that should help.

Could someone help me find the first kanji here? I can translate the rest but I'm not having any luck looking this up.

発生

Thanks

new thread