Hey, an interesting one. Xenoverse Trunks vs Archie Silver should be coming out Oct 2. Black Adam vs Apocalypse is out.
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>>133075756wait, is silver just trunks but stupid?
>Archie fags really think this room is infinite in size
>Bayofag inadvertently unleashes Archiefag autism through basic universe number designationsI knew you were good for something
>>133075790Trunks is stupid as fuck. On average, I'd say that outside of 06 (and his first appearance in Archie) and him being kind of naive, Silver is a lot better at dealing with his shit than Trunks is.
>Bayofag literally keeps screeching even into the new threadImagine becoming just as bad as Otto and his discord server.
>he's still going
Only slightly curious who won the Apocalypse Black Adam fight. I'm guessing Black Adam.
>>133075968>the multiverse is just the main characters with costumes and funny accentsGod I hated this shit.
>>133076307Apoc won. Stomped Adam’s skull into the dirt
>>133076428Interesting. Not what I expected. But interesting nonetheless less.Thanks user.
>>133076442Quite literally stomped into the dirt btw
>>133076535Thought that's what you meant, yeah.
You know, instead of trying to pull out a one time feat wank for an anti-shill they could have explained why Adam wins in a way that's convincing to the actual people who scale and debate that think of this as just a shill ez win. Normies will eat up any response barring it doesn't trigger them *coughAgumoncough* so this DB serves no point other than showing how broken the series has become by it's own past failings.
>>133076004I didn't know he was going to go insane from someone else pointing out Archie's worldbuilding flaws and non-limit fallacies, as he was replying to me. What kind of idiot doesn't establish even a basic number or designation system for his multiverse structure? It's worldbuilding 101. Also, using the words multiverse and universe interchangeably, whenever the writer pleases, is never a good sign.I will leave Archiefags to Dragon Ball fags anyway. Don't care who wins. All I know that both spinoff IPs have messy lores and that no matter who loses, there will be tons of salt. This will be the new Ben vs Hal, in the sense that even if you are neutral and don't watch the fight, you will be caught in the crossfire.
Can Luffy beat Plastic Man now
What if they did a Death Battle where instead of a normal fight, both competitors sat naked on some guy's face and ripped the biggest foulest most powerful farts and the winner was whoever knocked him out (or killed him I guess, if you want to stick with the "death" theme) first.Like, imagine it with Goku and Superman for instance (since they're the stereotypical DB characters), imagine how gloriously STINKY that would be!
>>133077458What is wrong with you
>>133077458Never post when horny ever again
>>133077041>What kind of idiot doesn't establish even a basic number or designation system for his multiverse structure? It's worldbuilding 101. Also, using the words multiverse and universe interchangeably, whenever the writer pleases, is never a good sign.Yeah welcome to Archie lore, it's a fucking mess. If you wanna actually have a stroke ask about the Echidnas.And nah, this can't be the new Ben vs Hal solely because us Archiefags are more insanely autistic about lore and characters than powerlevels
>>133077792Mewtwo vs Shadow, why do you ask?
>>133075756>They ruled atomic manipulation and the TO virus would have worked on AdamThis is why you stick with Zeus.
>>133078210Is it ever even said Zeus lightning is equal to Aten’s.Is Aten even a lightning guy
>>133077062Luffy has to try and beat the Goo-Jit Zu guys first.
>>133077041will there really be any salt though? It's not the main version of ether character.
So what makes Xeno characters impressive?How this Trunks diverges from his canon self
Since it's not manga Trunks vs. game Silver, I feel like logically Silver has this. Archie Silver should scale to a lot of the stuff from the Flash vs. Sonic fight. And Trunks is effectively losing acasuality without even getting multiversal power in return.So of course, Death Battle will have Trunks win somehow.
>Apocalypse, the biggest jobber of franchise final bosses, beat Black Adam, a guy who is on par with Captain Marvel and SupermanFucking how? Was it bullshit or did it seem like a legit win
>>133078830Energy manipulation and unlike Billy Adam has never forced the lightning back into him
>>133078774I was reading a good bit of Archie Sonic / Sonic Universe right around where Silver came in on the Moebius arc, I don't remember him doing anything that impressive as old Archie Sonic (most of Archie Sonic's best feats came from earlier runs)Considering Heroes Trunk can do wacky shit like turn SSJ4 I don't think Silver has this
>>133078848Is Black Adam not literally all the same powers as Captain Marvel? Could he not do pic related in >>133078210
>>133078629Technically speaking, Xeno Trunks is Super Trunks, just a further down in the future. He use SSG, train with Whis, Beerus and Goku, Get body changed by Ginyu, and could realistically scale to the MC, who fought MUI Goku, an enraged Beerus and Champa, angels like Whis and Vados etc. Other than that, he can somewhat go toe to toe with an amped version of Super Perfect Cell (with help of course), and can hold his own against Mira pretty well. >>133078774Silver's saving grace is the fact that he'll definitely be faster than Trunks and his time traveling being able to actually affect Xeno characters, since they're not immune to time travel shit. He's also the underdog in this fight, as I'm sure more people will be rooting for Trunks and will more or less be expecting him to win.
>>133078867They have different gods
>>133078774Eh I think Silver should take it. They can both get dumbass shit to put them around similar power. The difference is Silver has more stuff he can do between potentially countering ki energy, easier time travel, and just flat out portaling Trunks into the sun>>133078855You know they are just going to scale Super Silver to Enerjak, Mogul, or Solaris at minimum
>My power is to have any power I wantAnime Cartman is just like Superman, he has no limits!
>>133078890>He use *He CAN useCan't believe I jobbed to English this badly.
>>133078896Yeah but isn't that usually used to explain why Adam can take the whole Marvel family, implying his gods are at least even, if not greater?
>>133078890>Silver's saving grace is the fact that he'll definitely be faster than Trunkst. never read Archie Sonic
>>133078968He isn’t. Except in WW3 where he was amped by his gods. His first appearance had him straight out admit neither of them could beat each other since they were both invulnerable so he went for Billy.
>>133079005Yeah I'd still give the speed advantage to the guy who can at least somewhat keep up with the blue blur. Trunks has basically zero speed feats, and if they're going to scale him to the shockwaves, you know for a fact that they're giving Silver full Sonic scaling.
>>133079005Have they ever given a Sonic character lower speed than their opponent before? Besides Wally, but even then both were functionally immeasurable (even if they gave the reasoning that Wally could steal speed and thus still, somehow, be faster).
>>133078968>Yeah but isn't that usually used to explain why Adam can take the whole Marvel familyHe can do that because when Billy shares his powers with others they get evenly split between each Marvel. So instead of Adam and Billy fighting 1v1 with both having the strength of 3 it's BA with strength of 3 vs 3 guys with strength of 1. >>133079019>Except in WW3 where he was amped by his gods. I'm pretty sure nothing like that happened. He was at normal power levels, just berserk.
>>133079081They haven't I don't think and considering that Silver can at least keep up, there's no reason he shouldn't get the speed advantage>>133078855Going toe to toe with Enerjak alone gives him retarded scaling that was elaborated on last thread. And if they give him Mogul scaling things get really ugly really quickly
>>133079041>Yeah I'd still give the speed advantage to the guy who can at least somewhat keep up with the blue blur.Define "keep up".
>>133079155Slightly off topic but I still like that sequence. Just a perfect moment of Sonic being completely done with Silver's shit
>>133079081I think they said Mario was faster than base Sonic. They also gave Zero the speed advantage when he fought Metal
>>133078855Throwing down with a stronger variant of Knuckles-Enerjak means he gets all kinds of crazy scaling, as the last thread elaborated. Paired with potential Mogul scaling ON TOP of Solaris scaling, means things get really fucking nasty.
>>133079005You do realize that even Archie Sonic has been cauvht off-guard before, right? Sometimes literally when the villain is gloating in front of him?
>>133079155>Gets caught off-guard>By someone he's trying to help>Whom he also clearly didn't want to fightAnon...This also doesn't go against my point of Silver being able to ALMOST keep up with Sonic. Nor does it contradict what I said about how they'd fully scale him to anything they could in Archie.
>>133079191don't forget he could also scale to other Super Transformations that could fight against the Egg Wizard which was powered up by an artifact that could shield the Sol Dimension from the complete destruction of the multiverse
>>133079155>>133079256Anon is also forgetting how Silver managed to completely immobilize Sonic, Shadow, Metal, AND Scourge when he actually got serious that one time. They LITERALLY couldn't escape.
>>133079283It was no use
>>133079082He was explicitly amped
>>133079294IT'S NO USE
>>133079191>Throwing down with a stronger variant of Knuckles-Enerjak means he gets all kinds of crazy scalingHe doesn't get any Enerjak scaling. Knuckles was pretty explicitly fucking around with him the whole time for the sake of entertainment. And even then Enerjak bullied him at one point with zero effort.Silver scaling to Enerjak would mean he's comparable to Super Sonic in base and massively outclasses Sonic, Shadow and pretty much the entire population of Mobius who Enerjak killed singlehandedly. I don't think I should explain how dumb that is when both Sonic and Scourge trashed Silver in base. Or when Super Scourge trashed not just Silver, but also Sonic, Shadow, Metal Sonic, Amy, Rosie and Amy's cousin at the same time with zero difficulty.
>>133079317THIS WILL END IT!
GOKU VS SUPERMAN TRES
>>133075756>Fanfiction vs FanfictionJesus lord.
>>133079347We just got Hercules VS Wukong this season, user.
>>133079323He gets Dark Enerjak scaling via reflecting his blasts back at him continuously. >I don't think I should explain how dumb that is when both Sonic and Scourge trashed Silver in base. user a serious Silver literally treated them like squabbling children.
>>133079356Now hold on. It's licenced fanfiction. Well... Archie isn't anymore but it was at one time.
>>133078774>Trunks has acasuality???
>>133079405The Archie part is the one that rubs me off the wrong way the most. Just like with Star Wars Legends, it's a thing that isn't attached to the franchise anymore.
>>133079429It’s just another continuity
>>133079408Only in the main continuity, due to how time travel in the OG Dragonball/Super works.
>>133079323>bullied him at one point with zero effort.>Silver scaling to Enerjak would mean he's comparable to Super Sonic in base and massively outclasses Sonic, Shadow and pretty much the entire population of Mobius who Enerjak killed singlehandedlyAnd they're absolutely going to give it to him
>>133079429It's another continuity, in the same way the Movies have literally nothing to do with the games but are still official stuff. Calm down.
>>133079283>>133079382>user is also forgetting how Silver managed to completely immobilize Sonic, Shadow, Metal, AND Scourge when he actually got serious that one time. They LITERALLY couldn't escape.Except that's not exactly what happened. All he did was lift them off the ground. Which was detrimental to everyone because Sonic and others pretty explicitly need to have the ground underneath their feat to move around. They were blatantly moving their arms and legs while in that state too. They were not immobilized.And Silver only caught them because everyone was busy fighting each other. Two pages later he utterly fails to tag Scourge with his telekinesis.>He gets Dark Enerjak scaling via reflecting his blasts back at him continuously.He doesn't because Enerjak was explicitly going easy on him. Silver getting trashed by Super Scourge along with tons of backup serves as an additional proof of that.
>>133079447How did he got Mei to become his girlfriend then? She wasn't in the original.
>>133079440An abandoned one. It would be like using AoSth Sonic for more toonforce.
I am not sure why people are complaining about Enerjak. You know he is going to get it one way or the other either via fight or his super form which he 100% going to get
>>133079440Deleted ones. It's kind of deemining that you even use these continuities to represent the franchises.At least Heroes is still on going.
>>133079479Who cares if its abandoned? They are specifically using it. It's not like what they did with Boba where they just composited EU without calling him EU Boba. Here they are calling it Archie VS Heroes
>>133079473Splintered timeline. They explain it with the rings in super. A significant change creates a new timeline, it doesn't alter an existing one. If Silver goes back and kills Trunks as a kid, he just created a new timeline where that Trunks is dead. The existing Trunks he was fighting would be looking around wondering what happened and probably assume he won from stage removal.
>>133079467>literally slams Sonic into a wall and there's nothing he can do about it except take it>no, this doesn't mean he scales to him because...it just doesn't okay!user...
>>133079494Not really if it’s these specific versions
>>133079510It's certainly more honest, but it also feels more pointless. Everyone's just going to be "well Trunks would have beaten current Silver" if Silver wins. It wasn't an issue with Sonic vs. Flash cause Sonic didn't win.
>>133079482He can also get it because one of the Ixis Masterworks is directly implied to be Solaris, made by Mogul himself and who Silver fought since 06 still happened in Archie according to the Archie Sonic Encyclopedia. The same Mogul who literally needs Enerjak/Chaos Knuckles/Knuckles-Enerjak for his full power.
>>133079549Right because Heroes Trunks is "current Trunks". No shit everyone knows Trunks would wreck Game Silver barring some extreme wanking and roundabout wins via time travel. This is just taking the two most broken versions of the character
>>133079517>. If Silver goes back and kills Trunks as a kid, he just created a new timeline where that Trunks is dead. Yeah, if we were talking about normal Dragon Ball. Dragon Ball Xenoverse timelines work differently, as if you alter the past it will change the future. If Silver were to go back in time and kill a past version of Xeno Trunks, future Trunks would die as well.
>>133079467>He doesn't because Enerjak was explicitly going easy on him.Can you post the pages?
>>133079517It really just sounds to me that it's just parallel dimensions. But yeah that's how Silver is going to die.I mean, not exactly like that, he's probably going to die once he returns.
>>133077062>>133078276Luffy is for Naruto
>>133079517Not how it works in Heroes/XV unfortunately. Changing the past means you affect the primary timeline as well. In XV2, Trunks literally gets paradoxed out of existence because of this and the player needs to figure out a way to bring him back. Likewise, Towa preventing the player from ever being summoned means the Time Patrol gets utterly fucked.
>>133079574See but that seems fucked up too because the game continuations actually give Trunks a lose condition he didn't have before, one Silver specifically exploits. So it just feels like blatant, conscious stacking of odds.
>>133079575Yes I just meant the main continuity. The games make less sense. They add a Supreme Kai of time but for some reason time travel is LESS regulated.
>>133079601Naruto is for the Ninga Turtles
>>133079587See >>133079575 and >>133079602. That's not how Heroes works.>>133079612Even without the time travel weakness, Archie Silver with literally any scaling outmuscles and outhaxes Heroes Trunks. The only win con Trunks has is to immediately blitz him down whilst he's in base, and that won't happen if they give him Archie Sonic speed scaling.
>>133079635>Thinking a Kai would ever do their jobReminder that Chrona is such a shitter, she allowed multiple time eggs - which were powerful enough to destroy the universe if just ONE broke - to not only fall into the hands of demons, but the hands of humans, Sayians, Majin Goddamn Buu, and fucking Frieza. Are you really surprised that time travel is utter dog shit under her supervision?
>>133079635Chronoa is literally retarded user.
>>133079575Archie Silver can only go back in past using time stones. If Trunks gets a hold of it or simply takes it away from him, Silver is fucked.I'm starting to believe he isn't even getting the chaos emerald in this episode.
>>133079663>Even without the time travel weaknessThat's my point. It's stacked at both ends against Trunks. He gets less of a strength boost (Heroes Trunks doesn't really scale to things like full power Fu) AND gains a significant weakness that DB loves to exploit, and Silver specifically can exploit.It's even more of a "no shit" than manga Trunks vs. game Silver.
>>133079582Just read this issue and the next one.comiconlinefree.net
>>133079718They always give them the chaos emeralds
>>133079601The strongest Naruto would still remove Luffy's from existing.
>>133079718Archie Silver has gone back into the past (and across whole Zones) without the Time Stones. See Light Mobius. And even without them, Silver could still just beat Trunks to death. The time travel thing is just one of his many win cons.Also, pretty much every hedgehog in Archie is holding onto something they can use to juice themselves to Super.
>>133079733He's gonna get it with Super Silver as Super Sonic threw down with Enerjak.
>>133079733>And what puts the final logic in the whole "Silver scales to Enerjak" line of logic is this page*Puts the final nail in the coffin of that line of logic, I mean
>>133079753>The strongest Naruto would still remove Luffy's from existing.Haki
Let's be real here. Sonicfags are getting too cocky again.
>>133079733It's less "technique" and more that as an energy manipulator, Silver just inherently has the means to turn Enerjak's power against him. He says it himself in that last panel even. He hard-counters Enerjak by using his own power against him, and as we saw with Apoc, that's the sort of thing that DB can and will use 100% to scale a character and give them a win.
So is there a chance they will scale Heroes Trunks to shit he really should scale to? Or pretend they don't know Heroes time travel works differently?
>>133079772Wasn't Enerjak still weakened from Egg Grapes when Super Sonic fought him?
>another W for DBKekSorry potleaf, i basically got Xenoblade powers on my side.
>>133079813They'll scale Heroes Trunks but they'll also scale Silver so they'll just end up being similar power wise. Then Silver wins for having more tricks than Trunks does.
>>133079805Nah, they are right this time. I mean they had to deliberately cherry pick continuities, but going by the ones they picked there isn't really a good argument for Trunks winning.
>>133079718I severely doubt that they'd decide to not give Silver the emeralds or the stones, but that does bring in an interesting question: Would Trunks get his Keysword? It feels like it's the best way to balance things out.>If Trunks gets a hold of it or simply takes it away from him, Silver is fucked.Let's say for shits and giggles that Trunks just goes "I'll take that" and launches Silver's entire arsenal into space. What's stopping Silv from doing the exact same thing to Trunks via telekinesis. >>133079813If they go all in with scaling Silver to Sonic, Tails, Enerjak etc etc I can see them scaling Trunks to full power Chrona and the Demons.
>>133079813What DOES he scale to? The biggest thing I've seen people give him is the Keysword weakening Mechikabura, but that's not his own power at all and he doesn't scale to the three who did provide the power.
>>133079830Chronoa has to actively power that thing up, and it's pretty much designed to do something that isn't nessisary to beat Silver I exchange for making Trunks vulnerable to time hax.
>>133076105Damn, they didn't pay enough for that shilling
>>133079356SCP vs Creepypasta coming soon
>>133079847The demons wouldn't be enough. They would need to scale Trunks to full power Hearts or Fu or something.
>>133079830>>133079862Silver can also literally throw the Keysword into the sun and Trunks will never ever get it back. He's lost it TWICE before and needed to find it instead of it just flying back to him or something.And the full power thing needs to be amped by three entities who Trunks doesn't even remotely scale to.
>>133079791You can't even prove it he is immune to full atomization. And not just that, those balls can erase haki as well. As seen in the Madara vs Aizen episode.
>>133079847>>133079888They'd have to scale him to fucking Mechikabura for it to be fair.
>>133075756>Time Patrol TrunksOh boy, another stomping on Sonicfags.
>>133079811Okay that's fair, but my point still stands - Silver is not on Enerjak's level power wise, not even close.Whether Silver can reflect Trunks' attacks the same way is another argument altogether. Besides the fact that ki is not the same thing as chaos energy, Dragon Ball characters usually have no problem dodging or deflecting their own attacks. Even in Enerjak's case the trick only stalled Knuckles and set him up to be drained by the Sword of Acorn. Silver wasn't doing any significant damage to him even by redirecting his blasts.
>>133079854Nothing extreme really. Multiple bosses in Heroes are said to be Zen-oh level (multiversal) but you're supposed to take them out with teams and fusions, not one guy.
>>133079830>>Another W>DB hasn't gotten a win since Galaxia>One of their losses came from an active time traveler >Trunks also has an item that can be easily stolen or used against him>>133079805Fucking good. Most of the fights this season have made these threads stagnant as hell, at least some autism will spice things up.
>>133079880I was going to say something about Zalgo but then I was reminded of a thread here that devolved into Zalgo vs Goku for some reason
>>133079914Silver isn't comparable to Dark Enerjak, who is meant to be orders of magnitude above the Knuckles-Enerjak the Prime Zone faced. But the existence of the Ixis Masterworks and Super Sonic scaling opens up a whole rabbithole for Silver to indirectly scale to Enerjak via scaling to Mogul who made Solaris. So either way, there are multiple ways to give him that scaling even ignoring the possibility of them just flat out giving him it via the energy-manipulation.
>>133079897The key sword exists outside of time and can be summoned to his hand. It’s not a physical kingdom hearts keyblade.
I think people are forgetting how utterly incompetent Silver is at actually solving problems with time travel, or even time travelling to the right time. Killing someone as a child would literally be impossible for him without any prior knowledge about their identity and whereabouts.
>>133079938>Zalgo vs GokuHow did that go if you don't mind me asking?
>>133079928This fight is cut and dry, there's nothing spicy about it. Silver gets a bigger boost than Trunks and Trunks gains a weakness Silver specifically can exploit.It's like if we already knew they were going to scale Apocalypse to Phoenix.
>>133079959>The key sword exists outside of time and can be summoned to his hand.Literally any proof at all? Because the game and manga both show otherwise, where he fucking loses it in both.Not that it matters, because the charged Keysword is completely outside help.
>>133079905>And not just that, those balls can erase haki as well.Just flex on them. Or dodge.
>>133079977To be fair, how hard could it be to find a buff, purple haired kid who looks like your opponent?>>133079959Even physical KH keyblades have weird fucking properties, like being destroyed/erased from data entirely, but being reformed because of friendship.
>>133079977Apocalypse was utterly incompetent too.
>>133079977Silver has time travelled to the correct time in Archie and elsewhere. Just not the correct moment. If he wanted to, he could 100% teleport to say, the day Vegeta and Bulma engage in coitus or encounter Kid Trunks. In-character though, he probably wouldn't know the importance of either however.
>>133079715A sexy retard
>>133079715All Dragon Ball characters are retarded. It's a universe entirely populated by windowlickers.
>>133080052>Time Unleashed Chronoa
>>133080004He isn't fast enough to do that.
>>133079978pretty much it was said Goku couldn't be affected by Zalgo's corruption because:1: he was pure of heart so it wouldn't corrupt him2: Zalgo has only been able to corrupt newspaper comic strips the beyond fiction version of Zalgo was also disregarded by the Goku supporters because it wasn't in the original stuff for Zalgo and as such was considered fanfiction
>>133079977I know nothing of heroes. Does his time travel work as a natural ability or is it done with some sort of accessory? Asking in case I should expect anything similar to Goku Black vs Reverse Flash.
>>133080111So they literally only "won" because of wank and dismissal of evidence. Nice.
>>133080052>>133080083Her proto design is better than both.
>>133080133Her hair is better, I'll agree.
>>133080106They had him 13 times faster than SOSP Naruto in base literally five minutes after the One Piece Timeskip
>>133080111>the beyond fiction version of Zalgo was also disregarded by the Goku supporters because it wasn't in the original stuff for Zalgo and as such was considered fanfictionBut Archie and EU Star Wars are cool.
>>133078249Nope. Aten's a sun god.en.wikipedia.org
>>133079914>Okay that's fair, but my point still stands - Silver is not on Enerjak's level power wise, not even close.NTA but this whole argument has been about base Silver scaling to him, which is ultimately irrelevant because Super Silver absolutely scales to Enerjak thanks to being directly comparable to Super Sonic
Couldn't Super Silver just use chaos control and vanish Trunks to the sun.
>>133079957Ugh, right. But from what I remember Archie top tiers and their scaling is all pretty shaky in the first place. Master Mogul at his best could only destroy universes one at a time, and even that was leagues above anything Chaos Knuckles, any of the Enerjaks or Super forms ever showed. Even Super Sonic (and, therefore, Super Silver) shouldn't scale to Enerjak because Knuckles was drained by Egg Grapes when Sonic fought him and Sonic still wasn't getting anywhere and Locke needed to sacrifice his life to end the crisis (and in Dark Mobius timeline Super Sonic lost outright).I have no idea how Solaris relates to anything in Archie because I was pretty sure he only existed in that canon as a footnote in the handbook.
>>133080189>because Super Silver absolutely scales to Enerjak thanks to being directly comparable to Super SonicHe does not. Knuckles Enerjak was weakened by Egg Grapes when he fought Super Sonic, and Sonic still couldn't do anything to him and would have lost eventually if Locke didn't sacrifice his own life as Dark Mobius showed.
>>133080150what does Archie and EU have to do with Goku and Zalgo?
>>133080198>Even Super Sonic (and, therefore, Super Silver) shouldn't scale to Enerjak because Knuckles was drained by Egg Grapes when Sonic fought him and Sonic still wasn't getting anywhere and Locke needed to sacrifice his life to end the crisis (and in Dark Mobius timeline Super Sonic lost outright).The only reason Super Sonic didn't win is because of the hex shit iirc. Enerjak in general can't be beaten with brute force. Super Sonic can still scale since he was effectively going blow for blowAnd as for Solaris, because of said footnote it implies that both 06 happened and Mogul made him which gives Silver his Solaris AND Mogul scaling so he still gets that Enerjak scaling no matter whatAnd in terms of Super Sonic stuff if we go off WC I'm pretty sure they gave him multiversal repair or some shitThere's so much shit to unpack with this
>>133080229Dismissing fiction because it's not the original, but only when it's convenient.
And the threads are already more interesting than they were for the past 2 weeks. Thank you, Death Battle, for finally doing a fight that doesn't completely suck ass.
>>133080198>Master Mogul at his best could only destroy universes one at a time, and even that was leagues above anything Chaos Knuckles, any of the Enerjaks or Super forms ever showed.He destroyed millions according to Zonic shortly after absorbing the entire Chaos Force via Choas Knuckles' powers and the imbalance Knuckles caused. Even if you assume it was a Zone destroyed per day, that's still utterly insane. And that's without getting into the bete about whether or not they were universes or actual multiverses.Also, even stonewalling a weakened Knuckles-Enerjak is utterly insane and still gives Super Sonic insane scaling from that. >I have no idea how Solaris relates to anything in Archie because I was pretty sure he only existed in that canon as a footnote in the handbook.Solaris is implied to be one of the Ixis Masterworks made by Mogul, alongside Chaos.
>>133080242>There's so much shit to unpack with thisYeah, I literally can't even.
>>133080271Is it interesting if your into Archie Sonic or something? I'm already bored. People are just debating how hard Silver stomps now.
>>133080310Archie Sonic lore is crazy enough that it's genuinely entertaining debating it.
>>133079805It's just two or three Silverfags with autism for Archie powerlevels going at it. Doesn't even look like the dragon ball fags care much about Heroes so let them have their moment
>>133080335Is this because no one here cares about DBH
>>133080322Seems too crazy to me, like I'd rather take your word for it.
>>133080147They didn't put a number on Madara, just said he's FTL. Naruto is actually faster than him. You can calc stack this shit like a retard for both series.
>>133080335Dragonballfags don't care about Heroes because they mostly don't know anything about it. /dbs/ is more obsessed with Black Frieza because it's more easily digestible in comparison.
>>133076401That's literally how it almost always goes.
>>133080348Oh wait you made that assumption too. Fuck my reading miscomprehension
>>133080271There's not even a debate between Trunks and Silver though. This isn't interesting at all. Even DB fans know this is stacked. There's not even a struggle.
>>133079825Yes and Knuckles is explicitly stated to be a shit Enerjak because he lacks the creativity to use his powers effectively, for instance Dimitri tore Knuckles apart molecule by molecule, Knuckles turns him into a cloud, and instead of just leaving him a harmless gas, puts him underground and reforms him.
>>133080384This comic seems braindead.
>>133080384Knuckles-Enerjak is stronger than Dimitri-Enerjak in every way, but because he's such a total blockhead he thankfully can't harness that power in any way that doesn't mostly involve throwing more raw force at people.
how many times is silver gonna say IT'S NO USE in the fight
>>133080416Hopefully not as much as "OH NO"
>>133080242>The only reason Super Sonic didn't win is because of the hex shit iirc.I'm pretty sure he was unaffected by the hex. It was meant to stop anyone besides Finitevus from using Master Emerald, but Sonic did because he has in-universe plot armor as a being of pure chaos or some shit like that.>Super Sonic can still scale since he was effectively going blow for blowHe only scales to significantly drained Enerjak. Which means he doesn't get the scaling to the full-power Enerjak. And neither should Silver.>And as for Solaris, because of said footnote it implies that both 06 happened and Mogul made him which gives Silver his Solaris AND Mogul scaling so he still gets that Enerjak scaling no matter whatYou'd need to be more specific. First thing first, Mogul creates Solaris... how? Just generated him out of his power or created him in a tube? Because that makes a world of a difference.And even if it's the first case, Solaris would be weaker than Mogul and nobody would receive Mogul scaling. Especially because Sonic, Silver and Shadow needed to work together to beat Solaris, and I'm not even sure they actually beat him head-on. Didn't they need to time travel in the past to snuff him out or something?>And in terms of Super Sonic stuff if we go off WC I'm pretty sure they gave him multiversal repair or some shitBut that was only with Chaos Control. I don't recall Silver even knowing how to use Chaos control in Archie. Even in games or IDW he always needed help from a more experienced user to perform it. And even then CC on that scale required him being totally concentrated, took time and was fucked sideways by a fucking Eggmobile. No way that shit is applicable in a combat scenario against an opponent who wouldn't just do nothing.Also, technically it wasn't even mainline Archie Sonic who did it. Genesis Waves changed the timeline into the copy of the game one.>There's so much shit to unpack with thisYeah, Archie lore is a huge pain in the ass.
>>133080121What's Silver strength? I already know they're gonna have Trunks wayyy past planet buster since he quickly took care of Frieza in his first appearance.
>>133080460That's what most people are trying to figure out because Silver doesn't get a lot of showings in Archie and when he was finally getting his own arc the reboot happened.
>>133080439>First thing first, Mogul creates Solaris... how? Just generated him out of his power or created him in a tube?Mogul is a pure magic user. He literally doesn't do anything without resorting to magic or using it to augment his stuff. Safe to say that he presumably just created the Ixis Masterworks using his own power. >Didn't they need to time travel in the past to snuff him out or something?Their attacks knocked it's body unconscious/into a stunned state, then Sonic and Elise time-travelled to when it was still just a flame and blew it out to retcon it out of existence. At least in the original 06.
Boring fight. The external fictions chosen for BOTH characters give Silver an advantage. Just wanking to cutting Zamasu in half and keeping acasuality would be more worth it than losing it just to get physically stronger.
Oh this just made me realize that Archie goes 0-2 if he loses this episode.
>>133080277>>133080277>He destroyed millions according to Zonic shortly afterBut do we even have a timeframe? We saw that Mogul was busting them one at a time when he destroyed that superhero universe.>shortly after absorbing the entire Chaos Force via Choas Knuckles' powers and the imbalance Knuckles caused. Ah, so Mogul was actually more powerful than Chaos Knuckles due to absorbing the entire Chaos Force. But in that case literally nobody in Archie besides Titan Tales scales to him at all?>Also, even stonewalling a weakened Knuckles-Enerjak is utterly insane and still gives Super Sonic insane scaling from that.It's not really that insane. The drain was significant enough for Knuckles to be gassed from his fight against Egg Fleet.>Solaris is implied to be one of the Ixis Masterworks made by Mogul, alongside Chaos.Okay, but once again, how was he created and when? Did Master Mogul magic him into existence? Hell, did Mogul even have Chaos powers when he did that? Chaos existed for thousands of years.
>>133080439>>133080478>And even then CC on that scale required him being totally concentrated, took time and was fucked sideways by a fucking Eggmobile.The only thing the Eggmobile crash did is prevent him from bringing back the original multiverse perfectly. The Chaos Control still went off and recreated the entire multiverse, even without him focusing on it.The version of Sonic who did was also the original preboot one. The effects of the SGW changing everything only come about AFTER the CC and Eggmobile thing.
ENTER Trunks the NEGLECTED.
>>133080499>But do we even have a timeframe? We saw that Mogul was busting them one at a time when he destroyed that superhero universe.All we know is that it can't have been very long after Knuckles revived himself fro mthe Chaos Force, since thats when Mogul did it.>Ah, so Mogul was actually more powerful than Chaos Knuckles due to absorbing the entire Chaos Force. But in that case literally nobody in Archie besides Titan Tales scales to him at all?He explicitly needed Chaos Knuckles' power to actually pull off the absorption, paired with the imbalance from Knuckles bringing himself back to life. Even if he had the imbalance, he couldn't have done it without absorbing Chaos Knuckles' power first.>Okay, but once again, how was he created and when? Did Master Mogul magic him into existence? Hell, did Mogul even have Chaos powers when he did that? Chaos existed for thousands of years.Mogul was one of the very first Mobians to be gifted with magic, literally shortly after the species came about. The only ones confirmed to be as old, if not older, are the Ancient Walkers. He predates everyone else, even the Echidnas and Chaos. And as was said above, literally everything Mogul does is via magic - he doesn't do anything without it.
>>133080478>Mogul is a pure magic user. He literally doesn't do anything without resorting to magic or using it to augment his stuff. Safe to say that he presumably just created the Ixis Masterworks using his own power.Yeah but like... If there's no direct indication of how he created them it's hard to say if they scale to him, if he scales to them or how they scale in general. Chaos is obviously nowhere near Solaris, for instance. And if their creation happened thousands of years ago, when Chaos was created, Mogul couldn't have been in his super form back then. Which would have made Solaris more powerful than him at the time.>Their attacks knocked it's body unconscious/into a stunned state, then Sonic and Elise time-travelled to when it was still just a flame and blew it out to retcon it out of existence. At least in the original 06.Fair enough, but it still took their combined effort to do that. Which makes the scaling tricky.
>>133080466There's also the fact that his scaling is all kinds of fucked depending on how you interpret his bout with Knuckles-Enerjak and Solaris
>>133080583His bout with Enerjak is fucking nothing, he literally accomplishes nothing in that fight. At best he might get some good durability feats from it.If they try to say he's comparable in power they're straight up wrong.
>>133080606Huh? Oh right I forgot about that fight.
>>133080439>I'm pretty sure he was unaffected by the hex. It was meant to stop anyone besides Finitevus from using Master Emerald, but Sonic did because he has in-universe plot armor as a being of pure chaos or some shit like that.I meant more that the only reason Enerjak couldn't get overpowered by Super is because the hex kept Enerjak going. The moment it broke so did Enerjak iirc.>He only scales to significantly drained Enerjak. Which means he doesn't get the scaling to the full-power Enerjak. And neither should Silver.Fair but a massively drained Enerjak is still ridiculously strong The other anons addressed the other points
>>133080622They scaled Apocalypse to a being he's only fought in AUs and when he does he gets absolutely stomped by her.
>>133080622They'll use the energy-manipulation to scale him, like they did for Apocalypse.
>>133080575>He explicitly needed Chaos Knuckles' power to actually pull off the absorption, paired with the imbalance from Knuckles bringing himself back to life. Even if he had the imbalance, he couldn't have done it without absorbing Chaos Knuckles' power first.Yeah, but Chaos Knuckles didn't have the Chaos Force absorbed, unlike Mongul. I interpret this as Mogul setting off a chain reaction that required CK's powers, but in the end it made him much more powerful. Which honestly lines up with the fact that no other Enerjak or Super form could just crunch universes in their hands like Mogul did.>Mogul was one of the very first Mobians to be gifted with magic, literally shortly after the species came about. The only ones confirmed to be as old, if not older, are the Ancient Walkers. He predates everyone else, even the Echidnas and Chaos. And as was said above, literally everything Mogul does is via magic - he doesn't do anything without it.See this >>133080579Mogul was definitely not in his Master form that much back in the past, which means Solaris must have been stronger than him at that point (in fact, Solaris should be comparable to the original Master Mogul because it took 3 Super forms to beat both of them). Which means he couldn't have created him with pure power at that point. Which renders scaling Solaris to Master Mogul and vice versa invalid.
>>133080606>How MK vs DC should've been
>>133080579>>133080679Solaris' creation is hard to pin down, but it was probably made really early by Mogul. Given he literally got all of his powers from a Chaos Emerald implanted into his chest that fell from space (reminder that the emeralds in Archie are just ultra-dense aggregates of immense amounts of chaos energy across the universe and multiple dimensions - they aren't unique entities limited to Mobius), it makes sense that he could make Solaris that strong if he wanted. The only thing in question is why there's such a gap between Solaris and thge other implied Ixis Masterwork which is Chaos.
>>133080636>I meant more that the only reason Enerjak couldn't get overpowered by Super is because the hex kept Enerjak going. The moment it broke so did Enerjak iirc.Hm, to be fair I don't recall how the hex worked or how much role it played. But power-for-power Super Sonic would have still gotten bodied if Locke didn't interfere, as Dark Mobius timeline shows. And that should have still bean massively nerfed Enerjak.>Fair but a massively drained Enerjak is still ridiculously strongDefine "ridiculously strong". As I mentioned above, man was sweating like a pig after fighting off the Egg Fleet.
>Three IPs not even discussing the fight, just internal lore from one of the two series.Dead fight.
>>133080722Because Solaris never happened in the comic,the events of 06 are never brought up outside of the Encyclospeedia as far as I'm aware.
The reason why Black Adam's last Shazam didn't work is because he actually said> SHAZA- Oh, shit.when Apocalypse's boot was gonna hit his face
>>133080768Yup! In fact the only pic we get of Super Silver in the entire pre reboot is in that very encyclopedia
>>133080768That's not the Encyclopedia, it doesn't even acknowledge Archie.
>>133080754You say that but it's already shaping to be more interesting than Bootpocalypse vs The Rock of Eternity>>133080786
>>133075756doomguy vs master chief 2 when
>>133080722But by that logic Solaris should have been much weaker than any individual Super form, because it usually takes 7 emeralds or one Master Emerald for them to transform while Solaris was presumably created from the power of one.And it gets even murkier considering Master Mogul needed 3 supers to beat him while in a state that should have been significantly above the state he was in when he created Solaris. Who needed the same amount of effort to be defeated himself.And yeah, there's the thing with Chaos being piss-weak compared to Solaris and Master Mogul too.So I'm not really sold on Solaris being created out of Mogul's power alone. It would make more sense if it was some magic ritual, science experiment or a wicked combination of both peppered with rich amounts of chaos power to be sure.
>>133080768The Archie Sonic Encylopedia and Encyclospeedia are two different books.
>>133080736The hex was just a mind control thing, it also blocked the Brotherhood's connection to the emerald.
>>133080798What's interesting about it? Guy who can time travel beats guy who has specifically been beaten by tim travel, a win condition DB loves. You are being dishonest.
>>133080814I'm sure they are but I didn't know there were 2, just that Solaris isn't in the Archie comic and is only in an Encyclopedia.
>>133075756>Xenoverse Trunks vs Archie SilverHoly shit, never thought we would have seen the xeno crew in death battle.
>>133080808>And it gets even murkier considering Master Mogul needed 3 supers to beat him while in a state that should have been significantly above the state he was in when he created Solaris. Who needed the same amount of effort to be defeated himself.Master Mogul with Dimitri-Enerjak's powers necessitated direct intervention from the Ancient Walkers themselves to stop, which is in part why they started dying. The Ancient Walkers being the single undisputed masters of the Chaos Force across the entire multiverse (and possibly beyond) even well after their deaths. He wasn't beaten by the Super forms alone. If the Ancient Walkers had ever given a shit before then, they could have solved literally every problem in the setting.
>>133078830They really gotta stop using Superman to scale. Obviously Superman won all those fights. Superman has no limits
>>133080768>>133080786Wait... but since 06 events were retconned out of existence, that would also mean Silver has no idea how to use Chaos Emeralds, use Chaos control and how to transform into his Super form. And no access to Emeralds as well.He shouldn't even have access to his super form for all intents and purposes. He's should be royally fucked, but Death Battle will probably ignore that altogether and give him Super Silver for no reason anyways.
>>133080768>>13308085206s plot wouldn't have happened the same way even if it was in the comics.
>>133080852Even base Silver due to scaling to Archie Sonic would have immeasurable speed, meaning Trunks couldn't touch him. And all a bloodlusted Archie Silver would have to do is time travel to when Bulma was pregnant with him and off her. Even if he loses the Super Form, he's still an insurmountable OCP for Heroes Trunks.
>>133080843Oh right. Forgot about that. But Sonic, Tails and Knuckles still kept up with him iirc. And that's enough to throw the wrench into scaling.Actually, it supports the idea that Super Sonic doesn't scale to Knuckles Enerjak at all. If Knuckles was > Dimitri and Mogul with Dimitri's powers on top of his own couldn't be beaten by 3 supers without Ancient Walker's assistance, there's no way in hell Sonic alone would have done anything to fully powered Knuckles Enerjak.
>>133078830Because Apocalypse is stronger than Captain Marvel and Superman. Keep up
I mean like Sonic but this elephant in a suit seems kind of stupid. I've never even seen him before and he's the single strongest Archie Sonic character? Is he just unpopular?
>>133080953He is essentially furry Vandal Savage.>and he's the single strongest Archie Sonic character?That would be Titan Tails.
>>133080872Yeah, but the events of 06 were then erased from existence just like it happened in the game. Super Silver literally never happened in Archie by that logic and Silver probably has no idea that he can even go Super.>>133080885>Even base Silver due to scaling to Archie Sonic would have immeasurable speed, meaning Trunks couldn't touch him. Are we gonna talk about this shit from the point of how much sense it makes or from Death battle's PoV? I'm sure nobody here actually thinks Silver or even Sonic is anywhere near immeasurable speed without some outright nonsense, but I don't know if there's any point of arguing about that.>And all a bloodlusted Archie Silver would have to do is time travel to when Bulma was pregnant with him and off her. Even if he loses the Super Form, he's still an insurmountable OCP for Heroes Trunks.But he wouldn't know who Bulma is, when exactly Trunks was born and where to find him. His travels in time required prior research, and even then it took him like 100 issues to figure out who the traitor was. No way he's pulling that shit on Trunks.That said, why exactly didn't he travel back before Sally was converted once again? Does his time travel have some limitation that I missed?
>>133080974Titan Tails isn't technically a single character.
>>133080953Akshually he's a mammoth, not elephant. But yeah, at his strongest he's leaps and bounds above everyone else in Archie not counting Titan Tails.
>>133080978He went back in time because he thought Antoine was the traitor, and Mogul forbid him to come back if he didn't find the traitor because his constant time travel was fucking up the future, so he was just kinda stuck there.
>>133080978>I'm sure nobody here actually thinks Silver or even Sonic is anywhere near immeasurable speed without some outright nonsense, but I don't know if there's any point of arguing about that.Sonic actually gets that speed from the stated distances he has to cross to reach individual points on interest on the Cosmic Interstate.>That said, why exactly didn't he travel back before Sally was converted once again? Does his time travel have some limitation that I missed?Silver's time travel is accurate to where he needs to be, but does not drop him off at the exact moment shit hits the fan. If his appearance in Light Mobius is anything to go by, it's generally him getting a 'feeling' that something will go wrong in a specific era then travelling there.
I just want Zenitsu vs Usopp and for them to say something retarded like Usopp is a light speed timer.
>>133081117Are those Archie Sonic characters too?
>>133080953he's pretty strong
>>133081043>Sonic actually gets that speed from the stated distances he has to cross to reach individual points on interest on the Cosmic Interstate.Could these signs even be taken at a face value ? I recall Blaze just leasurely walking through the interstate in Sonic Universe. And I'm sure other characters that are nowhere near Sonic in speed traversed it as well. >>133080504>The only thing the Eggmobile crash did is prevent him from bringing back the original multiverse perfectly. The Chaos Control still went off and recreated the entire multiverse, even without him focusing on it.But it did fuck up the fine details of his universe and basically nuked the rest of the multiverse, erasing tons of people, races, items of powers and concepts (like Chaos Force) from existence. And that was with just Eggmobile bumping Sonic. This isn't something he'd use in combat and it's a massive liability if he does, because the fuck up might erase him from existence as well. >The version of Sonic who did was also the original preboot one. The effects of the SGW changing everything only come about AFTER the CC and Eggmobile thing.Nah, at the very start of WC Eggman and Wily set off the Genesis Wave that warped Sonic's universe into game one post-Generations and the Mega Man one into game one post MM-10. During the crossover they briefly got glimpses of their original timelines when Shadow Chaos Control's, but that's about it. So for all intents in purposes that was a different Sonic version. I'm decently sure Sonic gradually lost his memories of the crossover later too.
OK but how does Draygon from Super Metroid hold up?
>>133081522Someone has thought about fucking this thing
>>133081354Not sure about Blaze, but most of the other characters take vehicles. Like planes that can explicitly keep pace with Sonic and such. Thry never walk it themselves.
>>133081282The fucking hilarity of this
Which is best?Ultraman vs>Silver Surfer>Goku>Superman
Who would be a fitting opponent for the Idol of Millions? Both thematically and power-wise.
>>133081759He stomps the shit out of Godzilla already. We need someone more on his level
>>133081754The Rock.Havel Knight.Hulk.
>>133081797Is nowhere near close to Thing power-wise.>>133081784>The Rock.>Havel Knight.Explain
>>133075756Uh, I did not expect the ending. I really thought Black Adam was going to win.
>>133075756Does Xeno Trunks have anything bullshit up his sleeve? Because unless Archie Silver is significantly weaker than Archie Sonic, this feels like an utter stomp.
FUCK YOU MOUSESHITTERS!!! BLACK ADAM SHOULDVE WON BUT NOOOOOOOOOO YOU GUYS HAD TO FUCKING RIG IT SO FUCKING APOC WON. BLACK ADAM SCALES TO CAPTAIN MARVEL WHO SCALES TO FUCKING SUPERMAN WHY DIDNT THEY DO THAT? WHAT THE FUCK A FUCKING HERALD LOST GOD FUCKING DAMMIT IM DONE WITH THIS FRANCHISE
>>133078890Is it really fair to scale Trunks to the XENO MC's?Like you said the Xeno MC's are SUPER powerful much more than Xeno Trunk. Though I guess he does help us out in the games a lot so...
>>133081820>The Rock.>Havel Knight.Explain
>>133081977>Is it really fair to scale Trunks to the XENO MC's?Considering the full amount of scaling they'll give Silver, I think it's only fair. Then again, that would mean Xeno Trunks could scale to->A boosted SS4 Goku and Vegeta>Whis, Beerus, Champa, and Vados>Hit, Full Power Jiren, Dyspo and GOD Toppo>A boosted DB Broly and DBS Broly>Boosted SSB's >Full Power Mira (would've destroyed the universe and possibly even dimensions if he wasn't stopped)>A boosted Golden Frieza and CoolerAnd that's not including the side quest characters you could potentially scale him to as well.
>>133078890>He use>IESLB>SSG>No JStart running.
>>133081754Cliff Steele, the Robotman of DC's Doom Patrol. The men trapped in monstrous inhuman bodies that try to become human again.
>>133081751golden age Superman without retard scaling IMO
WHEN is the REN?
>>133081637Found the Blaze scan. Didn't Destructix move through the Interstate as well? Zone Cops also patrol it all the time and I don't recall many of them having any kind of notable speed.
>>133082204They want to keep superman alive.
>>133082204He's fighting Doomsday.
>>133082140That works thematically, but isn't Cliff a bit underpowered for that? I recall Black Adam punching right through him. Ben would turn him into scrap if that's where he caps.
>>133082369In a recent podcast, Flex Mentallo was given the feat of having rebooted the DC multiverse by Swan. There is some scaling bullshit waiting for Cliff, and maybe the rest of the Doom Patrol. It is fairly like that if they do Cliff vs Ben, they will be considered to be on par.
>>133082204>Black Adam just ate shit MMHbros... I feel unsafe...
>>133075968w-where are the fractals and aleph Tails I was promised?
>>133081931Apparently the Keysword can do some shit
>>133082532Silver is so fucked because of this sword its not even funny.Archie goes 0-2. Also fuck archie anyway.
I refuse to believe Marvel's apex jobber will win against any match up, Adam or otherwise.
>>133082612If I'm not mistaken, doesn't the sword need to be fully charged in order to do anything? It's not like Trunks can energize it either, since it required three other beings to be fully viable.
>keyblade is what decides the victorSo it is written
>>133082681It is thematically a better fight. The aliens who lost their families and became one of the strongest members of a team of legit superheroes while not being the leader.
>>133082746But Piccolo has a ton of cool powers at his disposal, making for a much more interesting back-and-forth.
>>133082861Makes me think if Piccolo is now stronger than Jiren in his Orange form
What are the consequences of singular DC universes requiring 2.59527e+1438 times more energy than it takes to destroy our actual universe?
>>133082861I actually find the contrast between Jiren's pure strength brute hammer and J'onn's multifaceted and versatile Swiss army knife to be pretty interesting. In any event, it's more interesting than the fight between Piccolo's relatively limited pseudo-magic and ki powers going up against the fact that J'onn can do pretty much anything Piccolo can do but better as well as a lot of things Piccolo can't. In addition to the probable stat advantage J'onn has.
>>133082983How many zeroes
>>133076401It has its uses. One of my favorite gags from Futurama is the revelation that (at least initially) there were only two parallel universes: the normal one, and one where everyone's cowboys.
>>133082987But Jiren doesn't have a strength advantage over MM
>>133075756What the fuck, Apocalypse won? I thought people here said DB was biased
>>133083076I didn't say he did. He might, he might not. But his approach is diametrically different, which makes the contrast interesting. Jiren is straightforward to J'onn multifaceted, which is a starker difference than Piccolo's powerset being a diet version of J'onn's.
>>133083079It's still capeshit
>>133082983>using throwaway golden age concepts that have never been referenced again in conjunction with a throwaway ignorant line from the current age about the rate of expansion of the big bang to wank the size of DC what manner of autism is this?
>>133082435But... Cliff shouldn't scale to Flex Mentallo's in any way, shape or form? Their powersets are completely different. Robotman is a metal dude who punches hard, Flex is a borderline reality warper. I'm pretty sure Flex is so physically weak he can't even lift two tons.
I just realized they worked in the eyebrow
>they are actually doing Trunks vs Silver because of their one single similarity being "muh future">Sonic series getting another LWhy don't they just give Eggman another chance already? His last fight occurred over a decade ago and it ended in what was essentially a no contest.
>>133083407Silver is literally based off Trunks
>>133083388And we just had an episode where Apocalypse was scaled to full power Phoenix, user. What do you think is going to happen?
>>133083412...fuck, I can't argue with that.
>>133083407Archie isnt Sonic.
Warcraft fight when?
Who would be a good opponent for my boy Cryptosporidium?I was thinking Invader Zim, but that's too obvious, plus the fight might be too one-sided
>>133083407Sega's internal bio on Silver for Sonic 06 literally stated "think Trunks from DBZ"
You know what sucks?A character you wanted to see struggle but ultimately triumph completely curbstomp their foe.Like, I want to see them fucking earn that W. That's just unsatisfying
>>133083466Probably soon, Lich King against Sauron. Unless they do Sauron vs Voldemort, which I have learned isn't as out of the realm of possibility as I initially thought.
Give Bass.Exe a fitting opponent
>>133081282>tossed into the ground and lying in pain>before you can get powered back up you get a boot into your face, only able to let out an "oh shit" beforehand>the dude, who invaded your city and home btw, proceeds to stomp you out for the next 10 seconds, literally breaking your face and leaving it a bloodied pulp>he briefly ends this torment, only to fly you high into the air>you look out through your bloodied eyes onto your country and its people, everything is destroyed and the people who admire you are being killed by robots>The dude responsible for this reminds you of this fact and that you could not do anything to stop it, laughs maniacally>he then fries you to a crisp, melting your eyes and charring whatever's left of your face, finally killing you>Drops your corpse as he laughs once more. His victory complete and the great nation of Kahndaq raped and annihilatedKwab. Maybe don't kill your nephew out of spite next time, ya retarded piece of shit.
>>133083407It's to throw a bone to Dragon Ball fans after two losses in a row. They'll have Eggman beat Bowser when they finally do that match though, so they can act like they don't hate the Sonic franchise
>>133083743BlackWarGreymon, the disobedient viral super projects.
Could he take on Dante?
Name a joke the hosts did that made you actually kinda laugh
>>133083466It would be very amusing to see Swank try to powerscale Warcraft characters lol.
>>133075968Mongul best feat was destroying zones once at a time.
>>133083856when they called capeshit capeshit
>>133083407Blame Sonic furries for forming a fake rivalry with DBZ because Sonic shamelessly stole ideas from it. They have to use Archie fanfiction to give Sonic characters a chance against Dragonball.Bowser beats Eggman too lol.
>>133083856Broomstick's version of Gamera's theme song that implied that Gamers is a pedophile. Honestly the only Death Battle joke I can remember off the bat.
>>133084013>Gamers*Gamera, dumb autocorrect
>>133083856The GTA drunk driving PSA from one of the really early episodes
>>133084028I mean, you weren't wrong...
>>133083856>Boomstick thinking that zoo animals will maul you to death if you speak>Boomstick's rant on how time is a manmade concept>HIS NAME IS T-H-A-T SPACE M-A-N!
>>133083856The bear pun duel
>>133084013Kinda falls flat with the whole "Sacrifice your life for kids" thing, but I see where you're coming from
>>133083969Archie comics are official, for what it's worth. No worse than using GT, movie or Super feats for DB.
>>133083852Is he at least wall level? That's where Dante caps out.
>>133083449I see the animespic is already coping...
When are IDW Sonic characters getting a death battle?
>>133082291The Destructix used a vehicle I'm pretty sure. The one time I recall where this wasn't the case, Sonic literally carried Scourge like a sack of potatoes back to jail.
>>133083407It's funny how you think Heroes Trunks even stands a chance, when his only shot is if he can speedblitz Silver before he does literally anything or if they just flat out refuse to use any scaling for Silver.
>>133082676It does. It literally requires three entities who Trunks doesn't scale to at all in order to amp it up, meaning its full power is outside help of the highest order.Also, the only thing the Keysword does is weaken characters, specifically those of the Demon Realm. So it shouldn't have any effect on Silver whatsoever since he's not a demon. And once again, Silver can literally throw it into space nd Trunks will be fucked out of luck.
>>133078959That cute girl can solo One Piece, MHA, Naruto, and Bleach's main cast. Hell, I think even Dodoria can solo One Piece, MHA, and Naruto.
>>133082681Piccolo is orange now meaning the main theme is fucked
>>133084511>DodoriaRaditz can solo them
>>133084277Never because outside of Surge every one of them is really, REALLY low tier. Maybe if you're generous with Starline but even then
DBZ is weird in that it got into cosmic bodies autism very very quickly which puts it over most anime, but then never ascended past planet level, inexplicably. it actually kept regressing in the Cell saga (I will shoot you in the head if you tell me the androids positively needed to be planet+ level)
>>133084511Chrona is an incompetent boob. She couldn't even handle the simple task of observing time and making sure it ran smoothly, anyone with an I.Q higher than a coconut would demolish her.
>>133084536Oh yeah, that's also right. Piccolo's most powerful form isn't even green anymore. It means Jiren and J'onn both being the traditional colors of aliens, with the newer Jiren being gray and the older J'onn being green in accordance with the periods of time each color was associated with aliens, is more poignant.
>>133084603The girl in the gif is Zangya, not Chrona though.
>>133084656Why do all dragon ball characters have the same face
>>133083856Baby launcher and Wiz finding it offensive for the wrong reasons
>>133084573If you said Nappa then maybe. One Piece has gotten past Raditz in power scaling.
>>133084656Oh I thought you fucked up and replied to the wrong post, carry on.>>133084679Because Tory based all of his DB characters after his Dragon Quest characters.
>>133081282Too slow.>>133080807Season Finale or next season's premiere.>>133083466If they go with Voldemort for Sauron, maybe they can bring back Nightmare for Arthas.>>133083543>which I have learned isn't as out of the realm of possibility as I initially thought.What makes you say that?
>>133075756So this is an apology fight to Archie Sonic fans, and after Trunks loses they will have Xeno Goku or Vegeta beat another OP character as an apology to DBH fans, then they will make an apology fight for the franchise that lost and it will keep going. This getting boring.
>>133084761You lol. But I am being serious.
>>133076105Their camera can handle Chuck and Segata destroying the universe, but not a simple stomp from Apocalypse?
>>133084862they had to sell that camera after they lost budget due to Deadpool vs Mask
>>133084886I guess ignorance is bliss.
>>133082654>I refuse to believe Marvel's apex jobber will win against any match upWell yeah, Thanos lost against Darkseid.
>>133084752>So this is an apology fight to Archie Sonic fans, and after Trunks loses they will have Xeno Goku or Vegeta beat another OP character as an apology to DBH fans, then they will make an apology fight for the franchise that lost and it will keep going. This getting boring.At least they get apology matches. Imagine being a Bomberman, Kratos, Doomguy, Tifa, or Bayonetta, or Team Fortress fan. Well, Kratos deserved to lose, but even he also deserves a 2nd chance against someone else, after all these time. While Bleach and Power Rangers are cursed. But you pretty much hit the nail on the head. That's how death battle operates for the most part. Balancing Ws and Ls, unless they hate or don't care for a character, like Hulk, Luthor, and Captain Marvel.
>>133084905Yes, you prove that well
>>133084999>DoomguyA 2nd Doom episode seems like an inevitability given how much the new games changed the series and how well received they are. >TifaI thought it was agreed that Sephiroth winning was the FF7 apology episode?
>>133084999Ichigo might get a rematch if Bleach characters get new feats in the anime. Kubo talked about how fights would be expanded and you'd see things that weren't in his manga. Also, Bleach had a chapter talking about Hell like a year ago, so if Kubo wants to, he can still continue the manga.
>>133085058Okay, I'll humor you.Raditz has a power level of 1200.Rob Lucci, converted from One Piece's own power scale from the one arc they used the system, has a power level of 2000. And that's not even getting into the feat differences, that's just numbers.
>>133085134Isn't Ichigo seen as more powerful than Naruto nowadays? I always got the impression that between Bleach, Naruto, One Piece, and MHA characters, the former has the more powerful cast.
>>133083856>Well, there is a wall
>>133084862Well they did claim that Apocalypse is several times universal, so they're technically being consistent.
>>133085159Bleach does have a more powerful cast with hax abilities. The problem is Ichigo just jobbed for the final arch, where Naruto actually got feats in his last arc, the movie the Last, and even Boruto with Baryon mode. We don't know how strong Ichigo is compared to Aizen or Yhwach. Even got humilated by Askin. When Ichigo was about to go Bankai, Yhwach broke his powers, so we have no idea what Ichigo can do. It's so bad, people wonder if he's any stronger than he was from when he fought Aizen. Kubo was rushing hard.
>>133085142Anon please, this is a serious discussion
>>133085221I'll take that as your concession for being wrong.
>>133085239Whatever you need to tell yourself
>>133085202Correct me I'm wrong, but the popular shounen main cast verses go:Bleach > Fairy Tail (100 year quest) > Naruto > One Piece > MHA > KnY?That's my general perception.
>>133085280Math is Math.
Can Black Adam beat him in the box office of ideals?
>>133085259Naruto is still slightly higher than Fairy Tail for now due to shit like the moon slicing feat and others. But this is otherwise correct.
>>133085321Both will be flops.
>>133085321>Can Black Adam beat him in the box office of ideals?I think it will make between 500 and 700 million dollars. I'm more worried about Shazam's movie numbers.
>>133085413Is Shazam 2 still being made? I heard it was March, but now I don't know
>Little Xeno Trunks discussion happening beyond "Keysword Lock GG" because Heroes is that boringkek
>>133085413I feel that Endgame was the real finale of the MCU and the rest is just trying to jack off after you blew your load. Save for NWH
>>133085514It's fanfiction vs fanfiction. It's just gonna come down to "muh gorillaversal scaling" and whatever DB thinks is fair use. No one cares about Heroes and Sonicfags cling desperately to Archie since its the only thing that makes them relevant in vs debates.
>>133085630To be honest, most of the Sonic fanbase on /vg/ hates Archie.
>>133084731>What makes you say that?I forgot how many basic normies would suggest Voldemort vs Sauron. There's a lot of them. I'm all for it, if it means we get Arthas vs Archaon in the future.
This was an acceptable outcome for Apoc vs Adam. It's not just a matter of pure strength (in which case Adam would win), but more so that Apoc's ability to absorb energy and become stronger was a solid counter. DB didn't fuck this one up.
>>133086349That death was cruel as shit though
>>133076129>Otto and his serverWhat's your problem with him and his server?
>>133085588>trying to jack off after you blew your loadit's doable.
>>133085630True the Sonicverse never recovered from CHADrio retrieving his stolen win.
>>133086502You get what I mean though right?
>>133085584Half human demons with human mothers who fight others of their kind, also being over the top with powers
>>133081133>jaaack! When is it my turn to fight in a death battle?
>Silver the HedgehogI'll admit I'm only a surface level Sanicfag but I had to do a double-take, I thought I was getting pranked. Is Silver really that popular? His intro in '06 was awful, way worse than Shadow ever was, and I haven't seen him improve THAT much. Is he really just that major in Sonic media now?
>>133081945Stop acting like mousekeks, anonThey won't get it, as they lack self-awareness
>>133087047>Is Silver really that popular?Nope. Tails, Knuckles, Amy, and even Rouge are more popular than him. Silver hasn't been relevant in years. But that's game Silver, and we're using Archie Silver, would be even less relevant to the public.
>>133087096I do appreciate them doing something that's different rather than the popular thing, a lot really, but what weird drunken bet was placed to where Silver was the pick?
>>133083282Everything is canon, non-reader
>>133083435>>133083412I mean, Cliff's power set is more 'get ripped apart, then put back together' than it is punching anything lol
>>133083543Venger. It could always be Venger
>>133087096Eh, Archie Silver was the only time he had any niche or personality, I can see why they'd use it if they wanted to use him at all.
>>133087244What's he like in Archie?
>>133076724What level of cope are you on, user?
>>133087147at this point "non-reader" is a buzzword
>>133087377'Buzzword' is the buzziest of buzzwords around here
>>133087171And Apocalypse's powerset and usual role is "lose", but look where we are now.
>>133087436Piss poor argumentation anonApocalypse' power set is not 'lose', and losing is what villains do in capeshitGet ahold of your emotions
I have always wondered, how do we make the most broken OP bullshit character that can never lose no matter what bullshit you throw at it?
>>133083856>Yknow we've sent so many people to that sun we really should have a timeshare...
>>133087475Hey, user said Cliff's powerset was "more 'get ripped apart, then put back together' than it is punching anything lol". I'm just pointing out an equivalent situation that's as easily dismissed. Cliff's role is fairly obviously being the muscle of the team. the fact he gets broken a lot shouldn't count against him in Death Battle any more than Apocalypse's very frequent losses.
>>133087535What like Power-Man?
>>133087145Because Trunks needs a time traveler opponent, so Sonic's Trunks ripoff will do
>>133087664They could have used Cable, but then people would have complained about another Capeshit match up, I guess.
>>133086349>Apoc can drain the li--
>>133087791>again reading it in manga order by accidentgoddamn
>>133087791>>133086349>Apoc will take the lightning and then he wi--(Well okay, this is probably a Billy only move since Adam was explicitly an empowered Teth Adam and not Teth Adam plus a magic other)
>>133087840Forgot the pic
>>133076105I’m honestly amazed. This fight wasn’t just a win for Apoc; it was an Omni-Man vs Homelander-tier (literal) stomp against a Superman-tier character. It’s hilarious how absolutely NOBODY, on ANY forum thought that Apoc even stood a chance. Then the fight releases, and not only does he win, but Adam barely even lays a scratch on him before getting one of the most brutal deaths in the show.
>>133087791This instance is actually a really good argument for Apoc not being able to drain Adam, since his powers come from the rock of eternity too.
>>133087903Yeah I don't think people are really realizing how ridiculously contrarian this episode is. Even if Apocalypse wins by the conditions they laid out, it should have been a fight where Adam was winning but Apocalypse turned it around. But that's not what we got at all.
>>133087047His only really story relevant games are 06, and the Rivals games which are very unpopular.
>>133075756Just watched it, I thought Adam was going to win. Can Apocalypse actually beat Adam?
>>133088011If you ignore speed, scale apoc to phoenix and reverse the living lightning absorption verdict from Carol vs. Billy.
>>133088048Adam can’t master the lightning like Billy
>>133087535Can solo SCP.There, done. You’re automatically invincible in the eyes of battleboarders
>>133088064He wouldn't need to.
>>133088011If you assume Apocalypse=the Phoenix Force (which lets be real, is bullshit, Nate reliably kicks his ass and he's sub-Surfer) and that Adam can't recall his own lightning, sure.>>133088064I actually --can-- buy this, but it seems extremely conjectural.I think they just fucked up, especially when they said the TO virus and molecular manipulation would work on Adam which is LMFAO levels of wrong.
>>133087963Yeah. At the start, I was expecting the whole “character who starts off winning is the one who will lose” trope that they love to pull. And then he just kept winning. And never stopped.
>>133088079Yes he does because Billy can drain it back. Also Carol is bas at absorbing magic
>>133088097>I actually --can-- buy this, but it seems extremely conjectural.It’s not like he has anything other than just spreading the lightning. Billy’s been able to lock him out of it and change his word and other times he has been drained of his magic and unable to call it back like Billy did when Sivana sapped him
>>133087903Homelander's death was more painful but Adam's felt more humilliating, the whole fight was just him getting btfo and being forced to watch Apoc destroy his kingdom
Why was this fight so... angry?I feel like we've had much more evil characters than Apocalypse show more restaint, or at least ended things quickly. It almost felt like someone involved in the creative team was venting anger directly. Did someone just really hate Adam? I'm a marvel fan but I didn't really think Apocalypse had that many fanboys, so I don't assume it's that.
>>133087985Apparently he's not totally insufferable in that Sonic team racers game.
>>133088141That game is written like a weird parody at best.
>>133088131I think it was a combination of them wanting to kill and humiliate a legit Superman level character and them wanting something to point to and say SEE SEE WE AREN'T BIASED.Also yeah, Black Adam is a fucking obnoxious poochie and everyone that reads comics is tired of Johns not only shoving his ass into event he writes but pressuring him to be this big --thing-- in adaptation media.
>>133088118Adam got cucked
>>133088150I guess that's why he's good in it.
>>133088159>Also yeah, Black Adam is a fucking obnoxious poochie and everyone that reads comics is tired of Johns not only shoving his ass into event he writes but pressuring him to be this big --thing-- in adaptation media.It’s especially sucky that Billy gets pushed aside for this shit
>>133088131Considering how much of a cunt Black Adam is in the comics I wouldn't be surprised. It's pretty fucked showing him his country being razed to the ground before he dies but looking at how badly he's fucked over others, there's some cruel kind of satisfying justice behind that.
>>133085359Moon slicing? That’s not canon. Only canon is Naruto part 1 and 2. I would say Naruto is weaker then MHA. Bulma with her tech can solo all of Naruto. Bleach is the strongest of all those shonen that guy listed. I agree there.
>>133088159I only dislike him from taking so much attention from Dr. Sivana and Mr. Mind. I mean Adam was literally a one off in the original Captain Marvel run while Sivana and Mind were his real adversaries. But you wouldn't know that with how things are now.
>>133088170Movie is canon to the official sequelWhy don’t you just pretend Z is not canon while you’re at it
>>133087258He leans heavily into the "naive idiot" role for a while, but does have his moments of genuine heroics.I think the real reason people like Archie Silver is that he ends up not only actually accomplishing shit (thanks to all the Dark Mobius stuff), but he faces genuine consequences for fucking up (i.e everyone in Sonic's time thinking he's an absolute dipshit to the point where Sonic literally drags him across New Mobotropolis), and ends up getting a team of his own in the Secret Freedom FightersBasically, Archie Silver actually has shit to do unlike Game SilverOf course that's only talking about pre-reboot Archie Silver. In the post reboot he's less of an idiot but does still get a team in his arc that consists of a telepathic tenrec named Gold, and Von Schlemmer from AOSTH, and that Silver had quite a few fans>>133087047Silver is Trunks' most popular matchup. Also while he isn't as popular as the bigger Sonic characters, he has a pretty vocal fanbase
>>133088159You can do that all without it being so strangely cruel. It felt like watching a temper tantrum in animated form. I can't think of another DB that compares.And I'm sorry, but even as a Marvel fanboy I find it hard to find Apocalypse cool. He's just such a dork and a jobber who's been demoted to a lesser Omega over the years. So it's hard for me to imagine this was just a fanboy's way of getting off.
>>133088170>Bleach is the strongest of all those shonen that guy listed.
>>133088192Does he ever get to make friends in the friendzone?
>>133087535Use the highest maths possible.
>>133088213>You can do that all without it being so strangely cruel. It felt like watching a temper tantrum in animated form. I can't think of another DB that compares.Hulk vs Doomsday felt really cruel by the end. Something about it always felt vindictive>>133088236I mean, in terms of the pre-reboot you could definitely count the Secret Freedom Fighters (especially Shard) as his friends, and the post-reboot, he kinda has friends in Gold and Schlemmer (which sadly never got expanded upon because lolcancelled)He's also friendly with the Light/Dark Mobius people but he doesn't hang out with them afterNever meets Blaze oddly enough. In fact, he never meets her in a comic before IDW
>>133088262Sometimes a hero dies
>>133083852If you consider attack animations, item descriptions and the implications of item world literally, Disgaea is absolutely insane. Dante doesn't compare even with wank.
>>133088262Silver always felt bizarrely powerful for Sonic but also a total jobber. Did they ever explain how he came to exist or where he's from other than 'muh future'?
>>133088213Omni-Man VS Homelander is just as stompy but at least John got to kill Nolan's wife
>>133088167YES.>>133088169That to. He's DC's Namor in a lot of ways especially with how many get-out-of-consequences cards he plays.>>133088213It's probably the most humiliating and cruel ending in all of Death Battle, even more than Drac making Ganon squeal like Deliverance and Darkseid sanctioning Thanos.While OS is objectively the worst from an individual perspective, Adam's involves him watching the people that worship him as a hero-god die to robots. He also, somehow, dies to his own lightning after being forced to look at Kahndaq in flames. It's the fact that his humiliating death entails the deaths of innocents he was earnestly trying to protect that makes it so stinging. It's not all that dissimilar from watching Apoc do this to Superman and Metropolis or Batman and Gotham.
>>133088267I mean yeah but the specific way that he died felt gratuitous for some reason. Although I just remembered Charizard vs Wargreymon exists and that's definitely way more meanspirited>>133088279>Silver always felt bizarrely powerful for Sonic but also a total jobber. Did they ever explain how he came to exist or where he's from other than 'muh future'?His past is never explained, but the comics do explain the future he's inIn the pre-reboot he's in a ruined future hanging out with Knuckes' descendant and former villain Mammoth Mogul, learning how to do time travel shit to save the future and later join the Knights of Kronos (basically the off screen guardians of the Time Stones)In the post reboot, he's from a dystopic future city known as Onyx City and there's a lot of shit going on there
>>133088279In Archie, Silver's future is canonically a weird slurry of every timeline where all timelines and realities inevitably meet as the endpoint. This means that he pretty much exists outside of a linear, coherent flow of time. It's never actually explained how he was born or anything, jsut that he comes from this future.
>>133088316Archie Silver was endearing because Flynn leaned into him being a hapless idiot.
>>133088328Yes, he made his uselessness a feature rather than the result of SoJ's own incompetence.
>Hey Archie Sonic, what's your favorite Linkin Park song? Mine's PAPERCUT
>>133088316>Silver, one of the worst parts of Sonic 2006, one of the worst Sonic games ever, comes from a place where all Sonic timelines end in disasterkek
>>133088267Except when you’re Hulk, in which case you have infinite lives from Hell
>>133088409It doesn't seem like other writers are really sticking with that run, unfortunately.
>>133088423>>133088409The Green Door was Ewing only. He made sure to close them all
Would this have been any closer of a matchup than what we got? It’s got the whole “villains who fight to lead and protect their countries” theme going for it, which seems a lot more poetic than “guys who are kind of Egyptian”.
>>133088473Doom's already had a comparatively recent DB, and I feel like he'd stomp Adam about as bad. Namor or Black Panther feel closer
>>133088473Same thing happens but Doom leans into the power steal move and gives himself a lightning bolt insignia.I AM...BLACK DOOM!
>>133088501>I AM...BLACK DOOM!Somewhere, in a distant corner of the multiverse, a hedgehog sneezes
>>133088501>BLACK DOOM!Shadow's cocking his MP5 as you say that
>>133088469>Retcon it so many many times through Hulk's history, he actually did die and came back to life>End run by removing this abilityHe literally retconned it so Hulk now lacks and an ability he has had throughout his entire history up until now. Why?I get if it was just a temporary ability for that run, but he wrote it so it altered Hulk's entire history then removed it anyways. These things DID kill Hulk, but he got better. But now he doesn't get better. So essentially he lost a shitton of durability feats to hype up his regeneration feats, then lost the regeneration feats, leaving him in a worse spot than before.
>>133084391>The Destructix used a vehicle I'm pretty sureApparently they were not. Did the Moebius shitters use a vehicle when they travelled to mainline Mobius in early STH issues, back when Scourge was still just an Anti-Sonic?
>>133088473If OP's outcome occurred with Doom instead of Apocalypse, then I would buy it. I don't as it stands, and I see it as one of the more erroneous death battles.
>>133088575>Did the Moebius shitters use a vehicle when they travelled to mainline Mobius in early STH issues, back when Scourge was still just an Anti-Sonic?Yes. Way back when, they took a vehicle to get to Mobius, but I'm pretty certain they just broke apart shortly after those events on mainline Mobius.
>>133086349At some point you guy must learn that they treat marvel and DC herald as equivalent, they didn't even bother giving them numbers this episode.
>>133088637Apoc is not herald level.
>>133077062The final boss of one piece just got a feat. It was only island level.
>>133078774>So of course, Death Battle will have Trunks win somehow.Yes. Ben has a huge mega bias against silver. His fate is sealed.
>>133088637They didn't treat Billy and Carol as equals. But then again, Carol being a herald level might be inconsistent. She was trading blows with OF Thor a couple of weeks ago though...
>>133088167The entire fucking mythos and its tone and history gets pushed aside for this bullshitIt's completely enraging
>>133078774Deathbattle subscribes to the highest levels of spic wank for Dragonball, I doubt even the most adamant Sonic autist could make an argument for the niggerillions of times multiversal DB powerscalers come up with.
>>133088501Wanna hear you saying this like you mean it, Otto lol
Daily reminder that Archieshit is not canon anymore.
>>133089041> I doubt even the most adamant Sonic autist could make an argument for the niggerillions of times multiversal DB powerscalers come up with.Just last thread, we had scaling for Archie Silver that put him well beyond infinitely multiversal based on Enerjak/Mogul scaling. At minimum. Heroes Trunks himself only has very nebulous scaling to infinitely multiversal and actually gets his shit pushed in by those types of opponents (Mechikabura) without a weapon that specifically hard-counters them, amped by three beings who are vastly beyond him.He also has the massive glaring weakness of ceasing to exist if even the slightest thing goes wrong in the past of his timeline. Against a time traveler whose time travel literally sets him at a point where he can actively take advantage of the ability to butterfly things away.
Xeno Trunks is definitely winning. Even more of a stomp if they gave him a keyblade.
I hate both Sonic and dragonball so I don’t know who to root for
>>133089185>Xeno Trunks is definitely winning.Based on? >Even more of a stomp if they gave him a keyblade.The Keysword literally does not effect things that aren't demons. It also can't reach the level of power to do so against infinitely multiversal or above characters without being amped. Nor is it a killing weapon (the most it does is weaken Mechikabura so Chronoa can seal him away again).There's also literally nothing stopping Silver from throwing it into space and Trunks will never ever be able to find it again.
>>133089175>He also has the massive glaring weakness of ceasing to exist if even the slightest thing goes wrong in the past of his timeline.No he doesn't? Where the fuck are you getting this shit? People in xenoverse use the time machine all the time. The only problem that will happen if they use time scrolls which is a different method to time travel.
>>133089232>No he doesn't? Where the fuck are you getting this shit? XV2 literally has Trunks get paradoxed out of existence. The Trunks in Heroes is that exact same Trunks. Towa preventing the player from ever being summoned caused the Time Patrol to get absolutely fucked because they had no means to react to the timeline alteration.>People in xenoverse use the time machine all the time. Which likewise, does not work in the same manner it does in the mainline continuity.
>>133089041>for Dragonball>not for everyone
>>133089228>The Keysword literally does not effect things that aren't demons.Wrong>It also can't reach the level of power to do so against infinitely multiversal or above characters without being amped. Nor is it a killing weapon (the most it does is weaken Mechikabura so Chronoa can seal him away again).Wrong again. Mechikabura > Silver. Also the keysword is the one that seal. Not Chronoa.
>>133089232>>133089255XV2 also shows that the Time Patrol and Time Nest can't deal with or prevent Infinite Zamasu from assaulting their base of operations and having them literally all at his mercy. Entities who are entirely omnipresent throughout all of reality and Time explicitly hard-counter them.Meanwhile, Silver was 1/3 of the force that ended up bringing down Solaris, who is that exact level of entity.
>>133089205Whoever you'd rather see seething, root against emThat's the Holla Forums deathbattle way
>>133089255In DB there is two specific ways to time travel. Those using the time machine and those that affect the fabric of existence. If what you say is how time travel works in the game, we wouldn't have Xeno Goku and CC Goku existing together. Heck, the current arc of SDBH couldn't even happen. Stop spouting bullshit my man.
>>133089272>WrongYes. It was explicitly created by a god to seal the Demon Realm. This is stated both in the game and the manga.>Wrong again. Entirely correct. The Keysword literally couldn't do shit to Mechikabura without the amp (in the manga, Mechikabura beats Trunk's shit in so hard at the Demon Tower Summit that he outright LOSES it and has to reclaim it). The amp from Demigra, Chronoa, and Tokitoki is the only reason why it could do anything to Mechikabura.>Mechikabura > Silver. Based on?>Also the keysword is the one that seal. Not Chronoa.Wrong. The only thing the amped Keysword does is weaken Mechikabura enough that Chronoa can seal him away again. That's it; it explicitly couldn't seal him away on its own.
>>133089275>Solaris, who is that exact level of entity.Lol lmao
>>133089301>In DB there is two specific ways to time travel. Those using the time machine and those that affect the fabric of existence.And in the mainline continuity, we are shown that BOTH only cause new timelines to diverge from the original. In Heroes/XV, the opposite occurs. Any alteration to the timeline in the past affects the primary one. >If what you say is how time travel works in the game, we wouldn't have Xeno Goku and CC Goku existing together.They literally come from different timelines, dumbass. CC Goku even experienced shit that Xeno Goku never went through at all (like the Cooler movie, Tree of Might, and Bojack Unbound) because they didn't happen in his original timeline. >
>>133089105Which is why it's better.
>>133089316Even in 06, we're told that Solaris exists concurrently throughout the past, present, and future and threatens each at the exact same moment. That's the whole gimmick of his fight even; each of the Super Hedgehogs is fighting him in the past (Shadow), present (Sonic), and future (Silver) all at once and it's the only reason their combined force is enough to knock it out long enough for Sonic to go back in time with Elise and retcon it out of existence. In Archie, it now gets explicit infinitely multiversal scaling to the setting and possibly more on top of that because of Mogul scaling.
>>133089343Holy dumbass. If it normal time travel affect the present everytime there wouldn't be alternate timelines. Get it?
>>133089232>The only problem that will happen if they use time scrolls which is a different method to time travel.Not even remotely true. Literally any time traveler in Xenoverse (I.E the demons) were capable of fucking up time without usage of the scrolls.>B-but they use the same method as ChronaAccording to? It's stated literally nowhere that Demon time travel = scroll time travel, so don't try to pull that excuse.
Terry Silver vs Mr. McMahon
>>133089175>Just last thread, we had scaling for Archie Silver that put him well beyond infinitely multiversal based on Enerjak/Mogul scaling.And the discussion in both the last and this thread shot all of this scaling down.TL;DR it's not clear if Archie multiverse is even infinite and even if it is nobody, not even Master Mogul, came close to destroying all of it. Mogul at his peak was busting universes at a time and he was at that point leaps and bounds above any Enerjak or Super form because he absorbed the entirety of Chaos Force. Enerjak is, in turn, massively superior to Super Sonic because the latter couldn't do shit to Enerjak when he was massively drained, and needed an intervention of literal gods of the setting to beat a guy with powers of previous Enerjak despite being assisted by Tails and Knuckles in their respective super forms. Silver gets no scaling to Enerjak because the latter was toying with him, Silver admitted he was nowhere near Enerjak in power and the energy deflection thing was done through specifics of his power and not his raw power. Silver himself scales below Super forms because Super Scourge wrecked him and 6 other hedgehogs at the same time. And to top it all off, Silver shouldn't have an access to his own super form because the only timeline where he used it was literally erased from existence. The scaling should go something like:Master Mogul w/Chaos Force absorbed = universe busting >>>>> power gap >>>> Enerjak >> power gap >> drained Enerjak ~ Super Sonic ~ non-existent Super Silver >>>> power gap >>>> base Silver.But of course Death Battle is going to ignore all of this, give Silver a super form and scale it to biggaversal because they never actually read anything Archie related. Fuck.
>>133089388>If it normal time travel affect the present everytime there wouldn't be alternate timelines.Alternate timelines in Heroes/XV are entirely different universes in the infinite multiverse with their own separate histories; they aren't connected by anything other than the timestream, which high amounts of flagrant timeline alteration (like what Towa and Mira do) CAN impact, but it doesnt risk retconning them away unless they're trying to actively change that specific timeline or if they get their hands on say, Tokitoki which lets them skip the middle-man and affect everything at once.And the most powerful demons like Demigra or Mechikabura can completely threaten all timelines at once just by existing due to raw power and scale, so they don't need to go through any time travel to do it either.
>>133089419>it's not clear if Archie multiverse is even infinite It's explicitly stated to be so multiple times over.Not reading the rest of your drivel since you got even this most basic piece of hard fact wrong.
>>133089397XenonGoku also directly mentions that him going full power could fuck up time at one point:>"Since we don't know what kind of impact it'll have on time, I promised the kaioshin I wouldn't use this but... IT'S TIME I GOT SERIOUS TOO!"So literally anyone can fuck up time if they try hard enough.
Here it comes>trunks winsDeath battle are just a bunch of Sonic haters!! Sonic characters always lose!!>silver winsFuck youu DB! You guys just hate anime characters! Gringo comics always winn!!
>>133089429>It's explicitly stated to be so multiple times over.By characters who have no way of knowing that and no credibility when it comes to multiversal shenanigans. Factually a guy who was destroying universes one at a time was a threat to the entire multiverse.>Not reading the rest of your drivel since you got even this most basic piece of hard fact wrong.Are you, by any chance, the same schizo who argued that the building that was housing ever Tails in the universe was infinite in size? That would explain the hostility.
>>133089388There are a multitude of examples I could draw from that show normal time travel damaging the present. One such example is the entirety of Dragon Ball Xenoverse 1 and 2. It's funny actually, because in DBX the entire universe seems to operate under a single timeline. Your OC goes back in time on numerous occasions, and every time you're seen by Goku he goes "hey I've seen you before!". If going back in time (at least in Xenoverse) resulted in splintered timelines (which they don't), Goku would have no clue as to who you are.>>133089449>Dragon ball>Not a gringo comic
>>133087394it does contain "Buzz"
>>133089449Sonicfags won't even care. We've already settled that Trunks wins if they give him literally everything + infinitely multiversal scaling + ignoring his crippling weakness to time alteration of any sort whilst giving Silver no scaling whatsoever. Silver wins if they give him basically any scaling at all, since he not only has more shit but has more win cons paired with the ability to easily exploit Heroes Trunks' weakness to timeline fuckery.
>>133087791I don't see how this would hamper his ability to absorb the lightning. that's a limitation for this specific character by the looks of things
>>133089422You denying time travel make alternate time lines deny that the Future Trunks arc in DBZ ever happen. So, simple question. Does the Future Trunks arc happen or not?
>>133089486Why are you bringing up the Future Trunks arc when we are debating Xenoverse and Heroes?
>>133089462Cell arc happens in both. Who's right? Game who uses show or show?
Anyone else surprised Captain America still hasn't come back for a second episode? I dunno, it just feels like he deserves better than being the Bat Jobber's only win, in a throwaway episode that was just used as filler for another match getting delayed.
>>133089492Because it happened. Xenoverse doesn't exist in a vacuum. It continues upon the show.
>>133087791This is NOT an energy draining resistance feat. Read your own scan. This guy has tapped into the soul of the universe and as a result is absorbing energy from everything the big bang created. He had hoped that thus would allow him to steal Captain Marvel's powers too, but the Rock of Eternity is outside the universe and wasn't created by the big bang so draining the soul of the universe doesn't drain Captain Marvel. Reading comprehension is not hard.
>>133089462Archie is an American comics company. If I'm using it wrong, idfk. I assumed it was a dig a the whole idea of marvel/dc beating anime or non capeshit became "it's american superheroes." And not because they have better scaling and feats.
>>133078210Why isn't the air turning into gold as well?
>>133089507It doesn't. Xenoverse is an explicitly separate continuity whose cosmology not only doesn't align with the mainline continuity's in any way, but directly contradicts it in several places.
>>133087852You do realize that the context of this is Billy and Captain Marvel used to exchange places when they were hit with the lightning, right? The mechanics of the lightning has changed so much since then that it doesn't even have relevancy to Billy anymore, let alone Black Adam.
>>133089505Yep. But putting him up against another guy who proudly wears another country's flag would probably result in /bant/ tier shitflinging and shitposting about the counties rather than the characters.
>>133084579Even Surge is really weak. She couldn’t even solo metal sonic.
>>133089501>Who's right? Game who uses show or show?Well since Death Battle is focusing on Xenoverse and Heroes, and simply using Super as a base for Trunks, I'd say that the game is correct in this instance. If you're going to use a character from a separate continuity, you're obviously going to have to adhere to their rules.One of those rules are "time travel will always affect the past". In fact, this rule is so prominent they focused the entire game around it! Crazy, isn't it. >B-but the Cell Arc!Was also afflicted by this rule. Your entire argument hinges on your lack of knowledge towards Xenoverse, because if you knew anything about the game you'd realize that it wouldn't exist in the first place if going to the past didn't do anything to the future. Now answer my question: What's the point of having Time Patrollers if time travel just creates a new timeline?
>>133089105Incorrect as per official word of god :)
>>133089270No for everyone else they use the most liberal possible interpretations of feats and retarded TNT/cloud clear calculations, for Dragonball they specifically use fanfiction multipliers with no feats to back them because DB fans would crucify them otherwise.
>>133089477>paired with the ability to easily exploit Heroes Trunks' weakness to timeline fuckery.That's not a wincon. Silver can't do shit to Trunks' past if he has no information on his age, location, past, identity and parentage.
>>133087903G1 had a few votes for Apocalypse
>>133089586>No for everyone else they use the most liberal possible interpretations of feats and retarded TNT/cloud clear calculations, for Dragonball they specifically use fanfiction multipliers with no feats to back them because DB fans would crucify them otherwise.I'd argue the latter is better than former. The "most liberal interpretation of feats" is just a kind way to say "they are making shit up without ever looking at source material". Nobody who actually consumes the media these characters come from will ever come to the conclusions they do.DB at least had simple linear scaling because it's all about characters getting stronger to defeat a new, powerful big bad before a newer, more powerful big bad comes in and they need to get stronger again. I don't see how multiplier bullshittery in any worse than autistic cloud calcs.
>>133089590It wouldn't be hard to put 2-and-2 together and figure out that the little kid qith the exact same hair and name he ends up seeing is the same as the buff twink he just fought. Killing Kid Trunks would be enough to erase Heroes Trunks from existence. Or better yet, baby Trunks since there's a clear point he can hop back to where that would still be a thing.The Briefs' family aren't subtle. Silver could find them pretty easily if he started looking, which if he gets immeasurable speed scaling to Sonic, means it would take less than a second to figure out where Kid Trunks is if a bloodlusted Silver foregoes anything else but the search.
>>133089564Hell, the entire reason Chronoa even recruited Trunks to the Time Patrol is because his time traveling started fucking up the timestream and necessitated direct intervention to deal with it. There would be no point to that if time travel simply made new timelines in Xenoverse/Heroes.
If Bulma is such a genius, I wonder why she never made Iron Man/Hellbat type suits for krillin tien and yamcha to give em a chance against anyone after the king piccolo arc.
>>133089705Because fucking nothing she'd make could remotely compare to Zenkai nonsense and God Ki multipliers. She is not Gero.
>>133089545His best matchup is with Fighting American, so that shouldn't be an issue
>>133089564>simply usingI need to sleep.>>133089590Anon, beings less competent than Silver managed to time dox Trunks. That's not even mentioning the fact that there's an entire history database in the form of the Cracks of Time, which showcase every battle that's happened in Dragon Ball, including ones that featured Trunks. You could very easily make the argument that Silver could find this database on complete accident, and use it to locate a past version of his opponent to merk.Before you argue that something like that would be extremely situational, let me remind you that basically anyone with access to time-based powers, no matter how unrefined, could find or transport others to the COT. It's not a difficult area to get access to.
>>133089705Gero is the most intelligent character in the series, nobody can even come close to comparing with him. The real head scratcher is how convenient it was that he didn't make the really strong androids sooner
>>133089772He was too busy refining them and putting them into storage, as well as designing the plans for Cell and making his schematics cross-compatible and inherently reliant on 17 and 18 on top of that as well as building 16 as an emergency backup plus making himself into an android and that other fat pudgy one as a further contingency so he could complete his work in time/possibly kill Goku himself. And if you take the filler movies on top of all that, he made SEVERAL other androids on top of all THAT. Then there's the Android 21 thing in FighterZ, but I can't recall if her design was also his doing. Gero put a lot of effort into making sure his decades-spanning revenge scheme would come to fruition - he wasn't going to half-ass a damn thing before it was all well and done.
>>133089711>>133089772Damn. Imagine giving any of those 3 with their marital arts skills a try at the hellbat or godbuster. It get rid of the jobber reputation they have instantly.
If we're getting this autistic with Archie Silver's scaling already, I can't imagine how bad it's going to get once they throw in Archie Knuckles and we have to figure out how the fuck Knuckles-Enerjak and Chaos Knuckles scale
>>133089837Enerjak Knuckles and Green Knuckles are basically the same iirc, Hell the version of Enerjak Silver fought is a Knuckles that never lost his chaos powers in the first place.
>>133089845Not like mecha animes were out of style in dbz hayday. He missed a chance to keep them badass.
>>133089554Yeah, but she's the only one I could see them pulling out anything relatively noteworthy for. It remains to be seen if her Dynamo shit amounts to anything, but even it it does, I can't see her scaling past maybe the likes of base Scourge >>133078774Ben may hate Silver, but DB fucking loves their weird scaling, and as demonstrated by this thread, Silver has bullshit scaling for days>>133089865You're right, but that's also based off the assumption DB will realize that instead of making Chaos Knuckles its own weird fuckin thing and giving it its own powersetAlso they could totally give him Mogul scaling because reasons.
>>133076105Honestly decent fight but Apoc’s voice was pure shit. Im sure the actor is fine but the distortion on it made me want to mute the video.
>>133089917Same for me. I couldn't understand shit without subs. Even adams accent was dick van dyke in Marry poppins level of "wtf is this guy saying?"
>>133089917what's he supposed to sound like?
>>133089713>Liefield's 90s shitBarf
>>133083503Earthworm Jim or a Mars Attacks alien.
I wish we could get SMT fights outside Persona.
>>133089625It was 5-6, literally only one vote, The Black Adam's side entire argument was could BA muscle through Apocalypse's shit with stats alone.
>>133090524Has no Limits
>>133090556>Retcon punches you into a unique and interesting characterNice try shitren
>>133090570>when the trump card of DCfags in power level debating is having shit writingwowperhaps you and SCPfags aren't so different after all
>>133090590Nope. You're gonna job and accept it rice and beans.
>>133090570>>133090590>>133090599Ladies, ladies calm down - you're both awful.
>>133090599Nah, I think there's a lot more in common than it seems.>Mindless wordbabble and exposition treated as feats>Wacky fourth wall bullshit made by pseuds who think they're smarter than they really are>Omnipotent extradimensional entities choose to personify themselves as trannies>New guard pretends to respect the old guard but in actuality despises them for not being PC enough and write stories about Superman being teleported to a utopia where everyone is transgender or SCP 173 fighting for BLM>Large portion of the writers of said stories are schizophrenic and in some cases even sexual predators>Most people only care about the old shit and don't dare care for the new shit unless it wanks the old shit by proxy>Max Landis worked on both