How do we fix, repair, save the Guild Wars franchise from Anet, Holla Forums?
Ughh ohh jeez what a hard question how about we start by firing all the writers in charge of getting our PC killed by a retarded "hero" NPC? yeah real heroes,they literally do a hero/suicide and we lose the mission, every goddamn time.
Next answer is: don't make the game in an object-oriented engine that feels like Java.
Remake GW1 with better graphics. Remove the furries as a playable race. Everyone is happy.
Remove everything other than humans as a playable race.
Remove/Restrict Heroes.
Keep making full continent expansion packs.
The fuck? You don't have any idea what "object oriented" means, do you?
Also acceptable, but I'm open to having playable characters from the other races that were in GW1.
Wut?
Guild Wars remake with BDO-style combat and graphics.
Each weapon gets its own "move set" that comes with it. Your skills are all tied to the keyboard motions - your "Left M + Shift" as an Elementalist could be Inferno or Fireball or whatever you tied to it.
Monsters, obviously, would have to be a lot tougher than in BDO - and the various skills and abilities they'd have (being GW) would help facilitate that, since you could have a Hydra just drop an Inferno or Meteor on you for heavy damage if you pissed it off. Zones remain instanced and everything else, with party size being limited as normal. You can hire henchmen NPCs to help out as normal, and bring heroes as well.
Congratulations, you just made the greatest MMO of all time. And it will never happen, so stop thinking about it, faggot.
The engine felt a shit load like an entity-based language and click-based language.
Every little thing needed a location set on an entity which was immobile or mobile. And you had to click it in order to disable/enable it like the fire flowers and traps.
You could see directly that the real hitbox were the circles around the monster models and not the models themselves, which meant that the animation was useless and so was the size of the creature.
That's why they couldn't create real location-based damage.
That's why Guild Wars was so fucking shitty when it came to scripted events and anything that didn't feel like a modded Warcraft 3 or Starcraft custom map.
That's a much better analysis of the engine than "object-oriented engine that feels like Java". What would you expect out of the engine though? I doubt many MMOs get much more complex
You mean Tera?
Fuck no, the combat is fine as it is, just update the damn graphics, give the change to make semen demons and add lewd cloths, swimsuits and underware.
Pretty much this. Also fuck everything after Nightfall. Fuck like half of Nightfall too.
They weren't a playable race in GW1 in the first place so you already have that covered.
Heroes helped kill the game. It made the game laughably easy and completely defeated the need for any actual human interaction. They turned an MMO into a single-player RPG that you needed an internet connection to play.
Henchmen were okay because they were almost universally worse than an actual person. You could use them in a pinch when one of the dorks in your PUG dropped, but they were practically always a last resort.
Heroes could be customized and controlled to almost a multi-box point with 1/10th the effort. You could abuse weird compositions and mechanics that would be exceptionally difficult to do as a human group, no matter how organized. What you got is an on-demand steamroller through content that was far less of a hassle to manage than trying to actually party with people, and they typically worked better too.
Graphics okay, but fuck that combat, GW1's combat was fine as it is.
Is this bait? That's pretty much exactly what GW2 did and they have gotten a mountain of shit for it. Of all the things to gripe about in GW2, this was one of the biggest ones. It's disgustingly restrictive and leaves virtually no room for build diversity. Certain weapon loadouts became FotM shit while others stayed sub-par and some were straight meme-tier useless. GuildWars went from being renown for its skill diversity, to being ASSFAGGOTS tier in just one sequel.
Guild Wars 1:
8 skills of your choice you pull out of a pool of about 100+ per class. However, you double classed so you really have a pool of about 200+ skills to chose from. Also one of them is an elite skill taken from a pool of about 30 per class not included in the 100+ base skills. Elite skills had to be captured, not just handed to you which meant you had to run some challenging content to get access to some of the more exotic skills. Also there was rarely a build that fit every situation well. Players were encouraged to mix-and-match their hearts out.
Guild Wars 2:
You get 5 skills taken from a pool of about 24 but you can only have your skills in 1 of about 10 different combinations. You can weapon swap, but that really only doubles the number of combinations you have access to, not the number of skills. You get one of 4 healing skills, but really there's only one good option most of the time anyways.3 skills of your choosing from a pool of 20 which was the only functional part of the build process; funny how these three skills were the most like GW1 skill building process and they are the best part of GW2's garbage system. And you also get one of three elite skills which are just handed to you, but don't kid yourself, 2/3 are typically worthless anyways.
However, on top of this, GW2's cardinal sin against skill diversity was the streamlining of its effects. In GW1, virtually all skills had their own effects. There were some conditions like burning or poison that might be shared between skill effects, but the effects were largely separate. "Backfire" had its own effect of punching you in the dick every time you tried to do anything. "Protective Spirit" had its own effect of pissing off the enemy nuke. "Spiteful Spirit" had its own effect of mulching the entire group because the party assassin was too stupid to realize it was on him before he started mashing skills. Meanwhile nearly every GW2 skill follows the format of "Deal damage and apply X stacks of Y(Boon/Condition)" where Y is one of 13 conditions, or their 11 boon inverses. All the skill effect diversity in GW1 boiled down to 24 effects across all classes, 90% of which just share inverse relationships with one another.
In some ways I can see this as a necessary change since they moved to an open world style game from an instanced-based one, but holy shit did it feel casualized and stagnant as hell.
As I said above I'm open to letting people play the Asura perhaps, but fuck the tumblr-plants (self-explanatory), the Charr (they must be removed like kebab) and the Norn (they're pretty much generic nordic shit). I'd be happy with just humans also of course.
We no longer have the excuse that network is too expensive to afford real-time calculations of locations and actions, like Blizzard kept promoting with their garbage mmo. Blizzard's idea of optimization is to remove every good feature.
Warframe, Firefall, Mount & Blade, Tera, Paragon.
Warframe has a well optimized engine by lowering the polygon count when the characters are moving, without you noticing it. They also cover the entire model in armor so you don't need to see their ugly faces and fake looking skin.
The gameplay was almost good except for the fact that you can only attack from the letter "E" instead of at least 3-4 commands. This ruins the control you have over your attacks and makes it too monotonous like most people have been complaining. That and the grinding is insane, same for the generic missions.
Right now we have downwatered hack & slash combat MMOs, but soon enough we'll be able to have a real fun and proper jump, combo, block style of gameplay.
Still, there were multiplayer games back in the 2000s which kept the original gameplay as the singleplayer because they never had to deal with millions of players loading up the servers.
All we really needed back then was a downsized online game. 200 players per server with a max total of 2k-10k instead of 500k-6 million. Like most
GW1 has a really nice art style for the character models, it's very appealing to look at. But the monster designs I felt kinda off-put by them, there were too many japanese influences. As for the terrain and world, most of them had a really low polygon rate and some locations were purposefully ugly, like the searing, kaineng city, echovald forest, compared to the pre-searing, snow areas, grasslands.
Instead the water looked good in GW1, again because of the art style.
But playing GW1 felt like you were playing as a ghost. You were floating on the terrain, the trees had their invisible walls too big around them, the bushes didn't shake when you ran into them, the effects were very downwatered, everything felt fake and like you were a ghost running through the world. No secrets, no direct interaction with the environment. Even WoW managed to create a more immersive world. All because the engine is a piece of shit.
The world-related gameplay for GW1 was like searching every chest, box, crate in Runescape 2 and finding out all of them are empty.
In GW2 they promised world events that players can take part in. Similar to Rift or Firefall. Nothing serious came out of that. Everyone thought they were going to be able to influence the pre-Searing and Searing events like in GW1 before the furfags turned the grasslands into a post apocalyptic desert. And before the story timeskips us 2-4 years while the lion-hyena abominations were attacking.
I'd remake Prophecies as a mmo - miniature multiplayer online game, rather than a massive one.
At first I'd only add the grasslands, northern wall, northern charr lands, then the catacombs which in my version would connect to the Underworld.
After that I'd slowly add the PvP as a separate game and with the Hall of Heroes.
PvP would be based heavily on the strategic squad-based gameplay that Anet never bothered improving.
Heroes Ascent would be its own game because each guild would aim to take over the hall of heroes in order to become gods and take control of The Underworld which would grant them extra bonuses for themselves and would influence the economy. Very similar to Entropia Online, where players could talk to the devs to buy land(even an entire planet) and any item the players bought on that land, the owner would receive a small income from them. In GW's case, the more players playing in The Underworld while the guild controls it, the more money that guild receives.
An easter egg will be Kormir sitting the underworld as a newbie being yelled by her egyptian officer for being retarded and the worst slave ever who doesn't deserve shit because africans are dumb even for a race of slaves that got sold by their tribes' leader.
Sex add-on? Sex add-on.
I'd keep the tab-based squad-based gameplay. I really enjoyed some of the Factions PvP missions.
But together with the option to play classic I'd add a new updated gameplay to make PvE enjoyable. The new gameplay would be hack n slash similar to Warframe due to all the wall climbing and jumping.
The option between classic and modern would be as easy to switch as the normal and hardmode options from the party menu.
Guild Wars 1 should have improved more on the hybrid professions by creating new skills out of combinbing 2-4 skills from different professions.
I think there shouldn't even be a profession and attribute system. Each skill should work without any hinderance.
You seem to misunderstand BDO combat. Also, you're a retard for trying to lecture me on Guild Wars skills - I'm one of the suckers that collected all of them back in the day.
The weapon move-set I'm describing is something like this:
Staff (2-Handed):
LM -> Targeted range attack.
RM -> Swinging attack in melee. Quicker, but does less damage.
Focus (Off-Handed):
RM -> Hold. Charges your Energy faster.
Sword:
LM -> Basic melee attack.
Then, you have eight other hotkeys, examples being:
(1) LM+Shift or 1
(2) RM+Shift or 2
(3) LM+Ctrl or 3
(4) RM+Ctrl or 4
(5) LM+Alt or 5
(6) RM+Alt or 6
(7) Q or 7
(8) E or 8
You could go into the menu options and change it if you want, but you'd be limited to a maximum of eight skills "Equipped" at a time - with the same amount of skill diversity as was maintained in the original game. As with the original game, you can use weapons, even outside of class restrictions, and so forth.
Of course, you could still leave the option to go semi-isometric, allowing the "point-and-click" movement and targeting from an expanded view, and just straight up playing the piano on the skill (I think DA:Inquisition tried something like this, but fucked it up horribly because of Bioware being incompetent).
The main thing that made Guild Wars great was the strategic element. As a caster, it was a great thing. However, there are sometimes some really shitty things. If you've ever played as a Warrior and had to watch your character gently float along in his circle behind some asshole running away, you know what I'm referring to. Granting the option of "action" combat alleviates that, and allows much more dynamic activity.
On the other hand, the shitty thing about games like BDO is that enemies basically exist to either be hit point sponges, or get boiled down. And that's not okay. But once you implement the Guild Wars skill system and combat mechanics, that suddenly becomes a lot difference. Now instead of enemies just being either "easily mowed down" or "takes forever to kill", they hit that nice middle ground - something perfect for a game where multiplayer is the intention. Because of the enemies having skills, things become a lot more difficult from that perspective as well. Charr Archers blasting you with flaming arrows from unreachable points, enemy Monks with healing and protective spells, etc. And always in strategic groups.
Also, you put a lot of effort in describing the problems of a game that doesn't exist. There is no sequel to Guild Wars and there never will be.
The reason you think heroes made the game easy is because PUGs have always been and still are so laughably bad that they made heroes look overpowered by comparison. But compare heroes to a human team that actually knew what they were doing and heroes were shit. The truth of the matter is that a good human team has always been able to kick the game's ass and a PUG has always sucked. Heroes gave an option to have something almost as good as a good human team and not have to deal with PUGs.
I'll take a team from my guild any day. But when that's not an option I'd always prefer heroes over being forced to pair up with PUGs, or with AI that are as bad as PUGs (henchmen).
Also, the game's difficulty declined over time due to Izzy's balancing laziness as players found OP team builds than Anet didn't care to balance, due to Izzy being too lazy to come up with good profession reworks and just buffing shit out the ass in PvE, and due to cons.
Was better than dealing with a lot of the PUG population.
It was never meant to be WoW. It was always intended as an instanced PvP arena game with an RPG campaign on the side. It was not an MMO in the sense you wanted from the beginning.
Agreed, I would have liked to see fewer professions but better hybridization between the lot of them, skills modified depending on the primary profession.
Private servers.
All I ever wanted was GW1 but with jumping.
Why?
That shit only worked for quests, exploring and missions
You still needed people for hard mode and end game shit
Pretty sure OP just hears about the weird hate some of the indie fags have for OO and thinks they know what the fuck they're talking about.
Virtually all the MMOs have simplistic engines like this. Not sure why we're singling out this one.
What the fuck is with this retarded obsession with jumping? It's like when people hate FPS games because "I CAN'T SEE MY FEET BAWWWW".
Those languages are required in game development, but I think you're referring to how the content has little variation and feels that it cuts corners. It's not the fault of the language, but with the design and intent. It's intended to be optimized while handling multiple entities, so it's going to feel cheap.
To be fair there were semi-common occasions in GW1 where you'd have to backtrack just because your character couldn't jump down a one foot high slope and that was fucking annoying.
This.
I'd love to see someone clear Tombs in 15 minutes with a Hero Team. Hell, I'd love to see most people manage it at all with a Hero Team.
Jumping is nice in MMOs because if you see some retard jumping around, you know he's new and possibly retarded. But GW uses instances, so it's pointless.
But that's not a jumping issue, that's a map design issue. There are lots of locations where you can effortlessly walk up or down really big slopes, it all depends if ArenaNet has made that area traversable.
Jumping in most video games is fucking stupid anyways since it's huge cartoonish jumps. GW is not a cartoony game.
The retarded thing about most MMOs is that you cannot interact with the world around you in a detrimental way or else you ruin the entire world for the rest of the players. Like say burning down the entire forest and setting the village on fire, freezing the ocean and killing all the mobs.
But in Guild Wars's case we had instanced areas where we could do whatever the fuck we wanted. Every player had their own private server to mess around in. Yet the faggots at Anet never realized how much freedom they could have given to the players if they stopped "optimizing" the shit out of everything. We couldn't even have an observer mode where we simply flew around and enjoyed the landscapes without the monsters attacking us.
The lack of jumping was a huge problem in Factions with the Kaineng City and Echovald Forest.
If they simply allowed you to climb or to cheaply teleport upwards then those zones wouldn't have been so bloody annoying and would actually be enjoyable.
Same for the lack of interiors/entering buildings.
Same for the lack of secrets, explorations, landscapes, purpose of exploration. Most mmos give you jackshit in terms of gold and items compared to singleplayer games.
But WoW's Mist of Pandaria had much more interesting worlds to explore if you went offroads.
Instead GW's world wasn't as small as say Runescape's, but exploring it was completely pointless and it wasn't fun to begin with due to how slow your PC was and how he couldn't interact with anything and the world couldn't give you anything.
Again, that's not an issue of jumping. Even if you'd been able to move while jumping those areas would still be flagged non-traversable and you wouldn't be able to jump over them.
That describes every MMO, user. That's the whole problem with the genre.
But what does that have to do with arena-based PvP?
Guild Wars was intended from day 1 to be a PC adaptation of Magic: the Gathering focused on arena-based PvP. PvE was mainly about teaching players to play the game before they moved on to the endgame and main focus, PvP.
What would your proposals have to do with that? If you want a sandbox GW isn't and has never been intended to be the game for you.
PvP and PvE should be 2 completely different games you buy separately.
You could buy PvP separately for $20.
Then why didn't they update the PvP since Factions?
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FUCK YOU RURIK and especially FUCK KORMIR
how about no
For what purpose? are they so lazy they can't add terrain hit detection?
GW1 was always a bit screwy with that. Also the older maps were not designed with expansion pack/patch content in mind. If you want to see something retarded get a pet flamingo: pets show up in cutscenes and it ruins the drama to have a retarded pink blob running around.
Oh or when your MM dies during the cutscene and all the minions go AWOL while everyone is trying to calmly talk while getting pummeled by 10-30 minions.
That also. I suppose the game was made with gameplay in mind above things like that.
make caster main/warrior sub class combinations more viable
Like that will ever happen. The most you had going on was E/A, E/R with conjure fire, ice, lightning, earth and Mesmer with illusionary weapon.
Mostly everyone that played Guild Wars 1 back in 2005 were originally Runescape players.
Use Guild wars 1's skill system rather than Guild wars 2's. Stop trying to make combat more "fluid" or "active". Instead make it easy to tell what is going on and reward the player for reacting properly to particular situations. Make the game focused more around builds rather than "you can do anything!!".
A classic mode for GW1's magic the gathering gameplay and a modern mode for jumping hack n slash would be really nice.
we stop bitching on Holla Forums, and start killing
Fix PvE by removing heroes and adding restrictions on skills based on character home region. Characters would have free use of core and native region skills, but would be limited on how many skills they could use from other regions. For example, a Factions character only being allowed to use Nightfall skills while in Elona and only one or two of them at most. The intention of the restriction is to make balance easier.
Fix PvP by adding similar restrictions to characters in casual formats and a campaign rotation in competitive formats. For example, recent tournaments would allow skills only from core and the two most recent campaigns.
Release campaigns and new BMPs once each per year. No expansions. Reduce campaign length similar to Factions. Focus on new game modes, campaign-specific mechanics (like the Kurzick-Luxon border and competition), and end-game content that emphasizes PvP.
Yeah when Nightfall got introduced it completely fucked up the balance. Nightfall had the most powerful skills ever.
But as a faggot who only had Factions+Eotn please go kill yourselves with all your campaign-locked skills. Every skill should be core-related.
The Luxon/Kurzick struggle was crap. An annoying PvP minigame for shit rewards for 1 campaign. Oh wow buying lockpicks with 250 less gold, what am amazing reward.
I originally thought it was going to tie into Hall of Monuments, just like The Underworld should have tied into the PvP HoM and Heroe's Ascent.
I thought that blue/red line was some sort of rainbow road to some portal to HoM or some major event on the map in a physical location, rather than just invisible territory markings.
What I love about hybrid classes is when they combine properly to form new things. For example back in 2005-2006 we had touch rangers, basically melee rangers which could burn through every defense. Then we had trappers instead of nukers, trap rangers were the original assholes that insta-killed you with spikes of 600-800 damage.
Anet didn't try at all to integrate specific builds and even attributes into the PvP and PvE. Minion Masters were useless in PvP and Assassins were useless in PvE.
Paragons again very useless and Dervish were overpowered and multi-functional, much more practical than the Ritualists pretending to be monks and necros.
Dervish were basically warrior+assassin done right.
I think reducing the professions to 4 and then adding sub-classes like Warrior (assassin, ranger, dervish, paragon) would have helped the game immensely.
Or imagine if elementalists+warriors could turn into the dervish class by combining their skills together.
It would be easier to have 1-2 main characters instead of 10 different ones for each profession. Starting a new game just to change the main profession was a pain in the ass, when the game tooted around the secondary profession. You could change the secondary on a whim , but for the main profession you had to start all over again.
It really wasn't, you could get a level 20 in an afternoon, easily. And if it's an alt you'd have materials and cash for the max gear.
How can someone fuck up drawing three different guns so hard?
Welcome /k/ do you want a drink? I'll call /ck/.
I think Guild Wars could benefit a lot from a campaign themed on celtic culture.
This is something I have personally thought about and made a list of several ideas.
They already have loads of unused content cut from all previous incarnations they could recycle into a new expansion.
Jesus Christ, GW2 was so bad
Nightfall's primary balance problems were a symptom of shifting the target demographic from PvPers to PvEers, but secondarily a result of having too many skills and interactions to balance across all the campaigns. Narrowing down the available lists would be a good thing, at the very least in giving them an extra tool to use for balancing skills.
The Luxon/Kurzick struggle was not limited to a single PvP minigame, and the rewards were much more valuable when the game was more popular, inflation wasn't so great, and access to the elite missions was more limited.
The way you talk about Factions like it's related to the HoM and then touch rangers in 2006 is very confusing with regards to when you started playing the game. Nobody thought Factions had anything to do with the HoM when it came out because the HoM didn't even exist as an idea yet. The notion that you would confuse the Kurzick/Luxon border as being related to the HoM is hilarious though.
ANet didn't need to make every viable PvE build work in PvP or vice versa. Paragons were not useless at the start of Nightfall. They were very much the opposite, both in PvE and PvP. Dervishes had much different approaches to melee combat than Warriors did, and they did not pretend to be Warriors, nor did all, or even most, Ritualists pretend to be Necromancers or Monks. Whatever impression you have on the meta today is nothing like what it was in the heydays of 2006-2008.
The core six professions were very well fleshed out and different to begin with. This is apparent in how the additional four classes were always seen as substitutes or replacements or finer focuses of the original six. None of the additional four ever filled some new niche that wasn't seen before. The original six were fine, and if they wanted to expand on that, they could do it with the idea I mentioned before of making new skills for each profession in each campaign and tuning those skills to make the profession play differently. Rangers could have been retooled as Assassins, Necromancers as Ritualists, Warriors as Paragons, and Monks as Dervishes, but only mostly within new campaigns.
The city/shitty Kaineng was a disappointment in terms of art style and level layout. Instead of everything looking nice like Raisu Palace or like Pre-Searing we get yet another ugly post apocalyptic location like the searing or the echovald forest.
Ibstead I liked the Jade Sea, even if most of it were islands and there were constantly missing pieces from the map.
When they originally said dynamic events in GW2 I thought they were going to let us switch between pre and post apocalypse locations.
Anyway I'd GW1 ever gets a reboot I'd love to be able to climb trees and mine deep inside the jade sea block by block(like in Minecraft).
Nahpui Quarter could have used an entire star world made out of celestial essence. It was pathetic to fight renamed tengu/dumb birds in the dump city and hot sewers of Kaineng.
I really wish the system of an instanced party-based combat game with MMO-esque outpost hubs was more common. GW1 was probably the best MMORPG I ever played because it wasn't really an MMO at all.
I'd agree: it was an MMO when you wanted it (trading, PvP, events) and a coop-rpg when you didn't (all PvE content).
Combine them with MMs in PvE, ooga-booga men's buffs apply to both party members and minions/pets.
Can we talk about how beautiful the artwork and the colors were in guild wars? It was really aesthetic, even if the graphics were dated compared to even PC games, let alone consoles back then.
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Most of the armor design was top-notch. The fact that each class had an entirely different look to their gear helped immensely.
Only thing which I didn't enjoy about monsters have skills like the players was the fact that they'd sometimes get too hard and annoying later in the game. There was too much Player vs Player AI instead of pure dumb monsters with their own shtick. Monster monks were especially insufferable.
TBH tho that made GW AI actually interesting to fight. You didn't just damage spam, you had to bre aware of who to target and when.
Assassins were always godlike in PvP if you were a competent player. They happened to be the class of choice for many shitty players which created a perception of being a bad class just because you'd see so many failing. But put even a half decent player in that profession and they'd always have wrecked shit.
The Charr weren't playable in the first one you fucking idiot.
Remember how great the southern shiverpeaks were?
Why the fuck did Aatxes in the underworld deal 250-400 damage with a simple melee strike? Fuck overpowered monsters.
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