Simcity

Simcity 4 is unarguably the best simcity and still the best city-builder outside of the old "city builder" series games like pharaoh, emperor, and caesar.

It may be nostalgia but sc2k was the best

RETICULATING SPLINES

are you retarded?

Well it's not just for the purpose of playing DOS games, that's just a good benefit.

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I only mentioned it as part of the reason for the large amount of mods, otherwise it would be the gap between SC4 and… nothing. I guess I could have mentioned Cities Skylines but this is a SC thread.

I also plan on buying a PC 98.

fucking THIS
it LOOKS better too!

name a fucking game that lets you do this (THERE ARE NO OTHERS BESIDES SC4)

I'm sorry, it tickles my funny bone seeing stereotypical shit like this. Sim City 4 was the best of the series but Cities Skyline is a pretty damn good modern alternative.

Posters like this should be permabanned

SHITY skyline is a joke of a game
garbage unity trash, takes 4GB to render an empty map (which you cant even build on fully)
enjoy buying DLC to get a fucking day/night cycle. cityskylines is the reddit of citybuilders

It's good for the price of 0 dollars but don't pay more than 10 dollars for the whole thing. The genera is dead, i'm happy it's just not forgotten.

10$ is the max i would pay for a GOOD GAME

Depends on the game but that's an awfully kike way of thinking. Of course some games are worth less than 10 shekels but you have to be a dense motherfucker if that is your mindset.

why would you care, you just pirate everything like you do with sim city

stop spending money on the publishing jew

Oh i'm laffin!~

Are you literate, you fucking fanboy?

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What the fucking hell is this hot garbage.

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Tell me more, Anita.

Reported for obvious spam.

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I should know consider you are just posting "le russles faec! xd" without actually saying anything. I know foresight and critical thinking is hard but something doesn't have to be 100% to change. It could be as low as 70% and those people would be the majority. Holy fuck, the fact I had to break it down to such a basic level shows you might have brain damage.

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High resolution 2D graphics with a good art direction age like wine.
I just wish it was more optimized, old PCs or new.

>>>/reddit/

Skyline is shit. The only thing you do is building roads. The rest is just cosmetics and lags.

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Can we have /cbg/ city building general?
really feeling the urge to it, got plenty of stuff to share
and whatever else similar

OpenTTD is the best.

nigger are you for real

nope

Why are you getting angry at him for spending money on real hardware?

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SC4 is great. It has a big mod community that's still active with all kinds of neat add-ons that change the functions and aesthetics of the game creating something entirely new.

community.simtropolis.com/

I don't see the problem.

I end up playing 2000 the most. It's available on so many things. The PDA version was even decent, basically the full game with just an odd resolution, the stylus was even enjoyable to use to play.

Only good to come from Skyloins was the peepeepoopoo thread.

2000 is great, I love building a big city and then using the 3D viewer to drive around my comfy low-poly city while MIDI jazz plays in the background.

Aw yeah, I wish SC4 had weird expansions like that too.

I wish SC4 was stable under win 7 64.

My city isn't fuckhueg yet though.
Best Simcity is Simcity 4, no debate.

PS1 version detected.
PC players had to buy two other games to enjoy the 3D tour, but they were full-fledged games. We need more shit like that nowadays.

That was specifically why I kept a partition for XP on my last computer. That and I just knew something wouldn't be compatible properly. Another thing about that PDA version which was nice is you could just pull a save from the PC version and have it to mess around with anywhere. Not sure if any other sort of handheld version does that.

SimCity 4 is fairly objectively the best in the series. The depth of the game is at least double the complexity of 3K (it's not just region mode, which is pretty broken anyway) with things like the tax micromanagement, wealth levels, demand caps for different sectors instead of just population as a whole, levels of building population and/or dilapidation instead of just filled-completely/abandoned. As others have mentioned, it also has quite possibly the best modding community of any game, ever. I also find it to just generally be "prettier" than most other city builder games, especially on closer zooms.

SimCity 2013 is what should be in the dictionary next to the definition of "Casualization". It takes everything in the franchise and simplifies it to the level of a toddler's building blocks.

Skylines is essentially just Transport Tycoon with a city simulation skin. The main selling point of the game is that the traffic simulation is better than SC4 (but it is ONLY if you discount the NAM), and the curved roads. Agent-based traffic rather than an illusionary one was a big mistake. The issue with the curved roads is that it still doesn't use them properly. The lots stick to the side of roads but often end up with gaps in between, which isn't how it works in real life. While the map-wide grid system in SC4 doesn't allow for nicely curved roads, it does allow for seamless transitions between lots.

The install from the physical disk I owned was buggy as hell (with frequent crashes) on everything after WinXP, but I now have a pirated/cracked install on my Win7-64 and it runs almost perfectly. I don't know why.

Do SimCity 4 mods change anything substantial, mechanically speaking, about the game or do they just add new buildings and some better traffic management?

Usually disc versions are older than pirated versions. Especially of old games, where pirates often fixed issues. Plus removal of dmr always improving performance.
Also tropico were a cool games back in the day. Less autism and more fun.

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For some reason after I reinstalled Windows 7 SC4 installed from my old discs wouldn't work AT ALL, like not even an error message, thank goodness for GOG.

Tropico 3 was already easier than the first one (in a good way, building shit in 1 was frustrating) but it was still more challenging than 4 and 5 that are so piss easy you no longer really have a reason to act like a brutal dictator.

That's why I stopped playing 5, it was no fun to stomp my serfs in the name of socialism when it was that easy.

Some do. The NAM also adds more types of transportation (particularly a "ground light rail", which is exactly like the elevated rail except on the ground, as a more flexible urban alternative to the existing heavy rail). There's a mod that doubles or quadruples the amount of jobs per industrial building (because the proportion in vanilla just doesn't make sense; you get these factories with like four people working there). There's a mod called CAM which adds many additional levels of building size, allowing you to take your cities to full-Coruscant, if you wish. I use a mod that smooths terrain with roads and also forces you to use realistic gradients with heavy rail (slopes of many dozens of meters for a few meters of rise). There's some mods that completely change how farms work. There's some I've heard of that completely change the entire game (like one that transforms it into what the canceled SimMars might have been like), but I don't look into those very much.

Honestly, I got SC4 to a situation I was pleased with over six years ago, so I haven't poked my head into the modding community since then. It's probably changed a lot since then, and I know there are a lot more "full transformation" mods and other ones that change game mechanics significantly. I can't stress enough how gigantic the modding community is, so if you can think about a potential mod, it's probably been done.

That's what I loved in 1 and 3, you could actually understand why dictators who are hellbent on keeping their power do shit they actually do, no point of that if it's incredibly easy to build a tropical paradise.
You could already feel the tone shift between 3 and 4 in the music selection of each game.

So how does modding work? Am I limited to "mod packs" or can I just mix and match whatever I like (within reason of course)?

I also thought 5's music was annoying as fuck

Mod packs aren't required. Some mods need "dependancies", which are other mods or graphical assets, to work properly. They will almost always tell you in the description what those dependancies are. A lot of what I've downloaded, I have specifically chosen ones that are free of these dependancies (they use only the graphical assets already in the game) so I can avoid this. That was because some dependancy packs can be extremely large, and the more megabytes you cram into your mod folder, the slower the game will load/run.

The thing about mod packs is that it simplifies the process. You just install it and everything will work. If you pick and choose your own mods, it's a longer and more difficult process, and you will sometimes have to troubleshoot problems. It's basically the same as buying a computer or building your own; it's a tradeoff between convenience and customization.

Oh, okay, it's modular like Bethesda shit. Thanks for the info, I'll look that shit up tomorrow.

HOW THE FUCK DO I GET SC4 TO RUN AGAIN? I HAVE TRIED EVERY SINGLE FUCKING SOLUTION

EVERY SINGLE FUCKING ONE OF THEM AND THE FUCKING GAME REFUSES TO START AND I WANT TO PLAY IT SO BADLY BUT THE FUCKING THING WONT START AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

Excuse me, I'm just really frustrated about this fucking shit.
On that note, Cities Skylines is cool and all but I just can't get over how dumb the demand for industry/offices works like and the moment you offer another kind of job the entirety of the factories go immediately abandoned, rip.

The fuck is this faggot on about?

The SNES version is excellent. And its soundtrack is wonderful as well. Eat shit.

SC4 is definitely the best in the series by far, followed closely by SC3K. They're all good, with the exception of 2013, which was made by Maxis by namesake only, with none of the talent.

Cities Skylines is also great, though it's really hard to improve the genre when those two games are so definitive to it.

Unrelated, but has running a game in Compatibility Mode ever fixed anything?

Seriously, it's always the first thing people shit out of their mouths and not a single time has it ever been remotely beneficial.

The thing I found most helpful is to shove "-CPUCount:1" into the command line to force it to use one core. Although, I'm also running it in XP compatibility mode, so it might help.

That said, I've NEVER been wholly unable to get a game to start. I've always at least been able to get it to get as far as a title screen and then crash/hang, and that's usually just modern games because you don't have some bullshit microsoft spyware module installed.

You can run Sim City 64 on an Everdrive, either the cartridge conversion which I'll link, or the original dump on later models.

64dd.org/dumps_p.html

Awesome, those everdrive things are some real life savers.

since some of you seem to be autistic enough to advocate sc4 modding, any chance of a primer on how to get smooth curves and interchanges with NAM's highway system? all of the ancient forum posts documenting this stuff used image/bucket/photo/shack retard hosts that have been offline for years

every time i try to design an interchange to start off a city I can't get two way highways to properly convert ramp / curved sections of road to one-way double lane highways

highway lanes reversing direction across an overpass attached

Dat SimCopter.

The fucking music from the first game is still in my head, fucking hell.

Sim City 4 remains my favorite autism simulator.

I've had the same problem, just download the GOG version.

Has anyone played SC2013 after the official "offline" patch? Is it still a total shitfest?

Is there a list of recommended SC4 mods or at least a list of mods that maybe give the game higher resolution sprites and textures?

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It plays the same, just that you don't need to store your saves online and you can roll back to previous saves.

Everything is pretty much a little bit buggy, autism usually fixes it

The game literally was made to be played online, allowing offline doesn`t change things, just makes it harder to achieve some things. It`s an overall bad game with no real way to fixing it, SC4 is better in all aspects, even more so with fan made patches

I am going to spoon it to you since the community is seriously amazing community.simtropolis.com

10/10 bait

Fuck, why isn't this a thing in this day and age? If I remember you used to be able to import your city and fly around in it, so why the fuck isn't this available in this day and age?

For what it's worth, somebody was working on a Cities Skylines mod that pretty much put Simcopter into the game, but he flaked and deleted all his alphas.

Yep and Streets of Simcity let you drive around in your city.

What a faggot. I know there is a "first person mod" that lets you tag cars and go down to street level, but you have no control over the car.

Damn, I never actually heard of Streets before, just SimCopter. It's a shame the genre is dead.

best comment by far, I do agree with lots of stuff you're saying,
SC4 was the best and I'd simply loved making farming towns, suburbs(U+200B was here), high density poor areas and whatnot
but I disagree and still am all out for CSL, there are just two basic design flaws they had:
that being said, I think city simulation is done pretty well on CSL despite what everyone says:
production and income actually makes fucking sense:
and specially services are one of my favourite parts:
though again, there were some stupid design mistakes like:

and to complement my post, what do the RCI represent in CSL:
and some mods that really do improve gameplay:

The traffic in Simcity 4 was not fake and I wouldn't say it was exactly agentless. Sims in simcity 4 have homes and jobs.They computed traffic by the congestion of their path finding to destinations. This system scales up well and even in my central business districts where i typically import around 1000000 daily workers from neighboring tiles it doesn't bog down. I can't imagine that working out well in Skylines.

of course that wouldn't work well, but SC works on statistics, so illusionary is a good term to it, its only a visual representation, while CSL you have actually one thing going from point A to B, and in reality, the true limit here is your PC capacity

Seems like it depends on what you want out of the game, though I'd say SC's method of handling it is better for gameplay, unless you can get a full simulation of everything going. Having it based on agents means that it quickly turns into a traffic simulator, instead of a city simulator.

Sort of like pic related; it was literally built on top of Japanese elevator simulation software, and they slapped a game on it. It's not about the tower itself or collecting rent, but managing traffic flow.

This game was crap and barely functioned properly but the concept has IMMENSE potential and could be fucking gold with modern technology.

I wish the DS port was in english

I wish more games like this, and SC were made. It satisfies my brand of autism so much

Technology is hardly progressing these days. People are stripping ancient features and later add them as if its something new and amazing. Look at fucking VR that existed during nes times. Look at fucking Red Faction with destroyable surrounding. Look at fucking ultima online and compare it to modern mmo features. Look at fucking elite and compare it to a fucking whatshisname with gillion planets. Look at fucking simcity then and now.
Even fucking dungeon crawl:ss is removing features instead of adding them. Compare pefromance of old as shit games that run on fucking 16 mb ram and modern games that eat all the fucking ran you can have to render 2d tiles. Like fucking tome4 that runs like shit while it has only fucking 2 dimensional tiles. Nobody fucking tries anymore. Graphics are developed by people who sell hardware. Who the fuck would optimize if your profits will drop if you start rendering better picture on older hardware? The worse your game runs the more support you can gat from hardware merchants. Fucking merchants ruin everything. Nobody is trying to make anything better than it was before, they trying to make something worse and made money out of ignorant masses.

Somebody never played Streets. I'd settle for a version that ran for 30 minutes.

This reminds me of that autistic guy that built the closest thing to a perfect city.

yeah it makes sense, but SC is still faux, simulated to the term,
I like transport management too, coming up with smarts way to solve traffic problems and what not,and thus may be why I like CSL so much,even public transport matters like that (better modded though)
but other kinds of city building too for comparison
would be one that accounts for agents, each citizen and each piece of meal counts, small scale
you could count that as city builder, with focus on transport management, there is a big overlap in the audience

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Man I love Factorio, but I just don't have the autism to exceed at it.

use gog version

KNOCK, KNOCK,

Hull…

punches you

GET OUT

Robots are objectively the most efficient way to build a factory, but they're just so fucking BORING and EASY. Considering all but the endgame is based around using belts, it's essentially like a legit cheat-mode.

I need to play more SimCity. I've got a SHITLOAD of cities in this region, but so much of it needs a lot of work to make pretty and ready for a nice screenshot or mosaic. Particularly, I need to add the ground clutter and decorative buildings. I love overview shots, though. SC4 looks great at every zoom level.

Guy in vid uses trains for everything.

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I need to find and install Simcopter from a proper iso one of those days. I've heard the ost is pretty good

Fuck i need to do that kind of autism again

Are you seriously comparing the shit tier stereoscopic headsets that existed in the NES era to the current ones?

Thread theme

going to autist it up when i get home with pics of CSL if you guys want

is it illegal for me to say cities skylines?

Sure.

Yes.

I have the superior Yoot Tower version.
Worth grabbing.

lol

The traffic simulation in CS feels like a dice roll most of the time, it adds frustration more than gameplay.

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sim city 2000 > sim city 2013

I'm sure it makes more sense if you're a veteran of TT games, but as I am not, I'd just keep trying to do things like in SimCity, which would fail. There's only room for one city builder in my heart and mind.

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here we go,
unfortunately, I only have my most recent city pics, everything else got wiped in the great hard drive crash of 2016

this was all early pics of this city design,
kinda went for an "old town" center there

and finally my latest progress,
redesigned the industrial section of that part of town, gotta love those RICO buildings

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Very pretty, but it's a bit empty. You don't see a lot of places like that surrounded by endless rolling wilderness.

I actually bought sc4 in a store when it came out in 2003 because I really liked SC2K and 3K

stay anger reddit :^)

anyone know how much bandwidth an openttd server takes for a few hundred people ??

well, its the only one i can really say i enjoyed. i just didnt get in to the other ones, not because they were worse, but i just never really felt like playing them all that much. i dont even feel like playing the snes one either.

why does it offend you?

Could you imagine a FPS or action adventure game that let you load in a map from a city builder game? I would play that in a heart beat if it was even just sort of good.

Yeah good luck with that. If it isn't monetized to hell and back with DLC and Mirotransactions™ it wouldn't even be green lit by any of the AAA jews.

set it to only use 2 cores and it will not crash
there is probably some weird hardware/software rendering setting too

btw sc4 wll also run flawlessly in wine and you can use a windows partition's install of it if you link your sc4 documents folder.

sim tower is fucking LIT 100 100 100 btw
just download YOOT tower if you want to play it (made by the same guy + more shit its a good game)

Maybe I need to be the change I want in the world.

theres no reason it would be impossible. im sure theres more than one solution too. ripping assets from one game and putting them in another is something thats been part of game mods since forever.

its the best way to see change for sure and who knows, it could have a snowball rolling down a hill effect.

> imgur.com/gallery/v8UxR

That seems kind of small. I mean even Toronto is a few million, is it not?

It would be cool as a GTA style multiplayer game.

well, its still a work in progress,
I know, I'm a slow builder

that link had only 300k population, its comparatively a small number, but its just a number
every single entity in that city has life and goes about doing its own thing, so yeah, still pretty huge

That's not even taking up the entire map square. I've heard the map size is larger than the one in SC4, but it doesn't seem to make much difference because it's still subdivided into "plots".

Anyway, according to what I can find, it seems that the largest population you can get in Skylines, in the whole "region" is around a million. Again, this is something akin to a hard limit because of the agent system. The game simply cannot simulate more active physical entities moving around everywhere once you reach a certain size. The reason why the game natively capped you at nine of those city plots (and you need a mod to get all twenty-five) is also because of this. They didn't want you to fill up twelve of those plots with skyscrapers and suddenly the game starts getting buggy because it can't simulate any more agents. People who have used the mod to unlock all tiles and try to build a megacity over a million have encountered these errors.

I'll reiterate: the agent system was A MISTAKE.

we never did. it was just some guy hosting it on his PC on the weekends.

The biggest problem with Skylines is that most of the simulation elements are garbage. Skylines is mostly a game about creating something that looks nice. It is like the urban renewal kit of SC2k.

The only element I like from it was the traffic management and that is because I already do it in real life. I like being able to instantly change the roads rather than the few years of getting budgets passed,
arguing about traffic control with people who hardly understand how to get out of bed, the miles of red tape, and so on.

what is a safe place to download the game? I'm always wary of FREEWARE DOWNLOAD NOW OLDGAMES sites.

that's your opinion…. I still rather have 100k (not even 1mil) real cims going all over the place than have whatever millionsth you want faux fantasy sims and traffic…
its a gameplay design, choice and preference, but don't call it worse…
also, all "plots" in CSL are simulated simultaneously, you don't need to reload a different plot to play on them, the rest of the map doesn't pause…. (I know this was a limitation of the time)
its up to the player if he wants to build several small towns over a big a metropolis or just a big city altogether

Looks like you're off to a good start, user. I downloaded all the key mods except for RICO.

NAM comes with a set of tiles that raise or lower terrain in perfect increments when you drag roads over them.
Place 1x1 streets next to each other to flatten things.
There are mod that change the rate of inclination/declination for things like rail and highways. Drag those then delete for smooth slopes.
Other than that you're just gonna have to get really autistic and learn the puzzle pieces.

Pardon me, NAM does not come with the terrain raising/lowering tiles. I forgot the name of the specific mod though.

Why? What, exactly, does it add to the game?

I use these hole-digger/lifter lots. community.simtropolis.com/files/file/3599-hole-digging-lots/

this is exactly what I ask you, what does having a statistical number bigger than 1 million add to the game?
but having agents going all over the place actual puts real stress to the system, puts your network structure to true challenge (including having decent public transport)

i kinda thought that the idea of being on-line was cool, working together with other player and building some massive monument, and that it could of been expanded upon if EA wasn't a bastard

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>>>/suicide/

get a load of this

It's not about the number, it's about the size of the city. In SC4 you can fill a region the size of Connecticut if you have the time, but in Skylines you can barely make Manhattan before the game tells you "sorry, no more!"

Here's a comparison. Keep in mind that the SC4 example is one of the default maps that comes with the game, and is very small (only 4x4 large city tiles). Using USGS data, you can import actual terrain data from the United States into SC4, and with it make, if you choose, gargantuan regions. I'm currently working on one that is a mindfuckingly-huge 20x20 large city tiles. From how difficult it was to get that to actually render, that's probably getting close to the hard limit of how big a region you can make. But the point remains, you can make a region in SC4 that's literally hundreds of times bigger than the most room you can possibly have in Skylines. The reason for that is that the agent system and having all the city tiles "loaded" at once puts a very low cap on the size of allowable cities, both population and physical size.

Also, just because SC4 doesn't use agents doesn't mean traffic management is unimportant. It's still the most critical factor in making a working city (including managing mass-transit); but it's also not the ONLY factor.

Finally, as a matter of fact: in the real world, traffic systems were not designed and managed by simulating individual entities, either; they would need massive supercomputers for cities with populations in the millions and with all the complication of reality. Instead, they use statistical models based upon abstractions like peak volume and speed — the same abstractions SC4 uses.

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I hope you're not using the game to make the map files. A 20x20 region will take days on an Alienware Citrix Hadron Core SQL Server running the latest distro of Ubuntu.
SC4 Mapper was pretty good, downside is you'll have to load each region individually afterwards to get the overhead render but it's much faster.

It's not a complicated process. I used the USGS data to export a terrain section of the approximate size, did some minor edits, then transformed it into a greyscale bitmap (of size about 22 mb). Then I made a new region in the game using an already-established config map defining the sizes and locations of individual tiles. Once the region was loaded (the correct size and makeup, but all flat) I use a console command then point the region at the correct bitmap, press enter, and wait for it to render.

It took about 3-4 hours, and failed several times resulting in a corrupted/incomplete region, so actually getting it to work took half a day. This was back in 2009 on an ordinary, off-the-shelf $600 computer with Windows Vista — nothing fancy. I'm not sure why you assumed it would be so difficult.

SC4 Mapper took all of twenty minutes to poop out a functioning region about half that size. Downside was the overview map was in green and red.
There's a separate tool that allows you to make a config file overlaid on the map itself so you can put the right region sizes exactly where you need them. Half a day to make a map is terrible.

Well, that nice, I guess. I used a much more FUN process to decide where the map tiles were going to be (essentially I wanted the large tiles to be centered on open areas of land and around the city-centers, so I wouldn't end up cutting downtowns in half) which was taking the terrain map, overlaying satellite data, and then dragging around boxes while counting pixels. That took the other half-day. Also, the region map looks just fine, which is good because I really like looking at it.

In any case, you sound like a used car salesman trying to sell me SC4 Mapper. I don't really get it.

Well shit, now I wanna go make a farm

I spent literally years struggling to make farms in SC3K (you had to zone light industrial in the very specific conditions, in very narrow demand restrictions, bulldoze factories that showed up instead of farms dozens of times, pray you'd get a farm, and then go back and historically-designate HUNDREDS of tiles individually or they'd turn to factories) so when SC4 made it so easy to make farms as much as you like, I kinda got obsessed.

Just a bit, you know.

You can't really make farms in SC2K can you?

Not unless you change some buildings to look like farms.

user, you pretty much made my hometown in pic 2.

You've inspired me to go further!

Also has anyone had the superhero guy show up in their city? Or is that not a thing in SimCity 4?

If I remember right one of the SC3KU tutorials covers them but it's far from intuitive. The main tricks are:
- Far away from other zones.
- Powered but not watered, and low land value.
- Light industrial 8x8 minimum, creating each tile not needed.
- Only one border should have road.

Something I haven't seen brought up with SC3K is that your difficulty setting doesn't just affect starting money. It also influences the economy to make it harder, and the terrain generation is much more uneven.

Also a thing I wanted to try ages ago was to have a pyramid-style layout of buildings with road tunnels running under it, similar to one of the other SC3KU tutorials that has you make a tunnel go underwater. It'd probably be too expensive to actually do though.

Another fun trick if you have cash to burn is to make airports that look better than a clutter of buildings and a runway. It requires creative zoning/unzoning and demolition to get pieces to appear as you want.

Why is the world flat in Sim City? Why cant it be round? Did flatearthers design SC?

So urban renewal kit then.

Because bumpy ellipsoidal things are a right pain-in-the-ass. Also even at the scale of a major city you won't get much of a curve relative to the terrain.

god i remember this, it was the worst most frustrating thing

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SimCity 2000 on PC gets my vote for best while my favorite "Sim" game was SimFarm which will never get a sequel.

>Not making a spiritual successor mobage with timers and waifus

I would rather it remain dead than have to witness it's corpse be reanimated by the unholy forces that own Maxis these days. It was hard enough to watch what they did to Carrier Command.

I do traffic engineering. That is why I like the individual agents provided by CSL. You can physically see where the problems are and then adjust them in real time. If I wanted statically data and those numbers run through am equation, I would go do my job.

fucking hell man, you just rushed me a ton of repressed feels, so long since I even thought about this game
used to love that shit too, god need to find a GoG or something, sure it must have it

Eh, I'd just open up the building cheat and plop shit down where I actually wanted it instead of bothering with that. The biggest difficulty with airports in SC3K (and almost every other city builder) is that even a SMALL airport properly scaled would take up a quarter of a large city tile. Real international airports are absurdly huge; pic related. One of the ONLY things SC2013 got right was making an airport a goddamn "Great Work" the size of an entire city, because that's how it is in reality.

That's not a problem in SC4 when you can fill an entire tile with nothing but downloadable airport pieces, and then just leave it as eye candy on the region view.

yeah I think realistically speaking there's not much chance comparing games with real life human swarm

on another note, got an itch to play TpF again, pic related, gonna be a hard to get this track across

Never played that, going to go ahead and correct that.

found download?

Is there some sort of mod list to make SC4 look as pretty as those screenshots?

Oooh boy. Let's see what my plugins folder says. It's been a long time.

Ploppable cows/horses/llamas by "wishes fulfilled".
Rocks and other stuff by Cycledogg.
More rocks by Dogfight.
Yet more rocks by GDV.
Flora and paths by ChrisAdams3997.
Farm fences entitled "cercafazendas".
More ploppable scrub, and forest flora by Pegproductions.
Oil and water tanks by… someone; it doesn't say.
Ploppable water by JRJ.
Rural power lines by SFBT.
Miscellaneous rural buildings by Steamrobin.
BSC forest props.
The "rural variety pack" adds all those growable big farm lots.
The terrain itself is CPT "Olympic" terrain.

Like I said, most of this stuff is just lots, props, and textures you place right on any open space. It's a bit like painting. Took me a lot of experimentation to develop a style that looks good.

let's be honest won't we, all these games are just exercises for our autism

SC4 is perfectly "playable" with only the NAM and maybe a couple mods to fix industry not having enough jobs or the right ones. It's just not as good looking.

Skylines needs mods to be playable, and it will never be that pretty. You have to sacrifice a lot for the privilege of those curved roads.

Will we ever see Sim City 4: Network Edition?

You can do that technically. If you share a region through dropbox and tell the game via command line to load that regiou, you can have cooperative play, there is one caveat though. If there's two players playing adjacent cities ( cities you can connect to ), once one of them saves the city, it will also rewrite the adjacent city to write the connection, so it is advisable to keep a file somewhere keeping track of who's connected and who's not, to avoid those conflicts.

I was thinking more along the lines of 2000: Network Edition's "Multiple District Commissioners, one city". Even at that, that would still lack things like regional laws, and having to pay for buying land.

If only you could have bigger cities… SC2KNE would be perfect

What are the mods that fix industry?

we have open ttd
we have open rct
maybe oneday
we will have open sc4 …

I hope so. In the meantime SC1K was open sourced under the name Micropolis.

Industry quadrupler (though I only use a double-version because I LIKE factories).

There's also one that fixes high-tech industry to ACTUALLY have some R-$$$ jobs.

MUH DICK

...

This tbh, I think an open source SimCity 2000 with the featured from the Windows version would be great.

This stuff takes so freaking long to do. I've filled maybe one quarter of a new large tile with farmland, and done only the first level of detail, and it's taken like four hours.

I wish those powerlines had dirt lots instead of transparent ones. Putting plop-grass under them only kinda works.

I dont know how many people here play city builders as a development game so don't bully this wip too hard please

I've been spamming park greens to separate heavy rail from technology parks and offices lately because I like how it looks in macro

what addons or settings were you guys using? Like how can i setup a server so no matter how long it is running it will still be playable ? (unlike in sp where the longer it runs the less shit there is )

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I like the separation of rails from building spaces, especially in a modern city. It's less important for industry, but looks very nice next to houses and offices. Holy Christ, though, do you need to get a slope mod, if nothing else. I'd forgotten how insanely jagged roads get in vanilla.

Also, realism tip: rails should always be flat; have roads and everything else go either over or under them.

The rail viaduct is a horrible kludge I can probably fix in that part of the city but not elsewhere. The stupid semi-realistic highway mod that comes with NAM doesn't play nicely with some categories of tiles, I haven't figured out how to get rails to cross a RHW highway without using some kind of disgusting viaduct solution to cross the tiles.

Will tear up the highway and try to smooth out the tiles it crosses to dejaggify it next time I open up the save.

Every fix that removes the horrible frayed road edges on one zoom level leaves the graphical error intact on zooming out. I am experiencing a slow spiritual death from this.

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user, autists specifically made park lots just for that. Go get em and fix your shit.

Then tell me how to virtualize a W98 PC that can play Resident Evil 1 and 2 at a constant framerate. I've used Virtual Box, VMWare, PCem. All work like dicks.

I've never experimented with rural highways (despite doing a lot of rural areas), but you can probably work out something with hole-diggers to just dip quickly underneath the rail without having to go full-viaduct. RHW can do tunnels, right?

I'm in pain looking at that.
community.simtropolis.com/files/file/27646-250458-and-brf-tunnel-and-slope-mod/

Anons how do you do it? How do you unlock the autism to get good at SimCity?

What a difference between railroads and monorails?

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I mean function difference.

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You're much more likely to find freight on a rail line, monorail is primarily passengers.

I hear those things are awfuly loud

What exactly are hole-diggers? I haven't really delved into advanced mod autism for SC4 before since I've only really played it as an easily distracted kid and maybe for a week or two in the last month. Will that slope mod make the highways smooth the fucking terrain instead of taking on awkward bumpy shapes?

Monorails are sanic fast travelling long distances (I think they're modelled at over 120 miles/hour?) but have an extremely low attraction for in-city trips. They're there to see how much inter-city commuting I can force into mass transit instead of congesting highways. Heavy ground rail is only connected to freight stations to try to stop trucks from taking long leisurely trips down the main avenues on their way out of population centers and towards interchanges.

it glides softly as a cloud

reporting back in - dragging a rural highway overpass over a rail line will successfully form a highway-over-rail series of tiles, despite not appearing as a selectable item in any of the RHW or rail menus. Good to know for the future.

Flatten your goddamn roads you mongoloid.

So you're the guy that puts stop signs in totally fucked locations to suit the interests of country clubs and rich neighborhoods that like to make busy streets stop on both sides so it's easier for the rich fucks to pull out?

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Special "buildings" that raise or lower terrain in a cell by a set height when plopped/bulldozed. They're used when you need to be precise in your terraforming.

I'm not sure about "unlocking" anything. I've been playing it since the early 2000's, which was SC2K on SNES, and have been playing frequently ever since. It is, without question, the gaming franchise I've played most. Tens of thousands of hours. I sucked ass for a long time (and also because I was like 10) and only got better with lots of practice, and studying real cities to learn how they work and how that can apply to a limited simulation.

Rails are heavier, louder, cheaper and on the ground. Because of the way the trains drive on them (just via weight and friction) the allowance of both slope and direction change is extremely limited. Basically, heavy rails need to not curve very much at a time (if you ever make a rail "curve" that is 90 degrees instead of two separated 45s, you're doing it wrong) and be extremely flat — only rising a few meters over dozens if not hundreds of meters of horizontal distance (basically, if you need to make a rail rise 20 feet above a road, you'll be starting the slope a mile away) which is why this is avoided when possible. Because of these limitations, and because they need to be on the ground, and because they take a long time to come up to speed and slow down, they are best suited for taking large loads over long distances. That is why they are largely used for freight (although their use for taking large amounts of passengers over long distances has been supplanted by airplanes). They can also run through the middle of nowhere, because once the rails are built, they require no infrastructure and very little maintenance; there are no moving parts except for the self-propelled trains atop them.

Monorails are light, expensive, and typically raised above the ground, used only for passengers. Cars on a monorail essentially wrap around the rail, and are driven by electromagnets instead of friction (which makes them very quiet). This allows them to bend and curve and rise, as well as speed up and slow down quickly, with a great amount of flexibility. Being raised also allows them to weave between buildings and over streets, so they are ideal for short trips, with multiple stops, in the hearts of cities where there isn't a lot of room. However, they require a lot of expensive infrastructure and maintenance, including having a consistent nearby electrical source. It's only really feasible in downtowns when you need mass-transit and don't have any other options.

In the context of SimCity, monorails are "classier", so you're more likely to get rich sims using them, compared to rails or elevated-rails (or the NAMs trolleys, which are just elevated rails… but on the ground). I usually don't bother except for aesthetics. Once I've got all my poorer sims using mass-transit, the rich can just sit in fucking traffic amongst themselves; serves them right for being too uppity to use the options I've provided.

That is their primary intention, although it does make running roads up the sides of literal mountains a lot more difficult. Basically, it limits the amount a road tile can slope (so no going up a mountainside at 45 degrees!) and also the amount any two adjacent tiles can be different from each other.

Very little. The biggest issue with bandwidth is uploading 5-20 MB of map state to new connecting players.

OpenTTD can't deal with that kind of a player count. It's really best left to a max player count of 16 if the players are building networks that are non trivial.

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A G R I C U L T U R A L M A D N E S S

I like that river near the end.

Is there a point in installing it with CAM mod? I can't even get what CAM does honestly. Because in one place download is 13mb, in other 500mb.
And its like supposed to give you lots of gray buildings if you don't install something.

It's been a literal decade so I forget what CAM was. Was it the pack with loadse big new buildings and 6,000,000 dependencies that every separate modder is hoarding on their own private site behind a paywall?
NAM is completely different and practically essential if only for the traffic calculation fixes.

Basically, the game has several "levels" of size for all building types. For residential, think of a tiny house as being Level 1, a big house being Level 2, a small apartment being Level 3, all the way up to the biggest high-density apartment block which is like level 6 or 7. When you reach certain thresholds for population, when you provide the right services, etc. the game will unlock more levels, and bigger buildings can grow; you can't just zone for medium-density residential in a new map and expect Level-3 and 4 apartments to grow right away; they'll just grow houses.

What CAM does is add MANY more levels to high-density residential and commercial buildings. So once your reach certain thresholds of population and services and whatnot, you can grow absurd skyscrapers that are like Level 20. The thing is, the CAM at its base is just the coding that allows this to happen; on its own it doesn't come with any ACTUAL buildings to fill those bigger Levels. All those buildings are custom-made by modders, and that's what the ones with the bigger file sizes contain.

Anyway, if you're content with the sizes of buildings in SimCity, you don't need CAM. If you want to build absurd massive skyscraper forests composed of mile-high buildings like from sci-fi movies, you'll want CAM.

Now that's fucked up. I guess i won't be getting it.

Thank you.

So, if i only installed NAM, is it going to be an allright Simcity 4 experience and i don't need anything else?

NAM fixes the biggest problem with the simulator side of things. If you also want it to LOOK better, that's a whole 'nother can of mods, largely dependent on what sort of visuals you want.

If anyone wants I can give out a backup of my sim city 4 mod / region folders with all of the texture and building asset dependencies for the CAM starter packs that are listed on the sc4devotion forums.

I had to click through around 60 adfly links to get them all, and run over 80 gui based installers that literally just copy a .dat file into your sc4 plugin directory as a justification to show off a splash screen and "license agreement"

CAM doesn't just add SUPER ULTRA DENSE development commerical/ residential levels to the game, it also spaces out the population thresholds that allow progressively denser developments. This kind of fixes the problem of the game letting you reach the final ultimate end of game maximum density skyscrapers in a medium sized city without really trying to. You have to build wider before the next level of devlopment pops up, and the modded assets for the game also fix the retarded problem stock sc4 has where a final tier office building can provide over 3000 office jobs for the same footprint in size as the last tier of high tech industry which provides ~70 jobs. Fun fact: There aren't any high density industrial high tech lots in the base sim city 4 game at all. No matter how high your demand gets and how educated and utopian your city is, you can never get a HT industry building that's more than around .5% the effectiveness of an office building. The base SC4 development rules create a horrible environment where there is no incentive to ever zone anything but an eternal grid of high density CO/R highrises

Good game.

They deserved it.

I actually found one mod pack. mediafire.com/file/d8bhad3tzbb418h/Plugins.rar

I would appreciate to see yours too.

Industry does have terrible job numbers for their footprint, but a simple mod to quadruple the industrial jobs fixes that. Countries with a ton of offices are service-based and don't have a lot of giant factories, anyway.

That's like saying a painter's canvas provides no incentive to paint anything but a large square of a single color. SimCity is not a game with a win condition; there is no right or wrong way to build a city. If you're making a skyscraper forest and nothing else YOU JUST SUCK AT IT. That isn't the kind of thing that is going to be fixed by a mod. Just because the CAM hand-holds you to make things easier to make a realistic city, doesn't mean it's impossible or even marginally difficult to make one without it.

This is what happens when you don't properly manage demand crossing borders. You'll get mansions popping up in shitty small towns filled with farms (only to promptly abandon because there are no suitable jobs) if you have a high global demand for high-wealth residential. That's why the very first thing I do in a city tile is decide what I want to put in there, and adjust taxes accordingly. If it's a farm town, high-wealth residential/commercial taxes go through the roof, and dirty industry also gets a bump because they'll pay it and help offset the fact that farms don't pay squat. If a few mansions pop up anyway, they can suck my Socialism and pay the 15% tax rate.

I'm extremely lucky I gave my shit to a friend to spare them the 3+ hours of gathering dependencies to try out CAM before my pc died.

magnet:?xt=urn:btih:792b06d529e80b363ad1b4ba78e1a53e7d91b123&dn=SimCity%204.7z&tr=udp%3a%2f%2ftracker.publicbt.com%3a80&tr=udp%3a%2f%2ftracker.openbittorrent.com%3a80%2fannounce

Includes my shitty first two region files circa a week or two ago as a bonus. Anyone with the autism to try modding SC4 should be able to figure out how to peel away the shitty personal mods I'm using and just keep the massive pile of dependencies for CAM.

I don't exclusively make skyscraper forests, I'm just saying it's an obvious and blatant deficiency with the base ruleset that even cities zoned to be almost exclusively industrial sprawl will still have more jobs from the handful of office buildings that pop up on corners than the endless fields of industrial parks. I wouldn't care so much if the ratio was more like 1:10 instead of 1:300, but it just isn't satisfying when almost all of my workers are in a few tiny offices and not the sprawling industrial districts that I put 10x as much thought and energy into laying out.

I'm just saying that a simple 33kb mod will fix that one problem; you don't need the CAM for it; you don't need to clutter up your mods folder with half a freaking gig of stuff. The only thing the CAM adds that nothing else does is the larger buildings. If you don't want the larger buildings, you don't NEED IT.

Damn that looks so sexy I think I'm going to fap to it right now.

Except you can just not add any large CAM buildings to your sim city installation and only use the growth pattern changes added by CAM if you really want to. CAM is just a mod that changes the progression of growth stages in SC4 so that you need a higher population count before skyscrapers start showing up, then adds a few extra tiers of growth at the very end that fuckhuge skyscrapers can be added into to make them only appear at extremely high density. You can install the modified CAM growth pattern to the base game without adding any new lots or assets and it'll just rebalance the rate that buildings show up and what job / residence values specific ones have. If you looked it up you could even see the charts explaining the growth curve for CAM and how it works. Adding additional stages of development to industry with higher job density is a solution that feels like it fits SC4 a lot better than just slapping a scalar on all industry, and doesn't create strange problems like making farms suddenly demand 4x the population density to keep them staffed.

Who the fuck is paying you to shill CAM so hard? Seriously. This is getting absurd. Do you even play the game?? You've added literally nothing to this thread except trying to convince people to use CAM as hard as you fucking can.

What's the point of arguing so intensely over a petty difference in values over how custom / stock lots should get shuffled into the game's stage system?

Pretty autistic to go straight from giving actual advice to salt the earth YOU JUST SUCK AT IT over this.

How should I know? It's your argument. You are the one claiming it's so important that you need a mod for it. You are the one who said (however much in hyperbole) that without it, you'd just end up making an endless grid of high-rises.

Does CAM affect gameplay/balance?

All I know is the superFami cartridge looks sexy AF I'd stick my dick in it.

Would love a SimCity 3000 "plus" sort of Mr Wright Nintendo cartoony version (that's not quite SimCity 4), touch enabled for the Switch.

On TV its controller functional, but can be played touch only sans-joycons on the go.

Fuck I'd jizz

Why can't sims games have all the features of simcity? I wish such thing existed.

3000?

For me SimCity should be offline and single player.

They were going to do something similar with Simsville, but I guess they couldn't figure out how to make them blend together.

I don't know much about the Sim City series but I know the soundtrack to that game in particular kicks so much ass. I think I can find a link to the OST that was hosted on EA's site, with all the extra songs that didn't make it on to the official release.

Please do, I like the soundtrack as well.

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Shieeeeet, why did they kill this?

Also here's more SC3 music webm'd

WOO MUSIC

If you wanted help filling out your folder you could have just asked.

Does anyone else listen to simcity music when you have to do boring shit like finances and taxes? Makes it so much better.

I often listen to a variety of music when doing creative things (that aren't writing), such as artwork or building shit for Halloween. SimCity music has certainly been in the rotation a few times.

Someone please tell me some madman made a "cyberpunk" mod that allows me to build futuristic cities and slums, all plastered in neon light.

The only thing that I know of is a DLC for SimCity 2013, although you might want to check Quad's assets for Cities: Skylines, those are pretty futuristic.

And now for something.

=Completely Different=

Thanks, I'll check out those assets. Shame nothing really comes close though.

Get out, Oldshoes.

you know, just today I found a game in my discovery queue on steam, called
supposedly like oldey pharaoh type and cyberpunk in theme, not that expensive either, I'm gonna be checking it out next its on sale

My slope mod doesn't play nice with hills (and I just built it where the city really is, so blame the Carillo family for founding it in the first place).

Isn't he that guy that made that minimal vanilla tutorial an age ago?

Yare yare daze.

Damn you for getting my hopes up. That's Steampunk my dude. Night-and-day difference.

You know what?

Screw nature, I have concrete!

Why would you do such a thing.

SimCity is a world that begins and ends with "eminent domain". Sometimes the birds and fishes have to be kicked out to build new shops and housing, and sometimes the poor homeowners have to be kicked out to build a new freeway.

Progress requires sacrifice. Your greatest tool as Mayor is the bulldozer; citizens decide what to build, but only YOU decide what to destroy. They must never be allowed to forget that they are expendable, even if it requires The Hand of God.

How long it will take to mod Sim City into japanese environment? I heard lots of mods are available on japanese websites, but cucks don't want to make a pack of them, because they believe its illegal. So you have to lurk on nip forums building by building.
The result is gorgeous though.

Which one?

Woah easy there Drachton Below.

I would prefer ultra-slums with neon lights.

Like Blade Runner or like Hotline Miami?

Imagine driving around night tokyo on AE86 sprite model in rush mode.

Fucking why. Why are the Japs always this fucking passive and retarded when it comes to shit like this? It's either that or they keep it to themselves out of spite. It pisses me off beyond anything.

That looks so cool.

Something like this but with more trash/dirt/slums.

I tried out SC4 a little while ago after playing a bit of Skylines/Banished.

What the fuck is this? This shit is ridiculous compared to Simcity 2000 or the games I mentioned above. I shouldn't have to constantly restart to get fucking anywhere with my city. Not to mention how everything looks ugly as hell with agriculture everywhere because nobody else with do anything anywhere else even with education.

Install NAM, vanilla SC4 is broken, also i will upload old shoes plugin pack on vola

You need to educate people before demand for better industry will increase. Its really complicated shit.

I added elementary and high schools (It's what we could afford) and still fucking nobody wants to do anything besides clog up entire maps with fucking agriculture.

The Environment score is pretty much the least important as a city-wide statistic, and has more to do with how many parks and green space you have than what kind of industry. The thing is that some types of farms put out ludicrous amounts of water pollution, but that can be solved later on by building water-treatment plants that clean a circle of water pollution around them.

Feel free to ignore the advisors. They don't matter.

Just because something is in demand doesn't mean you're forced to zone it. Build some schools and educate your dumb hick sims and they'll start demanding better industry and more commercial over time. You can also alter demand by changing tax rates. Agriculture won't grow if you zone for medium-density industry.

You can't "win"; it's a sandbox game; what the fuck are you smoking? I can't say I'm surprised at this from someone that came from Skylines, which is half a traffic simulator and half a hand-holding simulator, but SC4 requires you to actually figure shit out on your own because that's how games were a decade ago. You can't claim it's a bad game when there's all these people making beautiful cities.

Did you expect to just be instantly good at the game with no time or effort??

I often forget that SimCity 4 actually has a night mode, which is stupid because I even got a mod that makes it appropriately dark compared to vanilla.

It seems train service still runs, even at midnight.

I remember when a huge japanese database for one porn game was disabled because the developer died. And nips didn't shared anything they saved from other people because "they promised to not reupload each other stuff, even if links are dead". "Standarts of our community will become a new low if we allow ourselves to reupload stuff".

I had ethernal butthurt over this and insulted them.
Never dealt with nips since then.

japanese honoru prohibitu reupuroadsu

Did sumebody suy suburbs?

LIVE, damn you!

That's a nice town.

God, Simcity 4 has the weirdest fucking viewing angle I've ever seen in a video game.

>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isometric_projection
It's a classic pseudo-3D viewpoint, popular in many games in the 80's and 90's with a map you could scroll around in (like basically every RTS and TBS game ever made). It was what they used for SimCity2K, and it has stuck in the franchise ever since.

But it's not normal isometric. It's like it's rotated slightly to the right.

Been playing this recently actually. Having a lot of fun. This is what im working on currently.

Learn to budget and tax accordingly to draw in new industries

in the meantime kill yourself casual faggot

Digging through some old files. Found literally the first city I ever built in SC4.

Yikes.

By the power of cows…

I only ever played the demo and it was buggy as fuck and the character models were beyond ugly, but the world felt unreally huge. I remember just walking around the map for hours (there was a pedestrian mode too) even though you couldn't really do anything. Note this was one year before Carmageddon, three years before Driver and five years before GTA3 so the open world city feel was mesmerizing.

u srs

Random crap from years and years ago.

been working on this city for a little bit, what do you guys think?

I just hit 250k, I still haven't expanded into the entire map yet so I haven't used any high-density zones (except for industrial)

Right now my budget is ~65k spending ~70k profits

Playing on hard mode of course.

It takes a long time to learn the intricacies of SC4. The basic thing to do is:

Now once you are done with Phase 1 (your city should have a 10k surplus because dirty industry makes BANK)

Check the education graph, once it reaches a certain point your sims will want CO and I-MT. Demand for I-D will plummet. tax I-D to make sure it doesn't come up anymore. DO NOT delete your I-D.

Keep exapanding your city with commerical and residential things, make sure that you are giving everything water (including I-D, you need to give it water to get high-density I-D).

That should get you on the right track, the only effect air pollution has is that high-density residential will not appear in areas with air pollution. So dont expect R to get too high around industrial areas (except for I-HT). Otherwise air pollution means shit. Also build hospitals, police stations to make CO appear. Demand will go up and down but it means fuck all if you do things right, because eventually it will upturn and fill out your empty lots.

That grid is making me bleed from every orifice, and the traffic map is pretty much the worst possible thing you could have chosen to show off your city, but I guess it's okay if you're making a decent profit.

What does hard mode even do besides restrict the amount of money you start out with? I've never used it.

it lowers the demand in general, and punishes you far harsher for things. Its harder to do things the lazy way since if you go over the water, power capacity entire neighborhoods will abandon incredibly fast and you will lose thousands of people. Tear down the wrong factory, say goodbye to a city block who just lost their jobs.

The traffic here is actually pretty good, a lot of the red sections are "streets that should be roads" and are non-critical. (still important). Its by no means an ideal map but its definitely adequate… I don't have a huge amount of "abandoned due to commute time" buildings. I need to fix this for high density (I haven't made the subway system very extensive, nor Have I done so with the monorail system, so I am not worried about the traffic issues since once those are expanded things will be a lot better.

I haven't been autistically aligning the grid because it doesn't matter. Its so easy to max out roads that the real solution is to cut through the routes with an avenue. (which has worked wonders, some areas which have relatively low traffic were much worse before I did this)

Its easy to do what you want in easy mode, but if you try that shit in hard mode you will probably fuck up the demand and have your city spiral out of control, you should try it just to see what bites you in the ass since IMO it makes you a better player.

Hm, well I'd be interested to see other measures of the city, like zones and your tax rates. Honestly, by the time you get to having largely high-tech industry, traffic becomes a non-issue because you can put it right next to commercial and residential with basically no ill effects. The only thing is this actually harms you in the long run because higher density commercial LIKES high volume roads. It's tough to get any skyscrapers growing if your traffic system is just too good.

yeah, in hard mode commercially buildings will abandon if they don't get enough customers, which lowers the land value , which makes other buildings abandon…

These are all my stats, the garbage problem has to be solved by waste-to-energy plants, everything else is an illusion.

The solution to my problems is simple. More busses, subways, and monorails cutting through the road system. The areas without issues are the ones that have a lot of busses and subways and avenues, I just haven't bothered yet because I am still filling in the map, then I will fix my transit problems.

only tax rates is that I-D gets 10.5, everything else taxes are untouched. I did pass the ordinanaces for less air pollution, because you cant get skyscrapers if the air is polluted. Im not trying for that yet but I will soon.

I keep re-reading this, but I still have no idea what the fuck you mean.

If I had to guess, I'd say you got your start playing SC2K, because you're essentially still playing it exactly the same. I don't see any reason to not just plaster the entire tile with farms when you start out. It gives you an initial road structure (instead of just growing grids like the edges of an expanding bacterial colony) and they keep throwing money at you while you're waiting to fill the tile with something else. They don't demand any services besides power, and won't abandon easily even if demand starts going south. I've got maturing 100K population cities that still have farms on the outskirts.

No, I didn't start out playing SC2K. But I have a lot of time trying and failing with SC4. I never bothered with farms. If you're at 100k on a large tile then at least half of your city should be farms