Trophies/achievments

are trophies one of the cancerous pillars of modern gaming?

seems to me they often pad game with it instead of making proper content to game

I honestly couldn't even tell you why they were created. I remember unlocks in ratchet and clank for doing certain tasks but I don't get achievements and trophies and all that other junk.

Yes

Achievements are often used as a form of player research to see what people are doing and how far they get into the game, which is why you see "pointless" achievements like "Started the Game", "Beat the 1st Chapter", etc.

The problem with this is that the publishers saw that a bunch of people completed very little of the game and used achievements as one of the excuses to cut corners and make shorter games.

So yes, achievements are cancer.

To track how far how many players get in the game, what things most players do, or if they even played it at all. Why do you think Steam shows you the % of owners of the game that have each achievement or why "You started the game!" achievements exist?

Yes. Why?

Telemetry.

Achievements were devised as a means of providing metrics to developers (and by extension, publishers) for things accomplished in games, based on the scales of player progress vs. player retention.

Problem is, players don't like being datamined or having their metrics uploaded, or their game "phoning home" for any reason - so, achievements had to be created as a compromise between delivering user metrics while also appealing to gamer vanity. Especially when that vanity can be implemented in social media to supplement advertising purposes.


Progress is also measured on an incline. If player progress doesn't match that incline, then that is wasted man hours and content - which, also coincides with the "wider audience" and dumbing down of the hobby as a whole. If a certain percentage of players aren't meeting the criteria of certain progress, (be it the game being too demanding or simply being too long), then it is cut in the following title, with expansion upon the content that the players DID consume the most.

That's why you see games getting shorter, getting easier, and content as a whole being cut and gated behind incentives.

So, yes. Fuck trophies and fuck achievements. They aren't one of the cancerous pillars of modern gaming, they are the enabling framework that game developers and publishers a clear illustration of just what the widening gaming audience is willing to put up with.

Pirate your shit, folks, unless you REALLY trust that developer to use your telemetry to make their next game better.

I like the concept of being rewarded for my actions. Don't you?

Like unlocking DMC1 costume for beating DMC3 once?
Like unlocking additional characters in Tekken for beating game with default ones?
Like viewing narration from different point of view after beating Nier?
Like getting poster armor, that also has good stats for exploring dangerous off-the-track location in Dark Souls?
Yes, yes I do.

A fucking icon in the corner of the screen is not a goddamn reward.

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I actually like achievements. I have so little drive to do anything that playing most single-player games feels like a chore, unless I really get into it, and achievements give me a little hit of dopamine to reward myself for progress in a game I would otherwise not enjoy.

I sometimes think of going back to game but then I realize its just one icon and a text, nothing really of value and I could spent that time watching some movie or playing another game

I'd rather they do so with unlockable in-game shit rather than a picture and a pithy catchphrase on social media.

Yes. In fact, I remember a few specific games that would have been shit to mediocre without real in-game unlockables (the amazing precursor to achievements) that were amazing otherwise. There was Predator: Concrete Jungle that was fun, but was admittedly middling in gameplay, graphics, and mechanics; and the unlocks kept me coming back for weeks. Kirby Air Ride had an achievement system that shames most games. Modern trophies and achievements are a pathetic excuse compared to what came before them. Smash Bros Melee wasn't made by the trophies, but they were at least something cool in-game that was unlocked and provided something in-game. Mortal Kombat: Deadly Alliance had some really neat shit in the Krypt (or whatever it was called. Something with a k).
I want that shit back. I want completing some useless time-sink to give me something in-game I can use, even if it's a virtual poster or just some trivia. I don't want a feel-good point on some video game social media account I never wanted and didn't ask for.

Unlockables have been done away with. Now instead of earning them in-game, you have to buy them as DLC. When you do things in-game that would have previously unlocked an actual reward, you now just get a gay popup and get your info broadcasted to big brother as a bonus.

Achievements/trophies are key to the cancer that is DLC.

I think the last time this was done was in W101.

And to answer OP's question, yes, it's one of the biggest cancer as
nicely explains.
I turn that shit right off, be it on steam or any of the sony-consoles, because getting a trophy-icon during gameplay is really fucking irritating.
And for steam you have to be offline for that.

Instead of asking the randos all about this image board, why not point that question toward actual developers who may genuinely answer it?

Because I've never heard the developer's side of the story. I know we'll never get the publishers, but it's possible now to ask about cheevos from some devs. This isn't to say the answers here are wrong, but I recall a time when kids willingly sent in this Telemetry without even being asked to. Taking pictures or VHS data of their high scores or playthrough and mailing them to game companies, or else bragging to their friends at the lunch table in anticipation of getting a gathering together that afternoon. That used to be a thing for some players—perhaps not wisespread, but certainly not unpopular. After all, that same mentality was prompt and prominent in luring players far and wide to gaming tournaments of various makes.

Which leads me to suspect no one is taking advantage of the player, as much as they may be taking the player's natural actions to the next step in order to produce and act on trending data.

If we ask a dev, we can find out if those actions are any kind of boon to a game, or if it's genuinely a vice.

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i hate datamining and achievements. I just want the game to be fun. that should be the only reason why I enjoy it.

I find them a convenient way to see what games I need to spend more time on, and it also shows how many games I buy compared to how many games I actually thoroughly play
But there better be a way to just disable them

i only like
thats all i like

These are useful, though they don't need to be achievements. I've had friends who thought they completed the game because the second to last boss was a giant, and flat out ignored me when I said otherwise.

yes, they are!

it's a casual filter. For those who can't success atgaming. Remember when you had to be good to success at gaming? Playing actually the game? Get the gold chocobo for knights of the round, finish the game without saving for an extra costum, unlock the bonus car at the end of the game, they all have one thing in common; you have to play the game. A hard task!

With trophies,a ll you have to do is, start the game and you get at least one. But they are nothing than dead souls with zero effect on the gameplay.

But making the player aware of their existence fucking spoils that because it alters the player's behavior in the game in order to obtain them. So the only thing they learn from Achievements is just what % of players will deal with what specific bullshit in order to obtain them. It doesn't inform you on how they naturally play and enjoy the game.

They could have done all that shit in the background without the player knowing, and they wouldn't have ended up taking a big steaming invalidating shit right in the middle of their data.

How do you pad a game with trophies? They're literally just dick strokes for playing a game.

data mining.
we're getting to the point where devs have enough data to say 'oh, well, only 5% of users ever got to this part, just fucking leave it out of the sequel'

Now now, 5% is how many who Started the game.

Im convinced that Trophy statistics lie to make shit more rare then it actually is these days.

wait you can turn off trophies on psn?

collectibles instead of more/bigger levels

You say that like trophies are some big thing that take assets and a great amount of time. If any dev spends more than a day on coming up with trophy milestones and programming then into the game they should be shot.

im sure its a lot cheaper to make bloated trophy list than add content while the results in gamehours can be same

You're assuming the game loses content due to trophies being included. You assume something is taken once trophies/achievements become a factor. Why do you think this?

Why not both?

I have 25k achievement points in WoW

Help me I want to quit but the time I have invested is too great

ask relative to delete your account?

Achievements are nothing more than a trick to fool people into thinking that they have value so they'll be more likely to buy a game, if you think that achievements or trophies have any value you're a idiot who falls for corporate tricks.

not intended, I just had a thought how I spent 160h on gundam game on ps3 to get platinum and how it trapped me for digital picture in profile

Give me your account info and I'll delete it. Just change your password if you use it for other things. Or request a perma-ban from Blizzard tech support.

Only if you get them for completing shit.

That's cancer.

I think Perfect Dark has something like that as well, if you were able to do a certain task you would unlock a cheat. It's annoying because with achievements are worthless outside of a stupid gamerscore to prove you have a bigger gaming dick.

They used to be, now no one really gives a fuck about gamerscore or level or whatever. They were introduced to eliminate the idea of unlockables and replace them with DLC while pushing social media buzz.

I'd wager in the coming years we'll see cheevos and trofees go the way of the dodo since its just more dev cost, however minimal and no one really give a shit.

There are a lot of people autistic enough to grind for them that's for sure.

I'm not a people person and never share my Steam/PSN account with anyone so I've got no use for them. I just finish the story of games I buy and move on.

But if people get a sense of achievement or social status out of trophies: good for them.

Not really. You get a warped view of the gaming community here on Holla Forums but most are casuals who only buy 2 or 3 games a year.

I don't see them as being any different than a 100% indicator in Donkey Kong Country and I loved shit like that.

Rewarding a player for doing something hard or going out of their way to perform well is a commendable attitude.
Giving them a medal that has the only purpose of boosting their e-peen is not, when instead you could give them an in-game item.

Honestly all of this. I love 100 percenting games I enjoy and most Trophies / Achievments just happen to go around just that. But then there is some really stupid ones that no one would ever do and elongate the game by making you do something autistic as fuck. As an example, Why the fuck do I need to kill 200 people with the worst weapon in the game just why?

Unlike Holla Forums who never buys anything.

I use cheevos as a way to get everything I can out of a game. I have about 20 100% on psn and pic related is on steam.

Trying to 100% Binding of isaac

It's just fun honestly, people that buy shit games for achievements really ruin it for everyone

I'm pretty much the same I think of getting every achievement as what the devs would consider fully completing the game. I also enjoy the occasion achievement that gets a chuckle out of me, like pic related


Of course there are still dumb achievements too like Hatred has an achievement for playing the game for 50 hours when it doesn't have nearly enough content to justify playing for that long

I hate that there's no other way but rarity to assign achievements on steam.

It really does fuck up everything, it encourages people to buy shitty games to get the achievements nobody would ever get.

But you can assign achievements any way you want. just click edit and you can pick which ones show up in the box.

That's what you were saying right?

No I mean on the sites that track achievements like astats
There's not one good site that tracks them, should get working on it myself one day

I don't mind them, so long as they're actually hard to get. Like, fine, fuck it. Bronze trophies for story progression. But you better fucking impress me if you want gold or better. It seems the advent of trophies coincided with the death of games that might actually have something worth rewarding them for. All-Platinuming Timesplitters 2's challenge mode, now that's some shit.

My personal humblebrag will always being having shot down the 8492nd on Ace in the F-4E in the mission you're supposed to run or instantly die.

Trophies are also good nudges for players to try doing something they might not have even considered as a challenge before. Like fighting an enemy they are explicitly told it is their job to escape from.

WHY THE FUCK ARE YOU LOSERS PLAYING GAMES? YOU ARE THE ONES KILLING THE INDUSTRY!

It's a good thing that never happens anymore. Now you just get an achievement and the item is paid DLC.


Because trophies became popular around the same time as paid DLC, and things that would have previously rewarded unlockables now reward achievements, while things that would have previously been unlockables are now paid DLC.

Shit like TF2, MMOs and isaac really REALLY brings down your completion unfortunately

I have almost 600 games mostly from humble bundles
I only got into PC Gameing 2 and half years ago
I'm working on it O.K

I also like playing games that don't have achievements
I not going to waste my time playing games I don't feel like just for achievements. When right now I want to and am playing Drakengard.

switching to PS4 got me addicted to trophy whoring
started last februrary, have something like 10 platinums now, probably another 2-3 in a month

feels good anons

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Yes and no. I like achievements linked to ingame levels/missions, it's an easy way to know if people actually play games or not. Achievements that are linked to anything online is fucking cancer though.

There are like two or three games that do both.

Age of Participation Trophy
Achievements are this and nothing more. If a game was goid enough than autistswould willingly find easter eggs. Now any mystery is gone because of trophys. Even more insulying when trophys reveal plot twists. But you gotta make that cadual feel good about participating.