Ignoring his methods, why was his plan to make everyone super framed as evil? Obviously...

>>114909893Because giving the general public a bunch of weapons is the worst fucking idea ever. He couldn't even predict that his own robot would over power him while he played "pretend" hero, you really think handing some random shmuk on the streat a glove that shoots a zero point gravity beam is going to use it for good, or at all responibly? He couldn't even use his own shit correctly as again, showen in both his robot fight and when he accidentally flings Mr. Incredible across the island cause he starts monologing.

>>114910452That's the point. He wants to show off to the heroes that "abandoned" him how amazing he is.

>>114910452>I mean, regarding the robot, why not just lure supers into his scheme by lying about the robot going berserk, asking the super for help, and then just kill themThat's literally what he did.

>>114909893He was like a spoiled brat breaking toys once he's bored of them so nobody else can play with them. He didn't just want the fame of being a super, he wanted nobody else to enjoy that fame out of pure pettiness.It wasn't about equality, it was about tearing everyone else down.

>>114909893I never thought his plan of making everyone super was evil. Killing off superheroes to make a giant robot just to make a name for himself (by blowing up shit and harming innocent people) was the evil part.

>>114909893>but why is his goal of putting everyone on an even playing field seen as evil?He wasn't doing it to empower people or because he thought he was making the world a better place. He was doing it specifically as an act of revenge against the very concept of superheros. Inherently spiteful motivation.

>>114909893his plan boiled down to being an arms dealer and selling murderbots to anybody with the cash. and then using his backdoor hacks to game his own murderbots and then create an image of him being a superhero. and then after he's had his fun, he'd sell off the more mundane crap to normies to get even richer.People misread the scene as "I want to give everyone super powers!" when its "I want to create issues that I'll then solve for my own selfish gain, while also making money off of originally making these issues".

Wasn't his whole plan to basically become the corporate overlord of the world doling out tech to those who pay homage to him.

>>114910487Yeah but he's the one that builds and programs it, there’s no point in making it more advanced. It just needs to be advanced enough to the point where civilian defenses are helpless, and he can take center stage by being the one that stops it.

He wasn't planning on making everyone supers. He was planning on making the rich and powerful super by selling them his technology. And he was selling his technology through a live demo that would have resulted in a lot of innocent people getting hurt. On top of that, he killed a bunch of super heroes to get his killbot working.

>>114910487The NSA shut down Syndrome's accounts as soon as he was outed as a supervillain. Seems like they knew he was playing arms-dealer but couldn't do anything since he was legit.

>>114910655There's this thing called the military.Have you heard of it?>>114910677I meant before that happened.

>>114910731I was referring to the military when I said “civilian defenses”. It feels like you’re missing what I’m trying to say, so let me just clarify.Instead of making an indestructible robot capable of taking down supers, he could’ve just made a robot that was strong enough to pose a problem for the military. There is no need to make the robot capable of taking down someone laser vision when he can just kill the superhero with laser vision.He only needs a bot strong enough to withstand the military so he can play hero, he does not need to upgrade it to be able to fight against other superheroes when it won’t have to fight other superheroes.

>>114910882>strong enough to withstand the militaryAnd how does he test that?

>>114910487You’re treating that hobo like he’s scum of the earth just because he’s homeless

>>114909893Because the Incredibles as a movie, like a lot of Brad Bird products, is all about misunderstood exceptionalist heroes that the rest of the world won't let save them with their obviously superior power. It plays a lot into a heavily romantisiczed Randian Objectivism.Basically, in a Brad Bird story, if we would all just step back and let the ubermench superior beings do whatever they want with no oversight they would solve our problems for us. In the Incredibles its Super Heroes (who have been made illegal and driven underground), in Tomorrowland its super scientists (who have fled to another dimension so they can work in peace away from our destructive assholery), and so on. Syndrome's plan is evil in this mindset because it seeks to neuter the super special awesome individuals by not longer making them awesome. And in objectivism if the individual cannot rise above all of the rest and assert his worldview on the masses with impunity then there can be no civilization. Objectivism is a shit ideology, for the record, and treated as a crackpot philosophy because under Objectivism it is morally good to take money from a homeless person because doing so benefits you as an individual, and morally wrong to give money to the poor because you don't get any material benefit for having done so. Its not impossible to be a good person and an objectivist, but its a philosophy that naturally lends itself to justifying why its okay to ignore anyone who isn't you and to grind them beneath your heel.

>>114910649Not quite, easily assumed and misunderstood due to the rapid fire way he goes over the itinerary but Syndrome's actual whole hang up was a disdain for hierarchies.He wanted to be praised for his skills but he didn't care about being in charge. So, as he said, he'd first show everyone what his genius and tech can do for the world, not run it, then when he's had his fun he'd just sell it all open market so everyone, emphasis every single person, is equal and no one is special.People also seem to think he'd sell it at a high price, no he's rich already, he can make jet boots from common materials when he was a kid and could build improved Omnidroids from scratch so he can manufacture minimalist and quick.It's an easy ironic target to paint on him but he wouldn't bother re-establishing a different kind of Super class with tech if it meant a return to form. Otherwise instead of equipping governments with his weapons he could have just slowly taken over and made himself secret emperor to begin with.No, what Buddy wanted was for everyone important or unique to all suddenly feel equally irrelevant no matter what they do, just like when Bob told him to fly home.

>>114910916Oh gee, I don’t know, with military weapons maybe????

>>114910932I don’t get why Tomorrowland kept on giving me shit for liking post apocalyptic fiction

>>114909893It's a communism allegory and communism is evil, that's why.

>>114910882But he doesn’t want any actual superheroes to gain relevance. If any former supers heard that a giant robot was attacking the city after what is generally a long period of petty crimes being solved by police and such, chances are they’d take it down in a much more efficient manner than Syndrome could with all of his staging. Last thing he wants are supers that garner public support again when a robot that can’t be stopped by a conventional military shows up. He also needs to be capable of killing said superhero, which is probably easier said than done. Might as well take care of both issues at once with a robot only he could defeat, both ensuring his success and showing that technology surpasses superheroes anyway

>>114910926No, I'm saying that there's a high risk of him messing up and blowing up a building by mistake, because he hasn't been fucking trained how to use the shit! You do know why people need licenses to drive cars and own guns, right? And if it's actually about equality, he may as well give it to the homeless. Maliciousness isn't the only way for that technology to be misused, there's also incompetence, and for all you know, that hobo may have never received a proper education! Hell, depending on where he lives, a "proper education" might not be enough to prepare him.And like I said, if it's just going to rich people who can afford it, that's not really about equality, so some jackass with a lot of money could fuck shit up.>>114910954It takes more than just equipment to know your enemy, and I think the kind of espionage required to get all the other information, plus enough of the weapons and ammo to conduct the tests, would be a lot riskier than what he was doing. The private island is fine, but stealing military equipment and secrets? They're gonna notice that.

>>114910983Because your a being a pessimist, user. Just be smilely and optimistic and let your overlords decide what is best for you.Really, that whole plotline just fell apart because it gave the audience shit for having apocalyptic fiction that that makes us piss away the world because we worship our own destruction, but then also said we didn't have a choice because a machine was literally broadcasting that stuff into our heads on a constant basis? Whats supposed to be the takeaway there? Are we to blame or aren't we?

>>114911255I’m never gonna apologize for liking Fist of the North Star, Brad can lick my shit

>>114911039I feel like his methods were somewhat contrived. If he doesn’t want his show getting usurped but is also willing to kill off former heroes, it just seems easier to kill them off using other methods besides a giant robot. I mean, he managed to make a robot strong enough to cut mr. incredibles arm, and mr. i was supposedly the superhero with the most durability. He was even able to make a cell capable of containing supers, couldn’t he just keep them their and electrocute them to death? Idk, their just seems to be better alternatives to getting rid of former superheroes in order to make sure his plans aren’t foiled.>>114911161It’s true that getting access to military weapons would be a lot more suspicious, but wouldn’t superheroes disappearing one by one without a trace also be a point of concern for the government? These are the most powerful people on earth, and they’re all just vanishing. I feel like that would draw more attention. Also, it’s not like america is the only place with advanced weaponry. Russia would’ve likely been okay with selling weapons. Hell, they gave Pepsi a fleet of boats in exchange for soda. Also, syndrome likely already manufactured weapons that were more powerful than what other countries had. He did mention selling weapons, and seeing as how he’s a genius, it’s not to far fetched that they were a lot more powerful.

>>114910983Something something thanatic death drive something something subconscious desires something something self-fulfilling prophecy.

>>114911683>wouldn’t superheroes disappearing one by one without a trace also be a point of concern for the government? These are the most powerful people on earth, and they’re all just vanishingOf course not. The governments banned superheroes because they were sick of cleaning up after them. As far as they're likely concerned, it's just less liabilities to worry about.

>>114911683>Russia would’ve likely been okay with selling weapons.Yeah, but his plan isn't to attack Russia. And it wouldn't make sense for a guy who is not Russian or even anywhere close to it being the first one on the scene.>I mean, he managed to make a robot strong enough to cut mr. incredibles armAfter going through many earlier models of robot.

>>114910452Syndrome needed to be sure that his Omnidroid could kill any super. It's no good in trying to hog the fame and glory if a random out of nowhere super tried to or successfully destroy it.Remember that Syndrome was going to have Frozen killed at one point, but Bob popping up meant that Syndrome could skip right over Frozen since he knew if the Omnidroid could take on Bob, it could take on pretty much anyone.

>>114911778He also had Elastigirl on his radar, and she was presumably next on his hit list since he knew where she was living. Once he saw Bob, he went straight to the top.

Is OP Lex Luthor?

>>114911771Yes they would. A superhero going missing is like misplacing a nuke, and they’re all vanishing, that wouldn’t just fly under the radar>>114911776>his plan isn’t to attack russiaNo shit, for fucks sake guys, I’m saying he only needs a robot strong enough to beat the military, I only mentioned russia because that could’ve been another way of receiving high grade weapons that he could use for testing in order to make his robot strong enough to pose a threat to the military.>after going through earlier models of robotsYou missed the point. I was saying their are other methods of killing off supers, again, why doesn’t he just kill them off bu other means instead of using an expensive giant robot.>>114911778Yeah. I get it. What I’m saying is why not just kill them using ulterior methods instead of investing in an expensive robot that’s going to take years of improvements and modifications only for it to be used to make him feel special.

>>114911861He was looking for Elastigirl, but actually didn't know where she was. Bob found that in the records, remember? He gets worried when he sees Elastigirl on the list, but is relieved when it says "Location Unknown".Syndrome even has a little geekout later when Helen shows up. "You married ELASTIGIRL?"

>>114911778>Syndrome was going to have Frozen killed at one pointMust have really been planning ahead.>>114912305He'd have stats on Russian weaponry, not American ones.And I'm saying that he had to work his way up before making the robot that could handle anything by starting small.

>>114911778Frozone was his next target. After Mirage recognized Bob, she decided to lure him instead

>>114912305What good is dropping a untrained and mediocre robot in a city if it can be destroyed by some random jackass who had powers that was hiding the entire time? Making it absurdly powerful would mean that anyone attempting to destroy it would die, thus making Syndrome's arrival to save the day more dramatic and bold.Also Syndrome needed to be alone when defeating the robot or else the fame is fragmented to two or more people, and trying to make them disappear right after would raise flags. Having the supers he missed getting killed during the battle would make it easier for him to get the light.And that also brings that Syndrome could not find all the supers, he couldn't find Elastagirl, and he wasn't aware that she had kids that also had powers. Better to have the missed supers killed during the robot'srampage or have them being scared shitless and letting Syndrome do all the "hero" work.

>>114912393If it’s just a matter of working his way up, then why not use his own inventions to improve his weaponry? He is a genius and he is a weapons manufacturer, there’s no need to trick superheroes into fighting his robot just to test it out, he only has to kill off the supers and keep improving his own shit. Plus, his weapons are much more advanced than anything the military had. Syndrome invented a fucking laser that could just stop anything in it’s tracks, that’s more powerful than most conventional military weapons. It makes more sense to use his own weapons for testing. The dude even made a tiny ass bomb capable of doing more damage than anything in use at the time. He doesn’t need to test his weapons on superheroes. He doesn’t need a giant robot capable of fighting superheroes that were going to die anyway.

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>>114913008Are you assuming that he understands all of that though?

>>114912905It’s a learning robot. Making it strong enough to handle standard military is enough. He can kill older supers beforehand, and if a new superhero who was always in hiding comes out of nowhere, it’s a learning robot. It can adapt with the situation. Even if a new super who was unknown to syndrome appeared, it’s not exactly like they would be capable of taking down a giant robot while juggling civilians and making sure few people got hurt, they’re still a novice and have likely never handled a situation like that.

>>114913071Yes. Why wouldn’t he. Why wouldn’t he realize that a fucking spoon on his wrist is more powerful than a grenade

>>114913259I meant understand that he didn't need the robot to do stuff instead of using his stuff right away.

>>114913071>It’s a learning robot. It can adapt with the situation.Yes, we all know that. And despite that it still lost to multiple supers with experience, and even Mr. Incredible himself because he outwitted it with brain than brawn.> He can kill older supers beforehandHe didn't kill Helen, couldn't find her until she was on his island, and he ignored Frozone entirely despite finding him because Syndrome knew the robot learned enough from Bob that pretty much nothing could stop it. And remember that fucking Syndrome himself couldn't find Bob for the longest time either, and that was Syndrome's cherry on top. If Syndrome sent that robot to destroy the city without finding Bob, we could assume that Bob would more than likely destroy it.>it’s not exactly like they would be capable of taking down a giant robot while juggling civilians and making sure few people got hurt, they’re still a novice and have likely never handled a situation like that.How can you say that all the supers who would have dared to destroy it would be novices? We know that Syndrome missed two, how can we say he didn't miss any more than that? Why would the supers try to prioritize saving a few random stray civilians if they believed that if they failed to stop the robot, it would eventually kill all the civilians?

>>114909893Because that's what happens. Syndrome's a cruel menace to society who wants all superheroes dead, because of Mr. Incredible telling him to "fly away", and imagining the scene without Bomb Voyage in it from his point of view.As for the indestructible robot, it also goes to show us how villains can be too complacent, that their evil plans can backfire on them, as shown when the Omnidroid knocks away the remote on Syndrome's hand while it was unleashed on the city.

>>114913362I guess from a purely logical point of view, he should have. But I will admit, I did disregard syndromes own personal goals and vendettas against supers. Like, he did idolize superheroes and genuinely wanted to help, but was of course rejected, so I guess in retrospect, him wanting to watch superheroes getting killed by his inventions gladiator style did make sense in terms of his own personal life experiences. So yeah, it does make sense he would go through this convoluted process just to boost his ego and live out his revenge fantasy

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>>114910926It's less scum and more ignorant.We've seen a bunch of hobos cook food with a proton pack for crying out loud and that tech's been known to the public for decades.

>>114913490From a purely logical viewpoint, if he wanted to make sure everything went according to plan, he should have gotten rid of older supers. He doesn’t beed to test his bots on supers when he can use his own weapons which are much more powerful than anything the military would have. Regarding supers who have never done hero work, you cannot assume that someone would be capable of taking down a major threat just because they have the potential to. Just look at syndrome, despite planning the whole shebang for 15 years, he still got btfo’d by the robot he invented in one move. Just because someone has a big gun, doesn’t mean they know how to shoot it.

>>114909893>why was his plan to make everyone super framed as evil?It wasn't. The line is only meant to expand on Syndrome's world view and how much he resents supers. That part of his plan was never addressed by other characters as having any real importance or significance. Bob and Helen aren't like, "We've gotta stop him! He's gonna make people super!"

>>114913807Yeah man, I get it now, his motives were more personal than logical, we went through an entire thread talking about it and culminated here:>>114913566

>>114909893He was going to be an arms dealer, selling to the highest bidder.

>>114913860Word. Didn't read the whole thread before responding, my bad.

>>114913741>if he wanted to make sure everything went according to plan, he should have gotten rid of older supers.And how long would it take to find them all? An extra five years? Twenty? Forty? And in that time, more people with powers would have popped up, maybe another villain decided to make their plan happen, maybe supers become legal again? What if a bunch of unknown supers decided to train in secret and were just as good as the supers Syndrome killed? Syndrome had time but it was infinite.>He doesn’t need to test his bots on supers when he can use his own weapons which are much more powerful than anything the military would have.That's true, but are you going to use your weapons on the supers that popped up out of nowhere in public while trying to fight the robot you unleashed?>Regarding supers who have never done hero work, you cannot assume that someone would be capable of taking down a major threat just because they have the potential to. Just look at syndrome, despite planning the whole shebang for 15 years, he still got btfo’d by the robot he invented in one move. Just because someone has a big gun, doesn’t mean they know how to shoot it.And you can't assume they can't. Really I should just say that Syndrome himself says that he wanted to build something he knows he can only truly defeat during the second Omnidroid fight. It doesn't matter if he cheats, he just wants to rush of "defeating" something that many supers and Mr. Incredible failed to beat.

>>114914202>how long would it take to fund them?15 years. How do I know this? Because that’s how long it took in the movie. And within that span of time, nothing happened, no new villains and no new supers. It’s weird how you mention all these possibilities that could happen, who’s to say none of that could happen with his original plan, had it gone through? Either way, syndrome wouldn’t be prepared for a secret superhero teamI think you got my second point wrong, I was trying to say instead of testing the bot with supers, he should just test them using his weapons since they’re stronger than the military. I’m saying, from a purely logical standpoint, in order to achieve his goal of playing a superhero, all he has to do is kill the old supers and make the robot strong enough so that he’ll look like a hero. Hypothetical situations are just that, hypothetical. Yes, there’s a possibility that, like you mentioned, there was a secret team of superheroes training in secret this ENTIRE TIME and we just didn’t know it, but that could’ve also been the case if his actual plan succeeded, because it’s a hypothetical. We can only deal with what we know is for certain.Honestly man, we’ve all reached a common ground in the argument. Yes, syndrome’s plan wasn’t the most logically sound, but it wasn’t supposed to be and it made sense for his character. It makes sense that syndrome wanted to watch supers die by his inventions. It made sense that syndrome would view mr. incredible as the most worthy adversary for his inventions. It made sense that he would want to spend so much time tinkering with this droid that represents the efforts of pretty much every known superhero at that time (or at least the ones that we knew) was made so syndromes could boost his own ego and put supers in their place. Or something. Whatever. It all makes sense. We’ve gotten to the final conclusion.The thread is over.Go home.

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>>114914560So this has been an entire waste of time.Alrighty then. I'll see you.

>>114914597

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