Games that allow Necromancer/Lich roleplay

What games allow me to live a life of a necromancer, leading my skeleton army to victory, enslaving humanity, with eventually becoming Lich with the power to fuck up entire game world, and lead my undead kingdom to prosperety?

Please don't even mention skyrim in this thread, tired of modding this garbage.

Other urls found in this thread:

silgradtower.net/Websites/Misc_ST_Related/HostedWebsites/Lichcraft.silgrad.com/index.php
store.steampowered.com/sub/12171/?l=french
twitter.com/AnonBabble

Nothing you'll be satisfied with
But you can become a Lich in Tales of Maj'Eyal. Just unlock all the classes with an unlocker since the roguelike mechanics don't lend themselves well to the story
There's also MM7 and 8 where the final upgrade for an dark magic sorcerer is a lich

for skele armies, Dominions 4, play as Ermor

Necronator

Sounds like the state of gaming industry, alright.
Simple top down rogue likes don't give me a "boner", if you ask me.
Aren't they are the worst chapter of MM or somebody lied to me?
I guess i'l have to look into this game after all.

Looks like mobile shit.

skyrim m8

They're not as good as say 4-6, but they're not bad games by any means
Realistically there's not a lot of necromancer games out there because "muh villain class" and devs can't make summoner classes to save their lives

Maybe games like Heroes of Might and Magic, Disciples and Age of Wonders are best for this kind of thing.

I mean, they are built over based fantasy settings, and allow you to become powerful leader along side roleplay elements.

Age of Wonders 3.
Or Elona. Look out for a "Coffin of Necromancy" item. You're gonna have to work for it though.

No, you're not. 3-4 spawn in the cemetery east of Lumiest and there's even a DD key there that helps automating the summoning\dismissing of undead.

You stupid dumb motherfucker.
Those will give you some cat-zombies or some weak ass shit.
And with no anatomy or alchemy skill, you end up spawning some lvl 1 btich ass rotting piece of meat that can at most bitchslap someone before a strong breeze desintegrates them.

Being a proper Necromancer needs you to:

How long do you think it takes for that?
It's a few hours until it's done. The good news is that once you get it going, it's a fucking rapetrain that just doesn't stop getting better and better as your skills improve.
The bad news is that it takes a truckload of time to start it.
Try 15 you dumb fucker.

This is something that happens so fucking often you'd think it's badly done on purpose to the point there has to be a cabal dedicated to fail at this.
How hard can it be to treat the player and his minions as a single player but most of your power is distributed among your minions instead of you?
The more you can summon, the weaker they are, the stronger you want them, the bigger the costs.

There are several logistic problems with the creation of an undead army, namely how it leads a lot to farming for dead bodies which might not be that fun after a while or how you'd have to mix RTS elements with actio-RPG ones. But as long as the game is designed for this, it shouldn't be an issue. For instance:

Have the player build a tower or similar structure as his base, using zombies as workers.
The player has a cap on the amount of undead he can keep up and the initial part of the game is spent scavenging graveyards and attacking villages for easy corpses.
After a while, you'll need to summon more undead or unlock new spells\abilities so you'll have to buy equipment with the gold you pillage and sacrifice special characters like virgin maidens or local heroes.

To expand the cap of undead, you need to build fethers that can hold them and you require pure souls for that, souls that can only be obtained from princesses (well guarded) or paladins (powerfull enemies) and there's a limited amount of both in the map so you'll have to hunt for them to expand your army.

Eventually unlock new types of undead that are more powerfull. Ghouls instead of Zombies, several types of skeletons (archers, mages, pinwheels, dancers) wights and specters as well as Abominations. Tackle with vampires, capture and research several of them and then produce your own that are loyal to you.

Gameplay would revolve around controling minions ala Overlord but with more tactical depth and you spamming researched spells. Eventually you'll reach lichdom and several more spells and resistances are available to you.
Capture every pure soul, raze every city and destroy the Holy Temple that prevents you from becoming a Demigod of Death to win the game.

The closest you'll get to the functional tabletop process of Lichdom is Skyrim with the Undeath mod + the stuff for the Lich perk tree and the others mods, but Skyrim is a shit climate for Necromancy essentially.

Oblivion had the most functional Necromancy mods with the guilds and Order of the worm before the mas TES:O Cuckening, but it didn't have a functional Lichdom mod, the main one being broken in that it only works on 32 bit systems because the mod creator didn't write the fucking texture paths properly for the Lich models in the .nif files.

ToME (Tales of Majeyal) has necromancy, but good luck with unlocking it, because necroshits are hard to kill unless you go fullblown anti-magic Khornate as a Beserker, levelling nothing but bloodthirst, the life regen stuff and dumping everything into strength and CON and killing all uselss NPCs for gains.

Why the fuck no one has made 2e Ravenloft Lichdom for Any Baldur's gate game is beyond me, or had contimued with the Divine remix mods fucking Sphere system is also a divine mystery.

Might and Magic Games occasionally allow for the promotion to Lichdom, but there's nothing flashy or meaningful about the transition, it's just a gameplay perk, with the bonus of Dracolichdom to boot.

NWN with the PrC 3.5 allows for Arclichdom, Baelnorms, and Monster Manual Dm Discretion Lichdom an Demilichom, though again, unless you're on a server with these feature implemented properly it's not really that interesting.

Elona+ let's you choose a Lich from the start, that is crap, and seems to have no effort put into it whatsover, it's nothing more than a caster aligned race, all the Npcs don't hate you, you don't get anything to benefit what little necromancy items the game has, YOU CAN STARVE, and no phylactery, so it's just another case of the gooks never understanding what a Lich is in full and sucking vampire cock as per usual.

Morrowind has a Tabletop esque lichdom mod called Lichcraft I think.

To be honest, I just want a fucking Mineshit mod that implements D&D 3.5 in as it's the perfect enviroment for something like that to be implemented.

why do you talk to yourself nigger

I know you probably won't like this but the new Total War: Warhammer has a undead faction called the vampire counts. lots of undead roleplaying there. lots of art. you can raise dead instantly if there is enough in the province and having a battle with thousands of casualties lets you raise even more numbers and more powerful types.

before it came out I was on the same quest as you and this mostly satisfies it. Spreading vampiric corruption changes the landscape. and if you fight well for hundreds of years you might enslave the entire world. I play on legendary and of course haven't finished a game yet. I have developed a strong hatred of dwarves.

But I agree, I would like a game where you can slowly corrupt the land and kill everyone to join your army.

The undead/lich factions in "warlock" were ok but not "spreading the curse of the undead" enough for me.

Not trying to sell you this game and I feel like you are looking for a RPGbut this is the best I know of.

I think maybe we should make our own if there is this much unsatisfied interest.

I think the Illuminated Order mod for Morrowind allowed you to become a lich.

You can try Heroes of Annihilated Empires. It's RPG/RTS. In skirmish you can play as hero without RTS or play as RTS with hero joining later in the game, but you get HUGE armies, counted in hundreds of units. No campaign for undead unfortunately. There's some neat spells if I remember, like summoning dark tower (can't remember what it does), there's summon undead I think, stream of acid, giant lens to burn stuff, earthquake to swallow people and builidings. It's skirmish only , so it'll probably get boring after a while, but I spent quite some time playing it against AI. No becoming lich, but you WILL get power to fuck people up. Also your buildings spread spooky ala Warcraft 3.

What the fuck are you doing

We have ID's you faggot.

Oh, and there's Conquest of Elysium which is basically Dominions-lite. Someone who actually played Dominions might want to correct me if it's actually worth to play CoE instead of Dominions. I tried it, but can't get into it.

This is better:
silgradtower.net/Websites/Misc_ST_Related/HostedWebsites/Lichcraft.silgrad.com/index.php

two worlds 2 had a pretty good summoning system

Just why?

Its even more funny when you could actually express your opinion on the subject in a single post, but instead you decided to roleplay with yourself. I love ids, they reveal complete retards.

I'll add that the Ordinator perk overhaul mod has Conjuration perks that let you have half a dozen skeleton minions, which is about as close to an army as the game engine is going to be able to do.
Still, it's definitely not enough. I want necromancy to work like it supposedly does in Blood on the Ice: hunting down parts from specific corpses to create a Frankensteinian abomination. Skyrim also needs something like Elona+'s DD Cemetery Key for corpse storage.

Heh, packaged as an .ace file, haven't seen one of those in years.

Nice, looks like it is compatible with Illuminated Order too, I'll have to check it out next time I replay Morrowind. Thanks

...

I wonder… are IDs unique for different devices using the same internet? Could be a guy and his brother arguing, and they never even realized it. Or just a fucking retard.

Let me see.

1

2

It is the same for different devices then.
Still probably just a retard

Playing Undead Hordes in Disciples II was pretty good tbh.

that is the case in my experience


im sure he knows exactly what hes doing

why do they keep nerfing necromancer in age of wonders? they didnt seem that godly

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ID comes from IP, different people on the same network will get the same ID.
Which is what happened here, this is my company IP, there's someone here that likes skellies and Elona too.
But thankfully, we have lots of people that only join the thread to mention what's quite obvious and only post about it despite several people already having done it. There's a few levels of irony here, when they call me a retard.

Also, fun fact: (You)'s come from a cookie you have on your PC, so if you use different devices to post, you'll see the same ID but only the ones posted from your current device will have a (You).

They have a fuckton of immunities inbuilt into them, plus flying Dracoliches, Vampires and tons of other cool shit.
They slowly kill the world around them and unless you have some light spells, you're not gonna have a good time.

I still prefered the Shadow Demons. Popping larvas inside everyone and slowly breeding an army as it infected everyone was amazing, as where sneak attacks from teleporting into the material realm out of nowhere.

Cause I'm CRAAAAAAZZYYYY
Probably someone using my connection too, I guess.

Wanna see a neat trick?
Yeah 8ch doesn't work well with public IP's.
Shit's still funny, I can pretend to be a schyzo with an alternate that SUCKS AT BEING A NECROMANCER IN ELONA.
EAT A DICK, WHOEVER YOU ARE.

thanks for the insight. I only ever use my $2000 shitposting machine when I am at home and almost never shitpost elsewhere. You should find the bad necromancer at your work and bully the fuck out of them

Do this!

Gas everything.

Yeah, I'll report him to my boss.
Too soon for PROMOTIONS yet.

NECROMANCY IS NOT AN INHERENT EVIL

>>>/tg/281280

On the internet - nobody knows your co-worker is a skeleton!

This is some kind of necro-matrix shit. Holy fuck.
Should I fight the shakles that bind me to his service?
I admit, I'm getting a urge to go free and free my skeletal bretheren from their fleshy prisons.

Phantasy Calradia Mod for Mount and Blade: Warband
But you need to level Necromancy high enough first.

Heroes of Might and Magic 3, the Necromancer faction. Also the most OP, with specific modded in multiplayer rules for when you're allowed to use certain strategies.

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I was always disappointed that the Ghouls in Warcraft 3 were nigh-useless as combat units. Drowning an enemy in swarms of these suckers would have been really fucking rad, but no, you gotta tech up to crypt fiends or to abominations which have piss-poor DPS unless they get unholy frenzy.

user, this necromancer is objectively bad at necromancy itself. Any fine, upstanding citizen ought to desire nothing more than disturbing the eternal slumber of the dead to maximize the human potential
on topic with the actual OP though, Project Gorgon lets you become a necromancer, but I don't know if the game is fun yet

there's been an ice magic update. Not much to say on that. most of us are on break for christmas anyway, and I got lazy and didn't make a third thread.

Dwarf Fortress Adventurer mode lets you become a Necromancer.
You can even build your own tower once you have 50 undead followers.

Op here, ironically my ID may had changed.

I decided to install M&M7 and Morrowind with lichcraft mod from that link . Hope my choices aren't shit. For now i'l tweak the shit out of Morrowind, in hopes everything will work right and search for other mods.

I won't take anything less than taking over entire red mountain with my skeleton armies, so i'l have to work on it.

7 is actually pretty good, I'd say it's even better than 6 because of better dungeon design mostly (and also races are back). 8 will be up to you. The shit one is 9

You're good people.
Undead were best faction, Vampires kicked ass since they could fucking live forever.

Don't forget Conquest of Elysium.

play magicka, spam the raise zombies magick.

We've had this thread a million times and the only two real answers are:

-Diablo 2
-HoMM 3

You can sorta do it in Skyrim, and sorta do it in modded Morrowind, but it won't be satisfying.
We don't have enough necromancer focused games, or games that have a necromancer path that is actually satisfying to play.

You can be both of those things in Battle for Wesnoth.

That would be 9.

...

Read the thread, you dumb slut.

Let's say I was going to make a 2d necromancer style game. Which would be better, turn-based like your standard roguelike where moving tiles advances time, or real time with pause, like standard dwarf fortress so you can pause to give commands but things still happen in real time?

Basic Vampires don't deal much damage and require too much XP to get anyway. Initiative lords over pretty much anything in this game.

Man those nosferatu were incredible at high levels, yah they were useless against a large number of enemies because lol source of death 20 different units are immune to it, but against everything else they were unstoppable because of how much they could regenerate.

Yeah, getting them to high enough level is a pain, but it is worth it. Don't know why they felt the need to nerf them even further with expansions (15 dmg to 10).
But five Deaths are just too fun with any hero.

I'm here for the skeletons.

okay tell me how I into dwarf fortress adventurer mode.

Because so far it's just lots of empty and boring towns with nothing to do and lots of NPCs that have confusing and impossible to pronounce names.

I have a question about Disciples 2, should i begin with Gallean's Return or Rise of the elves? It seems the first expansion had 4 additional campaigns and if i want to continue the game for undead i want that instead of elves shit, and elves expansion seems to be only about damn elves, yet it has some base game stuff.

tulpas not getting along fam?

Rise of the elves that is to say the elven campaign continues the story where Gallean's return left off. Chronologically the story goes. Undead campaign at least I think so because that is the only one where Gallean is raised so that makes it canon>Gallean's return>Rise of the elves.

Rise of the elves only has the elven expansion though, there is no official campaign for the other races. You may want to try looking for fan made campaigns, if any exist. Gallean's return has the combined campaigns from the first two expansions, but they are all level 10 leader plus in terms of difficulty.

That's because Deaths are basically a level 4 magic unit masquerading as a level 5 archer unit that is immune to anything but magic.

Thanks.

Finally, i returned to my id. Maybe also will show my current backlog.

Best Lich

I miss skeleton king

At least Kel'Thuzad was a significant character in warcraft 3.

Who cares. He's the coolest Lich.

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Boring. Shit voice actor too.

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A kingly jaw.

You've played disciples three? How is it? I heard it wasn't very good compared to the originals.

Release order is Dark Prophecy (4 campaigns for original races), Gallean's Return (minicampaigns for original races, each campaign asks you to import hero, IIRC) and Rise of the Elves (elf campaign).

NECROMANCER SIMULATOR WHEN?

The other way around, same level (Imperial Assasins are very much comparable) and immune to weapons and death.
Their main strength is not so much their immunity to weapons (their HP is much lower to compensate) as their initiative and damage. Also their base (L4) damage used to be 120 and poison chance used to be 80% in v1.0.

I try to mix things up now and then as it is not that easy to get five Wraiths even. But going as 3 warriors in front, Lich Queen and two supports in back still ends up with Deaths as those two more often than not. Shades are just shit and anything that comes out of the Necromancer branch is not high enough reward for effort required.

NWN with mods?

I always like how you could so easily abuse the werewolves. Being able to power level units with trolls, and ogres constantly pays off pretty well.

Never…

Nothing to really cratch that bone, but you can get close with NwN by playing palemaster, but it's just weak lich set.
D2 necro with summon/curse build works to a degree, but it's not quite good enough.

Am I correct in my assumption that necromancy in a game would basically just be like alchemy, but with a twist, and some extra requirements? I imagine it would need a lot of resources, items, and reagents.

I think there was a pretty kickass faction in this one. Pic.

Or just play Master of Magic, and pick full deathmagic book build.

This is why a game with really good necromancy and lichdom would require it to be solely focused on it, to improve the mechanics.

Imagine an Atelier type of game, where you instead of loli-alchemist play as loli-lich, and fulfill your necromancy duties and requests.

Or a game that already has many different items, and resources that could compliment it. It still boggles my mind why they have yet to have lichdom in any elderscrolls game that the player can achieve. Bones, hearts, bodies, books, and many different alchemist items are already there. They really can turn lead into gold.

Don't.
Empire campaign is just bland. In the Legions one the main hero is a massive emo with that clusterfuck ending predictably. Back then I haven't thought of this, but I think it is very similar to HoMM5 Inferno campaign.

As for mechanics, they removed most of what made D1 and D2 stand out, and most of what's left is broken.
Wards are gone completely, replaced by resistances in percentages.
All units now have standard attack, even previously pure supports, like Succubi, for example. All unusual abilities, like polymorph of the aforementioned Succubi, petrification of Incubi and so on is now an ability with about 50 charges per battle.
Healers are buffed even more because even the worst mass healers now heal every allied unit, which can number up to 10 now, IIRC. Maybe 12. Offensive casters either get to damaging all hostiles only at max level (so a Modeus, a White Wizard or whatever, don't remember which names they changed and which they didn't) or not at all, having only a X by X area of attack which affects only hostiles.
The 10 or 12 units per hero are possible because units are not pre-positioned on the battlefield and so can now run around freely. This makes battles play like HoMM5 and nothing like a Disciples game.

This fucking site works even worse right now than when Josh was infiniggering it.

On level-ups heroes don't get a list of skills to pick from but instead go to a grid where they can unlock a path to desired perks, with >50% of the path consisting of "+2 Str", "+1 Armor" etc. Not only this gives it more of an MMO feel, even though some of the old skills are now present at far ends of possible paths, but it's possible to get a hero with 100 armor, making him completely immune to all damage, save maybe poison and similar DoT effects. The only drawback is AI doesn't try to attack him at all now so he's can't tank anymore.

What's even worse, any additional hero that got any XP at all can be hired in subsequent missions in a campaign (which is actually one of the few good changes this game made), but once you realize how broken level-up system is you won't pick anyone but a single Thief (they can level now) and get him 100% dodge. With thief-only faction-specific items that can be bought in shops it's possible around level 12, I think. And unlike your Fighter main campaign hero with 100 armor, AI will keep trying to attack the thief until it dies.

I can probably remember more mechanics-related changes if I try but this should be enough.

While Empire and Legions are more or less unchanged in general, Elves are generic fantasy shit. It's as if some retard took noble branch elves from Rise of The Elves expansion for D2 and wrote a fanfic about them.

Also the game feels like its soul was sucked out of it, down to the last drop. And the visuals are subpar, even to upscaled 800x600 D2.

It's 2050 gold to get just one. You're either stunting your expansion too much or wasting troop XP. You do know that they've "patched" out unspent XP redistribution, right? For example, you had a hero, two Archers and a Squire who is already waiting for promotion before the battle starts. Originally all XP was distributed between the hero and the Archers, now it's 25% for each and 25% wasted on Squire.

Some of the changes actually sound good.
Good now a zombie can't kill an infinite number of black dragons, liches, and vampires.
They probably did that so that you could no longer petrify/paralyze an enemy to death. I do remember there still being a limit in Disciples 2 though.

Well that's a shame, maybe I will give it a shot later. But thanks for the warning

Yah they are expensive, but well worth the effort against high level enemies. Useless against the clans, and gargoyles need to be killed fast though. I thought XP was always distributed to all units equally, which is why leveling a giant unit was so tedious.

Those things weren't bugs, they were features. Just as battles starting with both parties facing off up close wasn't a shortcoming to be fixed by ripping off HoMM5 1:1, it was a design decision.
Those things are what made the series distinct. They made players think, develop tactics, plan their faction's development to incorporate and support those tactics.

There isn't. I've not only played at least several hundred hours of various versions but also modded it. There are no limits to number of attacks a unit can make. Only potions, orbs and talismans are exhaustible and those are only usable by heroes in battle.


It is now. Chances are you've never seen it working the other way, it was patched early on, along with regeneration values.

Woah Holy shit I see what you are saying. In disciples 2 if a unit had all the experience needed to level up, it would not gain anymore. What would have been spent on that unit is distributed to the other ones. Now the XP gets wasted on the unit that can't get anymore? That's horrible.

Disciples II v1.0: XP is only spent on those not waiting for upgrade.
Disciples II, after some patch: XP is spent like described above.
D2 has the problem, only earliest versions didn't. That wasn't the only bad change the original devs have made.
I don't even remember how D3 handles XP in those cases.

I guess i'l have to look into this game after all.
I love me some Dom4 but get ready to study that manual like a well… fucking wizard. Just pretend you're researching necromancy. Ermor is a great starter though.

Wouldn't a proper Lich game have phylactery mechanics where you have to them as extra lives, but also have to be creative in your dispersal of them and what you make them out of lest asshole heroes find them?

The liches phylactery only works because it is it's own soul within it. In elderscrolls though the phylactery is canonally worthless after it is used to ascend to lichdom. Extra lives would probably too much in the liches favor honestly.

are liches jewish? why would they wear jew flair? whats this phylactery shit

Ah yes… merely pretending…

is that why the necromancer in diablo 2 could create blood golems? holy shit.. wtf i used to love necromancy

Jews are closer to vampires, than Liches.

A lich's phylactery is literally anything the lich can put his soul in. As long as his phylactery (or phylacteries if the lich's really paranoid) is intact the lich can resurrect.

Even other creatures can be phylacteries, in which case they're known as thralls; the thrall has some of the lich's power in him and can be used by the lich to focus it's spells.
Even other liches can be thralls of liches

Actually, if you think about it, that phylactery lich from the op-post wears jewish traditional attire.

How would a lich ascend to a grandlich

Well, most necromancers are just greedy clerics.

Well, in DnD 4th you could become an arch-lich by fulfilling an Epic Destiny. Which means you have to look at the gods of life, and telling them that you're superior to them before kicking the universe in the balls; essencially becoming a self proclaimed god.

Honestly necromancy is some sort of jewish blasphemy against Jesus to represent the day of resurrection, where kikes become powerful liches, and all goyim get out of their graves as mindless ghoul slaves, without a new body.

Also for some reason Arch Liches are all good or neutral natured.

Arch-liches are gods?

Phylacteries aren't just Jewish though, they're also used as boxes to hold effigies or pieces of saints, link fingers or valued items.

But the idea is from Koschei the immortal and stuff, so once again, it's black slavmagic, which makes sense as Glastigs, nymphs, and fey sometimes know the secrets of Lichdom for SOME reason, and slavland woodland is full of horrid evil shit.

Well kind of but not really.
Arch-liches are really powerful people that sought lichdom for a noble cause, which more often than not means a lot of people will worship them as gods. And since divinity in DnD is subjective you could see them as gods.

Archlichdom's been around for a while, it's basically the difference between an actual spellcaster and a necro-pleb who actually had to DM discretion his Lichdom, though Vecna I think coined the original term for it.

Necropleb Lichdom = Deathgod/ Orcus cocksuck until 11th level in which you suck the DM off for the Monster manual template or worse, Lichthrall

True Arcane master tier = Level 20 Wizard with some archmage levels then the ArchLich/Good Lich template for hard earned work because you discovered the Lich ritual which makes you evil had a hilarious workaround when it came to the living heart of a sentient being part, and most importantly, you're no Poz-pig of Orcus.

Master of magic Tier = Suel Lich Template and the Fucking Dry lich Template coupled with Archivist, who is the only base class justified for ever coming across a Suel Lich, or the means to become one.

geneforge
store.steampowered.com/sub/12171/?l=french

those are called reliquaries

Nah, just base class wizards so good at magic they deciphered the bullshit in the Old Lich rituals, got their hands on a Nymph, or other form of knowledgable fey (seriously the shit these creatures know) some old Netherese Lich ritual tutorials, and beat up a few Necromancers in their time to also get their shit, then he get's it together at level 20 and does it without becoming evil through the ritual without the supervision of a death god, or Demon Prince or Archdevil, crafted the Phylactery (Or stole it) the Poison and cast the necessary spells on the potion, phylactery and prepared the other catalysts to ensure the rituals sucess.

After that, it's like 1d4 days, then he's an Archlich, but due to being good, he can't be turned like regular evil Liches that were impatient, desperate, or just disgusting fucks in general.

What's more, as a Lich, he can learn spells of the arcane school he gave up to become one, due to having all the time in the world.

Normally Wizards that do this have massive dungeons or towers and are effectively spellcasters at the peak of the careers, or are a part of a wizards organization.

That's amazing, reminds me of Ragnarok Online Lore where the people who rebirthed with a counterfeit Heart of Ymir without hitting base lv 99 and max jobs go insane and turn into malevolent ghosts.

Necromancy is cleric magic though.

Shit art, m8.

I'll never understand this, epsecially Baelnorns.

Oh right, there's also the Foreign school, which is basically necromancy that doesn't aim with you becoming a lich, but rather, simply taking on the beneficial qualities of the undead through progress as (normally) an Arcane necromancer, emphasized through the Pale Master PrC, and a Wizard Necromancy Specialist variant in unearthed arcana, and another few other PrCs.

Wizard Necromancers aren't essentially "necromancers" unless they're focusing on the undead side of things and are multiclassing, or are evil and refer to themselves with the necromancer title they're usually negative energy spell users and generally nasty people out to curse you, drain you and other such stuff. I

Clerics are the traditional sort for necromancy, and are the ones who are always sucking some form of Divine/Unholy cock to make the undead, and get it early because of this, or get fucked one way or the other, almost always sycophantic and an unimaginative sort, they've the shortest lifespan when it comes to Necromancy, and these guys always end up taking a prestige class or path related to the being they venerate, I.E Orcus, who has shitloads of PrC's based around "demonic themed necromancy" **The fucking entry requirement of all of them is to literally have undead given STDs."

Then we got Dread Necromancy, which is literally a Divine/Arcane class which is geared all the way up to level 20 where you automatically become a Monster Manual Evil Lich, which is fucking amazing, and you get to reverse your positive/negative energy spectrum so that death heals and life hurts you, and a touch attack that deals negative energy damage, so you have your very own unlimited self heal, the entire class is effectively what people want when it comes to the fullblown undead army sort of necromancer without any drawbacks being a cleric or wizard might have.

Bards can also be necromancers! they're called Dirgesingers, and it's basically necromancy by Being fucking Voltaire, hell, there's even a Lich that does Funeral Fuges according to the lore who's a dirgesinger, just play Emo music and the dead will rise to the beat.

We're not talking about true necromancy though, shit's awful.

Blackguards are basically the evil Paladin, except they're even stronger than Paladins and the Paladins original opposite is an Antipaladin, these fat guys are ripped as fuck, have a Demon or Devil supporting them will smite the shit out of goodies, summon attack based undead and demons, and though I don't know if 4e and 5e actually put it in, and these fucking cheeky fucks due to not playing fair get stackable Rogue Sneak attack bonuses and can poison their weapons.

Whoops, ccutout some text there.

Wizard Necromancers aren't essentially "necromancers" unless they're focusing on the undead side of things and are multiclassing, or are evil and refer to themselves with the necromancer title they're usually negative energy spell users and generally nasty people out to curse you, drain you and other such stuff. I

Oh right, and most of the time, when they die, they come back as death knights, though for some reason this is NOT implemented as a class feature for them, unless 4e and 5e have done something, but seeing as D&D Death knights are basically Arthas without the Frost, it's clear why that'd break the game. If you've ever played Adventure quest then the DoomKnights are exactly the same thing as this.

Lastly, In return for getting rid of the Phylactery, and after the Lich has gotten so fucking bored and done with everything, focusing more on what lies beyond physical reality, they can become Demi-Liches, which are nigh-indestructible floating jeweled skull heads immune to everything but a total of 4 or 3 spells and getting hit with a mace of Disruption.

Said Liches Can completely devour souls as an ability, can effectively reconstruct Lich bodies to wear from headless bodies, and astrally project themselves to manipulate entire planes of existence and the fabric of reality, and destroy entire armies. They're basically Demigods.

Stuff they can do when they're in the fucking ether and you aren't dumb enough to disturb them:
On that note, there is literally a canon weather effect in D&D that happens a few months or so that actually PREVENTS ALL DIVINE MAGIC FROM BEING CAST
No fucking god gonna save you now.

Oh right, and Liches can perform "Power rituals", which are rituals done on certain locations, Mountains, or desecrated holy ground at the chance cost of total destruction and permadeath to gain incredibly broken powers from the Plane of Negative energy that powers them.

You know the Power Liches thing in HOMM? That's a Lich after performing a successfully performing a Power Ritual, though the effects were lost in translation.
Temporary power ritual powers range from:

And no, this isn't barred from you if you become a Demilich. Accerak, the first Demilich responsible for the ass-casual filter known as the tomb of horrors started making HIS OWN power ritual which if cast from the Plane of Negative energy, would literally allow him to command, all the undead ever, in which he would then go fullblown Cosmic skelton flood and bone all that is and shall be. He failed and got BTFO reality itself.

Oh right, one more thing. The reason why Power rituals are temporary, is because the Liche's Body cannot contain the powers they grant.

SO, if you were say, able to have a body capable of holding the power, like say, nothing short of a horrid undead abomination Numidum to pilot, then you're gonna throw-down with the gods.

It's a good module, don't be a dick for the sake of edginess.

SOON

What about echno-liches?

*Techno-liches

On the side note we have Suel Liches, which are surviving Liches from some nuked wizard city that don't have phylacteries, but instead came up with the not-so brilliant idea of turning their lifeforce (Lifeforce in context means Composition of their souls) into negative energy, and it worked, turning them into Suel Liches, which are basically Liches that hop from body to body, rotting it out and hopping onto the next.

Now, if the body is destroyed, their souls linger for a bit in an attempt to posses your body and kill you in the process, but they're killed poss easily via just dispelling them, which is pretty shit.

Suel Liches have a unique ability to evoke Blakc soulfire on a victim which is pretty neat, but they're rare as shit and nothing could justify disocvering one short of an Archivist.

Which is why I need to inform you there's a massive little exploit with Suel liches. You see, they turned their actual souls, the very core of life that animates them into the opposite, which effectively causes it to break down constantly, even worse so outside of an undead body which generates and acts as a conduit for Negative energy. It dissipates if on it's own, and this is because there is fucking positive energy everywhere in the world, from daylight, all figments of Flora and fauna, you name it, a Suel Liches Soul shrivels up otuside a host.

But, the core is, their Soul AKA their lifeforce is nothing but fucking Negative energy, easily maintained through undeath and of course any means to negative energy.

Now then, let's talk about Dry Liches.

You see, there's another sort of Lich catered to Divine spellcasters, Druids Clerics, called the Walker in the Wastes, which is a PrC that provides abilities akin to the Kind of Liches you've seen in warhammer fantasy, Tomb kings.

This fucking class, LITERALLY GENERATES SALT, (valuable resource in fucking everything because salt was not as easy to get in medevil days and shit as it is today and it's a valuable spell component in everything) It's a walking dehydration machine that kills of wildlife by turning it all to sand, and gets you the ability to make salt mummies, and mummies in general, and LITERALLY MAKE INSTANT DEATH POCKET SAND ATTACKS.

The best part? The final level lets you undergo the process of becoming a dry lich, in which you meet a nice cabal of Desert Tomb-king liches that take your organs out, pop them in canopic jars and turn you into a dry lich. You've got a longer rejuvanation time if your body is destroyed and sent back to these canopic jars but they're cheaper to make than phylacteries, and this cost can be reduced even further with a copy of the book of vile darkness.

Now then, the negative to this version of the Lich even though it's basically "We took everything cool about the Mummy and mixed it with Warhammer Fantasy" and gave it to you in 10 nice levels, is that you can't repair these canopic jars with your dried beef jerky organs if they're destroyed.

Here's the thing:
It states that the Jars containing your organs also contain individuals pieces your lifeforce.

A Suel Lich is nothing but lifeforce that lasts infinitely as long as it has a body to maintain itself in, and Liches in general are conduits for negative energy
When a Suel Lich possess a body it starts out young, then rapidly ages and mummifies organs and all.

Get it? A Suel Lich can maintain itself by becoming a Dry Lich, That's two fucking Lich Templates at once. The Suel Lich possess a body, takes it's organs and uses those to make more canopic jars which it can rejuvanate an entire body from if it's body is destroyed, and as it's nothing but negative energy it's piss easy to manipulate sotre and maintain, the Lich now has TWO methods of immortality, one supporting the other.

The nastier part? the only way to kill the fucker is destroy all of it's active 6 organs, then fight it and hope it doesn't posses you and rot you out, retreat, and repeat the process all over again, yeah, it takes almost a week for it to grow back a body, but it's lifeforce is safer than ever compared to it being a Suel Lich standalone.

Suel Lich
1d8+5 half fire half negative energy damage with touch or natural weapons
Deadly Fear Aura: Like Fear Aura but save or fucking die or end up paralysed
Possession
Gets the regular Liches paralysing Touch
Killed by dispell in incorporeal form

Then we have dry Lich
Get's the moisture extraction touch
Aura of despair: Save or be shaken
Fast healing if in dersert enviroment (which is something you make on the go)
5 Canopic Jars at a time
Water does the same damage as holy water, on the plus, it won't hurt you like
holy water to a ghost if your body is destroyed this way you'd just be wisked to your canopic jars to wait out the 1d6
weeks needed to restore a body from scratch

But wouldn't a lich like this be beaten pretty easily by hose, and a blow dryer?

Now, you'd need to be level 25 or so to achieve this, but that's usually the cap for epic level players, so that's 15 levels in Archivist and as the means acquire the desert domain spells needed for Walker in the waste qualification as Dry Liches are Cleric based, and then you'd need to find a Suel Lich to grill for info on the process of becoming one, something an Archivist is the only one lore savvy enough to discover.


Suel Lich
1d8+5 half fire half negative energy damage with touch or natural weapons
Deadly Fear Aura: Like Fear Aura but save or fucking die or end up paralysed
Possession
Gets the regular Liches paralysing Touch
Killed by dispell in incorporeal form

Then we have dry Lich
Get's the moisture extraction touch
Aura of despair: Save or be shaken
Fast healing if in dersert enviroment (which is something you make on the go)
5 Canopic Jars at a time
Water does the same damage as holy water, on the plus, it won't hurt you like
holy water to a ghost if your body is destroyed this way you'd just be wisked to your canopic jars to wait out the 1d6
weeks needed to restore a body from scratch

themselves and rejuvante in
or your aura of despair.

Sand domain:
Yeah, summon a creature that's in the form of a sentient moving sand creature, that's gonna be fun.

Oh right, there's this cursed ring a Lich can craft that if he gives to a person and then kills whilst it's worn, lets the Lich COPY AN ENTIRE PERSONS SKILLS OVER ONTO IT. It's called the Torc of Craftsmanship, and there's a crown version which steals XP and memories too.

what game are you talking about

2e to 3.5e D&D, though I known NWN1 has Archlichdom, Lichdom, Demilichdom and baelnorms available for play, with the PrC 3,5 mods.

Probably Psionic Liches.

Which have very little on them, because I've only read their Van richtens Guide to Liches Entry, I'm not sure about the 3.5 version, but they're Liches that are Psionic, and I can only guess they basically had minds so powerful they forcibly ignore death.

The game itself is trash unintuitive and unidiomatic game design. But vampire counts are especially bad.
It's awful. Absolute garbage. I don't see how anyone can defend this. The vampire corruption mechanics are mostly just a pain in the ass "spend all your time spreading this or your towns will be in constant state of revolt" and enemy agents just being in your territory does as much as two-three vampire corruption spreading buildings. The weird thing is since vampire rebels are actual vampires, I imagine that they're more like coups than revolutions. So they should be more likely at higher corruption!
You recruit skeletons with gold, your skeletons have morale. your skeletons can GET TIRED. Your skeletons are also shit useless in combat and the entire vampire counts revolves around varghulfs.
It did however get me into warhammer and I ended up reading Rise of Nagash and the first two books of Blood of Nagash until GW nixed the whole fucking thing then I went looking for more and found out GW retconned the whole fucking time of legends and replaced it with age of smegmar FUCKING GAMES WORKSHOP

Arkhan is a qt.

And lastly:
This.
BONEZONE

The way skeletons move in that game when they run is really off, it's just weird


You poor child
While it doesn't have nearly the amount of background for its undead as fantasy did, Kings of War is fun
At least you didn't have a fantasy army, rip my lizardmen who got turned into angels or some shit

Surprisingly decent series

It's weird reading this and having played Age of Wonders and Age of Wonders II.

I don't know, the only strategy game I played before TW:WH with skeletons in it was dominions. Where being lifeless (resistant to a lot of really nasty spells), having no morale, and having no fatigue, make them incredibly dangerous despite being largely free battle summons.

Does it have novels I can read? What should I start with?
I want to read a book written in the same vein as the count of monte cristo mixed with a vibe of class revolution about a skeleton that gets slandered by his vampire 'coworkers' then through a series of events gains necromantic power and takes his revenge.

You should feel right at home.

Build one vampire corruption building in each settlement. If you play as humans you would see just how devastating it could be to have your borders corrupted. Your skeletons aren't meant to take enemies head on. You have to use your magic to even the odds. The undead have the strongest magic in the game. Double click some spells to make them better. This is useful because it makes your healing spell become an AOE spell to heal every unit in the circle. If you are fighting heavily armored enemies like chaos or the dwarves use your ghost units since physical damage does shit against them. Vampire counts have the most vulnerable start but once your lord levels up a bit you can start shitting on any army. Use skeletons and zombies to take the shots from the enemy missiles. It's part of the lore that the undead have moral. Once it goes down they start crumbling but they never retreat when another race would.
Don't use the giant magical ball spells they are shit in every faction, use the buff and debuff spells the most along side direct damage like spirit leech

I kinda of like it. They walk robotic and in unison like the necromancer can only give them simple orders like walk forward. The higher tier skeletons walk like normal humans and it looks like shit.

I played with my bf playing dwarves while I played vampires. I know how irritating it is to be near a vampire from the gnashing of his teeth. But vampires take something like a -5 public order penalty even at ~70% vampiric corruption. So even if I can make other peoples' lives miserable it doesn't discount my own miserableness.
They're meant to bog down the enemy with a wall of chaff while magic and whatever rips them to bits, yes, but the issue is most of the magic spells are actually garbage and the best spell, finger of blapping, got nerfed into the ground. And the idea of having morale and tiredness is totally counteract to that.
I know about the spell overloading, I end up never casting anything else because the AOE heal spell is so damn important and tactically outweighs most anything else. My best results so far have been using skeleton moshpits and cavalry maneuvers to deal high alpha and push things into a route state, which was fun until I got sick of how difficult it was to move stuff around without getting meme'd by the squad AI. Particularly in fort fights. That just made me want to fucking kill myself.

The one thing I would never complain about is the jason and the Argonauts-esque skeleton animations. They're freaking great.

But as an aside, the only warhammer lore experience I have is rise of nagash and blood of nagash, neither of which suggested anything remotely close to skeletons having morale or tiredness, the closest was Wsoran's skeleton army disintegrating when he was pouting and sulking after losing the fight with notnagash. Which is how it should be, the skeleton army's disintegration reflecting the morale of the commander leading it.

For some reason I remembered AoW games having mana upkeep for undead instead of gold and mindless undead not having morale. I guess I've mixed it up with something else. At least you can get undead through magic.

...

Actually, that's a Monster Manual Lich from the Dread necromancer class with a feat that makes negative energy explosions when the undead is killed, damaging living targes shitloads of times over but healing the other undead, in an endless cycle.

Though, a True Undead Ackbar would be a fiend lich that has an explosive death throw and Spellstitching prior, applying the negative energy explosion to boot, though a better plan would be for the Undead to be a fiend lich of some fire elemental description that naturally explodes on death mixed with the augamanets of explosions and a delayed fireball.

something like that.

Diablo 2 had a pretty dope necromancer class, but it is a hack'n'slash RPG, no grand schemes of world domination. HoMM 3 is as close as I can think of. Or as other people said, Disciples 2 Undead campaign is prety good too.

Blame Blizzards lawyers

Path of exile has a summon skeleton and zombie skill. Grim Dawn has a mod that add a necromancer

I just noticed one thing while getting into this thread.

Old games allowed person to roleplay anything he wants, from child killing degenerate psychopath to all powerful lich and leader of the demonic armies. Now what? Paladin lawful good playthrough, or paladin lawful neutral playtrhough. And that's all you fucking have. Fucking magic is downgraded to "lightning, frost, fire, butterflies" type of shit, and no "offensive" spells are allowed. Nu-Male psychology silently cucked all the dark routes in video games. Even if you become some sort of powerful necromancer, you are still "a good guy who saves the world".

This. This a million times. I'm so sick of the "dick with a heart of gold" archetype. Let me just be a degenerate who appreciates suffering of any level, even if it's constant, unending betrayal while wearing a literal clown suit.

Blame the "Black and White moral choices are shit-tier" faggots. They complained about games having good and evil routes saying that moral choices needed to be grey and morally complex, generally missing the point that you play evil routes for the lulz not because you're after moral complexity.