General WRPG Thread

You fucking asperger

He's pushing the notion that since beamdog handled all the EE, and they also made Dragonspear, everything is on the same level of quality.
In reality, the EE of BG1 and 2 are fine, the couple of additional companions they added are incredibly easy to avoid and never have anything to do with, and the EE of IW is completely fine.

He basically hasn't played a single EE and is trying to push the usual agenda, standard Holla Forumstardism.

Don't do this. They're called CRPGs.

while I largely agree, technically that's only true when they're on a computer
Rings of Power, for instance, is western-made but only available on the Genesis/Mega Drive

you seem to know what's up
did they fix the gnome female mage sprite or does it still look like an old-ass bearded dwarf in wizard robes?

You're free to crawl back to wherever you leaked from. I mean it's not like we lack in cancer, though nice dubs.

The c can stand for console as well :^)

Except they are on the same level of quality, as you have said yourself:
Which only can mean that Beamdog's quality wasn't of any to begin with.

Not only that, but without EE, you have those mods and fixes that isn't supported by EE

I think you should stop trying so hard. :'^)

I think they patched that sprite, yeah.

90% of the modding scene for BG 1 and 2 now support EE.
Because, you know, they actually play these video games instead of jacking off on Holla Forums pretending to know what they're talking about, like this dumbass

Best 3D cRPGs coming through, don't mind me.

Age of Decadence and Dungeon Rats (just launched so good) are two recent god tier WRPG.

Don't get the "enhanced editions". They are a mess and full of aids. Plus everything looks blurry as fuck.
Get BG1 and BG2, and then patch with BG Trilogy. That's the way to play it and get the most out of it.
Any niggers that say to get the EE version never play the originals or are just shilling, beamdog is doing that great after all and Bioware is trying to get some more shekels out of them before they both are bankrupt.

isnt doing*

Fuck

Well, fuck me

Shill it to me, anons. I watched the trailer and it looks pretty rough/amateurish.

Age of Decadence takes place in a post apocalyptic, low fantasy setting following the fall of the fantasy Roman empire. It's main draws are how hardcore it is, and the high reactivity. Depending on what character you pick and how you spec him you'll have vastly different playthroughs, some where you can avoid combat entirely. Also, combat is pretty brutal (and Dungeon Rats is a dungeon crawler built on the AoD combat mechanics).

Basically, if you're looking for a hard cRPG that emphasizes non-linearity, choices and consequences and different ways to accomplish your goals AoD is your game.

Is AoD worth the price tag? I'm willing to pay a fair sum for an actual quality game in today's mess of shit

Games like Hexen are what should have replaced the RPG, minus the fucking garbage puzzles.

Until you realize you can't achieve a win state unless you min/max the fuck out of your character, and go through VERY specific routes.

The game expects you to play your given role instead of opting for a jack-of-all trades character build.

Don't you mean

[UNSOLICITED OPINIONS ON TAMRIEL]

I'm almost unironically looking forward to Tyranny if only to see how many shitty characters I can actually kill.

Its suppose to be a game about being a bad guy, I'm really curious what that means in obsidian terms.

I figure it's some retarded shit most likely, going by their recent showings. As long as there is an option not deal with [char_name]'s bullshit and some nice public executions for insolence, I'm game

The ending of the [OPINIONS] is ALMSIVI

By never installing it in the first place you can prevent copies of them from coming to "life", such as it is in this case, which is one step above unmaking someone.

IWD2 in ToEE engine soon.

Stop the fag retardation and the muh SJW and go play aarklash like right fucking now

Here, latest GoG version
magnet:?xt=urn:btih:FDC2893C1717B50460E6BAB5076D74EA958E1222

What's happening?

That ain't as satisfying as personally ending the fanfiction.net's reject's life. Like I really hope there's an option to do so right off the bat at least for two of them.

archive.is/0HtxW

I'll never know how Brazilians find so much time to shit up F2P mmo's when they're so busy murdering each other and uploading videos of it.

It looks like yet another faceless MMO. Why did they have to make it look like this? Otherwise from what I saw in gameplay trailer looked promising.

Its a party-pause-based-turn-combat game the trailer show retards auto attacking

IWD games have 0 story, you can't fuck up it

I got that. It just has disgusting visuals.

The problem is that this leads to meta gaming. Unless you get incredibly lucky and put all your skill points in the right skill at the right time for the right quest, you'll be forced with a dead end and/or game over. You HAVE to meta game, you HAVE to save scum, you HAVE to hoard up points so you can progress when the game puts another skill based wall to climb. The concept of the game is amazing and the combat has potential. But the execution falls flat on its face.

That's just females being females showing their true selves.

You're just shit at the game and playing it wrong. The game was never meant to allow players to see all the content in one playthrough. Like I said, you're supposed to play to your given character's strengths.

It leads to specialized characters or hybrids if you know what you're doing.
If you want to be another chosen one master of all trades and the big boss of all the guilds in the game in a single playthrough go play bethesda garbage.

You're fucking retarded. Let's say you make a merchant character and go down the merchant quest line. If you don't put in your points in exactly the right way to complete quests in exactly the right order, you can't progress through the merchant path. And if you're a merchant you sure as fuck can't progress through any of the other paths, meaning you can't advance and you need to either restart the game or revert to an earlier save before you wasted your skill points on something you didn't need.

Same thing with the archaeologist class or whatever it was called or the fighter/Legion class. The game completely railroads into a single path and there's no deviation allowed from that path otherwise your game ends in failure. This means the game ISN'T an RPG, it's just an adventure game where you're given the illusion of choice.

Let me make it clearer. You're a merchant. You have merchant stats, you have merchant skills, you have the merchant background and you're starting the merchant quest line. You're given skill points. If you put your skill points into anything other than what you EXACTLY and PRECISELY need to progress through the merchant quest line, you can't finish the quest line. Since you're a merchant, you can't finish any other quest lines. If you don't finish the merchant quest line, you can't progress through the rest of the game because you won't have enough skill points to finish later quests. That means you either do it exactly right or you fail. That's not a choice. That's not role playing.

You and seem to assume that I want characters to be jack of all trades. I want to be able to progress through the game without having someone drag me around by my dog collar. I want to be able to make mistakes and learn without having to resort to save scumming.

Go back to playing Bethesda shit so you don't have to suffer choices and consequences there.

Opinions on Icewind Dale? Thought about buying it, but I heard its almost entirely centered around combat, with only a very lukewarm story behind it when compared to that of Baldur's Gate.

There is like 200m BRs

You heard right and IWD is all better for it since BG's story, writing and characters are dogshit anyway.

Easily the worst infinity engine game for that, just combat and no story, still a 8,5/10 game

Lately I've taken an interest in western-made, Japanese-styled RPGs. Just started Albion for the first time and am really enjoying it. The interface is the only problem I've had with is so far, and even that's just a minor annoyance.

Are you brain damaged or suffering from some sort of mental damage that impairs your cognitive functions? Is your English so poor you can't comprehend what I'm typing? Are you so stupid you make assumptions instead of taking what I typed out at face value? Does a 100 word post count as a wall of text to you?

I clearly defined what my problem was with the game and gave examples of it and explained why I had a problem with it. So go read what I posted, for the first time in your life put some effort toward understanding what's in front of you and once you're done with that, remove yourself from the gene pool.

Combat is good/great, depending on which part you're in. Doesn't hold your hand and punishes unbalanced parties pretty hard. If you liked the combat in BG1/2 then the IWD games are probably going to be enjoyable for you.

I never expected this to be so good.

Yeah, it is 90% combat/dungeon crawling, but the encounter design is pretty good. Less instagib encounters and more fighting varied armies of enemies with different immunities/strengths/weaknesses/abilities/etc.

Hah, I think they handed out this game at a McDonalds when I was younger.

Silver is very, very good. If it's not the best ARPG ever made, it's definitely one of the top 5.

I used to love CRPGs a lot more before I got deeper into tabletop. Everything is just so much weaker than what a good tabletop campaign can give you. Characters are weaker, combat is less interactive, story is generally much more linear and weaker in terms of writing, the ability to save game completely ruins overall game integrity. They're still kind of fun, but in comparison to what could be?

I had a similar experience when I moved from JRPGs to WRPGs. Eventually I just learned to appreciate both for what they were.

just play the original version, add some mods if you want

DROPPED
When you go for party based tactical rpgs ,you either go for turn based combat or you go home

It probably means being able to play as a white heterosexual man who marries the woman he loves and has consensual sex in missionary position, for the purpose of procreation, with her.

what are some wrpgs with cute girls and fun combat

kill yourself autismo-berg

If you're not acoustic you've no business with rpgs.

...

Oh no, what a tragedy.

You're the reason why Holla Forums has come to this state

Brain problems

You're Playing a Role user, story is the least important part of a game. If you're a storyfag, reading a fucking book might be more up your alley.

Brain problems indeed

There's more to role-play than a story.
Try characters, quests, conflicts, classes.
You're probably one of the IEfags. Or worse, jrpgfag.

I genuinely feel bad for you, user. Not even shitposting right now, I honestly pity you and wish you could experience the joys of imagination and unstructured play.

So you faggots play rpg for the gameplay huh

Yup.

Autism of the highest order

But if killing 3 bugmeats is part of a story then it's fine!

wtf i hate wizardry now

Sure do. If it doesn't have good gameplay it's not a good game, and I could just be reading a fucking book instead. Good RPGs provide a fun world for you to explore and interact with in your own way, and don't rigidly constrain you with a shitty story. Fallout 2 is a good example of this, as are Gothic 1/2.

Actually, user, rigid thinking and inability to engage in imaginative play are traits commonly in autistic individuals. The fact that you consider it impossible to use your imagination to create your own fun in a sandbox with good gameplay mechanics backs up that assertion.

Bethesda faggots are a plague upon the genre.

Nigger, what you're describing is playacting and has next to nothing to do with proper roleplaying, which relies on game systems and mechanics to interpret what you are trying to do and output your success at those activities.

And while you don't necessarily need a proper narrative for a tabletop RPG session, that's because you have other people there with you to procedurally generate the story as you go along. You don't have that when playing a single player RPG, hence the necessity of having a narrative and preset choices given to the player.

You're a fucking moron, and I know you "roleplay" in Skyrim like every other filthy autist that shat 400+ hours of his pointless existence into that turd.

user your highly specific definition of what does and does not constitute roleplaying does not align with reality. Sorry, friendo :^)

Wow.

We all know what a roleplaying game is, user.

I'm not the obnoxious contrarian who jumped into a conversation, waved his dick around, and declared that "roleplaying" is only what fits his extremely narrow and arbitrary definition.

I'm pretty sure most you think roleplaying game as a genre is a meaningful definition, so no.

Obviously you don't. You can't roleplay without a narrative framework. You might as well go masturbate to Forklifter Simulator 2016, since that's the premier RPG experience in your mind.

I would need to know your personal qualifications for what you deem "meaningful" before launching into that debate.

This is a video game board, so I won't be talking about roleplaying games.

Or we can simply hide your ID and save us the trip down the autism spectrum.

How's ToEE?
I've only played FO2, FO:Tactics, BG2, PST.
I heard that ToEE would be good.

With Temple+ mod it's JA2 of D&D rpgs.

Great gameplay, decent story, dead world. Also, how long are you on Holla Forums and why haven't you tried muh arcanum?

Best implementation of DnD combat to date. It's also buggy as fuck, so get the Circle of Eight mod.

Also, if you ever want to replay Tactics there's the Redux and Equilibrium mod (Equilibrium being an expansion of Redux).

Also, anyone tried the Grotesque Tactics series?

Thanks, man

Tried Arcanum before, but it wasn't really for me

Low on T, eh?

Glad to hear it, better for everyone if you just stopped shooting your mouth off.

Taking an escape hatch is better for one's ego than manning up and admitting you were wrong. It's fine.

Might want to use autismo supreme's patches along with the high resolution patches, there's also a rebalance mod floating around that at least tries to limit broken spells and make gun based builds viable with more weapons.

Maybe you should shoot your mouth off in a failed suicide attempt.

Fair enough.

I don't follow

We've got a two 4am threads and several assfaggots tier ones including a dedicated overwatch thread and you're shitting here.
Why not use some of those shitposting powers for good?

mork should just off itself

I try not to judge a faggot on his fetishes but putting these fuckers down would be a mercy at this point

Oh shit, there's an amiga thread?
Later, fuckbois.

I can't even imagine why you think something that good would happen to us in this day and age.

But anyway, seeing as I have been remiss in actually give any recommendations, let me rectify that now.

Spiritual sequel to Planescape: Torment, and unlike the upcoming, festering SJW turd Torment, it's actually quite good. Then again, so is most of NWN2, even though the original campaign gets called generic way too often, it's not really that bad, and it actually manages to integrate the player "home" into the overarching narrative

Masterpiece in narrative reactivity and non-linearity, decent writing, and everything else is shit. This is one of those games that really suffers from shitty gameplay design that seems to plague everything Obsidian makes, but at least you can make builds broken enough to breeze through the game.

We have two Holla Forums threads up for some reason, one of them about Steven Universe.

Re-read the posts, user. I was discussing video games when two bitter anons sperged out on arbitrary definitions of what does or does not constitute roleplaying. I've never been one to back down when a smug, know it all faggot starts running his mouth about shit he doesn't understand, and I'm not going to start now :^)

also

Fire magic > self-healing magic>>>>>any other magic

Nigger, what are you on about? Gothic has a great story

Bet you watch anime too

First time around I took electricity. Holy shit was that a mistake. Used to take walks and smoking breaks for my mana to regenerate in the catacombs.

Again, there are higher value targets for shitposting then this thread.

Does not relate to the story, and the game takes place in a prison colony, so almost everyone is a convict
Yes, because you're in a fucking prison colony. If you want kingdomXorcs, play Gothic 2
Pc is left undeveloped so as to give the most player freedom (if you recall Fallout 4, half the board bitched about having to play as a cuck. By not developing the PC, you avoid this situation). The NPCs were fleshed out enough
Bully this nerd!

Running out of mana was part of the challenge in some parts of the game. You either had so much mana to pick up you didn't know what to do with it, or had to carefuly conserve every single point of it - specifically, the whole War section was about this, as no enemy dropped mana

Sorry, am I triggering you? Sorry for invading your hug box.

>'Does not relate to the story'

Chinese cartoons are old news anyway it's all about the taiwan puppet shows now :^)

Or you can go full dervish, stack a gorillion +crit (and possibly get some life steal going) and literally cut everything and anything to pieces.

I'm more disappointed then anything else. We always had shitposting but the sheer quality of it dropped significantly in recent months.

user, what did I say about being a faggot?

Would you say that's worth playing today? I've never heard of it.

Currently replaying malaria simulator 2008 on infamous with the realism mod, which is comfy as fuck, but I'm about to finish it and my backlog is woefully lacking RPGs and I'm just about burned out on shooters at the moment.

Barcelona is amazing, some of the best wrpg stuff out there. France is generally shit. There's no real ending.

You might've missed Masquerada, the Eisenwald expansion dlc or Dungeon Rats. There's also Balrum, Underrail and a few others depending on how hybrid/old we go.

Thanks user, Dungeon Rats and UnderRail are exactly what I was looking for.

Play old games like Pool of Radiance, Ishar, Eye of Beholder, Lands of Lore, early Wizardry series and check how much story they contain. Go back to the original Bard's Tale game if that's not enough.

Grandpa, the 80s called, they want your vintage "RPG" experience back. Get with the times you autistic shitstain.

And before anyone gets their sperg sensibilities triggered, what I meant here is that there has been a clear shift in tabletop RPG focus ever since the 80s, which in turn was a byproduct of Tolkien's tropes taking over the fantasy genre at large during the 70s, and all of this then translated to cRPGs as well.

So, yes, a narrative focus in RPGs has been around for a long time and I wish you annoying nimrods would fuck off already.

I'm not talking about the convict part, you inbred moron, but about "being sent to do shit by others" as it's what 90% of RPGs are about, and does not relate to the storyline

I finished playing it yesterday. It starts off really strong – the entire part in Spain is awesome – but then suddenly goes from cRPG to aRPG where you slash your way through a gorillion monsters with little to no dialogue or story. It's okay – not something I'd replay or shill to my friends, but if you're hungry for an RPG and have no better alternative, it's good enough.

Nice try, todd.

Yet both Legend of Grimrock games were a success. I wonder why.

I'm serious here, you always have a contingent of extreme spergs that will swear up and down that dungeon crawlers are the pure cRPG experience, when, at best, they are a game built around but one aspect of the whole RPG (experience).

Early RPGs, tabletop and virtual alike, did focus on combat for the most part, but after the hobby/genre had established itself you had a clear demand from the community for a greater focus on roleplaying mechanics and introduction of modules with better and more varied storytelling so players could actually diceroll their playacting.

Any faggot here that whines about "muh imagination" is on the same level as a Bethesda drone that "roleplays" in Skyrim by pretending, while the game lacks any sort of mechanical foundation to respond to what the player is trying to do. It's the kind of autism that no one can respect or wants to be associated with.

Too bad storyfags didn't get what they wanted with Wizardries, M&Ms, Fallouts or Grimrocks.

Meh. You have aRPGs as a part of the genre now that also are usually rather light on the story.

What has that to do with anything? Skyrim is more successful than both combined. Do I win something for making this statement?

And Wizardry (clones) still get released in Japan. No one here said that dungeon crawlers lacked an audience, just that they are not proper RPGs (in most cases) because they don't let you roleplay properly.

Claiming they are is like saying that Deus Ex is an RPG because it features some elements and mechanics cRPGs feature.

You're confusing nomenclature used for convenience with games that attempt a proper simulation of roleplaying.

There's shitloads of games and genres out there that borrow heavily from RPG mechanics, usually the combat, inventory and stat systems, but that doesn't make them RPGs anymore than it does VNs, where you can pick your choices.

How would you explain the popularity of roguelike games then? They also focus on a single aspect, namely survival.

See
Aren't roguelike games RPGs?

My god, I don't even know if you're baiting or are you really so far up your own pretentious arse.

Sperg about this one title not being a tru RPG:
incursion-roguelike.net/
Well?

Severe autism. Same way I explain the popularity of Minecraft, which is also focused on "survival".

Alternatively, the same way dungeon crawlers are popular. Some people like powergaming and the combat mechanics and don't want to bother with storytelling.

Depends. Some actually let you roleplay, though the lack of handmade content in that regard doesn't really emphasize that aspect all that much.

Are we saying that RPGs and [random game genre]/RPG "hybrids" count because they borrow stuff from proper RPGs or do we base the definition around the ability to build a character and roleplay?

For example, I wouldn't say Witcher games are RPGs. Yes, you build up your character and spec him depending on your preference, and yes, you get to make choices and suffer the consequences, but said choices are not dependent on your character build, merely the player's moral compass.

It's okay, there's nothing wrong with having shit taste like you do.

You're very impatient. Did I rustle your jimmies that much?

Well what? What the fuck do you want me to say about some random rougelike I haven't played?

imgur.com/a/NCGbR
Have another one in ready-made pretty pictures then.

If they companions they add are just going to be avoided, why even get the EE?

Bugfixes? Compatibility with modern systems, especially enabling HD widescreen display modes?

Why are people even recommending Baldur's Gate 2? I recently played through the enhanced editions of the franchise, and it was an eye opener to just how awful the forgotten realms lore truly is. I did skip Dragonspear, because everyone panned that as shit. I knew nothing of the games, other than I thought the Baldurs Gate I played in my youth was the second installment and not the first one, as people tend to hype the games up without ever mentioning why.

I didn't know what overhyped meant until I played these games. The dialogue is cringe worthy and the vast majority of characters are two-dimensional extremes [e.g. Overwatch, Anime], they've all got one or two quirks that they constantly talk about. Everyone's beloved minsc? Ha-ha, hamster and I must protect the witch!

Nigh all of the side content was awful in BG1, everything except for walking in Baldurs footsteps and exploring the werewolf isle, because it was the only quest in the game the rewarded the player with a reward in the form of good exposition. And the entirety of the main quest line was forgettable other than the return to candlekeep and then clearing your name.

Baldur's Gate 2 is a weird beast, where the main quest is best ignored and the side content is savoured, but interest fades quickly because -none- of the fucking side content has anything at all to do with the main quest, so what's even the point? But it's also the first game to set up the awful fucking romances that Bioware has become infamous for. And it's never been as shoved down the players throat, as it has in BG2. The 'canon' characters development is questionable, Minsc and Jaheira getting over their losses immediately and replacing their significant companions. Aerie is a tumblr speshul snowflake.

I can't really say much about Throne of Bhaal, other than I liked the ludonarrative of the protagonist dealing with his inner bloodlust, which is reflected in the gameplay, but I'm not a fan of how it's never seen in the dialogue, other than in accusatory form.

All I'm saying is, Baldur's Gate 2 came out in time where most other games had far, far better writing, and it should not be held up as an example of its time. Better to play Arcanum or Fallout.

I suppose I might be looking in the wrong place but are there any RPGs which uses a setting that feels as mythical and ancient as the works of say Tolkien? I feel that the RPGs I have played lack a sense of history, there are often tombs and ruins as locations but they are just excuses for gameplay rather than anything interesting by themselves and the lore is always shallow as a puddle.

I know pretty much no developer would go through the effort of Tolkien but even faked stuff would be enough if it just was presented right. Basically I'm looking for a game that feels like exploring the ruins of Rome in wonder or discovering a pyramid.

The Icewind Dale games were better written honestly.

Why are people even recommending Baldur's Gate 2? I recently played through the enhanced editions of the franchise, and it was an eye opener to just how awful the forgotten realms lore truly is. I did skip Dragonspear, because everyone panned that as shit. I knew nothing of the games, other than I thought the Baldurs Gate I played in my youth was the second installment and not the first one, as people tend to hype the games up without ever mentioning why.

I didn't know what overhyped meant until I played these games. The dialogue is cringe worthy and the vast majority of characters are two-dimensional extremes [e.g. Overwatch, Anime], they've all got one or two quirks that they constantly talk about. Everyone's beloved minsc? Ha-ha, hamster and I must protect the witch!

Nigh all of the side content was awful in BG1, everything except for walking in Baldurs footsteps and exploring the werewolf isle, because it was the only quest in the game the rewarded the player with a reward in the form of good exposition. And the entirety of the main quest line was forgettable other than the return to candlekeep and then clearing your name.

Baldur's Gate 2 is a weird beast, where the main quest is best ignored and the side content is savoured, but interest fades quickly because -none- of the fucking side content has anything at all to do with the main quest, so what's even the point? But it's also the first game to set up the awful fucking romances that Bioware has become infamous for. And it's never been as shoved down the players throat, as it has in BG2. The 'canon' characters development is questionable, Minsc and Jaheira getting over their losses immediately and replacing their significant companions. Aerie is a tumblr speshul snowflake.

I can't really say much about Throne of Bhaal, other than I liked the ludonarrative of the protagonist dealing with his inner bloodlust, which is reflected in the gameplay, but I'm not a fan of how it's never seen in the dialogue, other than in accusatory form.

All I'm saying is, Baldur's Gate 2 came out in time where most other games had far, far better writing, and it should not be held up as an example of its time. Better to play Arcanum or Fallout. And honestly, it doesn't even hold up to the average casual RPG of the past decade.

Have you tried smuggling a gun from the spaceship you start in?

Eh.. My original Baldur's Gate runs fine on windows 8. No problems. Haven't noticed any glaring bugs in need of fixing, so EE's bugfixes are negligible. Couldn't give two shits about playing in HD widescreen mode either. Still no desire to get the EE.

Apologies for double post. Browser refreshed with the wrong url.

You can delete the double post yourself.

Absolutely shit combat.
The game was so boring and annoying that I actually quit half way through.
I did start it on hard though which was a mistake, tw1 should be played on easy and fights should be skipped wherever possible. The combat is pure cancer.

Kill yourself.

Retards, here is the list:
Everything else is a shit name that only serves to confuse people.
Fucking kill yourselves.

Fucking kill yourself
ASAP NIGGER

KILL YOURSELF

Well double dubs compel me to spoonfeed you.
and others

Babby's first "rpg".
It's practically made from grounds up to be the most teenangst friendly shit ever.

Storyfags took a shit on crpgs. Their focus on story continues to this day and that's why retards calls fallout 4 "an experience".

And there is a reason we put them in a distinct category. The fact those were considered good CRPGs doesn't automatically mean that they are good RPGs.
Computer adaptations of any medium allowing (and, in fact, requiring) more freedom always suffered from (over)simplifications and various limitations.
And back then computers as a whole were much more limited in what they could do as far as games go. Monitors were much smaller, mice weren't a de facto standard, RAM and HDD capacities and speeds were shit, CPUs were slow so, even with good optimisation, simplistic graphics (from which artists still managed to squeeze a lot) and as little behind-the-scenes calculations as possible, we still had to routinely free ~560 KBs of conventional memory and go through other hoops.
All this does not change the fact those are all good games you've listed. It's just they had no chance of becoming good role-playing games, compared to tabletop. Neither did more recent games, but at least they have improved a bit in the nineties.

And I always loathed and complained about them being dumped into roughly the same bin, even though CRPGs are pretty lousy at allowing good role-playing on average.

Probably because roguelikes are good video games and allow you both enough freedom to build your own narrative, supported by framework provided by the game, and enough complex interaction with the game world to have some roleplaying opportunities. But one of the main appeals of roguelikes is significant challenge, anyway.

Sounds good. But you forgot first-person dungeon crawlers and roguelikes.

Yeah, it's shitty when the DM is railroading the party because it goes against the emergent narrative that comes about when a bunch of people get together and play an RPG.

You don't have that when you're playing a single player game on a computer. The machine can't come up with plots on the fly or understand and react to what you are trying to do if it's not programmed to, and there is no budget in this world big enough to finance a game that covers everything the player can come up with.

/tg/ is full of stories of players doing something completely unexpected (for the DM at least) and throwing his whole script out the window, but it doesn't matter because the DM is a human and can adapt to changed circumstances, you can't have that in a computer game.

Also, I fail to understand why you can't have a good narrative with non-linearity and a good combat system, other than because it offends autistic subhumans like you for some reason. Dungeon crawlers are still being made, you could just play and discuss them instead of whining like a bitch.

Define role playing.

What distinguishes role playing in a Japanese game from role playing in a Western game? Considering you're so stupid you're citing art as a distinguishing feature (hint: go look up localized Wizardry ports for Japan) I'm very close to dismissing both of your shitty opinions.

And here I thought I could not respect you any less. I guess Dragon Age doesn't fall into this category because the camera can be moved in a 3D environment.

Dungeon crawlers are full of combat as well. What are you trying to say here? What does "action packed" mean?

He was giving the most straightforward definitions for those terms. The point was to be as broad as possible about the terms so the debate can move past semantics. I don't see the reason to be so nitpicky. It's obvious what he meant when he typed this. Of course Dragon Age isn't isometric. Isometric is a specific thing. You already know what he means by "action packed." It's obvious he means a game that has actual action, as opposed to abstracted action through dicerolls and adding. You already know the particular definition of "role-playing" he has in mind. Obviously the definition that is associated with "role-playing games" like DnD. Stop just arguing for the sake of arguing.

No, he didn't. He fails to define what an RPG is. That's where the inherent problem lies, what constitutes role playing.

Thing is that semantics are all that matter in this case. Plenty of games and genres borrow from mechanics introduced in tabletop RPGs, but that doesn't mean they are games where you roleplay.

The perspective, yes, but not what said games are trying to achieve. I supposed he was referencing to PnP "simulators" like Fallout or Arcanum, or basically any other RPG that separates player and character skill to further accentuate distinctions between character builds.

aRPGs do the dicerolls too, or at the very least feature RNG and math in the background to determine damage dealt based on stats. Saying it's happening real time isn't a good way to differentiate them either, since there's plenty of dungeon crawlers and cRPGs that have real time combat too.

I do not, because his definition is circular in nature. A game is an RPG if it is called an RPG. That tells me nothing about what he deems a role playing game, and his inability to properly define the difference between "RPGs" made in Japan and ones made in the West just reinforces my conviction that he is talking out of his ass and throwing out plebeian, meaningless "definitions" because he's a moron.

I'm not arguing for the sake of arguing, a distinction needs to be made between games that use certain aspects of role playing and games that attempt to bring to live the tabletop role playing experience.

There's a world of difference between Wizardry and Fallout, for example, both in gameplay and what they set out to achieve, and lumping them both under the same diluted umbrella definition does neither any favors.

Oh shit, this is gon b gud.

The faggot wanted to jump into the discussion and acts all righteously angry because the rest of us "just don't get it". According to his retarded logic RPG = Role Playing Game. Here I thought it meant rocket propelled grenade.

Glad he cleared that one up, now we can all pack our things and go home, nothing left to discuss really.

I think that was the whole point of his post. "RPG" describes the latter. "RPG" with some kind of prefix describes the former. Semantics aren't as important as you think they are. Most of the time, when people use a certain term, most others can surmise what they are describing even when they are not using the term correctly. it's called understanding context and not being autistic.

To you. Because you're autistic.

Hence why we have this discussion every time RPGs get mentioned, because we all understand context and there is no inherent issue in lumping all the possible variants of games that fall under the label. Next up, Far Cry 3 is an RPG.

So Fallout is the same as Wizardry which is the same as Diablo which is the same as Final Fantasy. Okay.

how do you even get a shirt like that on a bird. god i bet it was such a pain in the ass

Exactly. Because this board is full of autists. I'm sure there are people here who would call Far Cry 3 an RPG. That actually sounds like it would be some juicy bait.

No shit your normalfag. Why do you think we tolerate Mark and his idiocy? If I wanted uneducated, moronic opinions I'd go to reddit.

There's also furries and horsefuckers and we even have a board full of Marxists. Just because you are here doesn't mean you don't deserve the gas chamber.

It's less juicy than claiming Halo is a role playing game because you play the role of the Master Chief, though easier to set up.

I don't want to.

Just because you're autistic, it doesn't necessarily mean you are also educated and smart. You got legitimately buttmad at a guy for saying "an action RPG is an RPG with action." Who deserves the gas chamber, again?

if when you kill things you get 'experience points' or any equivalent that could result in an increase in power including a currency to purchase better equipment and stats then its an rpg :D
how is plants vs zombies any less of an rpg than dungeon defenders?

Ugh. That's, like, so outdated and stuff. Streamlining is where it's at, CS is the best RPG.

...

the next echelon of rpg is to eschew rpg mechanics entirely and instead remove interface elements and other marketing terminology. or in laymans terms mental amputation.
get this, youre playing as a retarded person with a gun, hes so dumb he doesnt even have a health indicator, he doesnt know if hes been shot. now thats what i call roleplaying

Neither of you are true auteur visionaries of the future of RPGs.

Bethesda already has that covered.

True freedom.

it seem the most hardcore gaymers always want to skip something and get right to the good part.

unga bunga waterchips

You mean Blazkowicz, right? That dude was genuinely brain damaged, and so were the people writing the plot.

To be fair many cRPGs tend to have shit combat for whatever reason. It's baffling that so many games, made by veterans of the industry (and genre in general) consistently fuck up the combat, especially when there's plenty of games that showcase good implementation of whatever mechanics you might want.

Just look at Pillars of Equality, absolute shitfest where the game was purposely designed to suck out any possibility of fun from the game.

ugh, don't remind of that, it was so insanely lackluster, I still haven't managed to finish it. The story is boring, the characters shit and the gameplay atrocious.
Doesn't help that 99% of "NPCs" are just signposts giving you a glimpse into their previous lives or whatever.

Never worry, Tyranny is going to turn out the same, and likely feature more pozz than PoE ever did. The combat is some abominable MMO styled clickfest with cooldown abilities, one dev being quoted that they wanted to have (paraphrasing) an "awesome button", much like BioWare with DA2.

Four of the six possible party members are cunts, and between the two places of origin you can chose as your PC's background one is a land where women inherit all the land.

I fail to see why they're even calling it a game where evil won, considering it seems to have ushered gender equality. If Obsidian wasn't staffed by retarded cowards that do what a tranny on the internet tells them to I'd wager they were being tongue-in-cheek, but I know full well they're being serious about it.

They wanted to make a spiritual successor to games like BG and looks like they succeeded.

Inquisitor was painful to play and quickly dropped. Shit combat, unclear identical looking maps, and walking taking 10 mins to go from one house to the next killed the desire to check out the storylines people supposedly liked.

I hold out hope despite the grognard hate for Tyranny that they learned their lessons from the PoE failure.

Are there any other games where you can be the 'bad guy'? I think the only one that ever succeeded, even outside of rpgs was Dungeon Keeper, most are shit like Overlord where you are not REALLY the bad guy, just the anti-hero.

Fallout 1/2/New Vegas
Morrowind
Arcanum
Temple of Elemental Evil
Vampire: The Masqurade: Bloodlines

M8, nu-Holla Forums made me create an extensive filtering list filled with most of their buzzwords, but even I can see that it will be agenda pushing at its worst.

Those are certainly games. Did you have anything interesting to say about these games we've all played to death?

lmao, that's a Sawyer term

the c stands for cunt
crpg fans are the fucking worst

Eh? Isn't that just the old bearded fat guys in the back of the game store that have the right opinions on vidya and tabletop?

I know the historical etymology, but I had just assumed grognard is what we call nerds now, since the term nerds has been co-opted by marketing firms.

PoE seemed like it could have had decent combat with more polish, and maybe harder limits on the classes.

Chanter is coming back and that seemed like a decent new idea in the CRPG formula.

Is having women in the party really that triggering for you? Shit nigger, most of what I recall from BGII was from women and yoshimo.

How about you fuck off to tumblr if calling out leftists offends you?

And no, the issue isn't that there's more men than women, it's the fact nu-Obsidian is making it, and everyone knows how much they love pozz in their games. So what we can expect is that more than half of your party is going to be made up of unappealing harpies sprouting feminist bullshit while the narrative bends over backwards to tell you how perfect they are.

And that's supposed to fill me with confidence you cocksucker?

*women than men

What do you call it when somebody is clearly raging and upset over silly things, but then says other folk are too sensitive and tumbler?

Someone explain to me why it's called Pillars of Equality when it had absolutely no SJW pandering at all.
The entirety of the game was about rape and torture.

You have to go back.

Two topics leftists obsess about above all else. You have to be blind to miss all the leftist bullshit in the game, like Venice niggers being the most advanced civilization of all despite not making a shred of fucking sense in-game, or all the godawful female characters, but especially that warrior cunt and her "strong and independent womyn that need no man" shit.

Also, they removed a poem from the game because a tranny (emphasis on the singular) threw a fit online. They are perfectly willing to compromise their artistic vision to pander to the same audience BioWare panders to.

There might be things you don't like in this game. But the only thing you've bitched about so far is literally that there are female npc's. Which is a silly thing.

Rape and torture in PoE? What? Where? I don't remember that at all. Some rape and torture would have been nice, and if we are not getting the former, presumably we are getting some of the latter in Tyranny.

What venice niggers are you talking about? There was some silly multi-cultural nonsense that ruined any fun things about alien cultures, but the only niggers i recall were the sea niggers who had a patriarchal reactionary theocracy.

That "whatever" were fanmade vignettes describing the donut steel characters of the most prominent Kickstarter donors. Makes you wanna puke, right?

Two topics they shy away from because they're oversensitive cunts. Had it been leftist bullshit, none of it would've been in the game, save for a str0nk, independant powerful woman with a tragic backstory involving rape, but overcomes her past and saves the world.

Literally does not affect the game.

t. cuckold

I'm an oldfag liberal. Most of us love the idea of adult themes in vidya. I know you're a pol escapee, but lets not pretend that the historical enemy of things like rape and torture in fiction is the conservative busybody.

It's interesting to see the same pricks who would have been burning books for the church are now today's SJW's, but it doesn't seem to matter to them what side they are on.

*is anything but

No, he's right. The single biggest fuck up in PoE was not political but the speshul snowflake shit running around everywhere. By that point in the game nobody was still reading the kick start material.

Censorship is bad. That individual part did not impact shit since nobody in their right mind is paying attention.

The game had a lot of fuckups. A lot of them, which were discussed at large. The discussion is about Obsidian and their tumblr pandering.

Bravo, you're such a fuckwit you manage to contradict yourself in two sentences.
I'm sure the company that removed content a costumer paid for has the artistic integrity and competence to tackle a narrative focused on a world where evil won and will do so in a tactful and tasteful manner.

Thank you, you have reminded me why the industry is shit, and it's shit because it's filled with people like you that don't hold developers accountable for their transgressions. I don't give a shit if they removed a single word, let alone a poem, from the game due to outside pressure and bitching from a tranny. Obsidian are cowards and bottom feeders that will not stand and defend what they make, why should I expect any game of theirs to feature mature and nuanced writing when all it takes for them to buckle under is whining on the internet?

Which is why I called it "the single biggest"

That's the discussion you seem to be having in your head. Nobody else seems to really be having the same discussion as you. Remember, there are other people on the internet!

Something being bad in general and a specific incident not impacting a specific games larger play is not a contradiction.

Nigger, you're why the industry is like that. Have you ever thought about how the decision process for this sort of shit goes on in the technical meeting or, more likely, the board room? Who should they listen to? The SJW shitlord with social backing? Or the incoherent ranting shithead on the internet that is going to bitch about what they do either way.

Be coherent if you actually give a shit and don't just enjoy whining.

Now this is reddit spacing. Sweet jesus.

You could tell from his shit opinions, and the fact he's actively defending Obsidian and their bullshit. God forbid Marxist cockroaches get to suffer for their choices. Now watch him sperg out and degenerate into more obvious shitposting.

I have more respect for the likes of Zoey or Christine Love, that at least don't pretend to something they are not, you know what you get when you are a good goyim and hand them over your shekels, compared to cowards like nu-Obsidian that squirrel away the pozz and hide it in hopes of fooling unwary gamers into paying for their shit.

Why the fucking dancing around? Why can't they be upfront and tell me I'm not the audience they want? If you want to pander to tumblr then pander to tumblr with all your might, but at least have the decency to be upfront about it.

...

I've played all those but I don't think they quite capture what I'm looking for. I think the game closest to what I long for that I have played is Age of Decadence but that's more post apocalyptic than I'd like, comes pretty close though.

Dragon Age for example actually has a ton of backstory written but you never get a sense of the past playing the game, it's left to the codex lore entries. Dungeon Siege belongs to those games I mentioned only having dungeons almost purely for gameplay with handwaved lore. They all lack a sense of rediscovery and that there was a tangible ancient past. There's no real mystery or myth to them.

I assume you're basically looking for RPGs with lots of thought put into their worldbuilding.

Fallout (the first one, the second one has too many memes) and Arcanum then. They belong to the same "family" of RPGs that inspired Age of Decadence.

Maybe look up the two Ultima Underworld games, they're all about dungeon exploration. Same for Arx Fatalis, which is much better than Morrowind in my opinion, and is pretty much another dungeon "simulator" that draws clear inspiration from UU.

Also, Dark Souls, though it's not likely what you're looking for, but the game does have you explore the ruins of "Mount Olympus".

Thanks, Arx Fatalis looks interesting.

Go home manchild.

Make sure you patch the game with Arx Libertatis.

Does anyone else get mad at magic in RPGS? It always feels too unmagical. It should be mysterious and not understood, or evil, or something most people don't like and have never seen. Instead it's always PURCHASE FIREBALL AT LOCAL MAGIC SHOP 11GP DOES 30 DMG POINTS. THE DESIGNATED COURT WIZARD HAS MADE A GIANT MAGIC SHIELD BUBBLE. HERE ARE THE GOBLINS THEY ARE JUST GREEN MIDGETS THAT LIVE IN A VILLAGE NEXT TO US.

This is why historical settings are better because they don't have this. And they can't keep making magic plot devices

...

Overdone "Lore" is really annoying for similar reasons. Having a whole history of completely made up fantasy events that do not appear in the game at all, and explaining every detail and date is just extremely autistic and ruins the fun of not knowing and dreaming,

We'll never get Pillars of Avalon. The necromancerbro dies for our sins and the serving girl waifu dies right before the promised date
These feels were uncalled for, user.

Where do you think we are?

sounds like any blizzard game wc3 and above