Hey Holla Forums

gg no re

Lenin had this huge tendency to write things in theory and then do something completely different.

In The State and Revolution he talks about devolving power to federations. Yet he never did this.

In this book presumably he talks about the right of national self determination and yet he did not let Ukrainians or Catalonian Spaniards have their national self determination.

no

Holla Forums advocates for oppressed groups to sit there and take everything they get because to strike back would be to threaten the idea of Global Proleteriat Revolution. You know, the one that's perpetually round the corner.

Kinda hard when he was fucking dead. At least get basic facts like dates in order before you start talking out of your ass.

i certainly don't

secession is legitimate in the context of oppression, even better if it has a socialist basis

well I think that's the most reasonable point of view comrade, but this board has been so thoroughly spooked by identity politics that it sees every movement that isn't explicitly advocating for class warfare as worthy of contempt and certainly not support.

I was having an argument with someone a while ago who was saying that civil rights protests in America were bad because they improved the material circumstances of African Americans and thus made them less revolutionary.

and anyway most secessionists movements have a socialist tilt to them because they're born from oppression. Socialist secession is naturally the answer most of these groups arrive at.

so 1 of 2 of my examples was wrong. Explain the other one.

Eheheh to be sure, to be sure, you can trust me with your 🍀🍀🍀money🍀🍀🍀, sassanach!

The UK should be replaced by a loose republican confederation of England, Wales, Scotland and Ireland

Yeah I do but I hate their Rabid Nationalism.

I'm 98% Irish and I can confirm we're behind the jewish conspiracy, cointelpro and Black lives matter.

You'll never stop us

Didn't Marx and Engels support anti-imperialist/anti-colonial nationalism in the Austrian and German Empires?

Either way IRA were based. Tioch Fidar La.

uh oh Holla Forums's not going to blow up a bunch of English pubs again is it

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Meme tier movement pal.

belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/northern-ireland/northern-ireland-says-yes-to-a-border-poll-but-a-firm-no-to-united-ireland-30622987.html

It's almost like he had to adjust his views as events unfolded.
He actually did, to an extent. Ignoring the Spaniards, he went against the forceful view of Stalin that the Ukrainians be reabsorbed into a greater Soviet Union, along with Belorussia and the Baltics. Instead, they would have their own SSRs while still being federated within the USSR. And what happened upon the USSR's collapse? Suddenly we have all these Leninist ethno-nationalist states declaring independence.

good friday accords were a massive defeat for the british

Except Britain still controls Northern Ireland and managed to disarm most of the remaining militants.

cute

They really weren't. British strategy towards the IRA had evolved, slowly, over the duration of the conflict, and the 1985 Anglo-Irish Agreement paved the way to the Good Friday Accords in 1998. The British realized they couldn't defeat the IRA by pure military repression, so they switched tactics, incorporating low-key intelligence and police operations while denying the IRA hard targets, and buttressed that with political initiatives that isolated Sinn Féin and the IRA until their capitulation. For the IRA's part, the split between the Provisional and Official branches proved counterproductive, while the bombings were a sign of weakness rather than strength, which played into British hands and provoked Protestant reprisals.

Note the fact that there is a difference between nationalism under oppresion (ireland, palestine, etc…) And nationalisn fueled by pride (u.s.a)

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IRA NEVER EVER

KEK

Well done for not one fucking NIfag on the board. The truth of the glorious socialist republic is this: run poorly by the rich for the rich. No free healthcare cos no fucking way dail can pay for it. Not one northern republican wants to join as the benefits would instantly dry up. NI cannot foot its own bill - requires westminster mobey of at least 5 billion a year. We dont raise anywhere near that in tax. Sinn Fein corrupt as fuck and want money. Most within travelling distanxe of NI register as uk citizens to get free healthcare which, by the way, is shit and has ensured the entire of west belfast is hooked on happy pills (benzos).
No better example of why socialism doesnt work and why Irish republicanism is a mish mash of old men ex murderers and nostalgia fags who are happy wifh the status quo and fucking glad they dont live in dublin.
Crap opinions, crap board.
Was in 2 bombs myself. Cunts.

Everyone on left in NI. PUP linked to UDA more left than SF. With devolved govt no fucking point joining the republics car crash economy. Also with the EU on their backs you have a hard time convincing NI to join ROI. We have a mafia now who basically failed. Only ever hit weak targets, general public = cowards

I wonder what Irish leftists would rather

A united Irish capitalist republic or Ireland rejoining a socialist republic of the British Isles

overthrow the capitalist ireland with bri'ish backing

Socialist Commonwealth of England, Scotland, Ireland and Wales when?

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Soon, I hope.

Advocating the good Royals be given the Roman Emperor treatment. The bad ones can be given the Tsar treatment.

idk I think we should just give them some shitty jobs, more humiliating and useful

Improved the flag, mate.

Also, Ireland should be independent!

Instead, we need a federation of Commonwealths in Great Britain.

Ireland should be a confederal republic that includes Ulster and gives Ulster plenty of autonomy along with the other regions.

This isn't the 1950s anymore. "Nationalism from below" has destroyed the old colonial empires - and proceeded to turn swiftly, often at the very moment of independence, into nationalism from above.

I certainly have sympathy for the Northern Irish, and any organization who blows up London's financial district and tries to kill Thatcher can't be all bad.

But like every national liberation movement, they ultimately sold out the revolution in order to secure a better deal for their nation. Because the purpose of national liberation is to liberate nations, not the people inside them.

Who cares what the losers in the Socialist Party or the AAA-PBP want. What's important is what the Irish proletariat want, and the proletariat plainly do not want to be subjugated to Britain again. Why does socialism have to mean unionism?

To most extents, yes. A united Ireland must be socialist first and foremost.

This.
So fucking much

In the book, he argues that the state is just a phase before communism and it will slowly dissolve. He never devolved SU to federation, because he fucking died.

when you think you're being profound but are saying absolutely nothing

Yes.

Nationalism can be used for a progressive movement and people should be free from imperialism.

just a hypothetical Paddy

you can't spell for shit

fuck off imperialist

Ireland was a mistake

I used too. But back then i was a nazi so…..

So this is the power of autism. Woah…

a lot of Irish people sperg out by default whenever Britain is mentioned

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