I like the idea of a 4v1 or an unbalanced multiplayer yeah yeah, playing online. Playing with friends...

I like the idea of a 4v1 or an unbalanced multiplayer yeah yeah, playing online. Playing with friends. Having friends…..I'm a normalfag and have to go back to Reddit or whatever boogeyman you feel like

How this formula could work or how can we improve the exciting one?

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Well from my experience Dead by Daylight actually works provided perks are off since at any point in the game the killer is a threat while him choosing to camp a body causes generators turn on. Evolve is shit though since early game the xeno is a bitch.

Yeah evolve had a camping monster until it could fight back so was shit as a execution

Dead by daylight is nice apart of the bugs and being monotonous, they should ad new way to sacrifice (torture them, or feed them to some animal) or escape with building or excavate and not only make the generator work
I actually never played it so why the perks are bad?

A game built around hype and first-impressions.
The game in itself is amazing in concept, but the entirety of playtime is focused on the down-time during a hunt.
That in of itself, is why the game became boring. You either win by a landslide, or the game lasts for hours on ends by a game of cat and mouse.
They tried to fix this with the Arena mode, but Arena mode itself is unbalanced for the monsters due to how they NEED to eat to regain armor. Something you can't do when you're forced to fight.

Same thing with Evolve, but it plays better in its mechanics.
The only thing you need to worry about are stacked teams of Toolbox abusers.
Once they destroy all your hooks, the best you can do is run around chasing everyone like a middle aged man scaring kids away from his front yard.
The game becomes the opposite of Evolve but you know full well they're going to win this unless they fuck up big time.

The biggest problem with these types of games is that the personal skill of the player is as important as the tools the character provides. It's not like Call of Duty or Counter-Strike where each team has roughly the same equipment. Dead by Daylight has a few problems regarding how some monsters are more useful than others, but Evolve's problem was that it allowed four players to fight back at one player. They have to make the monster seem OP without actually being OP, which is a balancing nightmare when more and more skills get involved.

If you want a better example, try Pac-Man Vs. I think that was the title anyway, was a GameCube game that required GBA connectors. One person was Pac-Man and three others were ghosts. The ghosts had only a limited view of their surroundings, but Pac-Man could see the entire stage. It was more cat-and-mouse than the games you described, but it also wasn't unfair, as it was more of a party game.

Well there are certain things like self healing without medkits, or having the ability to destroy non basement hooks or traps without a toolkit. Plus things like getting a free heal once all generators are up or having a 150% move speed that lasts 3 seconds and charges every 20 seconds. Which once you get to two close ledges makes it near impossible for killers to kill you. Things like being able to see traps as survivors are also BS. Essentially at higher levels if you aren't the hillbilly and a god at chainsaw sprinting or lucky with the trapper and having nobody that can see traps the survivors always win. Wraith is fucked against higher level players.

How about 1v11? You can't kill the boogeyman by normal means, your main goal is to survive until time is up. You can work with your teammates to stall it but as soon as he gets up you must run away or it's massacre time. I find the mode quite entertaining.

In my opinion the game that got unbalanced, or rather asymmetrical, game play right was Natural Selection (Half-Life 1 mod).

Marines with a commander that had a top down view and played as a RTS while his team mates were in FPS. Aliens that had no commander but instead could evolve into a builder class that could place structures. Marines could research upgrades while Aliens had to build more Hives in order to unlock evolution upgrades.
Marine commander could drop armor, jetpacks and weapons, while Aliens had to evolve their life form to an attacker class with desired traits / perks.

Played it a lot, loved it. See webm for some basic 'rine play. That was 8 years ago.

Of course the devs decided to go for symmetry game play in Natural Selection 2 (and their own fucking engine which sucked ass) and ruined everything. No one plays the game anymore than a couple of handfuls of either competitive players or fresh meat who unwillingly brought the game in a Steam sale thinking it looked fun.
I regret my preorder of this game, till the day I die.


The problem with Evolve was that it was the Tank fight from Left 4 Dead (same devs), expanded by 20 minutes. This is not fun. It never was, even in L4D. Either the Tank was a round ender or Survivor blazed on through. Never commit as Tank, always stand on roof tops and start throwing rocks. Hope that one lands to reset your frustration meter to prevent loss of control, wait until a Boomer lands a shot, then commit with the rest of your Infected teammates.
Evolve just removed Infected teammates which does not expand on the fun.

If you are fighting good Hunters, you are fucked as stage 1. Like L4D the core design issue is that the difficulty of the game comes from the Survivors/Hunters. Infected/Monster versus shit Survivors/Hunters? Infected/Monster wins. Godlike Survivors/Hunters that never make mistakes, always move as a team, very careful and observant? Infected/Monster gets fucked.

L4D2 tried to fix this by introducing the Charger and Spitter, forcing the Survivors to not stand too close together or be bowled through or corner camping in spit. Of course that just devolved into Charge + Spit on one Survivor constantly for free 35 damage, despite of how well the Survivors played.

Turtle Rock doesn't know how to fix it or too blind to see this core game play design issue. I hope Evolve was a wake-up call for them.

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1v many is not a unique genre, it has been implemented before by vastly better gameplay. Evolve just fell flat because of more shills than game devs.

This meme needs to die.

Evolve wasn't a terrible game. If you're into mobas you'd be into evolve too. They just fucked it up because of lack of content and many microtransactions.

The game failed entirely because they spent more time shilling than adding substance to the game, which is too bad.

If somebody likes ASSFAGGOTS then they already have no taste, so what game they play is irrelevant.

Again, mobas aren't bad games. You're just a heard mentality faggot.

Well, as long as his reasoning is sound.

but they are bad games, they're just RTS for people too stupid to control more then one unit.

The most hilarious thing is when someone like you who never ever played a dotalike in their life tries to come up with excuses why the genre is shit. In the future, to save face, you should probably just avoid talking after someone calls you out. Since you really are just following the herd mentality as he said.

Dead by daylight is fun, with some bad flaws…But the idea is there and the execution is abysmal like evolve was.

I like 'em because they play like competitive Diablo PvP. The problem is that I don't like how justifiably angry the community can be for new people, and that I always end up with a family member pulling me away in the middle of a match.

That and I suck at strategy games in general. Can't beat Starcraft 2 on easy.

By that logic strategy games are the only good games because every other game is for casuals who can't control more than one unit at a time.
It's a shit argument and you should feel bad for even making it.

At least play the games you plan on shitting on so you don't sound like a complete retard.

The formula definitely works better in games like Dead By Daylight or The Hidden where the one pursues the many. Evolve gets really boring because you're many people with a pretty slow walking speed on a big map chasing a single creature. That simply doesn't work.
Dead By Daylight and The Hidden work phenomenally because it's one player chasing other players in a map small enough that the one player is almost always chasing after someone, keeping that gameplay flowing and the excitement alive.

It's very easy to look up IDs and who they belong to friend.
In a RTS different armies have different strengths anything in parenthesis will be the ASSFAGGOTS equivalent, some are better at being turtles (tanks), others can hold sustained attacks but aren't good at quick kills (bruiser), and others are just good or well known with swarm attacks (something of a ganker in a sense). Each map in an RTS around 3 or more lanes with some interchange between, MOBAS too. In and around those lanes there is resources to gather. Creeps for MOBAs and whatever the fuck you want to call it for an RTS. These resources are used to gain strength within yourself for an RTS or your team for a MOBA The goal for both games is to destroy the enemy base/bases. From these point I'd say it's safe to say they're mechanically similar, afterall MOBAs were born from the RTS genre. This is why I make the argument They're both types of strategy games, so I'm going to compare the two.

Now then what sets an RTS apart from MOBAs is micromanagement of units, placement of defenses since MOBAs already handle that with their inhibitors (For LOL) and towers being pre placed. An RTS player must decide when and where and what type of tower to place in each location to stop attacks.
Since they also have to consider what type of unit the enemy may send and when. Will they do a Zerg rush to quickly end? Will they turtle up? Or constantly nitpick at any scouting units you send, who knows. Because there is less worry in the early game MOBAS are already less complex. Because you don't need to manage a large number of units individually MOBAS are less complex, because MOBAS are more streamlined their barrier to entry and skill ceiling are lower.

They do have teamwork though but everyone knows
TLDR simpler game = simpler players.

You just keep embarrassing yourself. Did you ride in from cuckchan yesterday?

I'm using the MOBA term since it's most associated with those games, will you actually make an argument or sit around merely pretending to be retarded and only attacking character.

So you did ride in from cuckchan just yesterday.
I already did. That associating RTS with dotalike is a fallacy. False equivalence.

I played the original War3 DoTA mod back in the day, and I never understood the appeal to it back then either. I've played DoTA 2 and while I think it's certainly better than the original, it's still just an shitty *ARTS.
*"ARTS" is what the genre was called before riot bullshitted "MOBA" into existence.

You're not going to convince anyone if you're still call them fucking mobas.

You never pointed out why it's a fallacy user.
Here's your three posts

Now I've pointed out why they can be compared due to the lineage of MOBAs or *ARTS or ASSFAGGOTS or whatever the fuck you want to call them along with their mechanical similarities while at best you've said "you're a herd following retard go back to cuckchan"

False equivalence. There's so many genres and franchises that could be compared like this that have nothing in common, you're just showing how retarded you are.
And you're only proving that I am correct.

Again you haven't said anything all I'm seeing is a retard that ignores anything he knows is right and only attacks what little can be countered with shallow unexplained points.

Shit man you probably look at the demo of fucking halo wars and think it's to complicated for you.

Getting back on topic from fucking assfaggots…

Is there any game that takes a mole-style approach to this? In other words have a co-op game where a team of players fight AI enemy, but have one guy on the team be a mole whose got to try to ensure the team don't complete the objective?

Keep those ad hominem going bruh I'm sure that will erase the fact that your entire argument is false equivalence. Like you're trying to compare Super Mario Brothers to Ratchet and Clank.

The Hidden is pretty much the only good 1vMany game so far.

Man it's almost as if I have a post somewhere in this thread where I explain that the objectives are the exact same, the playstyles being similar, and the classes defined by developers holding similarity too. I guess we can add how players are controlled, and how the map is hidden away for areas with no units, and how control of lanes is a main objective of both. Man they're getting real similar now, if I remember anymore they might become the exact same.


I'd say give Daylight a month or two for devs to balance it, it might end up being good.

Too bad you don't have a post explaining anything that sort and instead rely on false equivalence.

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lol just sad

Fuck off already with your ASSFAGGOTS

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then give me a proper reason why ARTS isn't a retards RTS. You think you're right? Then stop spewing just false equivalence and give me the differences between the two. I've given the similarities you should be able to provide why it isn't in terms of mechanics.

No. Stop using fallacies. You haven't shown anything.

There's been nothing more nerve wrecking ever since and I'll never experience it ever again.

but I have you illiterate nigger, I've pointed out the main goal of lane control between the two, how different choices of armies show similarities to classes, how the adding of towers in arts along with the lack of micromanagement makes them less complex and then their older genre counterpart. You just ignored them.

Is there anything you can do that isn't a fallacy? Oh wait no there isn't because you never played one game of the things you're criticizing in your life. You're just a retard who is going by herd mentality. You have no idea why the games are shit.

I surprised no one brought up the some of the asymmetrical multiplayer games from Nintendo Land. (gonna copy paste the info from Wikipedia)


Mario Chase
Mario Chase, inspired by the Super Mario series, is a tag-based game that takes place inside an arena consisting of large obstacles, hills, and slides. Four players, whose Mii characters are dressed in Toad costumes, pursue and attempt to catch the fifth player, whose Mii is dressed as Mario. The Mario player, who views the action on the Wii U GamePad screen from a top-down perspective, has a map of the entire arena and can see the location of all the Toad players. The Toad players view the action on the television in split-screen from a third person perspective, and are each only given his current distance from Mario in yards or meters (depending on the region). The Toad players win if one of them catches Mario before the time limit expires, otherwise the Mario player will win. If there are less than three players, the remaining Toad characters may be replaced by computer-controlled Yoshi robots.

Luigi's Ghost Mansion
Luigi's Ghost Mansion, inspired by the 2001 video game Luigi's Mansion and based on the 2003 game Pac-Man Vs., is a game in which up to four players (dressed like Mario, Luigi, Wario and Waluigi) assume the roles of "ghost trackers" and explore a haunted house to hunt for the fifth player, who is the ghost. Each level is set on a different floor with different layouts of rooms and hallways, and the action is viewed from above, showing the entire floor and the location of all players. The trackers must find the ghost player, who remains invisible on the television screen, and decrease its health (a numerical value from 0 to 100) by shining their flashlights upon it. Meanwhile, the ghost must sneak up and ambush each tracker to make him faint. The ghost's proximity to a tracker is made known when that player's Wii Remote begins to vibrate, and different events or conditions may cause the ghost to temporarily become visible to all trackers. Fainted trackers can be revived by the others by using their flashlights, though flashlight energy is in limited reserve and must be restored by picking up battery items. The ghost wins if all the trackers have fainted; the trackers win if they decrease the ghost's health to zero.

Animal Crossing: Sweet Day
Based on the Animal Crossing series, four players control animals trying to collect candy as a team before they get caught 3 times by the guards, controlled by another player using the GamePad. As players collect more candies, their movement becomes slower, making it easier for them to be caught. If playing with only two players, the format changes to the stash rules, where one animal must collect candies and must put fifteen into the stashes on the map.

There's also Metroid Blast featuring a mode called Surface-Air combat that consists of players on the ground running around as Samus while being fighting against a player flying around in Samus's spaceship attacking from the sky.
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Yeah that the correct title. That looks like it did a good 1v3 multiplayer (3 ghosts instead of the usual 4). The ghost players did have "blind map" on the tv screen that showed the ghost positions in the maze but not the walls, power pellets left or Pac-Man location.

I get it now, you only say those since you actually have nothing to say, you know you're wrong so you try to do everything you can to dodge an answer. You spout false equivalence in an attempt for people to not realize that you're actually giving no points. You'd do great as a politician. After all the best way to attack someone is say that they're a retard using ad hominem while ignoring they're own use. You never had any argument, you're just defending a shitty genre in an attempt to justify the time you sunk into it.

Add another to the list.

Also yeah sure you go main random in ranked whatever that means.

Yeah ok there bud, it's not like the entire time you've been using the very things you've been talking about. No sir bob.

ayy lmao

well you see you're using the term projection which is a term used in psychology. For the post where I point out your hypocrisy. Ain't that a thing.

1 vs many will never work well. The big guy is either a bullet sponge that takes an impossible amount of damage and slowly chases down and kills the entire enemy team while the defeated have to sit and watch idly, or the big guy is slow and/or unthreatening enough that being a giant target for a multitude of weapons ensures his slow defeat. In both cases, playing the clock usually becomes a factor, increasing the tedium.

You could slap a player in control of one of the big baddies in Mass Effect 3 multiplayer with better results.

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Sure buddy. Still doesn't change that you've never had an argument and are just desperate to "win" the argument.

Pointing out a fallacy means he doesn't have an argument. But since you're probably him on an IP switcher I'm not surprised since you've only come in here to accuse me if being a retard who likes these types of games.

There was actually one 1 vs many that worked extremely well that I remember of. Sneaking mission in MGO2 where Snake had to collect the dogtags of knocked out players, if they killed snake a set number of times a team won, snake gets a set number of dogtags he won. A 1 vs many vs many.

again this paragraph points out why the games are similar and what an RTS adds on top of it giving it more depth. Please stop ignoring it and address it properly.

No it doesn't. I've said this many times.

Why not then? Why is a paragraph dedicated to explaining the similarities of resource gathering, classes of characters and goal of the game not giving the similarities. Even though it's doing just that. All you have to do is say why those points aren't similarities at all.

The fact that you still give a shit about people telling you to fuck off indicates that you are in fact a newfag and do need to fuck off back to wherever you came from.

Fallacies are not absolute. Some depend on context, which means you actually have to think a little before calling people out.

Because it does nothing to address actual gameplay. Its all surface level shit that exists in any kind of game. You could make the exact same post with TF2 characters. And also the fact that your only frame of reference you're using is apparently from LoL which everyone knows is so blatantly casual that even people without actual limbs can play it at a high level. But you already know all this because you've never seen a game of dotalike being played in your life.

Shit man I don't even need to argue, I can be smug now.

Shit man I don't even need to argue, I can be smug now.

Why do people respond to these insecure redditors with anything but ridicule?

they define the rules of the game, so they are. It's very simple. The rules of how the game acts is very much gameplay. I'm not even sure how you came to the other conclusion. It baffles me.

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store.steampowered.com/app/274940/
Here you go OP. Enjoy.

The problem with these games is that people generally suck at vydia. When it's 5v5 you hope to split the good and shitty players evenly to balance it out, if it is multiple v 1 you see the flaws. Back when i used to plat sc2 there was a mod called vampire hunter or something, which was basically 7 builders vs 1 "vampire" Ultralisk who would try to break into your base for resources. You constantly would see whining or a shitty game if a bad/new players was the vamp. It was a fun game though, but I don't see it being a 60 dollary doo game

post wraith

There's another thread with measurably more wraith.

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The toolbox spammer meme is dead. It no longer helps to break hooks at all, because level 3 iron grip lets you carry someone across the map and put them in the basement.

Trapper can easily get 2-3 kills every round with iron grip 3. Basically unavoidable.

If you're desperate, you can always burn an effigy so you can fucking kill them without a hook.