How come game designers suck so much at level design? This level for example...

How come anons suck so much at making threads that aren't rehashed whining about subjects we have thoroughly run into the dirt discussing? This thread for example was created a thousand times in the last 2+ years and it still has the same answers when it was made then as it was made today.

It's sad.

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Because good level design often implies giving players freedom to move around.

And giving players freedom is bad.

I guess I know what you mean. Like the devs making sure you see everything they want you to see, like when they wrestle control of the camera or movement speed from you.

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I don't think these maps are as non-linear as you think, OP. I realize this is the first level and the map sucks. I can't seem to find any online. But it's pretty linear.

Most of it is linear, but it encourages you to venture off the main path and explore a little bit before coming back onto the main path. At best it has two branching paths that take you to the same place.

Goldeneye was a more accessible FPS at the time, it's not the pinnacle of complex level design. It's fun, but it's not nearly as advanced as the games like pointed out.

But the problem is new games don't even encourage you to explore at all. You have very limited choices in the game as you walk through scripted corridors and wait for things to happen to you, until you get a chance to interact somehow.

maybe like me he was too busy banging chicks to have played every single game in existence, ever thought about that, nerd?

how old are you

Where do you think you are?

We are entering a world of subjectivism gone mad, that's why.

This was basically the most popular multiplayer FPS before Call of Duty and Halo.

It's kind of like not knowing who Mario is.

It's GoldenEye you jock.

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Fuck off, normalscum

Have you ever played DOOM 2 and Fallout New Vegas? The level design is fucking garbage. They're not linear at all, and that's the problem. In Doom 2 everything feels so disconnected and confusing. New Vegas feels like a repetitive corridor shooter with lots of confusing paths (even with the map and compass), samey looking rooms, backtracking, and lack of verticality in combat.

Interconnection between areas is the most important thing in level design. I'd rather have a completely linear level design over this kind of cluttered half assed mess in Doom 2 and New Vegas. Doom 1 has some of the best level design because it's both interconnected and encourages exploration.

Yeah, a popular game, when I was like 3 years old. Shut up cuck.

What do you think of deus ex's level design?

Seconding that

Stopped playing after finding out that the combat and RPG were absolute garbage. I've finished the first level though, the one on liberty island. It was fine I guess. I like how you're able to finish the level in different paths and ways. But still, I really don't like the other aspects of the game. If it wasn't an RPG I'd play it.

But the whole game is about denton getting his augments to stop the illuminaty. The game has to be an rpg to work. You should atleast try to get to hong kong. The game is amazing and we'll never have another good one again.

The only RPG games I like are sandbox RPG like Elder Scrolls and Fallout 2-4. Open ended shooter games can't be RPG.

This is the most obvious bait I've seen this week.

You are fucking pleb cancer.

Look at his other posts.

Games should do what Thief did and simulate actually.

Opinions discarded.

Skill progression should be coupled with the freedom of improving your character. I find open ended RPG games like SS2 and Deus Ex to be too restricting. I like the direction FO2-4 take for the freedom of battling more powerful enemies and grinding your character.

Im not sure why youre including fo2 in that. Fo2 is more restricive than ss2 or deus ex. faggot

It's about the freedom to grind, not finishing levels, you illiterate cuck.

Kill yourself my man

Although now I realize what you want. You just want the ability to fuck around and shoot shit for a while.

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There's a difference between grinding anytime I want (Morrowind) and requiring grinding to progress the game (JPRG).

ITT: I like to wander around in circles because it artificially enhances the length of the game and makes me feel like a hardcore gamur
Streamlining is a good thing, the industry agrees with me, deal with it.

Dropped immediately.

Deus Ex is a lot more open-ended than SS2. The only real notable thing I can think of from Deus Ex which you CAN'T do is kill Gunther early when MJ12 tries to give you the dick. But who kows you may actually be able to do that and I just hadn't figured out a way to do it.

SS2 I felt more like a god at the end of then I did with Deus Ex though. Crystal Sword plus pyro shield, squishy life forms btfo.

SS1 while the levels are a lot more open-ended you don't have skills or nanites to mess with it seems. I need to beat it. I was pretty shocked that there are seemingly less rpg elements in it. I got the isotope and kinda wandered around aimlessly after that.

I was meant to say non open ended. They don't feel open ended enough to be a good RPG game for me. Open ended for me involves freedom to grind anytime. I like SS1 more than SS2 for having less RPG in it though, I hate the nanites mechanics.

I don't know if do they count since they're only background, but some fighting games still have good level designs

oh okay, I was going to say I didn't get how you find open-ended games restricting.

I feel though with Deus Ex and SS2 what they did so well was immerse you in the world you were in. In Deus Ex every time I play and find a new little tidbit of information that I didn't find before or didn't quite remember and try to make decisions from it. I ask myself if these dogs deserve justice, if I am the ubermensch or if these fuckers are just trying to play me. Basically, there are people in the know and not in the know, and those with power within the system and those without, all with revolutions and subterfuge going on on both sides.

With SS2 I genuinely didn't want to do anything in that game. Every new area I went to or every time I turned a corner I was just nervous and anxious over what was waiting there in the unknown. I just got out of some comfy ass training comas or w/e and now I gotta get myself out of this huge fucking mess while god knows what is out there?

but freedom to grind anytime? Does that make FF XIII more open-ended than Deus Ex once you get to Gran Pulse?

nice trips

thats cool looking but I dont think its the same idea the other anons had when talking about level design

I think it meant the amount of different ways/options you can go and things you can do to achieve 1 objective

as in, some games you can crawl through a sewer, or go over the roof, be sneaky, kill everyone, talk your way without a fight, and that kind of different options
you dont get that in a fighting game

but yeah, the background is pretty cool there

Because you played those when you were young therefore nostalgia

bullshit

Nostalgia has nothing to do with good maps or gameplay user.

That sounds like a good recipe for great level design. Just design a level like you would design an actual building/city/complex/etc. Then have someone populate the game and lay out the path.

that was one of the most boring levels in the game

because he wants that feeling of camaraderie.
hey guys, isnt objectively terrible thing pretty terrible? remember when things werent so bad? upvote me for nostalgia

1. design a level like it would be a real place
2. ???
3. profit

or just make a straight street and put some building props everywhere and call it a day

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and yet he's here, isn't he?