How do you feel about the "sonic games were always bad" meme?

Most people who claim it are either baiting or don't seem to have the brainpower to grasp that Sonic is an entire series that was designed around speedruns, with the speed itself being a reward for doing well.

It's a platformer where you jump on enemies and that's about where the similarities with Mario end.

"Designed around speedruns" meaning that stage memorization plays a heavy factor into the level design and how you approach the entire game. It's entirely possible to get through the whole thing and enjoyable on the first time as you try to speed your way through sheerly by trial-and-error, but the intention is you replay it later to go for the best time you possibly can.

wew

But it does punish you for going fast, user.

AIDSmoby and fatcuck said so.

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Sonic is quite edgy, though, look at all those spikes.

Couldn't be bothered to webm it you faggot?

He's also so cool he doesn't follow any rules, that's why he goes so fast in every game.

Aidsmoby liked Firewatch.

Memorizing level design isn't as much of a factor as understanding movement and momentum. When you play the first time you just push forward, get hit, collect rings, push forward - you don't realize nuances like rolling, bouncing of enemies et.c. Memorizing level layout isn't the way (although it helps sure), you actually have to GET GOOD.

"I sucked at the game, but I still say that it's fun to play it"
PreRec is a huge mistake

You could try, user :^)

Firewatch is an okay way to kill ~4 hours if you pirate it and play it in a window while you shitpost

I didn't enjoy Sonic games as a kid. I thought the idea was to go fast, but I was always able to go faster in Mario.

It's a shit meme by people who don't play games, the real issue is a lot of them were pretty average.
A lot of the meme was borne around 2006-2007
And we all know why that time period is important. That being said, Boom, '06, Dark Chronicles and Shuffle are borderline if not irredeemably bad, everything else floats around average/good.

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Why are you opposed to learning?

Have a snickers, user.

Feel free to convert the video into that mess, or you could just use something like uBlock Origin and you won't be a monetized click when you view a jewtube video :^)

It was actually a real processing trick. Marketing department just took the name and ran with it.

You're just retarded, then. Carry on.

You're acting like a goon outsider, and you don't fucking belong here.

Adblock prevents youtubers from getting paid is best meme.

Yes youtubers still get money if you use adblock.

Are you a career consolefag? Holy shit.

Are you a jewtuber, user? Can you provide a reliable source for your information?

Skip to 12:36 you fucking idiot, the webm I posted is not at 12 fps and you need to get your eyes checked if you still think so.

I personally know Lonely Goomba, he confirmed that while, no it is not the same, he does in fact still get paid per view if the user is using adblock.

I mean a real source. Something verifiable, not second-hand gossip.

Fair enough, I understand as not being a direct source my claims are dubious. At the most I can tell you I'm being honest.

The early Sonic games were the most sophisticated 2D platformers ever created. The joy of Sonic is not HURR DURR FAST, it's the incredible nuance in physics and control, running and jumping off of curved surfaces and accelerating linearly instead of snapping to top speed instantly then running on flat surfaces like Mario. Sonic doesn't require you to go fast, it simply allows you to go fast once you know what you're doing. That's what every edgy retard trying to claim that the games are poorly designed is missing. They go "hurr Sonic is poorly designed because you go so fast that you can't react in time to incoming danger!" when they could have just slowed down a bit until they learned the stage layout.

But really what it boils down to is that most classic Sonic haters are just terrible at video games. Something like Mario presents the danger well in advance. Sonic can very well be played the exact same way, but these impatient fucks insist on going fast. Then they get fucked over time and time again, and they start to blame the game. Meanwhile I and everyone else that grew up with these games had our thumb mashing right for 99% of the game, top speed whenever possible, and we handled pretty much everything the game threw at us with fast reaction times. Because we weren't shit.

Same fucking people that try to look down on FPS for being simplistic but get booty blasted constantly because they are fucking shit at the genre, and blame it all on "I-I have a job, fucking teenaged neckbeard losers that play this game all day!"

Sadly Sega itself is partially responsible for this meme. With the 3D Sonics, they tried to solve the "hurr I didn't know it was coming!!!" issue with a behind-the-character camera. But now, without a direct side view of the slopes, the entire fucking point of the games, the slope-based physics, is impossible to visualize. So they got rid of that and dumbed the physics down considerably. Now it's so bad that even Sega doesn't realize why people liked their games in the first place.

You could have just said "git gud" and your argument would be the same. Classic Sonic and Modern Sonic both have their nuances, you're just too retarded and too biased to spend any time learning or appreciating Modern Sonic's.

I'm not saying you're lying, but the entire jewtube monetization scheme is anything but transparent, and every big jewtuber I've seen who has chimed in on the issue has said that they don't get paid for views with adblock. They could all be lying, and they're certainly motivated to do so, but I'd really like to see some solid proof either way.

I don't really care about giving a fag 0.1 cent or whatever it is they get, the main reason I use adblock is to block ads. The levels of paranoia some people have against clicking a youtube link are staggering to me.

Which is why fags like are cancerous as fuck and do nothing but derail threads.

Want a webm? Fucking make it yourself.

It's not a matter of paranoia or clicks but convenience, I'm not going to the effort of watching some shitty e-celeb's 17 minute youtube video to get to the terribly-articulated point you're trying to make. Want to make an argument? Fucking do it yourself instead of relying on some youtube faggots to do it for you.

Sanic was never good.

This is basically it. The meme of sonic being fast is so ingrained in people's heads that they just try to blast through the level as fast as possible without knowing the layout, and can't understand why the game punishes them for that.
You wouldn't do it in Super Mario Bros., Gradius, Dark Souls, or any other game that isn't for casuals, so why do it here?

I do think a lot of the direction Sega has ever tried to apply to Sonic has been due to 'trendy' marketing with gimmick-of-the-year and poor understanding mixed in. But the early Sonics were fucking gold in the history of gaming. Hell, I'll even admit, the Advances and Adventure 2 put out a fair share of merriment, too.

If there's anything I do blame this series for, it's for special snowflake fan art and not knowing how to observe itself and figure out what made it great. But I'd never say it was always terrible- Super Mario World had the upper hand in creativity and difficulty, but Sonic gave your ass good reflexes and an understanding of curved surfaces and physics (in an era of block/square level designs).

absolutely would, platformers require decisiveness and quick thinking much more than preparation and caution
you just have to be good at the game in and of itself or get good, and boom, it pays off nicely
unless I'm thinking of a different scroller, Gradius can't move faster or slower, to the degree that it's entirely reaction time and re-runs? Weird example.
if you don't dash the everliving fuck out of it, you're playing the game wrong
alternating between evasion and killing enemies is a key game design influence in Dark Souls and 3, not so much in 2.
Funnily enough, 2 is the easiest to dash through entirely.

Also, Sonic 1 is dated crap. Like hell it's better than Mario.

Came here to post this, glad I'm not the only one paying attention

This shit right here. Another thing that pisses me off is the whole "Sonic's appeal was being the edgier version of Mario" "He's dated as fuck, because he's COOOOOL!" No fuck you. The guy may have been created as competition but his creation was downright more sophisticated than other video game characters. His design was made by a fan of American animation, which is why he looks like Felix the Cat. The entire theme of Sonic is appealing in the same way as Bone with the cartoon characters vs real danger, but instead of Lord of the Rings fantasy it's plays off like an anime, hence>>9315455 the contrast. You never see contrast with Mario. I think Sonic was one of the few platformer characters to actually try to have some sort of contrast instead of focusing itself on being kid friendly. As an animationfag, the whole "Sanic is a Mario ripoff" pisses me off to no end because they're spouted by people that don't really play games or are butthurt Nintendo fanboys.

Hell, there are actual lore to this franchise that later games are ignoring. Though I'll give credit that the modern games by Sonic Team are at least striving for a more unified form. (If you play Colors, Generations, and Lost World back to back you'll see what I mean).

>decisiveness and quick thinking
Hence why the Sonic games have sections where its obvious you're supposed to roll up into the slopes to go high speed and sections (flat terrain and less rings with more enemies that you can see easily after a harmless obstacle breaks the neckbreaking speed) where it has good platforming.

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Did you know that Shigeru Miyamoto was so impressed with Sonic 1 and upset over the quality of Super Mario World, which had to be rushed to meet the SNES launch, that he pushed Super Mario World 2 into being a completely different style of game from all other marios and made the animal character Yoshi the main character? After playing Sonic 3 Miyamoto gave up on developing for the SNES and focused solely on his 3D mario game for the upcoming "ultra 64", which in turn has its own sad story involving another animal mascot rival.

Personally I want a return to Bad Future, like in the TV show.

And for Dr. Robotnik to be called by his actual name. Eggman is goofy af.

You won't get that because Sega of Japan has always hated the SoA canon that was being built in the 90s. They have their own shitty canon which is what we have gotten in all the 3D Sonic games. Hell they even shit all over the Archie comics concerning Sonic in relationships and having any kind of satisfactory conclusion for his story.

Sega of Japan is to blame for everything bad that has happened to Sonic. All because they were assmad at Sega of America for doing better than them during the Genesis years. While the Megadrive was unpopular and barely sold in Japan the Megadrive and Genesis sold great everywhere else with SoA's marketing and ideas. This jealousy lead to the whole 32x debacle and poor ideas with the Saturn.

The worst part is Sega was originally an American company. SoJ came under full Japanese control and their jealousy and inferiority complex drove them insane and the company into the ground.

SAtAm is shit and in my opinion actually the first thing in franchise the opened it for autism infection. If we would talk about Sonic CD bad future, that would be another story, but as it stands SatAm was actually boring.

Oh fuck off, Sega of America is good at marketing Genesis, sure, but their version of sanic is ugly as fuck and really SatAm is not good. In fact SatAm would be better as it's own show without Sonic (a Mary Sue that doesn't fit with the rest of aesthetic at all) and Tails (who doesn't do anything, since they are already have Walrus mechanic).

Eggman has always been his real name. Robotnik is something that Sega of America came up with, and Sega of Japan always hated it and wanted them to drop it. They finally phased it out for good with "Nobody calls me that anymore," line at the end of Sonic Generations.

Your opinion is shit.

Everything good about Sonic came from them. You don't know shit if you think SoJ had much of a hand in his success.

Also SatAm's look is entirely due to those artists. Not SoA.

I'm not going to pretend that SatAm was some work of art or anything, but its plot and story were way better than the cutsey retarded shit SoJ came up with.

Daily reminder that Sonic Heroes minus team rose, is a good game and deserves the love.

Eggman was his name, but it was more of a placeholder name. It only became his final name because of SoJ winning out on Sega's internal power struggle. Robotnik was "phased out" because Sega of Japan controlled the creative process 100% from the Saturn onward.

Pretty much all the games that came out after Sega CD are non-canon from a rational standpoint. They're fanfiction made by assmad nips.

If you're having THIS much trouble keeping at least one of the rings, then you're just bad at sonic.

I always loved Sonic 1, but Sonic 2 and 3 didn't impress me. Adventure is on par with Sonic 06 as one of the worst vidya ever created, and none of the other games were worth a damn anyway.
Except Sonic Spinball. That was pretty radical.

How about the mechanics of the original games?
I dunno, I thought plagiarizing Biollante's design in two consecutive games was a good idea.

I disagree, personally. There are a lot of good ideas, but it's executed very poorly. The team system could have been really cool, but everything's very slow and floaty compared to SA2.

Woah son careful with your edges. If you deny that anything animated with sanic aside of OVA and "Night of the Werehog" is trash than you are wrong.

Heroes are okay team Rose isn't the problem though, slippery movement and some occasional bugs on scripted loops are

Which pretty much explains the bestiality in sonic 06.

Maybe the first game and Sonic CD, 2 and 3&knuckles were made in SoA iirc.

meant for

Dunno about that, sonic boom is pretty decent.

The Sonic games made before 1995 were good.

Pretty much everything good came from Sega of America's advice to Sega of Japan. The CEO favored SoA at the time, to the continual irritation of those beneath him. They got routinely humiliated from 1991-1994 by SoA and being told "they are being successful, why not you?"

Once they got total control they wrecked SoA and worked hard to undo everything good that they could get away with concerning anything SoA touched. This is also why you don't see a lot of faithful revivals of Genesis games. They didn't care how popular they are, they hate anything SoA touched.

By a Japanese devs in San Francisco studio, not Americans.

For fucks sake, stop sucking SoA's cock. Yes Tom Kalinske is a good marketer, we get it and division during 32x days is unfortunate, but don't make up SoA achievements.

Reminder that if the furfags at SoJ had their way in the first place, sonic would have been edgier than fucking ow the edgehog, and would've had a human gf.

Looks like it was made at their place, but by nips.
segaretro.org/Sega_Technical_Institute
info.sonicretro.org/Game_Development:Sonic_the_Hedgehog_3

Who knows what sources are believable, though. There's a million different "official" stories of what happened with the Michael Jackson debacle alone.

When did that conclusion came from, considering it's the SatAm is dark and gritty as oppose to games. Also Sally invited way more furfags than any game in the franchise.

Not quite what i was getting at, i was trying to say it would have been more like sonic 06 than what we got.

Madonna thing was played for laughs, not like in 06. Or what , you assume pic related was created by furfags too?

THIS.

Do youtubers get paid if you go to youtube? Who cares so long as I don't see any ads.

All I know is that I have never in my life given a YouTube eceleb a single cent.

I'm not making up shit. Stop being a blind sega fanboy, faggot.

SatAm had beautiful animation.

Personally, I thought SatAm was decent on its own. I mean the writers didn't know much about the game. I thought Archie was the one that opened the autism infection because they turned Sonic from a cartoon character into a furfag with conjoined eyes thus why a bunch of crazies became intrigued with Sonic in the first place despite most likely never playing the games themselves. I love how people saying the series should dark as SatAm miss the point of the show itself. While fanfics write the characters as Ow the Edge on steroids, the show itself had a tone similar to not so edgy action shows like Motorcity. It got the theme of "light hearted characters fighting more intense situations" right. It's just that the situation is more darker as its light hearted Disney characters fighting a Blade Runner-esque dystopia already built on a metaphorical genocide. However, the Archie series (before the reboot) throw that all the way, and made it pure edge with awkward light heartedness built on poor 90's lingo.

It's sad that people think SatAm is the only Sonic media with lore when the Japanese already have something more fruitful:
info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_(16-bit)_manuals#Literal_translation_from_Japanese
info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_2_(16-bit)_manuals#Earlier_translation_from_Japanese
info.sonicretro.org/Sonic_the_Hedgehog_3_manuals#Earlier_translation_from_Japanese

You give them views. That's how they survive.

Doesn't that just make you a Kalinske fanboy?

That was intentional, user. The original Sonic games have a clear progression from cutesy, nature-themed levels to the more industrial levels you see later on. It's supposed to signify Sonic traveling from his home to territory where Eggman has more of a foothold, until he finally gets to his fortress and wrecks the place. There are a couple exceptions here and there (like Spring Yard being before Labyrinth in Sonic 1), but it isn't random at all.

Yeah, sure I'm the fanboy. Look the way I see it, SoA trying to prolong genesis life with 32x - life-support machines as equally retarded as SoJ with their Saturn. Kalinske was right back than, no doubt about it, but as whole SoA and SoJ equally shat their beds.

Animation was alright, but character designs are horrendous and creators just didn't understood spirit of their source material. Earlier I said that Sonic is Mary Sue, while actually he's Deus ex Machina of that series that solves any problems by just running fast. Tails don't do shit, I have to deal with a bunch of made up for this show characters that don't interested me in the slightest.

Kalinske did nothing wrong though.

You are fucking retarded, read a book. Blast Processing came after Sonic was already a thing and those "Sonic was always bad" shitters are the same kind of SJW numale post modern shitters that dont even play videogames and want to erase anything they dont like.

Sure seems like that today, where SoA is a lobotomized retard banging it's head on a keyboard screaming SONIC and SoJ pulled a konami, only instead of MGS and DDR it's miku and persona

Hey that Alien game was alright… I think…I didn't played it myself, but I heard good things about it.

Not directly, no. However, YouTube's new algorithm works on a CPM (cost per mille) system, which means that the monetary value each user's content is weighed by an ambiguous formula that YouTube keeps changing. One of the core factors of how a user's CPM is calculated is how much of their content is viewed, and its level of viewer retention. That is, they get paid more per view by how much content (in seconds) is being watched, and thus, each view is worth more. It's not the views that directly dictate your success, but how much time those viewers spent watching, and how many of those viewings led to subsequent clicks on other videos.

This is why Let's Players get crazy dosh for it, while YouTube animation has all but died now, since Let's Players can crank out crazy amounts of content, while an animator has to spend two months on a two and a half minute animation.

tl;dr, YouTube does not allow money to be collected on views where ads were not displayed (such as adblock), however, viewing the video does increase the person's CPM, which will increase the value of subsequent monetized viewings. Sage for off-topic.

Sonic games aren't that great the first time you play them. at least I have way more fun when I replay a Sonic game.

Sonic 1 2 3 and CD are great to pick up and play anytime.

I replayed Sonic adventure 1 and 2 recently and got all the Emblems again.

Sonic in adventure 1 is fun because you can abuse the living hell out of the spin dash to F with the gravity and skip chunks of the levels.

Adventure 2 is fun in different way though.
to get an A rank in sonic adventure 2, you had to know the best and most efficient route, destroy plenty of enemies to rack up points. (hopefully not missing the gold beetle.) and getting combo/stunt points.

while doing all of that in 1 life since if you died it reset you points down to zero.

that made A ranks very rewarding

I actually replayed Generations as well but that felt less fun then it did the first time I played it
it was so easy for me to get S ranks that I barely cared when I got one.

I mostly agree with what you're saying, but jesus, you've got a ways to go before fitting in.

If you want really rewarding S ranks in Generations I suggest you try the Unleashed mod.

This is valuable information which more people should know.

Does forcing an alternative player through userscripts like ViewTube prevent statistics from being recorded?

I'll admit that the side story episodes and Antoine were complete garbage, but the rest of the show was like watching the original Star Wars all over again.

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I've always thought of it as a platformer with pinball physics. You've got your running and jumping, but you can also roll and let gravity do all the work. It leads to some cool ideas, like Sonic CD's pinball boss. Add in some great music and a simple, likable protagonist and you have everything you need for a good game.
I think I might have an explanation for the whole Sonic is bad meme. The original game was made for US Genesis systems, which run at 60Hz. When they were ported the devs forgot to change the game's speed to account for PAL regions using 50Hz instead. Because of that the original Sonic in Europe and other PAL regions feels slow as fuck. I remember wanting to play Super Mario Bros more as a kid because you go faster and smoother in that game.

Yup. The new system is a race to the bottom, which literally values quantity over quality.
That, I don't know. I don't see how they could record the amount of video played if you grabbed the video directly.

What game requires hitting shoulder buttons that furiously?

Isn't Sega of Japan owned by jews in Hawaii or some retarded shit like that?

This game

But shes playing 360 so it could be out of the question.

The original SEGA was owned by jews off the coast of hawaii, but that was, like, during WWII and the games were like OY VEY IT'S HITLER SHOOT HIM WITH THIS FAKE GUN GOY.

played the sonic games at the time when genesis marketing was big and they were seen as the next cool thing.
my dentist had a genesis set up in his waiting room, and at the time I had to go in there fairly regularly to get orthodontic work done.
I was initially impressed(with sonic 2), but after that game with past/future levels and those bouncy mushrooms(think it was s3&k but idk) arrived there i'd lost all interest and viewed the mushrooms and weight puzzles as more of a gimmick than an improvement. I didn't like playing as knux because he was slow, and about a year after they got that game I had stopped going there on a weekly basis.
never once did it make me want to buy a genesis or seek to play these games anywhere else, when the dreamcast released I got one for a birthday present along with sonic adventure, I never liked it much and spent most of my time playing street fighter alpha 3.

Huh no kidding. But how do you explain the meme being spouted in America?

AIDSmoby has the worst taste in video games. Only cucks would take his advice
fatcuck is occasionally right about video games, but should stick to movies and comic books. He's only slightly above Razorfist-tier

Because most people who werent nintendofags became autistic sanic furfags or werent interested in the franchise anyway
As someone who had a Genesis, a Saturn and a Dreamcast at various points as a kid, I run into pretty much nobody in daily life who knows about any of the games I liked/played when I was younger unless it was in an arcade somewhere

Challenge, find people who are utterly repulsed by sonic on the level they are now before this game's release

I don't think they were all that good, that's for sure. Super Mario Bros. and Adventure Island are much better gotta-go-fast games. The problem with Sanic is that they fast that you gotta go requires a lot more of the screen in front of you in view or it just devolves into rote memorization. When you haven't memorized things, you go slow.

no no no user

SATam isn't bad, UNDERGROUND was bad

Also SoE was the best at marketing and building hype

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This.

Anyone arguing with this post is a dumbass with an objectively shit opinion

Both are shit, SatAm way less sure, since there is no Jalil singing, but SatAm is still bad.

50HZ downgrades made all games so unenjoyable, but Sonic especially, Sonic and probably first Devil May Cry,

Also, these two games are VERY good.

Racing was better than transformed. If not for the fact plane and boat controls are ass.

half of that roster for transformed looks shopped in.

it's not though, isn't it.

Smash-it-Steve is in because Sonic and Eggman appear in the movie, so i guess it's one of those, you scratch my back i scratch yours thing.
TF2 was a steam exclusive character.
Danica Patrick and her sponsors pretty much gave 90% of the games budget to Sumo.
Everyone else is a Sega owned character.

They are both good, and the boat and plane sections take a little time to get used to.

Boat and plane sections control like ass and Sumo knew this since eventually they updated the physics in the pc version of transformed.

Master race wins again.

Everybody Super Sonic Racing, gotta keep your feet right on the groooooound, when you're Super Sonic Racing there's no time to look aroooooound.

Except not really, since Racing doesn't run well on pc.

Explain.

Optimization issues on high end cards with the water, it uses more resources than on low end cards at identical settings.

It works on my machine.

It does, but it is documented, when water is on screen VRAM usage increases compared to older cards.

After playing the MegaDrive originals: yes, that's exactly what Sonic was. The games themselves are decent, but unless you are autistic for speed or older than 10 years there isn't really much substance in them.

The japanese lore for Sonic has and always will be shit. It is part of why it has been such a shitshow since the 16bit era. Sonic was primarly a western idea despite the bullshit SoJ has spun.

Read it was Samuel Vincent who did the singing voice for Sonic in Underground

Sonic was good, but as far as platforming goes, there was always better options. Sonic's main appeal was the strength of it's sound and visuals.

How can one man be this wrong and yet act so cocky?. Read a book tard, for the modt part SoA was strongly against the 32X but SoJ was pushing it while they were already working on the Saturn because the Genesis had been out for as long as 1989 on Japan and was already quite old by that time.
If Kalinske should be blamed for pushing any stupid ideas that would be the Sega Pico.

They were pretty good and charming the entire way through.

weird fact, the pico got software up until 2000 or so

Fuck me, I had the same problem. The spinning things needing you to press the up and down buttons which were never used in that context before, right?

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Well, since we're letting YouTubers do the talking for us…

triggered as fuck mate

aka shit stop and go game play

Sonic feels like shit unless going fast, which in most cases it just auto scrolls the level

All those "physics vectors" make for shit game play because you can't reliably predict your speed and angle when jumping off surfaces. They slow Sonic down and his shit inertia is terrible to play.

I remember saving these from other threads.

If you couldn't figure out how to use the platforms in Carnival Night after 2 minutes of trail and error, then gas yourself.

The first two pics sounded a bit autistic, especially seeing how the guy screencapped his own posts.

Well I kinda assumed that since, SoA wanted stay with genesis and most 32x games were made by western developers.

Low speed control felt tight and responsive in S1-3K & CD

That was far from a stupid idea, that's why when the japs saw it was doing well, they went "OY VEY" and forced them to discontinue it, while they kept it alive for decades.

A shit forced meme made by autists who weren't alive during the 90s

The Internet in general is to blame, though. That's how Chris Chan got massive exposure.

Sonic

The story for Sonic Adventure is foreshadowed in the manuals for Sonic 2 and 3&K. The american manuals remove a few of the references that wind up becoming the plot of Adventure, but the gist of it is still there.

Come on now. You know very well they were some of the worst comics ever created. Flynn is a miracle worker for managing to take that putrid pile of shit and make it into a less putrid pile of shit, but it took until the Mega Man crossover and the semi-reboot that followed to make the comics actually good. And even then they're still dragged down by SatAM faggotry taking up so much space and those characters being the main characters instead of more important characters like Knuckles. The Freedom Fighters should be tertiary characters like the Chaotix or Babylon Rogues, not the fucking stars of a tie in comic, since they don't even exist in the material the comic is a commercial for.

But I suppose the new comics are shit because Sonic isn't allowed to cry over his OC waifu getting married to some other OC faggot. Because that's totally what Sonic the Hedgehog should be about.

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You forgot to take this game into account. [November 2005]

This thread has opened my eyed to all the >20 yo users and ledditors that GG truly brought to this board.

Heroes is a lot better if you're the type of autist (like me) who plays every game starting from the easiest difficulty and working your way up. Then you have to realize Team Rose is easy mode and play that first instead of the obvious choice of playing Team Sonic first.

Or just play through Sonic, Dark, and Chaotix, then use Team Rose as an easy way to grab any Emeralds you're missing.

The game isn't as good as Adventure or Adventure 2 but it's okay.

This. Sonic Adventure 2 doesn't really begin until you beat the Story Mode. Story Mode is basically the practice round, and the real fun is in all the extra missions and perfecting your scores, to get all the unlockables. This is opposed to Sonic Adventure, where all the fun is in the Story Mode (including exploring for Emblems, which is pretty fun at least the first time), but going back to the extra missions in the Action Stages isn't as finely tuned, gets you no rewards, and is overall not very fulfilling.

I hear Shadow the Hedgheog actually has a Super Hard Mode where you play every level together in a new story mode, but I can't be assed to get all A Ranks in that game. Been meaning to go back and do it for like ten years but, even though I like the game, I don't like it that much.

She just wanted to film le epic youtube video with her boyfriend to get attention

You're not getting it. Super Mario Bros: The Lost Levels, is a game where a lot of levels require you to go fast to use the momentum properly and actually win. And that makes for a great game, maybe my favorite Mario game, but it's not what Sonic is. Sonic doesn't require you to go fast, you can beat the game going slow, and in fact that's exactly what will happen the first time you beat it. But once you get good, you learn the tricks to going fast. You get better reaction times and learn the patterns and suddenly you look really cool going through the levels, and the better you get the more levels you can zoom through like that.

pic related

This game isn't nearly as bad as people say. Hell, even '06 isn't as bad as people say. '06 is an unfinished mess, but people act like it's unplayable or like the glitches somehow make it harder instead of making it laughably easy like they actually do.

Shadow, on the other hand, is basically a shittier version of the Sonic/Shadow levels from Adventure 2. But I really, really like the Sonic/Shadow levels from Adventure 2, so Shadow still ends up being a fairly fun game. Not great, but for a fan, worth playing. I get the feeling people hate on it more for the seeming absurdity of the concept, a Sonic character using a gun (it doesn't actually change gameplay that heavily), and characters saying DAMN and SHIT. But even 15 year old me could laugh at Sonic saying shit, I didn't get autistically mad about it. And from this post, you can tell I'm autistic as fuck, so if I can handle the edgy abyss without falling into it, I'm sure others can, too.

The game is also one of the first where I really noticed slowdown to a degree that it hindered my enjoyment of the game. But only on multiplayer (on the PS2, which I assume had the problem worse than the other versions). But mainline Sonic games never had good multiplayer, unless you could get your little brother to be Tails in Sonic 3&K. And if that counts, then Shadow actually has some of the best multiplayer, because P2 can take control of any of the helper characters, from Sonic, to Rouge, to goddamn Maria. That shit was great. Even better than P2 being able to take control of Tails while playing Sonic's story in Adventure 1.

1, 2 and 3 are great.

The only good 3D sonic game is Generations, though.

You know you can figure these things out with about 3 seconds of effort, right?