I haven't played Overwatch and was not interested in it whatsoever

I bought TF2 years ago. have a bunch of "vintage" weapons that I haven't bothered to do anything with.

Depending on what they are you could sell them for a few Steambux

But yeah, that user is right. Overwatch has a few nuances that make it different from TF2 but it's very simplified and definitely not worth $40 in its current state. Wait for the price drop, and even then only consider it after it gets more maps and maybe a few more characters

will do friend

20 tick

Go hang yourself hipster.

he didnt offer me shit, he wanted me to buy it.

Oh, then call him a faggot. Overwatch is like $40 iddnit?

These threads are getting tiresome already.

$40 for default, $60 for the Origins edition which has a bunch of bonus lore-contradicting skins that nobody gives a fuck about

I want to rest my head on Tracer's ass

you mean the ass that's only good in fan-art

didnt they make an image about this, publicize it, then fake a scandal for attention?

You want an honest analysis, I'm the only one who will give it to you in this thread.

Overwatch has obscenely good polish, which is making people assume that it's a lot better than it actually is. The game actually feels pretty good to play.

The problem is in 3 locations in particular; the level design, the class design, and the gamemode design.

Level design in this game is fucking shit. I hope you enjoy running to the objective doing nothing, because that's all you do if you die. 40-60% of non-payload maps are completely wasted space, and only serves to keep you from the objective once you spawn.
I timed every single map in the beta. It takes on average 20+ seconds to reach the objective, with a 10 second respawn time, it takes 30 seconds. Die 6 times in a match, you've spent 1/3rd of your game time just travelling to the objective.

Not at all helped by the absolutely pathetic movement speed.
5.5 metres per second. Not even joking.

Let's thread this into the gamemode design.

Single objectives boil down to content over a single choke, because the level design again, is a corridor. Because of this, you stick with your team and blow as many projectiles/class abililties/ultimates at the enemy team until their formation breaks and you kill them. At this point they come back and this happens again. This comprises every single match you will ever play.

Finally, class design.

There are 4 classes, the 21 characters fufill these functions, and act as hard counters to other classes. It's surprising how little variety is actually here. Some characters are just outright better than others.

The problem here is that you can't be good at overwatch to the point where you can dismantle teams singlehandedly, such as TF2. Blizzard wants to keep the game "balanced" and fun for everyone, which means unfun for the people who spend the most time with it, as somebody who has just picked up the game can pick one of the meta characters and do just as well as anyone who's been playing the game for 100+ hours.

There's no such thing as a skill ceiling, only competence with a class, something most people can pick up within an hour or two.

All in all, the game is shoddy, polished but shoddy. A decent timewaster if you don't intend to play it much, but nothing interesting or decent.

POST PORN

I want to be violently violated by Bastion

And it worked. I never heard of this game until that faketroversy. Now you fucking retards keep 3 threads up 24/7.

Yes, and when people said "they're doing this as a stunt" nobody listened.

sounds a lot like HoTS, but from a different perspective. Thanks for the overview.

for your trouble

Rule 1, m8000.

why do her nipples have giant holes in them

has she been putting things in her nipple holes

Shit, they changed it to rule 3.

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Respawn/runback time is kind of necessary in the sort of game mode. If you kill someone they need to stay out of the fight for long enough to capitalize on the kill.

The dead space at the sides generally serves a purpose for flanking assault heroes, giving them space to maneuver around and behind the enemy. Also those hero types break the whole meta you seem to believe in where players contest a single choke with their entire team until the formation breaks. If Reaper or Tracer is in the middle of a team-fight like that they are playing fucking wrong. These classes have movement options to avoid chokes for a reason.

I'll give you that there's not a whole lot of skill involved. Most weapons are relatively inaccurate and short ranged, and there's plenty of ways to play that don't even require accuracy at all. The exception being the snipers but I'm not getting into that. However, it is GOOD design in a team-based game to require teamwork over individual skill. While they probably should promote more skill than they currently do, the idea that no one player can (in most cases) "dismantle teams single-handedly" is very much a positive thing.

I didn't see too much of "some characters being just outright better than others" during the open beta. Granted, between my limited experience with the game and balance still being in flux it may very well be the case, but that's something that's definitely being worked on constantly (blizzard always makes significant balance changes, though they usually end up making things worse in the long run).

k

I disagree with every other point you made but i agree with this one.

If anyone here has played TF2 for even a week, they will be absolutely shocked by how shit Overwatch level design is in comparison.

I'm not saying TF2 had godly level design, but it did the job decently, Overwatch introduces more verticality to maps compared to TF2, but at the price of having terrible overall level design.

They need to rework the maps.

You're not seriously defending level design like that, are you?

I'd rather have a 25 second respawn with a 5 second travel, because then you can at least plan, adding a little bit of depth to this mess. But that is irrelevant.

What makes this so bad is the sheer volume of single shot kills in the game. Imagine one bad game, you die, you spend 30 seconds getting back into the action to get killed again immediately, and maybe again. Because of the 1 shot kills, it's entirely possible these deaths were no fault of your own, and because the skill ceiling is so low, you're unable to prevent it.

Penalising death that hard works in a game where it's actually got tactics and/or a skill ceiling. People will quit the game because of this shit.

The dead space doesn't include the sides of the map. It includes the spawn/objective crawl.

Of course I'm aware of flanking, but when I refer to a choke, I do not refer to a choke point. I refer to more of a hot zone. The game will basically take place 90% in approximately 10% of the map. You're still attacking this one point, even if you are "flanking". Truthfully the game doesn't do that very well either. It's usually just 1 or 2 secondary paths that take a bit longer to get through, ensuring they're used less. It's basic bitch shit. Also let's be honest, it's still just hitting the objective and trading blows until someone falls down, there's no real dance of death outside of tracers "time rewind" ability, because the game is so slow.

I can name games which straddle both. It's not difficult to get right. Blizzard is just so obsessed with trying to hit as many wallets as possible, they're going to alienate their most loyal customers right out of the gate.

They're loyal to Blizzard for a reason.

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The long respawn short travel doesn't allow for variable times based on location. There are plenty of locations where one team can reach in

You know, if travel time from the spawn point to where you need to be is such a huge issue, why don't you get a Lúcio on your team?

That's his job, you start with speed, pump it up, then once everyone is in position he switches to healing.

It's not rocket science, he's super easy to play and speeding the team up to cut down on travel time is literally his job, he's essentially built to be the hard counter to team down time, so what's the issue here?

It shaves 2 seconds of time from your travel time, you ignoramus.

Lucio's movement speed under speed mode is 7.1 M/s, as are other players under the effect of the buff.

Having to use a specific character in order to appease shit level design is retarded, maybe you should have posted Symmetra as well, and suggested playing as solider or tracer as they're faster than other characters.

Then you could have the holy trinity of stupid.

So apparently runback time is only 6 seconds normally. You are also neglecting his E with speed up.

You really are starting to sound like a total bitch.

I already made a suggestion on how to fix this issue babe. Longer spawn time, less travel.

Also I made the point about staying alive. In some instances you just can't.

Actually, I'd argue this is one of the worst things in a Multiplayer game. This will give you map fatigue.

It causes other issues, like mercy's resurrection timing, or easy spawncamping. Or invalidating what sets certain heroes apart from others.

What causes map fatigue is that the maps are so similar. Large sections of them might as well be the same thing (as other maps) with a different coat of paint.

Git gud

I used to be a quake tourneyfag. This game lacks any proper skill ceiling. The most skillful character in the game is Junkrat, and only because of utility. Still just a cut price demoman.
This can be said for a shitload of games.
If you want to use this argument, it's far better to refer to lack of agency or emergence, as use of the basic geometry isn't prioritised over usage of player abilities. I'm surprised you can't even use the clutter in this game, honestly. On top of this, the limited chokes and simplistic loops mean that diversity in play is already limited, despite the feature set entailing experimentations with team setups and co-operative emergence, as Blizzard can't allow for it, as it means the game not be as casualcore friendly any more.

Mercy's resurrection ability would remain unchanged.

Spawncamping would be preferable to what is there. But believe me, it can be balanced really fucking easily. If only they weren't just trying to rip off TF2 at every opportunity, and they hired some half decent level designers, this wouldn't even be a discussion.

20 TICK SERVERS

You are walking around alone when you know enemies are between you and your team. Sometimes "git gud" doesn't mean "dodge better", it means "stop walking into stupid situations that get you killed like an idiot".

You're actually trying to defend this meme game garbage, I hope you realize that

I don't understand very much about netcode, can somebody explain the significance of tickrate to me please?

Going to have to take the other guy's side here chief. Overwatch promotes removal of player agency as a mechanic which stretches along a large portion of character abilites. It isn't just one character capable of doing it.

Again to repeat myself, this is not a game where skill is rewarded. One shot kills out of the ass.

A tickrate is how often a server refreshes per second. Higher tickrates give a more accurate representation of gameplay. Higher is just better. Fairer, more skill rewarded, more accurate.

Counterstrike has 120.
TF2 runs at 66, but can be changed for player servers if modded.
Battlefield 4 is horrendously bad, as only 8.
Overwatch is 20, which is still pretty shit. I'd say 60 is what the game needs minimum.

McCree and Mia have to get rediculously close to stun/kill you. If you are aware of where they are they CAN'T do it.

Roadhog has a lot more range, but he's also much easier to keep track of as well. If you get charged by reinhardt you just fucking suck and deserve your death.

The only one you might not be able to do anything about is the snipers, because that's basically what snipers do. There are still heroes who counter them but sometimes you are needed to be something else.

I could tell you liked Blizzard's dick in your mouth, you didn't have to go on and scream it in my face.

Something tells me I shouldn't be bickering with someone who can't even spell ridiculous correctly.

Because of the way level design in Overwatch works, the abilities you're describing are enabled, encouraged and rewarded. If you're not getting it by things like that occasionally, you're not playing the game correctly, as it means you're not at the objective.

His ultimate specifically stuns players in a small cone in front of him, which makes it literally impossible to avoid a charge.

Your point is moot.

The games pretty fun with friends. It's fairly "wet'n'wild" if you know what I mean.

The low tickrate means the more competitive you are, the worse time you are going to have since this was clearly meant for the casual player (and before anyone says this doesn't matter, I come from the fighting game scene, 3 frame built in lag is huge, I might not really play FPS, but I get it).

Team coordination is half the battle, and a team which is just running around vs a team that is working together is pretty brutal. It becomes one sided in a way I've never seen in other games.

I am curious how long it will stay fun for people though, since the content is fairly slim.

The game is only going to stay alive with a sizable content crawl. If it doesn't deliver. I'd say 8 weeks and it'll start losing players.

20 TICK alone should be enough to throw this game in the garbage.

and in searching to find out more I came upon the Overwatch subreddit defending the low tickrate. those pathetic cucks, hilarious.

Link please, I refuse to believe even reddit is that retarded. Plus goddamn, sorta thing seen to be believed

At least it's not Widowmaker porn, that bitch is fucking ugly.

That's his ultimate. Lots of ultimates are basically insta death for at least one player. They only start to involve some element of risk when the user tries to get more than one kill with it. You can go ahead and complain about that if you want, but it does help keep the game moving.

Team coordination is pretty much the entire battle, which is something the competitive quake player has no concept of. I play NS2 myself, which comes a lot closer to balancing the individual and team skill, but you can easily see how too-skilled players ruin the games for everyone on both teams, probably themselves included.

Start yes. It'll start sooner than that. It's big enough that it will take a lot longer than 8 weeks for problems to come up with lack of players though. I do expect fairly regular new content though, probably in the form of both heroes and maps (and aesthetic crap). I doubt they will do the TF2 route of new weapons for the same classes.

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m-maybe the 20 tick servers were only for the beta..?

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Thanks for admitting that nobody should bother with this game.

Yes

Dont expect too much

Jesus fuck.

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I don't think anything's technically an unavoidable one-hit. Reinhardt's stun is practically unavoidable if you are in the area and near the ground, but it's going to require a second attack to finish you (hence the stun+charge combo).

The damaging ultimates all have some kind of way to counter. One of the worst I think is Junkrat's, but he needs to position it to get you by surprise (or else you can destroy it before it reaches you) so ultimately it's not much more unavoidable than an instakill backstab.

It's just that the way the ultimates are if the enemy is willing to use them on a single player in an ideal circumstance there's probably nothing they can do. They are supposed to be used on a team to disable/damage/kill multiple players, but that requires a less-than-ideal circumstance and opens up ways for the enemy team to prevent you from getting any kills at all with it.

maybe they're just joking in that video

I mean, they DO reference Reddit

It is amusing that people were defending this game before the beta in larger numbers.

Alright, I get that it's a matter of taste, but not being able to carry your team is really awful if you've been playing any fps in the last decade. Improving your skills and seeing results feels fucking great, but I guess every game is going to have kid gloves from now on.

says there will be a 60tick option for competitive/custom servers.

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Nigga, the writing is on the wall.
The game is going to have 20-tick servers.

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I wanted to post you_replied.jpg but I haven't found it so I opted for jimmy rustler instead mr. >(215)

your mind's eye is not open to the jimmies, but they surround you always

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there was an open beta for a week that ended on the 10th, why the hell didnt you try it then?

the game is good just way overpriced.

The most fun "major" FPS to be released in the past decade, but still not worth $40 unless you have dedicated people to play with.

It's got a lot of quick decision making and decent depth to it, though in my opinion characters work a bit too much as "hard counters" to one another. Balance is, as usual, Blizzard tier, so who knows what the fuck will happen in the weeks following release. So far, nothing seems pay to win, and I'd sure hope not considering it's not a F2P game.

I'm going to go ahead and say this is the best game Blizzard has put out there in recent times, it's not just a piece of shit with a ton of polish over it like their post 2005 games.

Be warned though, that Blizzard, as usual, has overhyped this game. I played the game expecting it to be absolute shit and I enjoyed it quite a bit.

Also why didn't you try the open beta?

Formulate your own opinions if you're so much better than your friend.

Q and E should be either quickwap weapon and use, or lean left/right, depending on if it's a fast-paced game or a tacticool shooter.

to be fair you are a fucking child

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I can still fucking shoot when I'm being rocket juggled, you dumb nigger.

That, and the fact that one is a skill that takes a great deal of time to master and the other is just pressing a button.

fun game but that kind of thing bugs me too.
not to mention, certain combos are just hell for pubs to deal with. if you thought your team in tf2 was silly for not being able to handle a heavy medic, wait till they get a load of reinhardt mercy.

Good luck landing a hit while someone is juggling you.
Also, at least stuns set you up for some extra damage instead of doing the same but also heavily damage you like rockets do.

That's a shit combo, I don't understand why so many people still bring it.
You can't heal his barrier and he can't do anything while you are healing him behind his barrier. At best, you use him for cover while you heal whoever is shooting from behind his cover, which doesn't need to happen considering his barrier should be denying damage. Honestly, Lucio+Reinhart is MUCH more scary.
Unless you mean he changes to melee, at which point Mercy is gonna get focused on, die and leave Reinhart with a 5v6 fight.

The game is mostly about countering other people and I guess that's not everyone's cup of tea but I find it great. Reacting to the current team composition and changing strategy instead of having a "main" is great. I never even liked playing sniper roles but I often have to pick it to counter Bastions\Pharahs\Toblerones and I kinda dig it now.

That's exactly what it is. Have you even read the thread?

Your right.
It has no polish.
It looks like a game from 2004.

Just as I hit "New Reply"

I like the game, retard. That's just why faggots think it's a MOBA.

Shit forgot to remove name.

Shouldn't have changed IDs then, since that's not what your single post implied.

Holy fuck, I know Overmeme is targeted at casual retards, but you people are beyond autistic about it.

The game has too many choke points to take seriously, and a lot of shitty level design.

Almost every map has some sort of choke point somewhere. By choke point I mean a hallway YOU HAVE TO GO THROUGH. You cannot flank around the choke point, the absolute most you can do is fly above it and pretend they wont see you. You will recognize these points by the amount of tips you get that will tell you to flank even though you fucking can't.

The Temple of Anubis capture point map is one of the worst offender here. See the gate in pic related? I hope you like it because you're going to be shooting through it for the entire match.

Another thing is that there's a lot of higher up sections that are barely accessible. I get that it's supposed to be for the classes with mobility abilities, but it doesn't help that there's another half of higher up sections that would be perfect shooting spots if Blizzard actually allowed you to stand on top of them.
A lot of the level design needs some rework. The amount of flat roofs you magically slide off of is disgusting, and nothing is more aggravating than jumping on top of them, only to be thrown off into a bottomless pit and then having to walk another fucking 30 seconds back to the objective.

Never implied that. You WISHED I implied that so you could strawman the entire post but I didn't, stupid nigger.
Rocket juggling takes much more skill, which is why I prefer to do play Pharah and rocketjuggle every motherfucker, especially snipers.
I will however say that capitalizing on short stuns does take some skill. Landing a stun alone doesn't give you the kill.

You have McCreed whose entire purpose of stunning is to fan the hammer once, roll and fan it again. But this requires him to be in short range of you to have any accuracy, otherwise he hits one or two single bullets. If your team is nearby, that means death for him.
And even then, his stun has a very shortrange, so you can avoid it entirely by not going near him. Try that against Soldiers…

You also have Junkrat that can lock someone in place for a long while. But his trap is incredibly visible and has very short range, requiring him to be near danger to use it properly or just take any roamers that go after him and don't notice the massive trap, somehow. And even then you can still fire or use movement abilities to escape out of it.

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If you're not an Overmeme shill, then I'm really sorry for whoever had to raise you, must have been a tough fight living with such a retard.

i know whats supposed to happen but its not what tends to happen

some of the maps could use tweaking for sure, but you do get a lot of tools to actually break through chokepoints, wheither its ice walls or large german men and then the point usually falls pretty fast.
i feel like if any map is skewed in the defenders favor its the japanese one, hanamura? but theyre supposed to be arent they?
either way the capture point maps tend to be my least favorite.

i fucking hate this, why is this a thing? the levels have such nice verticality to them and then you dont actually let me use it?

They take away all your control for a wooping 1 second at best. Most aren't even that long.

McCree for instance can stun people at will. If they come near him of course…
And he can easily kill someone he stunned. And be killed afterwards because the other team is nearby…
The skill here is to throw the stun at the right time and get the kill without getting yourself killed.

Junkrat can land a few grenades on people he snared, sure. If they don't dash out or put up a barrier or have no teammates nearby…
Reinhart can also dash and crush anyone against a wall, too. If you are so slow you can't dodge him…

The skill here is not in aiming it or understanding how the physics engine works to exploit it as best as you can. It's knowing when is the right time to pull that shit off or how to get a good distraction so you can pull it off.
Because just spamming your stun gets you killed, but pulling it off at the right time means less one enemy to fight.

Come to think of it, this discussion is a lot like your average fighter. You are arguing that having an incredibly complex input to perform a special move makes it a better move while most pro's would tell you that it doesn't matter, the timing is much more important…

Maps usually are skewed for the attackers in the first point and for the defenders on the last point.
You'll notice that the first point is always full of many holes and obstacles to be exploited while the last one still has flanking routes but are much more obvious and easy to manage.

Capture Point maps are all about a massive teamdeathmatch in the middle, that's why they are the best mode. It's just killing them as fast as possible, with the point acting like extra pressure.

Devs already explained this. They don't want roofs to become fortresses that some characters can exploit very easily while others have no counter against. Most roofs that you can stand on have some way to climb up to them that doesn't require special moves. A ladder, ramp or some boxes.

You say you want other places that can't be reached by regular characters as available, but you really don't want that the moment a Widowmaker hooks up to one and proceeds to sniper your team. That would just force you to get a similar character in your team to handle her, but that's not a good solution.

Ladders and other acess routes to those places would be much better, though.

if widowmaker exists just so we cant have fun maps maybe she needs a dick in her ass

Widowmaker, Hanzo, Genji, Pharah, Lucio, Winston and even Mei. Maybe others.
Any character with extra mobility can reach those spots.
If they could reach and stay in them, they would act as safe harbours that people like most tanks, Soldier 76, Tracer and many others couldn't reach properly. Not to mention the advantage of higher ground.

I might be wrong here, but this is also only a "serious" problem on Capture Point maps, Payload and Assault don't have that issue. Maybe it's also to due with forcing the players to engage with each other instead of letting someone just stay out of reach and spam shit.

If they stay as sliding slopes, you can use them to traverse the map but not as stationary "I snipe here" spots.
It's quite possibly the best compromise that can be reached, since there are still a lot of different roofs where you can actually stand on.

I didn't think you could get more autistic, Mr. Shill, but you, again, surprise me. Bravo.

How's that boogeyman working for you? Are you going to call me an autistic shill as well?
Go back to gaia you fucking faggot

And yet you'll defend rocket junggling? Just because it takes more skill, it doesn't make it any more fun. And if fun is the main point here, lasting for a shorter time, does make it less shitty. :^)

Goes both ways, faggotsaurus.

Yes, I was mentioning that one of the stuns that lasts the longest doesn't take away all your control, while others that actually do don't last near as long as it does. Rule of thumb is, the more powerfull the stun, the shorter it is. This is game design 101.

I don't mention her because she is fucking great :^)
But quite honestly, she can only get people if she flanks them. A Reaper can kill her faster than she can freeze him and a Reinhart can charge her and rip that asshole apart.
She is essentially what the Pyro was supposed to be in TF2, especially with the movement options and the only people complaining about her also complain about Bastions and Toblerones and Dvas, so who cares about their opinion?

Are you saying you can just spam them and get 100% good results all the time? That they don't take a minimum amount of skill to properly time when to use them?
Or are you saying that aiming a gun and knowing how the physics engine is gonna react is the only SKILL in videogames?

UWUT? No, seriously. Unless you mean McCree referencing some old cowbow songs or silly shit like that, do point out what "memes" they forced into the game. Because if you are gonna move the goal posts from "stuns" to "memes", at least put an example to distract me from the fact you are still defending rocketjumping while complaining that you lose control over 0.5 seconds.

Go play TF2, mate. You don't like Overwatch, nobody is gonna bother you for that. Just don't go around defending doublestandards and complaining when people call you on that.

assault is king of the hill? or is that what im referring to as capture point?
i think the most egregious examples of slip n slide are ilios and mardi gras.
it certainly would be an advantage to characters who can get to those points but is that such a sin? you arent locked to any one class and we already let map layout influence our picks. now that you mention tracer being unable to reach those spots, isnt it a bit silly that she cant climb up ledges? i dont mean walls, just ledges to give her a bit more freedom where she can move if she uses blink creatively from on top of an obstacle.

havent heard that one in a while

Eh… I haven't memorized the names, I just call it assault because of UT2k4 Assault mode. It's essentially one team taking 2 points from the defenders. I figured Control Point was king of the hill for you. Boy ain't this awkward :^)

ilios does have a lot of those spots but many of them either don't give you much vision around or give you full vision to the control point.
If you had someone standing over it spamming towards the point, he could still pose a decent threat, especially for a junkrat or pharah.

It's not so much that it gives them this massive advantage, (it doesn't) but rather that the other team has little to no counterplay. You can't flank them if you can't climb it and trying to shoot up there just means they have the literal upper hand in the fight.
Even worse is that most tanks and supports wouldn't be able to follow you up there.

Forcing the players to change class just to handle that situation sounds kinda silly since it's not a particular hero that's causing the problem but the ledge itself. And the counter to those heroes would be exactly the same heroes, and this is bad game design to say you counter a Widow with another Widow. That's not really a counter.

Tracer's blink actually reminds me of that multiplayer-only Shadowrun game. It had a teleport ability that was pretty great to use, especially because if you teleported while jumping, you'd go up, while teleporting while crouching would make you go lower. You could even cross walls like this.
Really wish Tracer could Blink up and down as well or even through walls.

Again, if you're skilled enough you can kill the guy's who's fucking rocketjuggling you. You keep talking about rocketjuggling like it's a Mccree stun on demand. I hate saying this, but you need to "git gud" if you actually think rocketjuggling is as bad as stopping someone in their tracks for any amount of time and removing their abilities of self defense.

I wont repeat what I said just above.

Yes, everyone loves being slowed down, eventually frozen and then getting killed by her or whatever else passes by because they can't fucking move. She isn't what the pyro is supposed to be in TF2, people complain about the damn airblast, I can't even imagine the amounts of rage from the community if his flamethrower slowed down and froze enemies. This further proves you're a massive faggot.

No, I'm saying that being forced to stand still and not being able to fight back is bad game design.

Yes indeed, my good friend, there are, surprisingly, memes in this fucking pile of garbage. You thought "Oh, surely the same people who thought Doge was a good April Fools joke for WoW wont put memes in their new games!", but you'd be wrong!
Many of the unlockable lines and sprays are memes. For example: Zarya has a "In soviet russia" line, Tracer has a "Keep calm and tracer on" line, just like Reaper has a "Keep calm and reaper on" spray, then DVA is so full of "LEET GAMUR" speak that you can consider her whole writing to be memes, Hanzo has a "____ I choose you!" unlockable line, In a coversation between Reinhardt and Lucio he says something along the lines of "I just can't even right now!", Mei has a fucking "Let it go" line, and many more.
But surely there's no memes in this game, I mean, what is this? A bad game? Pfft, never.

You can defend this game's shit, but you gotta realize it isn't as perfect as you think.

Overwatch is fun

i had really high hopes for shadowrun, but every match was a lagfest, i feel like games for windows live had something to do with it because every game i tried playing through that service was assy until a certain point.

I don't think you understand how good game design works. Removing agency from a player is one of the worst things you can ever do.

Simple hard counters to being stunlocked does not change the fact that it's still present.

The difference between juggling and stuns, is that the juggling can potentially be interrupted, by yourself or a teammate. It's incredibly skillful and more difficult to pull off than pressing q every 10 seconds, and because I myself have that opportunity to interrupt it, I have no issues with juggling. You cannot pull it off consistently. That's not possible, there's far too many variables. It also doesn't remove agency, where the qualm comes into question.

The meme comment seems to be that every character is just built off of references. Pretty much 90% of the character barks are a reference of some kind, and the laziest and most trite ones possible.

Aiming in a general direction and stunlocking someone into death isn't skill. It takes competence to use, but competence can also be used as an argument as to installing a game on your PC. It's a false equivalence, which is something you keep fucking doing.

Overwatch doesn't have a proper skill ceiling. Please refer to my previous posts.

im not sure if zarya can outright remove stuns but she can prevent them, and surely prevent the death that would come with the huge shield. and in general your team can always just kill the guy about to kill you.
death removes player agency as well, and all a sniper has to do is click someones head.

A failure state is not the same as removal of agency. Death is a failure state, which should hold enough weight to convince a developer to allow wiggle room. Getting stunned to death isn't wiggle room, it's the opposite.
I appreciate you're trying to make a point, but you're wrong.

Additionally, needing a character in your team in order to counter stunlocking again does not change the fact that these design aspects are present, plus they will not be in every game.

Seriously, stop saying things like this. It's retarded.

I don't think it's as bad, I think it's worse.
You already have the upper hand of predicting their movement easier, you are also denying them movement AND causing a massive amount of damage. With one projectile.
It would be like as if the Pyro used fired for his backblast.

Mei is great to punish retards that roam alone or have no map awereness. Every single time I caught someone, it wasn't because I am good at Mei or she is OP, it's because the other tard didn't looked around or went alone.

Your aim is all fucked up when someone rocketjuggles you, good luck fighting back. You are also locked for much longer and there's no counter to it besides dodge the projectiles that this particular class use for it's main gun.

Oh, so that russian comedian is a meme now.
So british propaganda from world war 1 said by a character inspired by pinups in world war 1 is a meme now
So AFK and "easy mode" are now memes?
I fucking hate you and everyone in the same age bracket as you are. Back in the days, memes were not just "repeating pop culture references". What you are talking about are REFERENCES, not memes. I'm not gonna get into a discussion over what constitutes a meme with you, that's for you knowyourmeme.com shitposters to know and complain about. But if someone can't make a reference anymore these days without having it called a "meme", then fuck the internet. Did you really expect Mei not to have a "Frozen" line somewhere? And are you seriously complaining about an optional line that a player has to unlock to even use and is barely used in the game at all?
First world problems right there… :^)

Wrong. Removing it for arbitrary reasons or no reason at all is bad. Removing it to punish the player, not so much, although it's probably not as fun as some other alternatives.
In the case of McCree, his stun punishes people from going near him because he is worse at close range combat, even with his "fan the hammer" skill. He destroys tracers with the stun, but without it, he'd be the one that gets destroyed. An example of this would be Hanzo that has no short range defense.

Agreed. They change the way you engage a character, unless you like being stunned however.

Juggling can be interrupted by you, who is at a disadvantage or by a teammate, meaning it's a 2v1 fight so why even mention it?
Stunning can also be interrupted by a teammate defending you, like Zarya dropping a shield on you or simple bodyblocking. And since it's quite short, you also get the option to react to it once it's over. When Mei is stunned by McCreed, the smart thing to do is hammer Shift to use your Ice Shield the moment he uses his "Fan the Hammer" skill. By the time he realized the stun worked and moved on to attack, the stun passed. It makes it a matter of who reacts to it faster, involving skill with reaction times already.

You can also try dropping a stun on someone with teammates nearby but if you move in for the kill, you're gonna get yourself killed as well. Waiting for the right time and measuring the battlefield first ensures that your stun does indeed give you a kill, so there's skill involved.

Cut the bullshit, user. You drop a rocket near someone, he will go on the oposite direction. You see where he will land and put a rocket there before he lands. Rinse and repeat until he is dead. I did that flawlessly before in TF2, I do it now with Pharah and every good soldier can do so as well. There's no higher trick to this unless you like to show off your shotguns or airshots to make this even worse. It's not more skilled, just requires decent aim for a splash damage weapon (which is saying a lot, really).

I'm glad we agree there's no skill involved in rocketjuggling someone then. Because knowing the proper timing to use your stuns and actually reacting to them to capitalize on them also requires competence, far more actually IMO considering how someone is disrupted for far less time and with less damage than rocketjuggling.

...

TF2 didn't had a proper skill ceiling when it came out. Neither did Quake, neither did UT, neither did any game ever when it just had come out.
Everyone complaining about the "skill ceiling" seems hellbent on recreating on this threads the "Kramer goes to junior kung fu school" episode here…

Higher Skill Ceilings aren't necessarily that good either. You always have more room for improvement and you can have fun constantly learning how to play better, yes. But this means after an year or two, newcomers to the game will find a community that kicks their ass in ways they can't even begin to understand.
And the argument of "gitgud" really loses it's appeal when "gitgud" means "spend a few YEARS being fragged by US and maybe you'll make it to second from last in a match every once in a while".

Counter Strike players like to brag how you only really start to understand the game after 300 hours of playing. Now try telling someone "You really should play this game, it only takes 300 hours for you to not suck". Now think about how many it actually takes to be decent in Quake or TF2 with rocketjumping.
There are more games out there and pushing your autism just so you can prove to random people on the web that you spent as much time as them learning the valuable skill of rocketjumping isn't really as fun as playing any other game.

You are free to disagree and that's the main reason for old school shooters still having players. But everyone else is also free to disagree and that's the main reason why old school shooters are a dying breed. Because it's just not fun to grind that skill.

Any character can counter that stunlock by killing the guy using the stun. A Mei freezing people can only efficently freeze 1 or 2 at the same time. Split up and one of you can easily kill her or drive her away before she can freeze the other. The same for McCreed where he won't dive for the kill if there's an unstunned teammate nearby.

I really REALLY don't want to like Overwatch, but I just can't help myself. As a heal bitch, Mercy is one of the best medic characters I've ever played. Zenyetta is also the greatest 2nd support I've ever played. Please help. I can't not have fun.

being stunned isnt automatic death but a window for it, and if it was why not consider that your failure state anyways since youre the one who let yourself get stunned.
youre expected to change your play style based on the map, who you are fighting and who is on your team, and to support each other.

I don't see the appeal either.

funfact:
Mei can shield herself after a stun to negate all damage. Tracer can blink or recall, McCree can tumble out, Reaper can Wraithform and Pharah can literally jet it out, Genji can dash.
The rest of the characters are either tanks that are probabaly not gonna die just from the stun or supports\snipers that shouldn't have been stunned in the first place.

This includes things like Roadhogs hook, McCree grenade, Mei's freezing and even the Junkrat's trap.
You literally just have to react fast and completely negate all of the stun's benefit to whoever used them. Which usually leaves it with a fairly long cooldown.

They copied TF2 and somehow managed to make it worse and charge 60bucks for it.

It's fun with friends though

Why would you not want to like something?

Zenyatta is the best support character if your game meets two conditions.

1: Your team isn't shit, knowing how Zenyatta works.

2: Enemy team doesn't have a Widowmaker.

that assumes you didnt die which is fairly rare, and if you didnt hes probably stuck reloading which is enough time to kick his ass if you can aim.

...

So overwatch is a fun casual game right?
I'll buy when its in sale, or can I Yarr it?

It's a multiplayer only game. What the fuck do you think?

Yeah, I feel I can make Zenyatta work amazingly well if I got good enough. Never had a problem with Widowmakers though. I always knew how to juke the shit out of them from the get-go. I just prefer Mercy because of that fucking ult and the damage boost.

Game looks fun imo.
The only good thing about ASSFAGGOTS is the character roster giving a diverse set of playstyles. Naturally, some of them have higher skill ceilings than others.
If there's enough post release content and some of those choke points are opened up a little (particularly on Anubis) then it might be good.
I remain hopeful that it can fix my itch for a decent multiplayer casual romp since TF2 hit the gutter.

I cannot actually believe you're defending this shit.

I'm actually getting irritated because of your pigheaded stupidity.

It hardly ever plays out like that unless you're dealing with a chimp. Proper juggling is hitting someone in midair by predicting the falling trajectory, waiting for them to land is like asking to have your shit pushed in. You'll give them an extra second to deal with you, if they can aim; it can go either way depending on their health.

Did you actually play TF2?

Okay the kids are crawling out of their holes.

Fuck it, I'm saying it; you assholes don't play multiplayer games, or you're under 18.

If I have been playing a game for a few hundred hours, I want to be able to trash people who picked the game up yesterday. If I can't, it makes me question why I should even continue playing it.

Oh wait, instant gratification. Fantastic. People like you are the reason pretty much every multiplayer game that comes out now is complete dogshit.

This is an ASSFAGGOTS inspired shooter which borrows heavily from TF2. It is inherently shit, because it was made by people who didn't understand what made those games so gratifying. Saying things like "Oh, well I'm having fun" does not validate any single point you make.

Bad level design
Hard Counter , devoid of skill, generic character/classes
Simplistic loop
Poor gamemodes
Leftist political Pandering
Designed for the lowest common denominator

These are all fucking facts. If you disagree, you're just wrong. Why do you even want to play this game anyway?

It's fucking terrible. You'll hate it in a couple of months, you should be able to see that now. There's not enough in it to make it interesting.

THE ONLY TWO THINGS THIS PIECE OF SHIT HAS GOING FOR IT IS POLISH AND PORN.

Going to stop posting now, it's apparent I'm going to have to deal with fucking blockheads who think that removing agency is fine, whilst giving vague GITGUD advice in a game without a skill ceiling. You're contradicting yourselves, you morons.

I played this game, I would usually spend 90% of any game on fire, I would nearly always get play of the game. I would hardly ever get stunlocked, but it would still happen, which does not feel fair when it takes 20+ seconds to get back to any sort of action.

I'm not explaining anything else. You're too dense to grasp it. I can't even believe people are defending this fucking turd.

no, im saying you got stunned like a fool so you deserve to die. stop being mad that you made a mistake and play better next time

You didn't play the game. Fuck off.

>Holla Forums is not one person flips their shit
Why is this allowed?

sure i did, did you?

Hardly.

And worse in my book.

B-but the robot's feelings… God, kill me already.

If you were a regular lurker you would know it is not.
But you are just a shill.

???

Personally I love the game.

Juking would probably be a valid tactic if only the rifle wasn't hitscan

Not everyone in America is a Jew, user. Not yet.

Honorarily Jew =/= Born Jew

is there some reason whoever made this used skins to put in as many weirdos as they could instead of showing their actual nationality and default design?

You might want to change the Heavy's flag to pic related.

You're just not going to get through to some people. A demographic will think those mechanics are ok, but to you and me they just seem pants on head retarded and unfun.

Thankfully it seems that it's becoming easier and easier to make games, so SOMETHING great ought to come out of the indie scene eventually.

He's a butthurt stormfronter convinced that the silly skins are a ploy to brainwash people into accepting games without any white people.

user are you willing to give those Vintages away?

Pyro is a wildcard and more likely American

heh
every time it does everyone goes back to quake cause theres no sense in playing an inferior version of 'perfection' with less player base, and when its actually different nobody is interested because it changes upon what youre used to, and thats where these stupid opinions come from.
people who just can not stand that theyre not in their element anymore. get fucked

being stunner by mcree is so easy it's stupid. I can kill literally any character with one stun and fan combo. He is actually broken and you are a retard for eating up blizzard shit.

There's also a whole lot less of an indication about enemy snipers. There's no dot from Widomaker's scope, Hanzo's arrows fly faster than the huntsman and have a much less visible tracer, shots are much quieter and you can't tell when it was a near miss. The number of times I was killed by a Hanzo who was somewhat nearby but had no idea he was firing on me was pretty significant. There are very few characters who are made to counter them, and it's pretty fucking annoying otherwise. Damage markers are shit too, Widowmaker can take 75% of your health as a tank in one shot and you won't have time to know what direction she was shooting from before another lands and you're dead. Unless you have a Genji, Reinhardt maybe, or a good countersniper, you're basically fucked against a skilled sniper.

I gotta agree, my man.

I played in all the betas and a shooter with stuns in it is not alright with me, not to mention the "press Q to win" boring-ass "ultimate" shit. It really plays much more like a first person moba with shooting overtones.

The levels are not badly designed in my experience, but they do feel more like a bouncy castle than real architecture because of the way characters slide off everything. It absolutely is designed with mass appeal at the forefront, and I think it's going to pay off for them unfortunately. I want to see Actiballsack fail as much as the next goy, but Blizzard knows how to design for large groups of suckers with all their WoW experience.

Tribes Ascend says otherwise. That shit was great until the devs fucked with it.

Jew is a jew is a jew.
Enjoy your paid mods.

Those classes probably have faces which cant be seen.

Kind of irrelevant considering they have canonical homelands and backstories which can be seen. It's like claiming a game is pushing the jewish conspiracy of glorifying hydrocephalics because it has a big head mode.

Oh alright.

Everytime I play Mei and a Roadhog hooks me, I hammer Shift and freeze in his face, negating the easy kill.
Everytime a McCree stuns me as Tracer, I hammer down on either Blink or Recall and completely negate any advantage he is about to gain as soon as the stun passes. He is either fast enough to get me before I blink or he misses out.

Considering that we are comparing this to escaping rocketjuggling, I'd say it's more fun to test your reaction time instead of testing how well you can aim while being tossed aside and killed. I just came from a few quick matches in TF2 and killing snipers, scouts, medics, engineers and the like in 2 rockets with the second being an easy hit after the juggling is not even funny for me, let alone the other fag.

Game does handle those chokepoints well enough. Tanks aren't just characters with more HP than the rest, they have abilities that severely help their team cross chokepoints. That passage in Anubis is large enough on each side for a Reinhart Shield. It's also fairly close quarters, so the boost a Zanya can get from the shields will melt people. Winston can jump out of the chokepoint and draw attention, Dva can do the same.

Really, don't look at it like Team Fortress and wonder "how are people gonna shoot their way through that chokepoint?" because there's more to the game than just shooting.

I just came from a session of TF2. I spent a decent while practicing juggling people with rockets. They easily fly about their size, letting me hit them at any point with no oposition. Not that it matters, more than half the roster dies with the second rocket anyway.

My brother plays pyro in an interesting way where he crouches and uses the blast to charge against whoever is firing on him. That's pretty cool, but unless you are expecting a rocket, you're not gonna react fast enough for that. Not to mention, you're still gonna lose health and go against someone that naturally has more HP than you anyway.

Seriously. You're gonna use the Age Argument in an anonymous imageboard? What's next? Everyone that likes Overwatch is a nigger? A woman? Canadian?

And did I say you don't have the right to do that? No I did not you stupid hairless ape.
You can trash whoever you fucking want, but if your servers are empty, you're not gonna trash anyone. And the servers WILL be empty because nobody has the duty of being trashed by you. They'll move on to actually fun games they can pickup and have fun from the get go, instead of having to treat it like a job.

Here we go again. Because all the thrown shit from the Scout CLEARLY isn't a skill with a cooldown. Because the Uber from the medic CLEARLY isn't a Ulti. Because the banners, the sandvich, the charges, the jarate, the cloacks and the sappers and a fuck load of content in TF2 can't be seen as a Skill.
Because the game features lanes with Minions going from one side of the other.
Because the point of the game is to destroy a major structure of your oponent while defeding yours, with turrets in the middle.
Because the game progresses by farming XP and Gold to levelup and buy items.

Because the game doesn't feature any of those things, it's not assfaggots. Idiots like you keep spamming that "but it is assfaggots!" all so you can say "Oh, it's X therefore I don't even have to explain why it's bad". It's the lowest form of strawman possible and it makes you look like a retard to anyone that tried the game.
So you're just another /pol9k/ taking a visit to Holla Forums to redpill us about how liking porn is degeneracy. Go and stay go.

I get you. If Blizzard suddendly got it's head out of it's ass, who would you hate, right? But the thing is, you can dislike the company while still liking the game. Funny, uh? And you'll allways have Bethesda, Valve, Nintendo…

It has come. It's called Xonotic. From the videos I've seen, it doesn't look halfbad. It's not my kind of game but it seems like right up your alley.
So people like you have your game and the rest has Overwatch, I guess.
However one thing I don't see is people going over to the Xonotic Generals and post "This is shit because I subjetively dislike it!"

It has stuns, it has Shields, it has slows, it has 3 different types of Health, speed boosts and a lot of other pretty unconventional crap.
Maybe you gotta stop looking at it like a traditional shooter?

Here's an interesting view that I haven't seen many people explain or ponder on.

Believing on Tribesfags (and I'm not saying they are wrong) the game was an incredible sucess. However if that's true, Hi-Rez should have made a truckload of money with it and kept makeing more as time went on. It's the whole premise for why TF2 still lasts, for example. If they were making all that money, why would they cut support to their servers and their game?

Because you have two possible scenarios here: Hi-Rez is irrevocably brain damaged. It sees a nice oportunity to print money and trashes it. Unlikely, makes no sense. OR… Tribes wasn't as much of a sucess as the Tribesfags make it sound like it was. A good minority really liked the game but they alone couldn't sustain it or draw in new players. The game died because it had no new players and made no money as a consequence.

I really don't want to believe the second option especially since I hate to think that the company canned the game just because it wasn't making money… But it's a company, and making money is their job, so the second option is the more likely to be true. It just wouldn't make sense to can the game if it really was a sucess.

Tribes Ascend actually did fail because of Hi-Rez incompetence though, they had a decent working system and great player numbers and then a couple patches in a row they just decided "we want korean p2w mmo money" and put out a bunch of very clearly overpowered and unenjoyable weapons with prohibitively high unlock costs and started churning out shitty maps and fucking up ones that people liked.

Oh, so it was the third option: the company just wanted even more money.
Gotta remenber that next time (and hope it doesn't happen with overwatch)

...

I though like you first, we where playing with a bunch of vets (30 y/o on average 98% pure FPS players) and we were like "WTF is that shit, why is the level design so retarded".

Then we realized that it's not the case, you have ways to go around it BUT you need team efforts for it to work, you need May ice wall or a bunch of heroes with movement abilities that know what the fuck they're doing (which wasn't present in quantity during the beta, the ninja, the ghost, Lucio and tracer are probably the 3 hardest to play properly. All of them can go through any chokepoint. But all of them are attack heroes with not a lot of life points).

I agree with you for the fake flat roofs need to go.

Not necessarily on the rest though the snipers are already completely broken has it is (one shot one kill… hey why not throw in a wallhack and an attack that goes through wall).

What really needs to go is
1) The wallhacks for snipers. (sniper/archer)
2) The aimbots for soldiers. (soldier/cowboy)

Because since fucking when HACKS are a power?

Note that it's not a compliment it means you HAVE to play with teammates on a regular basis and making it certainly not a fairly casual FPS as it is marketed.

twitch.tv/a_seagull/v/64896969?t=3h51m59s Sure.

It's a game focused on teamplay and heroes synergies. That kind of gameplay is to be expected. To pass that chokepoint in Anubis, you're not gonna do it by pumping 6 guys shooting at the other side.
You're gonna need someone that can dash\blink\somethingelse to the two rooms on the side so he can flank, you're gonna need a tank to eat the brawn of their defense and a support in the backlines as well. And all coordinated and at the same time.
Having a game that requires and rewards teamplay like that is quite neat, actually.

You are looking at them like a cheat, but you really shouldn't. What they give your team is information and a sniper's role is to recon as well. Now Widowmaker's pretty obvious when she uses it (the french is the hardest part to understand) while Hanzo not so much. However, Widow's has to waste an entire Ulti for that and Hanzo has limited range.

When McCreed says "It's High Noon", the first reaction of decent players is to get to cover for the next 6 seconds or until they hear it go off becaise they associate that phrase with insta-kills. Decent players will learn that when they hear "none person me echape" (or whatever she says), it means you lost any surprise element, so no flanking and open fields are being monitored for easy kills, so hide or use cover for the duration of her ulti. If you look at it that way, it's not THAT different from McCreeds High Noon.

Hanzo has a very short range for his ability, actually. It's good to scope some places and see if anyone's hiding there and they should make it obvious with some loud beeping from the arrow or even giving the option to shoot it. However, it's not gonna help unless you know where to aim it and it can't cover every possible entry.

I tried enjoying the game, but ended up just getting frustrated. Went to the forums to see if people actually felt that way and I found this gem in one of the threads about comparing it to TF2.

….In Tf2 I felt like I was in complete control of my character at all times. I had advanced mobility as the combat classes which took time to master, and even then I still wasn't as good as others. In this game everyone moves at a snails pace, advanced mobility doesn't really exist bar going straight up, and half of the abilities in the game remove my control. Back when a weapon called the Sandman was released, it was extremely hated because it allowed for a stun-kill combo which wasn't possible in the game. The concept was so disliked that Valve ended up basically reworking the concept entirely. I stand by that decision that STUNS DO NOT BELONG IN FPS.

In Tf2 I felt like regardless of my class, I was going to do well as long as I was better then my opponent. There are generally no hard counters in TF2 bar Scout/Engi, and even then you could at least still just attack things not by the Engineer. In this game my class is entirely decided on what the better teams class choices are.

In Tf2, I felt like I had to aim every shot because it was nearly impossible to instantly kill someone bar Sniper due to the large damage falloff. This encouraged aggressive play to get close and do more damage In this game half the abilities auto-lock on to players, remove their control, or just flat out instantly kill them. Shootouts dont decide the better players in this game, who is off cooldowns does.

In Tf2, I could join any random server, have fun with a couple people, and then add it to my favorites and come back to it later. There are no servers in this game, and noone talks because the rounds are too fast and chaotic to just have casual fun.

Im not even going to comment on the map design, where you cant actually flank properly and dead ends are everywhere. Its like everymap is dustbowl and every payload is goldrush.

Basically, I feel like this game is almost the anti-thesis of what a good class shooter for me would be.

In a genre people, including myself, like due to the amount of skill required to be played well it has:

1. Multiple Stuns or Control removers
2. Heavily relies on Class vs Class balance rather then Player vs Player
3. Multiple braindead instant kills
4. Multiple AOE instant kills
5. No advanced mobility

My biggest issue is the fact that I see no incentive to practice. In shooters in general, the reward for practicing is less deaths and more kills. So I practiced my !@#$ off in TF2 and was rewarded with more playtime and less respawn time.

In this game individual skill is so undervalued to the point I may just look at my opponents class choices and react.

I couldnt sum up my opinions better then this guy did.

Honestly, I get being frustrated. I solo queue most games I play online and being partnered with tards is horrible. You do your best and it's never enough. All it takes is 2 half decent players on the other team working together and your efforts are void because your team are Lemmings.

But you can still use those games to practice your aim, map awareness and test out some neat tricks with your current champ or just explore the map and dick around.
You can even try and convince your lemmings to go the other way this time or wait and go together.

Fortunnely, not all games go like this and when you get two teams that are actually trying to work together against each other, the game is pretty fun.

Nice one.

Stay mad faggot.

that said, it would be pretty cool if pharah even had the option to juggle just as something else that shes able to do.

I've never seen a more blatantly obvious shill thread on my almost 3 years here shit.

In beta I almost never lost as defender on the British escort map that ends in a hallway. I picked pig and just went to town on anyone who wanted to walk on either side of the escort with walls on either side. Hooking a carry/support or two would just make a team collapse when they have to come from so far away.

have they revealed which character is the LGBT token yet?

ur mom

I played a lot of tracer over the weekend, and not immediately dieing to McCree stun meant he was bad or your team disrupted him. there was no "reaction time test" for him, he could just kill you before you could move. You didn't have actual counter play after getting hit. You HAVE to dodge it with a blink, come in when it's down or surprise them with an all in when they aren't expecting to use their stun.

My friends are pretty stuck in their ways, vidya wise. One only plays MMOs and MOBAs, three only play Counter Strike and StarCraft 2, one will play almost anything provided other people play it with us. This is the only time I've ever gotten them all together in one game. I enjoyed the beta, but mostly because I could get all of my friends into one game.

Having a full 6-man premade was great.

Is it as bad as Brink?

You can refresh your router as much as you want, doesn't make you any better at the game.

Pharah can juggle with her rockets, actually. I keep making characters like Widow, Mei and others jump around with well placed rockets. It's almost too easy, really.

Bad attackers then… That map has a long hallway where a sniper can stay at the far end and make bacon with your pig, as well as a sideway to the left of the defenders for anyone to flank.

It is considerably hard to attack with a bastion or turrets there, though, but any tank or long range engagement to soften the defense wins you the game.

That's usually because most McCrees are counting on the stun. They use it in a doorway or something similar and are close enough to immidatly capitalize on it, so you don't get to react to it.
The thing is, however, that this means they are considerably close and risking themselves. If they fail the stun like you said, you are assured to kill them. It's still high risk high reward for them, and what's more you can just peel them from a distance because they aren't even gonna try to get you, while they wait for you to get closer.

More like I'm behind/in/flanking their team with tracer which is where a lot of McCrees position while playing safe.

Anyone know how this game plays on triple monitor setups?

pic unrelated

That's a ten year old boy user.

I can count too faggot.

Run close to them and blink away when they use the flashbang, since you know they are counting on it. Use doorways for that, it's where they they have an advantage.
Peeling might work, but he doesn't have damage falloff while you do.

Alternatively, you can just damage him a bit and run off to flank some other side. If he comes after you, he's as usefull as dead, if he doesn't, you can pop in again and be as obnoxious as he is.

I like the game and I don't like when people talk bullshit. Sue me.
I get not enjoying the game, there are people with different tastes, but I don't accept blatantly lying about a game just to "prove" how bad it is.

Casual shit is all the rage but this game is Blizzard's attempt to catch up and it may not last. They are banking on the old, predictable "barrage of marketing" strategy.

Yeah, I haven't either, but I don't go around creating retarded threads trying to boost discussion and to keep it relevant.

Shills gonna shill