Will socialism fix the gender wage gap problem? Will women be treated as fellow human being instead of subhumans?

Will socialism fix the gender wage gap problem? Will women be treated as fellow human being instead of subhumans?

Other urls found in this thread:

nytimes.com/2010/02/06/business/economy/06women.html?_r=2
bloomberg.com/view/articles/2012-08-13/don-t-blame-discrimination-for-gender-wage-gap
time.com/3222543/wage-pay-gap-myth-feminism/
examiner.com/article/gender-pay-gap-is-not-what-activists-claim
telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/vickiwoods/7957186/Sorry-ladies-Im-not-worried-about-wage-gaps.html
bloombergview.com/articles/2012-08-13/don-t-blame-discrimination-for-gender-wage-gap
zerohedge.com/news/biggest-shock-fridays-payroll-report-sorry-men
economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/07/share-of-men-in-labor-force-at-all-time-low/?src=recg
businessinsider.com/women-in-tech-make-more-money-and-land-better-jobs-than-men-2010-9
reuters.com/article/us-boardroom-women-idUSN0752118220071107?feedType=R
abcnews.go.com/print?id=10630664
nytimes.com/2007/08/03/nyregion/03women.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052748704421104575463790770831192?mg=reno64-wsj&url=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704421104575463790770831192.html
clickhole.com/article/7-female-ceos-who-inspire-us-all-be-cogs-capitalis-1242
time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/
time.com/30545/its-time-to-end-rape-culture-hysteria/
m.youtube.com/watch?v=3TR_YuDFIFI[Embed]
sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/02/080204212846.htm
citation.allacademic.com/meta/p_mla_apa_research_citation/0/1/8/6/5/p18653_index.html
wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702303532704579483752909957472
huffingtonpost.com/christina-hoff-sommers/wage-gap_b_2073804.html
educationnews.org/higher-education/study-women-favored-for-stem-tenure-track-jobs/
pnas.org/content/112/17/5360.abstract
m.youtube.com/watch?v=6EDykuMDLpM[Embed]
pastebin.com/bfkB8vqw
takimag.com/article/feminist_fallout_a_roll_call_of_regrets_gavin_mcinnes/print#axzz3BY8F1OTw
bls.gov/news.release/atus.nr0.htm
washingtonexaminer.com/bogus-aauw-study-perpetuates-wage-gap-myths/article/2512127
payscale.com/data-packages/gender-wage-gap/job-distribution-by-gender
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_elected_and_appointed_female_heads_of_state
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_elected_or_appointed_female_heads_of_government
jjmccullough.com/charts_rest_female-leaders.php
anti-feminism-pro-equality.tumblr.com/wagegap
anti-feminism-pro-equality.tumblr.com/wagegap2
youtube.com/watch?v=8EK6Y1X_xa4
mltranslations.org/Britain/Marxclass.htm
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal_Pay_Act_of_1963
cbsnews.com/news/the-gender-pay-gap-is-a-complete-myth/
consad.com/content/reports/Gender Wage Gap Final Report.pdf
whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/Women_in_America.pdf
cnn.com/2015/04/13/opinions/williams-ceci-women-in-science/
thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/01/no-women-don-t-make-less-money-than-men.html
freakonomics.com/2016/01/07/the-true-story-of-the-gender-pay-gap-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/
billmoyers.com/2014/04/08/debunking-the-myth-of-a-mythical-gender-pay-gap/
youtube.com/watch?v=ObyfGIW6MUc
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

Socialism will fix the wage problem.

top kek libs

/thread

...

It'll fade away like the state my dude.

I mean literally all you have to, even in capitalism is just pay nurses and teachers more, plus strengthen collective bargaining. In socialism, all bargaining would be collective, so it wouldn't matter in the slightest.

Pay gap only exist because of capitalism.

There is no gender wage gap

nytimes.com/2010/02/06/business/economy/06women.html?_r=2

bloomberg.com/view/articles/2012-08-13/don-t-blame-discrimination-for-gender-wage-gap

time.com/3222543/wage-pay-gap-myth-feminism/

examiner.com/article/gender-pay-gap-is-not-what-activists-claim

telegraph.co.uk/comment/columnists/vickiwoods/7957186/Sorry-ladies-Im-not-worried-about-wage-gaps.html

bloombergview.com/articles/2012-08-13/don-t-blame-discrimination-for-gender-wage-gap

zerohedge.com/news/biggest-shock-fridays-payroll-report-sorry-men

economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/09/07/share-of-men-in-labor-force-at-all-time-low/?src=recg

businessinsider.com/women-in-tech-make-more-money-and-land-better-jobs-than-men-2010-9

reuters.com/article/us-boardroom-women-idUSN0752118220071107?feedType=R

abcnews.go.com/print?id=10630664

nytimes.com/2007/08/03/nyregion/03women.html?_r=1&oref=slogin

wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052748704421104575463790770831192?mg=reno64-wsj&url=http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704421104575463790770831192.html

Take your shitty ID politics somewhere else you cancerous piece of shit.

go back to Holla Forums crybabby. Holla Forums is a feminist board

lmao, no it's not.
>>>/tumblr/

fucking kill yourself you waste of human flesh

liberal idpoler detected.

Anyway, what if the pay were exactly the same? It would still be shitty capitalism nonetheless.

I don't know why feminists care so much about exploiting others as much as men do.

"well, you know, most slave owners are men! That's sexist! Women should have just as many slaves as men do, or even more!"

Unabomber was right with the ship analogy.

looks like nazbol already took over. It was good while it lasted

Read "Origin of the Family"

It is. Communism is feminist, whether you like it or not.

This.

The effort should be emancipating female workers, not fussing over the arbitrary amount they're paid.

clickhole.com/article/7-female-ceos-who-inspire-us-all-be-cogs-capitalis-1242

Maybe so, and I would consider myself one too, but I would still argue that the wage gap doesn't real.

KILL YOURSELF

It's okay, you can stop samefagging now.

aahahaahah

NO

How many times have we had to post this shit already?

time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/

time.com/30545/its-time-to-end-rape-culture-hysteria/

m.youtube.com/watch?v=3TR_YuDFIFI[Embed]

sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/02/080204212846.htm

citation.allacademic.com/meta/p_mla_apa_research_citation/0/1/8/6/5/p18653_index.html

wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702303532704579483752909957472

huffingtonpost.com/christina-hoff-sommers/wage-gap_b_2073804.html

educationnews.org/higher-education/study-women-favored-for-stem-tenure-track-jobs/

pnas.org/content/112/17/5360.abstract

m.youtube.com/watch?v=6EDykuMDLpM[Embed]

pastebin.com/bfkB8vqw

takimag.com/article/feminist_fallout_a_roll_call_of_regrets_gavin_mcinnes/print#axzz3BY8F1OTw

bls.gov/news.release/atus.nr0.htm

washingtonexaminer.com/bogus-aauw-study-perpetuates-wage-gap-myths/article/2512127

payscale.com/data-packages/gender-wage-gap/job-distribution-by-gender

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_elected_and_appointed_female_heads_of_state

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_elected_or_appointed_female_heads_of_government

jjmccullough.com/charts_rest_female-leaders.php

anti-feminism-pro-equality.tumblr.com/wagegap

anti-feminism-pro-equality.tumblr.com/wagegap2


Sometimes I think threads and posts like these are just Holla Forums trolling us to test how stupid we are. Yes, we lost the debate. Boo hoo. Fuck Xexizy, he was a faggot and he deserved to drown.

How many women are there that are truly apart of the proletariat?


*crickets*

There isn't really a gender wage gap problem. Men and Women work different jobs (by choice) and comparing those jobs is like comparing apples and oranges.

Sure a man with a college degree makes more money than a woman with a college degree. but what is that degree in.

Engineering is nearly all male,, Those people make a lot of money. Primary education is nearly all female. Primary education does not pay was well as engineering.

There is no conspiracy to keep women out of engineering just like there is no conspiracy to keep men from teaching kindergarten, but through self selection more women teach kindergarten than design dams and bridges.

Show me a female engineer who is not being paid as much as her male counterparts and I will support her right to an equal wage.

But don't compare apples and oranges and then scream discrimination.

youtube.com/watch?v=8EK6Y1X_xa4

Everyone is part of the proletariat who works for a wage. Seriously, this is Marxism 101.

This is a good observation. Women only demand equal representation in the high paying white collar jobs, they aren't trying to get on deep sea fishing boats or any of the dangerous dirty stuff.

American feminism is largely an upper class movement. betty friedan wrote about the boredom and frustration of college educated suburban housewives in 1950's and their desire for interesting work outside the home. My grandmother would have loved to have their problems,, she worked in packing houses and factories for whole life.

Nazbols are more communist than liberal idpolers like you, that's for sure. But if we take what you say seriously, more than half of the world is Nazbol.

Policemen are paid wages.

CEOs are paid wages

mltranslations.org/Britain/Marxclass.htm

Yes, they are.

And your link agrees:

...

What a great counter argument! Are you a debate champion?

That's just empty rhetoric (I assume, or maybe Trotsky had absolutely no understanding of Marxism).

Isn't the type of labor and the money earned a factor in this.. Is Brad Pitt proletariat because he doesn't own the movie studio and therefore sells his acting to those who own the means of making movies?

Communism wont fix it because it doesnt exist

It is literally illegal to pay women less than men to begin with in the US because en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal_Pay_Act_of_1963 You CANNOT legally pay women less for SAME ROLE, SAME EXPERIENCE, SAME HOURS ETC ETC, or indeed ANYONE. Women etc earn less because they work different jobs, chose lower paid roles, have less experience and work less hours. But they never sue. Why? Because everyone who is intelligent knows the gender wage gap is bullshit and even a female judge will laugh you out of court for comparing oranges and apples.

You didn't read a damn thing, did you?

The majority of people now (in the first world) are apart of the bourgeois (the middle class) and the bureaucrats, not proletarians. They push papers and produce nothing.

Only a few are the proletariat and they toil hard labour to another that exploits their labours.

Nope, the distinction Bourgeoisie proletariat lies in the income nature. Wage, work: Proletariat. Capital, portfolios: Bourgeoisie. Mix of the two petit bourgeois (i guess?)
So di caprio would be proletariat if he earned all his money trough acting, but bourgeoisie i he massively invested his earning i Banking, real estateand so on (which he probably did).
I'm not sure how unproductive labor fit into this tho, is this a specific class or a subdivision of proletariat?

France is now about 90% wage workers – that is, 90% proletariat. Granted, it is mostly proletarian aristocracy, due the imperialist position of France, but still.

Women shouldn't be employed or voters, tbh. Solves all these problems and more.

It is western feminism as a whole. This is exactly the problem. You look at feminism and find it riddled with nothing but muh privileged bourgeois bitches who have no worked a day in their lives whining in their sheltered suburban brat upbringing that they cannot sail on their father's yacht or drive his mercedes while wearing designer clothing and using products that have no necessity but only bourgeois status while crying oppression while a man and woman in eastern europe or asia works hours on the run down factories and fields with high mortality. Virtually all its leaders and spokewomen are bourgeois and they do nothing but create more oppression to the proletariat who merely wishes to live without needing to rely on playing a IDpol card. They are the bourgeois element and must be purged from the left if the proletariat is to survive.

I think the wage gap is liberal mythology but this idea that individuals work different jobs by "choice" is even worse.

communism is egalitarian. feminism is a meme.

CEO wages are tied to stock performance, and most own a large amount of stocks in the companies they own. Their income is basically a capitalist's income.

There is not really such a thing as a 'wage gap' that has women being paid less for the same work a man would do, rather a systemic societal tendency for women to be motivated to do work that is compensated either less in general or is generally not going to let them end up higher on the ladder.

This is largely a result of social norms which enforce gender roles, and is a remainder stemming from old patriarchal norms from late/post-mercantilist society. However, porky hates this because he needs more workers regardless of what they look like, so he's been trying to get women to work as much as possible and in as many places as possible. This is why capitalism is directly responsible, at the root, for motivating the diversity of employment in its never ending quest for compound capital accumulation.

Is that you? After losing the debates, did you think you could show your face here again?

As for feminism, they are nothing more than useful idiots to drive down wages for all to the benefit of the big pigs. They are fools and will cause the destruction of everything, including themselves.

If women were paid less,there would be almost no male workers.

No CEO's are paid by dividends and can also set themselves a wage.

t.Director.

No, I'm not Xerox.

Liberal feminism :/: revolutionary or materialist, unlike proletarian feminisms like anarchist or Marxist feminism. Strawfeminism as the outraged dyed hair freaks whining about manspreading should not be held as what feminism theoretically has to offer, just like the existence the embarassing communist club every college and university has is not an accurate depiction of the communist movement.

idpol is still idpol no matter how you want to dress it up. get out of here with that shit.

lol
And yes I understand they get a wage, but that wage is tied to stock performance usually.

Better time than ever to post this maymay. This vulgar Marxism that will petulantly brand any deeper, more subject-oriented analysis as 'idpol' or anti-materialist (really kekworthy) is really autistic, and shows just how there's still a few idiots here who get all of their feminist theory and 'critique' of it from post-GG migrations. You know little about the methodology of materialist feminism if all you've got to say to dismiss is scream 'muh idpol'. It goes much deeper than that and is actually useful for the broader communist movement and its mission of universal human emancipation.


Took off the name, didn't even notice I still had it on (had it for another thread, in which it was useful).

i am 50% sure that you are a poltard but what ever if you want to have a non-IDpol feminism read Simone de Beauvoir

What gender wage gap problem?


I genuinely think primary educators should be paid at least as much if not more than engineers though. Part of the problem with America's shit education system is that we value teachers so little that we don't pay competitive wages.

Everything in this post disappoints me. I don't have time to pick this shit apart further because I gotta go back to work soon, but you are a massive faggot for trusting right-wing retards and greedy porky fucks. Ever occur to you that these people perhaps find it to their advantage to pay some people less money?

Yes

Option one, early stages:
Worker control of the means of production means transparency in wages, making wage inequality among demographics of equal qualification unlikely, and workers will be responsible for their own wages, making it impossible to blame it on the invisible evil lizard man conspiracy.

Option 2, eventually:
Abolish money.

(Also the wage gap is largely non existent and is a result of different choices/working hours)

Worker control of the means of production means NO wages.

This is false. If anything teachers (in the USA) are overpaid. Look at their salaries and benefits and how many times of the year they work / how long their breaks are. It's ridiculous.

We already know as a fact the US spends more per capita and per student than anyone else in the world for education with shit results but countries that spend considerably less with teachers with far worse wages do far better. So what is happening here? That throwing money does not = solution you dumb capitalists

Way to cherrypick and ignore, you idpoling idiot. Common sense would dictate if your words are true, there is no point to hiring men whatsoever since the capitalists can just hire nothing but women and pay them lower wages. Besides, it is illegal.

Men and women make the same hourly wages.

1. "The Equal Pay Act of 1963 is a United States federal law amending the Fair Labor Standards Act, aimed at abolishing wage disparity based on sex:

No employer having employees subject to any provisions of this section [section 206 of title 29 of the United States Code] shall discriminate, within any establishment in which such employees are employed, between employees on the basis of sex by paying wages to employees in such establishment at a rate less than the rate at which he pays wages to employees of the opposite sex in such establishment for equal work on jobs[,] the performance of which requires equal skill, effort, and responsibility, and which are performed under similar working conditions, except where such payment is made pursuant to (i) a seniority system; (ii) a merit system; (iii) a system which measures earnings by quantity or quality of production; or (iv) a differential based on any other factor other than sex "

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equal_Pay_Act_of_1963

So why do men make more money?

2."Men are far more likely to take work in uncomfortable, isolated, and undesirable locations that pay more.Men work longer hours than women do. The average fulltime working man works 6 hours per week or 15 percent longer than the average fulltime working woman."

cbsnews.com/news/the-gender-pay-gap-is-a-complete-myth/


time.com/3222543/5-feminist-myths-that-will-not-die/

US Department of Labor: "This study leads to the unambiguous conclusion that the differences in the compensation of men and women are the result of a multitude of factors and that the raw wage gap should not be used as the basis to justify corrective action. Indeed, there may be nothing to correct. The differences in raw wages may be almost entirely the result of the individual choices being made by both male and female workers." consad.com/content/reports/Gender Wage Gap Final Report.pdf
"women are more highly represented in the lower-paying jobs […] only 7 percent of female professionals were employed in the relatively high paying computer and engineering fields compared to 38 percent of male professionals."
whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/Women_in_America.pdf
Women have a 2-to-1 hiring advantage in STEM fields.
cnn.com/2015/04/13/opinions/williams-ceci-women-in-science/

Even HuffHo realizes the pay gape is a lie.

huffingtonpost.com/christina-hoff-sommers/wage-gap_b_2073804.html


thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/02/01/no-women-don-t-make-less-money-than-men.html
freakonomics.com/2016/01/07/the-true-story-of-the-gender-pay-gap-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/
billmoyers.com/2014/04/08/debunking-the-myth-of-a-mythical-gender-pay-gap/

...

Sure thing. Now show us the employers who only hire women because it's clearly lucrative.

There's no such thing

Trololol

This fucking meme.

"If slavery exists then there'd be no wage workers!!!!!!!"

It's illegal so it must not happen?

Come the fuck on, you anti-fems can do better than that. I agree that the wage gap is a misnomer, as the gap between men and women's economic power is in overall earnings rather than wages. Some of the earning gap is due to wage discrimination, some is due to the division of labor in the household and the under valuing of traditionally femine labor.

oh fuck off op

Unicorns don't exist.

You forgot to add fem to your flag.

Tbh women do make less in the workplace, because of jobs they pick. BUT I believe also that they pay less because they generally are picked more by women.

this tbh, teachers and nurses and extremely undervalued

From what I've heard, nurses do most of the work, doctors just do the diagnosises.

Teachers need to pursue A LOT of education in order to begin to make over 50k a year.

Yeah, my mom is a second grade teacher with a masters degree, she has twenty years of experience and only started making more than 50 K like last year, and our area has higher costs of living than most.

My mom is a dialysis nurse and she still lives paycheck to paycheck

Either you are right and some shady conspiracy of oppression manage to get the global wages in that line of work lower, either we live in a capitalist economy and wages are decided by the law of offer and demand.

Job is easy, leave a lot of free time and a lot of people want to do it: low wage.
Chemical engineer in an off shore platform: who the fuck can AND want to do that? Fuck it, I just need ten of them, give them what they are asking for.

Nice false dichotomy, faggot.

Under the law of offer and demand, there is no room for discriminations.

...

Show me.

wew lad

...

You mean, like hiring women if they need less money to get the same work done?

...

When there is money to be mad, the bourgeoisie ask their dogs to be as rational as it is humanely possible.

...

this is the problem with you lolbertarians, you have no insight into your own capacity for irrationality, and, incapable of selfcriticism, you remain blithely unaware that your theories lack any real world utility.

Not as long as the unions continue to shepherd the middle class into service jobs. Manufacturing jobs have the least pay inequity, and the Left doesn't want you to know this.

unions are one of the many living embodiments of "boys club" tbqh. one of the many reasons for the wage gap is that traditionally female industries aren't nearly as organized.

If that is true, then people who are more rational than me have an advantage over me and will eventually replace me. No need for political action there.


That is the case only for fake jobs and highly ranked positions. Where shit have to be done, they hire who can do it for the cheapest price.

Can you imbeciles at least sage this cancerous thread, please?

rationality isn't that important in daily life, at least not as much as wealth and connections.
as you ought to be well aware, having and keeping a job is more about what people think you're doing rather than what you actually produce. if a manager dislikes you, rightly or wrongly, they're going to have a more negative opinion on your work. likewise people who have moved up the management food chain tend to become proficient on pushing the blame/workload onto the more junior members of the team.
i shouldn't have to explain this; it ought to be common sense.

This is why the bourgeois invented that crap about objective and measurable objectives and regular meeting with the manager to talk about it.

The guy one step above you is irrational, but the guy one step above him want him to be rational.

have you ever noticed how said objectives only seem to apply to certain people?

this is perfect
it'll be fun watching how this is pushed

Yes, this kind of people is called a worker.

Don't pretend men don't get ridiculously high objectives so they can be blamed if they miss their target.

of course, but don't pretend that gender doesn't factor into favoritism.

there is not wage gap youtube.com/watch?v=ObyfGIW6MUc

maybe

This is one of the dumbest fucking things.

How can you pay women less than men when people aren't paid anything in the first place?

agreed that idpol is largely a spook
feminism is a very bourgeois concern

If you make this kind of claim, you must prove it.

that class is a more onerous system of oppression than sexism? wage gap between rich and poor much larger than between genders, for example.

my issue is with people who deny that it exists. it clearly does.

sorry, misread your post. there were a number of pieces published recently on how women tend to bear the brunt of workplace bullying. you can find them with a quick google search.

How is it actually useful?

How is the idea that people choose their profession worse? Did someone force Sally to teach kindergarten? No, she chose it for herself, went to school and worked towards it and everything.

Did someone force Dave to become an electrician? No,, he enrolled in a trade school, got an apprenticeship and worked towards it.

Some careers seem to appeal more to one gender than the other.

Would you have stopped Dave from becoming a kindergarten teacher? No,, but Dave doesn't want to deal with thirty small children, he wants to wire buildings.

What is bad or wrong about this concept?

maybe sally wanted to be a mathematician but her middle school teacher told her girls were stupid at math and her dad scoffed at her career goals and her professor sexually harassed her.

maybe dave hates his job and lives to spend time with his family but makes better money than his wife and besides men are providers and his buddies would him a hard time were he to become a stay at home dad.

try to think a little less simplistically, this is why Holla Forums is a joke.