Why is Maoism more socially acceptable than Stalinism?

Why is Maoism more socially acceptable than Stalinism?

Both ideologies are garbage, especially because they idolize men whose actions caused the deaths of many, many innocent people.

But Stalin literally saved the world from mass genocide. Mao spent most of his time replacing Chinese traditions with Western ones, and created socialism so fragile that it collapsed nearly immediately after his death.

Maoists always go on and on about protracted peoples' war, but outside of China it's never worked! And Maoist-Third-Worldism is just hippie bullshit that celebrates non-Western people simply for being non-Western.

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delet this

This never happened

This meme again

Mao was an actual theorists and he laid down the foundations of societal transformation in China. He also wrote about dialectics, military theory, social theory, etc. So you can argue for that "I agree with him as a philosopher but not entirely as a statesman" approach. It's not rare to approve a person philosophy's while not approving of his personal actions.

Stalinism, on the other hand, is theoretically a bit of a blank page since he was a centrist during inner-party struggles and in the decades he was in power he supported some mutually contradictory platforms. And Stalin was never much of a theorist. So "Stalinist" has a connotation of adherence to the man himself. It's mostly used to describe his faction, his men, people who worked for him, people who served him, or just people who idolize his actions. You can't separate the thought from the person.

But do Maoists really make this distinction between Mao as theoretician and Mao as leader?

Given that nearly all Maoists idolize Mao as a leader, I'm skeptical.

Because china is further away.

Why in the fucking world would you want to kill 200 million ppl when your country is barely industrialized?

This. Western Maoism is just left-wing Orientalism, as edgy hippie liberals who admit fault in capitalism use it to promote the inherent superiority of foreign peoples.

the "people's republic" of china still exists

yup


this

It's like how american liberals use karma, do yoga, and unironically wear moccasins.

Trotskyists always ranting on how Stalin is the most evil person ever and that if Trotsky would've been in power the USSR would be perfect.

Stalin and Mao both sent a lot of innocent people to prison camps because of their "kill a fly with a shotgun" attitude. While paranoia is not reasonable, but necessary, for socialist rulers, mass executions on trumped-up charges shouldn't be acceptable.

Stalin probably was culpable in the Ukrainian famine, and I believe the treatment of German civilians after WW2 was unnecessarily cruel.

Mao was even worse, directing the lynch mob slaughter of any Chinese citizens who did not follow certain (often non-Marxist!) aspects of his philosophy.

Perhaps among the left, I'm pretty sure the mainstream bourgeois ideology see's him as an Asian oriental despot


What part of Maoism is non-Marxist?

Curious, what to Trots generally think of Maoists?

During the Cold War, I believe nearly all socialist organizations in the US were explicitly Trotskyist or Maoist, but they never really got along.

Only because he happened to be in the way. And even then it was despite him.

That's because it's bullshit and never worked in China either. Mao got his ass handed to him and went on the long march, meanwhile the Kuomintang fought the Japanese. Mao comes back and pushes over a heavily bloodied KT and declares it was all due to his brilliant strategy of getting rekt people's war.

You are a leftist. Who gives a fuck. Are you going to let (anti-communist portrayals of) Mao and Stalin define leftism.

Mao and Stalin had plenty of supporters, but they don't get the media coverage the capitalist give to a couple of dissidents.

Break the capitalist-mind prison and explore what Mao and Stalin actually said i,e put on the fucking glasses.
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What are you even arguing against? The idea that innocents should be put in jail and people deliberately starved? No one advocates for this and neither did Stalin or Mao.

To move the left forward argue about substantial issues. How to form collectives, how to educate people, policy toward religion, policy towards environment etc.

Arguing about how good or bad Stalin was is really pointless. All it does is promote a subtle anti-communism.

Last I checked, Marx didn't write anything about how the Cheongsam dress must be banned.

Somebody explain the difference between them

Maoists revere Mao as a fucking messiah, and this is somehow acceptable.

But if you say anything remotely positive of Stalin, socialists suddenly turn into liberals.

Moasim is Marxism with Chinese characteristics

According to government statistics, 15 million people died during the great leap forward famine.

That's according to the Chinese government. Are you denying what they admit? That is a very substantial number, in my eyes. It's not the kind of thing you sweep away as not being important.


The best you "gorrillion" strawmen can do is echo Holla Forumstards for denying the millions murdered by fascism, and simply be as ridiculous as possible by pretending that your average communist thinks that Stalin or Mao murderered 200 million + (or some other ludicrous number) for no discernable reason. The more idiotic you can make the argument sound the better, apparently.

That doesn't mean anything

Think Marxism, but without worker control or workers rights.

and lots of red xD xD

Stalinism is just what Stalin did – one-party statism, accountability through purge, and suppression of dissent among individual citizens. Stalin also promoted "low" and "high" Russian culture, celebrating proletarian traditions while also following Engels' belief that socialism should allow the proletarians to partake in cultural luxuries previously reserved for the rich.

Maoism is Stalinism paired with the belief that there are three worlds – liberal imperialist, Soviet imperialist, and the colonized. Colonized people are the true proletarians, because poor people in the US, Britain, or even the USSR are gears in the colonialist machine.

Maoism also incorporates the rejection of culture, rather than its celebration. Mao believed traditional clothing and music should be suppressed, due to their association with the Chinese Empire. Instead, China had to develop a proletarian identity. But he also incorporated aspects of Confuscianism because that's not bourgeois for some reason.

The part where Mao is the "red sun" in the "hearts of the people" and anybody who didn't memorize his book hard enough or didn't have a portrait of him in their home, or any artist who produced any song or portrait that didn't explicitly celebrate Mao's superpowers as the savior of mankind was marked for imprisonment or execution by violent state sponsored mobs of teenagers. Also the part where people had to take anything that contained steel from their homes and melt it in backyard furnaces to produce tons of useless steel so that China could signal to the world that it's a great industrial power wasn't exactly a fundamental tenet of Marxism either.

Other than that, he was a great "Marxist."

They got along in Europe some 21st century left party coalitions in Europe are a result of maoists and trotskyists getting together

So, state capitalism

Any of these left coalitions still exist?

I hate to break it to you, but socialists don't turn into liberals.

Are you shitposting or is this what you actually think?

From what i know some maoists were involved in the formation of this parties made up by coalitions, also known as the new left.


It's weird how Front de Gauche doesn't seem to have any maoist movement in its origin since maoism was so popular in France during 1969

1968*

They didn't want to. Most of these deaths were due to their incompetence as leaders.

Because Maoism appeals to idpol ethnic minority nationalism and thus it gets liberals wet

fucking lol

How is any of that incorrect? I'm sure my understanding of Stalin is shallow, but I thought all of that was accurate.

Oh noes not subtle anti-communism! Spooky.