Plan Elf

The only one that I know of like that is the one that correlates strongly to autism when expressed homozygously. I'd leave it up to the parents what they wanted to do about it.

Fixing a few minor things like single-gene errors is easier than trying to improve intelligence or physicality, which is caused by many things. Defects are caused by single genes, thats why we can easily spot them as defects, but overall "goodness" is a spectrum.

Elf, you say?

Just try and invade us p-orky!

Also why choose indian reservations? For the legality? They are objectively the shittiest pieces of land for agriculture.

Anyway this is fun and all, but besides yourself and a more sceptical me, I doubt you are going to find lots of people who both support communism, genetic engineering and want to be in a commune.

Legality, yes.

Yep, the core problem. Hence why we're raising elf-daughters and elf-sons to draw people in.

You would need to find at least two equally crazy girls then, unless you are a girl. But two people don't make a commune, just roommates on a farm.

Hydroponics are where its at

I'm not going to sit in a warehouse in Detroit lad.

...

Expect a visit from the KGB soon, "comrade"

Let me throw a rock out my window and get back to you.

Anyway I'm on board but only if we can make our official dialect trans-atlantic english, just for the lolz.

Step one:
Democracies work under the assumption that the electorate is not susceptible to manipulation
You intend to keep the co-op workers isolated form the rest of the world how?
See current first world "democracies".

I don't know where all these "we-will-out-market-the-capitalists" people are coming from, you wont.
You will, at best, survive ,in a sub-par environment with worse working conditions than the capitalist run analogue.

At worst, the capitalists all around you will collude to sacrifice a tiny amount of their profits to ruin you,for playing their game.
Then you will become an icon of "the things we have to give up to embrace socialism".

One does not end monarchy by declaring oneself monarch of their yard and expecting to culturally conquer the world.

One ends the monarch and associates.

Only if Elvish is our secondary language and Black Speech is used for defense purposes.

It won't be direct democracy, and the Amish seem to do it fine.

Communalism lets us live better, but with less material stuff. It's like eating organic every night, but with candle light.

It is in the nature of elves to be slaves to more masculine races user. After brief reconditioning they accept and enjoy servitude.

Sounds like a bretty gud plan OP. I would be interested in helping out actually. My family and I are talking about starting a commune when I graduate from college. I think transhumanism is a pretty good idea, but I don't know if we could get the general population on board with it. Many will likely be afraid of "playing God."

I appreciate your efforts but I don't think a bunch of tolkien-loving technocommies are, how do you say, top of the genepool, in my experience.

But whatever, also what this guy said

You're not going to be able to outperform capitalist companies as a small farmer. If you really want this crazy plan to work you'd be better off trying to ride the bubble of tech startups and use that money to set up a larger commune with viable means of income and perhaps farming for self sufficiency.

Playing god is not scary, it is what humans are best at.

Except you can't expect to just burst into your country's government offices and assume control, you need to build support for your movement. The best way to do this is show that alternatives are possible. Even in Russia the workers former Soviets before they toppled the Tsar.

Also capitalists won't give a shit about you as long as you don't rock their boat, but by the time you grow big enough to do so it will likely be too late for them.

We'll see user, we'll see.

This is now Detroit Commune 3.0: Transhumanism edition.

Calling it right now. This will never happen you op will die at 30 from clogged arteries and never get to experience transhumanism

Yes please
Nigga what

Man must recreate man.

You don't want to iron out genetic wrinkles to destroy all chances of getting cancer?

is that you prickly cactus

Kek

Nay.

OP if you created like a mailing list or something for people interested in participating in something like this I'd definitely sign up

ew. You disappoint me, transhumanistfag

I'm thinking about it.

You don't like grass fed steak?

Organic means no antibiotics or whatever. I like my meat efficient, not "organic". It litterally adds no value, same with "organic" crops. They take more land and cause wasted labour. Also, evolved plant cant be organic for whatever reason.

I honestly cant agree with this
I would accept using them in regards to where ever possible as long as they have no negative effect on the natural environment, but i doubt we would be able to farm enough biodeasal crops to power our entire society
Also you also have to take into account the amount of crops necessary for food as well, as now they're on competing levels
Personally i would wait for fusion or a better alternative of nulcear power
Because lets face it, Nuclear power is more efficient than any other method we have,

This is starting to feel like that marxist university that /p[ol universally despises

In what method? are we talking about genetically engineering humans while they're alive or just targeting the egg via IVF treatment?
One of those is illegal because there would be a major clusterfuck if someone stuffed uppersonally i'm for both as soon as we can make it safe

But on all seriousness, massive immigration might have a negative effect on our food supply, considering the amount of biofuel we will also need to grow

Honestly i'm all for genetic Counseling, it allows people to determine if their children will have genetic diseases as well offer an IVF way of treating them legally
If we made it mandatory we could remove more than 90% of all genetic diseases in our countries generation
But I'm unsure of what genetic Cultivation actually means and i hope it isnt some retarded gattica shit that shit costs us a fuck ton of popularity in the transhumanism polls

Not foreboding at all user

It will be cheaper in australia when/If the housing bubble pops, like quite literally we could easily buy land and housing, also its shouldn't be too hard getting their, they practically drink people who have degrees and the like
provided this is if the housing bubble does pop

I like what I like.

Not really. The crops presented as "biodiesel crops" are the least efficient to use. This was deliberate propaganda by big oil.

I don't know about a small commune having nukes, not that nuclear isn't cool.

We push it as far as we can get away with.

I think hydroponics can see to the food while the land would be more about cash crops.

Surely we can brand it as a positive thing.

mwahahaha

I was thinking that if we have some environment changing organisms that we can farm, we can try reclaiming swaths of desert for cultivation from global warming via terraforming.

Elaborate on this. Because if we're gonna have a vanguard, I'm out.
Also, how do we enforce mandatory genetic cultivation? What if some people don't want to have their genetics changed?

Not a vanguard. Elected jobs and responsibilities, but not resource control if that makes sense..

As to the genetics thing, it's a volunteerist thing required for full voting rights.

Wind power kills tons of birds. Unless you are talking small rooftop generators with mesh covers. Solar is not very efficient, solar-thermal work better in the right locations.

Your step 4 is Eugenics. Creating fame of some residents would be quicker.

Not totally sure but I think you can only live on a native reservation if you are native blooded yourself.

Both of those are doable. We aren't talking huge wind farms here.

No, it's transhumanism.

I am. If you're not, a quick injection of a retrovirus can fix that.

Eugenic with a fancy name if it is about babies. Transhumanism is ideally when people pick their own traits. Which is theoretically possible to alter genes of an adult but not likely.

Pretty sure the point is lineage not just genes alone. To do that you would have to do it unknown to the people who decide who gets in.

Lolwut. We have 3 methods to do it currently, the first one we discover may cause cancer but the other two new ones do not.

It's all on the up and up. Everyone coming there is theoretically a transhumanist.

Are nonwhites allowed in this commune?

Of course. We'll preserve differences in skin color, variety is necessary.

You don't think they're ugly?

...

But you already confirmed you have to be native american to even get in a reservation. I forgot the percentage but it is like 25% or something. So that means everyone would have to be ethnically mixed.

Right. But that's trivial to arrange in terms of what it does to biodiversity. It can be controlled for.

Am i racist if i dont find this attractive?

No.
The eyebrows kill any hope of her giving me a boner.

They're a mans eyebrows and her eyes are slitted unless thats an effect of the mascara she has on, which i thought was supposed to make them "appear" larger

Coal power kills the environment
birds

Also make that damn mailing list.

can you elaborate on this?
I thought Green house gases would increase the growth rate of trees and plants which would be fundamentally advantageous for our biodiesel society?

There is a thin line where this is most efficient, its somewhere between the coast and central australia, Rather the dust storms can spread over such large distances that solar power plants can be blocked rather easily, also the water needed to clean them off is absurdly expensive. Too close to the coast and it rains too much

Theres a reason they hate it user, If we completely disregard it because of any prejudice they may have without taking into account the facts, we're no better than them

actually he has a point, we can easily attain some transformer plants which can in turn the make our environment better suited for crops, but this can take decades also quarantine australia will rape us if they find out

you're completely wrong, half the year queensland is flooding, the other half is on fire
Victoria on the other hand only floods once every 4 years, and only really badly once every 16 or 32 years, otherwise it is also on fire
Australia is one of thew largest crop producers in the world, its rather easy due to the great swathes of land available, unfortunately water is expensive

Increased co2 in the atmosphere increases acidity of the ocean which kills the algea that make the bulk the the worlds oxygen, as well as melting the permafrost in the arctic which releases methane, which then in turn increases temprature by re-absorbing the infrared radiation the earth gives off back into the atmosphere, which further causes climate change in negative ways such as droughts and such.

How so? I don't see how building educational facilities with our own ideology is a bad thing.

Aw shite. No way to easily fix that eh?

Also whats this some kind of "environmental" group hell bend on trying to preserve lifeless desert?

The increased acidity is only very minor and at the rate it goes the algae can easily adapt, for example if we shoved algae of today 400 years into the future they might incur a high fatality

The permafrost of today is higher than it was a few thousand years ago, so i rather doubt that the increased temp will have any significant impact on it

worse, their a government funded security group with the sole purpose of keeping outside animals and plants from entering, if we wanted these transformers we'd have to get through them
And even then the quarantine act legally prevents them from being distributed under penalty of law

Its rather foolish and not really "transhumany", Ideological facilities are well known for stunting mental growth except across areas where the ideology takes place, it completely prevents new ideas that may be helpful for the society because they're in some parts related to alternative ideologies
They prevent social change which is extremely anti-transhuman provided the society is already at the level of ideology being produced in the school

Sounds good.

t. 4/pol/

Sure does. Also does global warming which may be more of an issue locally depending where you set up, and will be more an issue globally.

We have technocommie but do we have commie techno?

Just remember, no capitalists or nazis.

yes

youtube.com/watch?v=1PXCM3e-SMk

Why does it even have to be in a reserve? Why can't you just go to an area with various businesses and real estate already there then buy them out one by one converting them into co-ops? Yes, I also mean the housing as co-ops too so you can have control over who comes in.

Thats what they/we were planning with Detroit.

Not that any of this is going to get off the ground, but its fun to think about.

I wasn't around during discussion of this so why Detroit? Aside from the possibility of improving it.

I think a commune should have a food sharing program like this to help reduce food waste.
npr.org/sections/thesalt/2014/06/27/321691095/got-leftovers-to-share-in-germany-theres-a-website-for-that

Everything was cheap as fuck. You could buy an old warehouse for less than 10 grand.

You seem to have a popsci-tier understanding of genetics, fam

Ok i swear to god I turned off the shitposting flag, I didn't mean it that way lmao

Feels like the 90's.

It'd cost a mint to start up.

I'm a biochem/genetics major fam. You'd be amazed at what we can actually do but aren't allowed to do, at least publicly to humans, by the government.

Individually, yes. However if you start with building a co-op from scratch that is successful enough to raise money. You take that money and you try to get the people who actually work in small businesses to put money in to buying their own freedom and it becomes more doable. Each co-op creates it's own money and is a part of a larger co-op to pick up the slack of the more failing businesses within the co-op which can be retooled if they are unsavable.

Some of the tools and general way of doing things is outlined at link below.

opensourceecology.org

From the latest news, they have developed a tracked tractor (which needs further development from the proof of concept prototype). They are doing great work on aquaponic systems that are not that open, aside from energy and some water, but there is major closed circuit.

They have also been doing recently a campaign on compressed earth brick buildings, made from compressed soil on the building site.

Of course the soil for bricks has to be bottom soil, ideally with some cement stabilization so it does not break down.

To conclude, their overall method is good, but they need man-work-hours, and a lot of those.

Of course they are apolitical, yet they see the wrongs of the current socio-economic system. But them being apolitical is more of self defense mechanism, so they don't get extinguished.

Porky likes to hear the sustainability and green technology. Porky does not like to hear that they will be slaughtered and turned into various delicacies, such as sausages.

Well, take depression for instance as a major issue that adversely impacts human quality of life, and one which we should like to solve. SSRIs remain the gold standard thus far and prove at least somewhat useful for most patients nature.com/mp/journal/v21/n4/pdf/mp201553a.pdf
There is increasing evidence of the NMDA receptor's role in the condition, especially among "treatment resistant" individuals.
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4416968/
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3816696/
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24410564
as well as the K-opioid receptor:
nature.com/npp/journal/v36/n1/full/npp2010137a.html
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25538632
Much as we have a wealth of mechanistic and clinical evidence, a unified pathophysiology of depression remains quite elusive
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3181668/
ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2950973/
Indeed, "treatment-resistant" is something of an industry euphemism for "depression we do not yet understand the molecular basis of."
You may very well object to the presentation of depression as a single condition, rather than an ad-hoc, heuristic label for a suite of co-occurring symptoms. This is quite valid. But this is the rule, and not the exception, for psychological diagnoses. And these (intelligence, creativity, sociability, attractiveness) are the matters your sort of human enhancement is ultimately if not principally concerned with.
Indeed, intelligence has a high degree of heritability, and an environment-independent molecular basis (I assume you've read the Bell Curve.) The efficacy of human intervention is practically limited by the extent to which we understand these attributes molecularly. The lack of substantial support for most nootropics (i.e. "smart drugs") beyond a very narrow set of aspects of cognition is a testament to just such limited knowledge.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nootropic#Drugs
sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-pied-piper-of-nootropics/
The lack of mechanistic knowledge of the action of several evidence-supported nootropics illustrates this point further.

Of course I concede that effectiveness of chemical interventions is an imperfect barometer for understanding of a disease. The first rationally designed statins had serious problems with oral bioavailability for instance, and drug design must concern itself with pharmacodynamics every bit as much as affinity for and action at the target.

My forays into molecular biology have been mostly ancillary to synthesis tbh (recombinant microbes for enzymatic catalysis and the like) so feel free to post papers that inform and support your proposals. I may not be up on the same literature.

This is the part when I remember that Socialists were Luddites initially.

Would you mind explaining what exactly you can actually do?

Ah. It's you without the flag. Apologies.

We can just go underground like they do in the hottest parts of aus; change the commune to 'plan dwarf'

...

Elves can live underground too.

Are you tanshumanist poster?
I am not kneedeep into genetics, but you seem to know your shit.

Nope.
I'm concerned that the transhumanist vision is a little aspirational. I'm a chemist, not a molecular biologist, but I want to put some focus on the scientific, as well as policy, aspects here.
Being as historical materialism and Marxism are fundamentally scientific positions, we should rely on and exploit science to the greatest extent possible.This necessarily requires we appraise it properly at this moment and form rigorous predictions about its potential in the immediate future.

Most definately.

If you guys need a programmer, give me a call.

If you knew how to grow weed, you knew that composted super soil is easiest.

That's still inordinately expensive because you have to buy out those other businesses, which come with a heavy upfront price tag.

I propose that we focus on the conditions that we can eliminate or fix (if we consider lack of intelligence to be a condition) and let science catch up with other needs. We can't have utopia in a generation, but we can make progress.

That said, I may need to pursue an MD/PhD if I really want to make this work long-term, but we're going to need more research obviously.

It's likely to be tricky, but I don't foresee bioavailability having as much of an effect on our efforts as you would think: we're essentially tweaking the nervous system and endocrine system directly instead of trying to hack it through the introduction of molecules.

Biochem/chem has the weakness that we're looking at functionality and proteins/macromolecules, but the solutions that we're dealing with in transhumanism are genetic in nature. If we have active genes scripted for what we're looking at fixing, then the bioavailability of engineered products are going to be in line with our baseline for homeostasis.

I think that we're breaking new ground in that sense, but we're also bypassing a major problem with straight chemical solutions by doing rewrites.

You can rewrite the DNA of a living human being who has already been born with something called a retrovirus. The initial problem that we had with this is that the DNA would sometimes insert incorrectly or fail to "re-seal" together properly, resulting in it causing cancer. We have since fixed that problem, meaning that it is possible to rewrite a living person's genome and presumably watch it have effects on them over time.

Let me illustrate what I mean though.

Let's say that a person has defective osteoclasts: they don't break down the bony matrix in order to increase the bio-availability of calcium because they have defective receptors due to a transcription error back during development. Now, this means that the body's musculature lacks the level of calcium needed at receptor sites in order to fire off a nervous impulse because of a lack of availability of calcium. Not only is this debilitating to a person's ability to move around if they have a low calcium diet, but it's dangerous to a person's heart and other involuntary/smooth muscles.

So the biochem route would be to introduce a drug that triggers the osteoclasts receptors or induces the breakdown of bone independently of osteoclasts. However that doesn't really fix the problem long-term, so what we would do using genetics would be introducing a virus into the body that would be targeting osteoclast cells. It would rewrite the defective genes of those cells that were mistranscribed, hopefully restoring functionality to the osteoclasts in the form of correct scripts to be translated then processed into receptor proteins that are not flawed.

Does that make sense?

Bump

If I set up a mailing list and encrypt it, then can I get a headcount of who might be interested so I know if it's worth it?

You lost me at osteoclasts, but I'm familiar with the general idea. Whatever in body is replaced faster, will be affected earlier. On the other hand, stuff like bone formation will be affected last and it may take months, if not years to become noticeable.

My questions are of a more practical nature:
1) What equipment should laboratory have to be able to handle retrovirus creation? I.e. how many such laboratories are out there? Dozens or thousands?
2) What ways retrovirus should be introduced (yep, bioweapons)?

It doesn't matter that the charges would never stick because we're not making bioweapons, they'd still drag us through the mud publicly and brand us as violent extremists.

Fuck you feds.

nyezzz

I'm interested

Sure
Also, not sure what an encrypted mailing list is, can I just use my dummy gmail?

Bump