The Misean calculation problem is a joke, right? It liteally depends on the socialism is totalitarian meme. Also...

>mises.org/library/end-socialism-and-calculation-debate-revisited

The Misean calculation problem is a joke, right? It liteally depends on the socialism is totalitarian meme. Also, for anarchists, it's completley irrelevant.

Any theory autists care to give the problem the quick one-two?

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The ironic failing of this criticism is that socialism does reward work by allowing workers direct control over the products of their labor. It is ironic, because capitalism singularly fails to reward work.

Let's be honest, any lolbert "critique" of socialism is a strawman of big gubbbermint that actually applies to capitalism.

This. Giving them any attention is just validating their completely shallow or outright misleading interpretations of socialist theory.

Not really.


Not at all, in fact it's worse for them. The Austrians were at least correct to point out the difficulties of a decentralized socialism. How exactly is the commune of New York supposed to understand the needs of Seattle, LA, and a few thousand other economic districts simultaneously? Every single decision it makes would have to take into account every other decision of the rest and the other agents would all have to do the same, pure nonsense. The USSR under Khrushchev scrapped the industrial ministries in favor of 104 regional planning districts but in practice this was unworkable and the economy remained centrally directed. You could conceivably divide a country like the US up into several different planning districts but dozens would be unthinkable.

Don't get me wrong, "socialists" who buy into the ECP deserve to be ridiculed for their pessimism and complete disregard for empirical evidence. But this is all still something to take into account.

good post m8

With the increase in communication technologies - which doesn't appear to be slowing any time soon - I don't think decentralization is necessarily a problem in itself.

IIRC, one solution to the issue of the supposed calculation problem is stupid simple: produce a sufficient surplus to act as a "buffer" for expected deviations in the amount of goods society needs.

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Computers, fam.

Market socialism is no permanent solution, it will slowly slide back into capitalism, or economic conditions very similar to capitalism.

I can't read any further, this is some youtube cringe level of ignorance

So will any other failed system. Market socialism is equally capable of transitioning to democratic planning.

Austrian economics redefine everything to suit its special snowflake reasoning.

In comparison, Marx's concept of capital is still relevant to day.

Technology is more than advanced enough for this. In another decade it will be so ubiquitous that there will be no short supply of spare devices to work with, ensuring constant uptime.

Not to mention they hate empiricism and just assume things, go look up praxeology. ( en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Praxeology )

why? if you ban private property, then how can it?

Markets will lead to unequal development and capital accumulation.

I would say that progress has been dead for twenty years. The only thing that is improving is miniaturization. A smart phone is just an old computer shrunk down and packed with tracking devices. There is absolutely no form of communication now that was not available in the late nineties.

I want arguing against market socialism as a transitional state, just as some sort of permanent solution.

lol

No form of communication, sure, but what's being communicated haws changed massively. You can automate large amounts of data gathering and parsing that were previously only possible through personnel working on the problems. I can have a computer track what people need and are purchasing worldwide without me having to input shit. That wasn't possible 20 years ago.

Even if we assume that socialism = centralized/planned/comand economy, the calculation problem still fails. It falls apart once you take into consideration we now have advanced technology that allows us to actually gather information very easily and properly plan things.

The transportation service "Uber" is an example of a centralized economy. It does not work by consumers spontaneously making market transactions with suppliers; rather, data on the needs of the people and the resources available are gathered and centralized by Uber, which then commands what is the best plan of action. Through the phone app, this information is able to command individuals what is the most efficient way to distribute this service.

Sounds like a very efficient phone app. Wouldn't it be cool if our entire economy was designed like this? pro tip: if it were, it wouldn't look very much like a market economy anymore, assuming the workers are in control.