So guys, I've been wondering if your country is such a "fascist regime" for you and you clearly are for anarchism or communism. Why not leave the country? I mean you hate it and obviously you do not see it as your own?
There are a lot of nations where the only rules are made by those with firepower and more men. Look at Liberia or Congo for example. Self proclaimed warlords, who hold reign over small pieces of the land only with men loyal to them?
If you were able to beat him and his private army you would "rightfully" take his place as the new leader. Nobody would bat an eye for him or for you should you fail.
So why not go there? You would have something close to anarchism, there are even a lot of places which are not under the rule of a warlord, where you can do whatever you want whenever you want.
Same goes with communism, there is china, there is cuba. Why not go there? Your salary wouldn't be the biggest but you will indeed work together as a true proletarian. So why not go there?
Its just a question I've always wondered. Since most people here in europe or in america are not interested in these concepts and it probably will never succeed in these countries? Why not just leave it? I mean you hate it, you want something different and you even got other countries who offer just that.
Those foreign countries that "the only rules are made by those with firepower and more men" are just expies of larger powers, and regimes are created and toppled pretty much daily at the behest of those powers. They don't exist in a vacuum.
You can't just leave and do your own socialism thing. Capitalists will stomp you out no matter how hard you hide.
But also because But most of all
You are using a bunch of words you don't understand and drowning in ideology.
Jose Allen
In countless south american and african countries people took down the "madmen with guns" and did create better governments. Then the US funded "rebels", sent assassins and bombed the shit out of all of them until it was a man with a gun again.
Why would this not repeat itself?
Austin Kelly
Because this is my home.
I want socialism for my country, for everyone, not just for me.
Tyler Jenkins
No I'm quite sure Liberia lost all support when they refused to help the USA with their military, so besides a handful of corporations nobody takes that much interest in it, so you would be safe from capitalism. Or atleast mostly.
I mean of course "officially" speaking liberia and the congo have both their own state which rules over the country but they barely get any recognition in it. So it would be the closest that you can get to anarchism.
Well and dictators? As I know it in liberia its more, first to conquer most of the land gets to keep it. There are almost no influences of other nations.
Well and I guess China and Cuba would be the closest to communism. I mean there are probably only few alternatives.
I mean what would be the perfect communist state? Or perfect anarchy? Alone the thought of it would be impossible. Besides you see for yourself that people at the moment slowly move to the right, rather than further left at the moment.
Look at brexit and the votes in Austria or Poland and so on. So I doubt you will have a communist state anytime soon in the western world.
I don't really believe that, its true that the west fiddles around in all kinds of affairs but so much only to distort the country? Seems like a waste of time.
Well you see but that would mean that you didn't really embraced whatever kind of leftist political view you have.
There should be no "borders," for you. No "home," planet earth should be your "home," since everybody is welcome and no matter where you are it should atleast, be all the same.
Connor Phillips
That can be said for fucking anything?
Don't like wide-spread and unlimited immigration? Go somewhere else! Don't like the EU? Leave britain!
This logic leads us to the conclusion that we ought not change anything we don't like ever.
Blake Hall
I don't know, cheap natural resources or making sure you have market domination is pretty neat.
Nicholas Cox
Then you misunderstood leftism. Leftism is all about localism, about community ownership and control. Of course I have close personal connection to the people around me and the place I live.
The nation state is only one version of a community. We are not against communities in general. We are for socialist communities.
Leo Martinez
Actually, it's not a community at all I would say. It's the idea that we owe a certain state loyalty because we speak the same lanuage as those who run it.
Daniel Lopez
But you already have more or less exactly that what you want in these countries. Why waste your time here? That and you see for yourself that your ideology barely gets recognised in the west as of today.
I think we can safely say that africans really are not the brightest on earth and that without outside help they won't get one drop of oil out of their ground.
So we would be safe even if we wouldn't do something like that, over and over and over.
But you let everyone in, no matter who so you can't really call it a community in itself? I mean after all its constantly changing, with no limit in sight. Just like the worlds population. Why even call it a state? There is nothing you want to keep for yourself.
Well and again you got people around you, maybe you all want that communist, or anarchist lifestyle. Well there you have liberia or cuba or whatever, just move out together. No need to "fight for whats right" when people barely show interest in the current country where you live.
Blake Miller
No. We really really don't. We're not liberals. Liberals are our oldest enemies. We don't have what we want at all. If we did, why would we want to change things?
Diamonds more so than oil is the focus in Africa. And those become expensive if social order is established. You think big business want that?
Who said anything about letting anyone and everyone in?
I am pretty sure "arguemntum ad populum" can be used against right-wingers as well. Why oppose gay rights when most support it? Just move to Saudi Arabia? Don't want high taxes? Liberia it is for you! Want to privatize the NHS? You get a ticket to Honduras, buddy! Want to leave the EU? Well, Mongolia is not a member of the EU, why don't you just go there? Don't like liberalism? Uganda seems fine with that!
So why don't you fuck off and make your white utopia, perhaps in the middle of Africa? :^)
Jonathan Turner
You can't actually be this stupid.
Brandon White
Why so hostile all of the sudden?
With "these countries" I mean liberia and so forth. You don't have a central power there that controls anything. Its basically free for all, no liberals nothing.
Well same goes for diamonds, have you seen how they harvest those diamonds today? No modern techniques of actually digging into the stonemass, to try to reach those diamonds and then trying to actually mine those diamonds. No, they do it old western style. They hope some just wash up on rivers and catch them. They actually kill people for this! Despite not using proper, modern techniques of actually getting the diamonds!
Well you're not a true leftist, communist country if you don't let everyone in, or not?
Well you see if I were a nationalist I actually have things I want to protect and keep for myself and my "people." You simply don't have that. It would make sense if a nationalist fights for his country, because he even has a reasonable number of people backing him up! Trying to keep to the old ways in a more modern way so to speak.
But in your case it really doesn't matter, since for you nations are just "burdens," oppressive systems of "bigoted people" so to speak. You might as well go somewhere where your ideology actually thrives.
Most cultures mean nothing to you, borders mean nothing, religion means nothing for you and so on.
That and if you look at Rhodesia, or that one dutch city in southafrica, both were great at the time of the apartheid. Only after that it became what it is today. A third world shithole.
Gavin Gonzalez
I'm applying your logic to the right. If that is hostility, you initiated it.
That's anomie, not anarchism.
Yes. So? How does the lack of social cohersion that thus enables slave labour and thus cheap diamonds fall within the interests of people who want to be able to buy cheap diamonds?
Immigration has nothing to do with communism or socialism. You can be communists and let everyone in or be communists and not let people in.
Expect that you're constantly triggered that things are not as they once were and thus you seek to change things. And thus as you want to change things, you must leave.
Nation-states aren't communities. Why do I owe loyalty to a master just because he speaks the same language as me? No, I would rather have direct democracy in the local community so we can live with and control ourselves with the ones who geniunely share our ethical value and with to rule with us rather than over us. In this sense, the nation-state is against my community, against my culture, against my values and my ethics.
Its not like they try to actually establish a working economy with a effective infrastructure. They rather prefer it to enslave themselves and fight those petty wars. Why not take profit from it? I mean we get it on a silver plate, not from any white dude swinging a whip but from black people. They offer it and its not my fault they are corrupt as hell. They are the ones that give most of that money that they get from this trade to their ministers and generals.
Well guess what? Keeping the state closed is a rightwing policy, you put the lifes of your people over those immigrants in that case. Doesn't this make you look like an hypocrite?
Hey, I'm not saying that nationalists are against all changes! I'm saying they try to keep certain things of their culture, state or whatever alive. Completely replacing that is just a too drastic change, to be really considered.
Why do I owe loyalty to a master just because he speaks the same language as me? No, I would rather have direct democracy in the local community so we can live with and control ourselves with the ones who geniunely share our ethical value and with to rule with us rather than over us. In this sense, the nation-state is against my community, against my culture, against my values and my ethics.
Depends how far you let that state you're living in go? I mean I'd say its pretty sweet to have services like police, the fire department, hospitals and so on that are there for you all around the clock. You pay the state so that those services work correctly. That and I mean we do have system placed in your local community too. After all every tiny city has atleast a mayor.
But then I have to enslave all africans again. :(
Nathaniel Parker
They are not communist though, there is no such thing as a "communist country".
Wyatt Long
Well true but its the only way to go at this time.
Logan Diaz
lol whut
Justin Harris
Living conditions are better here than over there. Why the fuck would i leave?
Colton Brown
Yea sorry but any better idea to live out a "communist lifestyle?"
I mean many muslims say the sharia government in saudi arabia is not a real sharia. But if somebody would ask me, I'd probably say the best state to live in with sharia law in place would be saudi arabia.
Ayden Walker
lol ok
1. I don't care about the "communist lifestyle" whatever that means.
2. Im not muslim
Jacob Jones
And that coming from a communist! I'm so fucking disappointed in you right now, user.
Hudson Smith
lel im sorry comrade. People act in their own self interests under capitalism.
Benjamin Green
Cuba does seem pretty chill though tbh
Connor Carter
No. Organization of direct democracies in federations in not the same as a total power-vacuum.
No. I want autonomy for the local communities. If that means they don't give a carte-blance to anyone, I'm fine with that. That is in no way hipocrisy.
Yeah but also you seek to get rid of "degeneracy" which is a part of culture now. If you're so unsatisfied with feminists why don't you go to Saudi Arabia?
Again, none of those have to be managed by a top-down state. Those are perfectly compatible with direct democracy and therefore don't inherently have anything to do with states, in spite of the fact they're managed by states right now.
Ayden Gutierrez
Well than I guess we have a misunderstanding what anarchy means. I mean an "organization of direct democracies" would end up in a capitalist democracy and a total power-vacuum would mean that there will be anarchy somewhere, since no one is really in charge.
Wouldn't that make you technically more rightwing? I mean if you really have that autonomy for every local community you would have something like a loose connection between them. That said you support your own city, town or village or whatever but you don't care what happens beyond that. Something like all those citystates in germany?
As I said before if I were a nationalist, I would have reasons to fight to keep my country the way it was, or disable certain things.
In your case however, as you said you don't need a master that happens to speak the same language like you do, there is nothing to hold you where you currently are.
I mean wouldn't that just create more problems and tensions inbetween those "local communities" of yours?
Imagine two different cities both call for the fire department but they simply can't reach the other one in time, so they only take care of one city. There literally would be almost nothing to stop that one city that was left alone to cut all connections to the one city that was saved. Or worse.
With a top-down state you could organize everything better, people are forced to work together for good.
Luis Cox
Why would it? The second tyrants arise, other direct democracies that are members of the same federation would crack down on it if they have any idea what they're doing. Why would anti-democracy - capitalism - be able to arise within democracy?
The right/left dichotomy is utter trash, it's useless. As I said, I support autonomy for the local communities. As long as autonomy is presevered for both the community and the individual is preserved, I do not care what other policies these people seek to persue.
And thus change it from how it is. Meaning that you would have to go to Saudi Arabia or be a hipocrite.
Take that same example you just used. To cities are burning. You can only save one fully. How would a top-down system be any better? What about the city that is forced to burn to the ground? How do they benefit from the top-down state?
Rather, they should come to a consensus they would both benefit and suffer from in a mutalist relationship.
I'm not interested in living in the town that gets shafted by the state anyways.
Jose Myers
Because I love the country and not the state you silly faggot.
Because none of those are communist you retard.
Because I don't live under facism you used fuckpuppet.
Why don't you waddle on back to the adult learning center and let your handlers know you shit your pants for the umpteenth time?
Go be a fucking ponce somewhere else. Rude sage.
Lucas Lopez
Well technically one leads to another or not?
Yes that is precisely communism what we're talking about here in this thread.
No you don't. I'm only saying that what you want can be found somewhere else and I mean it doesn't really looks like any european country is going to go full on communism any time soon. Well or the USA for that matter.
Besides if I'm so wrong about communism, then go ahead enlighten me!
Why so hostile? I just asked a simple question? I mean you do have exactly that what you want, just somewhere else. What's so bad on pointing that out?
I'm just asking people, why struggle so much against the state you're currently in when you can have that what you want way easier.
