Does anyone else feel like Marvel never got the mutant thing correct...

Does anyone else feel like Marvel never got the mutant thing correct? Like for example Earth 616 I never understood all the hate mutants got when actual other heroes were around yeah you could say SHIELD and shit but seriously it never made fucking sense.

Then you got people who make their own universes of what ifs and mostly its the mutant hate thing taken up to 40k levels of PURGE THE MUTANTS. And while there exists other universes where mutants werent persecuted or genocided they end up taking over humanity and enslaving them since it turns out mutants are dicks aswell.

Is it just easier to write mutant genocide or mutant hate than actually looking into other what ifs of the scenario?

I'll be honest, for years I've treated any X-men story as an entirely separate universe. Sure there's the occasional teamups and crossovers where Wolverine or Cyclops shows up out of place, but I mainly agree with you. For a very long time, the driving force behind all happenings to the Xmen have been the "mutant prejudice," which doesn't make sense with all the other popular heroes.

I remember the Ultimate universe tried to explain it by saying there was a prejudice against people with the mutant gene, as opposed to people forcibly mutated later in life like Spider-man. It was a shitty explanation, but honestly the best one I've heard so far.

I heard the same "Jew gene" explanation from a Holla Forums in Holla Forums as to why german born jewish individuals deserved to be send to ghettos while german non jew criminals would be send to normal jails.
kek

People have told me that shit like the Avengers or Fantastic 4 werent persecuted since they are still technically allied with the government and shitlike spiderman is easier to explain than Johnny down the street pissing acid. There was an alternate X men comic forgot the name where the government turned agasint ALL super powered humans. but it had shit like insane hulk hating mutants,Iron man being forced into his suit, and General Frank Castle the ultimate mutant killer.

My problem with alot of the self contained Xmen stories is how they go to insane GRIMDARK levels of genocide and death camps of mutants.

Is that the story about everything went to shit, Galactus found dead and floating in the sky, heroes are killed right and left. There's a scene where Jean Grey, half crazed starts whoring herself. I think I remember that comic. People say it's supposed to be funny.

Nah thats Ruins with reporter Stan Lee the comic I was talking about is another one.

I still dont see the jokes

And yet again Holla Forums has to give their retarded opinion.
Do not mix fantasy with real life.

Ellis literally said that entire comic was a joke but it was the usual edgy trash of America going insane and torturing mutants for reasons.

Why do people ever draw comics like that? I fucking hate it.

Because mutant death camps are easier to write I havent kept up with alot of marvel or xmen comics but most alternate universes always go that route. Its mass human genocide of mass mutant gencide.

Trying to have the X-men make sense in the regular marvel universe will never work so people are forced to make this "what if" plots.

Me too. I think Ellis is a bit fucked in the head. Maybe from working in comic book industry way too long.

Were also forgetting all the bullshit endgame plots X-men had


Pretty sure im forgetting others but those are the main 3

Because you can't ride mutant genocide plots forever we gotta think of bigger and badder threats.

Just imagine yourself, not as part of a society, not as part of your race, but just as yourself, and your own goverment tells you have to leave the country or go to a ghetto because your great grandad went hanky spanky with a black slave and turns out you're a 1/4 black and because you're a 1/4 black you worth less as a human than what you did 10 minutes ago.
It's fucking bullshit.

Why did most alternate x men plots go with 40k levels on mutant genocide? Like holy shit I don't even think real life America would go though with a lot of the plots out there

dont humor him you fucker i like this thread

idk, it looks like X-men topic for me.

Max Payne?

The Trace webcomic series shares a lot of similarities to the XMen comics, but things make a tad bit more sense there. The majority of the population are normal humans, then you have the titular Traces (humans that have some mutant ability that they were either born with or developed later in life), and lastly a group of other-dimensional beings referred to as Troubles that attack everything in sight usually.

The public doesn't generally view Traces in high regard because most abuse their abilities, although the government does provide some opportunities for employment; however there's a lot of shady shit that goes on behind closed doors.

Trace 2.0 is pretty much what you'd get if Iron Man was a mutant police officer.

The art's a bit odd, and the backgrounds look like they were made in Google SketchUp, but it does improve over time.

To be fair with Spiderman he got shit on a lot because of J Jonah Jameson. Personally, I thought you could explain mutant hatred by the fact they can be one of you and fuck things up with their powers. While with guys like Captain America or Spiderman guys like them don't come into existence as often.

No. Get out of here.

Dunno OP. Ask Neanderthals how not wiped out of existence they are. Prejudices exist, I just believe thst Marvel wrote mutants into a hole by not explaining why humans hate mutants w/o a reason. Niggers at least have dindunuffin as a reason to dislike niggers. There is no superiority complex of humans over mutants but Marvel just got too fucking lazy to at least give a good reason and expects the audience to fill the hole.

What was the comic where the X-men beat up a old man in a wheelchair?

its because in the end we need conflict otherwise the ornery elements of society take it out on the weaker. its either you have two sides battling or one side dominating the other with rebellion at hand. plus its comics it be boring any other way

If they really want conflict it will be better if the anti group is not just for mutant but for all supers.

The only way to make X-men work and make sense is to have them in their own separate universe already. But Marvel's too stupid and scared to realize that. The japs got it right but Marvel doesn't. Want to have super powered individuals that are hated by mankind? PUT THEM IN THEIR OWN UNIVERSE WITHOUT OTHER SUPERS THAT AREN'T BORN WITH POWERS!

Another problem was that kinda happens but it's against heroes who are not big like Spider man getting confused for a mutant.

Even in regular X-men universes it still happens just all this random genocide the mutie bullshit.

Like others have said I am pretty sure there is no Alternate X-Men story like that jap book I think your talking about they either go full kill mode no actual thought put in.

Face it, writers they have for X-men are all hacks who never learn or do anything new. They just use the same edgy cliches over and over and over. When it's a self aware story that doesn't go full mutie genocide, it's usually ignored. The only two instances I've found of that is the story with the ginger kid and the one based on the 90's X-men cartoon.

Mutants were originally created just to have an easy out for where they got their powers from.

Then people thought they could use the fact that they were 'different' as a way to preach social equality.

And then, and then, and then, and then…

They never stopped to look at things from a logical in universe point instead of a narrative point of view and are trapped in a jail of their own design.

Mutants would make a more powerful metaphor if you simply focused on why they were feared and hated. If some random asshole gets powers, they can be a genuinely terrible person with them. Why have they never made a point that the most exposure the wider population gets of mutants is "Mutant gets powers, procedes to torture and kill those he didn't like" every few days? Go into how shitty some mutants feel knowing that people are, in fact, right to fear them with what is shown to the wider public at large.


The biggest reason why mutants as an oppressed group doesn't work is because the writers are not willing to take an honest look at what they would be as a group that is 'hated and feared' because it would require admitting that they aren't perfect. Which would be an amazing story with rich complex characters and not just virtue signalling tripe.

They establish that mutants are hated by society somewhere in literally the first 10 comics of the X-men. They establish it when Bobby is still a snowman for christ's sakes

Yes, first thing… then the next thing.

What was unclear about that?

The point is how quickly they decided to do that.
Complaining about how X-men are used to represent prejudice is like complaining that Batman doesn't use guns because "That's not how he started out." The argument is shit because they were still deciding on the characterization at that point in time.

The point of the statement was to establish the logical flow that the writing staff has been following.

Mutation is an excuse for powers.
Mutants are an oppressed group.

Followed by decades of story writing that continue that line of reasoning without the basic logical premise established. Which should read.

Mutation is a reason for powers.
Some emotional teens with powers abuse them and hurt people.
Because people see mutants hurting people, they fear and hate mutants.
Therefore mutants are an oppressed group.


I was attempting to explain that the reason why X-men stories seem crazier and crazier is, really, because they are becoming increasingly unwilling to admit there is a legitimate reason why mutants are oppressed.

I would go so far as to say that the subtext of that logic even used to exist in the early work, but has become completely lost as time has gone on. X-men fought Magneto, another mutant, who wanted to hurt people because hurting people is wrong and humanity at large is never going to trust mutants if they keep getting killed by them.


Now there is no subtext, just #mutielivesmatter and attempting to tack the characters onto a very biased view of society with no self awareness.

Funny now they are going to get wiped out by the Inhumans.

Genocide is only genocide when it doesn't align with profits.

Always found it annoying that more mutants don't just bullshit about their powers being from other sources like Terragin mist exposure/government super science/radiation. How would the general public even know the difference without grabbing someone who claims the aren't a mutant and then performing a DNA test on them to determine if they even have the mutant gene.

Imagine a scenario like this

I could understand the "normal people" mutant hate, if mutants were visually hideous monstrous beings who lacked control of their powers instead of the vast majority of X-men who can basically blend in with normal society (like Jean Grey/Shadowcat/Magneto/etc) without any problem.

You want to get even crazier?

Think about a kid who, after an accident, gets a blood transfusion from his best friend.

During his physical therapy, the kid who got the blood transfusion activates the X-gene in the blood and gets mutant powers, despite not being a mutant.

His friend? Well he's got an amazingly clam demeanor and he never triggers the mutation.

So you would have a situation where the not-mutant was the mutant and the mutant was the not-mutant.

Also there's mutants that is part of Fantastic 4 and Avengers and people don't give a shit. Pietro and Wanda only got a small demonstration, got scolded by Captain America and they never picketing Avenger mansion again. Hell, they even hate Hawkeye more because he used to be a small time criminal before joining the Avengers.

If mutants were real I'd estimate that democracy, or at least non-mutant elected or even non elected officials would exist, since technological and political progression probably would have been halted due to feudal mutant kings and duchies preventing non-muties from creating advanced weaponry like projectile weapons that would threaten the mutants. I also bet that if superpowered muties existed before the modern era, there wouldn't be a lot of people who didn't possess at least one power, due the to selection towards the advantages of mutant powers.

Basically, mutie superpowers directly would correlate with higher social, sexual, and political status. Muties would have harems of women or men and the will of anyone sane enough to bend their knee to them,.

*would not exist

So kind of what they were going for in season 1 of LOK?

Still want the MCU to get all the licenses?

I'd rather Marvel just stop existing or get bought out by anyone other than Disney.

Do mutants even count as a different species? Magneto impregnated a human woman and she had his child.
Species - a group of living organisms consisting of similar individuals capable of exchanging genes or interbreeding.

Well they can breed if they are apart of the same genus. Look at tigers and lions they can mate. Hell humans had sex with neanderthals in ancient times.

It's a Stan Lee thing to have at least one character who irrationally hates the hero for no reason. Spider-Man has J. Jonah Jameson, Bruce Banner has Thunderbolt Ross, and the X-Men have all of humanity. The enemy with no motivation is a Lee trope, a bit like Walter Peck from Ghostbusters.
There's an old Lee-Kirby story where Hank McCoy, who still looked human at that point, saves a boy stuck on top of a water tank, and in the time it takes him to climb the building the crowd turns against him and he literally gets a lynch mob chasing him and Iceman for his trouble.
I think Stan Lee just thought people were bastards. He may be right.

So the people in the Marvel universe are just dicks?

Aren't humans afraid of mutants because they're afraid of being replaced by them?

Species - a group of living organisms consisting of similar individuals capable of exchanging genes or interbreeding.

A genus (/ˈdʒiːnəs/, pl. genera) is a taxonomic rank used in the biological classification of living and fossil organisms in biology. In the hierarchy of biological classification, genus comes above species and below family.

literally what the fuck that is a retarded trope.

Its like how heroes battle a villains super Domesday plan and damage a city and people complain and say "we dont need you just leave"

Like NIGGA if the heroes weren't there the city would be destroyed and you be possibly dead.

Its the world around them that doesnt work

Didn't Morrison try to give them an out? It's been forever since I read his run, but didn't his run basically say that since the mutant population had grown it lead to the status of being a mutant start to be coveted by dumb kids? Kind of similar to how retards on tumblr want to be queer/genderfluid/trans/etc. They see it as some kind of trend. That could eventually have lead to the majority of humans accepting mutants on some level, but still allowing for the writers to soapbox about whatever stupid hate group they want.

But Marvel just had to have its special little X-Men as minorities slant.

I always thought the X-Men should be in their own separate universe what with all the different mutant books Marvel has.

Disassociating the X-Men and mutants from the MU is pointless and rather difficult in itself as they're firmly entrenched.


Didn't Grant also tried to rationalize mutantphobia as being caused by sentient bacteria? Not every idea he had was reconcilable with how Marvel likes its X-Men.

Why didn't Beast just climb down behind the building?

...

...

...

who wrote this?

Should that even be a question?
Extremes are easier to include in a story.
It's gray areas that writers always struggle with since at some point they have to look at their own perception and consider what could potentially go horribly wrong with their worldview, and let's be honest, almost nobody wants to question their own opinion.

I just want to point out the shitty artwork disguised with shadows everywhere. Shitty story, shitty artwork, what X-Men is this?

That's pretty much on the money. It'd be somewhat similar to the whole Islam thing. Not exactly, obviously, I only mean that the message of "Mutants are people too, hating them is wrong!" would fall on deaf ears when they keep blowing up their place of work or going on a large scale slaughter because they're pissed off.

When muties keep doing that, and there's no defense against it, just more spilled blood, people get fed up with it. And they'd be right to.

I mean think about it. Sure, there are Supers out there that got their powers because of radioactive bullshit or some nonsense. But come on. Someone like Spidey? He's not a bad guy. He was at least like us once. He wasn't born able to wallclimb and shoot webs. Even when he got his powers, he stayed grounded and he helps people.

But a mutant could be anybody. It could be that guy Steve who donates to charity every once in a while, and helps old ladies across the street. It could be that kid who's dealing with a bit of bullying but is still a good egg. Or it could be the fucking 15 year old psychopath who lights cats on fire in his spare time.

You don't know. There's no way you could know until something happens and/or someone dies. There's nothing but seemingly randomness dictating who gets these powers, and they're everywhere. Sure, supers can be unpredictable but there's a bit more rhyme and reason in how they get them. More than just "lol genetics".

If I had to worry about my jackass neighbor manifesting superpowers one night and mutilating me with them, I'd be fucking terrified. And what can I do about it? I had the misfortune of being born normal. It's not my fault my genes didn't give me eye beams or ice powers or the ability to erase people's minds. I just don't want to fucking die, or see the people I love die because of it.

And these jackasses try to preach and tell me the mutants are the people who are suffering here? I don't appreciate being handed the genetic short end of the stick and living in fear every day of my life because of it.

Looks like they are. Just take a look at the Civil War thread. Despite killing two other capes, crippling another and basically running a horribly incompetent and corrupt thoughtcrime department while acting like an insane child, Carol Danvers is apparently the most beloved heroine in-universe now and is pulling the strings of the MIC with the blessings of the POTUS.

Meanwhile Captain America is pissed off about this in a rational manner, but he's a HYDRA agent.

I think it may have been from a tie in to Civil War were Wolverine looks for Pyro who was responisble for killing all those kids. The art is similar to that story anyway.

I kinda wish mutants had more physical mutations that screwed up their body and not just give them powers.

That is dealt with at least a couple times I think, isn't it? I've seen a few mutants that are just fucked up and don't have any other powers.

That said, there really ought to be more of them.

I know of the Morlocks but I agree with what you said there should be more of them.

Reminder that this comic has more nuance than the entire X-Men canon combined.

Considering thats just one graphic novel while the x men comics are a convoluted mess I guess thats not hard to beat.

It's not a trope when it is reality. Hating someone for no particular reason happens every day. Hell, take a look at politics.

Also, there is motivation behind what people see as irrational hatred. Using the comic as an example, you see everyone crowding the tower talking about the kid stuck on top of it, but you see NO ONE going up there to help the kid (Or even suggesting it). Beast did, and he broke reality when that happened.

Now, the crowd faced a paradox. Mutants are suppose to be an evil group, but this guy went up there without a second thought to help someone. So, what does that say about them? Does that mean they're even worse than the group they're suppose to hate? No, that cannot be possible. So, therefore, they rationalize that he's doing it under false pretenses. And, that he and his friend DARE to hide their faces makes them even more suspicious, so they must be up to evil.

The "Hatred for no reason" trope my seem half-assed, but that's because no one wants to admit that it happens in reality.

It's because mutants have always been an allegory. That's the problem with allegory, the allegory drives the narrative rather than the internal self consistency of the setting and events and characters driving the plot like in a normal story.

Yes. And Marvel made that fear legitimate when they had the "Extinction gene" storyline which revealed that when mutants become populous enough then humans literally start dying uncontrollably.

They just kinda forgot they did that though.

If they actually did their homework and stuck with that event we can see actual interesting storyline where more and more mutants appeared and more and more people fell victim to mutants with ill intention. Actual conflict from actual cause.

But nooooo, they are so deep inside the "Minority" card they literally had to kill most of the mutants by using that stupid "No more Mutants" spell.

Seriously, if Scarlet Bitch is that strong what stop her from making stuff disappear from the world? Like when she woke up and groggily eat a nutella sandwich only to find out the nutella already went bad so in her sleepy anger she muttered "No more Nutella" and Nutella safe from several bottles in Dr Hank Pym's ass disappeared from the world.

I think a lot of the hate for mutants comes exactly because they're powerful, appear unpredictably and entirely without context, and can't easily be controlled. They're a threat to the status quo to anyone in power, individuals that can decide the fate of the world just for being born what they are. Makes sense that governments are going to fan the flames of prejudice and try to get rid of them all, and/or control them with horribly unethical, desperate experiments.

Of course, it doesn't work as well when you transpose real life prejudice onto them 1:1. That and you'd think at least one country would be all 'Welcome mutants! Come one, come all, we'll give you protection, jobs and the chance to breathe free! Also now we need you to defend and improve your new home!'. Then again, I think Magneto tried to make Mutant-Israel once or twice and it got literally nuked.

To be fair that's what happened when he created a group called Brotherhood of EVIL Mutants, I mean seriously none of them actually question that decision?

Sure the writers dropped the word Evil later on. But it's still pretty funny.

The government doesn't need to fan any flames. Scarlet Witch can rewrite reality itself and I'm supposed to pity her because people aren't super nice to her? She's quite literally capable of forcing people not to hate mutants. She even fucking did it once.
Franklin Richards is omnipotent. Literal omnipotence. And he did not gain this through merit, or through any extraordinary means, but he just happens to be omnipotent because the X-gene is ill-defined and inconsistent. Why should people not hate them? Equality is all fine until one man starts creating universes with his mind.

They don't want that. They want all the benefits of being a mutant with none of the drawbacks. When House of M happened the mutants didn't die or have anything particularly terrible happen, they just got turned into regular people. And they hated it. Cyclops thought it was the worst time of his entire life. Their most dreaded outcome, their worst fear, was to be like the rest of us.
That's what separates mutants from people, and that's why people hate them. Spiderman knows what it's like to be human. Captain America, Tony Stark, all these people are human and know what it's like to be human. Mutants, for some reason, lose their humanity upon developing their powers and forget that it's scary when random people start controlling guys with their mind.

I feel like a lot of people do.

The movies being disconnected from the rest of Marvel's stuff is a blessing in disguise, really.

The Muties are a forced allegory for whatever the writers are chimpingout about (Teenagers/Fags/Jews/Whatever) who don't belong in a universe filled with superniggers.

So they're fags or maybe niggers.

This assumes that every person on the street knows the origin story of every super hero. How would they know that Spiderman isn't a mutant?

I wanted to be a mutant when I was reading the various x books in the late 80s and 90s. I just ended up a wizard shitposting on chan sites though.

Thank you! Ive been wondering the same thing.

If anyone wants to tell me what they think of the following setting idea please tell me.

The year 2022
People with mutations have begun popping up with incresing frequency since 2020 and a scale attributed to the scope of the individual mutations power.

Multiple special interest groups have begun campaigning a reaction from the governments of their respective nations ranging from genocide, soldier programs all the way to registration of super humans. Debates range in regards to the ethics behind said registration and who to register and whether their shluld be surveillance of such individuals and at what level.

(Only gonna cover USA right now)
In the USA california, new york and chicago illinois are ground zero for for extreme anti mutant sentiments do to the justifiable fears of random people being walking weapons deadlier than a firearm which in heavily populated areas could do insane amounts of damage. Especially after the 2021 destruction of san fransisco by a mutant with the ability to control hydrogen and oxygen and anything that those two combined into ( fire water ice ) drowning the city and creating an ice wall on the shore line ro prevent survivirs as well as shooting down helicopters etc with fire. Nobody knows who they are but their have been numerous sightings of him.
Meanwhile other mutants with minor physical abilties (a horn or an extra eye or the ability to change the color of an object) arent discriminated against but still met with some noticable unease.

The bible belt states have seen the most dramatic rise of people with super powers and people their typically either treat their abilties as "miracles" and blessing ftom God.
Though they are still monitored and often the military silently dispatches a member or more of their Dispatchment squad in case one of them takes to using them for evil intents.

Texas' culture has become even more christianized and militaristic due to them being the state with the most mutants (2 % of the population) and have a law trying to be pushed that allows mutants with abilities geared to combat special training from the age of 13 and mandatory enlistment in military school if their ability rates at or near the top of the 1 to 10 power scale.
Their has been outcry from the UN and many parts of the USA but Texas has ignored it.

The northern New England colonies have signed into law surveillance and registration laws save for Ohio and who has neither but has encouraged their mutant population to join the police force.

The former confederate states have a mixed reaction to mutants. On one hand many have mirrored Texas' response along with a registration and surveillance act but on the other hand Georgia has mirrored Californias response and created a non mutant state by forcing through legal and sometimes shady practices a deportation to other states of their mutant populace.

Florida has nearly no mutants and instead have simply focused on developing ways to figure out who is a mutant and proceed to deal with the individual depending on how the individual uses their abilities.

Interwstingly enough their has been correlations found between how individuals with only one races dna have a higher chance to be born with an ability.
This is because the dna that causes the mutation is passed down on the fathers side.
Nations that have had very little interaction with the outside world have the
Highest chance to have mutants causing Iceland, Greenland, Madagascar, and Japan to become pure ethno states with breeding programs


Thats probably how blacks feel tbh

That's actually how it used to be. The X-Men existed originally not to defend mutants from human oppression - that's why Professor X worked so damn hard to build up credibility with the press and government - but to prevent mutant violence on humans because there were so many angry and confused mutants who thought new powers was a new right to be shitty. That was essentially the 1970's.

When people talk about how cool the 80's and 90's X-men are, and they are pretty awesome, they're also talking about the all-new all-different X-men because it's about the third or fourth time the comic got a complete overhaul, and as X-men became more about being awesome and less about storytelling it lost its teeth as a social analog.

Also the 1 to 10 power scale is based not only on how much damage they can do but how much choas they can cause.

So a color changer who can change the color of a traffic light at a distance without contact is rated higher than someone who needs physical contact to change the lights color

I was going to make a post about how shitty the media is because of people compromising stories for the action (And, on occasion, sex, though not as lately), but that seems like a discussion that goes nowhere, and results in nothing solved. So, instead, I'll ask this:

Define even balance

I think a better term would be sweet spot, but the question still applies. Simply put don't have too much action to where the audience feels exhausted after everything is all said and done, however don't have too much story that it bores the audience and nothing seems to progress.

If you want an example, the original "Dune" movie is an example of the former (The only one I can think of), meanwhile "CA: Civil War", "X-Men: A", and a number of other recent stuff have suffered from the latter scenario.

Damn it, reverse the order I listed the examples.

...

I recall there was a book - Earth X, maybe? - in which Beast explained that it was not prejudice, it was perfectly reasonable for regular humans to fear mutants.

Hmm. Good point.

It is dumb.

Humans have hated one another for lesser reasons

What doesn't make sense about that? Did you not hear about the Brit who was stabbed to death in jail by muzzies for putting bacon on a mosque doorhandle?

AS for Jews..
THEIR PUNISHMENT MUST BE MORE SEVERE

Women drivers her kids into a lake because of mental illness.
lock her up and hate her.
Women loses her kids due to babysitter smothering them becuase mental illness.
Feel bad for mother and sad.

It is not dumb.

I remember this guys tumblr. It was the funniest shit.

Best if you stop mentioning either, we wouldn't want to drag more unwanted stuff into the thread.

Ellis is an edgy tryhard who hates superheroes but somehow decided becoming a comic book writer was a good career choice.

t.leftypol

Yep

This is why I love the Boogieman: The comic never pretends there is a reason for his hate makes any sense

Like Chuck Jones said

But it's lazy thinking (and writing) to assume that bigotry comes out of nowhere. Whether you agree with a prejudice or not, they always have comprehensible roots.

I've always found the problem with X-Men in my opinion was that they focused on race (again, it was relevant in the 70's but becomes increasingly strained in modernity) instead of class.

Consider your average x-man: middle or lower upper class, boasting the benefits of a full education - and if they don't have one before the Xavier Institute certainly gives them one - and assuming their mutation like the vast majority is superficial in terms of they can have a human life without letting on at all they're a mutant, largely unaffected by the mutant question. They used to address this with storylines like Angel's dad being a mutant hating shit, but the Worthington family being rich enough to hide the mutantcy, Iceman's estrangement from his family, or Cyclops distance from his brother (picked up right out of the home by wealthy parents while Scott continued to watch and wait for a home to take him in).

But they don't address that idea anymore, and so your average X actually doesn't have any reason to be an oppressed outcast. They aren't the struggling working man, they don't actually speak to the difficulties of the street or the young person. They only talk about such things in the most abstract and high handed concept through the vague idea of mutantcy and so it loses all its narrative power.


The best example of this is the Morlocks: an underground dwelling splinter of mutants so freakish they can't exist in proper society. They were stealing to survive so the X-men step in to stop them, and Storm challenges Callisto for the right to lead the Morlocks, but once she has claimed the title she does exactly dick with it. Storm goes back to her mansion leaving the Morlocks in their tunnels so they can get massacred in the Mutant Massacre until they crop up again in the mid-nineties as more extreme and violent outcasts with Marrow.

Why was anyone surprised it would turn out that way when the X-men don't actually care about helping mutants or the factors that make mutants supposed outcasts? And now not only are mutants all mutant nationalists (Asteroid M, Genosha, Haven, Utopia, etc.) which further isolates them from humanity, but while they're at it they've got people like the White Queen a former member of the Hellfire Club - an association built on the idea mutants are better than other people, especially when they have old money - as part of their impromptu leadership among the various splinter factions of mutants in charge of different warring groups.

Xavier might have been a manipulative dick - as they engage in character assassination now that he's dead - but at least he had a more clear idea for a more beneficial future for mutants than what his students are doing without him.

This is maybe one of the best opinion about current X-men situation. I just want to add that there's a probability that the writers are pushed into a corner and have nothing to go from there. Unlike DC that can reboot their universe willy nilly Marvel decided to hunker down and let the universe go on and on. Back then it was fine since they have sense of continuity and stuff but now it became a very convoluted mess.

You nailed it.

I appreciate how Marvel doesn't do continuity reboots, but I feel like they could really do with ONE.

He has a valid reason to start: Power Pack destroyed the machine that was going to make him rich (not knowing it would destroy the world). That he clings to hating them despite learning why just makes him an interesting enemy. That the writers were able to make a fat middle aged man with no special combat training a realistic threat (who didn't overstay his welcome by being inexplicably death and imprisonment proof) was pretty neat.

You know one thing I wanted to see was how their own nationality or cultural identity clashes with their mutant identity. Or have more than two groups of mutants. I had an idea once of some mutants joining this anarchist dude because his ideas sounded good and were loyal to him and the ideals so they come into conflict with Captain America.

IIRC, that's been levelled against him occasionally.

Oddly enough, JJJ hates Spider-Man but is totally fine with mutants.


The X-Men are a good, probably unintentional analogy for limousine liberals and upper-class minorities who make a big noise about activism but are ultimately ineffectual and often counterproductive to actually making things better for people, mostly because first and foremost they protect their own interests, and live in their sheltered enclaves, interacting with the world only on their terms.

Is there an X men comic that criticizes them for essentially being limousine liberals? I know there's one with that atomic bomb survivor who was pissed when he learned they were good looking well off mutants.

Not that i know of.

As far as I know that one comic is the one that addresses it, and if its the one I'm thinking of the X-men don't even try to give him empathy. No one is like "We're putting you in jail because we're better than you" or "in another world we could have been you, we're sorry, but you still have to go", just white queen (shock of shocks) going "Are you done with your villain rant? Good. We're going to kill you now."

Its like Marvel doesn't get that you can't have a moral or ethical high ground when, to get to your victory, you behave worse than the people you're trying to stop.

Don't let leftypol see that.

They should have the Muties go full Nazi.

Isn't that exactly the Brotherhood's MO?

Probably

Cyclops is also an egotistical faggot. He uses being a mutant in the same way some gay people use being gay or those faggy atheists with the fedora use being an atheist. They let it define them and then if it up and dissapeared one day they would have nothing.

Some people have their ego so wrapped around whatever they define themselves as, that they can't live without it. Black people are the same way.

Problem is every time they go for the angle of the poor character from the street who becomes a mutant and joins the x-men, they have to throw the social justice angle in there and ruin it.

And Professor X actually gave a shit about mutants AND people. Professor X for all his flaws and writer fuckery over the years was always a better and more developed character than this franchise deserves.

You realize that if they were to rewrite professor X as a character in 2016 he would be black, pro social justice, anti white, and spouting twitter tier black lives matter shit every five minutes. Because that's what modern social activism is. The peaceful marching pro civil rights model is one from the 1960's. They only continue to write him like that because they know that trying to push him in the other direction has, just like twitter activists, no substance.

Funny enough, when Remender had Havok take the exact opposite stance (that he didn't want to be defined by being a mutant) he was called a bigot.

Was that the one where he gave a speech and people thought it was racist so one of the writers had Kitty Pryde give a speech on how she was bullied for being Jewish as a kid?

The part that I find ironic is that if you compare the effectiveness of the Martin Luther King style, the Malcolm X style, the post King Jesse Jackson race baiting, and the neo-supremecist BLM movement style of 'activism', it becomes very apparent that the Martin Luther King mode of peace march and clear concise demands is magnitudes more effective.

What Marvel has basically done since killing off Xavier is gone a "Magneto was right" direction in which all the X-groups are increasingly extremist and isolationist on the vague notion that the horrible things which have happened to the mutant community event after event justify their behavior. Except it doesn't, and each radicalized action further proves Xavier was right.

Basically. Remender had Havok not want to be thought of as a mutant, but a human. Bendis, once again, inserted himself in a book in a passive aggressive speech that doesn't really go against what Remender wrote.

Wait, wait, wait…

So Alex proposed a reasonable perspective for bringing human and mutant together, and Kitty Pryde the cute little girl who spent her youth hanging on Wolverine's arm countered that with being a Jewish stereotype because she doesn't want to be associated with the Goyim and Philistines!?

Martin Luther King did a lot of things better than BLM period. BLM held traffics and making people late to work just to fulfill their own ego. Funny thing is there's a nigga that can't go to work and when he was interviewed by the TV crew he lamented that he can get fired because of that.

Shit that sucks. I wonder what happen to the Malcom X school of resistance. Did that die out or did someone carry it on.

I believe it went EXTREME muslim militancy. Supposedly they tried to jump on the BLM train and BLM quietly pushed them off.

I miss Martin Luther King and Malcom X. BLM wouldn't have gone full retard like this if they were still alive.
Now all we got is Al Sharpton and Louis Farrakhan, which is like leaving the black Beavis and Butthead in charge of the movement.

Now that's something ripe for a tv series

Kek

...

...

then we would just get a rebranded Boondocks