Tfw scared of the future

So basically once Capitalism finally crumbles because every worker has been replaced by a fucking robot, we will have some kind of communist one world government, the notion of distinct cultures evaporated, children being raised by the state or some shit because family unit has been made obsolete thanks to artificial wombs, we will all be living in our VR fantasy world with our waifu literally 24/7, while Mark Zuckerberg, CEO of the Human Race, rules over everything from the top of some giant babylonian tower.

Other urls found in this thread:

opensourceecology.org
youtube.com/watch?v=cTLMjHrb_w4
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

...

Why are you scared again?

Yes, here is where I dissagree with you.

Why… rather.. what would he rule?
The simuations? The robots? The progress to better robots?

You keep thinking post-capitalism, with capitalistic terms.

It will be hell, if capitalism DOESN'T crumble.
If we go full Cyberpunk and the VR becomes drugs, the robots are used to produce better stuff for the bourgies and we are forced to become they're higher level playthings, or something.. Or we are sent to start establishing colonies on mars and moon…

WTF would the bourgies rule over, if there is no more scarcity???

Don't see what to be scared of. Once AI fully kicks in and we have it advance to a higher level and have let the machines take over all forms of life regardless of class and race [Or something along those lines, a bit hopeful but you get what i mean] And does who give them self up to the machines to be augmented or placed into a simulation to live a new life. Politics even wont matter anymore.

Capitalism
communism
socialism
All forms of government and political systems will be irrelevant; Plus if you live long enough, you'll get to see a whole lot of crazy shit

kek, no. Capitalism will collapse within our lifetimes, sure, but it will be replaced with fascism

You're stupid for assuming that they will even allocate artifical wombs to everyone.
A surplus of labor is a surplus of human life. Without the struggle for survival, they'll just come up with more and more draconian rules to force people out of existence.
Nationalists kill you for being foreign.
Capitalists kill you for not helping them get rich.
The robot economy will kill you for any reason they can find.

The part about children being raised by the state and the family unit becoming obsolete would be great for a pre-Revolutionary scenario tbh.

Fascism is capitalist. The historical fascist states had mixed market like today. Add today's economy with nationalism and you've fascism.

...

Hold up, lemme go grab my crowbar.

I'm aware of the similarities, but fascism will become necessary in order for the bourgeois and the State to maintain their power once the contradictions in capital become too much to manage without using simple brute force and nationalism.

It's still qualitatively different in a lot of ways, though, is the point. I don't know how long it could last though. Probably, if the West as a whole goes fascist, it could last a long time as the world wages a series of petty Nazi masturbation fantasys until we're all set back a bit technologically.

That's how I expect the next 200 years to play out. There's nothing to look forward to except the Singularity.

Fascists insist that the Marxists and Bankers are working together.
Marxists insist that the Bankers and Fascists are working together.
Bankers insist that Marxists and Fascists are basically the same.

Is it possible that this isn't some kind of dichotomy?

Yes, all along the Fascists and Marxists AND "Bankers" were working together.

wanting spooky scary bourgeois "traditional family values" in your socialism

wew lad

That sounds fine to me.

The Greek ideal of knowledge is virtue is as achieved as we are ever going to get with a singularity
The Christain ideal of forced abstinence and free will is impossible because of their own view of muh human nature
The neo-classical ideal of egoistism is achieved when we have robots producing whatever we need
The communist ideal of workers as the agents is acheived
Every other philosophy that talks about suffering is bad is satisfied

Its a win wi for literally everyone

Why is there fuck is there this meme going around that the robots become the ruling class in a post-scarcity society? They are

A) the lower class (if you could even call machines that) and
B) fucking robots

Is that sarcasm or do you not think that would have adverse psychological impacts?

Here we go with the fucking nazpol again who hasn't read Stirner

tbh: Is there anyone here who is unironically against AI replacing humans?

I mean, they wouldn't necessarily need to just outright kill us all, but if you don't think that AI would be the next logical step in human evolution you probably should get purge for the good of the race :^)

Left out the artificial wombs part on purpose because it's too scifi shit to really care about at this point imo

But yeah, I don't see the point of leaving sacred stuff like very long-term monogamous relationships intact if you're anyway radical enough to be communist/socialist. Also I don't see why for example the Mutual Adoption Club style model used by Huxley in the Island would have any downsides compared to the current ideal of nuclear family where you have to sacrifice a significant portion of your own time/interests if you want to raise children

There's nothing wrong with enjoying normal family life.

Did you know that if you give a child every resource and nutrient needed for life but don't touch, talk to or interact with it in anyway they will not develop properly and may die?


If were talking that far into the future then anything is possible. The adoption culb would probably relieve some of the problems with nurturing the children.
The problem I have though is that by removing those permanent bonds with, for example, parents and sibling, it would become harder to develop long term relationships and in turn have a cohesive society.

Read Nick Land if you want to know what capitalism will be like in the future.

But if it is nothing of value to me, why wouldn't I want it gone so it doesn't restrict the way I want to live my life?


But if it is "permanent bonds", with say, ~5 adoptive families, why would that be a problem compared to the singular holy nuclear family?

Also sibling-relations are overrated, I happen to have still have my brother as one of my best friends because we get along well and find each others company stimulating/enjoyable even after all these years, but a lot of my other friends have only very superficial relations with their siblings.

If you want to talk about relationships that help people function in a society, family relationships are irrelevant vs. interactions in extra-family groups i.e. kindergarten etc.

Its all about development and building on previous experiences. By the time you hit kindergarten you've had ~4 years of learning how to be a person.
If you had 4 or 5 groups that were totally committed to you it would probably be okay but right now it would be impossible to predict the logistics of raising entire generations that way. I'm not saying that its impossible but it is almost in the realm of fantasy.
How would you get to that point is the interesting question, implementing a system that works is harder than upkeep and its not like the current one is perfect.

I mean I'm not against a classical family structure per se (neither was Kollontai), but I think it's important to emphasize that it is a bad environment for the child unless the parents are actually committed to it, vs. just doing it because societal values/biological drive

Any environment is bad for a child if those conditions aren't met.

On the topic of:


Scientific pursuit would probably be the biggest drive.

I more scared of advancement in genetics moving the class divide on a genetic level.
Once porkies get make their baby live longer, less prone to illnesses and more intelligent there's no going back.

???

Widened sphere of guardians =/= some dystopian shit where everybody is forcefully separated from their parents and brough up in some indoctrination facility

also implying I need to use weak af moralist arguments against lolberts

Machines might become the "ruling class" if they really had the kind of general intelligence and creativity that humans have, but scientists understand so little about how the brain works that this could take centuries if it happens at all. In the meantime, it may just be a few decades before robots take over all the routine physical jobs like factory work and construction, and a fair amount of the white collar jobs that are less creative and don't require a lot of people skills. Like I said in I think this could be a good thing if it convinces enough people to get behind the basic income idea.

Can post scarcity promise everybody a home and flying car? Will everybody have their own rocket for going into space? If not then there is your answer.

you can't but help and always think of this when you see that

Wall-E is like The Matrix inverted.

As for everyone else in this thread, i'm ashamed none of you even considered the AI take over. Instead you all talked about
Capitalism like it will still matter when the singularity hits and talked on and on about "Muh working class" "Muh ruling class"

Capitalism will die out along with every other ideology…But no we have to keep the fire going, we must all ways be fighting one another because that's how the world works.

As said

Alienation is insufferable once you can put a name to it.

Everyone always says it's crumbling but it doesn't really. Until we run out of oil, then we just revert to feudalism. 6-7 billion will die of hunger. Sry no robo-waifus. Zuckenberg will be fine though. And there is no more significant unexplored oil deposit.
When hunger starts and people start dying there will be chaos in the cities, multiple revolutions or at least attempts. Army and police will defend holy private property of people like Zuckenberg but eventually fail. After that it is unclear what exact forms of government will be. Maybe elites have a plan for that already. Perhaps this is what they call New World Order.

The next decade is going to be a doozy for sure, but don't be scared.

The rise of ultranationalism shouldn't be what scares you. You should be scared about the rise of semiocapitalism, VR, etc.

opensourceecology.org

This is why we need to be prepared for the oil running out scenario. Mostly be either choosing different energy sources which are around us. Or using those that need significant infrastructure (nuclear fission, maybe fusion in future).

And the energy and food solutions need to go from below, decentralized, because if you have a great genetic variety of crops, no giant like Monsanto can't tamper with the genetic code to make entire population starve on a whim because the seeds of the crops cannot sprout due some intentional genetic manipulation, making the populations at mercy of a megacorporations that kindly give them seeds to grow every year and then eat the crops.

If there's no revolution but everything is eventually automated, we have genetic engineering fro humans etc. would the bourgeoisie, it no longer really being in their self-interest, voluntarily give up their positions and we simply fade into communism, or will porky keep his absolute control of all production to maintain power for power's sake?

I don't fear robots or VR, but I do truly fear for the future. My greatest worry right now is that environmental destruction and social collapse will undo the conditions for post-scarcity communism to emerge. Because we're really close to achieving it in a number of areas, the only thing standing in the way IMO is the complexity of the global economy and the momentum of the market system. But if we get a few more Syria-style civil wars and collapsed states in the next decade, prompted by economic crashes or climate-induced natural disasters, get ready for massive waves of immigration accompanied by mass starvation, war, and disease. The first world would go full reactionary nationalism to protect what prosperity and order they have left from the hordes of brown, black and eventually poor white people seeking safety. We probably wouldn't even get fascist aesthetics and order either, just a Children of Men-style police state and a lot of alienated, gated off white bourgies living in a bubble while the world burns around them.
Good fucking luck trying to achieve Communism under those fucking conditions.

OR not because he makes no goddamn sense and Ray Brassier owned him

This.

PEAK OIL will be the dominant factor shaping the future.

No more cheap, abundant energy (millions of years of solar compacted into black gold in the ground) = no more high-technology.

No VR waifus, no luxury automation, no Orwellian Police State.

Just back to good ol' Feudal bickering.

Kek ecological collapse and a natural disaster will already drive the human race to extinction long before we pull all the oil out of the ground. Energy is abundant all around us, oil is easy but there are plenty of other sources that can be used to sustain current consumption. Industrial agriculture without oil is currently unthinkable though. Wait til Lockheed puts out their fusion reactor.

They will keep the game going with artificial scarcity while systematically eradicating all the people unnecessary for the new economy.

Peak oil and civilization collapse is the hippie version of Holla Forums's day of the rope.

At least day of the rope can actually happen.

...

Yes.

youtube.com/watch?v=cTLMjHrb_w4

Peak oil isn't the big deal you think it is. As hints at, there's plenty of coal left for us to burn or convert into oil.

Underrated post.

that picture is so fucking funny

Plus nuclear energy. That's not going anywhere