Trump Leading 67% to Hillary’s 19% in National Poll of 50,000 Voters

PANTS WITH SHIT

He's already getting "rigged election" into people's heads, either to dissuade it from happening, or for a "told ya so" where he will either demand a recount, repoll or, worst case ontario, the Millitary takes over, you can guess who they'll support

OP you stupid faggot!

Shills are getting absolutely colon catastrophe'd over this news.

...

...

Now that's a Freudian slip.

ABC poll is still going

I want it to be real but this is a hoax.

It's a chain mail tier article. It's been posted here daily for the last week, and it's not any more real today than it was last week.

Unfortunately.

I've read the article, and the article it cites. Where is a link to the poll's internals? Without the internals I don't care what rosy scenario it paints it simply isn't credible without seeing the guts.

??????????????????

That's not even a real ABCnews poll, it's a spam site.

Even if its 100% false, it's still useful propaganda. It's a counter push poll. No need to be cucks to 100% truth in a battle where your enemy is doing anything but.

ZERO DOCUMENTATION

ALL THE LINKS JUST REFER TO OTHER SITES REPORTING THE SAME THING

THERE’S NO END TO THE CHAIN

Sage and report for hoax until actual data is released.

Weird how every online poll with MASSIVE numbers of respondents (50k+ as opposed to 3k max in official polls) goes our way.

People say those polls aren't representative but I beg to differ. When the poll was taken on a huge mainstream site (as opposed to an obscure site with a specific clientele) and has such massive numbers of respondents, an accurate "cross section" of the populace is pretty much inevitable.

This.
Fake it till you make it. That's the meme magic way.

So many words, so little sense. Do not push lies as evidence of superiority, that would be criminally stupid, Mr Agent Sir.

It makes no sense to poll 1000 people from every state. As if the value of Wyoming is equal to California's value in the electoral college. Obviously Trump would be way up in this poll.

No.

abcnewsgo.co/2016/08/abc-live-poll-who-are-you-voting-for/

read it and weep

...

I hear from normalfag basic bitch recucklican dudes about how blackpilled they are becoming due to their constant reading of biased polls that show Trump down 10 points. I can now show this to them to bring them out of their slump and renew their support in Trump. Whether this poll is true or not means nothing to these people as they believe whatever is put in front of them, and since I can't change their inability to disregard polls until methodology is considered (I've tried), then even dishonest polls in our favor serve a purpose.

Sorry you need things to be spoonfed to you.

That's a notable problem right there; the U.S. population isn't made up of that portion of people.

No. People have lost faith in the media and their polls because they push out so many that are all unbelievable, and they spit out so many stories that are anti trump they wonder if they could be true. Trump is using this as a weapon to inoculate his supporters from the media. If you do it, you inoculate independents and disaffected democrats from going Trump, or at least believing the polls where he wins.

That is not ABCnews, that is a recently registered domain with a similar appearance to ABCs site.
Your poll
>whois.com/whois/abcnewsgo.co
ABC news
>whois.com/whois/go.com
Notice that the actual website is
While your fake poll is
Not even a .com. Use your fucking brain instead of believing every piece of garbage that comes your way.

Look at it this way. How many Trump bumper stickers/yard signs do you see on any given drive? 1? 10? ~30? How many people do you know that support trump yet don't have bumper stickers or signs? A whole bunch? Yea.

I'd say that it isn't an unreasonable estimate to speculate that for every 1 Trump bumper sticker there are 10,000 Trump supporters.

I appreciate the enthusiasm, but that is really terrible sampling.

Alternatively, they'll think you're either retarded or trying to trick them with your fake garbage poll.

we should do our own sampling.

...

At least you have your principles

...

Pretty much.

They should've picked registered %dems, %repubs, %independents, and work for that individual ratio for each individual state.

But it's still more realistic than what media's reporting.

come on guys we should set up a Holla Forums and call random people everywhere.

To add, if someone cares for it and there's complete input data, you could adjust for this.

>abcnewsgo.co/2016/08/abc-live-poll-who-are-you-voting-for/

I just looked it up
it leads to DISNEY … the owner of ABC

...

Sorry you’re a leftist in Holla Forumsack’s clothing.

Reported for not even trying.

People don't want trump stickers because they don't want their cars being vandalized.

...

The poll is Weekly World News-tier. I'm saying it would be counterproductive to try to persuade someone the other polls are bad by showing them one that isn't even real and would obviously produce data hugely skewed in favor of Republicans anyway.

To be honest this wouldn't surprise me in the slightest. I expect the rigging in the elections to be ridiculous and it's good that Trump has said that he will have his own pollers up too. Enjoy your upcoming civil war, Americans.

Way to go.

Is this a new form of shilling? go.com is ABC news. ABC poll has hidden all the information. Anyone who goes to the WHOIS pages would show that.

None of the other polls are real, so why not use a probably dishonest white pill when we have it?

Purity spiraling RINO cuck detected. Sorry Gramps, but your time is over. Go mix yourself a whiskey sour and play a game of backgammon. Leave the taking back our country from kikes and leftists to us.

SASUGA

You fail at meme, dubs, and politics. Smh tbqh fam

Fake polls are fake polls. If people aren't trusting the media with them, why would they trust you? All it does is drive people away from believing in Trumps victory. It's better to make them doubt all polls and vote for trump than believe fake polls and potentially stay home.

...

Fuck all these kikes and especially fuck Joe. He's just a pretentious RINO whose day job is to get blue balled by that bitch Mika

hory fug

I know it's gonna be a landslide, but landslide numbers this soon? He really is going to hit 88%

Over 50% of the country is not registered with either major party, D and R are not distributed equally between the states, and population is not distributed anywhere close to equally. Only the severely mentally deficient will be fooled.

I put one on mine. I live next door to a guy with a hillary sign in his yard. I wave and say hi to him even though he's a total cuck.

>>>/gg/

I happen to be a fan of MJ since they gave Trump a lot of airtime when no one else would. He probably got an ultimatum from his network to go full hog against Trump as soon as the nomination was won, and that's what he did. Trump's hardest fight was always the primary and Joe let Trump get a lot of positive coverage back when it was most important. Don't hate him. He sold out in the end but he did his job.

Are you twelve?

It's not concern trolling to say you have a dumb idea, nigger.

I assume Trump has done his own internal polls. He has not deviated much if at all. Ask yourself if the Democrats have switched tactics.

That's exactly why I hate him now. I watched him a bit during the primaries and it was great. Especially when he even referred to Trump as "my guy"

But he sold out like a bitch

abcnewsgo.co/2016/08/abc-live-poll-who-are-you-voting-for/

the numbers just keep rolling in

There really aren't any. It's expensive to conduct accurate polls such as this, and the ones of any quality are usually done by firms working directly for the campaigns to provide highly accurate non-biased data.

Wow she's even losing to Jill Stein and Gary Johnson. Hopefully she gets schlonged on Nov 8

1000 calls per state?
Does this poll take the relative population of each state in account?

This shit is fake. The domain is registred via GoDaddy in Scottsdale, AZ.

whois.domaintools.com/abcnewsgo.co

MSNBC let Joe have free reign during the primaries because they wanted to go up against Trump, or at least that's my theory. Don't forget MSNBC is a radical leftist network. MSNBC was always going to force him to turn against him as soon as the primary was over, and to expect pro-Trump stories on MJ after the nomination is probably just wishful thinking. All the lasers are now on Trump, and given all the heat Joe got during the primary for giving Trump positive airtime I'm sure his job was on the line if he didn't join the kike chorus.

I went to the Pensacola, FL rally where Joe's brother gave the speech introducing Trump. He's good people, trying to survive on an enormously kiked up network.

One of the biggest domain registrars in the world…

pewresearch.org/data-trend/political-attitudes/party-identification/
My bad, only forty-some percent are independent. It doesn't change the fact that 33-33-34 is nine points too high for Republicans and again, giving each state equal representation and ignoring the party imbalances is a very obvious way of fudging the numbers in favor of Trump.

It's better to discredit the other polls than to try to pass off obvious false information.

Nah Joe's a pure 100% cuck. He voted for kasich and not even as a joke. Matter of fact I used to give Mika the benefit of the doubt back in the primary because she at least gave bernie some support when it was clear hillary was being supported by everyone else in the lugenpresse, I figured the retarded ideas she had were just the result of her being a retarded liberal woman. When the democrat party split during the convention and all the bernouts walked out I figured morning joe would mention it. Nope they sure as fuck, didn't even breathe a word of it. On the day of the rope they've earned their place.

The idea that somebody who can't fill a small room is beating a man who fills stadiums every week is ridiculous. It is full fledged ministry of truth. The only sense it makes is (((they))) are going to conduct massive voter fraud and they are grossly fabricating the polls so the normies believe the outcome.

Obviously Trump isn't going to win by that margin but it still goes to show that the (((media))) is selectively polling people. I live in a purple district of a purple state and Trump yardsigns and bumperstickers outnumber Hillary at least 10 to 1.

The (((media))) is going to be in for a shock come Nov 8th.

I live in a red state and I haven't seen lawn signs for either of them except this one guy who sells home made honey.

At that point the lugenpresse had already coalesced around Hillary. Trump's toughest fight was at the beginning of the primary when no one would take him serious as a candidate, and MJ was consistently the only people having Trump on giving him positive coverage. By the time he was in the final 3 and leading for ~8 months, he was big enough to fly on his own. Trump didn't need MJ coverage anyway. It's funny that you say that about Kasich when we in Florida were bombarded with ads saying, "A vote for anyone other than Rubio is a vote for Trump". I think that's true.

"Independent" is just what normalfags signal to seem like they are unpartisan. It's not true. "Indepedent" just means that you want to seem politically adept as if you're some arbiter of objectivity, but if you look at the voting histories of "indepedents" they vote down the line for the same party.

Keep concern trolling dude, it's not like Hitler employed a propagandist either.

It's not, look at the fucking WHOIS. Use common fucking sense, why would ABC register a new domain through fucking godaddy to host a poll, when they have a website that already does that?

For private individuals, not massive media empires. Is this a new CTR tactic, look as dumb as possible to dissuade trump supporters from visiting 8/pol/ anymore?

Whether or not independents are real is beside the point. Nobody believes that each state contains an equal number of people, split equally D-R-I.

What furthers complicates the stats is that a bunch of people like me signed up to the GOP temporarily just to vote for Trump in the primary but we still identify as unaffiliated/independent.

She's been averaging around 1000, while Trump averages about 6000.

It's a huge gap, but not as big as you think.

Nice concern trolling /leftyfag/

The poll is bullshit then.

Before you call me a shill I'll tell you why.
The states with lower population (and more Republican leaning) are over-represented in this poll method. Why? Here is an example.

Let's take only two states, Idaho and Commiefornia.
Let's say Idaho has a population of 1 million and Cali has a population of 9 million (not actual numbers, only to show an example)
Also let's say Idaho is 80% in favor of Trump, 20% Clinton and Cali is 60% for Hillary, 40 for Trump.
This means that there are 800.000 republican and 200.000 dem voters in Idaho.
This also means that there are 5.4 Million Dem voters in Cali against 3.6 Mill Republicans
So the total numbers in this scenario for Republicans are 4.4M vs 5.6M Democrats.
This means Hillary gets 56% of votes.

The makers of this poll then come and make a survey by asking 1000 people in both states.
If they do it right they get 800 Republicans and 200 Democrats in Idaho, while 400 Republicans and 600 Democrats in Cali.
The makers of this poll then have 1200 Republicans vs 800 Democrats.
They then annouance that The population is 60% Republican leaning, while in reality (in this thought experiment) you can see that the real population is 56% Democrat.

In the poll the lower population states get heavily over-represented.

They either published this poll for confirmation bias or they want to vomfort the Republican voter base to stay at home in november.

t. user who knows math

Yet when you consider that Republican primary voting is up ~60% and democratic primary voting is down ~20%, this sampling more closely represents the actual voting population throughout the primary process. National polls have always been bullshit because you have solidly blue/red states contributing to the total. The only polls that matter are state polls since we vote per state, but that's not to say that this poll, if legit (probably not), isn't correct to sample in this way.

On the surface it seems to be a weak attempt to take out bias from their polls since most pollsters over sample democrats, but you have to remember that modern polling is based on assumptions from Romney turnout which is completely not analogous to the coalition Trump has built.

Wait until Trump puts his internal polls out.

There's no way this is legitimate.

Except we don't have national polling so your concerns don't make any sense.

Hillary would win that example in a landslide since Cali has shitloads more electoral votes than Idaho.

Explain a bit, I don't think I understand your point.

There are way too many minorities, women, and cucked white men for Trump to even dream of getting two-thirds of the votes, get real.

State-by-state polling makes sense since the Electoral College is the only thing that actually matters but this is a retarded way of going about it, yeah.

Stay the fuck off this board.

Where I live I have seen many Trump signs, but exactly ZERO Hildabeast signs.
And I haven't seen bumper stickers from either one.
I am a Trump supporter & have no sign (yet) nor do I have a bumper sticker. I simply haven't taken the time to get either.
I will probably forgo the bumper sticker due to nigger vandalism, but I'll get a sign because I will have it at home, where I have an arsenal of guns & no niggers to shoot (yet).
You see, we have no police here, so by the time the staties get here, any dead sign vandals will have weapons with their fingerprints next to their cold bodies.

But…she isn't…at all

This poll does not even exist. It's a chain email that claims some group of 14 grad students took a couple weeks to comb through the voter rolls and call 50,000 people. That's 149 calls an hour for two weeks straight, if they did nothing but call people - at which point the poll would be worthless; you want to do polls in a short amount of time.

Not a concern troll faggy fag. Just facts.

cut your dick off on cam bby

One California is worth 13.75 Idahos in electoral college votes. Electoral college in most states is winner take all. Following that anons math, Hillary would win California with 60% of the vote, giving her 13.75x more electoral votes than Trump who would win Idaho with 80% of the vote, despite a pure numbers poll showing trump winning with 60% of the vote. Maybe that's not clear, so put it this way. Trump gets his 60% of the vote, but due to the fact it is in two separate states it counts for nothing since most of his poll was in Idaho, a worthless state, while Hillary carried her vote in California, the biggest state.

Only 300 here in Central Florida just the other day.

I had this thought, at the moment they have 2 possible scenarios;

Faced with this choice, isn't there a danger Obama will try to kick off WW3 before November to take control?

Isn't this almost their only option to keep control at this point?

Or is it another case of the left being literally blind to their own incompetence and they actually think muh vagina will get the white house?

First pic isnt Hillary dumbass it's Sen. Debbie Stabenow.

Dont get fooled by propaganda.

Right but California was never up for grabs so that doesn't exactly change the realistic delegate math for this election. If we had national voting this concern would make sense, but it's always been that republicans carry more states that happen to be less densely populated but the amount of states make up, in part, for this lack in electors. I get the concern, but it's not exactly groundbreaking. Trump has been leading in the counties that decide battleground states too (Hillsborough county in FL for example), and this is a place where it doesn't matter how many californians voted.

His concern matters for naught is my point.

do you really think so?

I believe you mean the Burger King Putsch.

That first pic isn't Hillary.

Source:

gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/sen-debbie-stabenow-d-mich-speaks-to-a-small-crowd-as-she-news-photo/484300132

prove it concern cuck

explain her weak ass 50 person "rallies" compared to Trump's fully packed stadiums

calling 100 people on a poll that consists in to DVs (Trump or Clinton) is perfectly legitimate you fuckwad.

learn to science

Prove its actually part of ABC news.
Protip: You can't.

There are far too many people here which are uncritical of questionable material simply because it fits with their worldview.

Very sad.

Reported.

nice ID

I'll give you a hint shill, liberal "tut tutting" doesn't work on us

Look at all your pics of ~100 person Hillary rallies? Notice anything missing? Like Hillary?

Those pics are taken while people are still coming in or during a warmup speaker. When she's actually speaking it looks more like this. Nothing compared to Trump, but anyone who believes she's not regularly pulling 500+ is sniffing their own glue.

"Stronger Together" is the Hilldog slogan you cuccboi

...

Correcting a faggot who posts blatant lies is now being a cuck?

Go be a jew somewhere else faggot.

This is the funniest poll in the world.

Oh, wonderful! What sh

lol your delusional view of Hillary support got BTFO, and you respond by calling me a shill and a liberal.

Moron.

Yea, they're called CTR

So all the Craigslist ads for a free 50$. a lot of folks would show up.

there's no way this shit isn't legit

you are the typical shill

check the damn site you moron!

sure thing bud

Fullchan needs population but it's much better than this.

I'm not saying it would work out very well for them, but they don't exactly have a history of responsible decisions.

My point is their desperation makes bad decisions easier, they could just do it out of spite if they realise their days are numbered.

But thats what you are.

Thought you meant the second pic, my bad.

10/10 bait I couldn't tell you weren't serious until now.

1 - town hall, not rally

2 - no hillary.

Hmmm….

Back to intl or leftypol

Yea, the pic of Hildabeast rally your cuck friend posted to brag about her 500 supporters shows me a standard high-school auditorium & it's not even half full.
That is fucking hilariously pitiful for a supposed presidential contender.

This is the most nonsensical con-artist I've ever seen! I guess it works! With 2585 active users there must be a hundred shills.

This is lower energy than Jeb's rallies.

THIS REALLY MOTIVATED MY SYNAPSES TO FIRE

First pic…look in the center next to the speaker.
The rare "stumbling Hildabeast" in blue.

...

It's a town hall, not a rally.

revised and expanded version

THAT POLL HAS ABSOLUTELY NO SOURCE.

It redirects you through as many sites as you can imagine.
I am not able to find the real data about this poll.

First :
archive.is/Ya4qq
then
arizonafreedomalliance.ning.com/group/watching-the-elections/forum/topic/show?id=6399857:Topic:102367&xgs=1&xg_source=msg_share_topic
then
investmentwatchblog.com/new-poll-50000-people-polled-trump-won-67-19/
or
alipac.us/f9/50-000-people-polled-50-states-trump-won-335883/

No real source.
That is no study.
Only a claim in a forum.

It is a Hoax.

I did my homework.
As much as i wish it was true, this is fake.

Also given that dem's republicans and independents are not a 33% 33% 34% , it's retarded without even looking at the fact that states have different size that should be accounted in such a miracle poll.

Sage because no real source.

Mistaking that first picture for shillary is an easy mistake to make. She looks exactly identical from the back, and even wears the same kind of clothing and hair.

I guess the flag should have been the biggest hint that its not her.

See pic.

Why do you say that?

I have given no indication that I'm a Hillary supporter.

Closer to right than the typical 45% Dem, 30% Rep, 20% Indy poll

Yuuuuge difference, I'm sure.
Show me a Hildabeast rally where she filled the better part of a sports stadium or convention hall, as Trump routinely does.

It'd have to be real to be right :^)

True, but still retarded not to take that in account if you are going to call 50k people.

I only said she averages around 1000, which is about how many you see here.

there is no reason to be upset

also it'll be hilarious when your main demographic votes on Twitter instead of at the booth

This poll's been posted around for a few days now, and while it looks good due to sample size, the distribution is all fucked because the low population red states are going to have a fuck ton of weight, while it only helps blue states in a few small cases like Vermont or Delaware. Until I see the specific data for this so you can adjust based on proportion, I would discard this poll as really not being any better than any of the (((MSM))) polls. It wouldn't surprise me if the properly weighted results had Trump ahead 5 points or so.

Polls like this are actually much better in my opinion because it won't be skewed due to location. If Hillary can't win among the internet, who are mostly millennials which have been the primary group that the left has relied on to win after non-whites. If she can't get this group on lock I have no idea how the fuck she could possibly win.

I'm using this from now on.

that picture is the biggest gathering at a Hillary event I've ever seen

there's no way her average is 1000 when she can't even fill up a university book store

Impressive, she managed to get one or two thousand people to show up.

I like how they don't show the crowd from further back though.

We all know that the lugenpresse likes to use manipulative angles to benefit shillary.

That fact that I have corrected you twice on the use of misleading Hillary photos does not mean that I'm a Hillary Clinton supporter.

That should go without saying.

You're responding in a completely irrational manner.

No doubt that the crowd was mostly there to see Buffett, who is Omaha's biggest celebrity.

Is no one going to check these digits?

you have been BTFO

no in this thread except for you shill buddies believe you

Hillary will die before the election anyways so all these hours you put in Correcting The Record will be for nought

then in 2017, since we have all your addresses from the FEC forms, we're gonna pay all of you a little visit as well

I'll check yours

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

they're real boys

I don't think that dude is a shill since he was right about the first pic in this post:

Let's not lose our objectivity here.

I've always thought so.

Just went to their site, pic related is what their front page looks like. Surely they're not biased or anything. Also, kek, the site sure does look super professional.

Not having the MSM report on this poll is like being shocked that the MSM isn't reporting on a presidential poll conducted by the Aryan brotherhood.

This tbqh.

Go back to leftypol or intl

He's right, analysis shows roughly 1000 people in that pic.
I have seen a pic of the same rally from a different angle, it is a standard high-school gym, and it is roughly 9/10ths full.

No, seriously, kill yourself. You were wrong about her rally numbers and are so autistic that you can’t accept fact when it’s given to you.

YOU’RE A LIBERAL.

I think Holla Forums would agree with this group on some things. I really should've scrolled down because it got even better. Those darn democrats and their gosh darn evil racist ways.

The smallest legit number I've seen for a proper rally, not a bookstore appearance or town hall, was around 300. 500-800 are typical. The largest was under 5k.

Trump's are often in the 4-8k range. 20k+ are unusual.

He's getting 10x as many no matter how you look at it.

However thinking she's having trouble getting 100 is just false. She does have some legit support. Just enough to make normies believe the fake polls.

God, I hope not.
Hillary will be utterly destroyed in the election, if she dies and the DNC gets anyone to take her place, literally ANYONE, the devastation of Trump's victory won't be as complete & embarrassing as Hildabeast's loss.
And I want to rub the faces of every cuck & shill in the most decisive Trump win as is humanly possible.

Holy shit, this site is a fucking goldmine for chuckles.

Beware of those evil democrats gents, what with them dismissing our greatest ally Israel and everything.

SOMEONE THINK OF ISRAEL!

This site is a fucking joke. Thread saged for reporting on a poll conducted by a group that's Weekly World News tier.

hurr you must love Hillary durr ur a paid shill XDDD

>The poll was conducted by the Arizona Freedom Alliance and according to their post

So the one who wrote that article didn't even take the time to examine their methods?

This is what the group wrote on their Facebook page:

facebook.com/arizonafreedomalliance.org/posts/1227218263989930

We have been made aware that a site called Constitution.com posted one of our re-posts. They misunderstood who actually conducted the poll in question even though those involved were named in the beginning of the article. We say to the Admin of that site: Please make a correction to this article: Arizona Freedom Alliance DID NOT conduct the poll in question. We simply re-posted and explained how to understand the poll that was conducted by those named on the article that was not included in your post - 13 graduate students who spent a lot of their time trying to get to the facts. Please restate the author of the poll so there is no misunderstanding. While we appreciate the call out, we do want to be perfectly clear about this and other information posted on our site.

So who did the poll?

This sounds like a hoax and I think this user is right

and like me and other anons have said, the crowd is there for Buffet AND it's still the biggest Hillary crowd we've seen

I would expect her real average attendance to be around 50-100 people

meanwhile at the average trump rally…

So Montana with a population of 1 million, and California with a population of 40 million were given equal weight.
tell me more about how this poll is unbiased.

I've blown you kikes out 3-4 times in this thread and gotten nod of approval (you)s everytime

now you're just shit flinging when the reality of your wasted hours confronts you

Everyone, SAGE. I don't doubt the polls are biased against Trump but this so-called poll by not-Arizona Freedom Alliance is very likely a hoax.

8ch.net/faq.html
What is "sage"? Posters may reply to threads without bumping them to the top of the index by putting "sage" in the email field.

Even during the civil war, elections still happened. If (((they))) try it, its very obviously not going to work. And if they did try it, its certain that trumps the next Hitler if they are so desperate to do it.

Yes, that was the point I was trying to make, myself.
Trump fills convention halls, with people forced to listen to the speech from outside, on the speakers, because there's no room left. When he has his rallies at sports stadiums, the crowd looks the same as a crowd showing up for the Superbowl.
Nobody else in the primaries on either side could do this, and Hillary does not even come close to this now.
The country is undeniably behind the message that Trump carries, Trump is their hope, and their voice.
Only whining, loudmouthed, malcontents…with no self-respect & no faith in their own abilities…support Hildabeast, with her message of cradle-to-grave nanny-suckling from the state, paid for from the pockets of the capable to the teat-sucking mouths of the useless.

America is better than that, and that's why they've rallied around Trump.

I smell a new meme

Reported for kike shill.

that's good to see
all this msm shilling has really been getting me down

To all the people that have been talking shit about my position that this is a morale booster, take a look at this post.

If they wanted to be accurate they would've called 30% Reps, 30% Dems and 40% Inds, because that's closer to current demographic realities. Also would've adjusted states based on population.

But it doesn't actually help.

It's probably just a hoax anyway

SAGE

Maybe next time Rand.

Are you implying the Weekly World News isn't the world's only reliable newspaper?

Except it’s a hoax.

Tbh, they over sampled republicans and under sampled independents.
Should have been closer to 27R 33D 40I, but it's still impressive.

They didn’t sample anyone. It’s a hoax. Sage the thread.

...

Let me guess, reported for intl?

YOU are now, yes, for admitting to being it.

Reported for being a kike shill.

I've always been registered as Independent because I hate both parties, the neo-Marxist Demokikes and the neo-liberal Republicucks and the neocohen advisors and donors. I only switched long enough to vote for Trump in the caucus.

I am really a part of the reptilian JIDF cabal of Holla Forums goons out to ruin your board! You have outed me. Good job. Only endless 'reported for intl' spam could have bested me.

All liberals will be killed.

After them, the christcucks

Reported for bumping a hoax thread.

Did they teach you at the CTR seminar to 'sage' all your posts? I'm glad you do, because once in a great while it's hard to see who is shilling who.

Do you actually report? You must have reported me like a thousand times but I've never been banned.

The thread is a hoax. Sage or fuck off.

sage

You mean, just like every poll out there?

So sage.

Kek.

Thank you for correcting the record fam :^)

To do this properly, you would have to not only base each states number of people polled on population, but also poll dems, repubs, & indies based on that state's demographics pertaining to each. And you would stick only to likely voters.
Other than that, the number polled looks good, as the current polls are woefully under-polling, barely legitimate numbers. And the current polls are being cooked, polling in known regions based on the demographics that will get them the results they want to report.

Calm the fuck down user.

I'm pretty sure CTR pays you by the hour, not the post.

Kill yourself. The thread is a hoax. Sage it.

So was the medical records thread, and the royal dutch shell thread, and the fbi insider thread, and the military user thread, but I didn't see you sage bombing those threads. I wonder, why?

idk about that, it's already up to 16 bosts

intl is so obvious.

Because those threads haven't been repeated every day or other day for the past week? I can see why others would sage bomb the thread.

Remember to sage.

They're getting tired of policing this thread, to be sure they can spout "but the poll is fake!!" every time an user comments on the OP.
They want to shut it down so they can get around to shilling other threads more exclusively.

It's rather amusing, really…that's why I've been kind of trying to keep this thread going.

Except why are we letting 93a1fc police our discourse?

So show us the data and the methodology.

Show us the link to the actual organization that did it.

OP doesn’t have it. None of OP’s links have it.

IKR

abcnewsgo.co/2016/08/abc-live-poll-who-are-you-voting-for/

and the numbers keep rolling in kek

Why?
This poll is as legitimate as any of the others being puked up on the lamestream media.

They vomit up a poll, and this one gets puked up in retaliation, they are all just as legitimate.

Because mods refuse to clean up blatant hoaxes and slide threads?

Please fuck off. I'm more convinced you're CTR false flagging this shitty hoax than anyone else ITT.

Reported. This is Holla Forums, not Holla Forums.

Why would CTR want to propagate a poll that is against their Employer Hildabeast, the patron saint of cackling & stumbling?

Psst: HE’S CTR. HE’S BUMPING A HOAX THREAD.

The guy you replied to is intl. Remember to report him.

Good question, why care about the truth when the mainstream "news" is filled with nothing but lies?
Everyone's opinion is just as legitimate as everyone else's, regardless of silly "facts," isn't that the libtard credo?

...

Sorry, while you were policing this thread, I was on another thread.

checked, this guy saging and bugging out is either an autist or doing some kind of weird avant garde shilling

It's not perfect polling but it's BIG LEAGUES more accurate than what the media have been peddling since the DNC

And thankfully I will never be 93a1fc begging for per-post microshekels

Because when Trump supporters propagate a blatant hoax it makes them look stupid? It's also so much of a hoax it makes MSM polls look believable, which may be their goal. Go so outlandish that anything inside looks real.

I don't see any point in sageing.

Who says it's a "hoax?"
I have seen criticisms of their methodology, but I've seen no proof it was a hoax.

who cares how we look

MSM is dissecting every little part of what trump and his supporters do and regurgitate it ad infinitum

we might as well propagate this to counteract their attempts at cultural subversion

no no user, we must cuck for principles instead of using propaganda in our own favor

It’s a hoax.

There IS no methodology. There is no data, and there is no proof it was even held. None of the links have any measure of evidence behind them.

see

see

You don't need fake polls, you just need to spread Trumps memes.

...

Why do anons get into arguments? It just clutters up the thread. Ignore insultposts, you faggots.

This study needs sauce, but it reflects other data being released by non-MsM sources at the moment. Even given the electoral coefficient problems, it's still an interesting study.

>does not need to lie

Doesn't mean you can't lie

Roast in hell, intl. We have standards.

...

Still not seeing any proof it's fake.
All I see is anons claiming it is.

Of course he can’t read. He’s intl.

This is you.

Well, where's the proof?
Just because YOU can't find the source doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

Looks more to me like you're the "hurr durr" here.

You're gonna be in for a bad time

This is exactly what is going to happen.
I have been trying over the past 3 months to motivate people against spending their time against trying to find ways to sell Trump's message, and instead find ways to the idea that our government would rig the election.
It is usually met with being yelled down and labled a "concern shill".

It also serves as a backup plan incase some how Hillary wins legitimately. I started typing after this, but theres no way Hillary would win legitimately so it is a moot point.

They can only rig it if people are willing to accept rigged results.

If the societal pressure for Trump is greater than those against it, it won't matter what the votes say or what Wolf Blitzer says. We will see revolution or complete jewish totalitarian crackdown within the year. There is no scenario that ends with them not stealing the election short of a pre-November assassination of Hillary or BLM forcing martial law and the elections being (((postponed))).

does CNN call it fake?

Nice fallacy, fuckface.

Reported for admitting to be intl

CTR is VERY mad about this!

Why would they be mad about something they created?

So evidently DNC is running anti-Trump ads in New York. I'm being told that this isn't normal.

MU'FUCKAS BE SCARED N' SHIIEEEETTT

Anyone have that graph from the primaries of Dem vs Repub results in a state that showed voting irregularities? I believe it was some souther state like Louisiana and it showed the repub votes flattening out into their average value over time wheres on the dem side it showed a strange curve up for Hilldawg and a curve down over time for Comrade Sanders, showing rigging fuckery.

Apologies if this is not the appropriate thread to ask but seemed the best place and closest applicable topic.

Oh yeah, that's not normal. Even if Trump doesn't win NY and CA, he's forcing the DNC to hemorrhage money advertising there.

They're scared as hell!

I turned on talmudvision to see a few olympic events and I got a couple anti-Trump ads, I'm in FL.

It was Hillary for America funded, not DNC.

Do you links to these sources with said data? I'm not saying you're BSing, but I'm curious about this data.

Reported.

Wasn’t there a new site drawn up that did “unbiased” polls and restored the numbers to pre-Khan setting? I forget the name and it’s offline right now.

I live and commute through new jersey

I see trump signs and stickers everywhere. I've only seen 1 hillary sticker this whole season. Hell, i see way more sanders stickers than clinton one's

...

Can you find proof it is real?
Protip: You can't.

sage

Are they really running ads in Cali?

I thought Cali was supposed to be a perma-blue state. It says a lot about how confident they are in winning it if they have to run ads there.

2016

user, both Nixon and Reagan took Cali. Thinking “the left has won permanently” is the only way they have ANY power at all.

From what I've heard.

Jesus I almost choked when I saw this article. I've been memeing this in my own head for a couple weeks almost down to the letter. In my daydreams, I organize a live open poll of exactly 50,000 people, 1,000 from each state. It's not so massive for Trump but it is different from the media polls.

You're right though, that sample is deeply flawed, it should be weighted by electoral votes. The randomness i got, you simply get a bressers book or something similar and just flat call random people by a simple formula,

The key, I thought, was to do it quick, and live. Have like a hundred bitter bernie babies show up with laptops, give them each a cheap headset, and have them all livestream their calls on upstream and youtube. They call each random person and ask

1. You gonna vote/are e? If so,
1 Trump, Hillary or other for President
2. Who did you vote for in the primaries

Won't get a hit every time, but can get lots of hits, and by law of large enough number you can get a pretty clear picture of the electorate. Also, it can be sold to the Bern Bro operatives as revenge for the dnc holocaust, and sold to the public as independent polling since the callers are not from either campaign.

The key is live. Get them in there live, on a weekend, preferably soon, before the football starts, and have them burn through 10 hours a day for Saturday and Sunday. Blow up the streams on social media and try to make them trend.

Pay the Bern Bros with pizza lunch and keep them all in the same room to peer pressure them into staying, and they each work until 250 responses for the day. At the end, add up the numbers and cap off the stream with analysis, striking while the iron is hot and hopefully getting one of the networks to report on it.

Arguably better than typical landline phone polls, but they do end up skewed. Most Dem primary internet polls showed Bernie dominating.

Not only that, they're running the ads in spanish
archive.is/4cyvY

But user, whyever would THAT be?

The intent of that may be to improve the abysmal hispanic voter turnout.

it's likely most Hispanics are following this line of thought

it's pretty likely that among legal Hispanics trump is 60-70%

even blacks like Trump since rappers have been idolizing him for decades

the Hillary campaign accurate internal polling must be having them shitting themselves

I guarantee the "secret Trump supporter" phenomenon will be yuge. Even exit polls will undercount this election severely; if he polls anywhere near 50% in polls leading up to and including election day, he'll win in a landslide.

Kek gives his blessing to this new meme

I've seen polls where Johnson and Stein beat Hillary
If That happens on the the day then it's going to cause the death of the Democrat Party

This is a bit wishful thinking to be honest. Realistically Trump will not win the non-white vote: blacks won't vote for him because they've been completely brainwashed as Democrat loyalists, and Mexicans won't vote for him because those that are legal most likely have friends/family that are illegal and don't want them deported.

Fortunately he'll win anyway because whites are not only still a strong majority, but also have the highest turnout.

So what you're saying is that we're going to Annex Canada
I'm up with that

I got you famalam.
Kek confirms you're onto something.

Who in the fuck is Darrel Castle?

I can't imagine the black Turnout being 2008 or 2012 levels and while Hispanic turnout is going to be higher than usual Trump is getting 12-15% more than what is precedented for Republicans

Nah

He checked them while getting his own dubs

Constitution Party, Basically they're the real Lolberg Party and not the Democrat Lite party the Libertarian Party is

Oh shit, I'm sorry.

I'll check yours then.

Kikebart article about media colluding against Trump, compares it to Brexit:

archive.is/Jbqze

OMG

Sorry, I haven't the time to humor you any longer, I had to lift weights and put 5 miles on the stationary bike.
Now I must hit the hay, as I have to rise at 4:00 AM (as usual) to do a few chores & work on a report.

I don't try to scratch out a living shilling for shekels a post, I have a business to run & a real life to lead.

Sorry you're so upset by this poll, which is just as legitimate as any poll currently being trumpeted by the lugenpresse.

Hillary is going down in flames, and you know it.

(checked)

My body is ready.

I can confirm Shillary is running ads in SoCal

Video of mostly empty Hillary venue.

youtu.be/XK1qgKQpSnA

...

That's why she's copied him lately, she said something today about punishing companies that send jobs over seas. Her and biden did that event in a fucking airplane hangar, just like trump. But she only filled the front few rows, rest of the place was empty.

It's obvious they're rig every election, but this time it's clearly all bullshit. She's barely a candidate, doesn't talk to the media ever and has no real voter support, is sick as hell. She's clearly someone's puppet, she would rather be home in bed.

It's all fabricated, election season is about money in the media industry. Trump hasn't spent any, meaning they haven't made anything off him thus far. They've only given him free media so they can get what viewers they can who tune in to see trump. If they just came out and said, Trump's winning so hard it's already over then they'd all be unemployed.

Ultimately the monster vote silent majority will overpower their normal cheating, which has them panicked. In the process of them shitting while knowing this fact, we see all their masks slip off.

charlotteobserver.com/news/local/article94274037.html
archive.is/53peJ

Is this a CTR containment thread? Seems to be doing a good job, keep it up.

...

But this is a bias in and of itself

They did the same thing with Herbert Hoover telephone polling in the 30s. It looked like he was going to blow FDR the fuck out, without realizing that only wealthier, affluent people owned telephones.

Same thing happening here. Who still has a house phone over a cell phone? That's right, older, wealthier people. So is it any suprise this poll comes out skewed the exact opposite way of the lügenpresse's scam polls? How many 20 year old SJWs actually have a "home phone" in their college dorms? Most Shillary supporters are young, brainwashed, poor, and stupid. These people are less likely than older and more affluent Trump supporters to own home phones.

tl:dr

It's fucking nothing.

& then I come here & it's fucking obvious how well he's doing. Should I even bother correcting him or just wait for his first day in office to hit?

PARKINSON'S DISEASE
PANTSUIT DIARRHEA

Underrated post

AYO HOL UP

Clinton's base is tech-illiterate baby-boomer grandmothers and their emasculated husbands. grandmothers are even more likely than Grumpy Old Men to have a landline rather than a cell phone because they can't into technology. the ones that do have a cell phone have a landline too.

You don't need OP's poll to know that MSM polls are completely fucked when you have the outlets themselves ADMITTING TO TAMPERING WITH THEM.

archive.is/HJL5u

archive.is/d898N

archive.is/5JFs2

Anyone who still trusts a poll that shows such a huge swing in a single day is a complete and utter moron. If this were literally any other situation, the people in charge of these polls would be fired.

This. 1000 per state isn't going to tell you much. Republicans win smaller population states, Democrats win bigger states unfortunately.

failing to weight the poll according to each state's number of electoral votes does indeed introduce a bias vs. what we will see in actual election results. or what we would see if the voting machines weren't all fucking rigged.

So what actually happened to The Longroom? All I can gather is CTR gloating over how (((Nate Silver))) spooked them.

This is the guy who conducted this "poll". You faggots are getting are getting cucked so hard and you're either too stupid or too delusional to realize it. Never change, gents.

I want Nate Silver to predict 100% Clinton victory after the first debate.

...

What's wrong with this guy, user?

When was that poll taken?

EVERY TIME SHE TELLS A LIE

abcnewsgo.co/2016/08/abc-live-poll-will-donald-trump-make-america-great-again/
dob geg

THE TRUTH COMES OUT AND SOMEONE DIES

So what you are saying is if the holocaust happened, so did that poll?

Anyone can vote for that one though, can't they? Hardly representative of anything. It may piss of cucks though, so it has some use.

Kek. I can't believe this thread is still up. It's like the mods want this place to look as retarded as possible.

You're a intellectual now harry potter. lol the fuck

I agree… other than the op and maybe 3-4 post, everything else is utter garbage.

...

...

...

=THIS IS WHY AMERICANS NEED TO ABSOLUTELY MAKE SURE RIGGING IS IMPOSSIBLE! GET THE FUCK OUT THERE AND MAKE SURE THEY(((MICROSHAFT))) DONT SUPPLY THE VOTING MACHINES==

does anyone else hate chinks?

Keep that shit contained on reddit or wherever you found it, thanks.

suck it up buttercup

Trump 70%
Clinton 8%

abcnewsgo.co/2016/08/abc-live-poll-who-are-you-voting-for/

Bernie Sanders was BTFOing her on every internet poll and look what happened.

Ebin

The poll doesn't even account for the fact that the states have different populations, you'll have Wyoming hugely overrepresented and California hugely underrepresented.

Are cell phone numbers not public in America or something? Why does "homes" have to mean house phone?

SAGE
SAGE
SAGE

Stop bumping this stupid thread. It's just an e-mail hoax, the Arizona Freedom Alliance says they didn't make the poll and when you try to find out who did it the trail is a dead end.

8ch.net/faq.html
What is "sage"? Posters may reply to threads without bumping them to the top of the index by putting "sage" in the email field.

Avon is a big-time pyramid scheme that hires gullible goyim who think they can earn money by selling their (Avon) products, but the only thing they do is lose money.

Anyone who has a partnership with Avon is a retard optimistic enough to believe that their net income will ever be more than 500 dollars in their whole 'career'.

just another meaningless poll

There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics

Benjamin Disraeli-redpilled jew

is that different elsewhere?

How the fuck do you get fourth place in an (effectively) two party state?

I doubt anything will happen before the election but between Nov and Jan anything can happen.
Maybe we will see a military coup from Obama's yes men. They will reason that Trump is too dangerous or something to that effect.

We've seen Trump dial back his rhetoric so he is still being controlled but his promises will hurt them in the long run. Rigging the election is viable because the media has been saying Trump has no chance of winning and it will be no surprise when he loses.

I think most people seriously overestimate the intelligence of the people in charge and they may believe their own propaganda.

by being the best candidate?

polls are designed to shape public opinion, not reflect it

Where are all these newfags comming from?

Gtfo normie

But trump is going to lose texas, rcp says so

Sounds more like it.

Its probably just people fleeing halfchan on account of the shilling level over there.

they are ignorant whoever they are.

the numbers just keep rolling in

abcnewsgo.co/2016/08/abc-live-poll-who-are-you-voting-for/

Sage for hoax.

Reported for kike shill.

It's fake. Check out the other links on the page. Nothing there. But ya gotta wonder why ABC hasn't gone after them.

if those ratings are remotely true than hillary and her puppet masters will have no option other than to kill Trump. I honestly would not put it past them, they have the money, connections, soldiers, will, motivation etc to do it. I'm scared for Trump, he's a bit naive and thinks this is all just about politics when in fact it's about powerful criminals protecting billions of dollars worth of contracts and keeping power.

And I forgot to add: Perhaps they have no problem muddying the water with disinformation.

says who?
some yes, some no. the site def looks newish and not quite filled out
plausible deniability ?

I truly think that a businessman / builder as successful as Donald Trump has been is quite well aware of the level of corruption and nastiness involved with that level of politics

Hey, did anyone save the analysis thread in which the polls from at least one outlet were proven to be falsified?

Or does anyone have any direct links to both current polls’ falsification AND proof of manipulation of the DNC primaries?

archive.is/2G5Tg

archive.is/d898N

It's fake and gay, disinformation at best. Can't help you otherwise.

Just take a look at the fucking headlines too. Do those look like the lead stories on your average MSM site?

abcnewsgo.co

says the increasingly nervous shill for the umpteenth time

Look at the site for christ's sake. You think that shit is real?

dear user, you can say that about almost any site on the internet.
I agree it looks a bit odd, but can you find any reliable source that says it's fake?
as myself and

have noted, it is indeed odd that the site has been up for as long as it has been up with no repercussions or MSM condemnation

So you think ABC is now posting 100% pro-Trump articles, videos and polls?

Well, it doesn't surprise me one bit. CTR shills are still trying to downplay these polls as fake, but then praise the obviously rigged polls.

Its not impossible. We know most polls are bullshit lies anyways, maybe they're finally wanting to get on the right side of history.

Why hasn't ABC sued them yet if its "fake" as you claim?

to be perfectly honest user, I'm not quite sure what to think about it.
1. it's a fake site
2. it's an authorized site
is there a 3rd option?

I think the 70% Trump / 8% Clinton probably isn't too far off from how the burger public actually feels and that's something that the (((MSM))) isn't going to spread

About as likely as Clinton dropping out of the race.

It's a trolling site imo but the sentiment in the online polling is real.

So likely then, seeing as she's half dead already?

Again, why haven't they been sued yet?

Again, why haven't they been sued yet?

Dunno, not a lawyer.

Maybe CTR should invest in one.

Hillary will never get so low.
This poll is as trustable as what Holla Forums spouts out.

my best guess is that it's a honeypot to collect unique IPs and browser fingerprints along with political leanings

Yeah, that too.

Wonderful, thanks.

it's a warped world and I'm a happy guy, glad to help

dubito ergo cogito erto sum

you should realize that the whole web is a data harvesting machine for various factions at this point in time.

Stop bumping this stupid thread dumbass.

no

Fuck you fag
: ^ )

I love how triggered the shills got by this thread

NO

and the numbers just keep rolling in folks… doesn't seem like there's much support for $hillibilly on the interwebz

abcnewsgo.co/2016/08/abc-live-poll-who-are-you-voting-for/

yup, me 2

God damn a sperg like no other.

We're waiting for heathens to slay signaling themselves, like the jews with parenthesis.

Finally we can unleash RWCS. Useful idiots such as yourself will be the perfect catalyst.

Yeah this seems about as bullshit as the rest of the left wing polls. I have a hard time believing Hillary is only at 19%.

A lot of people in Cuckifornia don't put up house signs because they don't want to be robbed.

my neighbor who supports trump has a hillary sign out front.

Fuck, ABC just had to ruin a decent online poll with retarded arithmetic.

That's a flawed method though. There aren't an equal number of republicans, democrats, and independents.

Christcucks not even defend this but even gloat about it.

There's a reason you're called Christcucks

It's not an ABC News website retards.

is this a shill or just a dumbass who can't into addition?
*gotta be a democrat because they can't add and can't use a calculator *

says the increasingly nervous shill for the umpteenth time hoping desperately that someone somewhere will believe his pathetic lies
if you're so sure it's fake, prove it!
*protip… hahahahaha you can't! *

In the 30s, wealthier people DID own telephones. But now every poorfag has one, come on, that's no bias.

Trump will probably win in a landslide but pushing disinfo sites will get you no credit.

OP's article is bullshit, you're not even defending it anymore but now you're clinging to an online poll in which anyone can probably vote multiple times. Are you that dumb for real? The mainstream media polls are bullshit but this ABC online poll is a joke and the man who seems to be behind the hoax OP is pushing is a nobody who sells Avon products

Anyone bumping this stupid thread on purpose is a confirmed low IQ moron.

Thanks, Satan. When it comes to Liars, I'm sure you can tell me who they are.

It's not like you have her file down in HR by the Styx or anything.

Whatever CTR.

Either way, we win. IT'S HAPPENING!

try, go ahead try and see what results you get

prove it!

Trump still running 70% to $hillibilly's meager 8%

the butthurt from an online poll is hilarious

Shills are so desperate.

wtf are you talking about 70 plus 11 plus 11 plus 8 is exactly 100%

wtf where did you get your math skills?

CTR shills BTFO
americanstrawpoll.com/survey/august16/results

So, their sample consisted of exactly as many people from say Alaska or North Dakota as people from say New York or California? For those shilling this poll, take a second to think about that one. And before you say "well, they probably weighted the sample by state population", someone actually asked one of the people involved in the poll about this in a comment at archive.is/5znz6 –

The guy gave a weaselly response which didn't deny the basic accusation they were treating all states as equal:

The Trump apologists here will probably just say that the other polls are secretly rigged in ways that are just as bad, but at least the other polls aren't advertising blatantly retarded methodology in their press releases…

We should accrue data from the websites and show that the "official" polls are being rigged in a picture/infographic

ABC had a poll that showed Trump at 70% and Hillary was below Jill Stein and Gary Johnson in votes out of 80,000 people.

bumping to piss off shills

Wow, look at that everyone, an average Jew who hates the truth and wants to hide it. Is such a thing even possible?

what a time to be alive

For the 6 millionth time, the poll itself is as real as any online poll can be. The problem is that it's on some fraudsters fake ABC website. But you already know that.

(((185e74))) is an actual shill. While calling everyone else shills. The domain shit has been refuted like six times in this thread but he's defending it with retarded logical fallacies like "if that site were fake, Disney would've sued them!" No they wouldn't have, because it's a fake site that gets no traffic and wouldn't catch Disney's attention for a while (if ever). This tactic has been around for years shilling scammy weightloss products and shit.

Anyway, what are you doing here? Trying to get some juicy screenshots for a plebbit post about how gullible those ebil trump supporters are? Go play another round of politically-correct Cards Against Humanity with the rest of your genderfluid friends.

wat

my numerical skills are more than adequate see the original posting of that mental midget math

You keep saying that shit, but you cannot prove that it's fake, nobody out there on the interwebz is calling it fake publicly, so why don't you just admit that it's not fake.

are you saying Disney corp isn't suing them because… reasons?
prove the site is fake then genius

the numbers just keep rolling in for the Donald and the 10:1 ratio is still holding

we did, multiple times. i don't know what condition you want met in order for this to be proven any more than it has.

by the way, since this is probably your site, don't you think you should've put something, anything, on all the other website categories? they're all blank: abcnewsgo.co/category/tech/

hey look at that, the website's gone! – abcnewsgo.co

pure coincidence, im sure.

Okay yaaaa, she can pull half a highschool gym.

Trump is fucking renting STADIUMS. which are packed

WTF are you missing here. Or trying to defend?

that's like saying. ya…my rabbit can go 20 mph, just because it's not as fast as your racehorse who goes 50mph
They are still the same!!!!

NO THEY ARE NOT