What is the best Batman movie and why is it Mask of the Phantasm?

I think another thing important about Andrea, compared to the other women in his life, is she was engaged to Bruce, not Batman. His relationship with Catwoman, Talia, Wonder Woman, etc. were all as Batman. And Batman is the mission. Anyone who accepted Batman as part of Bruce was basically accepting that he's never settle down, because his commitment is to being Batman first. The only way to get him to settle would have been to get him to stop being Batman, and none of those women would ask that of him, and he'd never get close to a woman that would ask that of him. So that was his one shot at a normal life.

That music is exquisite, and a big part of why the movie is so good.

Did you just watch the film? I can't help but notice you jacking it off over here.

I've seen it several times in my life. It never fails to impress.

The whole love interest angle was done so much better in this movie than in Batman Begins. I watched both in close proximity and the similarities were startling.

Though the Nolan movies and the DCAU are very different beasts which bear the thumbprint of their creators distinctly.

It's an odd thing with Nolan. He can't seem to write women, most of the relationships in his films seem rather sterile and emotionless. This wouldn't be a problem if they were all male action fests but for some reason Nolan's always got to have some kind of romantic relationship in his films.

That swell in the music clinched it. I've watched the movie twice before, and this still got me.

Ah, found it.

Poor Alfred had just wanted his surrogate son to recover and be happy. Now that will never happen.

That's an odd picture for Batman Beyond: Return of the Joker.

But even though MotP was great, RoJ still holds a higher place in my heart. If I was to sum up the entire experience of RoJ I'd say it made me feel old. Not in the sense of bad writing or outdated animation or writing. But that after that entire experience from the movie it had me feel the time that passed by in the Animated Series. No other episode or movies related to DCAU made me feel that more than RoJ. I enjoyed that. It felt like watching a home video with nostalgia on the sofa with me watching the movie. Not some deep thought provoking metaphor, but the simple enjoyment and satisfaction of the entire ride of life the Batman: The animated series.

Return of the Joker was depressing.

Although the two movies together make me wonder why Timm was so insistent on adapting Batman: Year One and The Killing Joke because he's done both much better with Phantasm and Return of the Joker respectively. Not only did he do them better but he made them his own instead of just adapting somebody else's work.

It's not like that problem is unique to him, Hollywood thinks you need a love interest in every movie to ensure maximum profits.

…But not to completion. That was a good noir flick. Right down to no one getting their heart's desire.

he did good with his own but The killing joke has probably always been something he's wanted to do.
having to adapt a movie for a story that differs in energy probably made it how it is.

And I get that, but with Nolan it just seems so dispassionate. Most of these are bland, frumpy women. Sort of like his wife, which might explain quite a bit. I think, in at least three of his movies (Memento, The Prestige, Inception) his leads are motivated by the death of their wives but with maybe the exception of Memento, you never really buy it and if you do it's like 'Really? Her?'

See, at least with a Bond movie, there's the standard girl. Bond might not love her but from the way they write it you could believe that he at least feels something for these women. If he were to take revenge because Blofeld or somebody killed his woman, you could believe it.

And I'm saying that's odd because he's done it. Not only done it but done it better in some ways.

Probably because he doesn't seem to really be bothered with it when pretty much every other relationship seems more interesting.

More authors need to do an Oda and just not bother with romantic subplots rather than shoe them in everywhere.

Then why is it there? I refuse to buy 'because the execs wanted it' because Nolan's early work was indie stuff where he basically did what he wanted, and with his later stuff he got so much clout that he basically does what he wants. This stuff is in there because he chooses to put it in there and for some reason nobody's told him he can't write women or romance.

Not like that stops any other writers and directors. And good question, though I think the idea is that Bruce Wayne's love interest is, like in Phantasm, his last connection to the sane, normal world that doesn't involve dressing up in costumes and getting in fistfights with criminals. Also no coincidence that he fucks not-Talia when he thinks he's done being Batman, and retires with Selina when he IS done.

Of course, just because mostly everything Nolan does is extremely deliberate, doesn't mean he does it well. Also, execs probably have influence with a goddamn Batman movie.

yes

both batman begins and man of steel present a "hero's journey" that consists of the protagonist doing almost nothing interesting until he's nearing middle age, then being forced into action by the villain, at which point he turns into a somewhat shitty and underconfident version of his comic self almost overnight

it seems to be david goyer's thing somehow

the whole damn movie

one freaking line about dick

and then the totally official and canon ;) comics got a hold of the poor bastard