I know most people here are on the same page that Trump and Russia didn't collaborate to take down Clinton etc during the campaign or that the DNC leak didn't come from Russia but just in case there are still anons here who are on the fence or have liberal friends who won't shut the fuck up about it:
The Same People Who Called the WMD lie what it is the day Colin Powell lied to the UN, the Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity, have written a memo to Trump revealing their findings of a forensic investigation in the DNC Leak.
They have found that it was strictly a LEAK not a HACK, AKA an insider took info they had free access to and revealed it to Wikileaks somebody didn't break into the DNC from the outside. They have also found that the leaker had to have been in the East Coast time zone of the United States.
They also point out to Trump that the Vault 7 releases back in March revealed that the CIA now has the ability to digitally cover its tracks by blaming other countries for their own covert operations including leaks and hacks.
Furthermore, Wikileaks recently released information showing that CNN, NBC, and the Washington Post directly collaborated with the DNC to influence public opinion during the election. This emphasizes the importance of the story in the DNC Leaks where Debbie Wasserman Schulz, while still DNC Chair, pressured MSNBC's Morning Joe to stop being so openly pro-sanders and critical of Clinton.
Thus the DNC's line is repeated almost verbatim in the liberal wing of the media and we now have the documentation to prove it: archive.is/X7nt2
TL;DR within the same week we have a Wikileak which proves that the DNC's word goes almost unchallenged in the liberal side of the corporate media of the US AND veterans of the US intelligence community publishing their findings which show that the DNC leak did NOT come from Russia and that there was no HACKING of the DNC. There was a leak by an internal actor who more than likely used CIA technology to associate the hacking with Russia
Are these new releases by Wikileaks or are they part of the old Podesta leaks that nobody got off their asses to synthesize?
Brody Robinson
We never believed the Russia Cheetoman bullshit because we're not liberals
Jaxson Hill
I wish Trump actually had some balls and declared a state of emergency tbqh.
Juan White
What the hell is even the purpose of masking your leak to make it look like a Russian hack, undermining the very credibility of the leak?
Blake Williams
Yeah this is just one faction of the establishment vying for political power against the Goldman Sachs faction, a grand theater trying to convince the proletariat that they have our backs and aren't funneling our stolen labor into the pockets of their cronies.
William Price
I am so confused here, I don't remember Guccifer 2.0 sending his shit to Wikileaks.
Julian Wright
It was made to look like a hack so it would lose credibility.
Thomas Robinson
Why would the leaker want to undermine their own credibility?
Chase Lee
He didn't. He appeared after the leaks started and it's likely he was an attempt to undermine the leaks' legitimacy.
Brody Robinson
Did Guccifer and Wikileaks both release the same set of leaks?
Joseph Wood
Nah. I'm at work right now so I'm afraid I can't look for it, but Craig Murray participated in the leaks and has several posts on his website talking about it, and iirc talks about the role guccifer2 played in the whole affair.
Oliver Ortiz
They're both the Goldman Sachs faction.
Aaron Smith
...
Brandon Russell
Of course course he won't, he's been friends of the Clintons for decades.
Ayden Watson
The leaker was probably a CIA connected agent or some such shit. Both parties, particularly the Democrats in the last few years, have wanted Putin's head on a platter for a while. Seth Rich probably wasn't some arbiter of justice if he was indeed the leaker, he more than likely was doing Clinton's bidding or was a useful idiot and then got whacked when he outlived his usefullness
Pic semi related
Guccifer is most likely some kind of patsy/distraction
This is all a Ruling Class manipulation to finally get Russia under it's control like it tried to with Yeltsin back in the 90s. If anyone is confused by what I mean read this piece:
Have you tried to calmly explain to them at the least the story of how the CIA helped organize the overthrow of Allende, a democratically elected progressive, and installed the fascsist Pinochet and neoliberal economic theorists?
If that's too "conspiratorial" for your liberal friend ask them why you should trust an organization that said Iraq definitely had WMDs back in 2003 which allowed one of the most right wing presidents in history to start a war which has wasted trillions in taxpayer dollars and killed hundreds of thousands of civilians, mostly children
Grayson Bell
Nah, point out they were behind the crack epidemic and it was proven in court. He won't give a shit about South America if he's a liberal.
Brandon Morris
Good point
Freeway is literally a netflix original documentary about this very thing
Nicholas Harris
Nonsense, the CIA has a vested interest in keeping the Democratic Party establishment alive and healthy. The DNC invited fucking Mike Pompeo to speak at their last convention.
Ayden Williams
Got a source?
Cooper Evans
fuck off shillcen
Dylan Young
You're missing the point entirely.
What was meant was: The DNC and CIA need a reason to get Russia under the control of oligarchs sympathetic to global capitalism ASAP
The CIA, probably with the help of some DNC higher ups, leaks info which destroys Clinton's chances of winning the Presidency.
Trump, who literally everyone associated with the Democrats or with the Left hates in the USA, is now President, and his Vice President is literally George W. Bush 2.0 and has openly disagreed with Trump on Russia numerous times. Nearly his entire cabinet are neocons, neoliberals, big oil, and bankers. His own UN ambassador often talks of how important it is to get Syria and Russia under control and openly supported the color revolution in Ukraine which put literal Nazis in charge a couple of years ago
The Democrats, now that Trump is tied to Russia through the phony finger prints and their media manipulation, keep trying to build enough evidence for an impeachment. It's basically a win win for the Dems because either 1) They successfully impeach Trump and then Pence, with a cabinet full of the worst of the worst of American Capitalism is leading the country with a Republican majority in congress or 2) Trump fully capitulates over time to the agenda of said cabinet
It's looking more and more likely that the 2nd option is going to happen as the DNC haven't spoken of impeachment for a few weeks now and neither have the media, but remember how big of a deal it was for a while and recall that virtually everyone who was so anti-Trump in the news had some kind of tie to the establishment. They even tried to rehab George W. Bush for fuck's sake
Owen Peterson
Can someone explain this "reddit spacing" meme to me? Is this ironic shitposting or postironic shitposting or what?
Levi Reed
They mostly say stuff like "well we used to do bad stuff but that was the republicans and were better now and the CIA is made of human being too stop being paranoid…"
Logan Allen
Sounds like a 5D chess theory to me. Are you going to tell me the CIA Vault 7 leaks were deliberate next?
James Morgan
Can't find anything about it being proven in court, largely due to Netflix running a series on it recently and the CIA has gone into full damage control mode. It wasn't specifically the CIA being found guilty in court of cocaine trafficking, but it was accepted they were involved in it as a fact in another court case on the peripherals of it all.
Henry Scott
No? The CIA wouldn't leak info that discredited their media manipulations so that's highly unlikely.
Also I know that the 5D Chess meme is funny whenever it's applied to Trump himself because the man is idiotic, but the CIA and other intelligence communities literally play 5D chess constantly all around the world to help manage American Empire and if you don't accept this as fact you know little about how US intelligence operates. It's why the intelligence industries often end up funding sects of civil wars that are fighting each other or end up having to go to war with terrorists who used to be their best friends.
Wyatt Moore
What bothers me is so many libs in the media and the more crazy Clinton libs irl actually want trump impeached. Why? He doesn't really control any real power he makes a fool out of himself on the daily and is reneging on all his campaign promises. He's good for building opposition against if you do it right(which dems don't to because their incompetent shills). Plus if he is impeached you get mike pence who is so much fucking worse. Who is clamoring for the typical neocon fundie who will do anything the republican and alphabet soup want. And he could actually get shit passed ALL because these libs care more about discourse than ACTUALLY ADVANCING A POLITCAL AGENDA.
Thomas Nelson
The CIA and other intelligence agencies have demonstrated to be incompetent as fuck on occasion after occasion. Stop elevating these guys to mythical 007-tier professionals, these agencies are composed of fallible humans just like any other ogranization.
Jose Thompson
I'm not saying you're wrong, there are obviously some brilliant people working at the alphabet soup, but reading about their antics makes it seems like they fuck up as often as they actually manage something. 5D chess might be taking it a little high.
Jeremiah Phillips
Forgot to add, much of their success seems to come from their practically unlimited resources more than the excellence of the agency itself.
Nolan Green
I'm pretty sure they have contingency plans for all outcomes, so it's kind of like 5D chess, except they've just got a different gameplan for every outcome rather than have a specific goal in mind. Look up the policy of tension for more info on how they gain even when they fuck up.
Christian Thompson
I literally never said they were geniuses just that they are up to neffarious shit constantly that usually gets complicated and turns into a quagmire repeatedly. All I said was that it isn't far fetched to suppose my theory is correct or at least on the right track because the CIA does shit like this all the time and yes a lot of the time they do fuck it up. Also there are other competing agencies, such as the FBI, who work against them to undercut the CIA's ambitions.
Just cuz they play 5D chess doesn't mean they're masters of it
Jaxon Davis
Liberals in the United States see everything as a good vs evil morality play and because of their addiction to pop culture this is even further simplified and made into a farce. Impeaching Trump=Harry killing Voldemort for a lot of American liberals because American society is the most blatant example of what Debord was talking about back in the 60s
Also
The Democrats are partially incompetent, but if you think they are generally just stupid people who don't know how to build a resistance you're wrong. They don't WANT to build a real resistance because if they did they would have to actually give the working class and the various marginalized communities they pretend to be the beacon of hope for the things they need and want rather than just using them to further consolidate power
Daniel Jenkins
All of the evidence of le RUSSIAN HAXXING is completely made up.
I've been saying since day one this was an internal leak. It's probably as simple as a PO'd member of the Clinton campaign who wanted to show what cunts his/her bosses are, or at most a Republican that infiltrated the DNC (because Hillary is practically a Republican, this is pathetically easy). You don't need mad Russian Haxxing skillz to pull something like this, and the simpler explanation is leak which VIPS has confirmed.
Bentley Lee
This. Seeing the leaks it's pretty clear that Clinton is a huge narcissist and treats her employees like shit. I'd imagine becoming even slightly disillusioned in her machine would be a slippery slope to full betrayal once the ideology wears off.
Kayden Cox
So let me just get this straight, the sequence is that another leaker from earlier had passed on compromising data to the DNC, leading to Assange tweeting about the oncoming release, which lead to the CIA producing a doctored leak as a means of turning the predicament in their favor? Or was the whole leak, all the stuff revealing the DNC and Clinton's true allegiances, an inside job, with the information all secure beforehand?
As damage control it sounds extremely plausible, but it's hard to believe that legitimately damaging information would be leaked on purpose. Unless they thought Clinton had the election so in the bag they could have their cake and eat it too?
William Sanchez
I thought collusion with foreign nationals to influence their governments was a proud American tradition…
Evan Ortiz
Because Hillary Clinton gave Russia control of 20% of America's uranium production after receiving a $140,000,000 donation to her charitable foundation from Russian oligarchs which was the major weakness of her campaign
Luis Turner
I don't think the leaker masked their leak to look Russian. More likely Crowdstrike planted Russian fingerprints after the fact, and even more likely the whole "Russian signs" on the hack was a complete fabrication, since independent investigation of the matter has been suppressed. Dunno what OP is getting at exactly.
Adrian Sanchez
QUIT TRYING TO DIVIDE THE LEFT YOU BERNIEBRO THIS IS NOT THE TIME WHEN WE'VE GOT BLUMPF TO IMPEACH
Cameron Jenkins
Why would they destroy Clinton's chance at winning the presidency if they wanted to overthrow or undermine Putin (given how aggressively anti-Putin Clinton was)?
Clinton was like the ultimate neocon fantasy, i.e. a ruthlessly competent career politician foreign policy hawk that would enact imperialism with a feminist face. Considering the likelihood that the CIA tried to flip the mountain states via Evan McMullin's White House run, I doubt they were trying to sabotage her (even if she sold uranium to the Russians - she did it because she's a corrupt cunt, not because she's secretly sympathetic to Putin)
Wyatt Hill
Also "Russia hacked the elections" would've given President Hillary the perfect casus belli to ramp up whatever plans the CIA have/had to undermine Putin/Russia i.e. in Syria. I really don't see how it's anything approaching 5-d chess to undermine the presidential candidate that would give your organisation everything it wants on a silver platter
Justin Gomez
I guess what I'm trying to get at is the context behind this particular leak. Was this just one of the multiple leaks I remember happening, with a legitimate leaker supplying data to wikileaks first, leading the CIA to forge their own DNC leak with doctored ties to Russia in order to make the most of the predicament? Or was all the damaging DNC data, everything that revealed the DNC and Hillary's true allegiances, safe before, and purposely leaked in order to pin blame on Russia?
I guess my biggest question is where the file that VIPS analyzed (and the analysis is damning that it wasn't Russia) came from. I suppose it's also possible that there was only one leak, and the alleged Russia ties were added in later before release, it all depends on the source of the 7z file in question. That seems like the most likely situation here but I don't have enough background info to be sure.
The idea that the CIA believed the "97% proabable victory" meme about Hillary and leaked compromising information on purpose in order to give her a license for military action, thinking she could take the hit, but failing, is just the kind of Bay of Pigs grade blunder that it's an entertaining proposition as well.
Luke Foster
They didn't. Bush fucking lied about what intel he was getting.
Ayden Jackson
IIRC the only sources which claim Russian fingerprints are Crowdstrike, because the FBI wasn't allowed to look at the DNC servers. In any event, Russian signs could be planted after the fact to make the RUSH'N HAXXORS story look legit, or the government can just say whatever they want. This is the same government who directed news agencies to insinuate a tie between Saddam and AQ, so that Americans can be sold on that particular adventure - repeat a lie or misleading info often enough and enough people will believe in it. The current propaganda campaign in the press targeting Russia and Syria is intended for old people consumption, because keeping old people onside is a lot easier than keeping young people onside. The young are either considered outside the mainstream and beyond hope, or they're apologists for the US Regime that will cynically accept any justification and honestly believe in US imperialism for its own sake. During the run-up to the Iraq war, I knew more than a few young people who just accepted the war as a way to get cheap oil.
I don't think Trump or Clinton matters to the ruling class. Once the primaries were over, you have two candidates who are close friends of each other, who will collaborate on any issue the deep state really needs. The reason you didn't see an NFZ in Syria is because cooler heads prevailed and realized what an absolutely retarded idea it would be, and that Assad will eventually win the SCW barring a full US invasion. Clinton's rhetoric on Syria was her attempt to talk tough, doing her best Republican impersonation in the hopes that she'd capture that vote. Whatever happens in FP happens when it needs to happen, or doesn't happen. I think ultimately the US will invade Syria, but the time to do so will be when Assad attempts to turn on SDF/YPG, not while fighting CIA-backed jihadi proxies.
Joseph Flores
Okay, now that I actually RTFA, I get what it is: - Someone leaked DNC docs on June 12 2016 (this is the infamous DNC leaks) - Guccifer 2.0 leaks drop on July 5 2016. This leak is a false flag from the CIA to implicate the Russians, releasing non-consequential information and putting a Russian stamp on it. This is supposed to be "evidence" to pin all DNC hacks on ze Russians.
I honestly think the hacks story is not going to hold up, but now that the Establishment has their special prosecutor, he's going to open the investigation to Trump's Russian business ties and try to find something.
Ultimately I think nothing will come of it, because releasing too much would also show too many American pols' corrupt entanglements with foreign governments, plus Trump is not an actual threat to the fourth branch of government.
I don't think it's about Trump, it's about any future insurgent candidates that want to run in 2018-2020, a threat that they better toe the party line or there will be a price to pay. The Republicans don't want any more Trumpublicans and the Democrats want to make sure the Left gets squashed. It will succeed in stifling political entryism and that's all that's needed, a bludgeon to use against anyone that wants to be an important person. Actually convincing the masses of the Russia bullshit is clearly not working, outside of old people (which is important to keep the gerontocracy in charge alive).
Jose Rogers
Holy shit man, none of that matters. First off in your opinion, why should I care about any of this? What difference does it make? Is this some grand conspiracy to make the Dems look like "the Victims"? Because just so you are aware, you are on Leftypol, here most of us have mixed feelings about somebody like Bernie Sanders, and not from the liberal standpoint. We are beyond that shit man, we already know both parties are two sides of the same coin, pro capitalist fucking scum. Even if Trump did collude it wouldn't change a damn thing, since the only difference between a Trump and a Clinton presidency is the media wouldn't be throwing a fit as Clinton fucked us in the ass, the same way Trump is. We are aware of that. Read some Marx, or read some (inb4 tankie ragestorm) some Bookchin, recognize all this shit you spent time typing up is a fucking show, a charade, and get knowledgable on some praxis my dude. Recognize the capitalists as the enemy they are.
Wyatt Myers
Putin's still a corrupt capitalist fuck. This whole thing is a struggle between capitalist powers surrounded by the utmost spectacle - the proles shouldn't take a side in this battle. We should have no dellusions about the "heroic" US Empire & its bullshit - but we shouldn't try to whitewash Russia either. There's no reason to actually support Putin & his cabal of oligarchs - they're just as corrupt & just as willing to spin their own narrative - they just have less power. And whether Russia or America win this idiotic battle - neither will aid the common people.
Don't forget Russia & Putin's role in the Chechen Civil War.
Brody Sullivan
Plus even if the "Russia hacking" thing is just a meme (pretty sure it is) - I think it's quite clear Trump does have at least business ties to Russia. All this shit with the Donald Trump Jr meeting & collusion reeks of spectacle but I don't doubt that it could all be real. But here's the thing.
Even if Trump teamed up with Daddy Putin - it doesn't matter. There is no side here supporting the proles. If they hacked the US election it doesn't matter - the US Empire has hacked/corrupted/shut-down a million more "elections" & the power of the prole in the US election is so low that it really doesn't matter. Liberals getting so upset about how our "democracy" has been compromised don't realize that we barely have a democracy - only a democracy for the capitalists. And it doesn't matter who gave us those leaks - no matter their agenda I like giving more info from the corrupt powers into the hands of the people.
Ultimately none of this matters & I'm sick of both US apologists & Russia supporters.
Eli Rodriguez
...
Anthony Gray
>rt.com/news/382940-wikileaks-vault7-marble-framework/ Ok obviously most people HERE, including me, are on your side on this; but there's NO WAY you don't see the problem of using an RT story to prove your point to those who aren't already on your side. Is there a better source?
