North Korea defector returns home calling South 'capitalist hell'

Hm seems the headshave is japan, but korea has similar shit with k-pop. And korea is even more superficial than japan as far as I know.

If you think that a refugee returns to North Korea because of a mere culture shock you are insanely classcucked and brainwashed

To be honest she did say that on north korean TV so she was probally either threatened or bribed.

I hear that a lot on this board, but I never really hear anyone say why.

Its more than that.

You make the claim, provide the evidence.

Not from this board. Korea is universally known as the country with an extreme focus on beauty. They give plastic surgery to their kids as a birthdaygift.

Compared to that, japan is pretty tame.

North korean goverment owns the TV station. They wouldn't allow someone saying something negative on their TV station.

South Korea is what Japan was in the 80s

businessinsider.com/kim-jong-un-defectors-return-2013-8

Are we completely eliminating the possibility that this couldn't have been a setup by NK themselves for exactly this purpose?

.t the linked article

Obviously they put her up on TV and probably also going to give her a nice apartment in that showcase apartment building next to the bronze statues that they show all the tourists and reporters. But so what? USA pampers these fucking Cuban dissidents in Florida for propaganda reasons, and the US is a country that treats immigrants like shit usually.

I just think it's ridiculous to always think because it's in North Korea it's all fake. Same with the people who believe literally everything they on these tours there is staged and everybody is an actor. They must be evil geniuses to set something up like that.

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We can't just discount the possibility that this is a kidnapping, considering they assassinated one of their own leaders family members in broad daylight and abducted Japanese residents from japan by boats during the 70's.
Sorry if we are skeptical of a revisionist quasi-nazi state, Kim.

so that makes what, 1 sk defector for every 100 nk defectors?

Jesus Christ you fuckers believe anything. There is no saving you.

Thank you for trying your best to stop western imperialist propaganda, one half cup of rice has been deposited in your Glorious People's burlap sack.

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Put on your tinfoil hat and stop spamming that video. We also can't discount the possibly that Obama wasn't born on American soil considering the US government lies all the time, checkmate I guess, uphold Marxism-Alex Jonesism

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It's so stupid right? In general we should only listen to what our trustworthy, independent and democratically controlled media says, like revered newsstations such as CNN

Yes? Video proof, shot in north korea, of an official north korea guide saying north korea doesnt follow the communist ideal anymore, and north korea removing communism from its constitution, is wrong? This is your brain on tanks.

1. It doesnt matter if obama was born on US soil
2. I will not stop spamming that video, because north korea is not a communist state, it doesnt follow communism, therefore I will post it again and again any time someone even implies north korea is communist in the slightest. Even claiming china is secretly communist has more validity.

This is your brain on tankism, folks…

Get a load of this guy

You haven't actually read the article have you?

No you moron.
This means the party condones this message. And the fact that north korea removed communism from its constitution further supports this claim.

You can keep LARPing about how north korea is secretly communist but it is openly NOT communist.

The thing is, is that nobody in this thread so far has claimed it is communism m8. You preemptively posted a video to shut down an argument nobody was even making yet and are acting all victimized because we called you on it.

you make the claim you post the source, that's how it works. The claim was made ITT that this is false testimony and nobody has provided any sources other than the standard "Well North Korea is JUST bad!" meme peddled by the US government, particularly by Neocons and the CIA, who are known for their integrity right?

The Reddit infestation of Holla Forums is getting annoying as fuck honestly. I know that it was never even close to being a tankie board but at least the libertarians could argue. You cunts just go "Yeah but your narrative isn't the mainstream narrative therefore I don't have to actually prove my point like I would in any other argument I just have to keep ridiculing your position with mockery then I win xD"

Some of north korea is real. Its not nearly as awful as the west tells you it is but Its still a starving oligarichical state.

You know this how?

Nord Corea is not gommunist, as in NATIONAL COMMUNISM, amrite xD

They maotist mentioned the tourist tours isnt a playset so I posted a video of said tour.

Then I said that we should be skeptical of north korea and theres no good reason to defend it, because it is openly not communist.

You are not a marxist, you are thinking communism exists when people subscribe to an ideology. This is pure idealism. They are still saying they are a socialist state anyway. Rojava doesn't even say that - I guess that makes Rojava less communist than the DPRK according to your retarded logic

I never fucking said that tour guides aren't briefed by the government. I'm saying that this guy isn't a reliable source on how their fucking mode of production operates

New York Times. Pretty much every western researcher admits that they overcame food shortages from the 90s by now.

no u
also

ignore also

Just because you think your mental fantasies are based in reality doesn't make it so, user. You've had enough shit posting for one night, kiddo.

He provided arguments. You're the one shitposting.

Point out exactly where I said any of that
Oh wait you can't because it's impossible for you to justify your claims :^)

Lmao defector are such grifters

You played the game of words, not me, don't you fucking dare invoke Marx now after you've engaged in late stage liberalism and rejected economic analysis

There have been a lot of accumulated links about the DPRK that have been posted here before. Do you want me to post them? You want to be critical about the North Korean state media? Be my guest. But at the same time believe western propaganda? Pure liberal conditioning my mate

NK has its problems but calling it a "quasi-Nazi" state is just a complete lie and serves the interests of imperialism

It's funny, someone who doesn't even consider the possibility an intelligence agency might do something like this as a psyop claims to know anything about the CIA

Literally 99.9% of news about North Korea is negative. It's the subject of a relentless, suffocating propaganda campaign. Prestigious papers of record frequently make basic factual errors and fail to make any effort to verify sources. Everything you hear about it IS wrong.

what the hell?

visual aid

I never said I didn't consider it a possibility I simply asked for a source

We are like 60 percent of the time tbh

And I never made the claim that it was, I simply asked a question

Ok mate, lets engage your problem from three angles:

1. Ultraleft, socialism and marxism is the same, therefore you cant have socialist but not communism, and socialism cant have a state
2. Socialism and communism are different and marxism wants to achieve communism. Abandoning communism then, at a stage of socialism, ie proletarian dictatorship (which i find questionable in the case of NK) would mean maintaining state capitalism or a variant therefof
3. We only look at the economy, which we cannot confirm one way or the other. However, the concept of "north korea" that we have today does not fit a socialist mode of production, due to lack of democratic control by the workers, judging from the defectors, stories you read, the slaves they rent out to russia, nor does it have a socialist means of production, as evident by the special economic zone where capitalist companies can come and exploit cheap north korean labour.

So in 3 ways, north korea is an anti-marxist shitfest and I dont need to defend it. Go hang yourself with your noodles.

I ask you this, have you ever seen a more intense propaganda campaign since the Red Scare? USA literally made a movie about brutally murdering Kim Jong Ill and then cried about North Korea being upset about it. Imagine a country would make a movie about brutally murdering Obama while portraying him with nigger stereotypes

NOW THAT'S WHAT I CALL IDEOLOGY!

Based. Would watch that movie.

Anyway I wish the 50 cent army and Jason goodnight. Don't overdo it, you'd find that reddit has more gullible people.

And here you are talking out of your arse.
1. Cooperatives exist in North Korea, the economy is controlled by the Supreme People's Assembly of which all delegates are nominated by trade unions, cooperatives and the like.

2. You are confusing the Kaesong zone with the special economic zones, the former has been shut down last year. Now tell me laddy, how much percentage of their GDP actually comes from the SEZ or outsourced labor? You'll find that almost over 95% of their economic output is collectivized. Your arguments are shit man and you are a tool of imperialism. Good worker, no need to defend evil socialist countries!

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This mindset made Neocons out of Trotskysts during the Cold War.

The conditioning works.

Also here's some interesting links for anyone who is genuinely interested in the spin regarding North Korea:

North Korean defectors are paid, promised gifts if they embellish their stories and add elements that Westerners will find juicy:

theguardian.com/world/2015/oct/13/why-do-north-korean-defector-testimonies-so-often-fall-apart

youtube.com/watch?v=VfNHdhIE13A

Positive thing said about North Korea from defectors (who to be fair still appear to prefer the South personally from the videos, but the point is that North Korea isn't the big all-out devil that the West says it is):

youtu.be/EhmzpMP3bEE?t=11m45s

Nobody from the "50 cent army" has every posted anything on 4chan, reddit, or youtube. That's not what they are or what they do.

Proofs

Proofs

>inb4 I dont need to prove anything but you need to prove everything and otherwise youre just a jew imperialist shill.

I'm not going to defend north korea, but I am not advocating a fucking invasion or anything.
To me and my goals, the existance of north korea is only a net negative. The idea of North Korea is painted as evil, the image of NK is that of an evil "stalinist" place. If it would seize to exist, it would only take away the last scapegoat that the red scare can use, a scapegoat that does nothing for the communist movement wordwide.

I do not buy your claims that north korea is a socialist nation for one second, and I am not going to defend a nation on the miniscule chance that it is. The USSR couldn't do it, why would a country that has had 3 consecutive father-son politicians and shit geology be able to achieve socialism? There is absolutely zero verifiable evidence that NK is socialist.

Twas a joke

It's a hallucination created by the cognitive dissonance maladjusted expats experience when they run into someone who doesn't hate China as much as they do.

Just wait a second, I guarantee you they are going to bitch about that one video being from RT while still not providing any arguments

rhizzone.net/articles/songbullshit/

Counter-narrative to the meme "DPRK are like Asian Nazis xD"

theduran.com/truth-north-korea-booming/

DPRK economy growing. Kim was cutting down the military budget, renounced Songbun policy and purged the party of adherents of the latter.

Alright going to bed for realsies now. Last thing I want to conclude is that even if the DPRK had a sliver of socialism to it, I am not going to defend it in any form of debate or anything because its bad PR.

Defending socialism in general is bad PR but at least you finally admit that you're completely spineless

Sounds like you just won't engage in any kind of anti-imperialism because the imperial core has total control over the media apparatus.

Defending socialism in general isnt bad PR if the country is defendable. Which NK is not.

Cuba has all kinds of redeeming stuff, so does the USSR. North korea is just a general shithole. Just like the south. I think its genetic or something.

I'm not sectarian, because I am a communist and I have nothing to do with edgy illiterate LARPers, who defend capitalism and nationalism and don't give a shit about class struggle.
Also, nice reddit spacing. Keep up the good work /r/communism, only you can save the glorious Korean nation and its enlightened leader from the imperialist orcs!!!

Anti-imperialism is almost like a magical word that can be used to excuse anything. From defending Assad because "he is a 'legitimate' government" to defending murder of civilians because their government did something wrong.

Stop using buzzwords and stop drinking the ideology.

HAHA IT MUST BE TRUE! Take that capitalists?

Daily reminder that North Korea is not real communism its a dictatorship and serfdom.

Proof that Special Economic Zones are not that relevant:

38north.org/2017/04/rfrank042817/

(scroll down to budget report)

Worker organizations make up the delegates:

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supreme_People's_Assembly

Maybe actually read Lenin about imperialism

You don't understand what anti-imperialism means. There are some internet tanks (who are really just Nazbols who don't realize it yet) who use that phrase to justify "supporting" Assad. But "supporting" anyone who is being invaded or bombed isn't the point, it's supposed to be a tactic where you point out that no matter how bad the current government of a "undemocratic" country supposedly is according to the capitalist propaganda, if you point to the concrete reality of US (and other Western nations) involvement, rather covert or overt, in struggles always leads to something worse coming after the fact.

The people will revolt once the material conditions engender revolution. If an an advanced capitalist country is forcing a revolt within a nation, even if it supports the "good guys", it will lead to bad news and literally ALWAYS has.

This is not complicated

Sounds like a good movie. Remember that movie about killing George Bush and remember nobody gave a fuck.

This is like being a leftist in the 70s and not opposing the invasion of Vietnam.

rhizzone.net/articles/songbullshit/

Also spoiler that picture

No, its more along the lines of being a leftist in the 40's and being against fighting Hitler.

You're a cuck.

Not at all.

How is different than not opposing the Vietnam War? I'd actually like to hear even just one way that YOU think.

Because the norks aren't communists, they are fucking dictatorship. All of your sources are shit by the way.

Oh im sorry, I thought it was you who accused me of "supporting imperialism" because I dont want to defend NK.

Quick update, tankos, not defending a country as if you agree with its policies is not the same as promoting war.

Fucking end yourselves, taking the moral highground "explaining" what imperialism akshualy is while at the same time accusing everyone who disagrees with you of being an imperialist just for disagreeing.

Also fuck you im not going to spoiler shit an im not going to reply to your retarded strawmen.

You're just responding with racial epithet now. It should say something that this particular one is acceptable to say boldly in the Imperial discourse. But here's my question: so what if they are a dictatorship. Does every non-democratic country in the world need American bombs and boots on the ground to set them right? Absolutely not.

I disagree. I think you are promoting war.

Name a single difference between failing to oppose the Vietnam war and failing to oppose the war with North Korea that is being manufactured right now.

I wish there was war just so they would kill you.

IM NOT OPPOSING THE WAR YOU ILLITERATE FUCKING GOOK

rhizzone.net/article/2016/05/28/songbullshit/

Look m8, although no one has any direct, undeniable evidence that North Korea is actually a decent place to live or a hell hole, but what we DO know is that there is a lot, a LOT of invested interest in manufacturing and maintaining anti-NK/pro-American foreign policy initiatives out there. Frankly, I take everything spouted out by American intelligence with a grain of salt.

I know. I'm asking you to explain the difference between not opposing a war with North Korea and not opposing the war with Vietnam.

* am not Failing to oppose the war
I shouldnt be debating maotists at 4 in the morning

Im not going to engage with you retards anymore.

If I say "not defending a country is not the same as not opposing war" and then you say "AHA SO YOU PROMOTE WAR GOT YOU NOW IMPERIALIST" then I dont know what to say.

Good
Day

Can someone give me undeniable proof that the NK government provides the majority of it's citizens with a good life?

Keep defending real socialism, fellow comrades! North Korea is how socialism looks like in practice! Praise the Supreme Leader!!!

You're just triggered, you don't really know anything about North Korea, provide no sources and you openly say the only reason you don't defend it is because the CNN says it's evil and you are more concerned about getting bonus points with liberals.

Just admit you don't know anything about North Korea and say you are a liberal and we can all go in peace

38north.org/2017/07/hferon071817/

Yeah totally looks like a hellhole to me

not either of them but I'm wondering if life outside of the capital is any good or if it's as bad as people say it is?

No cause there isnt any.

What kind of question is that? Do you think something like that can be measured? It's a matter of fact that almost entire world wages an unprecedented war of economic terrorism on North Korea which barely has fertile soil. So what do you except them to do about it? Considering their situation, they are doing surprisingly well.

Yes

Obvi jucheism is superior system of governance to decadent techno-capitalism

There are still areas which have yet to be electrified. If you look up pictures from rural areas, it's not as shiny, but it certainly isn't that horrible. Some cities look nice though, they are as developed as Pyongyang. A lot of pictures:

earthnutshell.com/100-photos-from-north-korea-part1/

Do they have any censorship laws like south korea?

she's a cutie.
but she was either abducted, or expressly allowed to "defect" in order to return with tales of capitalist fun. No one would have their mind made up enough to risk life and family imprisonment to escape the country, only to go back because the TVs were too loud and people were having too much sex.

Tankies… are our redneck conservatives.

In the decades that South Korea was a fascist military dictatorship, the north WAS better.

fixed

Low key

South Korea is an example of how eastern submissiveness and nationalism fostered by the US, are in perfect synch with capitalism. To them, human life is only useful to keep the law of value in motion. Since there has never been a socialist country that hasn't been bombarded with sanctions while being infiltrated with foreign spies, it is difficult to say if the NK government would be just as harsh if it wasn't in its current situation. Since it is clear that realpolitik is necessary to prevent the country from being destroyed from the inside. At the same time, their leaders don't seem all that trustworthy. Hierarchy always seems to stick around longer than it needs to.

DPRK is a confirmed fascist shithole

I think they are experiencing the early stages of the "lost decade"

NK isn't as bad as outsiders think, but it is still pretty damn bad
Not sure why maotists and tanks feel the need to defend it to the last breath - Juche is far closer to Holla Forums than us as an ideology
yea yea, I've read Cumings' book and I have a close relative who worked in Pyongyang for a year - I've heard enough anecdotes to form some kind of opinion independent of the media narrative