What does Holla Forums think of LaVeyan Satanism

/thread

Lavey was on the right track by founding his satanism on a materialist basis, but then committed the cardinal sin (pun very much intended) of binding it with individualism (nothing wrong with individualism per se, but on a bourgeois society individualism remains the muh privilege of a few)

Rather than rejecting his satanism as a whole a careful ideological operation should be carried out of purging it of all its bourgeois individualist tendencies, remove Rand and add Althusser or whatever

/bread

It would honestly be easier to convince Theistic Satanists of anticapitalism

Isn't objectivism objectivism for edgelords?

Individualism is based and should totally have been integrated into it. Read Stirner if you want actual individualism.

Chaos Magick and Thelema are vastly superior to the meager theatrics of LaVeyan Satanism or the slavishness of theistic Satanism

...

Is that off their site? Maybe I missed some of that before.

LaVey was actually a tad Nazbol.

thoughtsofaeurasianist.wordpress.com/2017/04/26/on-laveyan-satanism/

love it. It is so cool.
It should be the religion of communists

Ironically, actual Satanism is a lot less edgy and stupid than LaVeyan Satanism, which only referred to Satan to annoy religious people for no reason.

Reminder that Satan unironically did nothing wrong and that the Abrahamic god is a fickle retard.

"theistic" satanism is just reverse-christianity

Yes? That's kind of the point.

Is basically what theistic satanism is all abut.

Also does anyone know if there is unironic Jewish and Islamic theistic Satanism?

As always everything goyim try to do is just an inferior rip-off of something Jews had already perfected.

This user gets it. What Lavey did was salvage the edginess and shock value of Satanism and decoupling it from Christian slave morality and its ideology.

Again so far so good the problem was that then he went full retard and became a Randian.

Isn't Laveyan Satanism a bit like chaos magick though? Been some years since I read the Satanic Bible but I remember it emphasizes how ritual is just LARPing but nonetheless it works. How I see it while Laveyan Satanism shouldn't be taken seriously, it can be just another tool among many for a magician, specially given how it triggers the normies.

lavey was a jew who pretty much just copy and pasted ayn rand and called it satanism.
The modern satanist church are a bunch of secular larpers thinking they piss off normies.

If you are actually interested in real satanism you look for the theistic. Like the The Order of Nine Angles

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_Nine_Angles

Why is serious theistic Satanism a thing?

I mean who reads the bible and decides

>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_Nine_Angles

When people look for religion they want the real deal, spirituality, not a bunch of neck beard larpers who think they are being edgy by cosplaying satanism.

The order of the nine angels is more a mixture of heathenry, satanism, and hermitcism

"[Long] rejects the quasi-religious organization and ceremonial antics of the Church of Satan, the Temple of Set and other satanic groups. He believes that traditional satanism goes far beyond the gratification of the pleasure-principle and involves the arduous achievement of self-mastery, self-overcoming in a Nietzschean sense, and ultimately cosmic wisdom. His conception of satanism is practical, with an emphasis on individual growth into realms of darkness and danger through practical acts of prowess, endurance and the risk of life."

Within the initiatory system of the ONA, there is an emphasis on practitioners adopting "insight roles" in which they work undercover among a politically extreme group for a period of six to eighteen months, thus gaining experience in something different from their normal life.[100] Among the ideological trends that the ONA suggests its members adopt "insight roles" within are anarchism, Neo-Nazism, and Islamism, stating that aside from the personal benefits of such an involvement, membership of these groups has the benefit of undermining the Magian-Nazarene socio-political system of the West and thus helping to bring about the instability from which a new order, the Imperium, can emerge.[101] However, Monette noted a potential shift in the insight roles recommended by the group over the decades; he highlighted that while the ONA recommended criminal or military activities during the 1980s and early 1990s, by the late 1990s and 2000s they were instead recommending Buddhist monasticism as an insight role for practitioners to adopt.[102] Therefore, "through the practice of "insight roles", the order advocates continuous transgression of established norms, roles, and comfort zones in the development of the initiate … This extreme application of ideas further amplifies the ambiguity of satanic and Left Hand Path practices of antinomianism, making it almost impossible to penetrate the layers of subversion, play and counter-dichotomy inherent in the sinister dialectics."[103] Senholt suggested that Myatt's involvement with both Neo-Nazism and Islamism represent such "insight roles" in his own life.[104]

...

When your religious organization is just a neo-nazi front and you need a belief system for it so you just mashup Francis Park Yockey with Crowley and call it a day.

The neo-nazi front is actually a front. o9a is fronts all the way down.

They pretty much adopt the persona of every political and religious form that is subversive to the west.

The founder was a neonazi for a time then became a muslim.

To them satanism is being the subversive.

Its being the nazi in the soviet union or being the commie in nazi germany

They dont actually believe in these things

To them, satanism is undermining society

Needs more anti-civ.

They are Nietzscheian elitists too, you must destroy yourself and rebuild yourself into an ubermensch, and also you have to pass their tests to rise up in the levels of their satanic sect.

The ONA does not initiate members into the group itself, but rather expects an individual to initiate themselves.[93] It requires that initiates be in a good physical condition, and recommends a training regimen for prospective members to follow.[41] Newcomers are expected to take on a magical partner of the opposite sex,[66] or of the same sex if they are lesbian or gay.[94] Thenceforth, the practitioner must undertake personal and increasingly difficult challenges in order to move through the different grades.[93] Most of the ordeals that allow the initiate to proceed to the next stage are publicly revealed by the Order in its introductory material, as it is believed that the true initiatory element lies in the experience itself and can only be attained through performing them.[95] For instance, part of the ritual to become an External Adept involves an ordeal in which the prospective member is to find a lonely spot and to lay there, still, for an entire night without moving or sleeping.[96] The initiatory process for the role of Internal Adept entails the practitioner withdrawing from human society for three months, from an equinox to a solstice, or (more usually) for six months, [97] during which time they must live in the wild without modern conveniences or contact with civilisation.[98] The next stage – the Ritual of the Abyss – involves the candidate living alone in a dark isolated cavern for a lunar month.[99] According to Jeffrey Kaplan, an academic specialist of the far right, these physically and mentally challenging initiatory tasks reflect "the ONA's conception of itself as a vanguard organization composed of a tiny coterie of Nietzschean elites."

The ONA's writings condone and encourage human sacrifice,[121] referring to their victims as opfers.[66] The ONA outline their views on human sacrifice in a number of documents: "A Gift for the Prince – A Guide to Human Sacrifice", "Culling – A Guide to Sacrifice II", "Victims – A Sinister Exposé", and "Guidelines for the Testing of Opfers".[122] According to the ONA's beliefs, the killer must allow their victim to "self-select" themselves; this is achieved through testing the victim to see if they expose perceived character faults. If this proves to be the case, the victim is believed to have shown that they are worthy of death, and the sacrifice can commence.[123] Those deemed ideal for sacrifice by the group include individuals perceived as being of low character, members of what they deem "sham-Satanic groups" like the Church of Satan and Temple of Set, as well as "zealous, interfering Nazarenes", and journalists, business figures and political activists who disrupt the group's operations.[124] The ONA explains that because of the need for such "self-selection", children must never be victims of sacrifice.[125] Similarly, the ONA "despise animal sacrifice, maintaining that it is much better to sacrifice suitable mundanes given the abundance of human dross".[126]

The sacrifice is then carried out through either physical or magical means, at which point the killer is believed to absorb power from the body and spirit of the victim, thus entering a new level of "sinister" consciousness.[127] As well as strengthening the character of the killer by heightening their connection with the acausal forces of death and destruction,[128] such sacrifices are also viewed as having wider benefits by the ONA, because they remove from society individuals whom the group deems to be worthless human beings.[34] Monette noted that no ONA nexion cells publicly admitted to carrying out a sacrifice in a ritual manner, but that members had joined the police and military groups in order to engage in legal violence and killing.[129]

The ONA believe that there are historical precedents to their practice of human sacrifice, expressing belief in a prehistoric tradition in which humans were sacrificed to a goddess named Baphomet at the spring equinox and to the Arcturus star in the autumn.[66] However, the ONA's advocacy of human sacrifice has drawn strong criticism from other Satanist groups like the Temple of Set, who deem it to be detrimental to their own attempts to make Satanism more socially acceptable within Western nations

So what is their end game? Is it really the Imperium as they publicly claim or is that just their exoteric doctrine? How many dimensions of chess are they on?

It's for edgelords trying to piss off normies.

Self imposed alienation as a religion is just fucking retarded. It's clear their end goal is still individualism with moral relativism.

thoughtsofaeurasianist.wordpress.com/2017/04/26/on-laveyan-satanism/

Are you being serious? Have you actually ever sat down and read The bible? God is a fucking prick who kills people left and right for the most minor "transgressions". At one point god makes a bet with satan that a man named Job would continue to worship him even if his life is ruined, so god commands satan out to murder the man's entire family. Having to put up with god's shit for so long and the terrible things he's done to innocent people, it seems reasonable that people would identify with satan as the "good guy" in the book.

Dropped.

ED has a good article on them.
encyclopediadramatica.rs/Satanist

Don't get me wrong, the biblical god IS a prick. But he also does good stuff sometimes, Satan does not, literally the only time he ever shows up is to be a cunt (and invariably because Yahweh is letting him do it).

The fact that Yahweh is an absolute bastard is something I was going to bring up in that post. Consider this passage for instance
In the bible it is Yahweh doing literally everything, and if we're to accept the bible then it is him doing literally everything in the universe as well. Something good happens? Yahweh did it. Something bad happens? Yahweh did it.

The point is that his power is absolutely and totally inescapable. Anything and everything are just his puppets for guiding his creation the way he wants it to go. Including Satan. If we're to accept the bible as being true (which to my understanding theistic Satanists do) then there is no reason whatsoever to see Satan as a better alternative to god, or even that there's any alternative to god. Satan is just another stick for god to beat his creations with.

In this way theistic Satanism is more of a Zoroastrian idea that has hijacked Abrahamic aesthetics. In Abrahamic religions there is not two opposed gods of good and evil. There is one infinite god that created literally everything and is infinitely powerful.

Sure it sucks having god basically be cosmic Big Brother but it's not like the bible gives you any alternative. Every other figure in it is just another one of god's creations.

edgy libertarian tier garbage

literally the 20th century equivilant of atheism + and kekistan

Edgy liberalism