Let's talk Anti-Fascism in the US

I get the impression both Antifa and Kekistan are mostly composed of furries and other naive highly sheltered autists. America is under the spell of a revolutionary impulse that is not yet aware of itself. Most of those right wing counter protestors are 'civic nationalists' recruited from among the ranks of the multiethnic reactionary petty bourgeoisie.

If the alt right was thriving i'd agree but its in total chaos. Their rallies are all tiny now, they have faction fights that frequently escalate into physical violence, and they sleep with nightlights seeing antifa under the bed. The militia tough guys are dropping half dead from heart attacks and literally shooting themselves in the leg. They're making fake antifa protests and beating the shit out of each other at the counterdemonstrations. Most of that is probably their own stupidity, but if it isn't broke don't fix it.

People like you aren't part of the left because you do nothing but larp and piss weak memes.

I don't care what your definition of facist is, all outwardly reactionary elements should be resisted with force.

Srsly you guys talk about revolution 24/7 and yet clutch your pearls at even the smallest amount of violence (that's more for the Stalin moustache guy) Stalin himself was a renowned basher of the fash.

Larpfags go.

how many workers are now not exploited because of someone knuckles hitting spencer's cheek?

also people in silly costumes hitting each other is LITERALLY the definition of larping.

It's actually doing, not larping

stop pretending like the game is played on one front alone

How many workers have your memes liberated?

Larping is when you don't actually hit each other.

Also if you'd ever actually been to a protest at the same time as holding down a decent job and had conservative family members, you would understand the need to mask up.

Usually these events are full of cameras, face covering is a necessity

Read Alinsky.

On the other side is the older generation, whose members are no less
confused. If they are not as vocal or conscious, it may be because they
can escape to a past when the world was simpler. They can still cling to
the old values in the simple hope that everything will work out somehow,
some way. That the younger generation will "straighten out" with the
passing of time. Unable to come to grips with the world as it is, they retreat
in any confrontation with the younger generation with that infuriating
cliche, "when you get older you'll understand." One wonders at their
reaction if some youngster were to reply, "When you get younger which
will never be then you'll understand, so of course you'll never understand."
Those of the older generation who claim a desire to understand say,
"When I talk to my kids or their friends I'll say to them, 'Look, I believe what
you have to tell me is important and I respect it. You call me a square and
say that Tm not with it' or I don't know where it's at' or I don't know where
the scene is' and all of the rest of the words you use. Well, I'm going to
agree with you. So suppose you tell me. What do you want? What do you
mean when you say 'I want to do my thing.' What the hell is your thing?
You say you want a better world. Like what? And don't tell me a world of
peace and love and all the rest of that stuff because people are people, as
you will find out when you get older—I'm sorry, I didn't mean to say
anything about 'when you get older.' I really do respect what you have to
say. Now why don't you answer me? Do you know what you want? Do you
know what you're talking about? Why can't we get together?' "

The young react to their chaotic world in different ways. Some panic and
run, rationalizing.that the system is going to collapse anyway of its own rot
and corruption and so they're copping out, going hippie or yippie, taking
drugs, trying communes, anything to escape. Others went for pointless
sure-loser confrontations so that they could fortify their rationalization and
say, "Well, we tried and did our part" and then they copped out too. Others
sick with guilt and not knowing where to turn or what to do went berserk.
These were the Weathermen and their like: they took the grand cop-out,
suicide. To these I have nothing to say or give but pity—and in some
cases contempt, for such as those who leave their dead comrades and
take off for Algeria or other points.
What I have to say in this book is not the arrogance
of unsolicited advice. It is the experience and counsel that so many young
people have questioned me about through all-night sessions on hundreds
of campuses in America. It is for those young radicals who are committed
to the fight, committed to life.

This failure of many of our younger activists to understand the art of
communication has been disastrous. Even the most elementary grasp of
the fundamental idea that one communicates within the experience of his
audience—and gives full respect to the other's values—would have ruled
out attacks on the American flag. The responsible organizer would have
known that it is the establishment that has betrayed the flag while the flag,
itself, remains the glorious symbol of America's hopes and aspirations,
and he would have conveyed this message to his audience. On another
level of communication, humor is essential, for through humor much is
accepted that would have been rejected if presented seriously. This is a
sad and lonely generation. It laughs too little, and this, too, is tragic.

For the real radical, doing "his thing" is to do the social thing, for and with
people. In a world where everything is so interrelated that one feels
helpless to know where or how to grab hold and act, defeat sets in; for
years there have been people who've found society too overwhelming and
have withdrawn, concentrated on "doing their own thing." Generally we
have put them into mental hospitals and diagnosed them as
schizophrenics. If the real radical finds that having long hair sets up
psychological barriers to communication and organization, he cuts his hair.
If I were organizing in an orthodox Jewish community I would not walk in
there eating a ham sandwich, unless I wanted to be rejected so I could
have an excuse to cop out. My "thing," if I want to organize, is solid
communication with the people in the community. Lacking communication
I am in reality silent; throughout history silence has been regarded as
assent—in this case assent to the system.

==Our youth are impatient with the preliminaries that are essential to
purposeful action. Effective organization is thwarted by the desire for instant and dramatic change, or as I have phrased it elsewhere the demand for revelation rather than revolution. ==

It's the kind of thing we see in play writing; the first act introduces the characters and the plot, in the
second act the plot and characters are developed as the play strives to
hold the audience's attention. In the final act good and evil have their
dramatic confrontation and resolution. The present generation wants to go
right into the third act, skipping the first two, in which case there is no play,
nothing but confrontation for confrontation's sake—a flare-up and back to
darkness.

To build a powerful organization takes time. It is tedious, but that's the way the game is played—if you want to play and not just yell, "Kill the umpire."

We will start with the system because there is no other place to start from
except political lunacy. It is most important for those of us who want
revolutionary change to understand that revolution must be preceded by
reformation. To assume that a political revolution can survive without the
supporting base of a popular reformation is to ask for the impossible in
politics.
Men don't like to step abruptly out of the security of familiar experience;
they need a bridge to cross from their own experience to a new way. A
revolutionary organizer

Our youth are impatient with the preliminaries that are essential to purposeful action. Effective organization is thwarted by the desire for instant and dramatic change, or as I have phrased it elsewhere the demand for revelation rather than revolution.

Alinsky's advice was awful and basically killed the left in America.

it gets people out of the house and active at rallies, my local IWW has been snatching up these joksters and learning them how to be socialist properly

I asked for a serious refutation of Alinsky in that other thread and you never responded. Please try again.

Doing what, exactly getting your jollies from street brawling?
It's better to do nothing than do something harmful.

Nigga my dream is to make stalin look like a bitch ok? But it's not worth on some frog love asshole. If antifa starts doing some RAF tier shit i'm aboard. If you shoot a coop i'll support you. If you eat a wall street man alive I'll support you. What you are doing is prole vs prole and I won't support it. You will convert more people to the right this way, what we need them is to focus them on the true enemy:porky and capital. We don't need to alienate them even more

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Based anarkiddo

Wrong pic

If you had half a brain cell you would be islamophophic too and mobilizing antifa to shutdown mosques.

No, LARPing is live action roleplaying. The word you're looking for is reenactment, but that often has less focus on the costumes themselves and more focus on authenticity.

youtube.com/watch?v=jqcGXYQJ0MM

No you fuck doing that is to radicalize those fuckers even more. I fuck hate islam my self but i'm not stupid. Antifa should just stay at home or do something serious. Driving into muslims? Bombin mosque? Cool but what you will get is even more radicalized muslims

Don't disrupt alt right rallies either we are WHITE supremacists of peace if you disrupt us it will only radicalize us more.

Your ideology is based on the domination of other races. How do you think the "inferior" races will be subjugated? Hint: You won't send them chocolates until they comply. You will use violence. How can you be THIS retarded?

We want to live away from non whites non whites refuse to abide by this and wish to impose themselves on us violently.

We are peaceful.

That's literally what I said few post ago. We should be interested in dialectics first with you guys. If we make you guys reason we will convert you really easily. If not tho I don't think we shouldn't disrupt your rallies but kill you at that point

There is no reason that a global commune can exist with areas exclusive for white people but no you want us all to mix to look like Brazil because you're controlled by kabalist kikes.

Read a fucking book

You wish to revoke people's rights to disassociate by destroying borders so yes that's exactly what it means. We are in the midst of a massive non white invasion into our homelands and your side enables it by preaching internationalism and international solidarity for a pie in the sky global revolution that will never come and is utterly ahistorical.

Find one true communist that supports open borders in a capitalist society. I'll wait.

I don't know.

I think Antifa has actually done their job looking at the alt right now.

They are shooting themselves in the foots, showing up to fake protests, they are starting to get into fights among themselves from the "These are good memes" to "cuck knight" shown here.

The disappointment with Trump's daily stupidity is getting to them hardcore, and antifa bred a culture where open hostility is acceptable to them.

I mean did we except antifa to win? Anyone who has spent time around an anarchokiddie knows how dumb they can be. It's time for grown up socialists to start organizing. Here's the thing none of you are realizing. It's cool to be a socialist now.

Commie Jew Bernie Sanders is the most liked politician in the CAPITALIST UNITED STATES OF AMERICA

thehill.com/homenews/campaign/329404-poll-bernie-sanders-countrys-most-popular-active-politician

We don't have to associate with SJWs or anarchokiddies anymore to be politically relevant. Corbyn has proven we can succeed and make small or even big victories.Look we can take political power with one single political issue single payer healthcare

pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2017/01/13/more-americans-say-government-should-ensure-health-care-coverage/

The Alt-Right and their leaders continue to shit their pants on the world platform and people do not want to put up with moralizing of liberals and open sociopaths of conservatives party.

Organize around the issues and play the game of civility, normies eat that shit up. Let the anarchokiddies and the MAGA CHUDS continue to punch out their problems. We're beyond them now.

Be smart and study the economy so we don't repeat the mistakes of the past. Seize the opportunity we've been waiting for comrades. People want change. They'll come to us. If we present ourselves as the mature intelligent alternative who actually has new and exciting ideas we'll start having our victories.

Leave your computer screens, socialize with your friends, talk about politics with people who you respect, engage in community service or do what ever you can do to make yourself a bigger part in your local community. You'll see the impact you as an individual can make. I never thought I'd live to change so many lives and if I could do it, I bet you can too.

as far as America is concerned I 100% agree with your post. In other countries I truly believe it is different and antifa in some cases is historically prove to be a necessity.

In America, 'antifa' are literally the foot soldiers of neoliberal capitalism. If we look at the times where antifa has shown the most in america, its been during times where the system stressed the most, and they did little or nothing to 'tear it down,' i would wager a lot of their actions deep down were an attempt to save the system. Occupy seemed to be the largest 'anarchist' protest in ages and it devolved into a meager attempt to bargain with TPTB. No revolution, nothing of the sort.

And don't get me started on how easy antifa and anarchists in general are to infiltrate and entrap. For all the harping on 'security' they do, most of them are seriously shit at it.

So, 'former' Fascist here 'former' as in I still carry Fascist thoughts and sympathies and I would like to ask for what purpose should I oppose Fascism? I've been getting a feeling from lurking here that Fascism is just a defensive apparatus for the Capitalist establishment - Capitalism being something I am 100% opposed to - could it be said that this accusation is correct, and if so can someone elaborate?

If I were to oppose my brothers, and I still see them as my brothers, I could only do so with the understanding that, if this is proved to me, they are misguided and made to focus on the wrong parties. But then, what should I make of my antisemitism? What if I still find the swastika attractive?

I see a lot of these issues as symptoms of a much larger issue in leftism that people like Uncle Ted mentioned – the constant attempt to negate everything, telling people what you are 'against' but not what you are 'for'.. anarchists are notorious for this, they'll tell you everything they hate about 'the system' but little about what we'd replace it with. I think most anarchist spaces have become a "capitalism behaving badly" highlight real of the weekly news. It's important to talk current events, sure, but only to a point.

This was one of the things that got me out of anarchism. I'm there in spirits, and agree with most of the core theories, but still don't know if i'd ever 'identify' as one because of how many people are out there not trying to improve their own situation as anarchists. Most are so consumed with 'negating' everything that they really look no different than the lame ass hippies of the 60s and 70s that thought they could 'drop out' of society and that would make anarchism possible. I think there needs to be a line drawn about how much you cooperate with the system, but some anarchists are very arrogant and dare i say, stupid when it comes to this. Hopping trains and getting drunk every day I don't see as anymore productive or revolutionary than me going to work and driving a nice car – yet, the train hoppers are always the ones pointing their finger at me in my car and my job and education like I'm the leech on society. It's kind of fucked up and I've never understood that with some anarchists. It's like they refuse to take care of themselves. Not all, but some for sure.

Well, first, I just want to point out that those 'brothers' don't give a shit about you. Hasn't their been enough white-on-white exploitation throughout history to rule out any sense of 'brotherhood' ? I just don't get this mentality. My boss is white, but he's still a piece of shit asshole. I fail to see why I should see him as my brother when he's another exploitative prick. Wouldn't make a difference if he was black either.

Yeah this is pretty memetic tbh. We should have a meme about this 'no borders' bullshit. I've never supported open borders under capitalism lol. Only gullible liberals do this shit.

Christ Emma Goldman was such a hack

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so much for the master race

Well, I don't hate my boss, as I have the understanding that they are also fellow workers just like me and that their demands are just what's expected of them. What I hate is the system itself. I kind of don't just want to have my questions answered. I would truthfully be far more interested in an actual conversation.

I call them my brothers not because they are White - I am no White Supremacist as I saw the stagnation that this folly leads to, such as StormFront. I'm what you could call a CivNationalist - or was, maybe, - even though I HATE that term. I find value in the history of other peoples too, such as the Persians, or the Tibetans for example, and I always wanted to inform them of their history's value and to treasure it always. I'm an antisemite because I see the Jew as the embodiment of Capitalism, and also because I saw their hand in the destruction of so many other people's heritage whether it was for profit or just sheer spite.

The far right will find communists even when there are none. Anyone that disagrees with them will be called a communist.

They are kind of like antifa. Just on the right.

I hate fascism more than anything, but i would never join antifa. They hurt the left imo

I think people give too much of a shit about antifa in the negative when they just will be, regardless.

I mean the energy spent worrying and raging about antifa could be spent in so many other ways

as relivent dubs said

Apart from Europe being a place of semi-constant wars the main issue I see with this massive white ethnostate is, would it encompass all of Europe and america? If so does that mean giving up of all the distinct cultures that made those countries for a singular "white" culture that blends them all together but makes it a semi unintelligible mash? Because most aut-righters want people to believe that america was a wonderland in the past and there wasn't any hate between the different Euro-Ethnic groups and that is grade A horse shit.

On the inverse, if all the nations were to become their own ethnostates how long would the peace last between all the now Fascist powers? Since Fascism thrives on war and of course they would rage war on the newly minted non-white ethonostates because Lebenstraum, what then? It would just be more white boys dying on foreign soils for wars that dont even matter

True, but I have seen an anti-Traditionalism sentiment among the Left, and that is something I would have difficulty embracing. Of course, I'm very objective so I would be willing to hear out the reasoning behind these sentiments

Ethnostates are physically impossible at this point, and peace wouldn't last fucking long. Like that just wouldn't work without a large amount of chaos, and Fascism does thrive on war but the last time it existed it had the same problem, it just generated chaos to the point of self destructing.

Any attempt, any large scale attempt at an ethnostate at this point wouldn't be a place you want to live. You can't just force places like America or the UK into becoming apartheid South Africa over night

I can't believe there are people who honestly think that's worth fighting for because even if you ideologically support it you have to understand just how fucking terrible your life would be for over a decade and it's probably going to collapse in on itself.

while I cant speak for Holla Forums I can say as a recovering liberal its mostly just parroting the troupes of single parent hood is just as good as a two parent household.

ALTHOUGH I feel as if 2 parent households arent enough and instead a good community is key in raising health offspring and under capitalism that is largely impossible from a monetary stand point ( good neighborhoods are expensive to live in, the cost of raising a child is massive due to being nickled and dimed on basic amenities)
to even a capitalistic culture standpoint of near constant competition that in some cases would pit homes against one another creating a more predatory environment for the child to grow in

The family unit is a very basic example of how contrasted Traditionalism and… Progressivism(?) are to each other, and it's good to bring up, but I'm more concerned about institutional traditionalism, such as religion.

I say as long as it doesnt over reach and every adheres to the social contract of putting in your fair share you're religious beliefs are yours to keep, that being said certain religions do need to go through some reformations, and this board is mostly in favor of the more secular or progressive Muslim sects, the problem is those sects are mostly isolationist in nature and that fucks with porky's oil money so they instead fund the wahabbists and thats how you get your trucks of peace

Yet most Jews are not Capitalists and most Capitalists are not Jews. It's absurd to say an entire ethnic group is the embodiment of Capitalist when their over-representation comes about because of their historical role as moneylenders. You can't point at a "Capitalism gene" exclusive to Jews, so why have anything against the local factory worker Joe Finkelstein simply because of his ancestry?

Their mannerisms disgust me.

poor falseflag Holla Forumsack

So I guess none.

None, but I never pretended they did because I'm not a tremendous fag.

I'll take the expert's word for it.

lol, look at the burger trying to teach me what a protest is. keep pretending brouhahas with preteen memelords is useful.

If you believe in tolerance you must tolerate intolerance. Punching is not winning. Getting punched or bicycle lock in the noggin causes hate.

When I think of Anti-Fascism in the United States I think of someone like Dave Emory and his extensive research exposing post WW2 nazism, not a bunch of retards kicking off trashcans, wailing about anarchy and playing into the media's hands by turning the general public against socialism.

If we have cadres in the US willing to use force, they should be directing it at the bourgeoisie, not some irrelevant nazi LARPers. We need fewer campus riots and more factory occupations.

The only "no-platforming" possible in the internet age requires the active support of large corporations, so it's a fool's errand.

Sorry nigger but its "No War but the Class War" everything else is in the way. Including "tolerance".

Actually read a book. Frankfurt School writers warned about the useless consumerist culture created by capitalism through a división of labor (a culture industry) and the profit motive.

Antifa makes no sense in america, even if you hate trump he will be gone in 4 to 8 years.
Antifa are a tribalistc entity that doesn't really accomplish anything of merit besides smashing in the windows of kulaks and making it harder for proles to drive to work.

People see this on tv and they think "how dumb and barbaric"

If a real fascist got into power he would just kill you all, not let you protest.

Pretty good, all you need is a picture of an attractive woman and you will hit peak retard.

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They didn't do shit, except popularize them and alienate libtards. The only thing that "killed" the "alt-right" was election being over and everyone getting bored with rallies.

They had tons of rallies after the election, and the ones in spring were much larger than the ones now. Their whole idea was to make this unstoppable street movement and 'sack' all the major cities.

It's an amazing coincidence that all of antifa's targets are critics of the Muslim Brotherhood…