You Die If You Work

Daily reminder that communism is free time and nothing else.

If your brand of revolutionary socialism doesn't involve a radical reduction in working hours as a top priority, then it's trash.

Other urls found in this thread:

worldfuturefund.org/wffmaster/Reading/Germany/mussolini.htm
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proletariat
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

We already achieved communism

Communism will increase the workload, not decrease it. Our intent is to boost efficiency, and efficiency is not increased by people becoming lazy NEETs.

Reminder that anti-work is anti-leftist

While I mostly agree, we already have a reduction in labour hours through zero hour contracts and precarious employment. Being employed like this sucks tremendously, so the question is how would communists approach this contradiction?

unfortunately we are currently experiencing a shortage of communism, we are forced to release communism in short bursts to the general population or else we will completely run out of communism

Menial work is bad, but I also believe people want to "werk hard" on what they choose to, and when they're learning something from it. This is what needs to be enabled.

Food will fall from the sky. Chairs, PCs, windows, cars will produce themselves. Literature will be auto-poetic. Manifestos will write themselves. Books will read students. Relics will dig up archaeologists.

Read Lenin :(.

t. nerd

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Then what even is the fucking point of communism you gigantic faggot?

this

Learn2read

Seconded

The reality of communism will indeed be nothing but free time, but only insofar as free time means time spent maximizing utility instead of first producing for exchange and extracting utility from the exchanges after the fact. Leisure and work will intertwined categories under a mode of production consisting entirely of the free association of labour unrestricted by (private) property and the creating of commodities (objects to be exchanged) with labour surplus.

This. The reason why work is such a bore under capitalism is that it is exclusively centered around profit-making for the capitalist. If you actually get a say in how your workplace and workday look and feel like, then work suddenly becomes much more fun and fulfilling.

The little work that will remain under communism is unlikely to be that much of a pain, really. But it goes hand in hand with increased free time.

daily reminder that anarkids and commienoobs by "communism" mean immediate "post-rev."

t. based Herman Schuurman

if work is the enemy and nobody is making things that are necessary for life what the fuck do you think is going to happen

durr i dunno lol

A dictatorship of the proletariat, which will invariably mean the establishment or adoption of a state mechanism to secure the interests of a successful revolution, will indeed not in itself constitute an alternate mode of production but rather a transformative period in which the categories and prerequisites of capital will have to be abolished. This can only fall under communism the movement, not communism the mode of production. For it to be the latter the DotP must succeed and result in self-abolition, complete with the self-abolition of the proletariat and bourgeoisie.

free shit doesn't exist. Society won't feed and clothe because you're such an awesome neet shitposter. Parasites will be liquidated.

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when the form betrays the content

Putting the labourers in power you retard.

Bolsheviks want you to die in a workers camp. Don't trust crusty Lenin popagandists. Real Communism is freedom not the depressing as bullshit people like express. I would rather live in American capitalism than see Stalins mustache again.

Anarchists want the same.

t. totally not a demagogue

Low effort shitpost mode Leninhat is always a disappointment.

Does that mean that NEETs are the vanguard yes, they are?

this is literally the S.W.E.A.T. pledge with doodles of red flags scrawled over it

Orthodox Marxist postings are always a disappointment in the 21st century when we have so much to learn from the 20th.

...

I chuckled

And who will benefit from those 80-hour workweeks? I wonder!

How are those mutually exclusive?

False dichotomy

He didn't imply they were "mutually exclusive", just that the latter involves much more than the former.

Miss me with that historically limited Second International shit fam we /communisation/ here.

They aren't mutually exclusive. One just doesn't presuppose the other.

Do you hear yourself, comrade?

No, it isn't. Being mobilized for work all the fucking time puts you in power of what, exactly?

The more you work, the less you are free. Labor is the antithesis of liberty, no matter how hard crypto-Protestant tankies try to pretend otherwise.

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THE REVOLUTION WILL COME BY SITTING ON OUR ASSES
COMRADES, I URGE YOU TO EXIT THE WORKFORCE AND DO _ABSOLUTELY NOTHING_ UNTIL WE ALL DIE OF STARVATION
EVERY LAST GODDAMN ONE OF US
LET'S DO THIS GUYS

Replace wages with labor vouchers and the issues of alienation remain in the wrokerist, industrial fetishists vision of "communism".

The demand to be happy is the next stage of worker alienation, the techniques of which have been perfected to an edge and continue to be perfected. Whereas, in the past, workers were only expected to work hard to feed their families and not be replaced, it at least didn't demand that they be cheerful about their lot.

The current system not only demands hard work, but also a denial of the reality that the work is drudgery, or something purely transactional - a necessary evil. Now you have to like your shit lot. Come to the job interview with the smile. Bullshit me about how this job has been your dream since you were in diapers. Come in early and stay late voluntarily, for no extra pay. Regard your employment with gratitude. Oh, and don't just not join a union, but actively campaign against them - that's a good goy! You're not one of those what lazy, good-for-nothings, after all!

The next step will be unpaid and reverse-paid work, and it's already there. As soon as work is regarded as an opportunity for the worker, it becomes possible to price it, and turn it from a "gift" to him into a paid service. You pay for your education, after all, so why shouldn't you pay for your training? A company is sacrificing resources to provide you with experience and letters of recommendation. Why shouldn't you pay for it? It's only fair!

It's coming. Mark my words.

you still won't get your laptop unless you fill your production quota faggot and fill it with distinction.

Basically internships.

Paid internships (as in 'you pay for the chance to be an intern').

Indeed so. NEETs sap resources from the system. Non-participation in the workforce is the best way to usher in societal collapse.

and you will die starving and homeless after being evicted

I'm not trying to argue but I assumed this was a thing already.

You die if you dont work. or if you do. You'll be dead regardless of what you do.

New to leftism. Is this true, bros? I think I might take my chances with porky…

Payed internship means the company pays you.

It's not a commonly held belief so I wouldn't worry. The left is pretty diverse.

nah you''l get everything good and nothing bad at all. No work, cars porn drugs tight pussy, and friendly comraderie comrade!

Most shit will literally manufacture itself through the use of robots that leftypol will develop..soon after the collapse of capitalism! We know this because we are materialists and not at all a bunch of faggots! All those socialist states that relied on work camps and forced labor were not socialist but st8 crapitalists lol lmao

Didn't want to make a new thread for this, so hijacking a theory thread
I have put it to a friend that automation is not a bad thing because it will create unemployment, but rather will lead to a "drastic reorganisation of the economic system" (my way of saying softly that it will be a step towards communism). He disagrees that less people working - for example living on a universal basic income (purely as a stepping stone might I say) - is feasible. He refers to the "multiplyer effect" as a reason why this isn't sustainable.
Firstly, I know automation can be a contested topic on Holla Forums and that shit like UBI isn't communism etc - but I'm trying to take baby steps to educating someone as to why they are limiting their scope of understanding. He's a liberal and has said things like "capitalism is the least worst system" and "no one would work if there was no incentive".
So basically, keeping this in mind, any advice on how to refute the multiplyer effect as an argument against these points. Clearly im a communist system its completely redundant, but it needs to be framed properly.
I'm just trying to do my best and address a non-meme argument without sperging out and ranting about how Stalin dindunuffin.

The USSR might have been a shitshow, but it really wasn't communist or even socialist in anything but name. Stalinism was really just kosher (non-racial) fascism, and fascism is the last-ditch attempt at pacifying the working class by imposing a dictatorship.

National socialism is fundamentally different from fascism in that the fascist places the state before everything else, whereas Not Socialism places the nation first. Fascism can be entirely deracinated (as the USSR was); the only essential requirement is that it promulgates a recycled protestant work-ethnic (e.g. classcucking good-goyism).

worldfuturefund.org/wffmaster/Reading/Germany/mussolini.htm

Except for the religious references, this could've been from some Stakhanovist pamphlet, but it's from "The Doctrine of Fascism" by Mussolini.

Unlike the fascists, who did a load of fuck-all, the Not Socialists recognized the individual as valuable by himself and instituted programs to improve people's living standards (KdF, infrastructure projects, environmental protections, car and home ownerships, cheap loans). And even so, it must be admitted that Hitler cucked out to the industrialists in a major way.
The Assers did nothing wrong.

Are you that guy who started a thread a while back claiming Fascism and Naziialism were fundamentally different and then proceeded to get utterly BTFO'd? Because you're still wrong, in case it didn't get through your thick skull that last time.

b-but what if it's the correct belief?

I'm not, and I'm not a Hitlerite. The NSDAP existed before 1933.

t. Calvinist

That would be true, Leftism is the left wing of capital.

Kill yourself fucking liberal

Productivity will increase (after the transition). Workload, however will decrease immediately almost three-fold, and very quickly, ten-fold.

wew
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Fuck off back to Holla Forums

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I know, you're one of those snowflake Strässerites. I don't care, they too upheld the work ethic and opposed class struggle. In that respect, Strässer and Hitler are hardly any different.

Oh look, it's this faggot again. Every single time there's a thread on the nature of work in society, it's this guy.

C Y B E R N E T I X

Reminder that this is not 1918 anymore. Most "important" (read: socially necessary) work (read: Jobs. Not hobbywork.) is either automated, in the process of being automated, or is semi-automated. That which remains can be safely distributed to that there is less of a workload per-person.
Thing is, most work these days is actually make-work. Work that is either not socially necessary (management jobs, marketing, most retail jobs, etc), or jobs that could be automated but aren't because management is either incompetent or too scared of initial costs.

Food production has become increasingly automated in the last century. It used to require a whole army of workers to tend the fields. Planting crops, harvesting crops, tilling soil, etc. Nowadays most of it can be done by one guy in a tractor, and even he's on the way out.

They more or less do these days anyway. Factory workers are becoming less and less necessary.

And now you're just being retarded.

falcellerationism

Well, I don't uphold the work ethic. I just think Asser had some good ideas, I don't take all my thoughts verbatim from him.

Like what?

Why can't we just use robots for all of that stuff?

Because some people are retarded enough to enjoy suffering, sacrifice and self-denial as end in themselves.

This.
More people working = more production and less hours.

He precisely said that he wanted to increase the workload.

NEETS and rest of the unemployed`s workload should be increased trough.

We already have this. It's called university.

I look forward to working less. Degenerates and subversives can work the rest of the hours until they die.

He wanted to break up the estates of the land-owners and accepted the notion of class conflict, which Hitler didn't. He was also fundamentally opposed to the system of finance capitalism, an issue on which Hitler cucked with traditional ancap arguments ("but who will produce if he isn't rewarded? :(").

They didn't. As nationalists, they opposed class struggle.

Leftcoms are literally some of the only Marxists who actually want to move past the theories of the Second and Third Internationals.

Leftcoms are defined by their opposition to Orthodox Marxism and lump Leninism in with it (rightfully so, IMO). You're more of one than them. Hell, they're arguably the only Marxists beyond the Cockshottists who have truly moved beyond the 20th century (Zizek's just a critic).
Stop being aggressively dumb.

fucking retard, communism is the end of all wage labor. communism means lower and lower working hours until it reaches zero.

You're the worst poster on this board leave, ree, etc.

What about autonomists and other 'libertarian Marxists'? Don't they fall with leftcoms in that category?

This very much NOT. Measuring work time is important to do things efficiently.

There is a point when work will become indistinguishable from other daily activities. Deal with it.

And do you call that point communism and anything before that non-communism (contra Marx)?

Problem is: You need to measure work time in order to increase productivity to the point where work time becomes vanishingly small. Society can then try to abandon that measure. However: How can you be sure that productivity doesn't regress? Don't just think about people used to have their work measured, who have productivity principles in their bones; think about new people coming into this society. Productivity will likely regress, and it can regress to a point where measurement again becomes necessary. It is hubris to be sure that this can't happen. So, why risk going through all this wasteful nonsense?

I say: Keep measuring, and try to continuously reduce the amount of work people have to do, and don't promise that this ever will reach zero, as you don't know that.

Spending my free time maximizing utility sounds fucking horrifying. I'd rather clock in 5 hours of work-duty 4 days a week to keep free access afloat and than be fully and truly free for the rest of my time.

Do you see cleaning and cooking at home "work"? I think you have very poor understanding of the implications here.

I understand perfectly well.I'm just not completely sold yet on the vision of communization. I believe a mutually agreed upon work-duty system along the lines of what Kropotkin suggests might be necessary at first and to be phased out over time.

And how is cooking and cleaning "maximizing utility"? If maximimizing utility is the ruling principle then I'd hardly consider it free time. No, cooking and cleaning for myself is not "work".

The correct belief is that the only person you should work for is yourself.

I have a question related to spectacle, and no I don't know it entirely, but in the scenario that FALC or something similar happens, what's the chance that there would be more consumption of entertainment, rather then less?

This thread is the ultimate proof that NEETs aren't leftist

is this bait?

There is no point to communism. Communism is not something we all decide to do for some particular purpose. Communism is the end product of class struggle which intensifies within capitalism until the decline in the rate of profit collapses the whole thing for good. I swear some people on here are still in idealist utopian socialist mode. They might have read Marx but they don't understand Marx.

Spotted the NEET.

Anyone?

You die if you dont work too, might as well accomplish something in your life.

Its a workers movement jackass.

You're missing the point on purpose, right?

lmfao nice self-own

That image gave me a subtle yet palpable feeling of despair, the same kind of despair a returning veteran feels when he discovers his childhood home destroyed. All that I held close to me is now gone, thus what was "me" is now also gone.

you humanists moralfags are disgusting

More like the engineering class will engineer itself out of existence

Lel.
It's a proletariat movement. Proletariat = everyone who doesn't own means of production, not everyone who has a job.

There's actually a video game that kinda plays on that meme. Intentionally. rofl. I shit you not. Except it's "If you work, you lose!"

kys

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proletariat
>The proletariat (/ˌproʊlᵻˈtɛəri.ət/ from Latin proletarius) is the class of wage-earners in a capitalist society whose only possession of significant material value is their labor-power (their ability to work).[1]

You're the one implying that work magically gives meaning.
Kys wagecuck.

Fuck you!

NEETS (at least in burgerland, not sure about the Eurozone) hold more revolutionary potential than the wagecucks do.
Then again that's not saying much. The inanimate bricks making up the foundation of the local bar hold more revolutionary potential than the people who laid them, let alone the people who get themselves drunk on them every night.

Nah, fuck you buddy. Wage work is hell and anyone that wants to perpetuate it needs to be shot. Productivists are the scum of the earth.

Wow that guy is mad and really loves work

Classcuck: the post

The only people I've seen who know about this game come from /gfd/ threads. [spoiler] Like me.

No it's not. the only way that could be true is if one means that there will be 0% unemployment under communism, which it will.

Of course if the entirety of the population works, that means that everyone has to work a lot less. With full automation, which is only possible without collapse outside of capitalism, it will mean that people will work like a couple of days a week, for less than 4 hours.

I'm not a Commie - In fact I blew in straight from Holla Forums - but Holla Forums has never addressed this issue. I'm really considering continuing my day-in-day-out, day-in-day-out Groundhog Day-tier Hell just so I can save up enough money to purchase the items I need to kill myself, but this thread and the fact that it actually addresses this disgusting cancerous work-cycle gives me a new vision.

If you folks are really trying to help end the work-cycle, and Communism really is the way to realize this goal, I will give my all - every fiber of my being - to Communism. One question: should I start with Marx?

Oh, one more thing. If I wind up getting banned for this blogpost, I understand. I have to read more Communist material anyway. I hope I can become something fit enough to bring about the end of the work-cycle.

sure why not, but don't start with capital, check out some of his shorter essays first, like wage labor and capital.
btw that quote in the pic is actually very representative of marx's though, one of the reasons he wrote about capital is because he thought it turned people into mindless slaves, stripped them of what makes them people (free time, culture, the joy of creativity).
take a look at the reading list sticky.


son we don't ban people for wanting to join. welcome aboard and sorry you were charmed by the Holla Forums straw men.

Thank you.

It's better to be financially responsible and live modestly than perpetually be in tons of student debt because of interest on college loans taken out to finance your gender studies degree.

I just finished reading the Principles of Communism. I feel like a burden has just been lifted - like I've finally found a solution to these evils. I feel obligated to proceed forward in Communist doctrine, and to work hard to reform myself. Holla Forums, I cannot thank you enough.

Welcome to the other side, friend.

it's a hard life, but welcome.