Are all politics involving trans people idpol? Can we really allow trans politics to have a place in leftism?

Are all politics involving trans people idpol? Can we really allow trans politics to have a place in leftism?

It should be given attention in proportion to how many there are

define "trans politics" before we go any further with this because this is going to be a shitstorm of people talking past each other otherwise.

No, just because idiotic trans liberals dominate the scene doesn't make everything trans idpol.
They will have to be involved unless you'd like to marginalize a group for no other reason than "muh identity politics."

Yeah I'm not particularly certain what "trans politics" even entails. Is it trans people doing stuff? Is it troons on SA trying to recruit people for the Trans Agenda?

Traps are heros of the revolution

...

Any issue regarding the trans identity.

Trans people are an oppressed minority that should join the class struggle for human liberation, excluding potential comrades is bourgie as fuck.

keep my cute boys away from your nasty hormones.

Yes, having the ability to infiltrate Fascist and White Guard gatherings and fit in just fine is a great ability to have.

Traps and Cuteboys are both on our side.

I may just be picking and choosing here, but by my reckoning:


= idpol


= idpol


=/= idpol

Ah, I see. You're sliding the board and looking for split issues.

All politics specifically concerning one group is by definition identity politics. Leftism is about freeing people and creating a rational, humane economic system, if that's not good enough for someone and they want their identity group be given special prominence then they can fuck off.

The rational extent of trans, or any identity based politics should solely be "people should be treated decently and not oppressed regardless of their identity, and the only way we can achieve that is by eliminating Capitalism" anything more is idpol and is not Leftist.

where is that cutey from

Pretty much. Everyone read Lacan.

Opposing idpol isn't idpol.

Making laws to target [identity] people is idpol, and criticizing that or trying to stop it isn't idpol. Idpol would be "[opposite identity] people need to be stopped, let's agitate against them and try to pass laws." The issue isn't this or that identity existing or being recognized. The issue is using identity as a justification for treating people differently. To be anti-idpol is to say that these identities are purely ideas and to oppose bringing them from only conceptual space into the real world.

If and only if there are absolutely no problems regarding hunger or lack of hospital beds then yes, maybe something as unimportant yet expensive as srs could be taken care of

seems legit

If I wanted to derail a universal worker's movement I'd flood it with weirdo screeching trannies.

Just saying.

But Lacan would say trannies are identifying with their symptoms and reassignment is not the way forward.

t. merely concerned for fellow human beans

The discussion is a black hole.

I'm broadly for transgender rights because at one point I thought I was trans. but it's just a completely worthless topic of discussion. Why the fuck spend multiple days arguing back and forth over bathrooms and linguistics when I could be arguing about overarching economic issues actually relevant to the daily lives of the majority of the population?

99% of people should just be ignoring this monstrous black hole of pointless discussion and getting on with their lives, including me. Now I'm going to try and find some non-shit music to download so I can walk my dogs while fantasising about a world that isn't shit.

The issues of transsexuals ain't related to capitalist class struggle so it don't matter if it's idpol or not a proletariat revolution ain't gonna magically solve their problems.

It's kind of a class issue because transitioning costs money and a lot of poor people aren't able to and could risk losing their job if they come out.

Yeah, but the cost ain't really the issue with transsexuals, it's the way society looks at them which you can't do much bout cuz sex ain't a capitalist social construct and you can't force the proletariat to fuck traps if they don't wanna get a dick covered in shit or a mouthful of fish.

Surgery actually lowers the chance of commiting suicide

for sure

anime

Yes because I am a TRAP ADDICT

Can I please borrow your socks

So when liberals champion gays and transsexuals that is identity politics, when you faggots champion gays and transsexuals that is not identity politics that is just rational discourse am I rite?

Well I think we should be inclusive of gays and transexuals because I want to have sex with them. Is that not a water-tight logical argument?

Believing trans people should have rights and be free from discrimination is not identity politics, but the exact opposite.

This a million times

switching the meaning of tolerance to full institutional approval promotion and praise and celebration of the lifestyle is not identity politics at all it's just rational policy, shaming the middle and Christians into silence is also not identity politics in fact any programme to eliminate Christianity and religious identity and replace it with state atheism is rational and scientific nothing to do with identity politics at all

christianity started in the middle east, it has no place in europe.

why do you care what people believe ?

Science should explore the cause or cause of it to make more options of treatment available. Someone being trans isnt a good reason to hate them or love them as a person.

Because I have to hear about it later on.

Threads that should be banned:
Is x idpol
Is x Socialism
Is x our guy
Will X exist under socialism
Tranny anything
Reddit everything

/thread

Holla Forums has rules like this and literally nobody follows them


>Red pill me on X. (with no extra content or input of your own)
>Are X white?
>Is X fun?
>How come X girls love Y guys so much?
>If X is true, then how come Y? Checkmate Z.

Straight from their sticky

Leave it to the professionals, not your shitty "common sense".

This more or less. We should have the right policy planks, but no need to keep talking about it on and on and on and on. Freedom, non-discrimination and single payer health care for surgery. But none of this

No seriously there's no right wingers on this board at all.

What is "trans politics"? If trans politics basically means not to beat up people with gender dysphoria, then yes, I'm all for it.

However I'm staunchly against sex reassignment. It's retarded. Would you cut somebodies legs off because he suffers from Body Integrity Identity Disorder? Fuck no, post-modern relativism was a mistake.

Counter point.
The human body is not sacred.

If he wants it then why the fuck not?

what if he regrets it later?

It's his own fault for making a stupid decision and he must accept responsibility for that.

There is something like bodily injury which can be objectively defined. Society should be built upon the principle of avoiding bodily injury.

Sometimes people are confused, especially when suffering from a mental illness or being in puberty.

If someone wants to injure themselves on purpose then that's their own business.

not if he asks to get his legs cut off.

In puberty? Yes, only adults should be allowed to pursue drastic body-altering surgery.
In mental illness? If they don't want treatment or the treatment isn't working and they still want to chop their legs off I say let them have at it. They're going to be mentally ill for the rest of their life anyway.

If it reduces the feeling of dysphoria and no less invasive procedure exists, and people kill themselves more if they don't get surgery? Sure. Remember that most cases are not handled with surgery: the talking cure, or drugs and hormones, without surgery, are much more common.

You're right, it's also partly the business of whatever surgeon would accept such a request.

Nonetheless it's still the responsibility of the guy that wanted it and no one else.

The same way a worker wants to exploit himself, right? What's your argument against wage labor again?

That it sucks and I don't want to be a wage labourer.

maybe the faggot wants to kill himself doesn't mean you have to indulge him and kill him

I think hormone therapy is just as a bad.


If you're having gender dysphoria you are mentally ill by definition. I don't mean that in a negative way.

shut the fuck up about trannies you autistic retards

no one gives a shit besides you faggots

Maybe some people don't object to a voluntary contract. Should they be able to work as wage laborers in socialism?

Precisely, he's perfectly able to kill himself all on his own.


I know, nonetheless I think we should let them do it.

Maybe some people are fucking idiots and we should just let them shoot themselves in the foot.