There's now a revolution in your country

ebin

I pick the sui scide.

Eh. They are not my faction, but they are better than a lot of the others. At least if I join them I will probably not die in the mountains after two years.

Dumb thread, so sage.

ML's of course… and I'm an anarchist. Anyone that wouldn't side with ML's over the American establishment is either not a leftist, or cannot compromise. If I lived in a social democracy I might have a different opinion.

What type of MLs are they? Are we talking post-Stalin "Castro and Sankara were cool guys ey", or maybe the "ML could have been so much better" type, like certain trots? Or are we talking "khmer rouge and mao dindu nuffin, stalin was a good boy" MLs?

Marxism Leninism is a gigantic spectrum, saying "But its MLs" is as broad as saying "it's by anarchists" or "it's by leftists".

Join the MLs and then eliminate/dispose their leaders like uncle Stalin (nothing wrong be upon him) did

Those are maotists, totally different.

Maotists may as well be put under the ML spectrum, with their support of the ML system and all.

Was Sankara ML?

Every successful socialist revolution of the 20th century was ML.

Trots are not ML

The MLs, obviously. You have to uncritically support the ML revolutionaries in everything they do and faithfully execute their policy no matter what, otherwise you're fucking trot splitter filth. You don't want to be a filthy trot splitter, do you user? You know what we do to counterrevolutionaries, don't you?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

join the MLs and lead an internal ultraleftist opposition to the party leadership

Start an underground newspaper

Only correct answer.

Trotsky was the true heir of Lenin, Stalin was just a red Hitler who betrayed the revolution and his own party.

don't compare me to a trot reeeee

They were both pretty shit tbh

We can't now how the sovietic union would have been without stalin, but surely, i think, it would have been better than the totalitarian fascist shithole that was with him.

Well, pretty much all of today's ultra-left is trots. The fundamental question just beyond materialism vs idealism is whether or not you understand capitalism as an international system with international contradictions you can't just locally "opt out" of without resolving and supplanting them on the global scale, and recognize any "socialism in one country" declaring itself the end of history or promoting "peaceful coexistence" as rank opportunism subject to the same. So in that sense you would be in the same boat.
Really though I'm just taking the piss out of people who have a fetish for things like party unity above and beyond things like, say, theoretical justification.
If only us radicals could just settle down and become neoliberals!

They're really not comparable

Only M-L can lead a revolution, bring it to victory and preserve it, so obviusly i'll take the side of revolution!>>1612305

Trotzky was a traitor.
vault.fbi.gov/leon-trotsky The idea of permanente revolution was ridicolous, the USSR in the '20 will be annihilated if even tried to spread the revolution, look what happened against Poland in 1920.

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Also the proper argument here is clearly one of necessity and not practicality. Even if you weren't just making shit up to argue against, this is still tantamount to saying "sure, maybe we do have to choose, historically, between socialism and barbarism, but revolution just seems too impractical to pull off so you should vote liberal."

Look at neocon, they were trotzkists who turned side

They may not be comparable, but they're still both shit.

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confederalize

Gee, I've never heard this argument before. Sigh
Yeah, the people who believe that history ends in bourgeois liberal democracy, that the whole history of the soviet union was nothing but a troubled detour on the road to this democracy, and support its forcible promotion across the world through various policy avenues and particularly against workers' struggles… are Trotskyists who "turned side." Right, because one has the other as an intellectual influence. Same way Lenin's a Kautskyist. *rolls eyes*
Or how Bannon's a Leninist

Ah yes, the "world revolution" I keep hearing about has finally arrived

Impossible, people would lynch MLs here, even trots are more likely to lead the revolution

Join and advocate for an elite military unit to kill overseas capitalists and sabotage anti-revolutionary forces. Make sure to support any leftist uprising, doesn't matter if they are anarchist. Don't try to form the vanguard as an elitist group, instead let it grow larger until it can encompass capitalism. Destroy the vanguard in a second revolution, once any meaningful threat towards the establishment of communism has been eliminated. Not sure how well it would end.

Depends on how likely they seem to pull it off. It's good to get in on it early, but not if they are going to lose.

This is pretty much the only way ultras can be useful, as a sort of sounding board for tendencies which can actually do stuff.

They just take over a government and sit on it until it degenerates lol

Wrong

How can you even compare the state of Imperial Russia and Imperial China to their communist successors

Trots aren't fucking ultralefts, they're glorified social democrats.

How is this ever a fucking question?

M-L of course. Tankieism is better than rampant capitalism.

Trots are ultras, but there are socdems who masquerade as trots. Perhaps that's the source of your confusion.

Counterpoint:

Which side, Holla Forums?

The first part is appealing, but the second part leads me to believe I would be trading my porky oppression for chemical castration oppression tbh

Anfems obvs

The side with the armchair, obviously.

ahahahahaha

kill MLs -> victory is certain, everyone thanks you

no kill MLs -> fascism, dictatorship, everyone hates socialism for another century.

heads up brah, all these sluts grow up into disgusting neoliberal cunts.

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Some people think things are happening by themselves.

Whichever one lets me kill the most socdems too right-wing/compromising for my particular tastes.
Truthfully I probably side with the MLs just because I've got nothing to lose. life under modern capitalism isn't life at all.

Why choose? Vote Democrat/Labor and be on both sides!

This post is criminally underrated. Nice trips, too.

hmmmm sounds familiar

The Old Bolsheviks weren't """M"""-"""L"""s, though. That's why Stalin killed a bunch of them.

I'm of course skeptical of all the "you can neither form an internal opposition nor leave the party and form an external opposition when the party goes off track; you must always agitate in exactly the direction that the party is currently moving" nonsense trots get slapped with. The alternative is leaving politics and taking no responsibility for what you've been involved in or its future. That's why the OP sees "I pick no side" as silly.

I mean my options are support it or get an icepick to the face. So tough call really.