What would socialism with Canadian characteristics be like ?

What would socialism with Canadian characteristics be like ?

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What even are Canadian characteristics?

I think people might dig

Gotta rename the RCMP to PCMP

Fuck yes! Already got the bright-red uniforms. Couple that with their really fucking insane history - they always get their man - and they could make the Stasi look like hippies. In a highly constitutional way that respects human liberties and rights, of course! ;-)

Would we need to encourage population growth? It's a lot of land.

being awful posters.

Racist.

That's the opposite of what should be done in general.

Or just pursue automation. 30 mil over so much area is tough to maintain when the rest of the world is cappy and won`t want to have anything to do with you.

I mean I'm not a Canuck but isn't a lot of the land basically uninhabitable?

We'll have to export natural resources to shitty regimes, or alternately automate as fast as fuck and then use our natural resources to achieve post-scarcity. That being said, given our mining, farming, and energy we could theoretically go full juche without a problem

90% of the population is basically strung out along the southern border so kinda. However, there are mad natural resources up north and I do predict more people moving out there to pursue jobs as time goes on. There are also really scattered and miserable aboriginal bands out there who kinda got fucked by treaties and don't want to give up what little they have left.

From what I understand though, acquiring those resources is rather damaging to the environment for the most part. More so than extracting them from elsewhere.

It's kind of a mixed bag. On the one hand, it's entirely possible to have decently clean extraction. On the other, tho, broader social responsibility has never been a point of corporate interest unless they're forced to, and as we see whenever the libs or the newdems gain any power those corporations kick and scream a lot. On the other hand, the aboriginals are often pretty dubious about mineral extraction and the likes on their land because typically it shits up what little they have left. Even if the profits aren't as good, I'm pretty sure we could come up with some kind of middle ground as we've done before and will do again. Like maybe yes to oil extraction, but no to massive fucking tailings ponds that poison people and ruin their livelihoods?

If that doesn't work out tho then Canada has no choice but to declare Justin Trudeau to be Bro Number One and send everyone out to be hunter-gatherers. We've got some really massive forests just sitting there - even if a bunch of us starve, I'm sure most would eventually adapt!

I'll go with limited extraction. Don't we have uranium mines as well?

Y'all niggas need some fucking serious public transport projects. How can you stand traveling the distances between all your cities?

That is for fucking sure. Vancouver's transit is shit, but Calgary makes it look magical over here.

Really aesthetic giant highway? Rail lines? Denationalized bulk carrier airlines that the state should take back? Cute little indie airlines with a 60s aesthetic that should be employee-managed? That being said, it would be good to have a nationalized railway system. Like make Canadian National Rail actually National, and at the same time enhance the road system so that there aren't any more garbage private highways in annoying locations in Toronto. That's some good shit.

Our mineral sector as a whole is pretty huge. Nickel, copper, and other shit's pretty prevalent, and with some decent start-up capital that Ring of Fire up in Northern Ontario could be enriching aboriginal communities and isolated groups in no time at all.

My great-granddad's actually in the Mining Hall of Fame, strangely enough.

Calgary lmao

Torontofag here, I'm pretty sure we're no worse than Vancouver but we seem to bitch a lot more

Only socialism can give us the fucking downtown relief line we've been waiting on for decades

Skytrain is finally reaching out to Coquitlam, but in Calgary the CTrain is only just being extended to the airport. It took me almost 2 hours to get there. Proper inner city light rail transport and a cross country MagLev please.

Btw, how do we solve the issues plaguing native communities? The whole situation is shit.

What are the Canadian communist parties like?

IDK, but I'm voting ML next time. Not even ML myself, but why not.

We just need to stop being cheap porkies and pay the money it takes to provide basic resources like water, electricity, heating. Also it seems to me that we could move servers or other things that generate lots of heat up north to save energy on cooling.

Surprisingly anti-revisionist but like with most countries, they've gotten much weaker as porky sapped their strength. Apparently we've had good relations with both Mao and Hoxha.
Here's a song from the CPC(M-L): youtu.be/wDX7Ul9Kx7A

Canadians aren't a race tho

Defence wise we will have to aquire nuclear weapons otherwise the Americans will just walk in and wipe us out.

Biggest one is the Canadian Communist Party. They're essentially radical demosocs at this point, but when the royals visited they harassed them with a mock-up guillotine. Known for direct-action, IRL funposting, and all being York University students. I've got a buddy who's involved with them and every once and a while they provoke some really outraged media blowups.

Their bizarre cousin is the Marxist-Leninist Party of Canada (AKA CPC-ML, which grew up around a university newspaper in the 70s. They're ideologically anti-revisionist/legitimately Hoxhaist and have some wild dogma afaik, but at the same time their actual platform is tamer than the CCP. They're also much less active among young folks afaik.

Socialist Alternative is probably the second-biggest. It's a Trots org like its American cousin, and they occupy an interesting position. While they do independent stuff on their own, they're also halfway inside and halfway outside the social-democratic NDP and lobby to pull it left. Same sort of space as the DSA, except they're actually Trotskyites.

There's also Socialist Fightback, which is the other major Trotsky group. However, they're much less revolutionary and are pretty explicitly a socialist group within the NDP. They claim that they could survive outside of it, but one tends to doubt. I think they're pretty strong among student circles in Montreal, but at the same time I chatted with one of their organizers to see about joining and they unironically sell newspapers at labour meetings. My dignity won't let me stoop that low.

I've heard legends of a couple extremely aging Spart cells that harass other people's demonstrations and yell about NAMBLA or whatever, but there's no confirmation.

There's also an explicitly campus-based Maoist org, the Revolutionary Communist Party. When the SDS started founding Vancouver chapters they denounced it as American imperialism. They also try to use starbucks to get people to show up to their rallies. Total fucking meme.

I mentioned this before, but there's a very strong socialist left caucus within the NDP that seems to be doing pretty decently right now. However, given the war between the "activists" based around climate issues who have a fetish for the Leap Manifesto and the "workerists" who are less keen on that because it could damage labour ties and send the party into complete irrelevance, I'm not sure about the positioning there. The party's also really based on regional power, and where it ends up going really depends on the fortunes of its provincial affiliates. If the more demsoc Nova Scotia branch which I'm involved with does well in the fall election, we might see a broader shift at the national level and more socialist momentum there.

I think there are a couple other ones floating around, but these are the different ones I can remember.

I'd personally like to see a rehash of Paul Martin's Kelowna Accords, which was a nation-wide consultative process that involved aboriginals, the provinces, and the federal government in a wide-ranging attack on structural poverty, unemployment, and educational failings. The whole thing was ratified before Harper and his gang of rats torpedoed it in 2005. I'd like to see the same sort of process again, so that we can move away from the previous pattern of top-down diktat from the feds and confused provincial flailing. In the long run, I'd prefer a system of partnerships with aboriginal groups to rule over them. It's the only way things are going to work out. There also needs to be serious action to ensure that aboriginals off-res are able to access social services and can enter the job market - there's a reason so many of the homeless and poor in big cities are aboriginals, and it's structural as fuck.

At the same time, however, I'd also support continued accountability measures to prevent some of the instances where hereditary chiefs have awarded themselves huge salaries. Although the different bands should probably be seen as a series of semi-autonomous zones, I'd still like to see aboriginals equipped with the necessary tools to make it.

We actually basically ran the Indian nuclear arms program, and are listed alongside Japan as one of the countries that could have them if they really wanted them. However, I'd kind of be cautious of getting too confrontational with America, as ultimately a non-democratic revolution would be crushed in its infancy from across the border. The kind of smashy shit that works beautifully in the third world and in nations far away from the USA would just get us invaded. Furthermore, if we preserve an open relationship with the USA it'd be quite possible for us to redpill a lot of Americans really fast. Our countries are ludicrously interconnected - a victory for socialism in Canada, if well-handled, would mean huge gains for the American movement.

Dude how can you say that we're literally all Chinese you fucking sinophobe excuse you

I agree that we would need to have open relations with the US but there is no way the ruling class in America would let an openly socialist country share a border with them. Look at how many times they have attempted to crush Cuba. In order to have peaceful relations with the massive superpower that shares a border with us we would have to make any attempt at wiping us out extremely costly for them.

Considering how linked we are with the US economically, politically and culturaly I think that following a successful Canadian revolution there is a pretty good chance the Americans might follow. If they do the whole we need nukes thing is moot.

interesting post, thanks user

tyty

The thing is that Canada's an explicitly first-world country and is essentially America's best friend in the whole world. Even if Canada's smug about it, we love each other. On the one hand, the US actually couldn't afford the same regime change/sanction shit which they do in Cuba because it would jeopardize the trillion dollars in yearly trade and huge interlocked investments that we have. On the other, Canada's seen as one of the strongest democracies in North America and has a really disproportionate cultural connection with the US as its closest and dearest population of dirty Anglos. I think we're kinda the liberal wet dream, and even with their conservatives only Coulter and the real fuckbags actually hate us. If we were to achieve democratic socialism, on the one hand the US would be bound by its political economy to prevent them from being heavy-handed enough to make a difference. On the other, I'd argue that we're too close in every other aspect for the American people to countenance such a thing.

Imagine, though, the impact of a peaceful, democratic, and socialist revolution. 22 million Americans visited Canada for tourism, business, and family reasons in 2015 alone. If 22 million Americans went and saw first-hand a successful and (mostly) bloodless socialist revolution, they'd come home pretty changed. The same goes for the media, which is completely intertwined. If you got Canada's shitty celebs online, then there goes a whole bunch of other direct cultural impact too. My personal feeling is that if Canada were to go socialist in a legitimate and relatively peaceful way, America would be forced to take a long hard look at itself and actually consider its options.

Of course, if the American revolution failed and the reactionaries fortified themselves then we'd have no choice but to go the atomic route for reasons of survival. The idea is that those measures would be a last resort, when the chance for an American revolution had already been tried and died.

Not by 2040 or so. Tundra is a-melting. While that happens, the coastal cities of US will flood and everything from Nebraska south will be uninhabitable hot, which is one of the most underreported aspects of the recent migrations going on worldwide. Iran and Cambodia both had 135F summers in the last 3-4 years.

Speaking as a BC dipper: despicable Nationalists though they are, Quebec has been the primary thing pushing Canada to the left, or at least mitigating a rightward slide. The Bloc is populated exclusively with idiots, but the material threat of separation has been way more effective in getting demands out of Tory and Liberal government than the good boys of the NDP.
Of course, those demands became more and more idpol-y, so it's still trash, but if you want socialism in Canada, let's just say you're going to need to stock up on pea soup, pepsi, and try to smooth out the 4 corners of your square head.

Tell me more about the Maoist party, why are they "explicitly campus-based"?

What's the status of electoral reform?

He said socialism with Canadian characteristics, not social democracy with Canadian characteristics.

Nice to see a fellow Nova Scotian here. I honestly didn't think there were any. Nice post btw, very informative

I'm actually a torontofag who's out here for university, so I went full dipper with the local branch. I'm in a pretty small town, but I'm actually loving it out here. I don't know if I'd stay, but it's a great place and except for the fucker who keeps jerking off in my res bathroom and shaving his pubes in the sink it's wonderful.

They don't actually run candidates and just hand out Starbucks and say "please protest" while latching onto other people's campaigns and then critiquing them.

I won't pretend to be smart enough to give a single system. I prefer proportional representation, but ultimately it'd be better to have the consultative process and let the people decide.

Oh, I forgot >nationalize everything and turn it over to the workers

Isn't that basically just a given at this point? It asked "with Canadian characteristics", so I was proposing a platform that would deal with a lot of specific Canadian circumstances.

The NDP did well in Quebec in 2011 because they were able to pick up soft-nationalist votes. I know that Quebec is one of the bastions of leftist progress in this country and fully dig that, but at the same time it'd take certain things to get a lot of those people onside and one of them is defending the clarifiedterms of a referendum. The federal NDP does the same thing. Even without that, I'd probably consider myself a pretty strong federalist, so if Quebec ends up with more autonomy but remains within the federation I wouldn't object too much.

Speaking of which, tho, how's the BC NDP doing? I'm curious to hear about the other branches.

On the idpol side of things, you definitely have to address material conditions of course. However, narrowing the bounds of socialism to pure economics kind of limits its potential for broader social transformation, and there are certain things that a socialist government would ideally do that bourgies wouldn't dare. Having a strong arts policy and ramming through some serious aboriginal reform are both vital to Canada, and they'd both be reasonably popular talking points. Notice that I never said anything about making the Prime Minister a trans black demisexual demigender femme or anything, although the African-Canadian population has actually gotten the shit end of the stick for a while. When I proposed that program, I was looking to provide a decent framework for not only an economic transformation, but the social transformation that can go along with it.

It would be like an eh with a little bit of eh.

Well, if China is any indication, it would be pretty much like it is now–capitalism with a red flag.

Can I live in your barn when the US starts camping people?

This thread is so amusingly polite in a totally nonironic way. I love it. inb4 fuck you Canuckomrades, proud of you.

Rural Canada would see you swinging from lampposts long before America would have to lift a finger.

lol I picked up one of the trot papers once to take home, they stopped me and told me some price, i dont really remember but it was something retarded like 7 dollars.

… us IWW are spreading…maybe :3

But, in general, we should just go FALC - drone food and essentials to every house. just call housing and food the next step in socialized medicine, which even centre-right canadians like.

robots should harvest their wheat and oil, turn it into gas and bread, and deliver it to our houses

Seems revisionist, comrade…

That being said, kinda has a point.

I see far too many confederate license plates in rural nova scotia and hear about far too much rrreeeaaallllyyyy racist shit to ignore it. There's also a town near my family's farm (basically just for fucking around in the woods) where old people still call a certain place the "darkie corner" because the blacks lived there before they all got run out. This town was also known as a "sunset town" for a while - IE if you were black and there after sunset, things could get bad. Canada has some kinda creepy racist hicks, its just that there are less of them and all their kids left to be unemployed truck drivers. There are also just less of them than you'd find in America and they aren't that well-armed. 95% are a good lot tho, even if people do pull shitguns over wind turbines.

uuhhh eastern canada was more racist to blacks than the usa. they literally demolished the entire black part of town

it wasn't great, but the demolishing of africaville wasn't just he purging of the the colored part of town.

it was (for reasons relating to racism) a shantytown that never received municipal services or 'normal' streets and buildings.

people were rather roughly given some cash and relocated en mass to social housing elsewhere in the area

LAMO dude, im from rural canada and people out here would chomp at the bit for good jobs and the break up of corporate owned farms.

As in, US confederate battle flag license plates? Please tell me I'm wrong.

Yeah that happened in the USA too. Hell there were a couple times where it wasn't even "the black part of town" it was just a black town where black people were being reasonably economically successful and that just wouldn't do so they just fucking destroyed the place.

I'd like to, but I can't

Yeah, and a lot of the Maritimes actually desegregated after the South. Canada's level of smugness on these issues is fucking nuts.

It was the Young Communist League who built the guillotine.

The YCL is separate from the CPC however a lot of what we do is funded by the Communist Party.

Yes, how dare I feel a glimmer of positive affect when acknowledging that my polis's economic base never depended upon biblical levels of chattel slavery - the scars of which still create untold pain and division throughout society.

Like the USSR but with really smooth whiskey instead of vodka.

Canada's rural population is much less reactionary then in the US though there is still racism obviously. Race relations are generally much better in Canada and Canadian identity is very tied to multiculturalism and tolerance.

Polls have repeatedly shown Canadian widely support immigrants:
Immigrants are also more patriotic then natural born Canadians:

Your idpol race baiting bullshit will never work in Canada. Canada's socialist movement was largely based in rural areas and many of our most left-wing MP's like Charlie Angus and Niki Ashton come from rural areas. You're applying US logic to a different country, you're the one who will be hanging from a lamp post.

cbc.ca/news/canada/immigrants-the-proudest-canadians-poll-suggests-1.1225782

Forgot source. Inb4 muh CBC commie propaganda bullshit they link to a study.

Again dude he said socialism with Canadian characteristics.

no newfie screech? shameful

the first socialist government in north maerica was in rural canada so either you're a retarded torontofag or a yank although im not sure what the difference is