Who are all these people she's listing?

Who are all these people she's listing?
Are any of them actually worth a read?

Other urls found in this thread:

bennorton.com/adolph-reed-identity-politics-is-neoliberalism/
leftbusinessobserver.com/Antiracism.html
youtube.com/watch?v=C1rvIRtb1AM
stuartjeannebramhall.com/2015/10/13/did-the-cia-use-gloria-steinem-to-subvert-the-feminist-movement/
theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/sep/03/bojack-horseman-to-avoid-another-show-about-a-white-dude-make-him-a-horse
nplusonemag.com/issue-16/reviews/balibarism/
youtube.com/watch?v=EEI-NCTsiPE&t=207s
youtube.com/watch?v=kV2vfWUFtJ8
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Touchscreen#History
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

She clearly hasn't read CLR James and Adolph Reed if she thinks they're pro idpol

hi eleanor :3

bennorton.com/adolph-reed-identity-politics-is-neoliberalism/

Fanon was a fucking god who critiqued colonial liberation movements that tried to set up local capitalism and personally fought alongside the FLN in Algeria. Amazing guy, and although he's anti-Western as fuck Fanon is pretty interesting. Also takes a materialist approach to national liberation, racism, and the experience of being a highly educated black man in France and the racism he faced.

And he writes well to boot. I'd read even some of his essays. They offer some interesting perspectives on Marxism that you might not get from the standard canon.

this.
I'm pretty sure i got recommended CLR James by leftypol because hw was anti-idpol.

Lol this. Like, how you could read Adolph Reed and come away from said reading thinking "Wow, this person really agrees with ID pol" escapes me.

Why does anybody even pay attention to white women from upper middle class white suburbs anyway? They are quite likey the most muh privileged demographic that existed in all of human history.

This has got to be trolling.

elean please be my gf ;_;

The only material cause of identity politics is porky's interest in disrupting class consciousness.

She's completely right though, idpol exists as a material circumstance of capitalism. Alienation from one's labor in the form of false consciousness is necessary to prevent the proletariat from uprising.

Idpol doesn't, antagonisms do.
Idpol is a neoliberal vehicle to curb real dissent.

BTFO
T
F
O

...

Because they engage in attention-seeking behavior. In other words, they're women.
Addressing an anonymous community instead of simply coming here and posting anonymously is textbook attention-seeking shit, and shows a complete misunderstanding of (or maybe opposition to?) the purpose of imageboards.

interesting…….i was part of ows too and im a minority. back then i was very much into identity politics. hmmmmmmmmmmmm

Did any dudes in black suits with earpieces give you some help on your way to form a progressive stack?

She is right. You all should read ADOLPH and post ADOLPH quotes on twitter.
leftbusinessobserver.com/Antiracism.html

Downvoted.

But the exact opposite is the case and that's obvious.

This might be naive but I don't think Idpol movements are directly guided by the feds anymore. They were given direct state support, guidance, and encouragement in the "New Left" period absolutely but they have just been going on their own inertia since then with the odd ford foundation, soros, Rockefeller foundation etc. grant.

pls no bully the redditor

I wonder if this woman has even read Karl Marx lel

Does anyone have that wikipedia screen cap about Marx kicking feminist and anti-racist groups out of the second international

I was being facetious. The support has always been real, but indirect.

I just checked her twitter feed
holy kek

no

Here's some gold from this retard's Twitter:
1. She's calling it liberal, so…either she legit opposes socialism, or she's astoundingly ignorant and doesn't know what she's going on about.
2. Idpol is a vehicle for entryism, that's what SJWs do like 90% of the fucking time. Besides, I don't want it done to me, so I wouldn't do it to anyone else.


Fucking amazing.

No thanks

Adolph? You mean Adolph Hitler?

:^)

Stop trying to meme here, mom.

This sort of behavior is exactly why dad left you.

"Identity politics… In which we are all fighting with each other. Where blacks claim they are more oppressed than women, so women should subordinate themselves to blacks and SHUTUP. Or women who claim that the women's movement is more vanguard/primal than ____ (insert group here), or that males should generally subordinate themselves. This is getting sickening already this has nothing to do with the left. What it has to do with is chaos. That's what it has to do with. And it is EXACTLY the kind of chaos that capitalism studies and learns from."
"these things are a matter of concern to me in so far as they poison any possibility for a left emerging, and secondly because they turn your attention away from the social question which underlies most of the diseases we face today… notably HIERARCHY. and this hierarchy involves EVERYONE not only women and blacks or other people of color" - Bookchin
youtube.com/watch?v=C1rvIRtb1AM

I think during the 60s and 70s real direct support was provided. Its a matter of public record that during this period prominent feminist Gloria Steinmen was directly on the CIA's payroll and she also had relationships whith a Nixon-Ford assistant attorney general, and Henry Kissinger. There is quite a lot of evidence that Steinmen's messaging was funded and controlled by the alphabet soup agencies. She is a huge part of the reason why feminism has become so insufferably misandrist and bourgeois.

Its honestly completely repulsive that Steinmen will likely die as a well regarded figure .
Check out this article. Its written by another feminist group not MRAs or another flavour of reactionary.
stuartjeannebramhall.com/2015/10/13/did-the-cia-use-gloria-steinem-to-subvert-the-feminist-movement/

That's not an argument. If you can't articulate a thought in simple words, it might be because you're full of shit.

WTF?

is she a spooked SJW?

I think she might be an elaborate troll. How many legit people here talk about "NEETs," ever?

i fantasise about raping all the leftypol girls

newfag lrn 2 sage

>tfw no cute leftypoll grills to have a threesome with so they can redistribute my cum.

She seems to like us, but she is kind of spooked.
I wouldn't call her an SJW.

thats not healthy fam

get therapy

...

We do. They are capitalism, property, and class. Duh.


On the other hand it is especially funny when they tell people to read authors who patently disagree with them.

i like bill cosby's new alter ego

This board doesn't necessarily "hate" idpol, it's just that we focus on discussing class instead, since there are so many fucking avenues to discuss idpol. Additionally, since idpol is supposedly not entirely materialist (according to Eleanor, etc) us white male cis bros don't really have much of substance to contribute to the conversation of id pol on a fucking anonymous website.

t.Eleanor Robertson

>theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/sep/03/bojack-horseman-to-avoid-another-show-about-a-white-dude-make-him-a-horse

fuck you for making me agree with you

Adolph Reed's a great critic of idpol, definitely worth a read.

It would be awesome if it worked like this. But if you're a white-cis-male, according to the holy doctrine of Liberal Idpol Lived Experiences, your opinion is worthless. Plenty of them aren't even open to radicalization regardless of who is selling it to them, see: safety pin box, black capitalism, etc etc.

The only liberal idpoller I've been able to radicalize is my GF, and then together we've been able to radicalize a few more. So much of it seems to be tribalism at this point; it's easy to radicalize people if they think you're like cool or something.

i personally do.

i think idpol is not only keeping the masses distracted from class consciousness but it also has been causing wars and necessary suffering for as long as human existed.

Kill yourself

...

Not sure I need an argument for this one

me to : ^)

Fuck off, idpol scum. No war but the class war.

I LOL'd.

Wow, you're fucking edgy. Do you think the issues faced by a black worker are identical to those faced by a white worker?

Sure, the political strategy adopted by liberal idpolers is often toxic and completely obfuscates class issues (ie. black workers make X% of what white workers make, thus by omission white workers are not being oppressed, since they're the "norm" being compared against). But the whole idea that identity matters and gives you new social mechanisms by which to be oppressed is perfectly okay.

Wow

She is probably just confused about what identity politics means and thinks that being against identity politics means to be against any anti-racist, anti-sexist struggle et cetera.

great comeback, is 100% right
read theory

Can we get Holla Forums to swallow some of this shit?

You're right. The problem isn't class society caused by private property. Nope, black workers are exploited because racism. After all, black labor power is inherently different. We're all just special different categories of people with no unifying cause against any kind of economic oppressor. :^)

nah all they'll do is screech "cuck cuck im gay trump my ass daddy" until we give up.

Please tell me where Marx, Bakunin, Proudhon, or any other founding figure of socialism said that the working class should divide itself up by race and attempt to solve their problems in parallel.

you fucking tool, whatever specific problem "black workers" have maybe, its also caused by idpol.

Got you fam. Plus some bonus background info.

stop being a bitch, Eleanor.
give valid arguments or move to the pseudo-intellectual board >>>Holla Forums

since most of you anti-idpolers that miss the point so massively circlejerk over Zizek and Balibar, why not

Race, Nation, Class: Ambiguous Identities
by Etienne Balibar and Immanuel Wallerstein

Why are they 100% right?

literally who

Oh my boo

These issues can only be solved through economics (class). Anything else it's just aspiring for "capitalism with a human face".

Fuckin' narchos.

and by the way no one advocated for idpol, merely pointed out how accepting that oppression manifests in different forms depending on the sort of identity that capitalist society forces on you

this is not idpol and if you think it is, all youre familiar with is circlejerk on Holla Forums

...

Can't wait to gatekeep the fuck out of you

a wall-street brokers wants to sow discord i the international workingmen's association?

gee, I wonder why

Read some Bordiga and observe this novelty half the time self-proclaimed LeftComs refer to him.

...

you should seriously know Balibar

based parenti

Seriously though,

"Identity," in the way that it's used here, is a self-ascribed label. You "identify as" whateverthefuck. You want an example that isn't idpol? Black slavery in America. It was based on race for a reason. Attempts to enslave Native Americans failed because they had tribes (which were effective support groups) to help them escape and hide them. Blacks didn't, and they stood out because of their skin color. Those were the material elements that caused Europeans to select their race for enslavement in the New World. There, class and race did overlap.
In capitalism, they don't, because capitalism rules by deprivation rather than direct coercion (though it uses direct coercion against those who attempt to stop it, just like any other exploitative system). That is what it means to reject identity politics, within the context of socialism: to see that class struggle unites all working people, regardless of all the other orthogonal antagonisms it produces (which are real, but not universal in the way that class is).
I don't know how to spell it out any more clearly.

maybe it's because you're an American, but here in Europe Balibar is a well-known author of Marxist philosophy and wrote a lot about "idpol"

nplusonemag.com/issue-16/reviews/balibarism/

Eurocentrist

shitposter

Surely they'll listen to the wise words of "Adolph"

From Wikipedia:

It is not necessary for you to self-identify with an identity for it to be identity – being a black man during the time of slavery is as much of an identity as it is today, just that the context has changed and the understanding of this identity. In the time of slavery black people were thought of as subhuman, that changed quite a bit since then, though not with all folks.

You cannot claim that capitalism uses idpol to divide the working class and yet in the same breath deny that people face different forms of oppression in capitalist society – at the base lies the material oppression of course, but the superstructure is different for people with different backgrounds. A black woman in a racist, sexist town will have a harder time and different experience than a white man in that very same location, this oppression manifests mostly in material ways and at its root lies capitalist hegemony, but how it comes about is different and useful to analyze.

Fanon is ok. I'd hesitate to say that national liberation should equate to identity politics, more that culture imposes limits on that's possible.

If the two can't be separated, it's because they're mutually constitutive.

Rad, well that's how the term is used here, and what the essence of "idpol" means. You're free to masturbate to your own definitions elsewhere.
I didn't. I said that class struggle is the one thing that unites the working class by definition. Because of this, it cannot be subordinated to any other struggle, cannot be "put off until" any other struggle is complete, cannot be ignored or diminished or marginalized. It is the driving historical force of the world, and the only thing that can destroy capitalism.
I agree. But changing the base (which, again, can only happen through class struggle, and no other) will create a new superstructure. Obviously, I want to live in a world with racial and sexual equality, with equality before the law, all that. You should take that for granted (though I guess I can't entirely blame you if you don't, given the last few years).

I may have been overly harsh in what I said about masturbating over definitions. Sorry. It's just that "idpol," as it's generally used here, is a conception that was created as a reaction (inb4 "reactionary!") to the types of Tumblr-browsing retards who think that it's impossible for someone to have an opinion unless they have a "lived experience." That is, they refuse to distinguish between the contents of an idea and the identity of the person putting it forth. This is the same illogical thought process that leads people to believe that people can "change genders."

When did I say that? Class society caused by private property is most of the problem, but it's not all of it. The elimination of private property won't eliminate harassment or rape, etc.

Of course, this is not a defense of idpoller techniques like fucking "safety pin box" or the progressive stack in the DSA. I'm not even saying that it's bad for socialists to focus entirely on class, especially when so many organizations like BLM are focusing entirely on idpol.

I mean, it's another issue if you think the whole concept of gender is dumb. But given the definition of gender where it's some abstract notion of where you feel like you fit in and "identify" with most, why can't that change?

I guess I misunderstood you, then.
I've just seen so many reddit """""socialists""""" use this line of thinking to justify ignoring class struggle in favor of BLM or whatever other flavor-of-the-month bullshit they want to focus on. I assumed you were doing the same.

Then what point is there in eliminating private property as a legal conception and material fiction?

Because that isn't what gender is. Gender is a set of expectations and norms that society places on individuals, based on their sex. Claiming to be a "different gender" is to claim that society actually expects something else from you, which is obviously untrue.
So the idea that you can "be a different" gender is actually worse than wrong: it's meaningless. It's just something people say in order to cover up the true message, which is, "I wish I had been born as the opposite sex." In which case…I don't know what to tell you. Billions of people on Earth get by fine without having existential crises about their chromosomes. The fact that you can't speaks to other issues, for which you should seek help.
The solution to society wanting to limit people's behaviors (gender) based on their sex isn't to switch to the opposite set of expected limiting behaviors. It's to ignore those norms and expectations, and realize yourself as your own person.
Also, for what it's worth, if people want to be objectively wrong and claim that they're "transgender," and wear dresses or get fake dicks attached to their crotches–fine. I'm going to mock you for it, but I don't think anyone should try to stop you, or oppress you. (And I mean actual oppression, like violence or profiling or denying you service, not saying shit you don't like.) But the moment you demand that I take part in your self-delusion is the moment I tell you to fuck off.
That's pretty much all I have to say on that issue.

Who is she and why is she retarded?

So because a measure won't fix all problems it shouldn't be done?

But definitions about things without much of a material basis are subject to change, at least in the colloquial use. When people say gender, they don't actually mean "a set of expectations and norms that society places on [them]" they simply mean that they identify more with the archetypal male than they do female, or something along those lines.

I guess as a cis-male, I don't really understand this, since there's nothing inherent within my being that makes me feel like a male, I just accepted what somebody told me at some point. I don't have any reason to believe that dysphoria isn't real, though, so it's perfectly logical that while identifying as the norm isn't an intense feeling, identifying against it is. Additionally, just not being an ass to trans/non-binary folks and using what pronouns they want, regardless of if you have some sociological argument against it, lowers their suicide rate, so I don't see why not to do it.

very liberal statement from a nazi

idpol is not used that way here, you just misunderstand what idpol is. idpol has its origin in the new left and describes a very specific and well described form of social and political movement

and while what you described is part of it by the way, it simple goes beyond that as well.

I think this is generally the disconnect between the usage of idpol here and elsewhere (I assume Eleanor is one of those Jacobin/DSA folks, but I don't know for sure). I think when a lot of Holla Forumsers think of idpol, they think of generally reactionary practices by the /r/socialism mods, some gamergate figures, and the sort of Tumblr "WHITE MALE!!!" shit. But people who don't spend as much time on the internet think of it more as just "any politics involving mention of different races/genders/ethnicities/whatever".


The general populace does not care what a very specific and well defined sociological definition originating from the New Left. People use words outside of their original context, and thus their definitions (colloquially) change because everyone is not as autistic as you.

the general populace does also not care how the fuck idpol is used on leftypol or probably doesnt even know what it means. is it so hard for you to admit youre wrong and dont know everything? jesus fuck

Okay but they psychiatrists will recommend transition as the legitimate treatment of gender disphoria. You want them to seek help but you also don't want to recognize that help as legitimate.

Archetypes are the social ideal that gender revolves around; it's impossible for either to exist without the other. It's impossible to "identify as a man" unless there's already some social conception of "man" that exists outside of a person's sex (i.e., their chromosomes). This is gender. Again, this is why claiming that one is transgender is meaningless, rather than wrong. It's the "identifying as" part.

Fine, I'll indulge you. Let's be generous and assume that they're using the word "gender" to mean something else: "the subjective experience of being a particular sex." In this case, it simply means a subjective experience of sex. If that's the case, it is literally impossible to "experience" a "gender" other than the one you were assigned at birth, because you have never actually possessed a different one. It's like me claiming that my authentic life experience is that of a goldfish.

I'm not saying it isn't; it very well may be. But the existence of a mental illness doesn't mean that the results in the victim's mind bear any relationship to the truth. We don't believe that sounds have colors, just because people suffering from synesthesia sense (in a very real way) that they do.

Well, if all one is trying to do is be contrarian and break norms, I can respect that, in a way. But by and large, that isn't the character of the transgender phenomenon; these people are making real, biological claims that simply bear no relation to reality.

Like I said, I'm not going to take part in their game of make-believe. I'm not going to deny the facts of the world around me just because it might hurt someone's feelings. They're free to act as they wish, but their entire self-conception is based on nonsense. It's not my obligation to pretend that the world conforms to their incorrect perspective, and I certainly won't be pressured to do so through threats or implications of self-harm.

Any psychiatrist who does is indulging the victim's mental illness, rather than treating it. The question they should be asking is, "Why do you feel this way, and how can we get it to stop?" If I just can't stand the fact that I have ten fingers rather than eight, and it really eats me up inside, the appropriate response is not to cut off my thumbs. Treatment is not indulgence.

Have you considered that perhaps psychiatrists know more about mental illness than Some Guy On The Internet

Are you a psychiatrist?

stop asking those questions or youre going to summon Hoochie

I filtered her months ago.

filter hoochie and move on, retard

also this is my biggest trigger right after misuse of ad hominem, he said that you have no competence in regards to the topic as opposed to psychiatrists, he did not claim he had that competence himself in which case your question would make sense. I can tell you that a janitor is not competent in the field of rocket science without having to work for NASA

but I like Hoochie

Hoochie, you're not fooling anyone.

I am capable of googling "Gender dysphoria treatment."

Have you considered that perhaps logicians know more about fallacies than Some Guy on the Internet

This is pretty conceited desu

ad hominem

I'm happy for you. If it's worth anything to you, my mother is a psychologist (not a psychiatrist). When I ask her about dysphoria and all this kind of stuff, all I really get out of her is a shrug and comments to the effect that the psychiatric community is still trying to work out how to deal with all this shit.

I will kill myself if you don't admit that the Earth is flat.

That you have the capacity to make fun of it is more the sum of the conceit than it is a comprehension of it.

What? This thread is about how a normie (read: general populace) is essentially confused at how we use the term 'idpol'.


Link a paper that proves there's no biological origin of gender dysphoria.

You missed your chance, now I die. Goodbye, cruel, flat world!

You seem very confused.

No, that's exactly my point. You're invoking biology for a question it's physically unable to answer at the time, and thus the lack of any evidence means the negative is somehow true.

No, you're still confused. L2epistemology

To what degree it CAN be answered biology seems to suggest the opposite too: transgender individuals frequently have brain activity patterns that closer match their identified gender rather than biological sex.

What brain patterns do "wearing these clothes" and "working these jobs" have?

correlative, not real science bullshit. This is literally the same logic as "race-realists" use when they find some epic SNP correlated to low-IQ.


In the current state of neuroscience, how would you find a causal association between the network of an individuals neurons/their chemical environment and the experience of "gender dysphoria"?

I don't know. But that doesn't mean the truth of the matter doesn't exist.
The number of living fish in the ocean has a real, truthful number. Just because we can't know it doesn't mean that number isn't real.
Kind of a shitty analogy, but I hope you get my point.

correlative, not real science bullshit.
I did say SUGGESTS, not confirms

Holy fuck, SJWs were shitting the left up as far back as the First International. I fucking swear, I won't be surprised if I read about how the Jacobins had a section of monocle-wearing dandies who insisted the most pressing issues for the peoples of the world were the supply of colonial sugar and abolishing the law that included ankles among the list of body parts women couldn't show in public.

I don't think they should "just get over it," I think they should seek help. And it's not semantics; the entire idea rests on an incoherent understanding of gender and sex.

You think they should seek help, but also because the help they get isn't just getting over it you don't believe it's real help

Specialized or social

I'm not saying there isn't some physical truth out there that won't be at some point known. But taking something as indirect as EEG signals and then comparing that to variables whose definition is more steeped in sociology than the physical sciences isn't going to give us any sort of certainty on the matter. If the modest conclusions of associative studies have to be stretched for the point of argument, it's better to just omit science entirely.

I wasn't aware that therapy, drugs, and other potential treatments were "just getting over it." My point was that psychiatrists shouldn't just go, "LOL SURE WHATEVER U WANT, WHO CARES ABOUT THE UNDERLYING CAUSE :)"
By the way, if they don't want treatment, and want to trans it up, I said before that I'm fine with that–I'm just not going to take part in the delusion along with them.

What do you mean?


I agree.

Should transexuals seek social community care or specialized care

Oh. Both, ideally.

Thank you. The background info is also really fascinating I never would have guessed that leftists were dealing with this type of nonsense over a century ago. Its much harder for us to purge our movements of this type of thing though, with the whole oppression points=the value of your opinion meme making it harder to challenge Idpollers.

I've always found it ironic how Nazi's and other reactionaries are always willing to use liberal *anti-white prejudices when it serves their arguments. There always drawing attention to how white anti-fa and other leftist groups are as if that means the people in them weren't facing oppression or exploitation. They also love circle jerking about how spoiled and entitled white women are (to be fair I've seen comrades here do this as well.) Honestly most people's lives are hard under capitilism regardless of race and gender. The incels on here calling women the new labour aristocracy are just like the feminists who think all men have easy lives because of patriarchy.

including the male girls?

And this is why bourgeois decadence needs curbstomped wherever it is witnessed. Conceits are for cruel derision, not for respecting.


kys larper

I don't know what this means.
This isn't a word.
Try again, without the word salad.

I think this really betrays the intentions of a lot right wingers who foam at the mouth against SJWs. I'd argue a lot of them 100% believe in what SJWs say about whites the difference is they want to defend it.

hi idiots why do you bump a Holla Forums thread?


this is so retarded you must be trolling.

We hate white Sjws because they fight for non white interests. Cunt in the OP should be pregnant with white children instead of tweeting about oppressed Somalis.

lol you're a cuck who can't get his dick wet

Privileged blue check marks need to sit down, shut up and use their muh privilege to make room for the algorithmically oppressed masses of twitter to share their lived experiences and speak their truths.

smh that this bitch thinks her opinion is so important when she obvious benefits from blue check mark supremacist systems that diminish and oppress the struggles of egg accounts and systemically hide the destruction of egg bodies.

I couldn't make sense out of what he was saying. I didn't even say he was wrong. Are you illiterate or just retarded?

She should delete her account and go outside. idpol is the gayest thing to ever come out of academia, worse than transhumanism and neo-liberal economics.

There is literally nothing wrong with transhumanism.

Double >. I was piling on in agreement with not taking part in their conceits. I think?


doesn't pass

eleanor I will read them but

ONLY

if you post feet with socks

You need to improve your English before posting more. I'm not trying to be mean, I honestly don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

...

No we won't swallow this shit because we know race is not a class because class is not a social position but your relation to the means of production.

Neoliberals gonna neoliberal.

What.
What.
Fam, by "transhumanism" I mean putting human brains in cool exoskeletons and robots and shit. Not trying to map a human brain onto a computer system.

Identity politics divides people of the same material conditions.
Black versus white, gay versus straight, male versus female, etc.
Identity politics is promoted by the establishment because it is a divide and conquer technique used against the lower classes.
Class politics unites the lowerclass's, i unites the lower people of all races and religions against the rich.
The democratic party are neoliberal centrists who work in the interest of their corporate, lobbyist, zionist, oligarchical boss's behind closed doors, while using identity politics as window dressing.

The real left died when the wall in berlin fell, replaced by a polite, corporate, managerial, neoliberlism who despise the lower class, especially lower class white people.

Bill clinton, the champion of these people, expanded the private prison program, privtiesed the media so today only 6 corporation control everything, and finally passed NAFTA, a globalist trade bill that destroyed the rust belt.

Flash forward to 2016 and all trump has to do is acknowledge that lower class white people exist and he wins everything, flips the rust belt, and becomes a populist hero.

While the democrats keep screaming about how they are smarter, more educated, and better than the redneck scum in middle america.

By transhumanism I mean an elite genetically engineering meek slaves who are then enhanced with cybernetics.

Holy ever-living fuck.
No. No no no no no no no.
I don't want that, ever. Not in a million years.
That wouldn't even serve a point, you could just get robots with good learning algorithms to do that shit. Creating life just to toil and suffer for you is a fucking nightmare hell.

You can't do that without killing the person and dehumanizing them, you're completely destroying their endocrine system and relationship with genetics. Their genes will warp and morph in response to being separated from the body. What arises will be monstrous and not-human in any sense. Additionally the raw resources required for even one artificial human's life cycle much less millions (i know for a fact you don't think or care about giving everyone this super power, its an elitist masturbation fantasy). Further still this technology would only ever be developed in an extremely extraction based, stratified civilization where a very elite few are allowed the luxury of an extremely invasive and highly excellent mode of existence. finally, the immuno-evolutionary toll it would take would be debilitating and more and more of the human organism would have to be replaced until we are all machine. Which is the extermination of our entire genetic lineage

In effect its a death wish. You can't escape flesh without dying. Your machine body will slowly demand more and more technical support to maintain itself which will encroach on your neurology and genetics. Soon everything about you will have to be compatible with the machines needs and not yours. The body and its functions will own you, not the other way around. it will demand your genes be modified and your immune system buffered by nanotech. You will lose ground with every upgrade and again it will end in you dying and the machine being perfectly stable. This idea that you can keep the subject, the organic mind and person and species within a metal carapace is nonsense. It will immediately eat away at our humanity and then kill it.

A totally bat shit insane masturbation fantasy is what transhumanism ultimately entails. That and total genocide of the species as these creatures will not tolerate organic life or inferior life having any dominion over the planet. And of course it will happen within the framework of a massive techno-capitalist welfare state, so we will all be required to give up our bodies and then suicide ourselves so we can become machines. Our organic evolution will be ended by our technological advancement.

this tbh

anyone has the twitter screencap of one of Eleanor's followers that wrote something like "People who don't like IdPol have clearly never tried to organize anything"?

I want to make a meme


nice spooks you humanist fag

genetic engineering is much further along theoretically and practically than robotics and ai is. you aren't the one who will be in charge, sociopathic NRx/technocratic hybrid types will be in charge. They will need to modify us, lower castes will have no sex organs or ability to mate. They will have no ability to dream or to feel deep emotions, they'll have short life cycles. They'll all have the same plain, unthreatening face. Meanwhile the elites will have beautiful tall aryan god-bot exo-skeletons with neural enchancement tech and state of the art noosphere tech that supplements their cybernetic brains. They'll likely stop caring at all about the atmosphere or oceans or forests. They won't care about human decency or morality or ethics in any meaningful way. The notion of a "nightmare hell" will be amusing and primitive to them. You people don't fathom what the evil within us is capable of or how easily it could take hold of our most powerful weapons

nod an argument you cretin

scientific progress>humanism

...

The democratic party is a party of coastal elitism, university educated twats, people who live in gated communities and gentrified areas, hollywood, silicon valley, and wall street.
It is an unholy cabal of corporatism and has associated liberal ideas with the corporate establishment.
Capitalism always does commidfy leftist social movements.

Do you really think jim bob what had his job outsourced and lives pay check to paycheck gives a fuck where trannies take a shit?
Middle america is a howling snake pit of death, poverty, and drug addiction, they are mocked constantly by the media, who, lets face it, work in the interest of the democratic party 95% of the time.

Okay, watch this video i think it explains everything.

Trump = kamina
The american people = simone
Globalists = the anti spiral

youtube.com/watch?v=EEI-NCTsiPE&t=207s

We can't do it at all now. I'm sure a time will come when it's perfectly possible.
I'd want it to be done in a way that includes the body's hormonal systems. Brain chemistry relies on that stuff.
It's still organic material, it's just in a robotic shell. Every cell still has DNA in it.
False.
Sounds pretty spooky. We already wear glasses and use pacemakers. Transhumanism (of the sort I'm describing) is just a logical extension of that.
First of all, you don't know me, so you can stop pretending you do. Second, I think transhumanism should be an option for everyone. I'm not under any illusions that it's going to happen in my lifetime–I'm not one of those people who thinks technology is going to step in and make them live forever. Hell, I wouldn't want to live forever.
What makes you say that? Productive power is ever expanding, technology is ever progressing, overpopulation will end in time–why is it so hard to believe that a future society, which will already rely on automated production via robots, will have so much trouble giving robot bodies to whoever wants one?
I really don't know where you're getting this from. Perhaps you're confusing my position with someone else's? The brain would already have to be very, very well sealed in order to avoid exposure–infection would not be a serious problem. Further, people would still be born as natural humans–they'd only be given the choice to use a robot body when they're adults.

I'm too tired to respond to the rest of your post right now.

I'm not talking about AI, I'm talking about heuristics. It's very sophisticated these days. Self-learning industrial machines aren't exactly new. And it doesn't have the ethical complications that genetic engineering does.

Despite your Sanic pic, I actually thought you were being earnest for a minute there.

its not logically possible, its philosophically untenable
It doesn't matter if you keep the endocrine system, you are disrupting it. It is an open system that relies on external stimuli and the rest of the bodies many interlinked systems to function. Taking it out of the body is disastrous, just look at the mental illness crisis right now, imagine that times 1000.
DNA has a relationship with environment, robotic shell will change the dna fundamentally and thus the species. Even people with minor modifications will have epigenetic mutations that are unique.
complete and utter fucking bullshit, people who were alcoholics or experienced child abuse have epigenetic markers that carry on into future generations. The idea that the trauma of being removed from your body won't change our genetics is insane and unscientific. You can say false, but 2+2=4 no matter what you want to believe.
Yes and both of those things are dehumanizing. And glasses are a supplement to the body. They aren't exchanging the body for an unholy prison. You can meme all you want. Again it isn't an argument or philosophically substantive much less convincing. There is a subject, it is informed by its genetics and environment along with choices. It responds to everything always, if divorced from the body it will become mutilated. The nervous system evolved with the rest of the body in mind, our minds are reflections of the whole body. They do not exist on top of the body, figuratively, as the intellectual idiot believes they do.
I bet I know more about you than you think, most people who think the way you do are all the same
You won't be in charge of any of this pumpkin
That's where me and you differ
Every single new technology that's ever been invented ever has required more dangerous extractions of resources. I'm not aware of any major, productive technology that doesn't rely on rare earth metals, rare nuclear materials or rare minerals.
I know this may come as a surprise but technology hasn't noticably advanced much since the 40's. We had cell phones before that, they just weren't available commercially. We had wifi in the 60's and ipads back then too. Everything we have was invented 100 years ago and is being rolled out of DARPA/MIT vaults to nerds and professors who "discover" it all over again. This misundertanding about the role of the Deepstate/Blackbudget science in developing things like the Internet and Genetic engineering is telling and why I said I know you better than you think. You don't consider huge amounts of dynamic factors that effect your world view at all.
Because no society has ever given even a vague amount of shit about its proles ever (not the USSR or Cuba or Venezuela or Sweden or Norway or any other gay Dem Soc/State Capitalist empire) the only countries on Earth that will have the capacity for this are Capitalist, Hierarchical, Stratified societies. You also skipped a thought. you forgot to quizzically ask me about the need for raw materials, but i guess that is a glaring hole in your utopian fantasy so we can ignore it
Kantian logic
No, i am going off your style of transhumanism. I'm ignoring the more insane version where we all commit seppuku and upload our minds to the cloud.

I bet you don't.
I'm aware of that, sweetheart darling dear.
Oh, so you're just a crazy person. Never mind then, carry on.

Are you fucking retarded? Did you not realize that Tesla invented cell phones in the early 20th century and that the US government has been using touch screens since the 60's and has had wifi since then? Are you actually retarded? Do you think something is only real if the government reveals it? You know we had Stealth bombers in the early 80's right? Way before they were declassified. You know that LSD was being used by the British military in the 1940's right? What level of normie are you? the Deep state isn't real normie, or just "i trust everything DARPA and MIT say" normie?

Anime explains everything

Trump: "Make america great again"

Kamina: "DONT BELIEVE IN YOURSELF, BELIEVE IN THE ME THAT BELIEVES IN YOU"

youtube.com/watch?v=kV2vfWUFtJ8

You are deluded. Seek help.

He is right, touch sceens did not only exist in star trek.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Touchscreen#History

shit, bumped a shill thread

take a pill hill shill