Fighting Game Guy

Hey Holla Forums sometime last year I made a thread talking about a fighting game I was working on, so I thought I'd give you guys an update since I thought some people here might be interested, and you were all very very helpful:

So the game I was working on designing was for a manga that me and a friend are making about competitive gaming. We made two pilots for said manga, and entered them to a global manga competition held by Shounen Jump. Winner gets serialized on their weekly magazine.

That said, even if we lose the contest with Jump, we're still gonna make this manga, we both feel this concept can be very successful, especially with how we plan to execute it. Think, "Slam Dunk" but about fighting games, with shounen battle manga fights. The game itself, and the various characters are essentially the "power system" that determine the rules of combat. Like HxH's Nen, or Naruto's Ninjutsu.

The game is designed as a legit fighting game however. Every step of the way, I'm approaching it with the intent of making this into a real fighting game down the line. Down to character movesets and gimmicks, to the mechanics and movement options, as well as the button inputs and control options, etc… However, I just feel that building up the brand first in order for it to be recognized is more important, otherwise it'd get left off the wayside like countless projects.

Anyway, first pic is of the old roster I shared here months ago, and the 2nd pic is of the finalized starting roster. Overall, there'd be 40+ characters, maybe even more. But we wanna release them all in batches within the manga to kinda add a sense of intrigue to it all (especially since we will delve into the "mythos" of sorts of why certain people choose certain character and whatnot). We do have a centralized theme and lore for the game itself as well, it's why we made two one shots in fact, one about the eSports, and the other about the vidya characters.

The remaining pics are concept art of the manga btw.

Oh, and here's links to the two one shots if anyone is interested in reading them:

medibang.com/book/0o1712240724059010004309649

medibang.com/book/1n1801041429027430004309649

Don't worry about the voting or anything btw, it genuinely doesn't matter. It's Kishimoto and the Jump editors who decide the winner, not the votes.

Also, feel free to ask me about whatever you like regarding the game, and its design and stuff, I'm open to talking about it.

Other urls found in this thread:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giri_(Japanese)
medibang.com/contest/jumpuniversal/
archive.is/O9lR7
youtube.com/watch?v=teMdjJ3w9iM
youtube.com/watch?v=co-I0LDtFWk
youtube.com/watch?v=72DI5E1Q0Ow
youtube.com/watch?v=YF3jeAPGhrY
youtube.com/watch?v=ZkW-K5RQdzo
youtube.com/watch?v=xOz-T3NPtLA
youtube.com/watch?v=nM__lPTWThU
youtube.com/watch?v=L0FSMyFs6-U
youtube.com/watch?v=ybyU0pdIu4Y
youtube.com/watch?v=sGEVgU3hmC8
archive.is/FMcOS
dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=BBCF/Ragna_the_Bloodedge
youtube.com/watch?v=Sul-lc9D-8I
youtube.com/watch?v=Whe2qvEiZds
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

Oh yea, I remember you. Didn't know this was actually for a manga. Neat.

nice designs, nice waifus, better than battleborn and lawbreakers

...

I'm impressed with what I see. A more unique art style than most stuff I see nowadays. No commentary to offer otherwise.

You need to hide your sources better. All of your designs are derivative as fuck, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

But when people can tell, your shit ends up getting fucked pretty quickly.

Bring something new to the table. Don't just mash things you like together. Easier said than done with character design especially.

Hey there!

Glad to see you still working on this. I think I gave you feedback on the characters last time you posted about it.

Do you use Discord? I'd like to ask you some questions about it.

My Discord username is PsychoJosh#2917

nice trips, if your intent was for me to harass this dude I normally wouldnt, but since you got trips I will if you come clean

Red is still my waifu and that doom-guy big guy looks retarded. Very nice though

Nigger you're posting in his bloody thread. What is wrong with you autists.

this is going to fall through within a year

Sure, my discord is: ManlySpirit#5599

Which ones do you feel are derivative? First pic is old AF so it doesn't count. But in the 2nd one, Neon Knight is an intentional nod to Kamen Rider (he even has a "rider kick" and alt colors that refernce Kamen Rider), and Rozenrot is intentionally based off the Red Riding Hood fairy tail (her whole gimmick is transforming into a werewolf).

I mean, there are characters that are intentional nods to pop culture, but I do try to offset it by having original characters in there as well. Onigiri, Nin-Nin, etc… are all fairly unique imo.

Just out of curiosity. This stuff is always interesting to me.

Hop to it

looks like he would need to accept an unsolicited friend request for me to talk to him if I am understanding the discord UI right
if true then it isnt a good medium for individual trolling unfortunately

Nothing wrong with archetypes if they're done well.

Nah, I've been preparing this for over a year now.

Our options are this:

well, that's balls to the wall we're doing this, the success we could get is huge, the key now would be to stay in the magazine till it gets an anime adaptation and explodes in popularity

We'd approach Medibang who has a partnership program where they pay you a commission per page, and push it ourselves by talking to the right people to help us push it. We're already much better than people currently partnered with Medibang, so it'd be easy. In that scenario, we'd push out the first chapter in June 2018, and crunch all the way to Chapter 14 by winter 2018.

The Jump contest results are in Spring of this year, so for the time being, I'm prepping more stuff, and saving money by doing commissions till the results are out.

Josh, Josh, Josh… Don't waste those nice songs you got for your game, make sure you will have a demo this yer. No excuses!

Really enjoyed the "Shokan" girl. I hope she returns.
The whole idea of a story in the game and about the game, could work really well. But it will be a lot of work.

Agreed, but you must be careful with how you deliver them. AOF lost respect mostly because its main characters were so similar to Ryu & Ken.
I think the characters do have some weird designs in some cases. I can't put Neon Knight
in the same game as the others. Not with that armor, even if his design is really cool.

I remember you guys. Good to see you're still working on it. Ganbare with Jump. I'm not good at fighters but I approve of indie works like this.

If I could make a single request, it'd be for you to put a lot of attention into how the basic movement feels in the game. A lot of fighting games, especially recently, really seem to brush over how much walk/dash speeds and jump arcs affect a game. It's so basic that I think everyone takes it for granted. Especially, don't fall into the "slower = easier" trap. If the game is too slow, it just makes it feel more deliberating and hard to control for new players.

Trying to launch a multimedia project like this is very ambitious. Do you guys have other professional experience? I like the idea a lot. I like the designs too, but they hit my three major fetishes (dfc, hips, kamen rider) so I am biased.

Hm, I think you're right about Neon Knight. He looks really fucking cool (biased), but he should have more of a japanese mythology flair to him.

Sounds like you've got it all planned out. Nice.
Good luck with the votes.

Literally all of them. I could give you a detailed breakdown if you like with maddens and everything.

I'm surprised that you "cant see it" yourself.

Character designs are not archetypes.

The way we manage to inlcude characters like Neon Knight and Trooper (Doomguts guys) is because this is Chinese Hell. So some many of the characters were brought there after they died in the real world. Neon Knight is one of those.

And by Chinese hell, think more along the lines of how Dragonall did hell. It's not as edgy as you'd think it'd be. But overall, it's a very strong Chinese Wuxia aesthetic, with some cruveballs thrown in there that almost feel like they don't fit.

Think of how Disgaea added the Flash Gordon parody into their game for example.

For the game itself, particularly movement, one the main influences is Smash Melee, so it certainly wouldn't be a slow game. Not only that, but I would also push for analogue inputs rather than digital ones, precisely cause I want the movement to have a certain finesse to it. That said, it's not exactly a platform fighter, and certainly not a Smash clone. It's got HP bars and is meant to be played with a fight stick. It's also got 4 attack buttons. Though Ring Outs are possible in certain stages.

I'd like that actually, if you don't mind.

Okay.

I'd like the breakdown, please. Real criticism is better than bickering.

WHERE'S THE VIDEO GAME PART YOU DOUBLE NIGGER.
CONCEPT ART DOESN'T COUNT.

vs

It's hard to explain because the concept of "originality" is very very complex. I hope what I wrote was sufficient.

Expect it later in the day. I have to go get my car fixed.

I wish you the best, dear user.

Fixed it for you.

To someone who knows little, almost everything is original. To someone who knows a lot, nothing is.
There's no point in trying to be original, just try making something good.

So I left that one out. I really wouldn't include doomguts, femgorowithyellowskin or RaidenxSamxNier going forward unless you do like seven more passes at the design to make it more your own. You're clearly improving so don't let any of what I say slow you down.

The TLDR is: Just try to be more mindful as you design characters. Try to make more than one pass per character concept/archetype.

Every aspect of design is important if you want to create something that isn't generic.

Don't act like originality doesn't exist just because you haven't attempted to be creative. (not that I didn't say you ARENT creative. Just that you haven't bothered with it yet. Anyone can create.)

I'd name splatoon as an "original" game/concept. I'm aware of a couple games that are similar in execution but entirely different in concept.

The differentiation is the key.

I'll go through them 1 by 1:

Kinda missing the point. The core idea was "red riding hood" and then I ran with it. I guess you correlated the Alice side of it to her name, but that was added at the end, once her design was finalized. At the end, she's not even THE red riding hood, but just the core of the idea. She's a blood witch with a toture wheel for a weapon. Consuming more blood slowly pushes her sanity, till she turns into a wolf, playing on the original story. Hence the Yandere aspect.

Lol, c'mon man. I can't expect to take your advice seriously if you can't even bother to look up what her name means. It's Chinese for "fragrant flower" and I liked it cause of the aliteration. You say the dress is generic, but how many chinese dresses show that much skin, and have sleeves that long? What about her hairstyle? The fan also suitable for her fighting style. How many fighting games have characters with Giant fans? Only characters in media I can think of with Giant fans are that one chick from Naruto, and that's it.

Yes, his name is a Japanese pun. It's intentional. Oni is Japanese for Demon, Giri is a Japanese concept of devotion. Onigiri means riceball, cause he's meant to be rather tongue in cheek character. Dude is literarlly a NEET/momma's boy, who gets kicked out of his house by his dad. Read the one shot.

In that same vein, how many fighting game characters, or even protagonists in general have a club for a weapon, or use Tiger Style Kung Fu? The dude's got a massive Tiger motif going on. You're also way off on his inspirations. You're making connections where they don't exist m8.

Every time you can't pinpoint where something derrives from, you just toss out, "generic." Yet, there are clear influences to her design. Ninja catgirl for one, but more than that, she's playing on the lore of a two tailed cat. Her name is also a pun, like most character's names. They're all puns or references. Likewise, how many catgirls have that hairstyle?

Pretty much a kamen rider tribute character. but I'm surprised you didn't pick up the TTGL influence in his design. Also, his name is a reference to a Black Sabbath song.

Literally Nezha, yes. A Chinese deity. For a game set in Chinese hell, I'd say that's fairly original. It's much better than adding in Son Wukong like every other game ever has.

C'mon man, you shoulda looked up his name. Dude looks nothing like Gouken, and he's clearly influenced by and referencing the blue monk from a Journey to the West. Also, his outfit is inspired by Mongolian Wrestling attire.

Well yeah, because he's parodying pic related. He's Onigiri's rival, and like Onigiri kinda satirizes the classic shounen protag, Nihonmaru satirizes the pretty boy antihero archetype. He takes himself super seriously to the point of it being comical. Despite that, he's intentially meant to reference and parody an established archetype. Hair and everything. Still, he's got his own spin on it, with one being a demon, and two having chinese armor on.

I appreciate the feedback man, but you failed on all counts. I don't know how you can say something is not original, when you can hardly even pinpoint the influences in most cases aside from the obvious red riding hood, and kamen rider. If anything, the fact that you could not trace back the influences from the designs means the designs are successful. Nothing is ever truly "original" in the sense that it is never influence by anything. Everything, will always be derivative of something else. You show me a concept or design, and I can show you what it's inspired by. Splatoon for example, which you mentioned is taking the Squid from Mario, and personifying them as kids, in a very "Rocket Power/Nicktoons" art style. More than that, the game concept is straight up lifted from a Microsoft arcade game from half a decade earlier. That's not to say Splatoon is bad, but again, everything is always influence by something else because humans don't exist in a vacuum.

As far as my designs go, yeah, there are obvious references everywhere, but out of these 8, at least half are very original and unique in their own right. No characters really exist that are quite like Nin-Nin and Onigiri. And I challenge you to find anyone who's entirely like them. Archetypes, sure, they fit into archetypes. But that's not what you were arguing.

Also, Nin-Nin's pants are nothing like Juri's. They're actually quite common bottoms for Ninjas/Shinobi. The Naruga armor in Monster Hunter has those pants, and if you remember Beat Blades Haruka from back in the day, a girl there also has a similar pair of pants, just to name a couple of examples.

No, you missed the point. The point is that you merely made redraws of these archetypes and pallet swapped them until you felt you had something original.

And your defense is basically "He's drawn like that because he's X." It's like you didn't even read what I wrote

It's not in depth enough dude. I feel like I wasted my time typing all that up.

Your shit doesn't stand out from what it's pulled from. This is the problem. You asked for crits and you got them.

Your art looks good, your concept is generic. Work on it or suffer poor reception and sales.

Making a fighting game with 40+ characters from scratch is a suicidal amount of work. I'm not sure you realize how much artwork that requires, even if you stagger it and have a team behind you're planning to work on the game only for 10~15 years. I like your art, but illustration and animation are two almost entirely different beasts and the mountain of animation work to do might very well crush you like a bug. Unless you're doing 3D, but that's still a load of work and might just not look very good.

M8, I asked for crits, and I'm open to crit, I actually quite like when people pick apart my work. But your crit wasn't very good. Saying, "this is gay, therefore it's bad" or tossing out the word generic here and there doesn't stand in for good critique.

Again, you argue they aren't original, but to that I ask, which ones, how so, and what are they derivative of?

Considering you failed to pinpoint the inspiration in design to pretty much all of them, I don't think you're doing a very good job. I could list all the reference I used in design, for example, I could tell you that Rosenrot's dress is inspired by the attire from the lead singer of Babymetal. But then, I'd be doing your job for you.

As far as the game goes, my approach to it would be the following:

Game is f2p, base roster starts with 8 characters (those 8 you see right there), from there it's additive with new modes of play being added for free, but characters and cosmetics, and etc, being paid DLC. There's also a gatcha, which COULD get you a free character pass, but I have a whole model laid out for how the gatcha and in game currency would work, and that's paragraphs in an of itself.

Also, no game balance is not affect by the f2p model.

Also, it would be 3D, yeah, I've got tons of character costumes planned out, one, cause I need them for mirror matches in the manga, but also because they're a great way to incentivize additional purchases on the f2p model.

That said, the game would start development after the manga has kicked off and gained success. I'm starting with the manga first, and building the brand there. A manga about eSports could have explosive success, and I've seen lots of demand for something along those lines. So it's the YuGiOh model in a way, create a manga about a game, and once the manga gains success, people will wanna play the game of the manga. Manga properly launches this Summer at the latest (assuming we don't win Shounen Jump, otherwise it starts much earlier - around Spring I reckon, and releases at a much quicker pace).

Everything is a derivated work, everything is kind of generic. As long as it has appeal, it could be the same rehash over and over, and people will buy it.

but what makes them buy this over a different rehash?
of course if the gameplay is actually better OR it gets decent quality on a low budget it might not be an issue
personally I like the pun with onigiri, I love superhero names like that too but most of his critique is legitimate

Wow nice fucking overwatch clone :^) :^) :^), you fucking dork now with grapplers because all I play is fucking gay ass fucking characters that shoot fireballs like a gay retard faggot edition.
I would read the manga but I have to use a gay online reader, why couldn't you just give a simple pdf to jack off to because i hate everything about online readers, fucking retard nigger. Neat art, but everyone knows a good fighting game has set pieces and animated characters, all I see is a white background and no animations, lmao lmao lmao lmao haha nice meme. No game, no game there's no gameplay once again, you fucked up big time, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, no fuck you eat ass. No animations and you tricked everyone into NO gameplay. Stop with this advertising thread, go home. I bet your ass you won't flip a demo on 2/2, 5/5 or 8/8, not even 11/11, you're better off shilling this meme onto /a/ and sticking with the manga you fuckin weeb.

thank you very much for reading this, arigato domo

imo onigiri (鬼切り?) is cheesy as fuck but it's so stupid that it works somehow.
also you can point at a gigantic amount of popular characters and complain that they are derivative of this or that. It's not that the other guy doesn't have a point but he's doing a pretty poor job of explaining it. Like, Onigiri looks cool, tiger-oni is a neat concept, and all the guy can come up with "it looks like some manga character but i don't know what and his name is gay"

It'd be f2p. This is also why I'm going for creating a recognizable brand through a manga IP, and then making a game after that kicks off.

Published by Shounen Jump or not, I'm fully confident a manga about eSports could be really popular. That, in and of itself is super unique. How many anime/manga exist on that subject matter? How many have done it well. Off the top of my head, Hit Score Girl, Fighting Gamers, King's Avatar, and… that's pretty much it. Of which, King's Avatar is the most popular, and isn't very good. The other two fail to leave an impression due to the execution.

And there still, no one has done a series on this subject matter, what an original game is designed for the sake of the manga. A game with a unique and interesting cast of characters (derivative or not), lore, theme, and aesthetic, and an entire document of game mechanics, that works as the ruleset for the battles. Most just use a generic throwaway fantasy game. And even King's Avatar, which did make its own game, also went for the generic fantasy stuff. Hell, even the Isekai anime/manga, also go for the classic fantasy MMO stuff. In contrast to that, something like Tiger Square, with a strong nostaligic Wuxia aesthetic, and enough story for it to have its own shounen series, really stands out among the competition. Especially since there will be a spinoff series about the vidya characters as well, so that people can get connected to them outside of being "toolsets."

A massive endeavor, sure. But I can do it. And I know it can really explode in popularity. You got what was it? 40 million people who tuned into the LoL finals? And how many of those people would be interested in a manga about this? I know many people in the FGC would push it, I've talked about it here and there in some places, and people have been excited, and I'm friends with people like M2K who'd give it a push if I asked, and I know many anime fans have wanted a manga about this subject matter. So in terms of potential marketing appeal, it's insane.

And if we get in Jump, holy shit.

So, it's execute that first. The game comes next. The manga alone could have insane amounts of appeal, I'm very confident of that. I still wanna make a game, that's why I'm designing the game with that in mind. I have a 50+ page document that grows longer each day detailing various mechanics, character movesets, etc…

It's Giri, like this:
義理
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giri_(Japanese)

But yeah, it's a stupid pun, but it really works, and I love it. Also, he's got a "transformation of sorts which is the one in the eSports one shot. For now, we're calling it "Savage Fiend Oni" but we'll see.

The pun was intentional though, because both one shots were submitted to Shounen Jump's contest, and we wanted to show the editors we know Japanese, and can make Japanese puns. Plus, they love their silly puns over there, so it might get a kick from some people. Especially since the video game world stuff is very tongue in cheek and lighthearted. In the one shot, Nin-Nin points out how silly Onigiri's name is, and mocks him for it.

DO NOT REPLY TO THIS MAN

YOU FOOL!

I do like the Onyudo guy.

I'd have cared but since you use the spyware that is discord, I hope your shitty idea tanks.

If this somehow gets made, it will be the new Paladins.
Can we shitpost in it?

What's Paladins?

I only have my own personal discord account, but now that you mention it, I really SHOULD make a server for Tiger Square, good idea.

inb4 spider turns it into a steam friends thread

What does it do to spy on me?
Not trying to be a smartass, I think you're probably right that Discord spies on their users. I just want to know what it does, specifically.

how about you look it up yourself?

I tried to, couldn't find anything conclusive, or even really relevant to what I'm looking for here.

not only are you retarded, you are a newfaggot as well. go back to cuckchan

just proved everything I could have said

How the fuck did you get my IP? I guess you used the same VPN as mine.

was for

So when you say rushdown, do you mean an actual rushdown character or are you using the casual term for a pixie?
Rushdown is about forcing your opponent back and locking them in the corner. Rush + Lockdown.
If it's just a fast character that's good at mixing the opponent up, that's a pixie.

I thoroughly approve.
Will it be 2D sprites or 3D models?

I remember you. Did you take my advice that the elf samurai needed to be simplified? That said, if not Baiken and cat ninja play like shit I'll probably skip on the game.

I'm plenty of creative, thank you.

But it's peopel like you who constatnly jsut look a how something is similar. "Oh look, that character has a sword hat looks like one I've seen before. GENERIC!"

Fuck you. The word generic is overused and poinless. If you think something inst borrowing elements from something else, then you just didn't look hard enough.

Let's take an example from what you said:
- catgirls are generic
Alice + little red + insane + gothic. 4 different things mixed together. You call i generic.
Traditional chinese oufit = generic

No to say hat some don' look similar to something that already exist (like the big blue guy), but that's simply because you cannot avoid it without creating poinltess trash. Which is also generic in it's own way.

Oh I remember you. I was one of the people trying to discourage you from making a fighting game because they're hard to make and don't sell well. It looks like you were way more committed than I thought.

I still think making a fighting game is a bad idea, but good luck.

I don't give a fuck about anything else you're doing. I hope your hypothetical game tanks like crazy just for this.

First and foremost, all women must be gorgeous. Get hid of the four armed one (if that is a woman at all).
Don't design anything that would diverge from what GAMERS (straight white or japanese men) like.
The Angel one (final boss?) is amazing. You could make the whole plot revolve around it.
As for those that are homages to culture and or/pop culture (such as the Kamen Rider-like), make sure that they get as much homages in their moves and actions as well as innovate the concept without diverging from the basis. The best thing for a fan of those is to see a new creation that homages the officials but could be an official one itself.
Keep the good job on the designs, getting hid of anything that is not beautiful and/or stylish, and you will have a great product.

I want to fuck Nin-Nin

Best way I can describe it is by comparisons. She's similar to Chun-Li, Cammy, Noel, and Chip in terms of how she'd play overall. She's a combo fiend, but relatively light on the damage. But she's good evasive and pressure options. Also, one of her supers lets her create a ninja clone of herself, in which she essentially plays like a Duo character doubling her attack output. The clone stays alive based on how much damage it takes, and with it out, Nin-Nin gains some new options, like a guard cancel where she can swap herself out with the shadow clone, leaving her opponent open to attack.

Definitely 3D models. It's the only way we could add worhtwhile cosmetics like alternate costumes (these are still prototype btw).

Orc, Elf, and notVanHelsing have been scrapped.

The latter two where taken apart to help create Nihonmaru and pic related.

I just didn't feel those two fit the overall aesthetic of the game, despite the elf being a cool design, so I cut them. And I know that sounds weird in a roster that has a Kamen Rider Tribute, and Little Red, but there's a method to my madness I guess. I just go by what feels right overall.

Also, yeah, I have a bad habit of overdesigning when I create characters, but when making the manga, I'm forced to go back, and simplify the designs some more so it's feasable to draw them many times. This was Neon Knight design prior to being in the one shot. You can see how much sleeker the design got after I cut down on the excessive detail.

Thanks a bunch dude, cheers!

Also, the angel is still in being worked on, but no, she's not a boss. There are several story-based boss characters, with the main 4 being loosely based off the 4 horsemen.

Read the one shot I posted, pic related.

care to explain who his this jewcord fag?

Wheeler should have red Executioner alternate

Is Neon Knight a robot or a guy in a suit?

What is Alice suppose to be anyway? Is she a Pirate captain with a ship's wheel or is she derived from pic related?

There's room for more costumes, yeah. This first batch, I'm doing 3 per character for the base 8 to get the ball rolling, but the idea is to keep adding more and more.

Guy in a suit. Like the Tokusatusu heroes.

If you're referring to her first alternate outfit, that's an SS-inspired uniform. lol.

What she is: she's a witch who uses blood magic, inspired by the tale of Little Red Riding Hood. The Katawaguruma is how she got cursed and wound up in hell, and why she lugs around a torture wheel, you're correct on that.

Nice to see you too, SA.

OP the art looks pretty alright especially the designs for Rika and Okira so I hope you're legit rather than X autist who spergs out and runs to reddit or Y autist who constantly his shills his fetish game with little to no substance apart from 'muh erection'. You must understand the concern right?

Are you the main artist or is it the other guy? Those character designs look pretty professional, especially compares to the stuff that usually is posted here. Good luck on your project.

nah shes based off that soul calibur 4 character who uses the wheel weapon.

Thanks, and yeah I get the concern, but it's 100% legit. We even entered a Shounen Jump contest, this one to be exact:

medibang.com/contest/jumpuniversal/

I do feel we have a decent shot at winning, and the winner gets serialized. So I'm 100% ready to have a weekly series in terms of mental preparation and output. That said, who wins is ultimately up to Kishimoto, so with that in mind, even if we lose, we're still pushing on and launching the series this Summer, probably with Medibang's partnership program, as they pay a commision per page. Once we've got a good chunk of chapters out (around 14 as that will conclude the first tournament - which should be enough for a major hook), we'll start shilling it among anime and vidya communities.

I'm also learning Moonspeak to be able to viral it among Japanase communities like 2ch, especially since Medibang will translate your stuff into Japanese, and help distribute your stuff in Japan. Currently at around N4 level with 1000+ vocab under my belt.

Also, yeah, I'm the lead artist, my friend is the writer. I've been formally learning art for about… 4 years now. 1.5 years in art school, and 2+ years of self learning. My goal is to be make a name through comics/manga. And I feel like a manga about eSports could have some serious legs if executed and marketed properly. That's why I was so hush-hush about it last time I posted here.

If you mean Tira, she first appeared in Soul Cal 3, not 4, and she uses s hoola-hoop, not a torture wheel. A better comparison would be Bloodborne like someone else picked up. Though even then, her moves would also be different, as she can "yo-yo" it thanks to that chain.

I'm the user that talked about the need to beauty.
The most important thing: analyze the game frame by frame, when creating the moves. It will be tedious and time consuming but will assure the overall quality.Compare it to previous moves already made, by playing one against the other. Don't let something in just because it is cool. Follow the example of Ark System Works by reprogramming all frames until the fighting is satisfactory. Whatever you do, don't follow the steps of western developers such as Netherrealm Studios or Rare (Killer Instinct). They work by putting "cool" looking before fun when dealing with character's moves. Never do that in a fighting game.
As for any more suggestions, a personal one for me is when the protagonist has a transformation/power up. Either as a move (Sol from Guilty Gear) or as separate character (Evil Ryu, Rickey from Critical Blow, Burning Batsu from Rival Schools 2, etc). I always like to discover that the main character will awake a new power and transform/upgrade in one important fight in the plot, and see that transformation become a part of the game itself. Maybe the 4 horsemen could be the 4 main characters and you put their "horsemen form" as separate characters or as transformation moves.

You'll like Onigiri then. Though his transformation is more like Sol>HOS or Ryu>Evil Ryu, in that his transformation is a separate character withing the game, with a completely different moveset and fighting style.

I do play around with fighting game tropes a bit with the roster. There's also a "Mecha Version" of an existing character in the works. With Mecha Trooper being a Robot copy of Trooper.

Also yeah, ASW games (primary Guilty Gear and Blazblue), are a main source of inspiration behind the design of the game. ASW is one of my fave developers in the industry, and I'm a huge fan of Daisuke Ishiwatari and his work.

Are you Korean?

You seem to have accidentally made a Necron warrior.

That's why it's in the works, and not part of the first, nor even the 2nd batches.

Spanish

What point is the game in development? I ask because it seems like this post is more about the manga and therefore possibly out of place. That's based on my assumption that if there was something to show for the game you would be showing it.

I don't have strong feelings towards the characters.I looked at a little bit of the manga and the only thing that was interesting is that they're literally playing fighting games. Even then it wasn't executed in an interesting way.

Is there anything about the fighting game that would make me want to play it over any other fighting game mechanically? Especially with a multiplayer oriented game in a relatively small niche like fighting it seems like smaller developers struggle and nothing about this project is particularly grabbing me. That and as I said it seems like it's too early in your development to really be talking about the game.

That's just my two cents though. Even if it's just those eight characters you've shown, and not the 40+ you mention, I think it's going to be extremely difficult for you to make something that can compete with other titles.

I hate to be so negative, but it really looks like one of those projects that people get really excited about before they start and then falls of the face of the earth before too long. I'd love to see you prove me wrong, but as I said as is it doesn't like particularly interesting to me personally.

The Oni form is looking good. I always like japanese iconography incorporated into other settings such as futuristic or modern.
I can tell that you get inspiration from Daisuke.
Maybe we will hear some compositions inspired by the tracks of Guilty or BlazBlue someday?
If you care about the plot, you can incorporate small links to Onis and the Biblical Apokalypse, maybe?
As for the Necron look-alike, as the above user mentioned, if it is already looking good, you cold make it a direct homage to Warhammer 40k and the Necrons. Maybe making the Trooper as an Imperial Guard of some sort. Just don't forget to innovate with the basis, so they won't just become copies of already existing characters.
As for the Kamen Rider, another thing that i remember is that they have small homages in games, but almost none for the bikes. It would diferenciate greatly if you put ways to have a Kamen Rider bike to be a part of the character moveset. Look for SNK's Gowcaizer (character: Brider) or ASW's Hokuto no Ken for PS2 (character: Mamiya) as well as Ghost Rider in Marvel vs Capcom 3 to get a feel of what can be done with a character riding a bike in a 2D or 2.5D fighting game.

Inshallah my Iberian comrade

I'd so much fucking buy your game and main those two lolis user, just don't make the gameplay too anime if you know what i mean

Those are called Air Dashers.

archive.is/O9lR7

What's your opinion on the basques, famigo?

All of my YES

make the cat girl furrier, at least polt tier

I don't mind the Basque, they're alright. I dated a qt Basque girl for a while. Catalans on the other hand….

?

Well, I wouldn't exactly call those two loli's persay. Fenfang is in her late teens, and Nezha… well, look up the name on Google.

There are a couple loli-esque characters planned though, like Onigiri's imoutos as a duo character.

As for what the game would be like… best example I can kinda draw up would be say Blazblue crossed with Smash Melee. But even then, that's not quite accurate as there are plenty of mechanics in TS that are unique to it alone. Stuff that's never been done in fighting games before.

Hmmm, well Neon Knight already has the Time Stop gimmick going for him, and he is meant to be a glass cannon character. So it'd be hard to incorporate a motorcycle as part of his moveset, at least properly. I guess there might be an option to make it a potential special attack down the line, depending on how I implement it. Special movesets are customizeable in this game, so a NK build that's focused less on the glass canon time stop element, and more on whatever the bike could offer could be interesting. I'll keep that in mind. Thanks user.

As for story. There is a story, persay, but my m8 is the one on top of that. Plus, the story is mostly told through the spinoff manga. I'm unsure of what sort of story the game would tell, and how it'd be told.

Well, I encourage you to give the manga pilot a proper read through. The best and more unique parts happen toward the end. And many people really liked it.

That said, that pilot was made to win a manga competition, and show the potential this kinda story could have, as well as showcase our ability to execute a self-contained story within 54 pages. It's made to win the contest above all else, and generate some hype among eSports fans.

You won't really see what the ACTUAL manga would be like until you read the first actual chapter. As the strength of TS lies in the character interactions, and the actual manga follows a totally different and more likeable cast than what you see in the pilot. You get a taste for what we can do with character banter in the Nin-Nin one shot.

Anyway, as for the game itself, my approach is the following:

Build the brand first, create the game once the brand is popular. Thus, the manga comes first. I'm designing the game for the manga with the goal of creating an actual game down the line, but for now, the game IS made for the manga. It's the power system for the battles, and what makes the TS manga stand out among all (few) competitors. A tremendous amount of work, yes, especially since it'll also have a spinoff manga, but it's doable, and totally worthwhile.

On concept alone, a manga about eSports can become ridiculously popular, and there's been a lot of demand in the west. Not only that, but the potential in what you can do with this sort of concept as far as storytelling goes, opens a lot of unique doors to explore stuff that's both familiar and unique in its own right. Hence the demand. And more than that, it offers me an opportunity to push my creative muscles, and design that dream fighting game I've been itching to make for well over a decade.

Thus, my roadmap is like this:

Jump or not, manga releases the first half of this year. From there on it's push it hard till it really starts to catch on, and from there, explore my options as for how to go about and make the game. Whether it's through some contract with an established developer, funding it myself through the revenue from the manga, or pushing the brand recognition to fund a kickstarter (which would require a prototype be made anyway). But that's a couple years down the line anyway. Step one is the manga, and I'm already working on the names for the first 14 chapters of the manga to have that ready to go by the time the contest results roll along. Thus, as of right now, the "development" of the game is purely in the design phase, with a detailed document that I'm continuously polishing. I know a good chunk of game design can happen during the development process, but I'm drawing up the document with that in mind. Creating a clear vision and goal for what the game should be, while leaving flexibility where there needs to be.

As for the mechanics of the game itself. Well, like I said, the doc is dense and detailed. And I could go on about it for ages. But in short, TS can be seen as a traditional fighting game, that learns lessons from Smash. It's not a platform fighter, no, but it does look at what Smash did right, and incorporates that into its design philosophy. It's a game with high degrees of accesibility and appeal, but built with a competitive edge in mind. Beyond that however, it also explores various mechanics and concepts that haven't been done in the genre before. But outside of customize able character builds which I already mentioned, there's little I'm willing to go into too much detail about. The manga will explain some of those concepts over the course of its run.

Nah, she used to be more furry before, and I didn't like it. So I made her more catgirl. I think she's perfect now.

Can't wait for the lewds to be made when this gets famous,especially for the chinese loli

I archived this thread, what don't you understand?
Also, do you have any music yet?

trying to read you manga; the online reader is fucking shit
doesn't let me fucking zoom in on that shit so my options are to either squint like a gook or use the vertical display (match width) option which does zoom in but does it fucking excessively that I'm only able to read one panel

Someone over on 4chan's /ic/ already made some lewds or Rika upon some user's request.

Ahh cool, thanks!

Also, no music yet, but I can give you samples of music that I more or less see inspiring character themes that I used while drawing…

For Nin-Nin:
youtube.com/watch?v=teMdjJ3w9iM

For Onigiri:
youtube.com/watch?v=co-I0LDtFWk

For Neon Knight:
youtube.com/watch?v=72DI5E1Q0Ow

youtube.com/watch?v=YF3jeAPGhrY

For Trooper:
youtube.com/watch?v=ZkW-K5RQdzo

For Rosenrot:
youtube.com/watch?v=xOz-T3NPtLA

For the mecha angel:
youtube.com/watch?v=nM__lPTWThU

youtube.com/watch?v=L0FSMyFs6-U

For Nihonmaru:
youtube.com/watch?v=ybyU0pdIu4Y

youtube.com/watch?v=sGEVgU3hmC8

That Charlie Parra guy btw would probably be my first pick for who I'd commission to do the music for this, as well, tbh.

Yeah, Medibang kinda sucks as a reader. I can't do anything about that though as I basically can't touch the manga till the contest results.

To be perfectly honest shounen tournament stories aren't really something I care for either way. I think there's definitely room to do interesting things with Esports in fiction. Reading your manga though it gets so bogged down with the tropes and trappings of shounen that it feels like a generic story that has Esports as a gimmick. Like you could replace Esports with wizards or scifi tech that's controlling the characters and it wouldn't really change. I would find it infinitely more interesting if it mirrored real world esports instead of being a fighting manga except with fighting games instead of karate. I've followed several game's competitive scenes and it doesn't really resemble the manga whatsoever.

So, you haven't started coding, modeling, or anything yet? This is just an idea for a game? Now I'm not a professional by any means, but the way I see it there is such a thing as trying to build "hype" too early. Solo I don't think one person can code what your pitching without taking a hell of a long time like over three years at least. If your waiting a couple years for a kickstarter to hire a team then doing what your pitching right is going to probably put that at least three or four years out. That's assuming everything goes smoothly which I can almost guarantee it won't.

Basically either you should be on a different board pimping your manga or your wasting everyone's time on a game that not only has no guarantee of existing but by the time you have anything to show from development everyone will have forgotten all your hype and the idea will no longer be fresh or interesting. I get the distinct feeling that your putting the horse ahead of the carriage as they say. Even if this is all about branding better to hold off on talk of an actual game until you have anything concrete to show.

Whether or not you can actually do it your basically just an idea guy at this point.

Are you prepared to get bent over a barrel by the Jump™ editors, if you win?

Well, consider the target audience, and what contest it was made for. Ofc it's not gonna resemble real life, nor would that be too interesting. Fighting Gamers already exists as an accurate depiction of what eSports/FGC is actually like, and it's got very niche appeal as it only appeals to that specific crowd. Tiger Square is going for a more broad appeal with an exaggeration of what the scene is like. In the same way Slam Dunk was a bit ridiculous at times, but because of that managed to make basketball super popular in Japan, Tiger Square is going for a similar appeal. If anything, as a manga, it'd be closest to Slam Dunk in overall feel. A sports manga, with battle manga fights, and an eSports setting. Is it classic shounen? Yes. But it's meant to be classic shounen, it's meant to shoot for the mainstream.

Am I an idea guy? I guess. But there's a difference between an idea guy who just tosses out ideas, and one who works on them to create something. The approach here is intentional, if you make a game, it's gonna get left off the wayside and forgotten if it has no brand recognition, ESPECIALLY a fighting game, which depends on a community to stay afloat, and is constantly competing with other more recognizable titans for a playerbase.

If anything, because of the brand appeal I'm aiming to create, Tiger Square seeks to bring NEW players into fighting games, by making them more interested in them, than they would have otherwise been. That's why the brand comes first. From there, I'd have the resources and opportunity to create as many games as I like. Because a brand is much more important than any "idea game" anyone could possibly have.

That's not putting the horse before the cart, that's playing it smart. I'm working within my means and what I can do to build a name, rather than overextending myself in creating something that would otherwise have a much higher chance of failure.

Consider the following:

How many Dragonball games have been made?

How many One Piece ones?

How many Naruto ones?

etc….

Merchandising is a HUGE part of the anime/manga industry, and you're telling me that if successful, developers wouldn't be interested in making a fighting game, out of a fighting game, in a popular manga about said fighting game? Especially one that's already been designed?

I know that's a pipe dream, and in many ways it is, but I know I've got what it takes to make something popular. I just gotta play it smart, one step at a time.

As for this thread, hey man, I only made this follow up thread as a thanks to the people who gave me some input last time I posted, before I revealed it was for a manga. If people are genuinely bothered by this being here, you're more than welcome to delete or move it. I'm genuinely not trying to shill anything or generate hype, it's just a casual and friendly convo among what I found to be a welcoming community. I mean, lets be real, you guys are cool and all, but this is not exactly the best place to viral market something. Half-chan's Holla Forums gets like 10x the traffic. If I was trying to shill, I'd go there and to Reddit first.

If you mean workload, yes. I made the Nin-Nin one shot in roughly 3 weeks with no assistants. That's 27 pages in sub 21 days, by myself. I'm sure I can get even faster if I really push it, and with assistant help, 17 pages in a week, hell, even 5 days, is totally doable if I focus.

If you mean interference with the story. We have some room for flexibility, but that's a very back and forth relationship anyway. I read Bakuman if that's worth anything.

More like having your shit nitpicked six ways from Sunday.

Well, I guess all those popular shounen you list are fairly bad yet hugely successful so you have me there.

I have no idea what your doing really if your not trying to market it. I don't know what else to call building a brand, but I don't really take much issue with that either.

It just struck me as disingenuous to say your "working" on a fighting game with what you've said thus far. Trying to build a brand at this point in the cycle of your series seems to be either hugely arrogant or just extremely naive.

I really just wanted to point out to onlookers that at this stage realistically it's a bad bet to try and invest themselves in "game" at this point. The manga maybe, but you have next to nothing to even critique let alone show.

Oh, well I'd agree with you in that people shouldn't get invested in a game. Like an actual playable game. That's quite a way off, and there are many obstacles along the way. Nothing saying I can't fail, because I very well can, despite my enthusiasm and excitement. But given the reception I've gotten on things from people, I feel encouraged in many ways. I do feel I'm taking the right steps in creating an appealing and successful manga, and that's step 1. People like the characters designs, the concept is unique enough, and our execution will be on point. That much I can have faith in.

I am working on a game, designing one, yeah. But not developing one, no. It's a game FOR a manga as of now.

And again, this thread was more of a "hey, you guys remember me from that thread like 6 months ago, well it was for a manga that I now entered into a Shounen Jump competition, and I'd like to share it with all of you as a thanks."

That's pretty much it. I always get carried away in talking too much about the idea, and perhaps I've said more than I should have ITT, but at the same time 8ch is niche enough that I'm not worried.

I would not have made the same thread on 4chan's Holla Forums, in fact, as of now, I haven't, because it's not time for marketing yet. This was more like me giving all of you a bit of a sneak preview in goodwill really.

WE'VE BEEN HAD

How many muscle girls will it have?

This is the most important question. I can forgive the just-above-blazblue-in-originality character designs if you appeal to this niche. I do like your art but damn that is some shonenshit in design.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say this is gonna end up being the best thing to come out of Holla Forums in a while.

pics or it didn't happen

One think that I can't understand is why you can have literally dozens of muscular guys in fighting games, but not even a fit girl? A muscular one is even harder! Hope you can fix that!

Found it! Took me a while. Enjoy.

Dunno, there was one who was a "beastmaster" of sorts, but I scrapped her cause she didn't fit the aesthetic.

I mean, there's definitely room for one, it's just a matter of what I can think of that's interesting not just in aesthetic and theme, but also gameplay-wise.

What happens if the brand is a colossal failure? What will happen to the game?

Also, how far will you go with "references?" "Neon knight" and monk sand seem a tad bit gaudy. Yeah, it's hard to make good characters, but I like them so far. I just get the feeling that some of them are trying to be too unique.

this looks like some Overwatch reddit-tier shit kek do you go on Holla Forums by any chance?

...

I hate that trope.

Well, I guess you'd have to wonder how it could be a collosal failure first. I guess that could only happen in a case where it's:

We get in Jump, we get serialized, we push out the chapters, and it just bombs in the rankings. It then gets cancelled around 20 chapters in.

In such a case, I'd see what I can do to get the rights to the series back, and then we push it ourselves.

It's actually because of that that I'm a bit hesitant about Jump in the first place, and might actually opt for a less competitive magazine like WSM by Kodansha.

That said, Jump wouldn't serialize it proper unless the one shot did well in the rankings. Which I think could give us a good measurement of Japanese reception before going forward. Especially since the first chapter is like way better than the pilot. But it depends.

But yeah, and such a case, and if I can't get the rights back, then it's all fucked, and I'd move to the next manga project we got planned. Granted Tiger Square is the one we got with the most mainstream commercial potential, but well, you gotta roll with the punches. Going with Jump is high risk high rewards, and that's if they even want us. There's a lot of hurdles to overcome even if we win the contest. No westerner has ever gotten in Jump, so that's a major hurdle right there.

So that would be the worst possible case, outside of that, I see it hard for it to flop. At the very least it can be sustainable, and from there it's a slow growth. My current level is at a point where I could get a progressional job making comics/manga. Not only am I skilled, but more importantly faster than all my peers in the west. For example, Walking Dead, is one 20 page issue a month, and it's three dudes working on the art. I can do 27 pages, in less than 3 weeks, by myself, with more complex panneling (I'll leave the art judgement to others). Not only that, but my style has a lot of appeal. People really like it. And not only that, but I can only improve from where I am, and plan to as I'm still working hard to get better and better. The more I do this, the better I get at it. Combine that with my friend's writing which is award winning, and you've got a rare combination of exceptional talent, which I believe puts us way ahead of most of the competition in western webcomics/manga. I'd say that should be enough for at least sustainable income. In which case, we push on through with the manga till the end, all the while doing short side projects to get attention, until something sticks. If we finish TS, and it's still not popular, we simply move onto our next project, and keep going till eventually we make a name for ourselves. The game gets made when I have the funds for it. Even if TS isn't super huge.

That's how I see it at least.

It's this path forward, or nothing else. I'm gonna keep pushing on with this till I get a breakthrough, or I die of old age.

Also, my last comic was fairly popular. I'm the guy that made that Trump manga that went viral about a year ago. So I'm confident I can really make it big if I keep trying.

I'm a massive Holla Forumstard. I'm probably the furthest thing possible from Holla Forums you could possibly imagine. I've also always been way more /a/ than Holla Forums.

I'll let it slide them. They're honestly pretty neat. I like the robot the way he kinda looks like those Japanese Power Rangers in style, not the slightest bit of edge to him. That weird furry thing triggers me though. Also
At least the second could serve as a reddit filter

The one that reminded me of Overwatch was the angel chick, though I don't know Overwatch characters well

First picture is shit cause it's the old designs. Lol. All of them got redesigned. 2nd picture is the more accurate, current, and probably final designs.

t. 56%

Same user here.
Nice mechanic of having the option to change the way that a character plays. I would add just that it would be better to have some basic moves that aren't interchangeable between characters (if they are at all), to keep each one unique. As an example: the time stop should be allowed only for this character, and no one else.
As for the songs, the feeling of most are spot on. If the end product contains this style, it would already be great. Keep in mind that those songs fit better in fast paced "anime style" fighting games, as you already know from Gilty and Blaz, so it would be good to have the gameplay match those fast paced songs.
I wold also suggest that you ignore the furry requests and muscular gilr requests. Furries, for obvious reasons (their community), and musclar girls because that is just fags that like tranny abominations wanting non feminine girls. Don't ruin the visuals of your game by putting non-feminine and non-gorgeous girls in it.
Bt i'm all for at least one loli playable character. Lolis are welcomed by all who trully play and enjoy japanese games.

It's actually KrautChan.

I guess I could talk a bit about the the custom specials/controls, especially since that will be covered very early in the manga.

Basically, pic related is the controls in the game.

It's an 8 button fighter. Top row is your attacks, bottom row is everything else. As you can see, there are dedicated Jump and Guard buttons. This is intentionally different, because it allows movement to be much more intuitive in Tiger Square than it is in other fighters. Likewise, movement would be analog (though it is digital friendly), meaning, you have a higher finesse in how you can control your character overall if you are playing analog.

Anyway, lets focus on the specials. Top row, you see you have 4 attack buttons. 3 neutrals, Light, Med, Heavy, and a dedicated specials button. You can compare this to Blazblue's Drives in a way, as the function is basically the same. It's not as simple as it is in Smash where Specials have a sort of template, but more on that in a bit. The Neutrals for a character cannot be changed, and here they follow a template that's essentially the same for all characters. Neutral, Forward, Up, or Down + L/M/H. You also have 6 aerial attacks, one for each button, plus one for each button + a direction. Also, the function for what the different normals do are more or less the same across the board. Every character has a launcher which is up heavy, every character has a guard break which is neutral heavy, every character has an anti-air, or a low sweep, etc… etc…

Now for the specials:

So the list of specials a character can have is essentially indefinite, especially as more and more are added to the game as time goes on. However, a character can only "equip" 4 special attacks. You have to select these when you select your character. Now you can ignore that, in which case, they go for their default build, or you can create a preset in a different menu, so you don't waste time choosing your build before each match.

Now specials are balanced by inputs. So typically, the more powerful or useful a special move, the more complex the input. So you do have QCF, inputs, Full Circles, Charge Inputs, etc… It really depends on that moves function, and how it should be balanced.

The philosophy behind this is very simple.

Inputs aren't the hardest part about fighting games for beginners, it's memorizing movelists. If you have a character limited to just 4 special moves, it's fairly easy to remember what your character can do, and how to do it. Not only that, but all specials are limited to just one button, so you don't have to remember whether this special was QCF+K and that one was QCF+S, etc… It's all very simple. Beyond that, it also adds a high degree of customizability. The way one player might play Nin-Nin could b very different from how someone else might play her, and this gap is further exaggerated when both those Nin-Nin's have totally different toolsets based on the specials and supers each player picked. One player might prefer a Nin-Nin who focuses on her Shadow clone gimmick, for the Duo focus, and another might prefer to play her as an evasive Hit and Run character with her other Ninja abilities. And I think that's important. You're also getting way more characters for the value of one.

So this is one of those lessons that as I said, is learning from Smash. It's done both to simplify something otherwise complex to make it more accessible for beginners, all the while adding a higher degree of strategy and depth to it. Your planning before a fight has a lot more impact in a match, than it does in other fighters.

It makes it easier for beginners to kinda get into, as the controls are rather intuitive, and the moves easy to learn, but also adds a higher skill ceiling in what's possible. Especially since the default builds can have rather simple inputs that are easy to kinda get, but as more moves come out, much more unique attacks with more complex inputs can be added. And that's just with the specials, there's a lot more going into the mechanics of the game, and etc…

Oh yeah, I forgot to add. The reason why I believe customizabillity is important, is because it creates personal attachment. I allows players the ability to forge an identity out of HOW they chose to play. And I think that's something really valuable. The game designer for MtG actually talked about that in a GDC panel, and I fully agree. It's that slight bit of personal investment that motivates players to try things out a little more, because you give people a bit more room to modify things to their liking and playstyle, but to a degree where the game can still remain balanced.

Same here again.
Be careful of GDC. That is a full marxist propaganda convention. Most of their "opinions" are to derail trully talented developers into making just the same "experiences" (with no fun) again and again.
Your game must be FUN first and foremost, no matter what gameplay you implement on it.
As for the commands, i agree, BUT i also think that there is some fun to have in mastering difficult impts unique to a character. Take Geese Howard's "Raging Storm" command as an example. It is an unique command that is difficlt to imput on purpose, so a gamer must master it FIRST before he can use it in a real fight. I think that this approach is also valid, as it trully males the overall playstyle of a character trully unique.
Too much similar commands results in people simply chosing the character that have the easiest set ups or the one that they ust think that look good. By having unique commands, a character can be mastered differently from others, and it MAY drive gamers to try an otherwise ignored character.
As for cstomization, yes, it makes for a personal attachment. Just be sure to not overbalance everything. The fun part is also in having a "too good" character that can be brought down by a dedicated player with some "weak" character. If everyone is too balanced, the game stagnates and everything feels the same. Balance the frames and speed of imputs, but leave space for fun play even if it breaks the game a little.

Yeah, that's kinda the freedom of having custom specials. They can be as simple or complex as they need to be in terms of input, and how complex the input is, is one of the balancing factor for the special moves.

And you're right in that it adds much broader range of depth in terms of what's viable in the roster.

As for the balance, that's something I don't know for sure, until I actually start making the game, but that said, in my mind, and for the sake of narrative in the manga, I'm kinda picturing various builds, and seeing how they'd fare up against others. Not saying it would be accurate to the actual game, but currently I see a specific build of Neon Knight for example being top tier. One of the reason we added custom builds to the game was for the sake of narrative in the manga. Like you said, it allows for surprise builds and such to really shake up the meta, and this lets you have intrigue and dramatic tension within a story. Not only that, but narratively we can also explore thematic elements such as why players decide to main certain characters, and create the strategy and planning element prior to fights that's so common about shounen manga, all the while still keeping it within the ruleset of the game.

It was then that we knew that custom builds would be a defining aspect of TS. Because it just opens so many doors both in terms of story (in regard to the eSports manga), and gameplay. It goes beyond just learning how to play a character, but part of it, is also figuring out what sort of build your opponent has, and learning how to respond to that. Or alternatively, creating a specific build, as a hard counter to an especially tricky matchup.

And in terms of game balance, I do feel that constantly adding in new moves, helps balance the game in way that, previously underpowered characters could suddenly get a new special that makes them much much viable. It could create a very dynamic environment for the meta, that keeps things interesting imo. Which again, will be one of the narrative elements explored in the manga.

It looks generic as fuck
Your idea is good but you should hire artists and invest if you want it to fly.

jump buttons suck, just have it be up like us fighter autists want.

Me again.
Everything is looking fine then, going by that mindset. Just be sure to not fall in "Blizzard's stupidity" of changing too much of a character, that you make all else useless before said character, or by making a special so powerful, that it breaks the game completely.
Also, don't listen to autists. Innovate first, being sure that it plays fun. The most detrimental thing to a game is to follow "rules" that prevent you from innovating. Create, experiment, and if it feels fun, keep it.
Also, a side note: it occurred to me that if the game is so tied to the manga, it could have a Jojo's Bizarre Adventure character or presentation, in the sense that some moves are presented as if they were comic books, with big letters writen on the screen, or literal comic book pages appearing as special effects in some moves. Not sure if you would want that, but the strong link between manga and game reminded me of that franchise.

can't wait for the up-skirts lad

Approved

After reading,
You could at least hide your references a little better. Though I'm also working on a game with some shameless references like a robot that uses glowing knives called The Sentinel or a level in the desert with the only structure being a giant stone tower with a wizard at the top so I can't really talk

I'll probably allow people to have Up for Jump if people want, but the Jump button will still be there and usable as you need it for Rushes. However, you'll have a harder time doing any up Neutral with Up for Jump, as Up literally does nothing in terms of movement. It's used solely for attack inputs. Ultimately I'd encourage people to get used to the Jump button, as too much of the game is build around that separation, but for those that wanna have the option, I don't see why it can't be a control option.

Block will stay on a dedicated button though.

It's funny you mention Jojo, as if I were to ever have a guest character, it'd most definitely be Dio. Dio vs. Neon Knight would be dope as fuck too. That's most definitely a Pipe Dream I'd say though. The odds of that are super slim, and it would only happen IF we actually got in Jump, and I got to meet Araki, and get his permission, etc… So yeah.

Also, the aesthetic for the game will be a Chinese Wuxia/80s Kung Fu film, with some slight heavy metal vibes overall. The comic-style stuff doesn't work so well, as MHA is already doing that for it's aesthetic, and it would clash int he manga. Moreover, it'd be strange if the game in the manga and the game irl both had different aesthetics to them.

I personally wanted to call him Slayer. But my friend disagreed as there's already a character in Guilty Gear called Slayer, making that exact same reference, and more than that, Doomguy is also sometimes referred to as Slayer/Demon Slayer, and Trooper heavily resembles him.

Some of the references are less obvious to non-metal fans. Like the Angel basically being an "Iron Maiden" (that's not her name), or Rosenrot's last name which literally means "Red Rose" in German, being a reference to a Rammstein song.

Speaking of, some people wanted more art. Here's her wolf form.

I guess it's true that unless you're a big fan of 80s metal you probably won't get why a match between The Trooper and Neon Knight is so funny, so go ham.
throw in some Rainbow references for me buddy

I did not express myself clearly. What i meant was some character that was an homage to JoJo.
But getting Araki on the project would be great. Slim chance, but still possible.
May you and your team achieve that.
As for the metal references, i'm all for it.
References to music reminded me of Toshinden 3. There is a character that is a homage to Michael Jackson. His secret move is made with him bending foward, Smooth Criminal Style, and throwing knives at the opponent, finishing with a stand spin and pose.
If it serves as inspiration, it would be nice to have some character homage musicians with their maneirisms/poses/atitude.
Just more personal suggestions, if you like them.

FOR JUSTICE

bumb

Why don't you ask something.

I'd like to ask how normals are supposed to work. Is the player limited to just 15 normals (crouching l/m/h, standing l/m/h, back l/m/h, forward l/m/h, jumping l/m/h) as opposed to the 30ish you'd get in a traditional fighter? Or since there's a jump button, does the player have an additional 3 for holding up? Even then, you'd have 18 normals, which is a lot less than in a normal fighter, and 4 specials would give you around 19-22 moves total. I know Smash characters only have 16 moves but in melee at least they have much more robust movement options, and they also double as combo moves so it benefits them to have a smaller moveset to work with.

INTO THE FUCKING TRASH

Here's an old NK movelist I cooked up, though several things have changed since then.

Total, it's 18 normals (there's 6 aerial attacks total), not counting Grapples, the Get-Up attack, and Specials, which would bring it up to around 27 (4 actions from grapple, the Oki, and 4 specials). Plus the Supers and Overkill, that's 2 supers, and 1 OK. For a total of 29. Some characters can have more if they have unique normals, like Diagonal Down + something, or a QC input with a normal rather than a special. Though those are rare, so I'll leave them out.

If we compare this to Ragna in BBCF:

dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=BBCF/Ragna_the_Bloodedge

He's got 17 normals, including his drive. 3 Throws, a CA and Crush Trigger (+5), 7 Special Attacks (not counting follow ups, because TS character specials may also have follow ups too as part of one special), 2 Supers, 1 Overdrive, and 1 Instakill. Totaling at
33 moves total.

Which is really just 4 moves higher than Neon Knight, and that's really mostly cause of his extra 3 specials, and his Overdrive.

Likewise, there's a variety of movement options in TS that are not possible in BB. Like Rushes, a higher degree of movement due to being able to break Focal Adherence when you Run. Backstepping being separate from Walking, the ability to roll forward and behind your opponent, and sidesteps.

Reason why they were relegated to their own buttons is mostly to give players more offensive and defensive options whenever Jumping or Blocking.

There's definitely room for that. NK can't really reference Metal bands with his manerism, as he's mostly gonna reference the Tokusatsu heroes, but I defenitely wanna add a high degree of personality to how the character move and such. It's also the reason why I'm basing off each character's moveset off of a specific martial arts (Onigiri with Tiger Style Kung Fu, Monk Sand with Mongolian Wrestling, NK with Kick Boxing - that's also why the moveset image for NK is outdated, his fighting style is gonna be a lot more "Boxing" that what it currently is).

Also, I forgot to add, my brother is taking a couple courses in C++ and Unreal Engine, and he's interested in making a prototype for TS. So that's a thing. Once I get some money gathered up, I'm gonna hire some freelance 3D modelers and animators to work on 2 characters.

The prototype will have just 2 chars, and 1 stage, but all the core mechanics + sound design, and possibly music. I think it'd be good to get that built up for the future.

That makes sense. I've always been of the opinion that if you have less moves you should make up for it with better movement, and it looks like you're doing that. I do like how you're trying to add actual changes to the traditional fighting game formula instead of a gimmick, but I wonder how you expect fight sticks to work with analog control.
Well if your game ever does get made I know who my main will be.

Same again.
That is already good. The maneirism was a suggestion in the chance that some other character would also reference music or musicians.
As for the styles, keep that the focus. It is always good to see known styles well represented with characteristic moves. Although we have games doing this already, they went more broad with what the characters fighting style was. A true representation of a style, even if not for all characters, would be a nice addition.

cool design, will love that char for a single 2d platform game as well

that bithc is a goro clone, but since goro is a ganesha clone poo in loos win again

OP better come here to show a video promo or demo links, guys here are nudevs with nothig but empty souls and brains, they are depressed but can give you a list of books to defeat depression

we are not nice people, only 1 or 2 out of 1000 maybe, and that's positive thinking tbh

keep working for a product, admiration comes later, be stronk and i can see it looks good, don't waste time with this soulless cunts

A snippet from the design doc.

Basically, the game is digital friendly, and in that sense, it works just like other fighters. Tap forward or backward once, and your character walks forward or backward, tap it twice, and they run in that direction.

If you're playing on analogue however, it's a bit different. You don't need to double tap. If you tilt the stick, based on how much you've tilted it, your character can walk at varying speeds. From very slow to inch yourself toward your opponent (or covertly do a standing charge input), to power walking. If you tap the stick to the far end though, they break into a run in that direction.

Running (away) from your opponent is the only way you can break focal adherence. As the game does have you locked to face your opponent at basically all times. So running in the opposite direction will have you temporarily break FA. (technically speaking, blocking can also break FA, if you get crossed up during a guard. As blocks only guard out in front, high or low).

So what this means is that you have a lot more fluidity in movement, and precision to your movements in analogue, as positioning is a huge factor in this game. The same holds true for Air Dashes btw. In Analogue, simply tap the stick forward or backward in midair. In Digital, it's the same as it's always been.

As a result of this, Dash Dancing is a "tech" you could say has carried over from Smash, though it doesn't exactly have all the same functionality (as Heavy attacks in TS don't work like Smash attacks). It's still used for mind games, and re-positioning, but most of all, it's used to retain your momentum, and this is important, and why I decided to go analogue.

Like Guilty Gear and Smash (Melee and Brawl), TS has angular momentum. So your jumps, and etc… are all carried over by how fast you're already moving. Unlike those games however, it also has a damage multiplier based on momentum, so your attacks and combos for example will DO more damage, if you do them while retaining momentum, than if you do them from a standstill. Now for reference, my goal as for how it FEELS to move, is more along the lines of GG or DBFZ, as opposed to Melee. So the impact of momentum isn't as insane as it is in Smash, nor does it have ridiculous knockback scaling to where you're flying all over the stage. Overall, I'd say it has a little bit more kick to it than GG, but it's not as crazy as Smash.

So, all of this does apply to when you're playing Digital as well, you just have far more control over it in Analogue. So what this means is, there are some advantages to playing on pad over stick, unless you modify your stick with an analogue stick, as most fightsticks are digital by default. Imo, the ideal way to play would be Fight Stick with an Analogue Stick.

Overall, I'd say Analogue would feel more comfortable and natural. A lot less clunky. As, though you can get used to double tapping for dashing and such, it's always something that's felt a bit clunky to me in fighting games.

Whoop. Forgot the snippet.

Yeah, I'm putting a lot of thought into the personality of the various fighting styles of the characters, though not all will have room for Chinese Kung Fu styled moves. The Angel and Nezha come to mind.

Orc girl got scrapped anyway, and her gimmick, was given to Monk Sand anyway.

Also, yeah, once a demo of sorts is done, I'll come share it. It'll be a while though.

I think Sheeva idea come from Rhina from Tattoo Assassins, who came one year before MK3. But since Rhina idea come from Goro…yeah, you get.

One thing that you might want to consider is whether you're working cross-purpose to actually making this a real game. From the perspective of what you're doing now, it makes sense to be highly autismal about everything because you need to have a good idea as to what should happen in this totally simulated environment; there aren't any real dynamics, it's all just writing, so you need to invent theoretical dynamics. But from everything I've seen in actual games, this is never the case. Someone has a simple concept (character designs, a scenario, whatever), they put together some basic mechanics which they think represents the concept well, mess around with it for a while, see problems, add or change mechanics to deal with the problems and leave the rest up to the players.
GG is a perfect example of this. The entire series is describable as Ishiwatari designing/composing a bunch of shit he thinks is cool and fun and throwing it all together. It's a total fucking mess, but just with any other series, the gameplay gets refined over many iterations when it comes to light how people really play the game and what they really want out of it. It's not determined prior to the fact.

So I feel like you can take this in two directions. You can have something which is a celebration of fighting games, has all this detail and complexity but isn't suitable to actually be a real game. Or you can have an actual fighting game and all the compromise which comes with it lest you create something horribly broken and bloated. You can't have both without making one a mere shadow of the other. Personally, I think what you're doing now is by far the smarter option.

Pretty much.

Ultimately, I can't know for sure how the game would actually be, without having something to playtest and fiddle with. 90% of game design happens in development, not prior to, like you said.

For now, what I need is a detailed rule set as a power system for the manga.

Because also, if the manga picks up in popularity, depending on how popular it gets, there's no reason a development team wouldn't be interested in working with the brand, and I've already got a detailed design doc they can use to work with.

That said, going the solo route, my brother said he's interested in making a prototype, so it will be interesting to have something I can use to play around with and feel, to get a good sense for the mechanics. Doesn't even need the actual characters, faceless polygon men will do just fine as the goal would be to get a feeling for the "gamefeel" as people say. I reckon it'd take a solid year or two for the manga to start picking up in popularity, which should be plenty of time to fiddle around with the prototype and get it right, so that something is ready to be pitched to a dev team, or if need be, demo for a Kickstarter.

Plus, another benefit of the game is that it's f2p and iterative, starting out with just 8 chars, a vs. mode, and an arcade mode, and growing from there both in roster and 1P content. So there'd be plenty of room to continuously improve and refine on it.

But yeah, I'm operating on the assumption that everything I write in the design document for the manga is flexible and subject to change in the actual game. As without being able to playtest anything, everything is pretty much theoretical and mostly probably useless within an actual game pipeline.

Bomp

It's very obvious from your colored sketches that you don't have a lot of experience in color drawings, or, if there is a lot of it, you have completely outweighed it by drawing in black and white. I assume this is because of your amerimanga. The most obvious case of this is Onigiri and Alice but for different reason. With Onigiri, the dark green does not pair well with his orange skin tone at all. if it were more pale with red streaks or perhaps just red instead of orange you would also be closer to what the original mythological concept of an Oni, but this color pair you chose is clashing as opposed to contrasting. On the other hand, your best design out of the starting 8 roster is Alice, not because you actually did a good job with the colors, you just didn't need to. Her entire palette is black, white and red so you got to avoid actively thinking about your color balances as you just went neutral, neutral and bright, and basically drew the normal Black and White you are used to and just added Red to where it would have been screentone before. Even the browns you smuggle in are heavily tinted red. This isn't necessarily bad, as again, this is your best design out of the 8 as far as appeal, it just shows why you are lacking some distinct knowledge concerning color balance while having decent skill in drawing characters otherwise.
Another character that's suffering from color but to a lesser extent is Nihonmaru. His entire palette has almost no contrast and while you obviously don't have any stages as you haven't even started making the game yet, he'd have a very hard timesticking out from the backdrop. Your attempted to contrast with his cool overall palette by giving him that god forsaken brown, which just doesn't mess well with anything else.
Neon Knight is generic Kamen Rider tribute so I'm not even going into it.
Fen-Fang Far is the best example of drawing from other's art and not reference. You wanted to cash in on the Cheongsam without understanding how a Cheongsam is originally supposed to look. You wanted to have cute Chinese unrealistic hair buns with a character surrounded by people with far more reasonable hair, and someone still managed to fuck it up by flattening them. You wanted her to have a giant fan without even understanding how a Chinese fan would look like in Wushu demonstrations let alone when they could almost be considered a minor form of self-defense. Somehow Naruto managed to do this better than you and that's pathetic. You then fucked up her hair buns with god knows what giving her the most awful hair in the entire line up with mostly reasonable hair. You added sleeves with ruffles which has never been a thing with traditional Chinese clothing and only appeared after Westernization, and even then, it's still never mixed with traditional dress. You also added a ribbon where there in no way deserved to be one with tails that would undo it in second. Mind you, this isn't necessarily bad, but it's definitely out of place. Looking at any other character in the line up does any else have as out of place hair, dress and clothing compared to the Chinese slut? What might have been a good character design does not belong with all these other characters at all. She also is similar to Alice in you took a black and white design, and just chose 1 color to replace most everything screentone with.
Nin-nin is a generic cat girl ninja with a boring color pallet. I can't critique what hasn't had thought put into. I like how you tried to be special and made her a Nekomata but that doesn't save her design.
Monk Sand is nice but you're running into pallet issues again where you choose one primary color and everything else is neutral but scarce highlight, and even then you went with not 3, not 4 but 5 difference colors to all fight for attention compared to his blue skin tone.
Nezha is alright, color pallet problems are slightly less so but she is swimming in yellow and not even a strong shade it's almost white. Her highlights with red are fine though.

For fun I took your character sheet and put it in grayscale, it reinforces my point about Alice and Fen-Fang's color cop outs. Monk Sand, Nihonmaru and especially Onigiri instantly improve as well.

Also your panel lay out on your manga is weak, good job on facial expressions though you have those down pat.

I'm not sure f2p is the best option for your game. It carries with it a certain stigma of being cheaply made, and it would overall be a better plan to sell the base game with very few characters at a very low price (think $10-20) and put out character packs of 8 or so and bump up the price of the base game $5-10 and offer it as a free update for those who already own the game. Of course, this all depends on how much money you think you'll be spending on the game, how popular you think the game will be, and how popular the manga is (if it gets serialized). Right now I think there are too many "if"s to be considering your pricing model, especially this early. You don't have a team, a budget, an early build, any idea how much content the game will actually have, etc etc etc.

Or you could take the Capcom/Arksys model. Release the first edition with 8 characters. A few months later release Turbo Edition with X new characters, free for customers with the base game or maybe they just get a cheaper upgrade depending on how much of a jew you want to be. And then Tournament Edition, Deluxe Edition, etc.

But I can echo the sentiment that a F2P game will generally turn me off immediately. Much better that you put a small price tag on it. As an example, I actually bought Fight of Gods which is $8. I think it was $5 during the release sale when I bought it. There's a price sweet spot where people will see the product as having some level of quality and worth, but not so much that they begin double-thinking their purchasing decision.

Of course, all of that's only relevant when you actually have a fucking game.

Never do this
The worst model of all.
Everybody wants a full game, with all characters in, and any new release to be another full game, years after the first.

So will this have a telekinetic grappler?

Thanks for this, but I'm not quite sure I follow all of your post. If you have something that goes into more detail in color theory for game design though, I'd appreciate it.

I get where you're coming from, but a huge part of the reason why f2p is generally looked down upon, is because in large, it's very poorly implemented, and typically beget by greed.

I get that everyone wants a full game, but it's impossible for me to deliver on that, as I don't have, and am operating under the idea that I won't have the millions of dollars budget needed to make a full fledged fighting game. Break down the costs. Well-made 3D models go for $2000 a model. And then the animation? We're talking roughly 100 animations per character. How many man hours go into that for each character? 1000? With the average rate being $30 an hour? Plus rigging, and voice work, and balancing, etc… Low-balling it, you're looking at at least $50,000 per character. And that's low. Lab Zero put the estimate for their DLC chars at $150,000 per character. Multiply that by a roster of 8 characters, and you can't make a decent game under a million, as people will also bitch that 8 chars is too low.

Thus, I have to look at what's reasonable, and doable for me to do. F2P offers me two very great advantages, with an example of this already being done to great success with LoL.

Number 1, fighting games struggle to stand out and secure strong player bases, especially new IP. Look at Skull Girls for example, which is arguably the most successful indie fighting game ever made. Where is it now? It's essentially dead. More than that, fighting games also struggle to draw in and secure crowds outside of the enthusiasts. This happens for a number of reasons, but putting a price tag on something as a barrier when you're trying to invite people to play your game is essentially ONE more obstacle toward securing a player base. And a healthy player base is the LIFEBLOOD of a fighting game. No matter how good a game is, if there aren't many people playing it, people won't bother to buy it.

So, the alternative is then, deliver a small, but high quality fighting game, that's unique, and fun, but with a limited roster and content that will grow over time. It's much easier to narrow your focus on the most essential core fundamentals and ensuring they are top notch, when you don't have to worry about all the 1P content or an expansive roster, until you've secured the most important moment to moment aspects of a game to ensure they are on point. In the alternative, you'd inevitable going to have to split your attention across many aspects of a game in order to deliver the full package everyone is expecting if you want your game to sell.

So, if you have a popular manga, and you invite people to play a FREE game based off that manga, purely on brand alone, people will at least try it. And that's your foot in the door. That's far more inviting than trying to cash in on the promise that the game will be good based on brand recognition, and having to struggle with the development hell in order to meet player expectations, and still falling short of what you ultimately want to do.

If anything, I'd say people would be more surprised that a game of such quality on a brand that they like is in fact free. That earns you goodwill, and goodwill earns you word of mouth, and that sort of marketing, is multiplicative.

Which then brings me to the 2nd benefit. Rather than needing an initial investment of millions, and then rushing out to build a team, and risking it on a game that may or may not succeed. The F2P model allows me to make the game iterative. Whatever money comes in, is then used to create more content, which can then, be sold to satisfy players and make the game even better, which then draws more people in, which then allows me to grow the team, etc… etc…

This is how you handle a business in a smart way. You don't jump in assuming it's all gonna go to plan, and try to go as big as you can. Especially with your first game. You create something small, and build it over time. F2P essentially allows you to do that. You create model in which a game continues to get support until people are tired of playing it, and with you continuously improving and adding to the game, you further extend how much enjoyment people get out of a game. F2P allows you to have a development period that can go well over a decade with constant feedback from people to continue to improve things. Alternatively, with the classic model you'd have to gamble everything on a 2 year crunch time with heavy investment, and that's it. What doesn't make it, or doesn't get added, well, tough shit.

F2P essentially allows me to make the game I want to make. With a roster of 40+ character, and all the 1P content I want, etc… etc..

Because no matter how we start, building a team WILL be necessary regardless. Delegating work toward others so things can get done as they need to be.

But at the start, it's basically gonna be just me and my brother as we build things together. One step at a time. Thus, we're gonna have to work within our means, and what we can do and paying for whatever we can't out of pocket, rather than biting off more than we can chew, and hoping for the best.

It's much easier to build a framework, and workflow for how you want a certain thing to be made, when you've already started making it yourself.

And anyway, as far as development goes, me and my brother talked and planned a lot of stuff out, especially in regard to how we're gonna approach developing this game, and that's very exciting.

I found a way that will allow me to have:
-Beautiful character models, with tight animatons, that look as good as DBFZ
-with variant costumes
-in full 3D environments
-at a much lower cost than that of 3D models.

And the answer to that is Spine + Unreal Engine's Animation Blending:

youtube.com/watch?v=Sul-lc9D-8I

Spine is interesting as it's essentially 3D animation on 2D drawings. You attach art to a skeleton, and 3D animate it. So you essentially get the best of both worlds, and perfect for what we wanna make. I can do all of that pretty much by myself. So we're gonna take this approach, and start building something, as I'm able to lay out the exact workflow I need to create something with this.

So perhaps by around this time next year, I might have some videos and such to show off.

We'll see.

Yes. Though he's still very much a rough concept that essentially looks like Jinzo crossed with Voldo, crossed with Yuri. So I won't post it due to it lacking originality. I still need to give that one many passes before I'm ready to show it off.

This really sounds like the autism of needing "defective" gamecube controllers to play Melee in the most optimal way. You're segregating a huge part of potential players by doing this decision not only because it's not "usual" basics. There are people who have wrists problems and can only play on keyboards/hitbox controllers so by default they would be at disvantage in your design. For a game you need to cover every potential player in the platform using their respective default controller. So far you're forcing PC players to buy a controller with high precision in their analog sticks.

Trying to appeal to everyone is a sure way to make your product fail.
Concentrate in one target group only, and everyone else that are remotely interested, they must adapt to the game.
All games that made to have broad appeal failed soon after the hype died.

Well, no not exactly. I'm sure you could do stuff like that in digital if you got good at double tapping on a Hitbox. It's actually the opposite, the game gives you more options on how you wanna play it.

It's basically, playing it in digital is the same as you'd play it if I didn't have an analogue option to begin with. Analolgue is there because it's more intuitive, and ultimately more comfortable. It's much simpler to gauge your pressure on a stick to determine your movement, than to have to press or tap the stick multiple times in order to run. Yes, there's more nuance to it, but ultimately, none of that matters unless you're playing the game at high competitive levels.

The game can still be perfectly enjoyed at casual levels no matter what input method you choose.

Am I demanding people invest more money to play optimally? Well, this is a requirement for proLevel play of just about ANY hobby. You can use your standard old fight stick if you'd like, you can use a control pad, you can use a hitbox. Ideally though, the game is built around analogue fight sticks, but it's nowhere near a necessity, and there is room there for people to master digital inputs with something like a hitbox should they choose. Getting good at videogames though takes practice, and dexterity. People with low dexterity are unlikely to play fighting games competitively anyway. And if you're one of those people, there's still room there for someone like that to enjoy the game at a more casual/fun level.

The point of the game is for it to be easy to get into, but with an overall high, and rewarding skill ceiling. That's the goal at least. And one of my approaches toward that goal is by breaking the standard mold in fighting games in general, starting with the controls.

Either way, the nuance of what may or may not be possible, ultimately, idk man. That's a question that's answered during development. I have NO idea what sorts of advanced techniques players could come up with using these different input methods and mechanics. All I know is that I have a goal in mind for what I want the game to be, and a fairly good roadmap of how to get there in terms of development. But overall, I won't be able to answer finer points like that without an actual game in development.

And the sticks don't need to be high precision. Your standard stick in you usual console controller will do fine. You wanna use a keyboard or a hitbox? Go for it, just git gud at double tapping keys. You wanna use your old fight stick, totally doable. But each form of input that deviates from what the game was built around will come with its own fair share of advantages and disadvantages I'd garner. The game is still gonna be built around analogue inputs regardless though.

...

I see someone bought the Kotaku meme. You need a perfectly functioning Gamecube controller to play Melee optimally. The problem is that the vast majority of controllers in circulation have minor defects that don't affect most games but do affect Melee thanks to the importance of Dashback and Shield Dropping, which has been negated with the Universal Controller Fix being implemented at most major tournaments.

Well, the base game is free. And to be fair, the idea would be that you'd be able to get enough currency to unlock everything for free if you grind enough. It wouldn't be easy by any means, but certainly possible.

Also, it's not 3D anymore (well, technically 2.5D as people call it), I'm going with Spine to save costs on 3D models. It's actually pretty nifty, and I'm very confident that I can push out something that's very visually impressive for a relatively much lower cost. I can't model, but I can draw, and I can animate. So we'll see how it goes.

An example of what Spine is capable of:
youtube.com/watch?v=Whe2qvEiZds

With this, I can basically bang out a couple characters by myself, and build a basic game to mess around with the mechanics with my brother on UE4. That could make a good pitch, or if more money starts coming in with the manga, I could basically create a roadmap for how to get shit done myself and just hire Spine animators to follow the workflow I set up by making those initial characters.

Fucking hell, I thought your ass was dead. Good to see you're still trying to fulfill your dream.

suit yourself faggot

I just skimmed through because it looked interesting but jesus OP, take criticism at face value instead of arguing against everything people tell you and going all defensive. Feedback is what people tell you, whether or not you use that information is up to you but don't go around debating people who are generously giving you their detailed, honest opinions. If you want elaboration, ask for elaboration, but don't go around telling people that what they thought of your work was wrong.

Nice work user look forward to more.

OP, do you plan on posting to /agdg/ once development gets going?

Yeah, I don't see why not. Feedback/Criticism is always useful.

Fen-Fang Far lewds when

I rather have faster walkspeeds to gauge my movement.

And that's the difference between a busted game Last Blade 2, Hokuto no Ken and many others and a refined high level game with or without unintended stuff Marvel vs. Capcom 2

Not really. Just because SFIV did it with its 1-frame links and situational stuff doesn't mean every game should be a Rock Band level of "need to buy to play this". NRS does it fine with their recent games and now DBFZ and Blazblue Cross Tag are being made with the regular controllers in mind even if they feature dial-up combo strings. KOF, DOA, VF and others with fewer button layouts also are fine in regular controllers or keyboards. Unless you have no intention to have PC as a main platform in your mind

"Breaking the mold" is a high risk to take. Just look at what other games like Fantasy Strike and Rising Thunder did with their "simplified controls" and the backlash taken from the communities who are ultimately the main market if you don't own an IP that sell on its own like Pokémon or Dragon Ball.

^I've seen that guy on the shoryuken forums. He's working on a fighting game on his own (GigaMaidens) and he isn't dumb or anything (and best of luck for your game, Josh!), but he has the habit of constantly crapping on anybody who aspires to also make a fighter. He's comically negative.

But what if people don't look at her as a character with a giant fan, but a character with a giant fan? Then they will think of Kitana, popular character in the Mortal Kombat franchise, first appearance in MKII; or they will think of SNK's Mai Shiranui, the most well-known female character SNK got. So Fen-Fang's movement has to be very different. Probably a good idea to follow the maxim that everything she does should look completely weird and wrong when you replace the big fan with a small one. I guess from the description "Areal Fighter", that she will use that thing to travel further in the air. She could also use it to do a wind attack that barely does damage if at all, but pushes away the opponent and/or destroys fire projectiles.

I remember you user
This one is still my favorite, keep working for that dream even if I came to the thread super late

where's the indian/mongolian priest doing yoga or something? what about the old as fuck beardy ojisan?

also needs a trope who "eats like 10 people" guy that isn't socially serious.
where are the ships tho?

...

This man will steal all your shit.

I guess, idk man. For now, I'd like to make the game I wanna make, and then play around with the balancing and kinks as time goes on. At the end of the day, this is a sort of dream project anyway. I'm not working with a team or anything, nor do I have to deliver a project within a specific time. There's plenty of time for me to play around with things and experiment.

We'll see once my brother builds a simple engine, and we start playing around with skeletons and hitboxes and stuff.

Bingo.

She's the only character (so far) with a triple jump, and the ability to air dash twice (think Chipp). Her fan lets her create a gust of wind that does no damage, but reverses projectiles, and pushes opponents back (moreso if the opponents are in the air). This is especially useful as some stages in the game allow for ring outs with pitfalls and such. So she can really capitalize on that for gimp kills.

In terms of play, I'm mostly looking at Painwheel in SG, and Peach in Smash. She has a lot of air-to-ground options, and very fast air-to-air attacks. She'd definitely have something like Peach's Float ability in Smash, where she can attack while gliding. Overall though, she's more of a hit-and-run style fighter, as she's really light, and takes a lot of damage from hits. So she has to rely a lot more on baiting people in, and punishing their mistakes.

As far as how her moves would kinda look, there's a bit of Jam and Chun-Li in there, she has many multi-hit kicks, but overall, I'm also looking mostly at Wushu for what here martial art would be inspired by. I haven't fully sat down and sketched out her exact moveset yet (I'm currently fine tuning Nin-Nin, Neon Knight, Onigiri, and Rosenrot), but it's along those lines. I might also look at TLA with Aang for inspiration, stuff like that you know.

I've changed her hairstyle a bit. I like the shorter hair. But she's gonna go a few minor changes. There's also a 2nd sword girl with a more "refined style" and a really long Katana. Everything on that sheet is very much WIP, to varying degrees. You'll see many changes in design from minor to major. Rin overall will keep the general flavor and attire, but I still gotta fine tune many things about her design.

There is a Shaolin Monk of sorts planned who can terraform. No design yet though. It's stull just a concept. A character who can change the stage to fight is something we've wanted in since right from the getgo.

As for Mongolian Monk/Ojisan. Monk Sand comes the closest. And maybe Onigiri's dad?

Monk Sand fits that profile very closely.
eventually

Haha, neat.

Nice
found him?
Somehow affiliated with Yilx (ic drawfagg drawing giant muscular lolis)
Now it makes sense why that Yilx does that style.