Game Designing

agdg is also a general here that's kind of more populated than the board itself is.
I still urge you to play whatever video games you enjoy and try to understand in depth what makes these games so good and enjoyable. Too many indie games try to ape something and fail miserably at it because they're only looking at said something superficially. Not that I'm implying you'll surely get to use that knowledge in a big AAA/indie studio but I believe it would make you a better dev.

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Play games. All manner of games. Play good games, but make a point to play bad games and dissect why they're considered bad. Perhaps more importantly, you should be able to separate the wheat from the chaff and understand when a conclusion about any given element of a game is good or not. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but opinions themselves can be founded on faulty reasoning. In short, get good at critical thinking.
Be in the right place at the right time. It might also pay to be a minority or a woman if you're hoping to get a job somewhere that enforces affirmative action type bullshit. Your actual skills don't matter as much as who you know, the appeal of the position in question, and how many people are also clamoring for said position alongside you.
Programming knowledge, you should probably have a portfolio of garbage indieshit that you've made in class or on your own. The important thing is that you should have some working prototype to show for your effort. If you can demonstrate that you have an understanding of certain aspects of human psychology and a vast well of knowledge about history, the arts, and culture, these things can help.
Hell, I don't know. I imagine that most game designers are appointed through nepotism or seniority rather than meritocracy.
Don't be a faggot.
If you work long enough as a code monkey, you can eventually become head code monkey, which will then allow you to potentially be upgraded to some type of management position. However, most of the time there's a dichotomy between "suits" and "devs". If you're a suit, you're concerned with market share, economics, and the various aspects of analytics that allow you to manipulate these forces. If you're a dev then you may actually give a shit about your product. The two don't usually cross.
GameMaker and Unity. That, or you can be bold and build your game from scratch.
If you have to ask this, then you don't deserve to be a game designer in the first place.

Are you the same faggot that went into the AGDG thread and asked for a "programmer"?

i should clarify that this thread isn't about, or for, me

question sort of relevant:
long story short, im moving, and i have two options for the career choice i want to go into (animation)
community college bachelors for digital gaming & interactive media design
and a for profit school (digipen) for animation.

I don't really care about the gaming part of animation and would rather have a straight up animated arts degree, but if i do that, i have to fork out more money if they even accept me.
what do i do

(czeched)
Nnnnope.

Game design is a job, but you should probably look into programming instead.

Game design is pretty low on the totem pole.

You do none of the things, and join an existing art community on the internet while working whatever jobs you can get.

Debt is slavery, and you will ruin your own life if you bother with it.

The only thing you will miss out on by not going to college is the connections and outside opinions and relationships you develop.

Luckily, all of this can be substituted with the internet.

Just learn on your own through youtube and google searches. Everything you need to know is already out there man.

Download Krita, then start posting on /loomis/ and download books from /zundel/.

There is no shame in avoiding college. My debt will never stop haunting me. Don't do it.

I think students of these institutions can get job placement opportunities, but that's about all it has to offer. They're often advertised as places with "industry connections" and that focus on classes that are taught be "industry veterans", but who knows how true that shit really is. I think you could honestly learn anything that a course can teach you on your own, given ample time and the drive to do so. Point is, unless you're going to some reputable school like Yale, it doesn't really matter where you go.

Take community college if you don't want to burn a hole in your pocket. Take your fancy art institute if you're sitting on a pile of cash and you want to get the chance to maybe suck an instructor's dick who can get you a job at EA or something.

This difference is always outlined whenever the subject is brought up. So without having to scour search engines - what is the difference between a game developer and a game designer?
Is it the designers who dabble in the creative aspects of the game and the developers who make everything work?

This. Game design isn't something you need to take a class on, it's something you can learn just by watching youtube videos and pirated pdfsbooks on game design. You really want to look into learning programming so you can actually actualize your idea instead of being an ideafag.

Yes, if you're looking to become a good artist, going to college is a complete waste of time. All it does is structure the learning process and cost you a fortune(which for the former, is definitely not worth the latter)

The term game developer is nebulous, but basically a game developer can be considered anyone who is making a game or is part of a games studio(in a creative role of course, being EA's janitor doesn't make you a game dev). A game designer is someone who designs the gameplay. They design the core gameplay loop, all the aspects and details of the gameplay and do their best to make sure that nothing is unbalanced(You don't want the handgun to have better dps than an assault rifle)

A game designer comes up with gameplay mechanics and level design things like enemy placement to make the game interesting and fun for users.

A programmer uses logic and programming languages to make everything actually happen.

It's the difference between designing a new DandD manual and becoming a fucking dungeon engineer that makes actual dungeons.

You can very easily see how one would be more valuable than another.

Don't get hung up on the word creative. It's almost meaningless. There are creative programmers and derivative designers and vice versa.

You aren't creative. You are a faggot that enjoys consumption of entertainment media. The act of consumption and creation are VERY different.

If you've ever built anything, that is all programming or art or design is.

You have to enjoy the act of building or you wont have any fun.

Consuming media is more like destruction. You run around and break all the enemies and set pieces and move on.

Creativity cant even exist until you've built a strong foundation in any given thing. Creativity is the icing on the cake you spent 10 years baking.

There is so much wrong with how people perceive the world I cant even begin to type.

Learn to program and make games. If you want to study, take computer science. The real resume for game design is past experience making game mods and making computer games. You get judged on your portfolio. Short of that, if you have a computer science degree you can apply as another programmer. If you want to apply for an artist position, you need an art portfolio.

It's mostly job experience and portfolios in the game industry.

Honestly anyone pursuing a game design degree is already seen as a dumbass and ideafag.

I'm not going to pretend I know exactly what will make you an amazing game dev, hell I'm not even a part of the industry, I just make games I want for myself. But I can tell you what I would have done differently knowing what I know now:

Skills:
Analyze what kind of dev you want to be. Do you want to work on a team or alone? If you want to work on a team just focus on Programming or Art/Animation, though make sure you have some experience in the other because being able to wear multiple hats is always a good way to impress potential employers.

If you're like me and want to try making games on your own, learn to draw, if you can teach yourself to animate even better. Start right now. Seriously. If you're working on your own the level of skill you'll need in programming isn't that high, the equivalent of around 2 years in a cs programming, if that. If your game looks like ass most people aren't going to even to consider it. It's kinda dumb but that's the truth.

School:
Don't go to school for game design/development. it's almost always a trap, you're most likely going to end up being up to your eyeballs in debt and have no skills to pay off said debt. if you can survive without going to school at all just teach yourself, there are plenty of tutorials online, and for programming documentation is your friend.

If you're not willing to take that risk, try and go to a trade school, it's faster and there are some web development classes that will help at least get your feet wet with programming. Though be aware this may not be as marketable as a full on Compsci degree. Though depending on where you are sometimes a degree wont even matter. You need to do that research by yourself.

Though honestly my main advice is that you are most likely not going to be able to make game development a lasting career. The only thing you can really do is make sure to set up your life in such a way that you can make games without having to worry about getting a job in game development, and just keep making games on your own to build a portfolio and give yourself a greater chance of getting hired, or until one of those games you make becomes really popular.

I'm obviously not saying give up and not look for opportunities, but this is a game of odds and the longer you can stay in, the greater chance you have of making it.

Other anons may have a better understanding of the industry than I do so any of you feel free to correct me if I'm giving bad advice.

Wrong. True. True.
College isn't a waste of time, it's what you make out of it - considering you choose the college that's right for you. You should learn about who your professors are going to be and try and get info on what their classes are like, descriptive details about homework, expectations, and curriculum. Then find out what resources are available. It's not like you can't learn from college while at the same time conducting your own research - which is actually what is highly expected, encouraged, and required for anyone serious in their fields of study.

The rest is true, it's structured learning at an outrageous price, and the latter does not always equate to the former very well.

If you get a CS degree you're forced to take certain classes and get a choice between 1-3 teachers. Most of these classes are useless, but a few contain hidden trails to diamonds. I.E. really fucking important topic that deserves more attention, but they only briefly discuss it or teach it in such a way that you learn nothing. Example:
My one class taught us how CPU cache works. This is fucking massive for any high performance coding. However, instead of teaching us how to code with it in mind they literally made us calculate where in cache our memory goes depending on the size of cache. This is so fucking retarded on so many levels and everyone knows it. So it gets brushed off as another useless topic in a useless class not looking into this topic any further.

Just like how you can't become an automotive mechanic without knowing what makes an engine tick and what separates a good engine from a shit engine, you can't become a good game designer without knowing what makes a game design tick and what separates a good game design from a bad one.
This involves looking at games, typically by playing them since that's the entire point of a game's existence, and isolating the individual components to learn how they fit together into the whole.
If you can't take a good look at a game and describe how the mechanics shape the experience of gameplay, and how non-mechanical elements such as visuals and sound inform the gameplay experience, you will more likely than not fall into the typical pitfalls of indie development: poorly-stitched-together mechanics and non-mechanical aspects, feature creep, and superficial derivation.

You're real clueless.

I don't know where you came from, probably (((NeoGAF))), but you have to go back.

shilling the (((college))) meme
Please kill yourself.

I recommend against both of these, like other anons said.
If you had to choose one, avoid for-profit schools like the plague; they're all degree mills.

You know right I'm probably going to be owning a restaurant by the time you're out of Uni

I wanna make a game. I'm a decent but unfortunately self taught, programmer. All the ideas I have require me to have knowledge in other areas or at least some base maths skills of which I have fucking zilch I wanted to be able to actually talk to NPCs, so I started looking into linguistics engines and it feels like I'm missing some vast area of knowledge and don't know where to start on implementing this. Or I want to make goal oriented AI so I start reading up on STRIPS, satplan, graphplan, and even after struggling through everything until I understand the algorithms, it feels like I'm in way out of my depth. It feels like the online resources aren't nearly as mature as just programming even though the fields have been around for much longer, if I want to learn how to do something in programming there's a million crash courses that will teach you everything you need to know, but then when it comes to these specific things all I find is university papers written in the 1980s.

There's a reference linguistics engine I was hoping I could stealutilize but it's written in freaking Java. Why is making stuff so damn hard? I wish I could just pay someone else to do it for me.

You're trying really hard to act like the assholes you've probably only ever had the misfortune of talking to on here. And I'm sorry for that. I really am, man.

And I bet it'll have a kids menu, and that menu will see more traffic than your burger-fry entrees.

nah
also we'll see who gets the last laugh

k

You can. That's like a producer asking a director to put on a play or film.

I don't think it'll work any better for me than it'll work for Peter Monopole. I also don't have nearly enough money to pay people wages.

>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pirate_code#Example_codes

Let me clue you in on something, faggot:
I am the asshole :^)
>>>/neogaf/

I feel like you're trying to research "the best method", rather than the easiest to implement. Just make a minimax algorithm with a decent heuristic and/or Monte Carlo tree search; works just fine for an AI algorithm, and doesn't require expert skill to implement.
Not sure what you mean by linguistics engines; do you mean text-to-speech?

Look, OP, I know you think you're helping, but when you make a thread that shows you don't have enough functioning neurons to spark a fire, let alone talk intelligently about the topic, perhaps you should refrain from giving advice on the subject.

probably learn outdated game design templates to use, like some larping retard, lmao.

You don't need to take any classes to be a game designer. You just have to know what you like about the games you play and it helps if you're good at art. To be actually make a game work, you'd have to be a programmer or find a programmer to write the game and implement everything, and you won't learn shit about that in any comp sci program either. The most they'll have you doing is writing shitty java animations.

The top four replies you made are so worthless you might as well not have posted them at all. The last one was decent.

I'm afraid your post rates 1 out of 5 points.

Don't asshole shame him, this is a safe space to go fuck yourself you faggot.

It's building the search space, and figuring out where to get my heuristics that I'm struggling with.
nlp.stanford.edu:8080/parser/
That's the best example I've found so far. I want to be able to parse verbs, nouns, and constraints from sentences so I can actually tell NPCs what to do instead of selecting from a list. I built my own very rudimentary one using regex but it was pretty shitty.

The problem wasn't that he was being a dick. It was that he was being a worthless dick.

It's called "The Law of Jante"

I think it's called for.

fuck off back to reddit

This ain't your safe space, nigger.

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Interesting perspective, but the law of Jante is more of a hivemind attitude with a dose of "you can't teach me shit" and "don't rock the boat faggot." Imageboards are a lot more anarchist and individualist than that. I guess the law of Jante might describe Holla Forums though, but that's also part of what made Holla Forums into cancer.

Lurk moar and don't beg to be spoonfed are core tenants of "image board culture."

To lurk moar is to understand your surroundings before you speak.

To not be spoonfed is to do some research on your own and not make a stupid fucking thread asking how to tie your fucking shoes.

Both things contribute to the glory and longevity of our image board.

Being nice is not nor has it ever been a virtue.

It's not about adhering to a hivemind. It's about self development and respect of local culture.

The fact that I have to explain this to you speaks volumes about your lack of knowledge.

Lurk moar, faggot

Nice spacing.

You could say that shit like a normal human being instead of just randomly tossing in sage advice like "you have to go back" and "go lurk" and expecting your post to be in any way interpreted as anything other than a shitpost. And quit bitching about your right to be a dick, you delicate snowflake. It wasn't about that, dumbfuck. It was about the information-free post that was somehow expecting to be taken seriously.

Also: R E D D I T S P A C I N G . (Seriously, stop spacing your shit like a faggot who just discovered the enter key.)

Get a computer science degree. Get a real job and do game design in your fee time. Laugh at all those starving game devs when you release your masterpiece whilst living in relative luxury compared to those starving "artists"

Begone from this place

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This thread is fucking cancer and unnecessary with AGDG thread. Mods end this faggotry.

I'm a game designer, I've worked at a couple of big-name places, here's how I did it:

1. Took all the math and computer programming classes I could in high school. Learned some basic game dev skills through books that were available at the time. Graduated with 3.74 GPA and got accepted into DigiPen.

2. Took DigiPen's programmer track. Was good at it but couldn't afford more than two years - DigiPen wasn't accredited at the time so I have a lot of private debt from that. I met lots of people who would go on to be in the industry and left a good impression on them during my time there.

3. Since I didn't have a degree I started at the bottom as a tester at Nintendo. Nintendo and Microsoft are both easy places to get in at as a tester, it's seasonal work though so you basically gotta keep applying every several months. Be persistent.

4. After being a contract tester at Nintendo for a year, I was able to land a full-time testing job at another company. Difference between contract and full-time is paid vacation and health benefits, all that good stuff. Won't be naming companies I worked at from here.

5. After being at my new tester job for only a couple months, got the opportunity to interview for a junior design position at another studio. This came about because they were looking for someone who could do technical design work, and there were people working there who remembered me from college and so phoned me up out of the blue. I got the job.

6. This job was not well-paying. Not every opportunity has a go-d pay-check attached to it. I liked the work and stuck with it. The pay was only low for a probationary period of like 6 months, which isn't uncommon for someone when it's literally their first time as a designer. I stayed with the company for about 4.5 years and shipped to projects before getting caught in lay-offs. No matter who you are, this experience is highly likely at some point in your career.

7. Took 6 months to land my next job. Doesn't matter how experienced or prestigious your past achievements are, the only thing harder than getting into the industry is staying in it. That next job is never guaranteed and rarely easy. I've interviewed guys that I thought were legends for shit positions simply because they'd been out of work for a year or two. The struggle is real.

8. I worked at a start-up for 2.5 years, got a portion of the company for my sacrifices there, like only 0.01% stake in it but whatevs. It was fun, shipped another game, but again this was me taking a low pay for lead-level design opportunity.

9. From there I took a job in europe at a well-known developer. When trying to crack into the AAA studios, it can help to apply abroad, since Americans are considered highly by European and Japanese game devs. I again took shit pay because I wanted to have a AAA studio on my resume.

10. I worked there a year and a half before applying for a job back state-side. This was another AAA studio but now I'd get the pay that I deserved. Right now I'm a designer bringing in 90k a year. I don't have any pets or a partner - it would've been much harder to advance if I'd had either of those. At this point I think I have a stronger resume than many of the people who were in my class in college, so even though they're engineers and getting paid better than me because of that, they are all still in mobile game studios, which are the easiest to get into.

Hope this was helpful. Lot of people in this thread don't know what they're talking about; engineers don't outrank design - it's different for every studio. Many, probably most, are run by design, some are run by art, some are run by engineering, some are run by production. Benefits and drawbacks to every approach, no right answer.

Bonus Step: I wish to god that things like Unity and Unreal had been available to me when I was coming up. Download those tools and learn those tools. So many studios use them, but even the ones that don't will have something that's similar, so if you can demonstrate a mastery with either of those tools you'll have a stronger chance.

Pretty sure being a tester was not a particularly useful career move. Might've provided valuable experience to reflect upon as a designer later, but in terms of resume it's safe to say it was networking that got you that junior design position you needed to actually enter the market, not years of experience as a tester.

Seen a lot of them end up in the mobile market making cellphone games. Now that is depressing.

I think ultimately the best way to enter the career as a nobody is still to build up a portfolio in terms of mods or independent projects. Learning industry tools is also valuable.

I got the interview because of networking, but I actually got the job because of another job I had turned down. I had applied for a full-time testing spot at another company when I was looking to leave Nintendo. I got a phone interview and during it a big-time producer there was telling me that they like to have their QA go on to be producers. I told him that I wanted to be an engineer or designer. He said that was unlikely. I said that I didn't expect it to happen unless I proved it to be the right choice. The producer strongly urged met o say that I'd be okay becoming a producer, but I stuck to my guns. I didn't get that job, but after I interviewed for the design position a few months later, the producer on that team was 50/50 and unsure about hiring me. She knew the other producer I had interviewed with at the other company and somehow had found out that I'd interviewed there to be a tester, so she asked that producer, "Hey why didn't you hire him as a tester? We're considering him for design." And that producer told her, "We really wanted to hire him, if he'd just agreed to be a producer we would've, but he stuck to his guns that he wanted to become a designer or an engineer." The producer who hired me as a designer told me directly that that conversation is what tipped the scales in my favor. Knowing people gets you an opportunity, but to land the job you got to have a reputation, which can be hard to do if you ain't in the industry at all, and that's why I say get in as a tester while you're trying to become a designer. The number of designers I've worked with who started out in test is very high. Get your foot in the door, get years on that resume.

Oh and to be clear, yes I think they should be doing mods and independent project and learning tools also. I would just add that they can be gaining industry experience and contacts while they're doing that.

3D diablo set in an old renovated missile silo with a hidden passage to a deeper secret and more. Or set on an abandoned alien spaceship with an ancient evil on board that wiped out the former hosts.

It is that easy. Loot with many suffixes and hidden rooms with treasure. Sell Millions.

Welp, the thread took off sorta, but I left for four hours and guys started fighting each other over me. And as sweet as that is, I'm not interested. Sowwy

High schools don't offer computer programming classes. Unless you're referring to clubs?
What games did you test? where and how do you apply
I'm saving your post btw.

Halo without the Covenant? Dead Space? You mention missile silo and hidden passage and man did my mind start thinking of something awesome. Like, some sort of Soviet zombie/cyborg type shit? And I jut thought of something else, the v2 of audiosurfer - Bass Driver, custom tracks you can race on with your friends to tracks you can upload to the game, and it's bass boosted racing.
youtu.be/7RNK0YBdwko?t=313

They do actually.

I reverse engineered a company's game to fix the issues that broke my save game. They offered me a contracting job and I'm now a full developer on a game with several million sales despite having absolutely no background in any of this. I'd literally only done a couple "make the ball roll" tutorials in Unreal and Unity before. I'm doing it part time (I have a day job) so I'm working 12 hour days, but I'm currently pulling in a little over $200k/yr.

Nope; there's content in this thread with discussion open for game ideas as secondary thread-content, 25 UID's including your dumb ass, and it's not the same as the other thread in that the other thread seems to pander to people with projects already in their hands and people who actually know a damn thing - who aren't concerned with the educational aspect of game design and development. This is rudimentary, basic-bitch, for-dummies and those interested or curious not knowing where to start, who don't have time to read every fucking argument in the AGDG thread that isn't about getting started but how to continue or ask for criticism on what they're already doing.

Then you elitist JP's come in and shit the place up with your faggotry thinking every fucker who plays video games AND visits this board knows (or should know) how to program a AAA game as an independent. Pull your head out of your own ass for once.

Otherwise a duplicate thread.
No it's not it's you bitching. If you're incapable of using the threads for what they're for you're going to get shit on. Nothing in the OP couldn't have been asked in the AGDG thread and would get replies.

There's so many fucking assumptions here I don't even know where to fucking begin. AGDG isn't for late talents. You can get started there as well. If you're going to blog post about how much this board should cater to you then you'll be better off on Reddit where you can make your own and retards will eat it up. But you're basically spending >200 words to say you're a narcissist who has to make everything about him. Really do fuck off and spend 10 minutes lurking this board before you start making threads like a retarded manchild.

No, brother, I'm not arguing with you.

Great thread OP.

Like, just make game. No, seriously.
Depends on what part of game development you intend on getting into. Take a programming-heavy major such as software engineering or computer science if you intend to be a programmer, or intend to do solo work. Take majors dedicated specifically to a various other aspect if you intend to work on something else. Actual game development majors are effectively jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none programs. The coursework doesn't teach enough to realistically get placed into any job by itself: Lots of independent work and/or HR cocksucking is more or less required.
Do lots of little games outside of classes. Focus on genres you intend on working with. Shit looks good on a resume.
gamedevmap.com/
Also game dev meetups, although most are part of the cancer you probably want to avoid.
Again: Projects, projects. projects. Having a robust portfolio is incredibly important. Also, learning Unity and/or Unreal is useful to have.
Larger gaming companies generally have swarms of people applying to their positions. Refer to the past part of my second answer.
Extensive periods of procrastination. Game design majors. Openly expressing wrongthink, as hard as it to admit that.
Again, refer to the game dev map. Programmers are usually in high demand. Asset makers are probably the next most common. Writers can be pretty common as well, but you'll generally need to wear more than one hat, so to speak, if you're working for a smaller company. Larger companies have those keeping-the-company-glued-together type positions. I'd suggest avoiding them.
Common game engines are highly recommended. Not only will some companies look specifically for experience with said engines, but having the experience shows that you're likely to be able to adapt to other engines. Having dual screens is incredibly useful, as it greatly increases work efficiency.
Play a variety of games, both good and shit. Try to sit down and really analyze what made them good or bad.

On a semi-related note, read up on design philosophy, and remember that no advice is 100% useless, or should any be taken as the word of God, regardless of how successful or unsuccessful the person giving it is.

This entire fucking thread has been a shitpost because the OP was a shit poster who posted a shit post.

Seconded.

They do actually, you'd know that if you hadn't dropped out

If you weren't fucking illiterate and actually fucking read the OP of the /agdg/ thread, you'd see many different links to many different resources for beginners that would answer literally every question in your OP that wasn't (((college)))-related. Quit begging to be spoonfed.

...

didn't read

what the hell?

damn you guys really can be thick, telling people to say "fuck college" and shoot for being an independent game developer by just being called a faggot by a bunch of mouth breathers who think PC gaming is superior because you couldn't get anywhere on a console that wasn't made by Nintendo. Git gud scrubs, this thread isn't a place for you to brag about your drawing and coding/programming skills for potential game ideas some random fucker with a webm offered you, you expect too much from others and less out of yourselves.

I'm not bragging about shit. This thread doesn't need to be here and you're so caught up in yourself that you don't even realize you're trying to validate how useless it is. Move the topic to the AGDG board or thread or stop bumping the thread with your empty insults. The last thing a vidya thread should be about is an introvert imploding on himself.

Didn't most old devs, like Carmack, Romero, etc., not even go to college at all? If college isn't 100% mandatory for what you want to do, all it'll do is waste your time with Marxist bullshit and further delay your entry into the job market. Employers would rather see 'guy held bullshit job while working on projects that get him a real job' than 'guy went to college, had no free time, developed no meaningful skills and got the same degree as a million other fags.' And I can safely say this as an actual fucking scientist in a specialized field.

you mind if I stop reading there? i don't really care about the rest.

...

how new r u

New enough to not give a shit what your alter ego thinks.

I'm going to stop replying now, because this is clearly a bait thread.
OP, if you are not just pretending to be retarded, I encourage you to stop posting until you realize the error of your ways.

i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/531/605/3ab.jpg

Depends where the Uni is located, but some places are infected with a thought policing like agenda that's antithetical to the purpose of a university.
So to establish what one should be doing in Uni: things like learning new concepts, confronting ideas, debating ideas, and such; in place where this is encouraged.
Said agenda is mentioned as being unwanted due to these core principles being seen as "insert buzzword" (racist, sexist, etc), and it shuts down any debate due to potential social consequences of questioning the set "higher than thou" sense of self entitlement this leftist agenda predicates (I.e. establishing power, and threatening consequences that occur due to questioning these ideas; I.e. This line of thought is antithetical to the purpose of university).
Though of course it depends on the professor, and the specific branch of learning; as in most cases the math departments remain unaffected, and the philosophy/psychology departments have professors that can see the flaws, but cannot question it due to the established "power"/"threatened consequences".
Though that's not to say Uni is totally useless, far from it, as the structure offered by courses with good professors who care about what their course offers can give one amazing insights.
Though, again, with the prevalence of the Internet this can all be learned independently.
This is why anons mentioned that game design is something best learned independently, as game design is riddled, in most cases, with this agenda; which contradicts the purpose one would want to take a course for it in the first place; thus it's generally a "waste of time".

So why do classes for it exist? Furthermore, why do game companies exist?
And couldn't the same argument be made for every field of study?
So what's the point of colleges at all?

Not everyone enjoys independent games - even most independent game lovers enjoy the biggest names in the industry, whether they admit it or not - and if they didn't, then I doubt sales would be affected that badly.
Is it not easier for someone to go to college and learn, at the very basic levels, and with a team, how to program, code, design, etc., and develop video games with real-world, hand's-on experience as part of the curriculum that most colleges have or yeah, should have, that also should offer networking opportunities for students who see themselves as team players with a company a company that might pay well, offer benefits, and likes to see college degrees on resumes, and looks well on a resume to other companies afterwards instead of the lone wolf trying to make a million bucks out of college for soloing a remake of another RPG set in suit and armor times?

If you want to be spoonfed just ask where to get started.

If you want to justify your stupid decision to endure indentured servitude for something that is largely NOT WORTH IT by all means travel to destination fucked.

Stop pretending you cant do it on your own you weak faggot. Everything is available for free online now.

With a single word I could direct you where to get started RIGHT NOW and you could be well on your way to making your game.

But you are going to wait for college like an idiot, pay a bunch of money to learn nothing from idiots, and then have to spend all your free time while you work a shit job making up for the gaps in your teacher's knowledge/ability to give a fuck.

So a college can hopefully trade knowledge for money. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

You are getting a free lesson on life from people who have already been through it you ungrateful shit.

Yes they will. Everything is available for free online.

The only had part is justifying doing part time work to your parents while you "self study" without college. Which is why I went the college route and have fuck all to show for it

I should also mention that once a student takes a student loan they're immediately obligated to start paying it back, monthly +interest, after 6 months of graduation, or, if you fall under half time status. So people like to brag about working right out of college as you can tell…

And independent work might not be the best route, especially for someone who isn't in college or is working part/full-time on close to minimum wage. Independent is best for people, it seems to me, when they have no financial obligations or they're still living with their parents and have that kind of time - unless of course they spend all their free time outside working on a game and have that kind of all-around knowledge and skill, which you can't expect out of everyone. I'd like to make my own video games, sure, but I'd also love to snag a comfy position at a decent (maybe even overseas) company with paid vacation and retirement plans. It's all way too boring to talk about, but a lot of bros go into college and completely unaware to this shit.

I'm pretty capable of finding most of this out on my own, but not everyone else is, and I like the convenience that's being 'spoonfed' to me - and this isn't just about game design, this is about how to get into it, from finding out what there is and understanding what you want to do, to learning about the college game and finding work afterwards - not how to be an independent game designer and show other user's your shit and ask for opinions.

So you know, if you can't understand this, then go stop breathing permanently or something.

Do you know how to check post IDs?

Look at my posts. I already did spoonfeeding because I like to help people grow and am not a huge cunt. That being said, being a huge cunt is part of our culture here for the reasons I already described.

This basic information you want is already available through google searches. You cant just make a thread and say "hey guys, tell me things I can easily run a search for" and not have anything to offer.

I understand your intent. Your intent is not sufficient for the community.

You obviously don't speak for the community.

By a show of posts, who thinks this guy is a faggot?

Me!

you're posting form a phone, pfft, off

It's a shame you've turned this into a shitflinging match. I've done nothing but my best to help you. but because I'm a "big meanie" about it you cant absorb my words.

lol

That comic is disingenuous and retarded, honestly. Student loans are overwhelmingly a sack of shit, and they sure don't contribute to social security or medicare. Student loans are shit you owe banks. If you actually have a federal loan it's a much, much better deal than anything the banks will give you.

That said I agree that if you want to become a game developer a degree is overrated. You need to build a portfolio, learn industry tools, make contacts, and get some certifications in whatever field you're after.

hey I'm on a new ID you paranoid faggot, just here to chime in and tell you that you're a retarded nigger. post more reaction images while you try to fit in, reddit.

will do

So basically you want to shitpost. k.

Better question: how do you get into it if you have zero drive to do anything?
Learning vidya dev is a daunting task to tackle even without the disadvantage of having gone through a shitty school system that doesn't give anyone a starting point in any of the prerequisite skills required, so just getting to a place where you'd be able to confidently start a project seems like it would take a lifetime of dedication and most people in a place like this are lazy faggots who would be starting from step 1 in their early-mid 20's, which alone is more than enough to kill motivation
Is adderall a good investment for something like this?

user OP doesn't want to post well written debates. He wants to blogpost and sound angsty. Read the thread.

I don't really give a fuck about OP

Then why aren't you posting this question in the AGDG threads? Where people can actually answer your question?

The only advice AGDG regulars generally have on topics like these is "just do it"

You ever consider they might have a point? Nobody who's higher up on experience is goign to bother teaching fundamentals. It's something you gotta start on yourself because the only other people who can say anything don't know shit. In any case why do you expect a different answer here?

Depends on your school and even then you might not get much good out of the curriculum. Take my high school for example. It's programming course taught Python and HTML. Good course for learning basic programming syntax, but not the best for learning how to make games.

That's only if you don't ask specific questions. Ask them what books you should read, tutorials to watch or what tools are best for beginners and they'll tell you.

I never said they wern't shit. The education system needs to get its shit in line and teach students proper programming. Last I checked they were pushing some retarded puzzle piece shit developed by google that I don't remember the name of.

It can be done, but it's a high-risk endeavor. If you were to go to school specifically for game design you would be severely limiting yourself in terms of marketable skills. If I were you I'd go into comp sci or engineering. Basically I'd pick up gamedev as a hobby and pursue a career into it when you have a few successful games or you can make it profitable. You don't want to work for some other company being a codemonkey or underpaid tester.

To be honest, I don't know how common gamedev studious even are. I'm sure big name studios recruit artists and programmers from schools, or are mostly insular and hire people who have worked at other studios. I think the idea of a game development studio as a business is kind of dead anyway, most of the indie studios you hear of are just a handful of dudes who collaborate over the internet. Actual, physical game design studios are AAA garbage companies that waste millions of dollars to make a product that will most likely flop or just break even are not places you want to be.

Go back to whatever social media you're used to using. Tumblr is my guess, though I'm sure you use several

This is why I don't bother reading your gay posts.

Really irritating how there are extra pixels between some lines.

Bait somewhere else.

You're 12, aren't you?

You're not much better user.

It's not offtopic, so why would I sage? I'm not one of the autists who think sage is a downvote.

The thread is a duplicate. Sage for the sake of not bumping the thread.

incorrect, design and development aren't the same thing

Design is discussed on the thread and you're given sources from the get go in the OP. Quit bumping your thread at page 14 and let it die.

...

Stay mad reddit.

you know, you're starting to rub off on me

Keep posting.

hm?

would you happen to have a set of tits, a writing tool, and something to write on?

Hey OP! Nice thread!
Have a bump, on me! :)

I'm disappointed in this thread.

I'm happy in this thread.

How do you become one what? If it's faggot congratulations. You already are one.

...

optitrack.com/products/motion-capture-suits/

Would any of you ever bother programming (or hiring someone to program) your own game design and development software; drawing and recording your own ideas from photos and drawings; and maybe building your own hardware or programs that can handle advanced graphics, motion mechanics, geometric contact, memory, and scene-gameplay crossovers?

Where would you pull inspiration? Would you be more interested in level design, character/npc/monster design, weapon design, armor, setting, anything else? Story writing? Research? Promotion? Voice acting?

youtu.be/gX1qAxc_OX0?t=1956

Your inspiration should be core and fringe STEM. Going deep down the rabbit hole. As well, occultism (including or even beginning with ancient mystery schools and traditions such as shamanism), martial arts, ancient cultures/history, literature, art, morality, state and government/politics, alchemy, and ultra-modern phenomena. It all starts to blend together and interact in ingenius ways when you apply Mystery to it. "???" is a magical substance.

That would be great though yes. Take care of your own ability to get through it and not burn out and you're golden. That means, weight lift 3x a week, intermittent fast with a fast on Sunday and a 3 day fast once a month (Fri-Sun), with a nature retreat spiritual fast once a year, supplements, strange roots and herbs, teas, brews/stews, meditation, yoga, breathing techniques, cardio, reading, an artform such as drawing or music, strategy games (digital or analogue) and sports or hand-eye reaction based games for your reflexes. A martial art would be wise as well. Requiring your team to perform at least the core of these (weight lift, diet, meditation) would ensure success and stability.

This is a troll thread, don't fucking reply.

I will transform this thread.

When stuck in a creative rut, fast and meditate for 3 days, including a 2 day water fast on the latter half. Ingest garlic and onion, turmeric, red pepper and sugar at the outset in a tea. Move your internal force downward the first day, upward the second day, and outward laterally the third day. Perform cardio on the second day. Break the fast with a post workout meal and drink, lifting weights in a fasted state. Put honey in your drink. Eat something fermented. Drink a large amount of green tea. Best done on the fourth day.
Creativity involves creating or allowing desynchronization of your hemispheres and then resolving said desynch. Like the netcode of an mmo. Seratonin is responsible for you feeling fresh in the morning, and synchronizing the hemispheres of your brain (and body I believe). Delta brain wave activity (.5 - 4 HZ) is the level of brain activity that all the good chemicals are produced, and incredible creativity is permitted. This is why meditation and zen is essential.

Drink a pot of coffee and go for gamma (>40HZ) brain waves after the fast is finished. Just speed up your mind until "the blinded mentally traumatized man inside a metal egg begins screaming unendingly as he charts a course through the Warp".

Watch Extra Credits every day.

Why not dig deep and swallow all the semen you can while you at it, faggot.

Who do you want to work for, or with?
If you could cast any actor to do the voices for you - who?
If you could hire any artists, who would they be?
I think Bill Maher could make for a killer main character's voice, and Geoffrey Rush would make an interesting addition to either a villain or special character.

Any game engines you prefer over others? Do they make affordable 2D and 3D software that outperforms open-source at a reasonable price?

I was looking up Bethesda, just because I wanted to think of a plan for example to prepare for. I read that it's based out of Rockville, Maryland, and the city has roughly 67k people at 13.57 sq. miles. It's smaller than my hometown, and I fit in perfectly around my hometown, even getting around very easily by car. I just think the cost of living starting out in Maryland would be hard, but hey, look what I just read;

I guess if you want to fully prepare for where you might want to work you should consider the cheapest places first and see what you can find out where the cheap housing is, check craigslist, classifieds online from their local newspaper outlet, then plan accordingly. Bethesda is a little north of the city away from all the inner-city bullshit I guess. Not far from the beach, not far from the capital. Eh.

If I had to choice a voice actor for anything I'd choose Alex Jones

Lol, he'd make for a great, bearded army commander always yelling and always drunk, or the outraged rebel that defies orders And definitely the juiced up ally that bashes walls and carries the big guns.
I'm trying to listen to his voice, and I can hear him really carrying that low growl you hear under his voice, or he could carry that dialect of his in the upper range of his voice.

I think however he has the kind of voice that would be best suited as various characters here and there. He's too much of a character himself for me to decide whether he would make a great main character or not, and that's only because I feel limited to the 'types' of main protagonists and antagonists out there today that I can compare him to.
You could definitely make him a reoccurring character that is absolutely anything - but makes aaaall the same facial gestures and movements as he does. Like, he could be a bunny or a fucking dinosaur, so long as the faces match up.

Well sure, if that's what you're into. I'm open to new things.

bumping my gay thread

So you want to get hired at a big developer rather than be indie? You'd probably be better off majoring in computer science than game design and just having a lot of related experience on your resume - game dev internships, personal indie projects, clubs, game jams, etc.

not really, anybody can learn how to make a game.
making good ones that people like is the actual tricky part.

THIS
But please stop the spacing, it's hard to read. No, I don't care that you were taught that in school, it's as hard to read as non-indented paragraphs.

marketing
psychology
sociology
ui/ux design

basic programming just to be able to express the logic and understand the limitations.

regarding game design jobs it's just selecting how long are the timers in microtransaction skinner box or picking values for item stats.
if you really want to innovate you'll have to make your own game.

...

That is a shitty meme degree, what you want is programming and not that cancer. If you ABSOLUTELY have to go to university then take computer science, computer engineering (if you're good with physics) or software engineering. Alernatively, if you're really good with maths, go into a maths degree.
Get programming courses, even if you don't get to become a game dev this opens up a shitload of work opportunities. Avoid going into shit that is explicitly about videogames because most of those courses are just there so the institution can earn money from gullible retards.
Having a significant number of programming languages under your belt, also HTML doesn't count.
Avoid being a developer in games you enjoy. I know that may seem very counter-intuitive but you will develop a certain degree of repulsion towards games that resemble the ones you make.

Just noticed that OP doesn't really understand how IDs work

yeah, probably plays around with black 3DPD penis with his mouth, hands, and butt cheeks. fuckin' duplicate-thread-postin' gaylord is what he is.

Take actual coding and if you are an artfag go to a animation workshop.

What did he mean by this?

Fuck off wherever you came from you dumbass.

Workshops in college are typically one credit hour and complimentary to a three or four credit hour classes. In fact, Computer animation is a minor and major in most places because of 'muh growing industry', but it's really all about the texbooks being made every year and publisher's making money off thousand dollar software leased to colleges. And I was considering it with a major in computer science or engineering, maybe focusing on software development.
Could you imagine selling your own game engine to a huge company for gorillions of dollars? Or maybe something like designing and programming a software that NASA might use, or for a science lab?
I don't get why a lot of these kids have fallen for the 'indie games are the best and they're really easy, design is pointless' probably comes from growing up as little kids playing with Gary's Mod and Team Fortress online play while still browsing halfchan when if you can 'develop' a 'game' with no story, game-play mechanics, art, scenery, characters, or sound then you've got basically nothing short of a card-game.

Other important shit to consider might be Computer-Aided Design and Web Design. Music and Theatre, focusing heavily on stage movement, lighting, sound, and design, and then voice or music theory and styles. You can also try simple art classes like drawing and cartoons or whatever.
If you're reading this and you haven't been to college yet' please take note - there will be classes offered by the most affordable of colleges that are exactly what you want and need to take, but you will most likely not be able to take these classes right off the bat until you've completed preliminary classes required by that college's major and minor program. It's worth a shot, but you can probably ask instructors and counselors to give you special permissions to take the course, but do not put all your eggs in this basket.

bump

bump?

It was intense and fun