How many of you actually buy into the Russia boogeyman meymey and if so...

I'm seeing preemptive media narratives saying that Putin is hacking Merkel's reelection. If she loses, then Russia will be blamed.

End of the world, right? I'd be very surprised if he didn't work with Russia at some point during his long career.

I'll entertain the idea that Russia wants to get NATO out of what it perceives as its sphere of influence and get sanctions lifted and would run propaganda campaigns to help a favorable candidate. You can't really take news seriously except as an indicator of what the ruling class is telling itself or trying to convince the masses of.

Russia didn't hack shit. The mainstream media is an extension of the ruling elite trying to exert their influence over the population's minds.

That's a given.

I see this get thrown around a lot, but no one ever points to a tangible example. "Fake news" on Facebook seems to always end up being done by clickbaiters who just want ad revenue, rather than a state party looking to propagandize.

>tfw Russia will bring actual democracy to the US

Also it's not too late for Bernie to win the primary.

They do have a lot of online shills tho…

Or maybe they share the sentiment that hate for Russia feels manufactured and that the narrative is used primarily to soothe the bruised ego of the defeated Democrat party.

How many of you actually buy into the Russia would never aim propaganda at opposing powers meymey?

Aim propaganda? How so? Russia doesn't exactly have a lot of pull in American mainstream media. They were definitely pushing Trump and bashing Hillary over in Russia, for obvious reasons. That doesn't mean they hacked the election or had any significant influence on the outcome. In fact, I'd wager Russia's influence was far less than all the European leaders who made a big show of shit-talking Trump and praising Hillary. But nobody's bitching about that, are they.

don't mix that bourgeois social democrat into my perfect conspiracy theory.
Just think about it. Russia, with look that they have ultimate hackers which can do whatever they want want looks strong, much stronger than the US.
With combination that they do not look very warmongering, there would be problem with morale in some NATO states if there would arise some open NATO vs Russia conflict.
I think this conspiracy theory has potential, I need to perfect it later.

Why it should be mutually exclusive?

I don't know. I'm not a GRU agent.
I've seen a story about an American warship being disabled with EW and buzzed by Russian planes posted as proof of Russian military dominance several times. I don't know if it was intended for internal or external consumption.

Isn't Russia Today airing there?

I agree.

I'm not bitching about anything.

Can't tell if retarded or joking.
The Russian elections are just as, if not more, rigged than the US elections.

I'd say nobody believes it and on top of that we're all very skeptical of CIA spooks, but there is a nervous chilling effect that's been created (very intentionally by major players like WaPo) that keeps us from being very loud about it, as a group.

Because there has been zero evidence.

As I said earlier, I see a lot of allegations and yet there's nothing ever cited to back it up. Propaganda campaigns, hackings, botnets, etc.

RT does not have much sway in the US and everyone knows it's Russian media.

How so? I have heard that a few times about them but never seen any proof for that claim.

I saw that too. What the media doesn't report is that the US does that shit to Russia all the time. Especially intruding on their airspace on a regular basis, and then throwing a fit when Russia does it to anyone else. It's a big international dick measuring contest.

Not as far as I know. I've seen some RT links posted on other sites, but it's not at all in the mainstream media.

Russia most certainly did want Trump to win, especially when Hillary was threatening enforcing a no-fly zone over Syria at the end there, which is huge. Russia is allied with Syria and if the US forced Russia to back down on helping a Russian ally, then it would do huge damage to Russia diplomatic position. So it was basically a lose-lose for Russia, either go to war with the US or capitulate and lose all influence allowing the US to snap up Russian allies. So yeah, they were definitely rooting pretty hard for Trump. But there is no evidence at all to suggest they influence the American election, despite what the media loves to imply they have zero evidence for any of their claims.

I meant it as an example of Russian propaganda, because the story is a fabrication.

The focus of RT is a little odd because it seems to be suggesting that foreign countries should not be allowed to have an international newspaper– that having one alone is an act of aggression.

As far as I can tell, since my parents are massive consumers of Russian propaganda, it tends to be aimed at people who are distrustful of the US and are desperate for facts that corroborate their worldview. This is then mixed with some bullshit and people project their own worldview onto the propaganda. In other words, if it's critical of America, it must be true, only Trump can save us from a nuclear war with Russia, and so on.

Like, the idea that Sputnik, RT, Zerohedge, or whatever are also spouting a party line apparently does not enter into their brains because they view Russia as an anti-imperialist hero out to destroy the evil United States like Twitter tankies. So basically, projection.

Kill me.

What do you consider a reliable news source? Al Jazeera?

You try to teach the Rusky feudalism and you get brutal Tsars. You try to teach the Rusky socialism and you get Stalin. You try to teach the Rusky liberal democracy and you get an oligarchic mafia state and Putinism. Every form of governance ends up more brutal and inhuman when attempted by the Rusky.

Unruhe.

theguardian.com/world/2012/mar/05/russian-election-skewed-putin-favour
Can provide more sources upon request.

That's what you get when you mix vikings and Asians.

No news source when it comes to foreign affairs is "reliable", all of them have an ideology or worldview that they're trying to push. It's only useful for knowing what the ruling class is telling itself or trying to convince the masses of. How do I know that a given news item about some foreign country isn't totally made up? Furthermore, suppose I read a source that contradicts the mainstream news source. How do I know it isn't an intel op by some other countries' government agency? Anything is possible, in theory.

(checked)
Well said.

Well, if you consume only Sputnik and RT, then it's certain you'd think whatever Russian media tells you.

But the average American doesn't consume those sources. Unless FOX, CNN, MSNBC, WaPo, NYT, and other western media outlets are all secret mind control apparatuses for Putin.

Well, suppose I read X in CNN and the opposite of X in RT. Which one is true? Or could neither be true? Both have "sources" demonstrating their reporting is accurate.

Greenwald et. al. were to right to challenge the dominant media on their extremely lax standards w/r/t Trump. He was afraid that once journalistic ethics were loosened they would stay that way– and look at us now. Everyone is going in hysterics every time some NATO ambassador stubs their toe anywhere in the world. Writing hysterical stories about Russian hacks when CSPAN has an internal routing issue after a power outage or there is a brownout in Sweden. Totally embarrassing besides everything else.

Depends on the subject at hand.

please, anything else than guardian. Source do not need to be in english.

Well since CNN no longer verifies or independently investigates their claims– both reports are coming from spooks who are just writing blackbook stories. So it comes down to which nationality you are.

MSM pundits were, and still are, calling Trump an evil fascist while Hillary and the Obama administration are being handled with kids gloves.

I have no idea what would qualify as fair. Media calling Trump double Hitler? Calling him a lying, stupid, treasonous, incompetent, orange, racist, xenophobic, homophobic, sexist, woman hater, bigoted manbaby in big bold letters? Because that actually did happen.

Imagine some event happens, where CNN paints the US in a good light and RT in a negative one. Should I assume that RT is correct just because I've put on my anti-imperialist Twitter tankie goggles and see American intelligence agencies behind everything? No, this is exactly how people fall into the trap of believing Russian propaganda. It is as says, it is all just spooks writing narratives to be delivered to the masses, so don't take it too seriously.

theatlantic.com/international/archive/2013/10/russias-online-comment-propaganda-army/280432/

Again, Western media blaming Russia like Holla Forums blames the Jews doesn't mean Russia don't use propaganda.
There is no all powerful evil secret organization on one side and the good guys who dindu nuffin on the other. Every side can, and must do shady shit when they're interested in power.

You seem keen to call out Russian propaganda but not so quick to call out CNN and their ilk.

I'm referring to Greenwald, who criticized the media for running anti-Trump stories without verifying them as true.

My bad.

I don't think Putin is behind this one.

CNN is American propaganda. Almost everyone knows this except hysterical centrist libs. RT is Russian propaganda. I just think Russian propaganda is more interesting, because it's so effective at getting people who are nominally suspicious of America fully onboard with Putin's Russia as a downtrodden good guy of world affairs.

American propaganda is sort of boring, too. It seems to me that American propaganda relies on spin and strategic omission, whereas Russian propaganda freely mixes truth and bullshit and lets the reader project their worldview onto it.

I've read a little bit about that, and you're right that the Russian propaganda strategy differs from the American one. The Kremlin will often put out multiple accounts and explanations for the same event through their various outlets that often conflict with one another, making it hard to discern the truth. While American propaganda relies heavily on controlling the entire media narrative.

Lately I´ve enjoyed the articles posted by The Intercept, fucking liberals should read a couple of their latest articles to see what fuck Obama is really about.

russian government being behind the dnc hacks seems plausible to me. they definitely wanted trump to win and there is decent circumstantial evidence. no hard proof but attribution is basically impossible for cyber attacks so that standard could never be met. i don't think it's certain or anything but i also don't understand why people seem so invested in it not having been russia.

this is a good example though not really related to Russian propaganda - a nontrivial number of leftists on Twitter will tell you that The Intercept has Pierre Omidyar pulling the strings, who is, of course, a billionaire. My understanding of this may be flawed, but there also appears to have been some sort of feud between The Intercept and The Exile or whatever it is called. Some of the writers for the latter now appear to write for Pando which is also owned/invested in by various venture capital firms and billionaires.

It serves the purpose of deligetimising Trump.
7 days left until his inauguration. What could possibly happen?

an effective transition of power has already been completed, there is no way Congress will vote to impeach if they want re-election because half the electorate will view it as a globalist coup with the aid of the intelligence agencies. Worst case scenario is President Mike Pence.

They probably hacked the DNC
but that's why we should be thanking them though imo

Putin doesn't need to rig elections to win. Presiding over possibly the greatest economic recovery in modern history will get you elected for life. Russia's economy was absolutely screwed by Yeltsin on a scale almost twice that of what the Great Depression did to the USA, and Putin fixed it in his first term.

It's entirely possible that there are uncoordinated and efforts to sway elections on a local scale or in the Duma (where Putin's party holds around 75% of the seats), but Putin himself will win any election he enters.

To the wounded liberals and democrats it does– but imo the CIA is participating in this hostility against Russia via Trump, and their motives are harder to divine. It's why we need real journlists tbh.

Putin is just as bad.

There is no way Merkel can lose the election.
Conservatives (which she leads) are first place and there is simply no way conservatives get under 30% in Germany, it's a natural law.
The party who has a chance to contest them are the socdems. The thing is, people are fed up with their shit and now they are around 20%.

So in Germany the largest party in a coalition has the right to leadership. socdems, greens and liberals (if you are NA read: libertarians) are open to a coalition with the conservatives. Together they have 63% of the votes, so a combination of them will make Merkel the new chancellor unless divine interference happens.

Also there is a chance that conservatives may go into a coalition with the right-wingers, even with Merkel, because right-wingers in Germany are extremely opportunistic, as they have proven in Hamburg 17 years ago.

The only fraction conservatives are absolutely unwilling to go into a coalition with are die Linke (they also double up as a conservative boogey man).

So if you want to prevent Merkel, you have to vote for die Linke. Every other party will become the junior partner in the coalition. Not many Germans are getting that.

The articles are indeed flawed and the bias of some of the journalists may be indeed steep. Yet I haven´t seen the big papers like the NY Times or the W. Post refute much of the data, I just saw Wonkette trying to somehow mock Greenwald´s article by mocking him instead of arguing against the substance of his piece.

It's not hard to figure out. They were told by the Obama administration to create a cudgel for the Democrats to use against the Trump administration.

The CIA's purpose is to gaslight and push psyops.

Russia and Germany are on good (ish) terms.
The main opponents of Russia are the US, the UK and most ex Warsaw Pact nations.

The old "show them the wolf and they'll run to the fox" routine doesn't seem to work as well these days.

i really wish the anti-russian propagandists are true and Putin is influenced by Dugin and is using Trump an puppet etc

German here.
This is absolutely not the case.

Germans themselves may have an understanding with Russia, but the corporate press and the establishment are toxic as fuck.

It used to be the same with Greece before they buckled in. German people had huge sympathies with the Greeks until an epic media campaign was launched. Now Schäuble is viewn as some messianic saviour which bends reality by a lot, but such is the power of the media and the servility of the Germans add a lot to that.

Russians will never forgive the West for Yeltsin.
The elections which made him president were anything but fair. Either a HUGE shy-Torrie effect is taking place or he committed fraud twice and the West approved of that, turning both blind eyes to that.

I don't care either way.

If Russia did hack, then they cost Hillary the election by showcasing things she actually said. If they didn't hack, then what? Couldn't give a fuck less.

No war but the class war.

We should never take sides in petty battles between the bourgeoisie of different nations.

Did you think this was /liberalpol/? Nobody's falling for that bullshit here.

Holla Forumslack here. We may be bitter enemies but at least you guys aren't fucking retards like mainstream liberals.

By the way the elections really were rigged but it wasn't by Russians. The Republicans have built up a very well-oiled voter suppression machine over the last couple decades. Hillary skillfully cheated Bernie out of the primary but Trump was much better at cheating in the general.

youtube.com/watch?v=3C760QhgOHg

If that were the case, why did he gain votes in the recounts? No, Trump went up against the establishment and won, although they're now rapidly working to corrupt his presidential circles. He's no god-emperor though, he's far too friendly with Israel for that.

Voter suppression isn't something that a recount will easily reconcile. Keep someone from voting and it ends there; you don't have a receipt to come back to hand-count later.

Also the "recounts" in Michigan at least weren't even real recounts. They just fed their crap through the same exploitable optical scan machines again.

Where was voter suppression practiced? I saw a lot of attempts at suppressing Trump voters but none trying to suppress Hillary voters.

of course it wasn't hacked. hardly any evidence.
if you asked people what it "russia hacking usa election" means, they won't have a damn clue
americans believe russia hacked usa but they don't even know how, what, when, etc. lol.
that is how powerful the american propaganda machine is.

Check out that video I posted, the main tool of voter suppression was a system called Interstate Crosscheck. There's a big list comprised largely of non-white names (less likely to vote Republican) through which officials invalidate votes for double voting when the first and last names match. If your nave is Jose Garcia you've been accused in voting in 27 different states for instance. According to Greg Palast, significant voter suppression happened in places such as Detroit, Flint, Philadelphia, and Dayton.

fucking lost the get fuck

Remember when some strange reports by some "computer experts" appeared that Trump may have cheated in Wisconsin, Michigan and Philadelphia?

How did they knew this? Easy, because they cheated and still lost. The only logical explanation was that Trump cheated there as well. That's why the Clinton camp didn't push for a recount.

Dr. Stein on the other smelled that something was wrong. And don't blame her for pushing said recount, because through this she got more publicity than the entire election season.

She even did Trump (and indirectly Sanders) a favour by revealing that in some Detroit district the same votes were counted up to six times. Detroit is Clinton's turf, but it is very shameless how she treated the presidential election as if it was the Democratic primaries.

who got it?

You guys still haven´t figured out how to rig an election? I´m truly dissapointed at you! Russia, lol

I'm not sure what you're referring to explicitly but one such expert was a statistician by the name of Richard Charnin and he was just as critical about the exit poll discrepancies revealing Clinton's apparent election fraud during the Democratic primary as he was about them revealing election fraud during the general. The real reason Clinton didn't push for a recount is that it might have drawn attention to what happened in the primary.

You can't invalidate votes. Votes have no voter data attached. You can invalidate voter registrations, but this would be done months ahead of time and someone would be pointing it out then rather than after the election was lost.
Why would cities that are 80-90% Dem be suppressing Dem voters by de-registering them? The only people at risk of being suppressed are the minority Rep voters.

No evidence tbh. Depending on how you run the numbers against the demographics you choose to pick you can always find anomalies. There was no widespread evidence of anomalies that couldn't be explained by other demographical features like there was with the primaries. Furthermore the fact that anonymous computer experts are saying something should give pause, anyone with something conclusive would want to attach their name to it and become famous.

Hardly. Are you implying that there are voting machines with multiple backdoors for each party to use or something? Any "cheating" is all done at a decentralized local level so the party leaderships can claim plausible deniability.

There wasn't a hack, some Berniebro hired by the DNC leaked everything to Assangel because Posadas is just a piece of shit.

RT is full of fascists, alt righters and even NeoCons.
They might try to sound "Alt-Left" like Telesur and other New Age "Socialists" but their audience is mostly Far-Right and anti-"Globalist" and pushes them into that direction.

No RT is not full fascits, did you see their article where they askedd for some Americand media to set the lies they sais about RT straigh? Why the fuck are you burgers afraid of RT?

Yep, and guess when Palast's new documentary got released.

Sounds like complete bullshit

but in any case all they're really claiming isn't that "russia hacked the election," but that "russia hacked the DNC emails," which essentially is only giving voters access to the knowledge that clinton and the dnc were corrupt pieces of shit, and if they didn't want people to know about the bad things they did they shouldn't have done bad things

Sorry for the late reply, but here's a couple more sources:
nytimes.com/2012/03/06/world/europe/observers-detail-flaws-in-russian-election.html
slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/foreigners/2012/03/russian_prime_minister_vladimir_putin_has_rigged_the_country_s_elections_to_guarantee_he_will_win.html
google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/world/russians-voting--and-watching/2012/03/04/gIQA3j6CqR_story.html
news.com.au/world/europe/russian-president-vladimir-putin-returned-but-was-the-election-rigged/news-story/7aff2d18ca41b0f2486a4f8de25c064c
thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/03/04/russian-elections-is-vladimir-putin-rigging-the-vote-again.html
telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/vladimir-putin/9106101/Ballot-stuffing-vote-rigging-and-fraud-Russians-on-alert-for-tricks-that-may-help-Vladimir-Putin-win-election.html

i'm pretty sure RT are pro-black lives matter
does this mean BLM are Russian spies trying to undermine our police force?

You're acting like

are mutually exclusive statements

There's literally no reason they can't both be true, and looking at the evidence I think they both are.

Yeah sorry i am not brainwashed by your Russian propaganda to defend Russia against my home

Sorry Pootin, some people online have brain and are not desperate to be accepted by your torture chamber so you can brainwash them by calling them smart

Liberal tears are best tears.

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Мы проводим свою страну в настоящее время. Расстроиться?

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lol

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We got some neolib r-tards here

What about the eastern neoliberal powers?

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You can't even post examples of your crackpot theory. You're a completely deluded Clintonite.

You believe the russian propaganda with no proof and just online memes, you have far too little credibility, especially since most of you dot think and just jump to the conclusions your russian master's give you.

Russia knows they are irrelevant and worthless and are trying to get attention

Post evidence, Clintonite.

Sorry you are the ones who are posting anti west propaganda trying to get dumb americans to become anti west

Sure pal.

Yeah might have to try harder

You mean Democrats, who are the primary peddlers of this false story. You do realize you're a partisan pawn when you irrationally defend this flimsy narrative, right?

The only people who believe Russia is out to get them are sore loser Clintonites. Anyone with a triple digit Autism Level can poke holes in this story by simply asking for evidence, which is NOT a controversial thing to do.

There's no doubt Russia thinks chaos in the United States is beneficial for them, but I doubt they actually ever got close to tampering with the election. I'm almost certain they shilled for Trump online, though.

And anyone with a brain can also see it, it is basic information manipulation, spread bots to easily push for anti west posts, news real or not, spread anti west stories to destabilize the trust and use places like chans to spread propaganda because they are filled with desperate collectivist who have nothing to be proud of as individuals so they are desperate to be accepted as a part of a group or board and blindly follow le board's beliefs.

Holla Forums is literally the perfect target to brainwash morons who ll go there and "is x degenerate, is x bad" and then use those brainwashed morons to spread your propaganda for free.

Sorry to break it to you but the only people not buying that is brainwashed online babies

Of course fucking not, nobody is suggesting the elections were hacked directly

They were simply shilling for Trump, pushing for anti hillary anti liberal news real or fake.

They didnt shill as much for Trump than they shilled anti hillary and anti establishment, and with the whole dnc scandal they used it to influence the elections inderectly, the real question is how much have the elections been influenced and we can never really know that, also that fbi faggot commey did affect the elections slightly but again, we dont know how much that shit affects the dumb masses

Genuinely curious, what would you consider to be a legitimate news source then?

Of course, Hillary was talking about a hot war with Russia. It was in their self-interest to advocate for a candidate who wanted warmer relations.

…which contains no evidence. Why are you pushing neolib and neocon narratives? Next you'll say the CIA is a bastion of truth and honesty.

Sorry m8, but the IC is far more credible than a shady community in a shady side repeating about how all of west is lies and they only know the truth who just happens to be anti west lol

Maybe you should try to shill harder, get more of your bot friends to drown me in negative comments so it can look like all people here are brainwashed and agree with you.

And Iraq totally has WMDs. How utterly sad and predictable of you.

Which really makes me realize that you are just a brainwashed drone and not Russian cyber agency because anyone who knows even a little about the intelligence communities knows that information isnt always hard absolute facts like Holla Forums tries to feed you and instead are pieces of information that conclude to a probable statement and depending on the information level they know how trustworthy it is.

So maybe you should get out of the internet and get a real job before starting thinking absolute facts is something you fall onto every single day, oh and btw someone telling you something online isnt an absolute fact either ;^)

I must say, you're fulfilling your role as a neoliberal peon very well. Lots of huffing and puffing, but zero substance and evidence to back up your claims.

Now call me unpatriotic for questioning the CIA and its unreasonable calls for war against another country. Become the mirror image of the conservative of the 2000's.

You are the one who is supposed to bring evidence about how evil le western establishment is and why anyone should trust you, and all you got is just memes or circumstantial twisted cases only seen through a particular lense to profit you.

It is like saying i should trust a random stranger more than my boyfriend and telling me i have no evidence my boyfriend is trustworthy, you are the one who is supposed to show real proof and by real proof i mean real, not twisted overly specific examples that somehow imply the entire system is evil and corrupt

And if anything YOU are the suspicious one because what you say PROFITS a FOREIGN GOVERNMENT

Now drive a scooter, wave an American flag and call me a traitor, Democrat. Complete your transformation.

You should have stayed banned FBI-shill.

Intelligence services work under the executive branch and are loyal to the president. If they say something without proof, it's fair to assume they are using their influence to back up the president's position rather than because something is necessarily true. Instances in which the CIA has lied, broken the law, and deceived the public and the other branches of government to advance their agenda include: The Vietnam war, The Iraq war, MK ULTRA, the torture report, and others.

Furthermore anyone remotely knowledgeable about hacking knows that its very hard to pin down who actually hacked something because the source could be going through a proxy. "I'm behind seven proxies" is literally a meme almost a decade old. You can't know if a computer is a proxy or the actual source unless you are able to directly inspect it and/or the traffic logs. The CIA clearly didn't do this, they saw a Russian IP and decided that blaming Russia was in their interests. Logic states that anyone trying to hack the DNC would also want to frame someone that was convenient for them and not their own nation, so the fact that the CIA is assuming Russia is in fact falling into the hands of whoever hacked the DNC.

If the DNC was even hacked. We now know that the CIA and other intelligence services never even inspected the DNC systems. The inspection was done by a third party hired by, get this, the DNC, and the the intelligence community simply took them at face value. There is very little trustworthiness here, the DNC is already known to be corrupt so why assume that they wouldn't hire someone to push their own propaganda once again?

Once again you have no idea how intelligence agencies work if you believe intelligence is often based on conclusive proof about everything.

Maybe you also think that intelligence gets their proof with a super spy under Putin's desk recording whatever he says too, might need to watch less movies.

Short sighted examples through the lens of an ignorant civilian with no idea why they made such calls, you have no proof or knowledge about that but you just use the "OMG DEY LIED, DEY BAD PEOPLE" and are not even casting doubt, you are literally trying to suggest that the entire intelligence community is under some l33t conspiracy and lying is their main job as if there arent regulations that need to be followed or arent accountable to their actions.

You are literally trying to make simpletons believe the world is simple, which is the furthest thing from the TRUTH, you are literally saying what i SAID YOU WOULD aka "they did X bad thing, that makes them terrible people, we dont need to analyze the case, we should just paint them all as evil lying corrupt people and not question or ask anything".

The line of thinking works only on simpletons, that is why most of congress hasnt bought your "Russia dindu" story

Once again going through he simpleton's strategy, find the most simplistic and basic thing that everyone knows is wrong and suggest the entire case was dependent upon this overly simplistic thing because people who work there are complete morons and jump to conclusions on the smallest of pieces of information like your brainwashed simpletons.

The whole leak clearly benefited some country, and that country was also in charge of other cyber anti west activities and also had similar behavior in the past, but i guess that doesnt mean tehy are the ones who most likely did it, it has to be that 14 year old who is bored and conveniently did that. which of course might be true but the chances of that happening when russia has a cyber division dedicated on spreading anti west propaganda is incredibly small.

So maybe you should learn how the real world works instead of trying to simplify things to make it easier for the brainwashed simpletons to follow your propaganda

So much babbling to say nothing.

Sorry, the world isnt a simple place where your simplistic 3rd grade "arguments" are taken as fact, because there are many layers, sides and details on each subject yet you think you can generalize everyone based on one situational event without even analyzing it

Though tbh, racism acts in the same way, generalize about entire groups of people because of a few specific cases, maybe that is why the right wing is often far more simplistic and out of touch with reality with liberals try to be more realistic, psychologically literate and knowledgeable instead of spewing simple generalizations

Did we summon this idiot through [email protected]/* */? Have we made a terrible mistake?

Tell me, why didn't the US invoke the "Treaty with Russia on Mutual Legal Assistance in Criminal Matters" congress.gov/treaty-document/106th-congress/22/document-text

This falls under that treaty and legally Russia would be required to comply and hand over information relating to the case. If they were innocent they would have no reason not to, and if they refused then it could be taken as evidence of the Russian government's involvement in the case.

No one demanded conclusive proof, but any evidence at all would be a good start.

It's almost like when you lie people stop believing you unless you have evidence to back up your assertions.

China?
North Korea?
Iran?
ISIS?
How do we even know that it was a country? It sure benefited the Republican party and every other similarly ideologically aligned party.
How do we even know it wasn't a single person? It clearly benefits any third world hacker if they can get some secrets and auction them off for 10x the average yearly salary in their country. There's millions of people in this situation with the capability to hack the ridiculously weak security that the DNC had.

Maybe you should make the propaganda less obvious

Oh yeah lol cuz i am also the president of the US and know about major US decisions because i totes being in that table to know all the details and facts

And guess what, you were not there EITHER, but you are trying to push your propaganda as "real proof" when in reality you have nothing but a manipulated speculation to profit Russia and anti west forces

Sorry unlike most humans i have the realistic gut to admit i dont know a few things instead of make up bullshit, just like most cucks instead of admitting they dont know they ll use religion as an answer to some questions they dont know the answer to ;^)

Once again you are pushing for propaganda with this whole "pro russians are all about proof, look at my meme at the OP XD" while in reality you are the one who has given no proof about his statements, but you believe just like Trump that you can repeat it enough and that will make it real.

maybe you should try going back to Holla Forums where simpletons live and will fall for that attitude

Once again using the simpleton's logic. "Look dere are many countries who try to hack us guys, that means we dont know who did it even though we know a very big part of the online propaganda is driven by Russia, but who knows, it might ahve been Iran all of the sudden"
Once again using the simpleton's logic "We cant be 100% sure it wasnt a 14 year old randomly deciding to play with the elections, we cant blame poor russia without 100% proof, russia dindu"

All the signs point to Russia, but i guess you just want to use simplistic Holla Forums tier arguments in Holla Forums to brainwash more people with your anti west propaganda, which makes what the IC report suggested even more realistic since you are pushing for it hardcore

Which ones?

wew the CIA's really lost the plot

So was involved in the hacking, voter suppression, and election fraud used to systematically deny Bernie Sanders the nomination in the Democratic primary too? How do you know PUTIN didn't prefer Clinton? She's been friends with Trump for decades you know.

I dunno, maybe that report you believe it is a lie, and how all the congress, democrats and republicans and even the nominated nsa director who were exposed to the classified version also agree that it was russia.

Oh wait, they are all liars lol xDdDdDd

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, I'm afraid. Especially so when the people making the claims have a history of crying wolf.

democracynow.org/2017/1/6/greenwald_us_intel_chiefs_alleging_russian

You are confused, i am not a brainless Holla Forumstard m8 you seem to be in the wrong place since such non arguments only work on simpleton Holla Forumstards.

And you still have given no proof or evidence as to why the total IC report is false and how all the members of congress who believe it after seeing the classified version both republicans and democrats agree with it.

You are the one making the claim that all of these people are false and how a pro russian guy on the internet is somehow more credible, you are the suspicious one here m8, you are the one who is supposed to do the work

all of them looks like bullshit opinions tbh. Some of them link to sources like osce.org/odihr/88667 which shows that only "rigging" is that Putin have much more space to spread his propaganda, there is no proof of direct rigging. Seem like russians just love strong, charismatic leaders. Pretty normal bourgeois democracy.

You keep using this phrase as if you think because there's bipartisan consent in Congress, we must accept it as true. As far as I and most other posters on this board are concerned, both of those parties have ideological reasons to oppose Russia, and I think everybody should know by now that regardless of the nature of the classified materials, it doesn't matter what is shown to them, they will push the agenda of American capital.

Have you even read the "report" you're referring to? They don't do a single thing to substantiate hacking. All they do is blubber for several pages about hired trolls (with no evidence) and Russia Today programs (one of which was ended a year before campaigning even began).

Remember when those members of congress agreed that the Gulf of Tonkin incident was enough to start the war in Vietnam? Remember when those members of congress agreed there was convincing enough evidence of weapons of mass destruction to destroy Iraq?

+15
Ignore the thread guys. It's by midless olgino bots.
P.S. Volodyn Dolbit

Says the suspicious individual rabidly defending the honor of imperialist spy agencies.