So what makes a good final boss? A simple question everyone can discuss

So what makes a good final boss? A simple question everyone can discuss.

A fight that tests everything the player has learned through the course of the game. It should be a puzzle itself, while also being a bit of a bulletsponge to ensure that the player has truly mastered it.

See: Undertale

Prove me wrong.
It provides closure to the game and has book ends and running themes through the game

The gay goat and photoshop flower were still mediocre, though. The former was simply gay and edgy in a bad way, the latter was great visually and thematically but holy shit both of these have a fatal flaw, the player's health hesitates to go down when it's low enough because the game wants to take it easy on you, and that alone removes all tension and fun.

Not to sound like an emotional faggot, but seeing the true ending the first time was … I admit to crying like a bitch for some reason.

A good soundtrack.

Has to feel unique to every other boss while being quite challenging. The soundtrack choice and scenery can also make or break the atmosphere of the final boss fight.

It has a hell of a punch the first time you see it but afterwards if you think about the writing you start to realize Asriel came absolutely out of nowhere before the tapes in Dr. "Alphys" Mengele's lab and that one flashback in Waterfall that didn't have any explanation, there's not much reason to care for him in particular (especially after shitting all over you in a great many ways as Flowey), and given he went crazy after a time and went all omnicidal in the first place there's nothing guaranteeing he won't go down exactly the same path now that he's an emotionless flower again and has smashed the barrier.

The way the character handled the final boss was fun, though, considering he had a catastrophic amount of power and decided to exert it via a twelve-year-old's Kingdom Hearts OC because that's exactly what he was, a twelve-year-old. Flowey via the photoshop fight was fantastic and the only shred of difficulty the game had, but like you mention it's heavily negated by the scaling HP reduction the closer you get to death. You can die in that, but you practically need to misstep.

THESE

This is the correct answer.
I'm a fan of the multi-part finale, with the epic build-up of the "climb the tower" of OoT with a gauntlet of tough enemies, followed by a boss fight, followed by the mad flight, followed by the real final boss fight.
Super Metroid also did it really well, with the excellent descent in to Tourian with the foreshadowing and reintroduction of Baby, the two part Mother Brain boss fight, and the final escape while fucking super powered and that awesome soundtrack blasting away.
The first Halo also did some of this, but lacked a real boss (I don't count throwing grenades in to the exhaust vents as a boss fight).

This but it also should be aesthetically and thematically striking.
So far Vergil from DMC3 is the pinnacle of video game last bosses. Music, story, build up, fight mechanics, everything about him was perfect. Nothing comes close really.
DS3 final boss was decent in this regard, but only if you played at least DS1 and 2 to completion.
Dracula from SOTN was ok, but was easily cheesable just like the rest of the game.
Automata's last bosses in all routes were disappointments except for Emil, and that is considered hidden super boss which is different thing entirely.


Undershit is not a video game.

It's more of a VN, really. Except VNs are allowed on Holla Forums.

a giant metal cobra….

These are all excellent answers, and there isn't much that can be added. I guess one could say that the final boss is better if he is a giant(God from Bayonetta) or if he has the same abilities as the player(Vergil from DMC) or if he has multiple forms(most final bosses from Final Fantasy), but this a subjective, rather than an objective analysis of what makes a good final boss. With that said, I do believe that the final boss should have some build-up to him(ex: characters talk about him, your friend/family was killed fighting him, he is the literal boss of all the enemies you fight and so on) and it also needs to be intimidating so you know that he is tough shit. A good way of making the boss intimidating, is that he faces you at the beginning or the middle of the game and either he defeats you and a cut scene starts where you are saved or run away, or you just run away, though if you do manage to defeat him, it should be a game-over with an alternative good ending. Having the boss run away after you chop some of it's HP down makes him look like a wuss, and not as a real threat. Bosses that you have to run from can also work, a good example being the Dahaka from Prince of Persia 2. He is immune to all your weapons(except for a special sword you get for collecingt all the HP upgrades), he instantly kills you with his tentacles, he can't be reasoned with, and the atmosphere changes the closer you are to him(embeded related).

There are two main factors that make a final boss worthwhile, and they're pretty simple.

This fight should actually mean something outside of a win state; whether it be the resolution of a character arc, the confrontation of the prominent antagonist, or the last struggle to lay a conflict to rest. Good examples of this are The Elite Four and Vergil.

Whether the genre is action or puzzle, a final boss should challenge a player's complete mastery of the game's toolkit; even going as far to have individual segments dedicated to the use of different mechanics introduced throughout the game. Good examples of this can be found in the Megaman and LoZ franchises.

Without narrative stakes, the game becomes a lackluster experience with a hamfisted damage sponge gating the credits off or a disappointing and jarring end to content as the plot resolves itself. Note that this doesn't mean a game has to be narrative heavy, but even something as simple as the very personality-driven Shao Kahn's threatening of Earthrealm can make due.
Without the game challenging your mastery of the game, you're left with a lack of satisfaction to the final conclusion of your journey; if that last encounter fails to challenge you or tie into a larger design, it can retroactively invalidates the experiences leading up to it.

Some games can make ends meet by heavily favoring one or the other; Dark Souls is a great example of this if you didn't suck at it: Gwyn is an exceptionally easy boss if you've been picking up what the game puts down, in fact he's routinely beaten on player's first attempts if they've mastered the Parrying mechanic before this point. What makes Gwyn a memorable fight is the ambiance and thematic shroud of the fight, where you stamp out the flickering ember of The Age of Fire as it stumbles and clumsily strikes at you. The Lord of Cinder is withered and forgotten, and he isn't so much a challenge to you as he is a mercy killing; but this doesn't keep his death from fufilling players' sense of achievement, instead Dark Souls uses this moment to prescribe the relief and pride of overcoming that challenge to the journey that Gwyn's death punctuates.

Not if it completely changes the mechanics or otherwise limits them. In God Hand's Azel was a better final boss than Angra, because Azel was the same as you, making for the best fight in the game. But Angra was giant, so he was immune to a lot of the things that made the combat really fun. Being double god hand was nice, though.

As I said, it's a more subjective thing, but you are right, it also depends on the type of game, imagine playing an action game such as DMC or Bayonetta and the final boss is a sliding puzzle or worse a tower of hanoi puzzle, however giant bosses can be better than enemies who have the same abilities as you, and that would be generic FPS games, since all the enemies have the same abilities as you have, so fighting a giant mecha for instance could be better, if not it would at least be a breath of fresh air.

Mark was a mistake

holy shit looking back on so many shit "bosses"

portal- puzzle game with some hacked on "combat" puzzle that fit no where on the game portal 2 pulled the same shit.
red faction gorrila- just kill a dude in a tank
FTL- was intresting but sheet just had to spend the game building your shit up to the point of beating it FOR THE WHOLE GAME
The witcher 2 - SURPRISE DRAGON nah you don't need prep work like half of the major shit you do it kicked your ass in the beginning but now you are level 30 so we will let you fight it. but god forbid you deal with a wraith without a talisman
TW3- lets have 2 final boss fights, like why did we go to kar morhen in the first place? & all the ceri play where you don't affect anything just shy of watch a cut seen. also she dies if you don't pat her head enough. (the real final boss)
crysis 2- final boss is you getting killed by your suit in a cut seen
hotline miami- i won by pure fucking luck after 30 fucking tries
borderlands 1- you opened the vault no shoot it in the eye also you don't get shit. worst treasure hunt ever.
borderlands 2- why doesn't he just use the "respawn" serves his company owns and why is he there it makes no fucking seance. and why does he give a fuck about where he mines shit to the point of wanting to genocide the locals.
DS1- not a boss you don't build up to it. it plays like nothing else in the game. you can just parry it. i mean fuck. you can bring friends. he is a big guy for you.
DS2 did not play
DS3- he swaps move sets constantly seems to be what the player could be, a true reflection/ antihero a final obstacle and a dreadful warning. or a final god to kill.

i mean all and all you got to mix the narrative or at least theme from the gameplay and half the time you get some unholy abomination that should not be. where the writers clearly got in a pissy fit over muh story and where forced to write a "FINAL BOSS" that most games don't need. from a storytelling perspective or worse where the game has no way of having a boss fight because, idk its a FUCKING puzzle game? but nah games have bosses at the end we better add one. minecraft. the abandonment of games as games and pushing muh narrative theme boss that may or may not belong. we usually get the mechanical gamplay climaxes mired with some fucking narrative dump of hot shit. rather than a final boss.

This.

lol gay

aside from sans, the final bosses in undertale were mostly cinematic, they could have been cool but the game just forgave you for sucking.
granted, i was busy bawling my eyes out at the god of megadeath fight and wouldnt have been able to give it my all.

Here my take on epic boss fight

Gehrman was better than any of the souls final bosses, IMO. He was just like most of the hunter/npc fights in that he didn't have too many over the top abilities, save for a few moves, like his high jump slash. I think he was actually slower than them, when he wasn't actively attacking, due to his peg leg. If you're far away you can actually see him limp a bit and hear labored breathing as he walks to close the distance.

Do you even final boss Holla Forums ?!

1. BUY 24 EGGS
2. FUCK EVERY EGG
3. BURN ALL THE FUCKING EGGS

You should feel drained after beating it.

It was really nice reference to 1st game but fight hardly drained you. I wish they used invaders for it. Or at least made final passage longer so you are invaded more often.

Emotional impact. Gwyn is a shit boss mechanically but people still remember him for his role in the story and the implication of his death.

Only if cutscene is skippable in case you die. Fuck the shadow queen in Thousand Year Door.

To be fair, DS1's final boss was pretty good thematically.
Gwyn, the guy who pretty much built the entire kingdom from the ground up and led the war against the dragons being in such a withered and pathetic state reflected the rotting world of DS1 pretty well.
I'm pretty convinced it wasn't supposed to be hard, what with parrying him being an option.

An exhibition fight. A good final boss is a boss where fighting it is its own reward. Senator Armstrong is a great one; he's not particularly difficult, but he's flashy, exciting, and over the top; you can fight him over and over and over and it's still entertaining, it's a fight that rewards YOU for playing the game, rather than punishing you just so you can be a neckbeard and brag about being a TRUE GAYMER because you play only shitty games designed from the ground up to be nothing but exercises in trial-and-error and boss fight memorization.

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The flashy parts were exactly the most bullshit parts of Revengeance
The most fun part of the game was fighting entirely using defensive offensive, which became less and less viable with each boss fight due to forced mechanics

THEIR FINAL FORM MUST BE HUMANOID.

I'd say a necessary condition is to fight the final boss.

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It should
a) be relevant to the story / world
b) be built up and foreshadowed through the entire game
c) have multiple phases
d) require use of all techniques and core gameplay elements in the game
e) have good music

I want to scale Mt Everest, have no regrets and know I've earned it. So, a good final boss should put every skill acquired over the course of the game to its absolute limit. The win must demand and reflect mastery, without cheapness or distracting gimmicks.

One that I can stroke my e-peen to impress the other cool kids online.

Yes and No.

One of the things Undertale did really well was have final boss fights that felt like the game was taking things up to 11 it certainly had some goat boss fights. And really if you want to have a final boss fight that makes a good impression you need to fucking make sure to give the player that "shit just got real" feeling that Undertale does.

But as said Sans was the only final boss that could actually be considered a boss fight (it did good job at trolling the player with it's difficulty, helping to spawn the game's biggest meme). Both Asriel and Nightmare Flowey did that thing where your progress would be saved everytime you died meaning there was no actual challenge being posed at you. Only difference being that with Flowey the game was trying to hide this and trick you into thinking the game had gotten impossibly hard while Asriel stops pretending that there is any challenge and instead tries to make you feel unstoppable.

MULTIPLE FORMS
ULTIPLE FORMS
LTIPLE FORMS
TIPLE FORMS
IPLE FORMS
PLE FORMS
LE FORMS
E FORMS
FORMS
ORMS
RMS
MS
S

Charkravartin from Asura's Wrath is my favorite final boss, like undermeme, it's as good as it is due to themeatic execution and playing with your expectations (like Asreil or whatever the fuck his name is, he has a lot of 4th wall breaking stuff with the UI and QTE'e) rather then actually feeling rewarding to beat due to gameplay mastery.

But then again, Asura's Wrath is really more of an interactive anime then a game proper anyways

I'd say there a two things that can make a good final boss, both of which probably have been brought up in the thread already.

I should specify neither of those webms showcase the particular things that makes him cool, because I don't want to spoil them.

I feel like a good "final boss" doesn't necessarily have to be a confrontation between the player and a character. In Mario games, the final level itself is usually more of the "boss" than Bowser, since it's a taxing test of your skill at platforming. The final unlockable levels of each game, like Grandmaster Galaxy and Champion's Road, are also worth mentioning here, since they're focused on giving a well-rounded "final exam" composed of all the different obstacles that the player encounters.

Bowser using the double cherries and the cat bell power up was pretty fucking epic though. The race to the top for the POW block was quite fun. It's a pity the game was designed as a four player thing, since unless there are four players to face off against the four bowsers it sort of loses its thematic appeal.

I never cared for this game, does it have any gameplay at all? This looks like total garbage, to be honest.

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It does have gameplay but it's pretty shallow. Essentially, half of the actual gameplay is rail shooting, the other half is third person action. But there's a ton of QTE's and cutscenes intermixed.

If you want a mechanically satisifying game you'll be dissapointed but if you can just apperciate it as an anime that you interact with rather then a game proper it's a fuck ton of fun. The missions are even called episodes, with "next time on" previews and mid episode commercial bumper breaks, it's really obvious what they were going for.

Honestly, I'd just watch it on youtube and fully treat it as an anime, but you do lose out on some of the fun that way.

You, but better. See: Vergil, the Shadowlord

well this was a short thread

Man I've been saying this shit for years. People always overlook gauntlet style endings. Shit like the Halo series vehicle escapes, or the parkour chase in Dying Light. Though the fact that DL had a major antagonist who you take out in QTEs probably overshadowed that example.

it's not a game because it's propaganda, has no challenge or game mechanics, and exists to propagate a pro-diversity narrative.

forgot your redtext

typical

They are soundless because the footage it's from had commentary.

you're more pathetic than I thought

It's a computer RPG that isn't a traditional Roguelike, that's all that needs to be said, it's a piece of shit and like all non-T. Roguelike RPGs its boring, gay trash designed to appeal to people who don't play video games, can not find enjoyment in video games, hate anything they deem "video gamey" but still want to associate themselves with video games so as to maintain their gaymur cred and nerd chic. They play these games for the fucking storytelling, and accept the fact that the gameplay is awful 100% of the time. RPGs are the surefire way to deliver propaganda, with teenage level philosophy and young adult-tier storytelling. Is it any wonder why Bioware and Obsidian, these two big RPG developers are the way they are? How about tabletop games, plenty of infestation there. RPGs are the SJW genre of choice, you can't deliver their tier of faggotry so well in any other way while having a select few fucking idiots who call it anything other than what it is: trash, shitty propaganda, and fucking junk.

wew

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Sans and Undyne were better bosses than the normal bosses because they were an actual challenge
The flower and goat felt more like scripted movies than a actual fight
I could never do a genocide run because I didn't want to hurt Papyrus, he's too innocent

Yes. Have you ever played an RPG before? They're all shit as games, because they're not designed to be games, they're the second type of "experience". The first being the Text Adventure, which I'm sure will make a comeback, if it already hasn't with Twine "games".

RPGs usually at least try to have a challenge and usually take effort to make. Memeshit is the vidya equivalent of modern communist "art"

Go suck Stalin's dick more KIKE

Nowhere in my post did I mention anything about Communism or Stalin. I fail to see your argument. RPGs don't take effort: New Vegas was made in a single year but RPG fanatics love the shit out of it and all its fag and dyke characters, all its black and white morality, and all of its shit gameplay. You're a fucking cuckold if you actually like RPGs.

If you're like undertale you're a fucking communist, plain and simple.
It's communist propaganda.

RPGs are shit though I agree on that level, and Fallout isn't even an RPG after 2. NV was just a bit of a return to form that got all the hipster-chicks wet.

Nowhere in my posts did I say I liked that fucking RPG. It's like every other RPG, fucking dogshit. There is not a single good RPG that isn't a Traditional Roguelike in the likes of Angband, Nethack, Rogue and so on.

Okay cool, I'm just being hostile m8. Glad you like Nethack though.

ff5 has good gameplay if you limit yourself to only certain classes the way the game intended instead of grinding like a tard, because each boss turns into a puzzle of using your abilities and equipment to negate or downplay his major abilities, ie using coral rings to survive the first turn against shinryu, or relying on a heavy armor class blocking with an aegis shield, or having one of several casting classes remove his ability to cast tidal wave via berserk, etc

oh and no there's no way to grind to a high enough level to kill him before he casts it or to get enough hp to survive it. cannot be done.

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Not because I watch let's play, but because the videos of that fight on youtube that had the best video quality were from a let's play

I'm an autistic qualitywhore when it comes to video quality, i'll admit, but i'm not a faggot.

The final boss fight I mentioned in >>12258245is both those things.

The battle theme is a mix of the game's main theme and the battle arena takes place inside a black hole.

My favorite is when these bosses have multiple phases because it gives a climatic feel. That's the important thing for a final boss, it needs to feel climatic. Also good music is a necessity. Music is a good tool to guide what you feel. And what better way to feel pumped up is if the music you're playing in the climax is grand and climatic as hell.

From a gameplay perspective, the final boss should be the hardest non-optional boss fight in the game. It's meant to put the player's skills to the test after going through the entire game. It's pretty much the "final exam". It could be a logical progression from the rest of the game's mechanics, one that incorporates all of the elements from throughout the game, or be unique in some way.
Narratively speaking, it should be the resolution of the plot and/or themes, and should be heavily built up or foreshadowed. It's important to nail the atmosphere and tone, as it will end up being the thing that defines the rest of the game.

Gwyn is obviously a good example, as he represents a final test of skill (he's pretty hard if you aren't overleveled or parry him like a bitch would), and he sums up the themes of the game. The idea of a once-great thing reduced to a hollowed husk of its former glory, complete with a sad piano.
As for Undertale as previously mentioned, I side with matthewmatosis in that I think Flowey is a much better final boss than Asriel. The whole game is about how everybody is nice and a good person, so you shouldn't fight them just because they're in your way. So what do you do when faced with someone who is actually 100% evil, with literally no good intentions? You kick his ass and spare him, even if he is an omnicidal psychopath. He's so baffled by the fact that you would even show mercy to someone as contemptable as him that it defeats him internally. Asriel just reduces it to a generic, sappy "good boy dindunuffin" backstory. Neither were very hard, either.
Sans was better because he breaks the 4th wall in a more clever way than Flowey just saying shit like "I saved my game!" and "You're just playing a game!" instead, Sans manipulates previously untouched variables from the perspective of inside the game, but without seeming like he's some cheeky author insert nudging you and going "you're playing a video game haha"
He's also proper difficult compared to the other two pushovers.

Crying like a little bitch is a sign of a good boss.

now that is bad writing. a true bastard would use any chance he gets to win.

What's even dumber is that Flowey wants to kill you so he can take your soul and become a true god. Yet he keeps bringing you back to life every time you lose, so this can never actually happen.

It's better than a generic "misunderstood/tortured child" sob story. It's at least thematically related to the game.
Undertale isn't exactly a well-written game.

That's not Flowey's doing, though, that's yours. Determination lets you keep coming back as often as you want: Flowey just knows this and is prepared to run the gauntlet.

Wholly agreed that Flowey feels like a much better finale than Asriel. The true pacifist part feels more rushed to the more i think of it. It needed more to happen in the Core and New Home to help build up the new ending, IMO.

Boss fights are utter cancer. Just give me a good challenging final level, like Tony Vercetti's last stand, GTA IV's final mission, and President's Run in Driver.

Gehrman was a pretty nice final boss and I liked him more than the moon presence. He wasn't one of the harder bosses but wasn't one of the easier ones either. He was challenging enough to feel like a fun fight while the narrative and theme for the fight was also pretty great.

I also really liked the Shadowlord in Nier. The fight is pretty decent, it has one of my favourite songs in the game and it's a nice climax for the entire ending segment before that point.

The final bosses of the Otogi series were pretty damn good. Ridiculous difficulty jumps, but fuck, they knew how to make it memorable. Multiple phases on both the rock part of the second game's last boss sucked though, both took place well outside the normal environment, and they were designed so you were under a soft time limit because there was no way to recover your magic during the fight. I think the first game's last boss was better, since he had that ridiculous dodge that made it almost feel like a fight with a rival.

To anybody who cares, you can watch the game instead of playing it.

I'd argue that it should effectively wrap up what plot there is, and be one of, if not THE goal the player has been striving to reach and defeat the whole time. The boss should be suitably difficult, either testing the player's skills (preferably) or testing their patience (not so preferable, but leaves it as an endurance mission to be able to see it through to the end). A nice final boss theme is always welcome and can add a lot.

Granted, there's some cases where the final boss itself can get away with being disappointingly easy, namely if it's counting as just the final step/phase of the gauntlet, so to speak (boss has become that weak, or the player character that strong, over the course of the fight), or because there's an intended lore reason. I wouldn't exactly say either of those are preferable, but they can be used to a decent effect. Just give the player either memorable bosses/phases beforehand, or provide satisfactory explanation.


I'd argue it depends on the game. Looking at something like, say, Odin Sphere Leifthrasir, killing enemies is what builds one of your resources back up, and some of the abilities that use it have large costs. If you didn't have anything besides the boss itself to kill, you'd be stuck having to make "Xtra Phozon" potions, or get creative and dump an assload of food and pop a "Naturalize" potion to convert it. The latter not exactly being something you want to do for a boss fight. As such, most, if not all the boss fights have some sort of other enemies present; whether they're actually siding with the boss, or just a free for all of everything against the player, depends on the circumstances.

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You get to bang them after defeating them.

Wasn't the one I was thinking of, but sure.

Brad did nothing wrong
Does Holla Forums like LISA?

Got very mixed feelings on it. It gets quite good towards the end, but all the shitty forced toilet humor before that (i.e. that one party member that wants to take a dump but is scared by a spider) really sour the deal.

Watching the dev behind it go into full Twitter meltdown during Trump's election was hilarious, though.

The only thing I can add is that if the final boss doesn't have the best fight music in the game, the developers fucked up.

lisa the painful was fantastic, had a ton of fun playing that. Lisa the joyful was a fucking abomination, dingaling needs to release a public apology and offer a refund for that pile of trite.

I don't really give a shit about ding losing his shit, I think a dev can hold whatever view they want as long as they don't force it on me or make it the sole issue of their game. Gone homo is just muh lgbtqbbqphat politics so I toss it in the bin, lisa stayed away from the politics and it worked. Same with multiplayer games, if the devs let me talk all the shit I want in the chat then they can hold whatever view they want. Everyone keeps saying tripwire are a bunch of cunts but they let me act like a giant racist in RS so i'm happy.

when I play games I like to stop worrying about the stupid fucking dilemmas that make up my life and get immersed in a different set of stupid fucking dilemmas. I keep the socjus drama to my mongolian metal mending meetings.

what made you hate Joyful so much?

Lisa stayed away from politics because Ding hasn't gone insane at that point. His next game will inevitably be plastered with politics and racially charged shit.

He did an interview here on Holla Forums, IIRC, and it was a good thread. I think the death of his father really shook him up. The dude was such an inspiration for him.

The whole reveal in the end was that he wasn't a true bastard but rather lost his way through the influence of his sociopathic human friend. Honestly it was a pretty stupid twist that ruins the whole "evil flower" thing that had going with him.

The thing I will say it its defense though is you're not actually required to show mercy at that bit, whether you kill him or not you're still get an imperfect ending and are required to backtrack in order to do the stuff needed to unlock the true ending.

Nah.

I wish twitter didn't ruin people. I wish it was reversible.

I think final boss is a climax, the turning point, conclusion to everything prior. It's all about atmosphere, experience, whatever you call it. Basically what said. Agreed with every word.


Strange. I didn't cried. I felt pumped as fuck! After seeing true end I felt like I can do anything. And during bossfight i was stunned, amazed and happy at the same time.

buddy was made into a completely unlikeable cunt. "i'm going to kill pacifists, i'm so fucking edgy!". the plot made zero sense and completely lacked urgency, and every problem in the story was made by buddy through no fault of the player yet we're supposed to feel bad about it and by extension feel bad for her.

And of course the gameplay is nothing but garbage timing puzzles interspliced with bosses that do so much damage that the game basically forces you to use joy then goes "hurr you shouldn't have done dat!". In lisa the painful you could realistically beat the whole game without using joy, but in the joyful the joy mutants make that impossible, probably because you only get one fucking party member in a game where the combat is designed around having a full party. None, and I mean fucking none, of the new characters were any good. Everyone always acts like eagle was a great character but he wasn't, he just had a really cool boss theme. The most standout character in the whole stupid game was the shopkeep since he goes "oy vey" when you kill him.

it's the laziest writing ever and it's the laziest kind of gameplay. Lisa the joyful is anything but.

That guy has fucking terrible grammar. You could see it in the game as well. I can't take him seriously.

There's actual gameplay too, you know. And how it uses QTE's is what makes it so cool anyways


Absolutely, it's clearly trying to be more of an interactive anime then a game anyways, and the parts of it that are super fun are the cutscenes rather then the gameplay itself.

It's best treated as an anime to begin with.

12/10 anime, 6/10 game, is how i'd put it.

I know, I played it. The "actual gameplay" is filler.

No need for long speeches, foreshadowing or multiple forms. The mystery is what makes a final boss great.

First post and we already have the best answer. To add on this, the boss fight should progress in a logical manner. Why does the boss change its pattern in the way it does? What is the boss adapting to as you get further into the fight?

Pic related

And even if you do I still wanna post this webm

I'll tell you two conditions that makes a boss instantly shit
couldn't find a good-looking image for the second one but you'll know who I'm talking about

He was badly established. Good fight tho.

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Sometimes I wonder, what if they skipped the brawling, and just made shooting and QTE game?

Like seriously the only moment brawling felt really, REALLY good in Asuras Wrath was a handful boss battles.

And Kalrow´s stage, but we can argue the continued rampage of Asura into the ships IS his boss battle.

Moon Presence is weird because he's kind of easier than gherman, he has a bunch of devastating moves that can prevent you from healing, making the attack where he reduces your health to 1 a massive danger, but he usually gets killed before that happens.
Orphan of Kos was much better, he was hard as fuck but really just required knowing his patterns and where to dodge.
Soul of Cinder I thought was an awesone boss in concept, just executed poorly. Of course, that's probably just because the player is buffed beyond reason in DS3, making the whole game an unbalanced mess.

Painful was awesome. Joyful was not. I tried getting some friends into LISA, but only one of them managed to play through all of it. The others didn't even get the bike. They're casual trash with too much money to throw around.

I wish yo' boy Dingaling would make something else.

No, you learned this stupid shit from Zero Punctuation (or others who got it from there). It reeks of final school exam and is completely gratuitous. Not only this, but it effectively makes final bosses redundant: if I need to CONFIRM that I know all abilities, then it follows that I've learned and used them all ALREADY. And why do I have to confirm what I've already done previously?

This. If the game you played is not total shit, then you've already proven your worth. Now what really matters, is to provide the setup for a proper goodbye.

second one is like, fable 2 or 3 right?

only lorefags do
he is barely established and the story is pretty much nonexistent.
Artorias gets more exposure than Gwyn and he isn't even in the base game.