Should we back the PRC in order to bring about an end to the global hegemony of the United States?

No.

We should work to destroy both and fetishize/support neither. Most leftists don't fetishize the PRC but there is a serious problem with people who fetishize bourgeois democracy here.

I think you have to criticize the PRC without falling for yank propaganda and scheming and that's a tall order given all the "fake news" put out by Washington. Comrades have to base themselves on the most solid factual basis when criticizing a rival imperialist like the PRC so they don't fall for NGO-humanitarian imperialist bs.

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You don't know what neoliberalism is do you?

Seriously, it's a totalitarian state that works directly with corporations to keep the workers down and prevent them from protesting their exploitation whilst shouting nationalist rhetoric and pursuing expansionist goals to keep them distracted.

I've seen a bunch of so-called Leninists ardently claim that the PRC is still socialist. I largely cut off contact with those people because they were fucking insane.

How is this different from what life is like for people who are actually workers in the West?

Lol no

Daily reminder to always hate Deng.

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Who said he wanted anything to do with socialism?

Are Boris Yeltsin and Deng Xiaoping responsible for the fall of socialism in the 20th century?

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>this unaware that there are still literal Dengists in the world

deng was the only person in the ccp who actually understood marx, he was the second greatest communist of the 20th century after lenin

China is an absolute piece of shit and if it is a 'superpower', it was built solely upon the backs of suicidal underpaid workers.

Not to mention they don't have any sort of animal protection laws. Chinese people are barbaric and need actual socialism.

Any space the US leaves is filled by Russia or China. There is no alternative.

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Kind of like the "communists" on my campus, except, at least, they pretend to hate capitalism while doing everything to promote it.

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This is frighteningly close to the truth

There's still Africa, parts of Asia and Latin America where capitalism still has room to expand. And you neglect the fact that Chinese capitalism made the system far more stable and labor far weaker over the past couple decades then it was when China was "closed" to the world.

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– They are terraforming to block off the South China Sea
– They are trying to steal away islands from Japan and Vietnam
– The Chinese Communist Party owns casinos
– Russia and India have nukes pointed towards them
– You need a gas mask to enjoy an evening stroll.
– You will learn to get used to being called "wai lo"
You know this, right?

Same here. (Though they are "ML" or "MLM")
If you call them out it's a backpedal towards 'US Imperialism' instead of a fundamental critique of commodities and wage labor. And yet they are a major 'leftist' grouping. But it's okay since Leninists are basically the bullied kids who like Lenin, Stalin, Mao, because "they won", they had power, and they gave the normie/bourgie what-for, and that's what matters!. (I still sort of like Lenin and Mao but not the way the tankids do)

All I can say is Facebook and redditsocialism is a hell of a drug. Sometimes I think that's what drove the roo over the deep end. People who identify as tanks unironically end up taking positions that none of the classics of ML (Lenin, Stalin, etc.) would've accepted.

I hate to say this but Nazbols make a lot more sense and are more revolutionary then brezhnev-esque tankies

China is the bourgeoisie's factory.
they used to have to call that shit imperialism - they would get local 'officials' to police the locals to do all the slave/commodity work.

then someone in china came up with communism. now they are even happy to make porky toasters at 13 cents an hour!

1 billion people serving consumers!

Chinese wages, especially in the coastal regions are much higher then the rest of the Third World though and a large middle class has emerged with a first world standard of living. Even the conditions of many Chinese proles could be described as second world. Like I think the average for Chinese industrial workers is now between 2-4 dollars an hour depending on the source you trust.

I think China itself has become economically imperialist and so for the world bourgeoisie now its a lot like investing in any other developed country.

Chinese social-imperialism will probably grow into the most profit-hungry imperialism the world has ever known because buying social peace covers a demographic of hundreds of millions.

China already invests more in Africa then any single Western country.

heritage.org/research/projects/china-global-investment-tracker-interactive-map/china-global-investment-tracker-interactive-map
im aware the source is conservafag shit

-chinese bourgeois already invest in africa…
-china found they had to pay off a managerial class to keep things in 'harmony'

meanwhile all wealth is created by people working 12 hour days 6 days a week, and students studying 70 hours a week. they entire society is perfectly directed towards purely bourgeois purpose

I have this to contribute

2percent of 15 cents?

red line point up

Sometimes I think that Holla Forums's only knowledge of China comes from trite 90s liberal anti-globalization and 50-style red scare disinfo.

cnbc.com/id/100651692
reuters.com/article/economy-mexico-wages-idUSL2N0CR1TY20130404

Pic related is from the US bureau of labor of labor statistics and the data is over 7 years old. Chinese wages have become very high on a global scale and are starting to enter the lower-tier of developed nation wage levels.

*anti-globalization memes

You mean China. All Russia can do now is being a boogeyman to its microstate neighbours.

So the capitalism raised billions out of poverty is true? Now what.

That's good question. In my opinion the answer is revolution. Poverty is obviously a relative question but the reality is most Chinese workers are still poor even if they now have a standard of living a lot closer to the rich nations then in the past.

One reason I like Hoxhaism is because of their critique of the PRC: revolutionarydemocracy.org/archive/ChinaAlbania.pdf
revolutionarydemocracy.org/archive/chinecon.htm
enverhoxha.ru/Archive_of_books/English/enver_hoxha_reflections_on_china_volume_I_eng.pdf
enverhoxha.ru/Archive_of_books/English/enver_hoxha_reflections_on_china_volume_II_eng.pdf

Reviving Maoism as some on the Chinese New Left want to do is not practical because Maoism was not a Leninist ideology, nor was it systematically Marxist in even a lackluster way. The Chinese Right and Center in the PRC draw a lot of their inspiration from Maoism as an ideology even if they've given up all pretense of "serving the people"

The world needs to beware Chinese imperialism just as much as American imperialism. In my view, because China is probably the world capital of labor strikes rn, if Chinese imperialism takes it on the chin it will be more likely to go to revolution then say if the same thing happens in America.

But it should go without saying that I think American imperialism should also be opposed.

This
Half a shit sandwich is better than a whole one.

This Comrade right here.

In the long term the balance heavily favors China, though.

wtf I love confuscianism now

The largest strike in human history happened in India last year. I'm not sure China is top dog anymore.

Yes, India had the largest strike in history that is certainly correct and India is probably closer to revolution then China. I should've specified that China is the leader in the number of strikes not the size of said strikes.

smh karlthisell.wordpress.com/2016/10/21/the-limits-of-buzgalin/

Hopeless.

I'll take anything over Amerifats at this point, their constant meddling and interventionism has gotten completely out of hand. At least the Chinese mostly keep to themselves.

They're stealing islands and blocking off the South China Sea.

Maybe American supercarriers shouldn't be there in the first place.

yep they clearly have no right to this sovereign american territory

reading this thread, I find again that it doesn't really matters where on the political spectrum people find themselves

in the end
if situation will come to a global confrontation, people will crawl into their own corners
americans into american corner, chinese into chinese corner, et cetera

international solidarity is just a phrase, it has no substance

because if shit hits the fan, you just can't stay neutral
eventually you have to choose a side

and it is in this moment that nation-state comes into play not just as spook, but as real being

Agreed my CIDF brother, the sovereign territory of that evil American puppet state: Vietnam.

The Chinese are clearly intimidated.