Is a theistic worldview compatible with leftist politics and praxis?

Is a theistic worldview compatible with leftist politics and praxis?

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You can find any kind of message in most religious literature, so yes.

There have been theists who were also active leftists so I'd say the answer is yes. A better question is if a theistic worldview is compatible with leftist theory; I'd say no.

No.

I should clarify in that I don't limit theism to a strict form of monotheism but any belief in divinity/ies in general.

It is a vital component to our gulags.

No

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Being a leftist means questioning authority and this includes divine authority.

You can also find a lot of different interpretations of Marx.

All of them?
Famrade, religion is a personal freedom and it's something you do in your private life so it shouldn't have nothing to do with your political beliefs.

Many religions are also political ideologies.

That's not how ideology functions.

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If your leftist politics is humanist, because revolution out of the spine of a book, then no.

1. There have been plenty of leftists who didn't question authority.

2. There have been plenty of religious people who question authority.

3. Its stupid to deny God's authority if He actually exists

If it doesn't sanctify domination or property, why not?

What part of no gods no masters don't you get?

Well, let's put aside almost every form of Marxism for a second… There have been plenty of Christian anarchists throughout history, including Catholic anarchists in the Catholic workers movement.

That's an anarchist slogan, but whatever. There have been and are religious leftists of various ideologies and faiths. Still are.

The idea of man as a sinner can be the ultimate justification for statism and is still used today. Then again, some have taken the message of Christ to it's most radical conclusions. Even present-day bourgeois christianity often refers to human liberty despite the sovereignty of god. It was once the religion of the poor and destitute.

Who is the best for demolishing religion? My friend has been brainwashed by sinister agents of the Catholic church, and all he does is cite verses as evidence for everything.

Shouting not an argument at him does not work. I'm going to need to pull out the big guns.

Bakunin?

Okay, friend. The thread is asking for whether or not a "theistic worldview compatible with leftist politics and praxis?" not specifically about anarchism. And secondly the quote comes from Blanqui who was most certainly not an anarchist.

Christians make better leftists than humanists and fanatics on your side make for better bedfellows than pathetic "moderates."

As an atheist religion doesn't really speak to me, but I have noticed that religious leftists have a fervor and a way of speaking that can break a lot more barriers than a purely atheistic tone can. It was also a mistake in my opinion for American leftism in particular to start with an anti-religious message first and then work their way out. Tying socialism and communism to Judaism and atheism was one of the things that helped kill it fast here, you know other than the actual killing they did.

Bernie Sanders was hurt by the fact that he wasn't christian. Maybe not as much as the other side hoped, but in southern states it was a factor. Being christian makes it harder for other people to ignore Chris Hedges, Cornel West etc Atheism has also become a token identity here and "the four horseman" are all moderate liberals at best and outright right wingers at worst.

Why do you hate theology, G_d, and Torah, user?

*God

My mistake.


They justify porky's rule?

They can also de-legitimize porky's rule.

They could if they would.

Christian posters on this board are unironically the most compassionate, wise and decent people here. Far better than the "i'm fully like fuckin rebel against my people cos they're ugly and dicks and aren't cool like new yorkers" weinies here who just want to remake man in their own image - a bland, nationless faggot with no personality. It makes me want to revisit the Gospel.

I think it really depends. Is an atheist apostate in a Muslim country free and unoppressed? Can they be true to themselves?

My point being that religion is totally compatible so long as it does not dominate people. Often times though people feel tremendous guilt if they question the doctrines of their religion, families disown people. So I would be inclined to say no but I don't like to generalize.

Certainly, religion can delegitimize capitalist rule *in the mind* (i.e. Jehovah's Witnesses refuse to salute the flag and many Muslims and Jews make it a point to reject secular forms of nationalism) but we're not just talking about what's "in the mind" but what's being practiced in the real-world. While fundamentalist Islam or Christianity can snap someone out of capitalist ideology, it can also bring people into other reactionary ideologies. ISIS and the Mormons are an example.

Fuck off we're full

Literally follow your leader and kys.

That makes no sense. Bakunin was such a fucking moron.

Can we stop making shitty "is *insert topic* compatible with leftism" threads. We need more intelligent and thought provoking OPs than this shit. Plus we've had this exact OP every week for fucking years.

Why not?

Logic > Faith

If you have to ask, you're a reactionary.

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Not sure how I feel about agnosticism tho tbh, I could go either way on it

Humans are inherently irrational. It's not a case of garbage in garbage out because the processing is garbage itself. It's a matter of finding the right garbage in to get non-garbage out.

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How is LT petit-bourgeois?

Found the feminist.

See:

Because they are religious.

What about Ali Shariati and his Islamic Socialism? Or Mirsaid Sultangaliyev?

It's the original conflict.

Communists want to build a paradise for Earth.

Theists shun that, claiming Earth is too sinful, and that the true paradise comes after death.
A core philosophy of hardcore theists is actually to make the Earth so fucked up and sinful, that it triggers the Second coming of Jesus Christ, who will lead the faithful in an all out war against the Antichrist who will get defeated and the Kingdom of God descends.

That's why Radical Evangelicals stir shit in the Middle East. They think it will happen there. Read up "Project for the New American Century", that's some serious megalomaniac stuff.

Trump was indeed the best Republican option out of all these shitbags. At least he is driven by greed and not by higher purpose.

Sultan-Galiyev was a rightist on the national question and a general philistine.
Socdem

Explain in more detail. How was he a rightist? He was literally a Bolshevik.

Shariati was a Marxist with strong anarchist leanings.

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Probably not a Western one.

Which religion is Western? They're all Eastern

Monotheism in the form of Islam, Christianity, and Judaism.

Western religions: Roman Catholicism, Protestantism, Reform/Conservative Judaism, all other forms of Judaism except for Sephardic and Yemenite, Mormon, JW, new age spiritualisms.

So, you mean the Abrahamic religions.

Only western Christianity and non-Sephardic/Yemenite forms of Judaism.

Islam is much more eastern than western.

Calling the Near East the East is pitiful since its the originator of much of your culture.

yeah, it was more directed towards the anfem.


Confucianism seems pretty fascist.

What's the problem?

Buddhism doesn't.

Islam is eastern because it preaches egalitarianism and libertarianism over blind following of commandments. Muhammad even said there's no compulsion in religion and Muslims have historically been much more egalitarian in their social organization than Christians or Jews.

I think that just depends on the interpretation.

hahahahahaha

You're kidding, right?

Explain why I'm wrong. I can provide you quite a few examples of times when Islam has been very egalitarian.

Fair enough.

I don't trust Monotheism.

Must I? Christianity does the same shit and better.

And being egalitarian does not Eastern make.

It does. See: Asiatic Mode of Production. Easterners have always lived in communal settings. Even Engels said private property was exclusively a western phenomenon.

You have never been around any kind of Asians in your fucking life

I admittedly know little about Islam apart from memes. You'll have to explain that to me.

Is Christianity non-egalitarian. Did it lose this trait more when it became adopted by the Roman sword?

I mean I can't believe the shit you're suggesting. India isn't Asian at all, you have to be one of the yellow ones, the good ones.

Also Japan says hi.

But all the Dharmic religions come from India. Including Buddhism.

So does Hinduism.

This was somewhat excusable over a century ago. Now saying this nonsense is just setting yourself up for embarrassment.

Yea

What do you mean? Arabs and South Asians are still very communal. What the hell do you think zakat is?

How is India not "asian" at all? It's in Asia

I was being sarcastic, it is Asian.

Show me where Islam has ever produced a successful socialist revolution.

Reminder that the invading Ariyans are what ruined India, and then colonization!

Urge to go on a tirade at an all time low…

Bye

Sure
I've seen worse doublethink

Believe whatever you want. Religion has nothing to do with worker ownership over the means of production. The anti-religion stuff that Marx talked about was only in there because he was a fedorafag who got butthurt at the idea that someone might choose to believe in something.

Refer to flag.

Not only is it compatible, it is necessary.

Marxists can deny this all they want, but they have a religious fervor for Marxism. Just look at how many will dismiss things like art and become philistines just for the sake of it being "bourgeois".

More like Marx correctly recognized people's spiritual needs as what they were. He didn't call religion the opiate of the masses for nothing. You treat people's spiritual needs like a drug addiction: you wean them off slowly and don't go cold turkey on them, lest they stop cooperating with the government. Even worse, start revolting.

Ah shit, and I forget my shidbosd-lefdism flag on.

The true opiates nowadays are drugs, porn, anime, and shitty music.

Deep

idpol is toxic

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Your issue with walter benjamin is that he's jewish? this isn't a gotcha it seems like that's what you're saying.

Judaism is reactionary.

reddit.com/r/exmuslim/comments/5lb39m/hypothesis_why_muslims_believe_in_conspiracy/

The acceptance and glorification of an irrational authority in society surely favors the exploitation of the common man, does it not? If you're willing to accept the highest boss of them all acts on no basis other than he is your boss then that makes you a useful servant.

Belief in God and religious scripture can also provide a space for resistance AGAINST dominant colonizer cultures.

Why does it matter if people want to believe in something? Why do you compare religion to a drug? If someone is practicing their religion without infringing on someone elses rights why shouldn't they be able to do so?
This is why Marx and a lot of hard core atheists are autistic fedora fags. Someone can be religious so long as they recognize the value of science as a counterpart to spirituality instead of opposing it. To want to completely wipe out religion is not only idiotic, it's dangerous.

You have no idea of what marx wrote on religion and are just memeing. You don't seem to understand religion (even etymologically) isn't a personal belief but an institution. Shut the fuck up.

I know exactly what he said, faggot. I've read Marx. The fact is, Marx is outdated. Religious leaders don't have the same power they did in the 1800's. Not to mention, Religion is a social institution, not an economic one, so it in no way conflicts with socialism you neckbearded retard.

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That's true though. The age of feudalism is over and the Church has lost a great deal of power that it used to have before the age of liberalism disrupted its rule.

Catholic Church != Religious leaders. Take a stroll through the bible belt, through the Middle East or through Latin America and look me in the eye and tell me religious leaders don't have the power to sway entire countries.

Marx critique on religion still is as valid as it once was, only the context through which he exemplified it is outdated

I'm talking about the West, also, still, no, they do not have the same power they did. I also never said that they didn't have any power

Furthermore, "Latin America".
I happen to live there are no, the state, corporations and cartels have power that matters, not the church.

Kek


"There"? Not "here"? And no, you don't live in Latin America, pal, if you really think that

I just said I was talking about the West.


Yeah, I do. I'm more concerned with what I just mentioned than the church

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refer to

refer to

Except both statements are true. The church has been steadily losing influence since the age of enlightenment and that trend has recently accelerated with increased modernization and social liberal attitudes.

only if you believe in a creator but that we know nothing of him except by studying nature (biology, physics etc)

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It's G_d or GD, saying his full name is disrespectful

Shariati also inspired the clerics.

Yes.
Some of them are kind of spooky, but I believe a lot of the same things as them, but for different reasons.
I'm kind of fascinated by liberation theology.