Quack

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I remember playing Quake ages ago but I haven't played it this decade. I'm pretty sure it's open source, what source port should I get? Mainly just wanting single player, I essentially want the ZDoom of Quake source ports.

You just convinced me that Quake with fast moving/shooting hitscan only enemies would be fun.

Dark Places was pretty good.

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get yourself the quakespasm sourceport

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this looks like shit

:^)

what is that s/t? sounds so familiar. I dig it a lot

the engine was free as in freedom long while ago

quakespasm for faithful port
darkplaces for ooh it looks pretty

moddb.com/mods/quake-epsilon-build/news/merry-quakemas-every-one

I knew I had heard this somewhere before.

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jesus christ

thats how the original was played kiddo. eduke32 free look is also balls.

/thread

you can turn off the autoaim

Games back in that age all had innate auto-aim because there was no positional damage and were built not just for KB+M but also for pure KB gameplay

no you could not. not in options or via setup.exe. and literally nobody did because build engine games had terrible mouse horizontals. stop pretending like you were ever playing duke 3d back when it was released you hopeless little shit.

*I meant diagonals

Which FPS games would Holla Forums recommend?

Quake 3 arena, Unreal tournament, older versions of Counter Strike (though GO is okay I guess), FEAR, Call of Juarez: Gunslinger, DOOM 1 and 2 (you can play Nu-Doom but if you want to then do it before you play 1 and 2 or else it will feel fucking bad)

Thank you, friend. I will try each of these.

Duke Nukem 3D, Blood, and Shadow Warrior.

Here's few recommendations from me:
Painkiller Black Edition, Postal 2 Complete, Blood

Doom 1 and 2. Mod the fuck out of them too. Start off with vanilla, Brutal Doom, Demonsteele and Reelism, but don't become one of those fags who refuses to play Doom without BD and insists all mods work with it.
Try Doom 3. It's more of a horror game with an FPS tacked on than an FPS, but it has some neat ideas. Ingame menus are mouse driven, and the fact that you can either have your flashlight or a gun out means that you have to think about whether seeing or shooting is more important. Unfortunately the gunplay is kinda bad.
Turok: Dinosaur Hunter. It recieved a remake, so you don't have to emulate the N64 version. It's a weird mix of cool ideas, and has a nice setting, but it has aged since release.
EYE: Divine Cybermancy. The Holla Forums guys meming about their broken legs gets annoying, but outside the weird translation it has some very interesting ideas. It's like a tabletop FPS. You roll stats, RNG plays a big part in crits and uncrits, there's a sanity meter and the hacking system is it's own Pokemon-style minigame.
Serious Sam: TFE. The first Serious Sam was split into 2 parts for all versions except the Xbox. The First Encounter is the first part. Serious Sam is about having a fuckton of weapons and mowing down giant armies. Enemies are predictable, but you aren't given any cover. Imagine an FPS bullet hell.

Check out the Half Life series and their expansions, Killing Floor, the rest of the Serious Sam games, and Shadow Warrior and it's reboot. You might like the Rise of the Triad reboot if you have a good PC and a love for rocket launchers, but it's a bit iffy. Try the original at least.

If you're going to try EYE though, a word of caution: The game won't really "start" until you get a grasp for quite a lot of the mechanics, once it gets rolling shit's fucking awesome though

swisscm.duke4.net/mine.html
ayy lmao

At least recommend it with "project brutality", instead.

you can only have so many games about poking around corners in basic environments with a horrendous art style and not get bored of them.

If you go as far as including half-rpg FPS, might as well remember vodka simulator

The only good thing about Quake were the technological improvements and level designs. The enemy variety and weapons are dogshit.

bmouse was released in 2010 you fucking mongoloid. that website is intentionally made to look like an old geocities website - not that you'd have any idea what geocities is, just like you have no idea about duke nukem 3d. literally nobody played duke 3d without auto aim and there was not an option to turn it off in the in-game menu or via setup.exe. hell the average player was still playing with keyboard only controls when the game came out. competitive multiplayer fags used to use joysticks because they allowed you to run faster in all directions, and they would still play with auto aim on because it's inherent to the game's design. keep pretending that you have any idea what you're on about you tryhard little turd.

Also remember to play through Final Doom as well (both TNT and Plutonia). Maybe even Plutonia 2 on top of it all if you really want to. That's more than 150+ doom levels when you add in Doom 1 and 2, most of which are generally pretty good, so it'll keep you sated for a long while.

End this meme. "Metastreum" and "brouzoufs" didn't magically come out of nowhere somewhere between French and English.

You posted it, right there in your webm. People never learned to rocket jump or bunnyhop.
Why make a good shooter when you can make interactive movie and more people will buy it?

Consoles.

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Reminder: never ever.

halo was great

why do you queers like stalker so much

Does anyone feel like the mouse aiming in Quakespasm is really off? It's like there's some mouse acceleration or smoothing present which fucks up my aim, which is strange considering I never had such problems with Quakespasm on my laptop. I read that it has to do with your screen resolution and Windows fucking with your mouse to compensate for that (which makes sense considering I'm now using a 1920x1080 monitor as opposed to the 1366x768 screen on my laptop) but there seems to be no way to enable raw input in QuakeSpasm. DirectQ does offer raw input, however it glues the barrel of my guns under my head regardless of what FOV I choose and many newer mods are not made with DirectQ in mind. Anyone know how to unfuck mouseaiming in QuakeSpasm?

Also, how do you get your music to work in eDuke32? Music works fine in the Atomic Edition, but it's straight up missing in eDuke32.

Does crouching in Blood actually help you avoid getting shot?

supernerdland.com/m-m-m-monster-kill-the-death-of-the-arena-shooter/

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First person.
First person perspective is the most stupid idea ever. I'm already in first person. Why would I want be in first person while I'm already in first person?
Only games where you see your character from the outside worth a damn.

FPS didn't go wrong, we did.

It had an alright mostly stripped from Marathon and was mostly slow and floaty. Although one redeeming factor was that it had A.I that was superior to the majority of other FPS on the market. It didn't do anything significant until 3 and Reach introduced Forge which created very low entry level community content creation suite. Custom games in those two were a blast, particularly Reach.

How are you supposed to immerse yourself into the role of a character otherwise?

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What is "immerse"? Some buzzword? What does it mean?

Gendum is the least weeb source of reaction images available.

AM I KAWAII UGUU

Gundam doesn't exist post char's counter attack.

The industry could never properly rectify the problem that gamers couldn't decide if they wanted them to be silly fantasy games or hardcore edgy realistic games.

Casualization.
Graphics over gameplay.
Consoles.

Are there any good sound fx replacement mods for quake? The audio in that game irritates me more than nuDooms buzzs, skreeches and wubs.

Many games rely on the first person perspective to even work, you're retarded.

Such as? Every first person game would work better as 3rd person one.

Infiniminer, and any game that copied it. You can't have a third-person perspective in cramped spaces.

Portal and games that use portals, jumping through small holes with a third-person camera would be far to jarring. Also not being first person kills the fun of mucking about with them.

Horror games often work with having things move or change when outside the player's view. Traditionally that sort of thing was often done with fixed cameras but that's considered outdated nowadays. Also some mystery games work in a twist that the person you are controlling isn't necessary who you thought it was or doesn't look like what you thought. Though granted, there is at least one game which managed that twist without being first person, but that required a specific premise that not every game is gonna have

Thief and really any proper stealth game because being able to magically look around corners is cheating. And on that note stealth mechanics in multiplayer titles too because you don't want to have to guess what an enemy player is able to see. Good luck trying to make the Team Fortress Spy's backstab mechanic work in a third-person game.

Why aren't there more patriotic shooters set in the medieval?

Quakespasm

Everyone else has mentioned a bunch of good ones, so I'll recommend Killing Floor if you're looking for a good co-op FPS. It's still fairly active. Haven't played KF2, though, heard too many mixed things about it.

I don't rememberr this level being the game; I remember seeing beta versions of it though, back when the game was meant to be a multiplayer/coop Gauntlet-like FPS.

I don't think you would like that. I remember that there's this one mission in Unreal: Return to Na Pali, where you get ambushed by humans with hitscan assault rifles which had a hitscan small rocket like alt fire. Fucking bullshit.

there aren't that really many, to be honest
The most alive of the games in this list. The community creates mods non-stop. The community is also well-known for constant dramas about retarded shit nobody should care about. This is because the game at this point is a mainstream cancer thanks to Holla Forums, Reddit and Brutal Doom.
The main web sites are…
DoomWorld: doomworld.com/
/idgames Archive: ftp://archives.gamers.org/pub/idgames/
Has a really niche but very dedicated community. Most of the people there are pretty smart, most of them are veterans and at least 1/10 of them tried making his/her own source-port of the game.
The main web sites are…
Quaddicted: quaddicted.com/
Func_Msgboard: celephais.net/board/news.php
The community is quite niche from what I know. There are definetely mods and maps being created but I can't tell you any directions because (for some reason) I never really got into Duke Nukem 3D.
Beyond QUAKE III ARENA I have no idea how things are there. There should be mods and maps but I can't tell you much.
The modding community is still quite alive but already entering the niche zone. A lot of 40+ y.o. veterans who don't have much time to play games anymore. Also, many people leave because Valve Software is really bad at actually making software and supporting their customers. Other than that, there are tons of mods and maps to play.
The main web sites are…
RTSL: runthinkshootlive.com/
TWHL: twhl.info/
The community is pretty much dead and it's really hard to find mods (if they even exist). Which is quite a shame since the game has a really good engine. The only web site I know is pkzone.org/ but I've never done anything with Painkiller outside of just playing the vanilla multiple times.
The community is very alive and it's the only reason the mentions of the game haven't been deleted from the Google servers. They do mods all the fucking time. There are only two major downsides: the community is 99% Russian-speaking and the game requires a pretty powerful PC.

Also I should probably mentions such games as DOOM 3, Prey, Crysis and others, but I never had much experience with the modding scene of these games. There are definetely mods and maybe some community but I've never been there myself. Also, I didn't mention any multi-player-only game because you probably heard of the most popular ones anyway (QUAKE, QUAKE II, QUAKE III ARENA, Half-Life, Half-Life 2: Deathmatch, Counter-Strike (1.6), Counter-Srike: Source, Team Fortress Classic, Day of Defeat, Day of Defeat: Source, Team Fortress 2 and so on). All of them are either mods, ex-mods or has tons of mods for them. The only problem is that if the game itself may have alive servers it doesn't mean that the mods for that game has any servers alive (see Action QUAKE II and many other mods for QUAKE and QUAKE II). Multi-player games based on GoldSrc and Source engine has server-side mods, so the situation there is much better (see things like SURF for CS:S).

Yeah, I had some problems with it but I thought it's due to the fact that I play on a trackpad. There are three main variables that control the mouse behavior:
Try playing with them.

Reminder that consoles ruined everything.
Reminder that 6/7 Gen ruined everything.

Well obviously when something gets too popular and gets too many games coming out doing the same thing, it gets boring and shitty very fast.

you sicken me

Consoles

this map is so freaking cool, episode 3 and 4 get more shit than they deserve

tf2 itself is a lot of fun but i agree if your point is cosmetics

Here's a new perspective for you guys that's not often posted here…
This is what I think happened to FPS:

Used to be you didn't had much choices in what games you could play, PC library was fairly small. So you had to make the best you could with the games you had and extract as much fun from them as possible since you didn't knew when you were getting a new game.
Thus all the extra movement tricks for Quake appeared, as well as all the details and tactics people learned from them.
Without those, most of those games become fairly mundane and you can enjoy all they have to offer in about 8 hours or so.

Come modern times, you have competition for your money and attention. You have a plethora of different games to try and not even just FPS anymore. Whenever you're tired of one and feel like you got a good amount of fun out of it, you can just go play something else, something new instead.

And thus, the previous model doesn't work anymore. If anyone tries to make a quake-clone like Xonotic or similar, it's never as popular because why would anyone spend 600 hours learning how to play it, when they could play 60 different games for 10 hours each? It simply doesn't make sense.

It's not necessarily about the money, but rather that games are more efficient and reliable at fullfilling their main objective: entertain you. Any new player can either start Quake and he'll be having fun playing with other people in 600 hours, give or take, or he can instead play any of the AAA currently available and in 10 minutes, he's already having fun. And when he's done with it, he doesn't have to stick with the game forever, hoping someone makes a carbon-copy of it with better graphics, he can just play something different because he never attached himself to it.

Finally, a burst of intelligence on Holla Forums

crits were a bad design decision

Stalker sucks

agreed, iron sight shooters are pretty boring and stalkers weapons are all too samey for game play and the AI is a joke.

So I guess ASSFAGGOTS should be dying th-

Nice bait

Believe me or not, but ASSFAGGOTS are kinda stuck on the same situation Quake was when it came out.
Quake launched in a period where your only choices of FPS were:
Yeah, we later got CS and Painkiller, Serious Sam and what not and the FPS genre had a nice little boom with tons of options.
But I'm tlaking about nearly 10 years of the same 3 games dominating the scene. Were there more games? Yes. Were they known or popular? Nope. Hexen was nice and I enjoyed it. Top multiplayer too. Was it modded with wads, did it have tournaments? Nope.

Now consider what I just said and think of:
Like I said, ASSFAGGOTS are severely limited now, and people don't have a lot of choice on what they get to play. Thus, they invest a lot of time into the same game trying to improve themselves.
Yeah, there's a ton of other ASSFAGGOTS you can switch to and play, but they have really small playerbases. I'm not talking about individual players here, more about the large portion of market.

Ebin. You argue like a leftist.

I haven't played Qauke, but that looks incredibly linear with 5 or so enemies in the whole level, doesn't look that great. Or could be that one level.

And you argue like a midwit who wants to feel informed and important, but doesn't even know what Duke Nukem 3D is (this is braindead retardation on your part, I feel embarrassed for you) and seems to think that FPS was the only genre on the PC at the time.

Not even cute.

You mean comic Doom? A game that was also only singleplayer, failed to bring anything new to the table that Shadow Warrior or Blood didn't had already and didn't made a mark on multiplayer as well?
Already covered that in the same category as Hexen: a neat game that was played by some but never made it as big as those other 3. It's dialogue and humour did set it apart but that was it.

You are sounding a lot defensive here for no good reason in particular. The kind of people that enjoyed FPS did not overlap much with those that enjoyed RTS or RPG.
And even then, the same thing happens with those games.

Why do you think new RTS games don't have the same appeal from older ones? Because nobody is gonna funnel the same autism into learning and exploring them the same way they did with older games when they can go play something else instead.
Why do you think they jumped to city builders, RTT, 4X or even MOBA's? Especially RTT that enjoy more popularity than RTS are games that let you have fun right off the bat without a gigantic burden of knowledge weighting on you.

RPG's are a bit more sad since it used to be interaction was the norm, but people prefer the immidate appeal of a story or visual effects over that so they were simplified a lot. Doesn't take long before you're throwing around fireballs and wearing flashy armor, despite the game being incredibly stale and static. Doesn't matter though, as soon as you clear the story from this RPG, you can go play another, instead of having a gigantic world full of things to know and interact with and explore.

I'm not saying progress is always good, faggot, but that's what happened. You had less games, you explored them more. You have more games, you explore them less. That's it, occam's razor, no jews or AAA or SJWs needed to explain this.

The stupid cinematic set piece I'm makin a movie bullshit happened, good games took a backseat.

slightly off topic but what the hell happened to tf2?
I mean it just runs like shit on my computer when a year ago it ran fine.
It freezes in the middle of fights, turns some players invisible, doesn't show players as the right team colours. not just happening to spys
what the hell happened?

see

Something to do with performance. Constantly drops every update they make.
I had a toaster on which I used to play it and it worked fine for many years. Come the Merasmus update and the same maps it ran on are now giving me problems. Come a few more updates and it just keeps getting worse.
I don't play on that toaster anymore but that was good enough to notice performance problems creep up with every update they make.

I've heard theories that it's because of the achievements code that has to check a truckload of other things but quite frankly, I'd just blame it on whoever they have coding for it that probably doesn't even play or like the game anyway, he just does it because someone has to.

Try turning the graphics up. I know it sounds stupid but when I got into TF2 it was so laggy and slow I made it look like an N64 game. When I accidentally forgot to use my settings it ran smoother and nicer.

These games came out after Duke Nukem, you are retarded.
Says you? How the fuck could you possibly know this? Plus, this goes against what you said earlier whether it's true or not (it's not). You said there were no choices genrewise, there were, end of story.
If this is true, why has HotS been a failure? It was made by a titan in the industry, so it's not like people didn't know about it, yet it failed. It dumbed down the ASSFAGGOTS formula by a lot, but it failed to even come close to even matching DotA2. If your theory is true, then HotS should have been a wild success.
Except we didn't. You yourself admit this, but handwave it as not counting because they weren't popular. They weren't not popular in a vacuum, people chose not to pick them up for whatever reason. If people were just miserably shoehorned into playing a small selection of games as you idiotically claim, then why did they not branch out into these other options you yourself admit existed?
This is also laughably stupid since many people will spend copious amounts of time trying to get meaningless achievements in order to show off on their gaming profiles. Not to mention the amount of people who complain that they own a lot of games but never actually end up touching them. Plus, the "more games" people have to choose from these days are usually yearly installments from the same 4 or 5 series, and who could forget the amount of remasters people are paying for as well (probably counts as a new game in your middlebrow mind). You are incredibly out of touch if you think the average gamer has a giant library, or that if they do that they end up touching all of them. Also, if gamers are eating up large amounts of choices, why are gaming companies so scared to make new IPs?

douk had multiplayer and was out before sw and blood

360 era bungie seemed like developers that wanted to make a PC game but had to sell it on a console, which is why they jammed all of that customisation stuff in there.

Examples of Doom cancer? Last I noticed was Cyberdemon pissing off viewers of a charity stream by responding to a troll.

Call of Duty: Hundred Years' War fucking when?

GREAT NEWS FAGGOT
The best way to learn game design is to make quake or doom levels. Get trenchbroom and
MAKE THEM GREAT AGAIN
That's what I'm doing. Too bad I suck at it though.

pleb

Xonotic has a pretty good ost.

Because it went a different direction than other MOBA's and does away with many of the details that specific playerbase is used to without actually bringing anything that new to the table. It's not exactly a failure but it certainly doesn't have the same amount of success because of that and also because MOBA's have a progression of their own unlocking things that retains players, something traditional shooters did not have.

But if you're gonna pick on that example, I'll use it as well for other reasons.
HotS was made by a AAA company that spent a fair amount of effort and even marketing on it and yet it did not atract as much a crowd as it planned. This alone is proof that the whole argument "AAA companies make trash games for casuals, that's what ruins previous games" is retarded, it doesn't work like that and their sucess has nothing to do with the company that made them or how much money they sank into it.

You gonna tell me people spent hundreds of hours playing Blood or Shadow Warrior or Hexen learning the engine quirks to perform better at it and had several tournaments with competitive players world wide? For those games?

They were cool games that I like to play as well but they were at best sidegrades to what was currently available. Shadow Warrior and Blood for instance are pretty much Doom but with an inventory system and jumping. Their aesthetics change but you're still playing pretty much the same game which is why the first with a certain type of gameplay is the game and everything else is the clone.
You default to the game to play it autistically and go to the clones for some variance but they never enjoy the same level of dedication the main one had.

Realism.

Half Life had multiplayer too and it was pretty fun. And yet the default game became CS, not Half Life.
If I had to venture a guess, I'd say it was because Half Life deathmatch was too close to previous games in terms of multiplayer, weapons and movement while Counter Strike attempted something different and with a more tactical aproach.

I still think Half Life Deathmatch is the better game and CS is fucking retarded but it tried to do something different instead of aping previous concepts and was rewarded for it, while HLDM faded out.

Same thing happens for every other Quake clone that comes out and does nothing new with the formula.

HL DM was competing with TFC right out the box and then CS dominated both of them.

Then that sorta confirms it.
Seeing all those videos of gameplay for TFC with rocketjumping, grenadejumping, strafejumping and the like, both TFC and HLDM were a bit too close to Quake and similar. Despite the attempt at classes with TFC, their gameplay simply wasn't that original to grab that much attention, so when something new (but not necessarily better) came along, they were swept under rug.

I'm sure CS enjoys popularity for being gun autism too, but the fact it strayed far from the "go fast, respawn faster" to the "tactical shooter" way certainly atracted people that did not apreciate the movement technics from other games but still enjoyed the tactics.

Could you just stop replying to this thread? You clearly didn't live through this era of gaming, you're making wild and completely inaccurate claims with no foundation to work from at all.

TFC and CS did not compete with each other as most people happily played both. The difference is CS became the first major E sport where as TFC stayed cozy with amateur leagues only. The completely different formats meant they suited different crowds and both were happy with what they had. I was primarily a TFC player but I would fire up CS when I fancied a change, and I had CS friends who did the same thing.

You're applying modern internet theory to a time it doesn't relate to.

Prey.

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Should I feel bad for playing only at a fraction of that speed?

at least they took it off for competitive but i don't always like playing 6s

turning off cosmetics and particle effects is worth a try
teamfortress.tv/35222/no-hats-mod
forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2380675

this makes it less laggy without being ugly as fuck

The game is good as well.

Serious Sam has no context any more. It was a game designed for LAN parties, where you and like 20 other dudes could just mow everything down while half asleep and full of Dr. Pepper. It's very hard to explain to people what LAN parties were because they have no frame of reference for the speeds the internet used to be and how games were different with people playing in the same room.

Older FPS aren't about having a shit load of enemies, they're about having unique enemies and then using the map's design to create unique challenges. Like doom was about dodging fireballs and then creating rooms where that was difficult to do.

Duke, Doom and Quake were the 3 biggest FPS of their day. You can't ignore Duke 3D if you're talking old school FPS.

wew, unlike RTS it's not a dead genre so it got that going for it

It doesn't take that long to learn the game and have fun. Webm related explains a chunk of how to build speed Xonotic, but it'll apply for similar games. Perhaps it will take that time to become one of the top players, but there's more low-skill or intermediate players than one would expect.

Consoles became the target platform. Analog controls required slower movement, less movement options, autoaim, and generally slower gameplay. This combined with the room temperature IQ of the modern console FPS audience lead to dumber and dumber gameplay.

Multiplayer console FPS went for P2P matchmaking so devs wouldn't have to pay for dedicated servers. P2P matchmaking greatly limits the number of players per game, plays like shit, and killed the community aspect of servers. At the same time, console FPS ditched split screen, the best thing it had going for it, and a new generation was born that never went to their friend's house to play vidya together.

Half Life started the trend for the "cinematic experience." Devs want to be Hollywood so bad so their shitty liberal friends will take them more seriously. Budgets are so huge to make a "AAA game" that publishers refuse to fund anything with original gameplay. So they stick to the lowest common denominator of gameplay and dump all of the money into muh assets muh voice actors we need to focus test this to ensure it appeals to as big of an audience of drooling retards as possible gamers are dead xd

AAA devs are either kids with shit taste and no real control anyway, or old farts that don't play games anymore and actually like the "cinematic experience" and get butthurt when games kick their asses. Same with the players, they've attracted an audience that wants to get continuously jewed for shitty campaigns and minor variations on the same matchmaking gameplay.

Even in the mid-sized studious and indies that can innovate, there is the problem that vidya is now an established industry and people are unwilling or unable to think outside the box the way they used to when there were no "rules" and anything was possible.

The online multiplayer matchmaking + X/XX hour campaign model is too entrenched. Few devs are willing to do something purely focused on a unique offline or online experience.

Valve, one of the last champions of the PC FPS, went full jew, stopped making games, and now derive all of their business from virtual hats and gambling4kids.

The market is so saturated with high production value FPS that, even if they play like shit, they are impossible to compete with for the attention of the majority of FPS players. Even Epic Games couldn't get people to play the new Unreal Tournament, so there is no hope for an indie trying to do something new. And the FPS fans with the best taste have mostly siloed themselves into various "dead games" like Q3A and competitive TF2; you can't even appeal to them because they won't play anything that isn't exactly like their game of choice.

A focus on "realism" even in sci-fi that precluded the outlandish "fun" designs of the 90s, or even meaningful gameplay differentiation. Everything's a rifle.

Ironically Splatoon is the best thing of recent note to happen to the FPS genre and it's a fucking console third person shooter designed for women and children. Gyro controls allow for faster and more accurate aiming than pure analog. The inking and movement mechanics are unique. A wide variety of crazy and fun to use weapons. The game is almost purely focused on competitive multiplayer, the single player campaign is a glorified tutorial. And the playerbase it attracted is pretty much completely disjoint from the modern cancer FPS playerbase.

I see it the opposite way. People are even more likely to pick one game or franchise and sink hundreds or thousands of hours into it these days. The problems I detailed above, along with many others, have tainted the genre (nay, the industry) to the point that it's more rewarding to completely ignore it and stick with the games you already know are good. It's only when something really interesting and unique (like, say, Splatoon) comes around that the spell is broken, and then they end up sinking hundreds or thousands of hours into that.

I don't get how half-life is overly cinematic, you spend pretty much the entire game in control of your character, and the story is relatively minimal.

Ask a speedrunner. Let them tell you about the 15 minutes of unskippable cut scenes at the start. Most of which is two men talking while you wait for them to unlock a door.

It's 15 minutes at the start of the game. If you aren't speedrunning it, it's a miniscule amount of time.

It has a lot of unskippable cutscenes and scripted sequences, so I can understand the argument.

Unreal had fantastic story and atmosphere without the use of cutscenes (save for Return to NaPali which was just little diary logs between the levels) and was delivered to you in a way that let you chose to ignore or even possibly miss bits of it via the universal translator.

Yeah, I guess if that's not your thing, but I still like the game.

It doesn't seem that way today, but it was a huge deal at the time and changed the way people thought about the genre. I'm sure you can dig up articles of fags calling it "the thinking man's FPS" or something fruity like that. It was the start of what I call the "FPS tourist" audience, people that play FPS to feel immersed in a setting and story and are actively annoyed by challenging gameplay. It was a real FPS, but it planted the seed for the campaigns and walking simulators to come.

Just like how Halo was not itself a bad game or series, but it attracted an audience and cemented a lot of game design aspects of the console shooter that contributed to the downfall of the genre.

I agree. Half-Life did plant the seeds for the cinematic FPS genre, which took over the genre.

That start of the game is exactly why I made a save file right when it ends and start from there instead. 15 minute cutscene sounds long as fuck if you ask me, I don't know if its hyperbole, but either way I have little patience for the kinds of things. The usual cutscene is normally under 5 minutes I recall.

In HL Source(which is sadly broken), you can skip it after seeing it.

It's actually around 5 minutes.

I still enjoy Half-Life. It's a pretty fun game.

Half-Life 2 is the one that really suffers from that kind of shit though.

The Half life tram ride is infamous at this point. The start up sequence is the cherry on the shit cake.

Isn't that webm from the menu demo?

I thought Ultima Underworld and System Shock 1 were the beginning of the "thinking man's FPS"

I'm not saying Half Life is a "thinking mans FPS," I'm saying that's what muh immersionfags thought of it.

I still think Half-Life 2 had some really great points(ie: the point when you're scaling the underside of the bridge has great atmosphere), but yes, it really does suffer mainly due to scripted sequences taking up too much time.

I think one of the biggest flaws aside from terrible gunplay and enemies is that it all just feels like segments. You're pretty much just jumping from gimmick to gimmick to gimmick. The airboat sequence. The desert 'dont touch the ground' segment. The opening where nothing happens. The horror segment. The highway segment. Prison break segment. Done with that segment, move to the next. Every level feels like it's designed ONLY to showcase the engine and what it can do; like a tech demo. That, and that the puzzles are pretty bland and uninteresting.

Unreal changes themes and atmospheres constantly, yet it still feels cohesive and flows pretty nicely. It also doesn't chop each level up and separate them with a long stretch of unmemorable scripted drivel.

You've been playing too many multiplayer games and modes if you seriously think something is wrong with the genre. It's better than it has ever been. Try playing single player games some day.

That part was great, you actually felt scared of falling off the bridge.

Who cares? If it really bothers you that much you can just load up the console and load up the map right after the shit goes wrong or you could play one of the metric fuck-ton of custom maps or mods that were made for it that just gets you straight into the action, there is so many fucking maps for that game that you can spend probably half a decade just playing half-life maps every day all day.

I'm going to say that one of the ways they could improve modern FPS games is to bring back modding capability and put a working console or at the least a level select for their game so players are able to jump to the parts they want with no hassle.

It does not take a whole 600 hours to just enjoy yourself in quake. Maybe it takes 600 hours to be a fairly good duelist, but so long as you have sorta-new players to play with you aren't actually that hard-pressed to enjoy yourself with the game.

Everyone was shit at Quake, Unreal, whatever-you-may. It's just that most of the people who were bad at it slowly left to go on to other games just like people do nowadays. The only thing holding back a "new player" is the fact that there's a lack of new players. Multiplayer games are only ever as hard as the people playing them.

Nah.

First, someone playing like that has played the level about 6000 times.

Second, a lot of the movement (at least in the duke nukem one) is completely unnecessary.

what modern (lets say 2010~) shooters have good campaigns in your opinion?

the last newer shooters i played were multiplayer only and nuDOOM, which i will admit was kinda fun but not brilliant

What the fuck is this shit? Not much choice, when there were always a section at the video rental store dedicated to vidya left and right and even stores where they sold computer parts had a PC game section? 600 Hours to master a game that is actually pretty simple to get in to? Reliably "entertains you" when they only made several overhaul changes because data mining revealed unpleasant truths about the market and their products to stockholders and investors? You really believe people who stick with Quake don't have better graphical upgrades to choose from?

Hey Nigger, here is the Quake shareware demo, have fun. No music though.

It was a lot of fun when classes were well-defined.
Now all the different weapons muddy their roles and turn everyone into a jack-of-all-trades that's only really decent at 1v1 fights but sucks at supporting their team.

This. Been playing QW consistently for about half a decade now. I built a powerful PC in high school and then questioned my purchase.

They need to bring back abstract level design, but they never will because games need to look true to life to sell to the plebs. A great designer would be able create realistic looking environments that also have the gameplay of abstract level designs, too bad there aren't any good designers in the industry right now.